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Global legal war between Apple and Samsung remains far from over and damage may soon escalate

Samsung Electronics Comp., Ltd. (KSC:005930), the world's largest maker of feature phones and smartphones, remains embroiled in a heated legal battle with Apple, Inc. (AAPL) over features in each other’s phones.  Each company claims the other's designs "steal" from their patented intellectual property.

I. Judge Koh -- U.S. Galaxy S III Ban is Possible, at a Cost

In the U.S. Apple is chasing a ban of the upcoming Galaxy S III smartphone, which will launch June 21 on all four of America's top networks.  A ban could help Apple's upcoming sixth generation iPhone get a head start on Samsung in sales, and prevent the reverse scenario -- Samsung beating it to the summer market.

In Northern District of California late Tuesday, Judge Lucy Koh delivered a bit of an ultimatum to Apple, telling it, "I cannot be an Apple v. Samsung judge."

The judge had previously tried to get the two companies to reach an understanding at the settlement table, but talks quickly collapsed.

The remark relates to Apple's last minute decision to file for a preliminary injunction on the Galaxy S III, which it had hoped to tack on to the its request for a ban on the Galaxy S II and the Galaxy Nexus.  Samsung complained about this tactic, saying it should be to late for such an addition.

Judge Koh partially agreed.  She said a preliminary injunction before June 21 was out of the question.  However, she said it might be possible for her to hear arguments from both companies on a restraining order on sales, but that the hearing would push the July trial date to August or September.

In other words, in order to have a chance to ban the Galaxy S III, it must sacrifice its chances of having a ban on the Galaxy Nexus and Galaxy S II for the next couple months.  Still, that may be a chance Apple is willing to take, given the potential damage to Samsung and its potential gains in sales.
 

The Samsung Galaxy S III

While its potential to secure a short-term ban, at a cost, remains strong, Apple's long-term prospects of stifling Samsung in court are less hopeful.  The recent federal court ruling in Oracle Corp.'s (ORCL) Java anti-Android lawsuit, and the dismissal of Motorola Mobility and Apple's suits/countersuits, have set a precedent that patent damages must be reasonable.

Samsung's lawyers appear to be latching on to this tact.  While to they do not admit to infringement, they point out that patented features like autocorrect likely to not constitute a significant portion of the iPhone's value.  Attorney William Price comments, "There is no advertising or marketing on these features at all."

Thus if Samsung is found in infringement, but can successfully argue that the value equation is slender, it could be only on the hook for millions, rather than billions.  That means that the financial danger to Samsung is mainly from a potential ban, rather than the actual court outcome.

II. Samsung is Not Happy With Australian Patent Office

On the other side of the globe, in the "Land Down Under" (Australia), Samsung has sued the Australian patent commissioner, part of the nation's federal government.  Samsung is looking to force the Australian patent office to review four patents granted to Apple that it considers questionable:
  • 2006330724 - Unlocking a device by performing gestures on an unlock image (Granted April 1, 2010)
  • 2007283771 - Portable electronic device for photo management (Granted May 20, 2010)
  • 2008201540 - List scrolling and document translation, scaling, and rotation on a touch-screen display (Granted February 11, 2010)
  • 2009200366 - List scrolling and document translation, scaling, and rotation on a touch screen display (Granted July 23, 2009)
Samsung is not necessarily contesting the validity of Apple's invention claims, but rather is questioning the fact that Apple filed for duplicate innovation patent and general patents on these technologies.  This is a common problem in Australia because the innovation patent review process is completed much more quickly.

Kangaroo crossing
Samsung takes issue with the Australian government's patent granting procedure.
[Image Source: Search Engine Journal]

Mark Summerfield, patent lawyer and senior associate with Watermark, expects the case to be settled quickly and says Samsung has a legitimate case.  He comments, "Technically, the patents should not have been granted, so there is a legitimate case for review.  On the other hand, the consequences for Apple are fairly harsh ... I think the court will consider itself to have considerable discretion in determining what the legislative intent was in a case like this."

One difficulty facing Samsung, though, is the judge involved -- Justice Annabelle Bennett.  In the past she has shown favor to Apple, ruling to ban Samsung's Galaxy Tab 10.1 tablet.  Her colleagues in a higher court called her justification of the ruling highly inappropriate and reversed the decision.

It remains to be seen if the experience leads her to continue to show favor to Apple or forces her to give more heed to Samsung's arguments.  The initial hearing is scheduled for June 25.

The Samsung Galaxy Tab 10.1 is currently available for sale in Australia, with the lifting of the ban.  However, the trial regarding tablet infringement between Samsung and Apple is ongoing and will conclude in a series of hearings between July and October.  Apple has announced its decision pursue a total of 258 claims and 22 patents (including the duplicate patents being challenged).

A finding of infringement could force Samsung to pay damages to Apple and/or modify its products to avoid a ban on the basis of "willful" infringement.

Sources: Chicago Tribune, IT News



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The worst part....
By Quadrillity on 6/8/2012 4:02:10 PM , Rating: 5
I think the worst tragedy throughout all of this is the fact that oblivious fans of Apple are still blindly throwing heaps of money towards their products; which effectively supports and affirms their overall nasty and cowardly business practices.

Cut the head off the snake; stop buying Apple products!




RE: The worst part....
By aurareturn on 6/8/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By retrospooty on 6/8/2012 4:36:59 PM , Rating: 5
"Has it ever come across your mind that people buy the iPhone because it's a superior product to what's on the market? Again, I'm NOT an Apple fan."

I dont think you've been shopping lately. Its good, and I see why people like it, but it is absolutely not "superior" to much of what's out there in both Android and Windows mobile camps.

" Second, it's obvious that Samsung and other Android makers copied Apple's style and some functionality."

Again, your knowledge of the subject if very limited. All companies copy each other, its normal. Apple copied Palm far FAR more than any Android maker copied Apple. The very thought of Apple suing for copied tech is hipocracy at its highest.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/8/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By ritualm on 6/8/2012 4:59:47 PM , Rating: 5
quote:
various pro-Apple claims

Tony Swash, we missed you.
quote:
Yeah because that makes any sense at all? Apple pioneered the whole industry that we now understand to be 'smartphones'. If Apple had copied Palm they would have failed like Palm did. To not understand the differences and that said differences were the essential part of their massive success shows your own limited knowledge. Android haven't improved any of the massive innovations Apple made - they've just copied them.

Apple didn't pioneer the smartphone market, it merely improved it. There are lots of things that are not really innovations but are marketed as such by Apple.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/8/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By ritualm on 6/8/2012 5:13:11 PM , Rating: 4
Pioneer what? More like an evolutionary step. Spit out that Apple-branded Kool-Aid(TM) and try again, kid.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/8/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By Cheesew1z69 on 6/8/2012 7:14:38 PM , Rating: 5
We all wish you could make competent anything....


RE: The worst part....
By kfonda on 6/9/2012 9:53:55 PM , Rating: 3
You should look at this page http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smartphone

You will find several companies that had smartphones with that form factor at least 5 years before the first iPhone.


RE: The worst part....
By theapparition on 6/12/2012 10:22:54 AM , Rating: 2
See what kfonda did there?

He posted a link to the facts that someone didn't like and shut him up.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/14/2012 10:41:44 AM , Rating: 2
OMG, first of all, please, in order to maximise efficiency and minimise time wasted on this awful blog, I wait and then reply in batches. Don't dream that a link to a Wikipedia article proves anything.

And secondly - the article itself. It shows 2 phones older than the iPhone, both of which have nothing like the form factor, if you wanted to prove the point you did it quite emphatically?

While individual aspects all existed before, just like steering wheels existed before Ferrari brought their latest car out - nobody had put it together in such an original way which was to steer the whole industry. Your article just proves that.


RE: The worst part....
By Quadrillity on 6/8/2012 5:17:48 PM , Rating: 5
quote:
They most certainly did pioneer the Smartphone market as we understand it today


As we understand it today? What kind of non-sense is that? By the way, Apple did not invent the touchscreen or candy-bar form factor. I love reading the delusions of Applehaulics...


RE: The worst part....
By herrdoktor330 on 6/8/2012 11:50:46 PM , Rating: 5
The first "Smartphone" was Blackberry. Granted, they failed to innovate, which is why they're where they are today. But give credit where credit is due.

But here's the real problem. If we had this kind of litigation back in the days of IBM, Apple II, and the start of the home computer, we'd have never seen the innovations we've seen in GUIs, hardware, and functionality. And most importantly, we wouldn't see competitive pricing.

We'd have an almighty finder bar at the top of our phones and computers. All while paying $3000 per unit.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/9/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By dark matter on 6/10/12, Rating: 0
RE: The worst part....
By theapparition on 6/12/2012 10:21:44 AM , Rating: 2
Guess I should be diciplined for feeding the troll, but here goes.

quote:
In the same way, the Palm devices which had large ugly keyboard, didn't have full web browsers, poor touch screen without gestures, no app store - isn't the same as our modern day understanding of what a smartphone should be.

I was using a Windows Mobile phone before Apple even thought of one. It was a black rectangular candybar shape. It had a full web browser. It had a touch screen, and there were gestures. And there was an app store.

I'll be the first to admit the touch screen wasn't as good and I don't believe had multi-touch (although there were gestures), the web browser wasn't the best, and the app store only worked by docking to a computer.

I'll give credit where it's due, and Apple definitely took the next logical step and made all these items function much better. But claiming that they invented them is ridiculous. They took existing ideas, and made them better. Jobs even claimed they were unabashed about stealing ideas, so stop your own ridiculous crap.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/14/2012 10:46:51 AM , Rating: 2
Did you just use the big 'I' word?

'Invented'?

I wonder if after perusing through my various very precise posts you actually believe I stated that Apple 'invented' the smartphone? Ironic that you describe what I say as 'crap' having evidently failed to comprehend it.

Taking existing ideas and improving them is what pretty much every single modern 'invention' or 'innovation' is - take the mobile phone itself, 'invented' by Motorola but actually just using technology which already existed and had been tested by other people. You need to learn what innovation is and why being 'unabashed' about stealing ideas is completely irrelevant.

Multi touch, App store, and FULL web browser were all NOT available on Windows Phone pre-Apple iPhone. It was also very slow, very hard to use, and had a large space reserved for buttons.

So it was certainly not the start of the revolution in smartphones which has led to their current form as it stands today.


RE: The worst part....
By retrospooty on 6/8/2012 5:30:11 PM , Rating: 5
"Apple didn't pioneer the smartphone market, it merely improved it. There are lots of things that are not really innovations but are marketed as such by Apple."

Don't bother. This guy is so Applesauced that he cant comprehend logic that doesn't favor Apple. He's delusional enough to actually think that if he keeps posting "I am unbiased" that people will believe it even though he does nothing here at AT/DT but speak for Apple and defend every product they make. Take any point and he will dismiss the good in competing products and overhype the good in Apple. At the same time dismissing any weak point that Apple has while overhyping the weak points of competing products. The very definition of a fanboy.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/8/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By themaster08 on 6/9/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/9/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By retrospooty on 6/8/2012 5:21:01 PM , Rating: 3
Oh, here is mister "I am not biased, I just created an ID at AT/DT for the sole purpose of defending Apple" guy again.

When you post here, all people read is "blah blah blah skew the facts toward Apple blah blah" .... You are all over every smartphone article on this board spouting your disinformation...

There is no arguing anything with you because you aren't here to debate, or learn, or even discuss. You created your ID here on an Apple agenda and that is all you do here and you know it.

I don't disagree that Apple makes good products. They have a place in the tech industry, but I also don't put them on a pedestal like you and create ID's just to blindly champion their cause and post one sided bits of info. Now, I will address your "argument" argument and at the same time, show you an example of being unbiased so you can't say that you don't understand the meaning...

"Leading performance across every single smartphone in the world for 7 months."

On some benchmarks that you pick and choose. They did have the best GPU for a while. Cool.

"Leading reliability ratings."
They do make a solid product hardware wise. Some android makers dont.

"Leading customer satisfaction ratings."
Alot of that is overhyped and alot is the fanatical devotion factor. Alot is true too.

"Leading sales."
Actually Android outsold iPhone by something like 2 to 1.

"Leading app store (profits + apps + quality of apps + unique apps not available on Android)."
Subjective at best.

"leading software support (legacy devices receive updates the same time new ones do)."
Yes, they do. But Apple has only 1 model at a time, so there is only a few ROM's to make. A total non-issue. Anyone that bought a phone based on a future OS upgrade is not thinking straight. You buy a phone based on its features today, not a potential future OS upgrade. Way to glom on to your sell points though.

Apple also has the highest DPI. A very solid product. Android has more options to meet everyone's needs, not just Testerguy's needs. Android has higher resolution screens, larger screens, qwerty kb's, removable batteries, small models, big models, low end models, high end models and everything in between to address everyone's needs. Not just people that like one set of options. Both are good and both have a place.

You see what I did there? I see and spoke to both sides of the same argument that you see only Apple's side. Android outsells Apple 2 to 1. Surely you must see SOME reason why that is. The vast majority of Androids sdold cost the same $199 with 2 year contract, so its not price. What could it be?


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/8/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By retrospooty on 6/8/2012 6:02:51 PM , Rating: 3
"I only post the facts about this because of so many biased morons such as yourself who can only talk negatively about Apple"

He said in a reply to my post where I said 8, yes 8 positive things about Apple in the one post above (not 8 in the whole thread, just in the post you directly replied to). Hilarious.

So I reply to your points with both positive and negative points about Apple and Android and you reply to each with only positive for Apple and negative for Android... Not surprising, that's what you do here.

And you don't see how you are biased? Can you seriously re-read these last 2 posts each that you and I made and not comprehend the bias that I am talking about? I post good and bad about each, and you post one direction... If you cant see that, you are absolutely hopeless.


RE: The worst part....
By zerocks on 6/8/2012 8:11:34 PM , Rating: 2
3 cheers for this guy! ( NOT testerguy)


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/9/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By retrospooty on 6/9/2012 12:35:46 PM , Rating: 2
So my positive comments on Apple are "backhand compliments" because I don't see it as 100% rosy. And they are also just being said because you are right, however the other side of the fence has no merit whatsoever. LOL... You are truly priceless.

Well we can agree on one thing for sure. The iPhone is the best model out there -for you and for many others that think like you do about phones. You need to understand that not everyone thinks that way. The majority of us do not and that's OK too, agree?

I am lucky enough to be a network admin at a small company of 450 people. Since we are small, I also have the Verizon account on my plate. We have about 250 users with company phones and I can "borrow" the 2 year upgrade from any one of several dozen users that don't care. I have a blue Galaxy SIII on pre-order due to ship the first week of July and I am totally psyched about it. With that said, I am also intrigued by an iPhone 5 with a 4 inch screen. I will be able to play with them as I order for users that prefer it, so I will have ample chance to evaluate it personally in a much better setting than in a Verizon store with an employee trying to "help" me into purchasing. If I like it I can "borrow" another 2 year upgrade and get it instead. I have a strong feeling that the 4.8 inch 1280x720 screen will trump the positive aspect of the iPhone5 for me, but will give it a fair chance. You on the other hand will stick with Apple and never really know what the other side has to offer because your mind is pre made up. Enjoy that.


RE: The worst part....
By sigmatau on 6/9/2012 3:34:26 PM , Rating: 2
Wow. You shredded testerguy into ground up 3GS dust. It's funny how foolish he makes himself look.


RE: The worst part....
By retrospooty on 6/9/2012 4:40:42 PM , Rating: 2
"It's funny how foolish he makes himself look."

True.. but, he created the ID here at Anandtech/Dailytech for the sole purpose of defending Apple... I dont know what exactly that gets him, some sort of fanboy pride I guess. If that act alone doesnt make him realize what a fool he is, nothing I say will. We can all see it and just laugh at it though. Its at least funny to me ;)


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/14/2012 10:52:38 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
So my positive comments on Apple are "backhand compliments" because I don't see it as 100% rosy


Do you understand what 'backhand compliment' means? It means a comment masquerading as a compliment but with an underlying critical tone. It is not the same as making a compliment.

quote:
And they are also just being said because you are right, however the other side of the fence has no merit whatsoever.


The point is there isn't 'another side of the fence'. Take the performance, for example. iPhone 4S was factually, the fastest phone on the market - for 7 months after it came out. You respond with 'fastest GPU for a while' as if it wasn't the fastest overall (which it was) and a 'while' implies much less than 7 months. How can you not get that? You are absolutely correct that your criticisms have absolutely no merit since they are fundamentally wrong.

quote:
ell we can agree on one thing for sure. The iPhone is the best model out there -for you and for many others that think like you do about phones. You need to understand that not everyone thinks that way. The majority of us do not and that's OK too, agree?


I don't believe I've said anything about which phones are 'right' for the majority of people. That's subjective nonsense. I deal in facts. I would never make such silly claims on irrelevant topics.

quote:
I am lucky enough to be a network admin at a small company of 450 people. Since we are small, I also have the Verizon account on my plate. We have about 250 users with company phones and I can "borrow" the 2 year upgrade from any one of several dozen users that don't care. I have a blue Galaxy SIII on pre-order due to ship the first week of July and I am totally psyched about it. With that said, I am also intrigued by an iPhone 5 with a 4 inch screen. I will be able to play with them as I order for users that prefer it, so I will have ample chance to evaluate it personally in a much better setting than in a Verizon store with an employee trying to "help" me into purchasing. If I like it I can "borrow" another 2 year upgrade and get it instead. I have a strong feeling that the 4.8 inch 1280x720 screen will trump the positive aspect of the iPhone5 for me, but will give it a fair chance.


This rant of boring drivel does nothing to disprove all of the points I made about the original comment being incorrect and the advantages of the iPhone being true.

quote:
You on the other hand will stick with Apple and never really know what the other side has to offer because your mind is pre made up. Enjoy that.


Wonder how many times I'll have to tell you that I don't own an iPhone 4S and haven't decided which phone I'll get eventually yet. Project opinions onto me which I don't even have, then argue against them, is that the best you can do?

A shorter reply, this one, since you've deviated so far from all of the coherent and proven accurate points I made that you're just rambling. Post on topic next time.


RE: The worst part....
By althaz on 6/10/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/14/12, Rating: 0
RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/14/2012 11:03:30 AM , Rating: 1
quote:
Actually, the iPhone is NOT leading in performance


Arguing against something I didn't say? I said it led for 7 months. It did.

quote:
it's NOT leading in reliability ratings (HTC and Nokia are both ahead of apple)


quote:
Smartphone Reliability and Satisfaction: iPhone Tops the List Readers like their handsets from Apple and HTC, but were less impressed with phones from LG and Samsung.


http://www.pcworld.com/article/244607/smartphone_r...

quote:
it's NOT leading in customer satisfaction (Windows Phone actually dominates in this category, it's not even close)


quote:
The 2012 report shows that Apple has amassed a staggering 83% customer satisfaction ranking, becoming the first cellular company to break the 80% mark. Apple was a full 8 percentage points ahead of Nokia, HTC, and LG, who shared the number 2 spot at a 75% rating. Motorola and Samsung came in at 73% and 71%, respectively.


http://www.intomobile.com/2012/05/15/apple-rim-cus...

quote:
it is NOT winning sales (Samsung is and if you are talking OS it's Android by miles)


quote:
Apple's iPhones were the top three most popular smartphones in the United States for all of 2011, according to comScore's 2012 Mobile Future in Focus whitepaper. NPD reported similar results for the months of October and November, when the iPhone 4S was the most popular smartphone in the country after it was released.


http://www.macrumors.com/2012/02/24/apple-sells-to...

(Don't confuse Samsungs range of cheaper models with any one model outselling the iPhone)

So now who's making up shit, and who's just crying because the facts got laid out in front of him?

I'm actually disappointed that anybody was retarded enough to actually deny reality.

As for iPhone being a Palm Pilot, LMFAO. No multi touch, inferior screen with a STYLUS, physical keyboard, slower, impossible to use, no proper app store, not a full web browser.

But apart from the, the same, yeah ;-)

Good work with all your 'facts'.


RE: The worst part....
By mars2k on 6/13/2012 9:28:14 PM , Rating: 2
I had a great post but Daily Tech caught it as "Spam" good thing I'm not sensitive


RE: The worst part....
By ritualm on 6/8/12, Rating: 0
RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/8/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By Reclaimer77 on 6/8/2012 4:56:08 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Samsung is a little pawn in Apples large collection of suppliers (or bitches, shall we say)


And these are the words of a self-proclaimed NON Apple fan? Everyone is just Apples "bitches"... and you're NOT a fanboi.

Right tester, okay.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/8/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By Reclaimer77 on 6/8/2012 5:15:17 PM , Rating: 2
It's a symbiotic relationships in which currency is exchanged for goods and services. It is NOT "subordinate" in any way, and suppliers are not "bitches". There are NO "facts" in your interpretation of business basics. They escape you.

And again, you're a fucking retard.


RE: The worst part....
By Quadrillity on 6/8/2012 5:27:24 PM , Rating: 1
ROFL, do you understand how much of a giant heap of shit Apple would be in without Samsung fabs? When it comes to tangible capitol and fabrication, Samsung beats the hell out of Apple.

I guess your solution would be "Well, someone will pick up the slack if they lose Samsung". Good luck finding someone that will replace the equation of capacity and quality... It won't happen. Samsung has tried to negotiate trade agreements with Apple, but so far they have continued on their rampage of delusions. It will come to an end here soon, don't you worry.

I'll give it a few more years that Apple stock is right back in the crapper.


RE: The worst part....
By Reclaimer77 on 6/8/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/8/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By Yongsta on 6/8/2012 6:29:23 PM , Rating: 2
3 manufacturers and guess which manufacturer they had to use for the first iPads? That's right Samsung because LG & Sharp couldn't deliver on the scale Samsung could.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/9/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By marsovac on 6/11/2012 11:19:43 AM , Rating: 1
You as a fanboy should be grateful to Samsung for having a business relationship with Apple at all (because of its bullish arrogant business behavior).

They do make money on Apple, however their margins are very narrow since based on hardware fabrication.

Apple on the other hand has all of its profit in only a handful of devices and their margins are overwhelming.

If Apple could not meet demand for a few quarters that would mean that their stock would just be flushed in the toilet in a nanosecond.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/14/2012 11:06:34 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
You as a fanboy should be grateful to Samsung


Just because I understand supplier/client relationships and facts doesn't make me a fanboy, I don't care about Apple or Samsung - I have my own life to care about.

quote:
They do make money on Apple, however their margins are very narrow since based on hardware fabrication.


Yeah they make so little money that's why their stock dipped 6% on news of Apple ordering one part from another supplier.

quote:
Apple on the other hand has all of its profit in only a handful of devices and their margins are overwhelming. If Apple could not meet demand for a few quarters that would mean that their stock would just be flushed in the toilet in a nanosecond.


The point being they are moving to a point where they wont need Samsung at all to achieve that. That's precisely the point. Even now there are numerous suppliers who claim they count cope with the demand, but Apple is taking a risk-free gradual approach.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/8/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By Iaiken on 6/8/2012 5:57:59 PM , Rating: 3
quote:
Apple is already moving large parts of their business away from Samsung and Samsung can't do anything about it, and will simply lose money. That puts Apple in the position of power.


Hahahaha...

Samsung revenue from Apple in 2011 totalled $9 billion USD
Projected revenue from Apple for 2012 is $12 billion USD

These supply contracts stretch out for the next 5 years and are the impetus behind Samsung's 3 new fabs in each of of South Korea, the USA and China.

Nice to know your opined nuggets came from somewhere near Uranus.


RE: The worst part....
By Yongsta on 6/8/2012 6:33:59 PM , Rating: 2
LOL, so tell me when Apple has their own fabs manufacturing LCD screen, ram & cpu chips. Tell me when Apple is making their own TV's, refrigerators, microwave, dishwasher, washing machine / dryer's, printers, digital cameras, faxes, camcorders, etc.

Tell me when Apple has their own Life Insurance Company & Advertisement agency. Tell me when Apple has their own Construction company that can build the 3 tallest buildings in the world. Tell me when Apple has their own shipbuilding company.

Samsung scale is huge and in many different industries, Electronics is just one portion.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/9/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By matty123 on 6/9/2012 10:50:43 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
As any Samsung exec would tell you - and any logical businessman would assert, Apple can find another Samsung. They could even create one. The reverse is not true . Samsung clearly need Apple more than Apple need Samsung


That's not true at all, apple may be the most profitable tech firm in the world but samsung is by far the largest {by revenue} apple's total revenue in a year doesn't even match samsung's to say they could simply create another samsung is absurd and quite frankly laughable. Through I would agree at this point samsung need apple more than apple needs samsung...

Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_largest_t...

However

quote:
Apple is also Samsung’s biggest customer, as the Korean company supplies chips and displays for the iPhone, iPad and iPod Touch devices. Apple accounted for 7.64 percent of Samsung’s revenue , according to data compiled by Bloomberg.


8% of samsungs revenue is hardly the be all and end all of samsung I think they would survive just fine without apple if they had to.

Link: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-06-04/apple-s-i...

As for some of your other posts they just reek of bias towards apple...

quote:
Leading performance across every single smartphone in the world for 7 months


And before that the galaxy s2 was the best phone for 5 months yet I don't see you praising it {and the galaxy s2 was orders of magnitude better than the iphone 4 was, far better than the iphone 4s is compared to the galaxy s2, where the galaxy S2 still holds it's ground in almost every test except GPU benchmarks}?? And at the moment the galaxy s3 is the best device and yet even now you won't praise them but I am sure when the iphone 5 comes out you will be here reminding all of us how superior it is, really the mind boggles??

quote:
Leading reliability ratings.


True that apple make solid hardware that lasts {as long as you don't drop it} I think I still have a fully functioning iphone 3G in my desk somewhere.

{However also source this information, I can only find info on the US market hardly representative of the rest of the planet especially since iphones tend to be far more popular in the US than the global average would suggest}.

And samsung as a brand is rated above apple in the US and europe...

quote:
Samsung is the most preferred consumer technology brand, ahead of Sony, HP and Apple, according to ConsumerMetrix Technology Brand Preference Index just released by Strategy Analytics. In a survey of more than six thousand consumers in the US and Europe, “Technology Brand Preferences,” Samsung received the highest overall preference rating of +41 percent, followed by Sony at +29 percent, HP at +20 percent and Apple at +19 percent. The lowest brand preference ratings were given to Lenovo (-37 percent), RIM (Blackberry) (-28 percent) and Sanyo(-26 percent). Respondents were asked to consider how likely they would be to choose each of more than twenty global brands when buying technology products such as computers, mobile phones and TVs.


Link: http://www.bloomberg.com/article/2012-06-06/af1VC3...

quote:
Leading customer satisfaction ratings.


This I tend to believe as I know very few unhappy iphone owners...

{but again source I can only find info on the american market which as pointed out above has a disproportionate amount of iphone users compared to the rest of the world}.

And again...

quote:
Samsung is the most preferred consumer technology brand, ahead of Sony, HP and Apple, according to ConsumerMetrix Technology Brand Preference Index just released by Strategy Analytics. In a survey of more than six thousand consumers in the US and Europe, “Technology Brand Preferences,” Samsung received the highest overall preference rating of +41 percent, followed by Sony at +29 percent, HP at +20 percent and Apple at +19 percent. The lowest brand preference ratings were given to Lenovo (-37 percent), RIM (Blackberry) (-28 percent) and Sanyo(-26 percent). Respondents were asked to consider how likely they would be to choose each of more than twenty global brands when buying technology products such as computers, mobile phones and TVs.


Link: http://www.bloomberg.com/article/2012-06-06/af1VC3...

quote:
Leading sales.


That's not true at all as I am sure you are aware samsung outsold apple in total phones sold and even in just smartphones sold, I could provide links but a 2 second google search would give you all the information you need.

quote:
Leading app store (profits + apps + quality of apps + unique apps not available on Android).


True to a degree but android also has many unique apps it doesn't really say much at all, through I will agree apple has netter unique apps especially games...

quote:
Leading software support (legacy devices receive updates the same time new ones do).


True for now but let's also not forget apple is still selling {and manufacturing} the iphone 3GS which I give maybe a 1% chance of getting iOS 6 which is expected to be released in the next three months... It's taken longer {obvious since their is only one vendor} but apple will inevitably hit some form of fragmentation soon as well}.

Also while some android manufacturers have been quite bad with updates some have been quite good updating the phone for 3 OS revisions {Same as the iphone.


RE: The worst part....
By Cheesew1z69 on 6/9/12, Rating: 0
RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/14/2012 11:28:25 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
That's not true at all, apple may be the most profitable tech firm in the world but samsung is by far the largest {by revenue} apple's total revenue in a year doesn't even match samsung's to say they could simply create another samsung is absurd and quite frankly laughable. Through I would agree at this point samsung need apple more than apple needs samsung...


It most certainly IS true that Samsung could create another Samsung for the purposes of creating their own phones. Why are you banging onto me about Revenue? Revenue is vanity, profit is sanity - every good businessman knows that. Nobody targets revenue - everybody targets profit.

For your future reference, the bold part is the part being claimed, nice that you verified that whilst believing you were contradicting it.

quote:
8% of samsungs revenue is hardly the be all and end all of samsung I think they would survive just fine without apple if they had to.


Look at this:

http://www.phonearena.com/news/Samsung-loses-10-bi...

There were RUMOURS of Apple ordering elsewhere, and Samsung lost $10bn, just like that. Survival is not the issue here, pure monetary loss is. That highlights the value Apple has to Samsung. And it's not just the profit or revenue either, it's guaranteed recurring trade which opens up development and technological benefits such as insider knowledge etc - it clearly has a value to the educated shareholder.

The bottom line is that Samsungs stock would drop far more if the relationship ended. A fact I pointed out, which you agreed with, then proceeded to talk irrelevance about 'survival' - as if I had said 'Samsung will die'..... come on.

quote:
As for some of your other posts they just reek of bias towards apple...


All factual, I'm impartial.

quote:
Leading performance across every single smartphone in the world for 7 months And before that the galaxy s2 was the best phone for 5 months yet I don't see you praising it {and the galaxy s2 was orders of magnitude better than the iphone 4 was, far better than the iphone 4s is compared to the galaxy s2, where the galaxy S2 still holds it's ground in almost every test except GPU benchmarks}??


Sorry, so your argument against my factual statement that the iPhone 4S led the performance world for 7 months is that another phone led previously for less time? Is that supposed to be a relevant point or what? Do you honestly think that disproves the fact I stated? The SG2 had numerous flaws which meant that it was not clear cut, certainly not 'better' as you describe it. First, the battery life was massively inferior:

http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph4686/41017...
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph4686/41018...

Secondly, at the time there were some critical apps (from my personal perspective) which Android didn't have, such as Sky Sports Football app (the most watched, most profitable and most successful sporting league in the world, bar none).

Thirdly, numerous lag issues and crashing issues plagued Android particularly at that time, meaning that a faster phone didn't actually feel faster when in real use.

All of the above being said, none of what happened previously is at all relevant to the fact I stated about the iPhone 4 - that you think I should be 'praising' another phone, if anything, 'reeks of bias'.

quote:
And samsung as a brand is rated above apple in the US and europe...


Nonsense.

quote:
Smartphone Reliability and Satisfaction: iPhone Tops the List Readers like their handsets from Apple and HTC, but were less impressed with phones from LG and Samsung.


http://www.pcworld.com/article/244607/smartphone_r...

quote:
ACSI’s May 2012 report includes its yearly data on customer satisfaction with cellphone manufacturers. This is the first year ACSI has included Apple, RIM, HTC and LG in this particular survey. Apple topped the heap of cellphone manufacturers with 83 points, out of 100 total. This is slightly lower than the customer satisfaction for Apple’s personal computers, which include Mac and iPad products (yes, ACSI considers the iPad a PC). Mac computers were awarded 87 points by ACSI in September 2011.


quote:
It’s surprising that Nokia ranked above Samsung, which had the second-lowest score at 71 points, given the latter company’s success with its Galaxy smartphone line.


http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2012/05/its-officia...

The link you provided about Brands has nothing to do with reliability. Mine both do, of course, since I stay relevant.

quote:
That's not true at all as I am sure you are aware samsung outsold apple in total phones sold and even in just smartphones sold, I could provide links but a 2 second google search would give you all the information you need.


Did you just cite 'total phones' in a discussion about the best selling PHONE?

Do you know the difference? While Samsung sold more smartphones, they did so at budget basement prices (not hard to give things away for free) and across a wider product range, thus not one of their products outsold the iPhone 4 or 4S:

quote:
Apple's iPhones were the top three most popular smartphones in the United States for all of 2011, according to comScore's 2012 Mobile Future in Focus whitepaper. NPD reported similar results for the months of October and November, when the iPhone 4S was the most popular smartphone in the country after it was released.


http://www.macrumors.com/2012/02/24/apple-sells-to...

quote:
True for now but let's also not forget apple is still selling {and manufacturing} the iphone 3GS which I give maybe a 1% chance of getting iOS 6 which is expected to be released in the next three months... It's taken longer {obvious since their is only one vendor} but apple will inevitably hit some form of fragmentation soon as well}. Also while some android manufacturers have been quite bad with updates some have been quite good updating the phone for 3 OS revisions {Same as the iphone.


True is true. I'm glad you agree. The iPhone 3GS has been CONFIRMED to be getting the new iOS, proving you wrong once again - but even if they had neglected to support the 3GS - at least it's a far far cry from the Android way - with even some brand new models not on ICS. I don't care if Apple can only offer that because they have fewer models - that's obviously therefore an advantage to the consumer - which was my point.

All of my points thoroughly proven - see I don't play guessing games, I deal with facts. I think you should ask yourself why you went to such great lengths to try and disprove my facts, whilst calling ME biased ;-)


RE: The worst part....
By matty123 on 6/27/2012 11:48:06 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
There were RUMOURS of Apple ordering elsewhere, and Samsung lost $10bn, just like that. Survival is not the issue here, pure monetary loss is. That highlights the value Apple has to Samsung. And it's not just the profit or revenue either, it's guaranteed recurring trade which opens up development and technological benefits such as insider knowledge etc - it clearly has a value to the educated shareholder. The bottom line is that Samsungs stock would drop far more if the relationship ended. A fact I pointed out, which you agreed with, then proceeded to talk irrelevance about 'survival' - as if I had said 'Samsung will die'..... come on.


Says nothing the fact remains that apple only accounts for not even a tithe of samsung's revenue while losing apple's business is bad and investors may not be happy apple's business is a drop in a cup despite your claims otherwise.

And it's pathetic the way you bring up a stock slide need I remind you...

quote:
Apple‘s stock fell as much as 5% after its iPhone 4S announcement Tuesday, illustrating that the news failed to wow investors


Link: http://mashable.com/2011/10/04/apple-stock-falls/

Apple lost far more with their five percent slide when releasing a phone you worship and pray to imagine what would happen if they released a truly sub par device {which considering the law of averages is inevitable}.

quote:
All factual, I'm impartial.


Sure you are /end sarcasm...

quote:
Sorry, so your argument against my factual statement that the iPhone 4S led the performance world for 7 months is that another phone led previously for less time? Is that supposed to be a relevant point or what? Do you honestly think that disproves the fact I stated? The SG2 had numerous flaws which meant that it was not clear cut, certainly not 'better' as you describe it. First, the battery life was massively inferior: http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph4686/41017... http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph4686/41018...


What's laughable here is I have already pointed out to you in a earlier article that you conventiently leave out the two other graphs where the galaxy s2 has better battery life {out of four in total I will add so in other words half}, I will link here to the original anandtech article so that you can't mislead anymore people with your outright lies and bias...

Link: http://www.anandtech.com/show/4971/apple-iphone-4s...

quote:
Secondly, at the time there were some critical apps (from my personal perspective) which Android didn't have, such as Sky Sports Football app (the most watched, most profitable and most successful sporting league in the world, bar none). Thirdly, numerous lag issues and crashing issues plagued Android particularly at that time, meaning that a faster phone didn't actually feel faster when in real use. All of the above being said, none of what happened previously is at all relevant to the fact I stated about the iPhone 4 - that you think I should be 'praising' another phone, if anything, 'reeks of bias'.


At least you admit "from my personal perspective" credit for that...

Through again weak sauce just to push your own personal agenda...

Link: http://www.forbes.com/sites/tomiogeron/2012/02/02/...

quote:
Nonsense.


Thank you Lord for deciding the truth and just dismissing a survey of over six thousand people clearly you are all knowning /end sarcasm

Again I will leave the link here so people can read what an impartial source has found not what you a clearly biased apple fan has decided...

Link: http://www.bloomberg.com/article/2012-06-06/af1VC3...

quote:
Smartphone Reliability and Satisfaction: iPhone Tops the List Readers like their handsets from Apple and HTC, but were less impressed with phones from LG and Samsung.


And you manage to ignore completely what I posted before...

quote:
{However also source this information, I can only find info on the US market hardly representative of the rest of the planet especially since iphones tend to be far more popular in the US than the global average would suggest} .


So what do you do provide me info from " American Customer Satisfaction Index " without even addresing the concerns raised about the far larger than normal amount of iphone users in the states and all this after dismissing a survey from another reputable source, clearly you don't see the hypocrisy.

quote:
Did you just cite 'total phones' in a discussion about the best selling PHONE? Do you know the difference? While Samsung sold more smartphones, they did so at budget basement prices (not hard to give things away for free) and across a wider product range, thus not one of their products outsold the iPhone 4 or 4S:


I never said any model did through considering your clear inability to read anything that isn't worshiping the great apple I understand your dilemma and will again elaborate...

You claimed in your post "Leading Sales" all I did was point out samsung outsells apple in the smarphone market by quite a substantial margin and then you again try and prove your point by offering american data {really??} when I have so many times pointed out the problem with that, also lets not forget apple also still sell the sub par iphone 3GS and iphone 4 and include them in their sales but of course let's not let anything get in the way of spreading your bias by claiming samsung only sell cheap phones {the hypocrisy at this point is laughable}.

quote:
True is true. I'm glad you agree. The iPhone 3GS has been CONFIRMED to be getting the new iOS, proving you wrong once again - but even if they had neglected to support the 3GS - at least it's a far far cry from the Android way - with even some brand new models not on ICS. I don't care if Apple can only offer that because they have fewer models - that's obviously therefore an advantage to the consumer - which was my point.


I will concede this point I was wrong through the 3GS is severely crippled in iOS6...

quote:
All of my points thoroughly proven - see I don't play guessing games, I deal with facts. I think you should ask yourself why you went to such great lengths to try and disprove my facts, whilst calling ME biased ;-)


Because I admit I am biased I feel I must be to counter the {obvious to everyone but you} bias you {and Tony} keep putting forth on this site and then try to trumpet your impartiality, any long time reader of the site doesn't take you {or Tony} seriously so that's not a problem however someday a google search will lead some poor unsuspecting soul to one of these article's and he will read the clear lies that you have written, I feel I must at least point out your clear bias, selective quoting and complete refusal to accept anything not pro apple so that they can make an informed decision instead of getting sucked into a lie by you...

I doubt I will get a reply to this I only stumbled upon this post now while looking at my old posts {you only replied 5 days after the thread had moved off the main page} but at least I have set the record straight.

Good day to you.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/28/2012 5:37:19 AM , Rating: 2
From me:

quote:
There were RUMOURS of Apple ordering elsewhere, and Samsung lost $10bn, just like that


From you:

quote:
Says nothing


Riiiiiight. OK. So losing 10bn means nothing. And some of you think I have rose tinted glasses on.

quote:
apple's business is a drop in a cup


The stock slide disproved precisely this.

quote:
Apple‘s stock fell as much as 5% after its iPhone 4S announcement Tuesday, illustrating that the news failed to wow investors. Apple lost far more with their five percent slide when releasing a phone you worship and pray to imagine what would happen if they released a truly sub par device {which considering the law of averages is inevitable}.


And how does that contradict anything I've said? Since Apple lost 5%, you would therefore deduce that the iPhone was important to them. Which it clearly is. Yet when Samsung lose 10% on a RUMOUR that SOME of their business with Apple is being lost, you claim it 'means nothing'..... Ironic?

quote:
All factual, I'm impartial. Sure you are /end sarcasm...


I would say the same to you. Your refusal to concede the basic obvious common knowledge that Samsung needs Apple more than Apple needs Samsung suggests you dislike Apple.

quote:
What's laughable here is I have already pointed out to you in a earlier article that you conventiently leave out the two other graphs where the galaxy s2 has better battery life {out of four in total I will add so in other words half}, I will link here to the original anandtech article so that you can't mislead anymore people with your outright lies and bias...


What's more laughable is that you failed to realise I responded to and disproved your points in that article wrong.

What I proved, just to recap, was that in SOME BENCHMARKS the CPU of the iPhone was faster. I didn't post the benchmarks in which it was slower, because all that was required to satisfy my argument was that it was DEBATABLE, in other words that there was contention over which CPU was faster. Since the GPU is undeniably faster in every benchmark, and by a far greater margin, that means the overall performance crown goes to the iPhone. Exactly as I claimed. The same is true of the battery benchmarks, which are far more in Apples favour overall anyway. While you may think linking the Anandtech gives your post credence, that very link is what proves my point, so thanks.

quote:
At least you admit "from my personal perspective" credit for that...


I always speak precisely, you just need to read more closely if you ever think I'm being biased.

quote:
Through again weak sauce just to push your own personal agenda... Link: http://www.forbes.com/sites/tomiogeron/2012/02/02/...


Should I say 'weak sauce' for pushing YOUR agenda, since that article clearly shows the majority of crashes in iOS 5.1, which wasn't even out when the iPhone 4 was released? Or did you just flagrantly disregard reality to try and pursue a point? Talk about picking and choosing.

And what's even more of a joke, your article which you claim disproves my 'agenda pushing'... quotes the following:

quote:
So what does all this data mean? On a basic level, you can see that iOS apps crashed more than Android apps during this time period. But Crittercism’s Levy cautions that this doesn’t necessarily mean that overall iOS apps crash more than Android apps. That’s because Apple had recently released a new version iOS 5 in October. Android’s new Ice Cream Sandwich operating system (Android 4.0), meanwhile, had not been widely released on phones yet at the time of this study. “I expect as Ice Cream Sandwich just launched and the new Nexus S phone launched (during the study), we’ll expect the same situation to occur (with Android) as what happened (with iOS),” Levy says.


So seriously, you need to be more careful with what you post next time, and do I even need to mention you didn't address the apps, or lagging, or my claim that iOS feels faster even if the benchmarks are less? (Which I proved by counter example isn't categorically so).

quote:
Thank you Lord for deciding the truth and just dismissing a survey of over six thousand people clearly you are all knowning /end sarcasm


Nonsense because it was a small survey, in a small sample set, in a specific area - about BRAND. Nothing to do with reliability or customer satisfaction, as per my original claim. Again, you need to read more carefully. Your link to Bloomberg basically documenting the article I've already both discredited and exposed the irrelevance of, is pointless.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/28/2012 5:38:51 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
And you manage to ignore completely what I posted before... quote: {However also source this information, I can only find info on the US market hardly representative of the rest of the planet especially since iphones tend to be far more popular in the US than the global average would suggest} . So what do you do provide me info from " American Customer Satisfaction Index " without even addresing the concerns raised about the far larger than normal amount of iphone users in the states and all this after dismissing a survey from another reputable source, clearly you don't see the hypocrisy.


Should I make the ridiculously dumb argument of 'Thank you Lord for deciding to dismiss .... how many people is it? Is it more than 6,000? ' and then point out the absurd hypocrisy of being prepared to listen to a survey of 6,000 people about a completely irrelevant topic, but ignoring the largest smartphone market in the world on the topic which was actually being discussed? (Certainly one of the top 2 with China?).

It's not specific to the US either, and it's not specific to any one genre of product:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/apple/801740...

http://www.v3.co.uk/v3-uk/news/2011102/apple-tops-...

http://www.ipadstand.co.uk/news/apple-online-store...

http://www.macworld.com/article/1162396/apple_tops...

quote:
I never said any model did through considering your clear inability to read anything that isn't worshiping the great apple I understand your dilemma and will again elaborate... You claimed in your post "Leading Sales" all I did was point out samsung outsells apple in the smarphone market by quite a substantial margin and then you again try and prove your point by offering american data {really??} when I have so many times pointed out the problem with that, also lets not forget apple also still sell the sub par iphone 3GS and iphone 4 and include them in their sales but of course let's not let anything get in the way of spreading your bias by claiming samsung only sell cheap phones {the hypocrisy at this point is laughable}.


The fact that you didn't say any specific model is exactly the idiocy I was referring to.

We were talking about iPhone specifically. A model of phone. Within THAT CONTEXT, I said Leading sales. Thus, to contradict this factual statement (which has nothing to do with American specific data, it's worldwide sales in which the iPhone leads - America being the biggest market is just a good example) - you would have to show a specific model of phone which is outselling. Instead, you gave me the name of a company. Can you really not understand how unbelievably retarded and irrelevant that is? Samsungs 10+ models may sell SLIGHTLY more in terms of absolute number sold, between them, when compared to the iPhone, but none of those product genres eg Samsung Galaxy outsells the iPhone. Simple as. Furthermore, if you had any clue of what business means or how it operates you would know that 'Sales' refers to the actual cash income, which is far far higher with the iPhone, which is again another point I made. Apple could achieve probably double the absolute sales figures by halving the cost, but would only achieve the same total sales and a lower profit margin. So, my original, factual, and entirely correct point, that iPhone leads in sales, stands completely and absolutely unaffected by any of your comments. Making you an irrelevance. Both in absolute number of sales, and sales, the iPhone has been the most successful of any phone. Simple as, and that's despite charging more than the average phone that you're referring to.

quote:
I will concede this point I was wrong through the 3GS is severely crippled in iOS6...


The 3GS isn't 'severely crippled in IOS6' at all. If you're going to finally concede your idiocy, at least do it right.

quote:
Because I admit I am biased I feel I must be to counter the {obvious to everyone but you} bias you {and Tony} keep putting forth on this site and then try to trumpet your impartiality, any long time reader of the site doesn't take you {or Tony} seriously so that's not a problem however someday a google search will lead some poor unsuspecting soul to one of these article's and he will read the clear lies that you have written, I feel I must at least point out your clear bias, selective quoting and complete refusal to accept anything not pro apple so that they can make an informed decision instead of getting sucked into a lie by you... I doubt I will get a reply to this I only stumbled upon this post now while looking at my old posts {you only replied 5 days after the thread had moved off the main page} but at least I have set the record straight. Good day to you.


You know what's ironic? The impartial observer stumbling across the drivel on these forums is exactly why I correct idiots such as yourself, who deny the reality such as the iPhone 4S having far superior performance to the Samsung Galaxy 2. I've noticed that because of a select few morons such as yourself, word spreads and soon people actually believe this nonsense. You admit you are biased too, which is an absolute joke given that you then go on to claim that 'nobody takes me seriously' - look at the rant you posted. Clearly not the actions of someone who doesn't take my words seriously.

It's not about being unwilling to accept anything not pro Apple. I'll accept anything, if it's true. What I do not accept, however, is simple untruths which seem common on this site which is full of pro-Android bias, mainly due to Jason.

Needless to say, all of my original points still stand, and remain common knowledge:

- Apple leads the customer satisfaction ratings.
- Apple leads the reliability ratings.
- IPhone 4 is faster than SG2, overall.
- Apple is more key to Samsung than Samsung is to Apple.
- iPhone is the best selling phone of all time. Certainly the iPhone 4 and 4S set record sales figures, perhaps the others did too.

You can spam articles about 'brand' all you like, or articles about the reliability which explain themselves why it isn't a conclusive analysis, but it wont change any of the above 5 facts. In fact you've done absolutely nothing to disprove anything I've said.


RE: The worst part....
By Boze on 6/8/2012 10:04:45 PM , Rating: 3
You're one of the few posters on this site whose mental problems I actually want to fix by repeated application of a sturdy 2x4 to your cranium.

Eventually I might be able to remove all the "stupid" from your brain.


RE: The worst part....
By Cheesew1z69 on 6/8/2012 11:01:45 PM , Rating: 1
Not possible, you can't fix stupid.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/9/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By Cheesew1z69 on 6/9/2012 10:51:32 AM , Rating: 1
And none of your 1billion posts prove anything, your point? This post has no relevance to anything.

Same shit over and over and over and over day after day after day.

You are a parrot...


RE: The worst part....
By dark matter on 6/10/12, Rating: 0
RE: The worst part....
By Yongsta on 6/8/2012 6:27:24 PM , Rating: 2
You're an idiot. Samsung controls everything, everything in their phones they make while Apple needs others to make things for them. So because Intel makes cpu's for many PC manufacturers, by your logic, they're just pawns for the PC manufacturers? Sure buddy, what an idiot.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/9/2012 8:38:15 AM , Rating: 1
I was hoping someone who doesn't understand the dynamics of client/supplier relationships would use the example of Intel.

The big difference is, Intel is in a unique position of being the only supplier who can offer the technology of their processors. In that scenario, it's actually Intel who has the power.

With Samsung, Apple prefers Samsung due to their proven capability to produce products en mass, but what they do produce can be produced by any number of manufacturers and they are not offering anything unique in terms of technology. All they are doing is manufacturing according to Apples design. They control precisely nothing, Apple could produce every single thing without them. They could not produce an iPhone without Intel.

And that's the difference.


RE: The worst part....
By dark matter on 6/10/2012 2:36:54 PM , Rating: 1
Why are you stat there "hoping" for people to say something?

Seriously dude, you're an absolute jerk. Not only are you totally clueless about the shit you write. You're actually that fucking dense you not only believe it yourself, but are so retarted and have such an enflated ego that you're amazed that no-one agrees with you, to the point where you sit and write pages of utter shit.

Take a step back, stop taking the Internet so personally.

My advice I shall take, especially after seeing your name all over this story, talking utter shite.


RE: The worst part....
By Cheesew1z69 on 6/8/2012 7:17:02 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
Android copied the whole operating system, app store and phone format.
You are completely out of your fucking mind....wow...


RE: The worst part....
By Fujikoma on 6/9/12, Rating: 0
RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/9/2012 8:45:56 AM , Rating: 1
quote:
Highly unlikely. Tech, tool and die, manufacturing, research and fabbing are all more important than retail. I don't know what planet you are from, but retail falls under the service industry and they tend to pay very badly.


Which job is more 'important' is both subjective and irrelevant. I've worked in the office for a large car manufacturer and I got paid more than anyone on the line did. I don't know why you have the delusion that manual labour pays better than office work, but either way, you're wrong. Perhaps the lowest level sales people get paid roughly the same, but sales people do not constitute all of Apples offices in the US.

quote:
Apple purchases components, has them assebled at plants that aren't theirs and ties the iPhone together with their OS. They purchase Samsung components (which are far more reliable at those purchase orders than other vendors, so Apple is more dependent upon Samsung than you understand), which they did not design. Much like their computers with intel chips. They did, however, design the wonderful authentication 'Apple' chip that is required to run all iPods because they didn't want everyone being able to interface with their product. They also designed that piss poor connector that manufacturers are also made to purchase. The thing has bad pin structure AND the little plastic tabs break off too easily. You might want to ask Apple about royalties paid out to the Frauhofer Institute among the myriad of other patent holders that they pay in order to use their I.P. Without them, they would have no product.


Apple designs components, and instructs manufacturers to build the parts to those designs. In the past they have also used some 'off the shelf' parts such as graphics processors etc, but so has every single phone manufacturer. They have already placed orders with other suppliers for items which were previously thought to be exclusive to Samsung, such as DRAM, and doing so knocked 6% off the value of Samsung Electronics overnight. Now, they design pretty much every element of the phone and simply choose which supplier they prefer to build it. Pretty much every phone manufacturer also has to pay royalties to varies companies for using technology, I don't see how that takes away anything from what Apple do.

quote:
So you're saying that Apple is running what would be termed normally as slave labor. The reason the Chinese don't get that label, is that the U.N. allows feeding and housing of the employees to offset slave wage accusations. Apple doesn't own these facilities, because it would pull it's production and move it somewhere cheaper in a heartbeat if it could find someplace cheaper. It's all about the profit margins and even though they could make a profit paying fair wages, they want to make a little bit more profit. A lot of companies do this, not just Apple (hell, the company I work for does this). That extra bit of profit really isnt' worth it in the grand scheme of things, but humans are, repetively, slow learners. Apple gives these companies a design using established market components. An authentication 'Apple' chip, connector and O.S. are a small part of that phone. They DID NOT design the memory, touch-screen, processor, wireless/blue tooth/gps/accel. chips, plastic.


By 'slave labour' do you mean the factories which were independently reviews with the conclusion being that the standards were far higher than the average, the average being where many other parts for almost every other smartphone are produced? Or the factories which Apple have invested millions in recently to 'improve' what was already above average and required standards? Funny that you describe employing people as 'slave labour'. I wonder if you realise that taking ANY job in this world is a choice for the employee to make. If they don't want the job, don't take it. Apple owns much of the infrastructure and whether they technically own the facility or not is pretty much irrelevant given that their uniqueness is not in being able to assemble parts, but being able to manage the whole production process, from design through to purchase and production, and end up with a product which typically is superior technologically to other devices on the market, and certainly delivered at a much lower cost.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/8/12, Rating: 0
RE: The worst part....
By Quadrillity on 6/8/2012 5:03:09 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
the masses of better educated people (statistically) will stop buying iPhones in their millions.


Are you seriously trying to imply that being educated and having an iToy are correlated? I'm sure I could go at great length to describe why Apple is a scumbag company that produces over-hyped shiny toys, but it's been proven over and over again on this forum.

simply stated: If you want a shinny, expensive, dated, and simple phone that is locked down to what Apple says you can do it, then buy an iphone.

If you want the choice of variety, customization, personalization, superior hardware and software, and carriers, then choose an android phone.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/8/12, Rating: 0
RE: The worst part....
By Reclaimer77 on 6/8/2012 5:18:30 PM , Rating: 1
That's classic iTard strategy #1. When all other arguments fail, just claim Apple consumers are "smarter", so there! Take that!

But remember, tester is NOT a fanboi lol. Riiight.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/8/2012 5:41:17 PM , Rating: 1
It's not me claiming it, it's the evidence claiming it.

I see you didn't try to claim it's not true, you're learning - young one.


RE: The worst part....
By SpartanJet on 6/8/2012 6:19:35 PM , Rating: 2
Its a stupid and useless statistic. That is why nobody is refuting it. I'm really not surprised that one of the most expensive phones to own over the lifetime of the contract have owners that are generally more wealthy and better educated (The two often go together). Apple makes ONE phone. Android phones come in a variety of shapes, sizes, costs, and contracts. Its no stretch that a phone that might be free on contract with a 200MB data plan would have less wealthy owners than the iphone 4s.

Now if you were to take the education/wealth level of lets say the iphone 4s vs Samsung Galaxy S3 perhaps you would be able to make a better case (flagship v flagship).


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/9/2012 8:53:56 AM , Rating: 1
quote:
Its a stupid and useless statistic. That is why nobody is refuting it. I'm really not surprised that one of the most expensive phones to own over the lifetime of the contract have owners that are generally more wealthy and better educated (The two often go together). Apple makes ONE phone. Android phones come in a variety of shapes, sizes, costs, and contracts. Its no stretch that a phone that might be free on contract with a 200MB data plan would have less wealthy owners than the iphone 4s. Now if you were to take the education/wealth level of lets say the iphone 4s vs Samsung Galaxy S3 perhaps you would be able to make a better case (flagship v flagship).


1 - Whether or not people are buying iPhones because of their intelligence, or because of their money (ie causation), the stat is still relevant to the often claimed 'iTard'. Even if they aren't buying due to being more educated, they are still more educated. Since you mention expense, don't you realise that that further proves the argument? For those for whom money is less of a consideration and they actually have to just decide which device is the best, they choose iPhones more often.

2 - When you mention the fact that Android comes in cheaper flavours, you actually make my point that cheapness is one of the primary reasons Android is selling better. The fact that less educated people buy cheaper products doesn't change the reality either. If Android was better, people who have more money would buy it too.

3 - It's so funny that when it suits, Android fans want to take an Android handset in isolation and compare THAT to the iPhone, but when it comes to sales, it's always the combined total of every Android handset vs Apples one. I also don't see you providing any of the stats for SG3 vs iPhone 4S, I don't see any point in just guessing what those stats would be? It's worth pointing out that my original comment was not specific to SG3 vs iPhone 4S, it was part of an iOS vs Android debate. Not a debate of SG3 vs iPhone 4S. So what I said remains true.

As for the SG3 - I think it's currently the leading phone. I wouldn't buy it personally due to wanting to wait and see if the iPhone 5 is better, and also I have concerns about the update cycle and security on Android, but I do need a new phone and if when the iPhone 5 comes out I prefer the SG3, and can be convinced that it'll receive updates, I may buy it.

All of this doesn't change the fact that you can't associate iPhone users with being idiots, or non-techy, because they are on average better educated. As already mentioned, I'm not claiming causation, I'm claiming evidenced correlation.


RE: The worst part....
By retrospooty on 6/8/2012 6:28:50 PM , Rating: 2
"But remember, tester is NOT a fanboi lol. Riiight"

I know... This guy is truly a piece of work. He has the blind devotion of Tony Swash and the shiftyness of Pirks with a heaping side order of deep denial and unwillingness to accept that he could possibly, just maybe be incorrect.


RE: The worst part....
By Cheesew1z69 on 6/8/2012 7:28:32 PM , Rating: 2
He has tried to correlate it MANY times....


RE: The worst part....
By Reclaimer77 on 6/8/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By aurareturn on 6/8/2012 5:04:18 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
What, exactly, is Samsung "blatantly copying"? The design of the modern smartphone does not belong to anyone, not Apple, not anybody. Samsung phones are thinner, lighter, and have bigger screens than Apple's. What's being copied?

Look at this: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-8tkI_Y7I3bQ/Tov308JNA0I/...

You seriously don't think that's straight up copying from Apple?

I hear people say all the time that Apple copied from this and that. Well, show me a phone that looked and functioned like the original iPhone when it first came out.

If you ask the same question - show me a phone that looks and functions like the the Samsung Android phones that came out first - I will show you a picture of the iPhone.


RE: The worst part....
By Reclaimer77 on 6/8/2012 5:04:00 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
You seriously don't think that's straight up copying from Apple?


No, it's not.

You fanbois have polarized the argument so that similarities are now "straight up" copying. And congrats on using a phone from three generations ago to try and make your point.

The issue isn't whether or not who copies who, but how relevant that accusation is. It's become nothing but a smokescreen by Apple fans to try and legitimize this anti-competitive immoral legal campaign.

quote:
If you ask the same question - show me a phone that looks and functions like the the Samsung Android phones that came out first - I will show you a picture of the iPhone.


Yes Apple was first to come out with a multi-touch smartphone. Now I ask you, so what? Coming to the market first with something has NEVER granted you a monopoly in the past. Why do you people insist that this is how it should be now?

I guess this stuff helps you sleep better at night, but it's just irrelevant.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/8/2012 5:22:44 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Now I ask you, so what? Coming to the market first with something has NEVER granted you a monopoly in the past.


Sorry did anybody here say we thought Apple should be granted a monopoly? Are you arguing against a voice in your head?

Last I checked we were just correcting morons who seem to forget that Apple created the modern interpretation of the smartphone. That's the reality, and any smartphones which came after that were heavily, heavily influenced by it - in many cases too much so, and they are simply copies.

When Apple seeks to protect their uniqueness through patents, obviously they have more to protect having come up with it first. If it's so 'illegitimate' then it wont succeed - it's a self regulating industry.


RE: The worst part....
By zerocks on 6/8/2012 8:38:13 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Apple seeks to protect their uniqueness through


You've got to be kidding. Uniqueness.
They managed to patent the most absurdly generic bar phone appearance imaginable in the US because it, like most countries, has a very flawed patent system.

Apple are fighting a battle that they started to lose because they stopped innovating their own product, Sure they might have come up with a design that has been built upon by others and improved but the right way to compete is not to just sue.

Apple are petty.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/9/12, Rating: 0
RE: The worst part....
By Fritzr on 6/8/2012 9:54:08 PM , Rating: 2
Apple put a cellphone radio in a Palm Pilot. This was the innovation.

The PDA was the original "smartphone" type device, though the originals did not include telephone capability. People were expected to carry a PDA and cellphone, using bluetooth or similar local connection to allow the PDA to connect to the internet.

Then came cellphones with internet browsers builtin and the ability to connect to the internet directly. PDAs became much less important.

Finally Apple revived the PDA market by adding full cellphone capability to a PDA calling the hybrid device iPhone. A touchscreen 'smartphone' is what used to be called a PDA.

So yes there was a lot of copying going on ... Apple copied the Palm Pilot and similar devices when they designed the iPhone.

Android is not the first non-Apple 'smartphone'. Many of the early 'featurephones' were in fact early smartphones using custom OSes and J2ME to support user loaded programs.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/9/12, Rating: 0
RE: The worst part....
By Cheesew1z69 on 6/9/2012 4:16:50 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
I've covered in my other biased posts how very different and unique it was in various ways.
Fix that for you.


RE: The worst part....
By retrospooty on 6/10/2012 10:26:40 AM , Rating: 2
"I don't understand"

Obviously.

As for most sane rational thinking people on Earth, we dont understand why you get so offended when someone doesn't choose the same product you choose. I didn't choose the iPhone, but I can understand why some do. Is it really so hard for you to step outside your little box for a few minutes to try and understand why people are buying the high end Android phones in volume?

It's called empathy and its what separates us from lower mammals.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/14/2012 11:34:25 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
we dont understand


Obviously.

quote:
we dont understand why you get so offended when someone doesn't choose the same product you choose


I don't believe I have spoken at all about anyone's choice in anything. I don't care what you all buy. What I dislike is factual misrepresentation. It's that which I correct.

As for why people buy Android, this has been done over and over - cheap, niches filled (ie large screens, physical keyboards), more handsets to choose from (colours styles etc). A higher percentage of Android users want to try iOS than the reverse. Recent stats show 38% of iPhone purchases are ex-Android. I don't know why you keep referring to iOS vs Android usage anyway, that doesn't change the facts I am making, such as best selling phone, or highest customer satisfaction ratings, highest reliability ratings, best performance for 7 months, best app store, etc etc.

It's like you think I'll be somehow hurt that Android is achieving a lot of sales? I am completely impartial, don't confuse me with someone affiliated in any way. Like I've said before, I am impartial but you guys see it as bias because you constantly criticise Apple incorrectly and I constantly correct you.


RE: The worst part....
By ritualm on 6/8/2012 5:22:18 PM , Rating: 2
All I see are rectangles with rounded corners. They are not clones.

Don't give us that bullcrap.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/8/2012 5:15:50 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
I love how you say you aren't an Apple fan, then go out of your way to repeat the same old bullshit we hear from Tony and all the others.


Are you referring to the facts I provided, such as the leading reliability ratings, or customer satisfaction ratings?

Thinner, but wider, and taller - more volume in total.
Lighter because they have slower hardware (only exception being SG3 which came out 7 months later)
Bigger Screens - most people don't want bricks for phones, so that's a negative. It's not like Apple are incapable of creating large screens, and it's not like enlarging the screen or making a wider, longer but tiny bit thinner phone is innovative.

Nobody said the 'design of the modern smartphone' belongs to Apple - I said Samsung copied it. They did. And Apple were the first to create it. And it's not about shapes, its about the software, the idea of the whole app store, even more recently S-Voice is a blatant rip off of Siri. The list goes on and on.

Your argument about shapes is complete nonsense since nobody has said anything to do with shapes at all.


RE: The worst part....
By Reclaimer77 on 6/8/12, Rating: -1
RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/8/2012 5:44:33 PM , Rating: 2
1 - Who said Samsung made Android?

Answer: noone.

What Samsung did do is choose to use Android in their phone. Since Android is a copy of iOS, that makes Samsungs phone a copy of the iPhone. Logic 101.

2 - Google Voice <> Siri. iPhone had voice control before Siri too, they are not the same thing.

3 - No relevance.

quote:
AHAHAH!! Hey guys, didn't you know slower microchips are physically HEAVIER than faster ones? GPU's too! You're such a goddamn idiot tester. Your world orbits Apple, clearly.


Do I really need to go back to primary school level and explain to you that accommodating faster hardware (which often is larger, by the way, but not always) requires various other additional items to be larger or heavier, such as battery or heatsinks?

Come on, you're not THAT dumb... well I stand corrected.


RE: The worst part....
By Iaiken on 6/8/2012 6:09:14 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
accommodating faster hardware (which often is larger)


Might want to check your facts on that one brah, you're mistaking packaging size for chip size. For example, Intel CPU packaging today is roughly the same size as it used to be, but the actual CPU itself takes up only around 1/10th the surface area of a CPU from even 3 years ago, while packing in roughly 10x the number of transistors. Last Intel developer conference I attended, one of the senior engineers said that one of the biggest restrictions on packaging size for consumer CPUs is that they can't make them so small that people can't install them without tweezers.


RE: The worst part....
By retrospooty on 6/8/2012 6:13:29 PM , Rating: 2
Fact have "no relevance" to this guy. He is here for his agenda and that is all.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/9/2012 8:57:05 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Might want to check your facts on that one brah, you're mistaking packaging size for chip size. For example, Intel CPU packaging today is roughly the same size as it used to be, but the actual CPU itself takes up only around 1/10th the surface area of a CPU from even 3 years ago, while packing in roughly 10x the number of transistors. Last Intel developer conference I attended, one of the senior engineers said that one of the biggest restrictions on packaging size for consumer CPUs is that they can't make them so small that people can't install them without tweezers.


Did you miss the word 'often'? I use words for a reason, see I'm precise like that.

Do you know what 'accommodating' means? It means the packaging. So your whole argument is irrelevant.

I think you need to read more carefully. I'm very accurate in what I say.

;-)


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/9/12, Rating: 0
RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/9/2012 8:57:05 AM , Rating: 1
quote:
Might want to check your facts on that one brah, you're mistaking packaging size for chip size. For example, Intel CPU packaging today is roughly the same size as it used to be, but the actual CPU itself takes up only around 1/10th the surface area of a CPU from even 3 years ago, while packing in roughly 10x the number of transistors. Last Intel developer conference I attended, one of the senior engineers said that one of the biggest restrictions on packaging size for consumer CPUs is that they can't make them so small that people can't install them without tweezers.


Did you miss the word 'often'? I use words for a reason, see I'm precise like that.

Do you know what 'accommodating' means? It means the packaging. So your whole argument is irrelevant.

I think you need to read more carefully. I'm very accurate in what I say.

;-)


RE: The worst part....
By Cheesew1z69 on 6/8/2012 7:35:45 PM , Rating: 2
Logic with you = FAIL


RE: The worst part....
By zerocks on 6/8/2012 8:44:51 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
it's not like enlarging the screen or making a wider, longer but tiny bit thinner phone is innovative.

Is that why Apple are increasing the size of the iPhone now?

quote:
the idea of the whole app store


Wow. no one's had an online store where you have an account that keeps all your purchased digital items in one place. Oh, wait, Yes they have.


RE: The worst part....
By retrospooty on 6/8/2012 8:48:34 PM , Rating: 2
"Is that why Apple are increasing the size of the iPhone now?"

sounds a lot like Apple is copying Android to me. Maybe they should ban the iPhone 5 for blatantly copying the idea.


RE: The worst part....
By Cheesew1z69 on 6/8/2012 8:49:12 PM , Rating: 2
Come on, don't be so naive, Apple invented all those....


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/9/12, Rating: 0
RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/9/2012 9:36:25 AM , Rating: 1
Oh and also, if Apple did increase the size of the iPhone, I wouldn't call that innovative, either.

(Your comment was in response to me saying that Samsung making a larger screen isn't innovative, again something which wouldn't at all be disproved if Apple followed suit).


RE: The worst part....
By zerocks on 6/9/2012 1:39:41 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Why do you have to take a sentence out of context, or try and argue against something that wasn't said


I was responding to your point, where you claimed Apple came up with the idea for an app store.

Just in case you didn't know this already
Apple originally never wanted to open their app store to having anyone other than themselves making apps for it, it was the user base that demanded it and Apple conceded after resisting it from fear of losing their fans.

They didn't come up with the idea of having 3rd party developers and without those developers there market place would be dismal.
I'm glad it is as big as it is today, though, It's certainly useful for me and my iPod.


RE: The worst part....
By testerguy on 6/14/2012 11:38:25 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
I was responding to your point, where you claimed Apple came up with the idea for an app store.


After I explained this to you, you still don't get it? I'll quote myself:

quote:
something that wasn't said (such as online stores not existing) to make any kind of a point? Because you can't dispute what was actually said. Let me remind you: it was a list of elements that Android has copied from iOS


To dumb it down even further....

Me Never Said Apple Invented App Store Idea.

Do you get it yet?

quote:
Apple originally never wanted to open their app store to having anyone other than themselves making apps for it, it was the user base that demanded it and Apple conceded after resisting it from fear of losing their fans.


Does this change anything? Nope.

quote:
They didn't come up with the idea of having 3rd party developers and without those developers there market place would be dismal. I'm glad it is as big as it is today, though, It's certainly useful for me and my iPod.


Again, lets repeat (rinse and repeat hey?) :)

quote:
something that wasn't said (such as online stores not existing) to make any kind of a point? Because you can't dispute what was actually said. Let me remind you: it was a list of elements that Android has copied from iOS


To dumb it down even further....

Me Never Said Apple Invented App Store Idea.

Do you get it yet?

Whether Apple invented it or not isn't the point, and isn't a comment I've made or a claim I've made. What I did say was that it's their app store which Android copied. Which is true.


RE: The worst part....
By chµck on 6/8/2012 7:20:44 PM , Rating: 2
and justin beiber is the best musician alive


RE: The worst part....
By mmarianbv on 6/9/2012 3:47:13 AM , Rating: 2
long time reader, long time gamer.

i would like to say that apple is like blizzard.
they stoled a lot of good ideea from various mmos at their time, and created the giant wow.

noone really knows why they still have that kind of subscriber numbers, because before gfx rewamp it have low graphics, it was way to simple, grinding, eazymode and so.
but still, it have 10 millions subscribers, and no sign of fast decline in the near future.
probably the same thing with apple aswell.
personally i own and use a nokia 1101 phone from so long ago, but if i would think to buy a smartphone i will buy one which will stay on battery at least for 6 days. and my top for smarphones for buying is : one with windows os (i know a bit of .net programming), iphone (ios), android.

why iphone vs generic android one ?
i used both an iphone 4, and an galaxy s II for months at work, and i like it better (from games to remote servers control). i don't care about marketing or evil corporations, i care about my user experience.


RE: The worst part....
By tayb on 6/9/2012 10:26:04 AM , Rating: 2
iPhone - $200
Every other smartphone for sale - $200
The arrogance of thinking that your choice of OS somehow makes you superior to others who think different - Priceless


RE: The worst part....
By cschuele on 6/9/2012 2:04:17 PM , Rating: 1
As an owner of 2 different iPhones and 2 differnt android phones and being open minded and non brand loyal I have spent a lot of time thinking of why apple fans are so loyal, and at the same time completely blind to everything else out there.

I have a few friends who seem to think that everything else out there is worse then an iPhone but none of them have owned anything but iPhones and most dont even have a iPhone 4s. I think its more about the lack of tech knowledge and the fact that they have not even borrowed a friends to write a text or look up something on the internet. If they did they would prob see how lacking a 3.5" screen is and how cartoonish those giant icons and small resolution look. I really hope the iPhone 5 can catch up to android, although the specs look very lacking. IMO apple has been lagging behind android big time since about 6 months after the 4 lauched.
Cheers, sorry if I offended any iSheep


RE: The worst part....
By sigmatau on 6/11/2012 12:24:19 PM , Rating: 2
You sound like an arrogant twit.


RE: The worst part....
By Cheesew1z69 on 6/11/2012 12:28:50 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
The arrogance of thinking that your choice of OS somehow makes you superior to others who think different - Priceless
Like most Apple users? Yes, it sure is priceless.


RE: The worst part....
By mars2k on 6/13/2012 9:23:48 PM , Rating: 2
No,the worst part is that Microsoft owns an enormous stake in Apple. That’s where the nasty comes from.


meh... nothing to see here.
By retrospooty on 6/8/2012 3:50:39 PM , Rating: 2
" She [Judge Koh] said a preliminary injunction before June 21 was out of the question. However, she said it might be possible for her to hear arguments from both companies on a restraining order on sales, but that the hearing would push the July trial date to August or September."

All that means is the judge wont put a quicky ban on the S3, but has agreed to hear arguments from both sides. If Apple wants to add the S3, then it will push back the date of the hearing.

Regardless, it will get thrown out, like the others, because its a ridiculous lawsuit.




RE: meh... nothing to see here.
By messele on 6/8/2012 4:01:11 PM , Rating: 2
The Australian Courts should just give you a call when something needs to be fast tracked, they could save themselves a heap of time and money and go straight to verdict!


RE: meh... nothing to see here.
By retrospooty on 6/8/2012 4:39:03 PM , Rating: 2
It would be nioe, but cant happen... Ridiculous lawsuits always get thrown out at some point. The problem with these things is there is no system in place to effectively determine what is full of crap and what is valid until it gets its day in court. Once it gets its day in court, Apple will get slapped.


RE: meh... nothing to see here.
By Tony Swash on 6/9/2012 9:48:47 AM , Rating: 1
I am currently on holiday high in the Dinaric Alps. I see you guys are coping quite well in my absence. Keep up the good work. Now back to the beer and the stunning view.


RE: meh... nothing to see here.
By Cheesew1z69 on 6/9/2012 2:29:21 PM , Rating: 2
Yes, they are, since the world doesn't revolve around you....


RE: meh... nothing to see here.
By Tony Swash on 6/10/2012 1:57:26 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Yes, they are, since the world doesn't revolve around you....


I see the humor bypass is still working. Dude you need to chill.


By Cheesew1z69 on 6/11/2012 12:23:33 PM , Rating: 2
And the idouche filter never worked unfortunately. You need to get a life...


RE: meh... nothing to see here.
By retrospooty on 6/11/2012 1:11:46 PM , Rating: 2
LOL... Enjoy your vacation and take a rest.

Apple will still be here and in need of defending when you return. Until then, Testerguy is filling in and doing a great job distorting reality in your absence. ;)


RE: meh... nothing to see here.
By driftersdr12 on 6/11/2012 7:28:19 PM , Rating: 2
I created an account and logged in just to say, in one comment section I already think testerguy should just go away what an idiot. testerguy, your "facts" are merely what you see as true they are not necessarily facts at all since everything you've said is merely rumor or opinion, "applejacks" will defend apple until the grave, each phone has its "markets" clearly there is market for more than just the iphone (obviously I disagree with your comment that nobody wants larger screens or whatever niche their android fills) and for the record blackberry pioneered the smartphone market more than apple ever did. Thank you have a greay day XD


By testerguy on 6/28/2012 6:02:26 AM , Rating: 2
I provided links and evidence for every one of my claims.

You may not like the claims, but they are substantiated.

I don't deal with opinions, and I don't defend Apple for the sake of it - I just defend whatever is logically correct.


iphone is old and outdated
By SPOOOK on 6/10/2012 4:21:37 AM , Rating: 2
i have a iphone with verizon when i got it it was outdated
by 4 years it was the same as atnt that was out for years there was no updates the samsung looks great removeable battery lighter faster better apps and great large screen
its selling 2 to 1 over apple somehow apple has lost it the screen on the iphone is too small the battery cant be replaced as soon as i can i am dumping the iphone for samsung and apple better watch themselves or they will be big loses there is a new boy in town and apple better remember samgsung makes the iphone screens they should stop selling it to them that will put apple out of work banrupt company who thinks they will get by , by there name apple dont cut it anymore and they know it




RE: iphone is old and outdated
By Cheesew1z69 on 6/10/2012 10:22:00 AM , Rating: 2
Holy crap man, learn to form a proper sentence!


By Nyu on 6/8/2012 4:16:54 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
2007283771 - Portable electronic device for photo management (Granted May 20, 2010)


Seriously? Much bribing? the fuck with such patents..




By fourzeronine on 6/8/2012 7:18:56 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
The remark relates to Apple's last minute decision to file for a preliminary injunction on the Galaxy S III, which it had hoped to tack on to the its request for a ban on the Galaxy S II and the Galaxy Nexus. Samsung complained about this tactic, saying it should be to late for such an addition.


I've never complained about the sentence structure and grammar in an article, until now.




A big fat dump.
By B3an on 6/9/2012 1:14:54 AM , Rating: 2
I'd like to take a big fat dump on Steve Jobs grave.




oops
By mchentz on 6/9/2012 5:39:04 AM , Rating: 2
I clicked the wrong button, so to undo my rating I am posting.

BTW for me iTunes is why I will not get an Apple product. I really do not like that piece of software.




f%ck 'em all
By Motoman on 6/9/2012 9:25:36 AM , Rating: 2
High past time for a world-wide reboot of all patent processes. It's f%cked everywhere.

Let all companies successfully ban all of their competitors based on retarded patents. In a couple weeks, no one will be able to sell anything, anywhere.

Once the depth of that stupidity sinks in, destroy all existing patents, and re-do it from the ground up - governed by smart people who understand the technologies involved in the patents that they are reviewing for approval.

Oh, and f%ck Apple.




Yawn... More Apple BS
By Bigbeam on 6/9/2012 5:53:13 PM , Rating: 2
Leave Apple to it - you make the bed you sleep in...




Yawn... More Apple BS
By Bigbeam on 6/9/2012 6:43:03 PM , Rating: 2
Leave Apple to it - you make the bed you sleep in... or how bout another one.. don't sh*t where you sleep...




use any argument you want...
By jnemesh on 6/11/2012 1:35:00 PM , Rating: 2
But the results are still the same...

Fact: Apple can NOT compete with the new offerings from HTC and Samsung, so they are litigating instead of innovating.

Fact: Steve Jobs said he would go "thermonuclear" on Android

Fact: Courts are tiring of Apple's "sue everyone" strategy

Fact: Apple fanboys posting on this site (I'm looking at you Tony!) are extremely annoying.




Sue the patent offices
By ProZach on 6/11/2012 1:53:05 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
"Technically, the patents should not have been granted..."
I think the unbiased and mature audiences know this. I say, way to go! Hold the patent offices accountable for grants where prior-art or over-general claims are found. As for patent reform, I have to admit I don't know what would be needed to do so.

I do think 200 years from now Apple will be a franchise of over-priced septic tanks (and attorney firms).




"We don't know how to make a $500 computer that's not a piece of junk." -- Apple CEO Steve Jobs














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