backtop

Print E-mail del.icio.us 155 comment(s) - last by Guttersnipe.. on Oct 15 at 4:24 AM
Rumored new manufacturing process would be a breakthrough in notebook design

Every time a new Apple press event is announced, the speculation runs rampant. This time the press event isn’t even announced and speculation is brewing quickly.

According to 9to5mac, Apple will unveil new MacBook's at a press event to be held on October 14. The fact that new MacBook's are supposed to be coming is only half the rumor. What's making some of the biggest waves is the report that the new MacBook cases will be machined out of one solid chunk of aluminum.

The system is already being called the MacBook Brick as an ode to the solid brick-like metal chunk the new and revolutionary process is said to start with. The Brick is cut out with lasers and jets of water to produce a one piece, seamless case for the new MacBook systems.

The new manufacturing process is supposed to make design changes faster and allow Apple to reap cost savings, which will drive the price of the Mac notebooks down. 9to5mac says its source insists that the rumor of the new manufacturing system for the MacBook computers is accurate.

Advantages to the new manufacturing process will include no need to bend the metal, which reduces weak spots and folds and eliminates the need for screws to hold the case together. This should make for a sleeker looking computer that is lighter and stronger than previous MacBook designs. This is all speculation at this point and we can only wait and see if the mythical press event on the 14 of this month materializes.

The last MacBook update added new processors and a few tweaks -- nothing as interesting as this new design process.

Comments     Threshold


This article is over a month old, voting and posting comments is disabled
Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/6/2008 3:59:17 PM , Rating: 4
OK, as a youth, I worked in a machine shop for years, and I'm not sure how one would cut out a laptop from a solid chunk of aluminum. Not to mention how expensive the manufacture this way would get.

Water jets are used for cutting, lasers as well. Not sure what magic factories Apple has, but I have yet to see something that can hog out the center of a brick, without it being in pieces first. Even the best 5 axis machines can't do this, so I would be interested to see what they actually are doing here.




RE: Apple has magic now?
By mindless1 on 10/6/2008 4:05:28 PM , Rating: 2
Agreed, it seems likely the top will be left open with a plate over it.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By 3DoubleD on 10/6/2008 4:39:49 PM , Rating: 5
I also agree. This method would not change anything. You would have the bottom piece with a lid (keyboard, palm rest, touch pad, ect). Since laptops are already made like this... milling out a brick of aluminum to accomplish this goal instead of stamping and folding is pretty ludicrous. It would be insanely expensive and a huge waste of time and energy (and I mean in the anti-green sense waste of energy). To top it off, why would they want to make it stronger? I can't imagine any rabid mac users breaking their macbook sending emails, watching youtube, and surfing facebook (I can't think of anything else people use macbooks for???). If they were really serious about anything, they would build the laptop out of carbon fiber, it would be light, strong, with slight heat conductivity (less than aluminum though). They could even paint it white or black! I have a black ASUS laptop with carbon fiber metal alloy for the case... AMAZINGLY light and strong http://www.topmicrousa.com/asusz33a.html. Apple should catch up, I bought mine in 2005.

I really hope this is just a rumor, because it would top the "Stupid things about Apple does that Mac fans love" chart. I'm sure my old housemate would love it.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/6/2008 4:47:15 PM , Rating: 2
Agreed, carbon fiber would be the way to go. I saw that Asus before, loved the idea. But, I'm a fan of Asus products. I don't understand how using metals for something is a progression when metal isn't needed.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By snownpaint on 10/6/2008 6:08:38 PM , Rating: 2
Our R&D team makes complex markers(guns) out of blocks of AL for the paintball industry. (grooves and holes drilled 4" down a .7" hole) I have seen some amazing stuff made on a CNC / lath machine out of a block of AL. With the right case design the laptop could be made from one block, but it would have to have a large opening on top (keyboard opening) for the mill head to carve out.. However, I do not think this is efficient (lots of waste) or any stronger then a well assembled case.

Then there are the 3d printing prototype machines which can make amazing stuff the CNC can't do. Parts assembled inside parts, just not very strong polymer and not metal..

Carbon Fiber is a easy way to go, and much more cost effective for the Qtys they are running especially after making the mold..

But if they are going for colors, you can't go wrong with anodizing and laser engraving AL.. the possibilities in design are amazing and durable.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By BladeVenom on 10/6/2008 7:13:03 PM , Rating: 2
Color anodizing would look great on a laptop.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By DigitalFreak on 10/7/2008 8:06:42 AM , Rating: 5
Apple = form over function


RE: Apple has magic now?
By DeepBlue1975 on 10/8/2008 10:13:26 AM , Rating: 2
Correction:

Apple = form WITHOUT function

It's like an airhead stunning, easy going (to bed) girl who just can't make a single complete sentence out of her mind and all she seems to think about is her looks.

You'd like to be intimate with her just a couple of times because she is stunning, but you wouldn't wanna engage in any kind of serious or long term relationship with her, because she bores you to bed as soon as she steps out of the bed.

Same happens with nowadays Mac Hardware: insanely expensive standard PCs with sometimes seriously reduced functionality packed inside an awesome looking case.

The advantages Mac OS could have vs Windows will never be enough to offset the price because, at the core, you know it's just another PC (unlike some years ago).

That unless, of course, you need to use very specific software that only runs on Mac OS.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By frobizzle on 10/13/2008 12:28:29 PM , Rating: 2
Are you referring to the Mac Book or Sarah Palin?? The description fits both to a tee!


RE: Apple has magic now?
By paydirt on 10/7/2008 10:52:00 AM , Rating: 2
I gotta agree that I see this as possible and don't see how it will save Apple money (unless they can recycle all the scrap aluminum). There's potential for the laptops to simply look and feel awesome.

If anyone has ever seen the computers make custom wheels for Orange County Choppers (motorcycles), they can see the potential here.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Ricklar on 10/6/2008 6:53:50 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
Agreed, carbon fiber would be the way to go.

How would carbon fiber be the way to go? Does carbon fiber dissipate heat good? NO. Is carbon fiber cheaper than aluminum? NO. Can carbon fiber be easily working into a laptop case on a mass scale? NO.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/6/08, Rating: -1
RE: Apple has magic now?
By mindless1 on 10/6/2008 8:48:05 PM , Rating: 3
While I agree that people won't want the laptop heating up on the exterior to the extent it would if the exterior were used as a heatsink, you are incorrect about the general cooling benefits of doing so.

Metal of sufficient thickness without fins can still be a fine heatsink due to the large surface area of the entire case. You can still have forced air across it because a fan that sucks in air someone then blows it out in the opposite side is moving air over that casing IF it is designed to do so.

You wrote "ranther than just heat everything up" but that is the idea of a heatsink, to create a thermal gradient. SOmething with high density due to small dimensions like an engine will need increased surface area for more effective cooling but an entire outside case on a laptop already has more surface area than any heatsink you could reasonably put inside of one.

Sorry but the dumb part is your inability to grasp cooling design, given enough surface area you don't even need active airflow at all and indeed there are laptops now without fans. The entire case of a laptop is enough to cool a moderate CPU, except for the issue you already mentioned that people won't want to be holding or placing on their lap a hot case. Because of that, yes plastic is the cost effective choice most popular today.

Even then, inside you often find secondary heatsinks that are little more than flat metal without significant fins or fans for that 'sink. A laptop external case is potentially multiple times larger and more effective compared to these existing 'sinks already used in laptops.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/6/08, Rating: -1
RE: Apple has magic now?
By mindless1 on 10/6/2008 11:43:47 PM , Rating: 3
No, the opposite. I'm saying you are wrong about your heatsink ideas and the main problem is it could heat up the case enough to make handling it or putting it on one's lap uncomfortable.

Fins are more effective given the same 2 dimensional area for the heatsink, but when the entire case is the 'sink it is the equivalently larger surface area too. That is the only reason you see finned 'sinks, that cheaper non-finned would be too large to fit in the available space. There is no available space limit when the enclosure itself is the sink and is so large just to have room for a given screen dimension and keyboard width.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Cullinaire on 10/7/2008 2:33:13 AM , Rating: 2
Now would be a perfect time to introduce the iMelamine laptop, what with all the free publicity you'd get at this point in our history.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By randomly on 10/7/2008 9:28:59 AM , Rating: 2
You don't have a clear understanding of heat transfer and heatsink/system design for laptops. Do a little research.

Besides that, Do you think you are smarter than the engineers at apple? Do you think they don't understand thermal design? Do you think they don't understand manufacturing costs? Would management in the company allow a non-economical manufacturing technique be implemented?

They know a great deal more than you do, they don't make obvious engineering/production mistakes. They are vastly better informed on all aspects of the design and manufacturing than you are. You are jumping to all kinds of lame conclusions with insufficient information.

Ignorance breeds confidence, and you are so very confident.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/7/08, Rating: -1
RE: Apple has magic now?
By randomly on 10/7/2008 10:17:17 AM , Rating: 3
Many laptops get hot, not just apple's. It's a general issue. Higher peformance cpu/gpu the more heat it generates.

There are limited ways of getting rid of the heat. Heat sink and fan on the CPU but you don't want the fan too loud and you have to deal with probability of the vents being restricted or blocked.

Other components generate heat in the system. Hard drives, backlight supplies, charging circuits/controllers, power supply/regulators, DRAM, North and Southbridge chips, not just the CPU. That heat has to go somewhere also. Do you put a fan and heatsink on them too? or couple the heat to the case?
Dumping some of this heat into the case becomes very advantageous in the overall system design, and if you want a higher performing laptop it's a necessity.

Give me a single example where Apple ever implemented a production technique that was poorly cost effective.

Certainly there is incompetence in engineering and management in companies. Apple however has a record of one of the best, if not the best, industrial design groups in the industry. They may occasionally make poor product choices, but their product designs are almost without exception top notch and often leading edge.

To jump to the conclusion on very limited information that they are making huge mistakes in thermal design and production techniques is arrogance on your part. If I were you I would keep silent until more information is forth coming.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/7/08, Rating: -1
RE: Apple has magic now?
By randomly on 10/7/2008 11:28:02 AM , Rating: 4
Your statement is gibberish.

Obviously you have no engineering training and have no clue how thermal design actually works.
I think it best you remain silent on the subject until you educated yourself on the field.

High strength steels can have a better strength to weight ratio than most aluminum alloys. However for equivalent structures you can end up with the steel so thin that it is difficult to work or attach too. They also have different failure and damage modes. The aluminum has much higher thermal conductivity, and coupled with the increased thickness of the solution provides a much better thermal solution.

In weight critical applications like rockets what do they make the propellant tanks from? Steel? no, Aluminum.

You keep repeating this 'form over function' mantra with no clear example of what you are talking about. Give me an example in an existing apple product where significant functionality was actually sacrificed for a better form.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By audiomaniaca on 10/11/2008 11:02:56 AM , Rating: 2
Oh yes, I can give many examples.

The ridiculously located usb ports at the back of the iMacs. They are simply ridiculous. Every time I need to plug anything in and out, it requires me to turn the (huge 24 inches) computer in 60 degrees and mess the table up.

The ridiculously shaped hamburger mouse from the first iMacs
That was a real classic of stupidity over functionality.

The ipod earbuds. Can that be worst designed? It simply doesn't fit well the ear and doesn't provide acoustic isolation.

There are many more, I'm just tired to remember them all.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By 3DoubleD on 10/7/2008 12:13:09 PM , Rating: 2
You want an example?

How about the horrible screen coatings on the nanos? Even iPods in general are piss poorly designed. My favorite was the iPod mini. I think out of 6 of my friends that owned them, 5 of them broke within a year. I shouldn't even have to mention the inferior specifications of iPods vs competing products that have existed since the birth of the iPod. Since they charge so much for these inferior products I can only assume their production techniques are poorly cost effective.

I won't even bother addressing the huge premium on their laptops for absolutely no gain to the customer. I feel it would be easier if you named some cost effective production techniques they utilize.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Nyamekye on 10/7/08, Rating: 0
RE: Apple has magic now?
By ZmaxDP on 10/7/2008 5:22:40 PM , Rating: 3
Man, Apple is so evil they took away step 4 completely...

Damn you Steve Jobs! I Liked #4!


RE: Apple has magic now?
By DBRfreak on 10/6/2008 8:00:34 PM , Rating: 2
I think you're a little off base about the cost issue. Carbon fiber can be significantly less expensive than aluminum depending on the amount used and the manufacturing method. As others have said, milling is a very expensive process, especially when you're talking about machining things out of a solid billet. Lots of time on expensive machines, lots of waste chips.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By derwin on 10/6/2008 9:22:08 PM , Rating: 2
Carbon fiber has great str/weight ratios in certain aspects, but has relatively weak tensile strength... so its good for the hood of your car, but not so good as a door which would take head on (contorting) impacts, etc. Thats why you are loath to make an aircraft wing out of carbonfiber. Carbonfiber is not as strong as aluminum as far as making a casing for a computer (albeit I am still in college here, so please by all means correct me if I have placed a foot in my mouth).


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/6/2008 10:17:03 PM , Rating: 3
http://www.geocities.com/vpkelly.geo/index.html

Whole wing made out of carbon fiber.

http://www.answers.com/topic/carbon-fiber
http://www.azom.com/details.asp?ArticleID=2538

Couldn't be more wrong on the tensile strength. 5650 MPA of carbon fiber versus about the best 7001 aluminum at 570MPA. So, 10 times stronger for carbon fiber?


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Zshazz on 10/7/2008 2:36:49 AM , Rating: 2
Yeah... the real reason you wouldn't want a door made out of carbon fiber isn't because it's weaker... it's because it's too strong! You want the door to flex a little bit, because it decreases the energy transfered to the passengers.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By theapparition on 10/7/2008 10:13:29 AM , Rating: 2
Get ready to remove foot....:-)

Carbon fiber, or most composites like fiberglass, kevlar, etc. all have extreamly impressive tensile strengths. The tensile strength comes from it's fiber, weave, and layup. With the proper layup, strengths of over 100times an equivalent aluminum can be achieved.

However, composites don't generally have great compressive strength, since thier strength is now based on the matrix (read: glue) holding the fibers together. Think of it this way, a nylon stocking can lift up a car, but obviously if you tried to put a car on a stocking it would just be worthless. In that reguard, certain impacts can shatter the matrix rendering the composite damaged.

Still, with the right design, you can specifically engineer the composite to provide superiour strength in all directions.

The only thing holding back composites is cost. Partially because they can't be manufactured/formed as efficiently as metals, and partially because they can't be repaired. Once something is damaged, you pretty much have to replace it.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By kondor999 on 10/7/2008 3:37:46 PM , Rating: 2
Just wanted to mention that carbon fiber is very electrically conductive (not well known it seems).

And you're definitely wrong about the comparative strengths of AL and CF. Remember that CF is layed down in cross-plies as it is strong in only 1 direction. Try to bend a piece of thin flat cf, then repeat the experiment with a thin, flat piece of AL and you'll immediately see the difference.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By 91TTZ on 10/8/2008 9:05:23 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Carbon fiber has great str/weight ratios in certain aspects, but has relatively weak tensile strength... so its good for the hood of your car, but not so good as a door which would take head on (contorting) impacts, etc. Thats why you are loath to make an aircraft wing out of carbonfiber. Carbonfiber is not as strong as aluminum as far as making a casing for a computer (albeit I am still in college here, so please by all means correct me if I have placed a foot in my mouth).


They do make wings out of carbon fiber. Besides the cost, carbon fiber is an ideal material for wings.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By strikeback03 on 10/6/2008 4:05:54 PM , Rating: 3
not to mention that unless they have some serious plans for all the scrap, material costs alone will eat them up.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By michael2k on 10/6/2008 4:09:44 PM , Rating: 5
I hear you can recycle aluminum...


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/6/2008 4:15:53 PM , Rating: 5
Does the aluminum melt itself back into nice little bricks? I believe it takes a foundry to do that. Unless the ifoundry is on the way, I have a feeling that will cost some cash. You have to transport all that metal, which is a pain, I have done it more than a few times. Then you have to have someone melt it back down, that costs money. Not a great return on investment, as stamping is a much better use of the metal, and is a cheaper process. Oh, and it is also possible, unlike the story's process.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/6/08, Rating: 0
RE: Apple has magic now?
By FITCamaro on 10/6/08, Rating: -1
RE: Apple has magic now?
By Brandon Hill (blog) on 10/6/2008 4:21:34 PM , Rating: 4
And your point is?

Products fail. Just because one product from a company fails doesn't mean that a person is forbidden from buying something else the company makes -- or even the same product again.

And so what if she think it's pretty, girls like pretty, shiny things :)


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/6/08, Rating: 0
RE: Apple has magic now?
By FITCamaro on 10/6/08, Rating: -1
RE: Apple has magic now?
By Lord 666 on 10/6/08, Rating: -1
RE: Apple has magic now?
By FITCamaro on 10/6/08, Rating: -1
RE: Apple has magic now?
By Lord 666 on 10/6/2008 5:59:02 PM , Rating: 1
50 percent of all marriages fail...


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Fronzbot on 10/6/2008 9:41:25 PM , Rating: 4
90% of all statistics are made up ;)


RE: Apple has magic now?
By diego10arg on 10/6/2008 9:44:24 PM , Rating: 2
And now you should do something about that :P


RE: Apple has magic now?
By FITCamaro on 10/6/2008 11:06:31 PM , Rating: 4
So they don't need any help from me. If it breaks up, then I make a move. I don't believe in trying to seduce married women.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Misty Dingos on 10/7/08, Rating: 0
RE: Apple has magic now?
By FITCamaro on 10/7/2008 8:15:21 AM , Rating: 5
quote:
Or she seduces you, well that would be OK too.


No then I tell her husband and wouldn't get involved with her at all. If she'll cheat on him she'll cheat on me.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Myg on 10/7/2008 9:06:50 AM , Rating: 3
Spot on FIT; though this one would save alot more trouble for people...

- If someone can't say 'no' before being married, they wont be able to when they are.

Its all about habits, look for the people with the good ones!


RE: Apple has magic now?
By MrBlastman on 10/7/2008 9:12:30 AM , Rating: 2
here here!

Once a cheater... always a cheater.

I have a great friend who married this girl, she then fell in love with her flight instructor and it broke up their marriage. This flight instructor was married. She then broke up their marriage.

My friend is not happy and is pretty lonely. This other man's wife is now lonely. My friends ex-wife isn't completely happy with the man she ended up with.

Nobody wins.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By theapparition on 10/7/2008 10:16:23 AM , Rating: 2
Married woman won't tell your girlfriend either........


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Lord 666 on 10/7/2008 8:14:43 PM , Rating: 2
But it would be ok if the husband AND wife came on to you at the same time?


RE: Apple has magic now?
By homernoy on 10/6/2008 6:00:34 PM , Rating: 2
I have to admit aethstetics play quite a role when I buy components for a new PC (mainly the case). If I knew nothing about the specs of a PC or didn't play video games, I might be inclined to purchase the coolest looking computer.

In the case of laptops, that might be a Macbook. I don't see anything wrong with that, really. This is a hypothetical of course.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Aeonic on 10/6/2008 4:20:16 PM , Rating: 2
But... Plastic isn't as shiny. :]


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Howard on 10/6/2008 6:17:16 PM , Rating: 2
Pennies per pound? Aluminum is almost a dollar per pound now, and everything that isn't mild steel goes for quite a bit more.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/6/08, Rating: 0
RE: Apple has magic now?
By afkrotch on 10/7/2008 4:20:57 AM , Rating: 2
Dollar a pound for the company. $100 dollars per pound for the customer.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By kelmon on 10/7/2008 3:46:33 AM , Rating: 2
Customers don't want plastic because it looks and feels cheap. The same applies to pretty much any piece of electronics. Plastic is used for the low-end models but as soon as you get higher up in the range then metals are more desirable. And the customer is always right.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By PandaBear on 10/6/2008 6:20:13 PM , Rating: 3
IMO most likely it is a thin sheet of aluminum "frame" or a thick sheet that is too thin to be CNCed, and they will jet or laser cut various area for components locations. You install all the components on this "frame and then slap it onto the shell/case. It is not cutting out from a brick, that would be too heavy let alone wasteful. Cutting from a semi-finished sheet/frame is reasonable. Seems like someone misunderstood the concept.

The only time that really justify hollowing out a brick is vacuum environment. I've seen a 6 feet by 3 feet brick hollowed out for a vacuum chamber for 300mm wafer processes, because they cannot afford to have leak. That chamber alone is probably $200k.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By cornelius785 on 10/6/2008 4:31:31 PM , Rating: 2
My guess would have been apple is using a mill/cnc machine (could be interpretted as 'robots'), along with a laser or water cutter to break a block into rough shapes, to make the individual parts and the rumor has some false interpretations and guesses.

It is not easy to read the original article and figure out what is the: original slipped info/rumor, speculation, old facts, and the typical journalistic 'glue' to tie everything together.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By 3DoubleD on 10/6/2008 4:54:06 PM , Rating: 4
Even with this limited sketch information I can't see how cutting a laptop form (either entirely or for small pieces) would not bring cost savings to anyone. Cutting and folding sheet aluminum will always offer superior cost savings as waste is minimized (and easy to collect) with minimal strength loss (its a laptop, not a car frame). The whole idea is flawed, I really can't see the devil being in the details on this one.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/6/2008 5:00:29 PM , Rating: 1
I would go a step further, and say that making it out of anything besides a plastic or carbon fiber material is purely insane. What are these people doing with these laptops where they need all this strength? I usually don't throw my PC against the wall every hour on the hour just for the hell of it. Apparently the average Mac customer has an inordinate amount of rage against their possessions, and require serious strength to abade this.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By crimson117 on 10/6/2008 6:33:34 PM , Rating: 3
Aluminum is a much better heat sink than plastic or carbon fiber.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By 3DoubleD on 10/6/08, Rating: 0
RE: Apple has magic now?
By afkrotch on 10/7/2008 7:11:00 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Additionally,depending on what matrix the carbon fibers are set in, it could be a great conductor of heat (eg, metal with carbon fibers or carbon reinforced carbon (sounds crazy, but that is what the nose of the space shuttle is made of)).


Reinforced carbon carbon isn't made to conduct heat. It's made to withstand the heat. That's why it only covers the nose and wing edges.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By 3DoubleD on 10/7/2008 8:19:52 AM , Rating: 2
On second thought, you are correct it. Carbon-carbon was primarily chosen by NASA for its high strength while enduring high temperatures. However, it does have a high thermal conductivity too. This makes logical sense because if carbon-carbon was an insulator with a high melting point it would have no way to dissipate the energy accumulating in the nose/wing edges. That wouldn't protect the astronauts on re-entry. Carbon-carbon can have thermal conductivities close to that of aluminum.

http://www.stormingmedia.us/44/4418/A441803.html


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/6/08, Rating: 0
RE: Apple has magic now?
By Sooticus on 10/6/2008 8:14:21 PM , Rating: 2
Actually, using the case as a heatsink is not as much an issue as you might think. Sony brought out the x505 years ago, albeit a limited production, it was a fanless design using the case as a heatsink.

When your dealing with components that have a total of maybe 10-20W at load, Its probably unklikely that they will even get uncomforably warm. It might also indicate apples intention to use SSD and other low power features as standard.

I sould also mention that if mac wishes to continue shoehorning components into smaller frames, at the risk of reducing their operational lifespan due to heat disipation issues, this option has some merrit.

The stronger case could also be engineered to be water resistant. Only time will tell, or a design leak...


RE: Apple has magic now?
By FITCamaro on 10/7/2008 12:16:26 PM , Rating: 2
Actually yes they do use the case as a heatsink. The Apple G4 iBook I have has no fans. It uses the case as a heatsink. And it gets pretty hot.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By mindless1 on 10/6/2008 8:52:26 PM , Rating: 1
Actually, many laptop cases flex enough that eventually it causes mainboard or solder joint cracks if the laptop is moved around a lot or not handled with kid gloves. The situation is worse today than yesteryear because now they're using more bittle lead-free solder and more surface mounted, and smaller, components.

If these laptops were thrown against a wall you can bet they'd still break, they can't be making the Al case very thick or else it would weigh too much.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/6/2008 10:20:59 PM , Rating: 1
Uh, do you have examples of these joints breaking? The only ones I see break are the jacks like AC and headphones, since people bang them off things. Honestly it sounds like you made this up.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By mindless1 on 10/6/2008 11:57:12 PM , Rating: 1
Sorry but we don't keep damaged parts around. When the physical shock of dropping or other rough handling cause a failure, how else do you think it would happen? Laptop just got mad and decided to quit? Hardly. Physical stress causing cracks is a fairly well understood and accepted problem in the industry, one that some effort and cost is put into designing to prevent but only to a reasonable extent when consumers won't notice the difference at purchase time.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/7/2008 10:00:40 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Sorry but we don't keep damaged parts around. When the physical shock of dropping or other rough handling cause a failure, how else do you think it would happen? Laptop just got mad and decided to quit? Hardly.


Right, so how does aluminum better protect from shock damage? I would venture to say it worsens the problem, as plastic absorbs a blow better. You don't have examples cause it isn't happening.

If you are using plastic that they use to make drinking cups, I'm sure this is an issue. But in the real world, they design the plastic properly with reinforcements so no significant bowing occurs. You are making up a problem to justify what Apple does.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By mindless1 on 10/9/2008 12:37:35 AM , Rating: 2
You'd venture to say it because you don't understand the failure mechanism. The failure mechanism is not subjecting it to high G's, it's flexing the circuit board. Plastic flexes far more than aluminum does unless there is quite a lot more of it.

Every laptop I've ever handled had detectable flexing and creaking as the shell parts moved slightly. A rigid Al chassis removes this undesirable result.

I don't ever justify because it's Apple on any product, and frankly I own zero apple products, quite the contrary I see the other issues surrounding it being from Apple as negatives. I have only dispelled your myths. You utterly fail as a laptop chassis design opinionator.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By prenox on 10/7/2008 2:44:07 AM , Rating: 2
Uhhh Xbox 360? MS even admitted that it was their switch to the new solder that causes the joint breaking on the CPU and GPU.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/7/2008 9:54:33 AM , Rating: 2
http://sogamer.wordpress.com/2007/09/01/360rrod/

It was because of long term heat bowing the board, not flex from the case. This has nothing to do with material of the case, which is what we were speaking of. Meanwhile, who is tweaking the case of the 360 anyway? It is a stationary object, and is a horrible comparison to a laptop anyway.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By FITCamaro on 10/7/2008 12:18:58 PM , Rating: 2
My old laptop has a huge crack at the left hinge of the screen. The brackets are made of metal but encased in plastic. The plastic has cracked. There is a huge amount of stress on it that area when the screen is being lowered and raised. I can take a picture if you'd like.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By 3DoubleD on 10/6/2008 6:52:13 PM , Rating: 2
Edit: meant to say "I can't see how cutting a laptop form would bring cost savings to anyone"


RE: Apple has magic now?
By LivingDedBoy on 10/6/2008 4:49:21 PM , Rating: 2
Or they could just you know, cut the brick in half, hollow out the top, then the bottom. And poof a shell is born! Its magic!

I'm sure they aren't going to do one whole piece without seams... I mean that'd be the most useless laptop ever. Even if they could get the MB, Screen, keyboard, etc in there. How you gonna open it?

Then again they also don't say how big this brick is. Maybe they just cut individual pieces out for each part. Who knows! Its Apple, it'll probably be shiny, and exactly as useful as a non Apple computer. Because amazingly enough, despite what fan boys on both sides say. Now a-days, they're both the same in terms of functionality.

But then again this article is coming from a source who says its source is credible according to a rumor. Not exactly inspiring my confidence there.
quote:
9to5mac says its source insists that the rumor of the new manufacturing system for the MacBook computers is accurate.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By afkrotch on 10/7/2008 7:20:30 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
But then again this article is coming from a source who says its source is credible according to a rumor. Not exactly inspiring my confidence there.


Think it's actually a source who says their source says the rumor is real. Or maybe it's a rumor of a source who says a source of theirs says a rumor is correct.

Weeeeeeeeeeee!!!!


RE: Apple has magic now?
By pauldovi on 10/6/2008 4:59:54 PM , Rating: 3
I work for a manufacturing company as a process engineer. In this field they don't call rough stock a "brick" but instead a "forging", "billet", or even "rough stock". Brick is a retarded term.

It is not complicated to create a laptop out of billet aluminum. You would require at least 2 pieces obviously (LCD part and keyboard part). Financially it does not make sense to do this though....


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/6/08, Rating: 0
RE: Apple has magic now?
By mindless1 on 10/6/2008 8:54:43 PM , Rating: 1
That's not the two pieces some are talking about, they're talking about two pieces for the keyboard half and at least a 3rd piece for the screen.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By DLeRium on 10/6/2008 10:09:00 PM , Rating: 2
THANK YOU! Process engineers unite! Hah, well I may not be a process engineer dealing with aluminum, but I have enough metals processing knowledge to also know that it is a billet. Stop calling it a damn freaking brick you idiot. No one calls it a brick of aluminum. I hate it when people use the wrong terminology like when the WTC steel "melted."


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/6/2008 10:27:15 PM , Rating: 1
You don't call raw metal Billet champ. Billet is the finished product after machining a solid piece, so the finished laptop if done this way would be billet. Forging is a process, not a thing. Jesus, what kind of engineers are you guys? Most people just call it "stock". I assume we are dealing with many people who never get near the stuff, cause real work seems to scare many a person.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By pauldovi on 10/6/2008 10:49:10 PM , Rating: 2
Making a Mac Book case out of machined aluminum would require surface machining that would take 25-30 per cycle optimized. Cost effective? Not.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By SeeManRun on 10/6/2008 5:26:52 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Water jets are used for cutting, lasers as well. Not sure what magic factories Apple has, but I have yet to see something that can hog out the center of a brick, without it being in pieces first. Even the best 5 axis machines can't do this, so I would be interested to see what they actually are doing here.

CNC Machine?


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Gzus666 on 10/6/2008 5:48:19 PM , Rating: 2
Let me guess, never used a CNC before? What magic CNC machine can cut out inside of a 13-17 inch box of aluminum while leaving it as one piece with a place for a keyboard, and all other mounting? If it is a CNC mill, which it would have to be as a lathe wouldn't work, the head is monstrous, and the tool itself does not bend like rubber as it would need to to do this.

Even a 5 axis machine is not capable of these kinds of cuts, and the setup required would cost a fortune. Plus it would no longer be automated, cause you have to have someone setup the tooling, and the part itself. Some crazy jigs would be required to even attempt doing this in 2 pieces, let alone one.


RE: Apple has magic now?
By Don Tonino on 10/6/2008 5:29:04 PM , Rating: 2