Print 70 comment(s) - last by omnicronx.. on Oct 22 at 2:40 PM

  (Source: HP/Palm)

HP's Palm Pre 2 features webOS 2.0 and improved internals, but only packs a tiny 3.1-inch 320x480 display.  (Source: HP/Palm)
New device features a tiny 320x480 and won't launch in the U.S. until next month -- what is HP thinking?

Today Palm ended weeks of speculation unveiling the Palm Pre 2 (previously code-named Mansion) and its new webOS 2.0.  HP has shown its hand and it appears as underwhelming at best.

On the surface the device itself seems reasonably well-equipped, containing the kind of high-end hardware you'd find on a high-end Android phone.  The phone packs a 1 GHz processor (doubling the original Pre's processor which was underclocked to 500 MHz).  The camera is bumped from 3 MP to 5 MP.  Memory holds steady at 512 MB -- the same as the Pre Plus.  And the Flash storage -- 16 GB -- is also identical to the Pre Plus'.

The biggest disappointment is the screen.  The Pre 2 still packs the same 3.1-inch 320x480  HVGA display as its predecessor, at a time when Android and Apple have graduated to higher resolutions.  Other potential downside is the lack of microSD support and the lack of support for the latest/fastest 802.11n wireless standard.

If this was Hewlett-Packard's grand scheme to use its recent acquisition Palm to make a splash on the smart phone market, something seems to be missing. 

Compare Palm's launch today with Microsoft's launch of Windows Phone 7 next month and you'll realize that Palm is at a distinct disadvantage.  Palm only has one new handset -- Microsoft has nine (as does Android, for that matter).  Palm supports apps (including Angry Birds and Oprah Mobile!), Skype, Bluetooth, and VPN, but Microsoft is expected to support these things as well (and Android already does).

One of the only advantages that Palm holds over Microsoft is that webOS 2.0, features a refined version of true multitasking, which is available for both third party and built-in apps.  Windows Phone 7 is expected to only support multitasking for built-in apps, not for third party apps.  Then again, the iOS and Android platforms already support true multitasking, so Palm is hardly in a league of its own here.

The success or failure of the Pre 2 ultimately matters little to HP, other than perhaps as a matter of pride (it's chief rival Dell is designing/launching multiple upcoming Android and Windows Phone 7 smart phones).  HP can afford to sustain Palm even if the experiment isn't working out, in interest of one day trying to conquer the phone market.

But in the face of a fast-advancing smart phone market, HP needs to do something at some point if it ever wants to get ahead -- more handsets -- better hardware than its competitors -- some decisive advantage.  That something is not the Palm Pre 2 -- a single smart phone with a tiny, low-resolution screen and lack of brand recognition. 

But HP seems determined to go its own way and will launch the device into the packed market anyways.  The Pre 2 will launch Friday in France and in "coming months" in the United States and Canada.

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That is one tiny screen!
By MrX8503 on 10/19/2010 11:47:54 AM , Rating: 2
What is HP thinking? Do they have amnesia and have totally forgotten that the Palm Pre 1 was a failure? *sigh*

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By Samus on 10/19/2010 11:52:50 AM , Rating: 1
They clearly don't know jack shit about the phone marketplace. Sadly, over 10 years into it, neither does Microsoft, but we'll see if at least they reinvent themself....hmm, isn't that an HP term?

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By inighthawki on 10/19/2010 1:24:08 PM , Rating: 2
Had to slip in MS huh? You know, just because you don't like what WP7 is going to be doesn't mean there aren't others who do. It's clearly a quality made product if you get passed the few missing features (most of which are useless for its target market anyway).

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By Xenon14 on 10/19/10, Rating: 0
RE: That is one tiny screen!
By inighthawki on 10/19/2010 2:23:29 PM , Rating: 4
Features ARE what make the device, you just have to understand that the term "feature" refers to more than just the hardware level benefit over competition or included apps.

Yes, the Wii WAS worse on paper, but the attractive feature was motion controls. As far as WP7 goes, it may not have multitasking or copy/paste (yet) but it has what some may consider to be a very nice interface and great integration with existing software, as well as a selection of rather high-performing hardware via MS's specifications.

As for Palm, from what I've read, it has little actually going for it. They have a fairly generic looking phone with a small screen, (didn't take note on the CPU), and the last one wasn't that great either. So where is the interest?

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By mcnabney on 10/19/2010 6:36:28 PM , Rating: 2
Wii offered a significantly lower price and brought with it a completely new way of playing games. The Pre, not so much. Nice OS, lousy hardware. Pathetic marketing. At least this time it won't be anchored to a Sprint exclusive.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By Samus on 10/19/10, Rating: 0
RE: That is one tiny screen!
By Chadder007 on 10/20/2010 1:39:11 AM , Rating: 2
I've already played with one, I still like the WebOS much better. It's more intuitive to me. Just wished there was a better form factor avail and more apps.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By retrospooty on 10/20/2010 8:12:41 AM , Rating: 2
"I still like the WebOS much better. It's more intuitive to me. Just wished there was a better form factor avail and more apps. "

Me too... to bad it looks like it wont happen. I could totally love a Web OS Droid 2 hardware based phone, or perhaps Droid incredible-ish

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By Targon on 10/20/2010 10:14:31 PM , Rating: 2
The Pre 2 is really the Pre Plus Plus. In theory, the REAL Pre 2 will be a more significant upgrade, but HP/Palm is staying silent until 2011 when the big technology trade shows provide a stage for BIG product announcements. You may notice that the Pre 2 is really the existing Palm Pre Plus with some hardware improvements and a major OS update. The current Pre Plus can already be overclocked to 1GHz with ease, so making a STOCK Pre Plus that clocks to 1GHz isn't a big deal, except that it does it with less power draw than an overclocked Pre Plus.

Apple releases their big products at various times of the year, for iPhones, laptops, and desktops. Google just releases Android updates whenever, and various manufacturers pump out updates. HP never really got into the cell phone industry until they bought Palm, but there have been statements to indicate there will be multiple WebOS based phones released in the next 9 months or so.

A "slab" style with ONLY a touchscreen is something expected. A larger version of the current Pre Plus(or Pre 2) with a vertical slider design is what many have been waiting for. If you took the current Pre Plus or Pre 2 and gave it a 3.8 inch screen and also kept the vertical slider, that would be seen as a winner by many people. A tablet is also expected(PalmPad is the name floating around).

If you compare the Pre 2 to other high end devices on the market, the only thing that is weak is the screen size. 1GHz processor, 512MB of RAM, 16GB of storage is fairly standard right now, though the storage may seem small, it is enough for most people. How many devices actually exceed those specs? It is the screen size that people are complaining about, and having a physical keyboard does help compensate a BIT, but not enough.

I'd wait until March before counting HP/Palm out.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By inighthawki on 10/20/2010 12:12:19 PM , Rating: 2
Nobody called it revolutionary, and the only reason i called it quality was because it looks like a superior and better performing version of the zune HD OS which i've used extensively and love. I've watched a lot of reviews on it as well, and done some development which is very nice. It is quite apparent that it wasn't something thrown together last second.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By omnicronx on 10/19/2010 11:56:09 AM , Rating: 4
Oh stop whining .. Not everyone, heck MOST people do not want a giant candy bar in their pocket.

This idea that every smartphone needs 4"+ display is completely ridiculous..

It also has the slide out keyboard which limits the screen size in the first place. I know many more people that would care about the lack of keyboard over a large screen.

That being said, there are rumors that the next Palm device to be out next year will be of the candybar style, most likely with a larger display.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By UNCjigga on 10/19/2010 12:33:40 PM , Rating: 2
Exactly, screen size/resolution is not as important as some make it out to be. On a pure touchscreen device it is important, but not so much on a device with a keyboard. I've been using a Droid Pro demo unit and I find Android perfectly usable on a smaller touchscreen.

I'm curious whether HP will target this device more to business users, as RIM and Microsoft are struggling in that department, while Android/iOS still haven't gained a lot of traction in that market.

By VitalyTheUnknown on 10/19/2010 12:56:53 PM , Rating: 4
"screen size/resolution is not as important as some make it out to be."

Depends on what you do with your smart-phone, If you're going to browse the Internet on a phone it's the most important combo.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By nafhan on 10/19/2010 12:40:52 PM , Rating: 5
Even with the same display size 640 x 480 would have made a big difference.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By quiksilvr on 10/19/2010 12:42:18 PM , Rating: 3
Actually I wouldn't have minded 640x360. Seriously, at least make it widescreen.

But they fell short in some other areas as well. No 802.11n wireless for one. No microSDHC slot either.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By Moishe on 10/19/2010 4:01:08 PM , Rating: 3
802.11n is really a necessary thing at this point?

I'd love an expansion slot too, but I wouldn't consider it a deal breaker.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By Suntan on 10/19/10, Rating: -1
RE: That is one tiny screen!
By Suntan on 10/20/2010 12:24:53 PM , Rating: 1
OOOhhh... Hit a nerve with all the giant-phone-clipped-to-the-belt IT nerds out there huh?


RE: That is one tiny screen!
By Targon on 10/20/2010 10:20:04 PM , Rating: 2
WebOS is very easy to code for, and is fully open for patching and coding. Palm, and now HP encourage the idea of Homebrew applications and patches.

If the phone had a larger screen, it would get more respect, since the hardware specs are competitive with the other high end devices on the market.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By AstroCreep on 10/19/2010 3:16:34 PM , Rating: 5
Not everyone, heck MOST people do not want a giant candy bar in their pocket.

That's not a giant candy bar; I'm just happy to see you.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By adiposity on 10/19/2010 11:59:37 AM , Rating: 4
They haven't had time to do a complete hardware redesign. You can be sure better hardware is already being designed. Maybe they should consider licensing the software. Most agree it's better than Android--especially for developers.

I wish google had bought it and taken the good parts to put into Android.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By The Raven on 10/19/2010 2:29:47 PM , Rating: 2
We should all just pass the collection plate around, buy the rights, and open source it to the community, and get the good parts.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By n00bxqb on 10/19/2010 7:54:08 PM , Rating: 2
That doesn't stop DT from slagging it ... We should fully expect a complete redesign 3 months after the acquisition was finalized ... :roll:

I would assume a phone that was designed from scratch, tested, and mass manufactured in 3 months would be a disaster. You wouldn't have anywhere near enough time to adequately design or test it.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By Moishe on 10/19/2010 3:35:08 PM , Rating: 2
I just gotta say, your comment, and the stupid subtitle in the article are just lame. Mick should be ashamed, but the articles are always the same. Spend less time coming up with inaccurate sensational words and more time proofreading.

The screen is not tiny. The screen is basically a normal cellphone screen size and resolution. It IS smaller than the a lot of the recent generation of smartphones, but those are not the norm. The norm is iphone/pre.

Also the word "tiny" is like calling the hummer "enormous", when in reality, it's just big. Sensationalism.

OMGZZ!1 it's tiny!! ...

Gimme a break.
OMGZZORsZ!1 it doesn't do 802.11*N*!! ...

Are you effing kidding me with this?

It's obvious what HP did here. HP took the current device and put the new OS on it and then clocked the CPU to 1Ghz (the Pre+ was underclocked). It's the easiest way to turn something around, sell old stock, and save time until the next device. Is this a great strategy? Not great, but given no other device at this time, it's not a bad idea. I bet they have a crapload of unsold Palm Pre+ devices that are burning a hole in their pocket. Best to unload them.

I own a Pre+ and the keyboard makes me want to commit murder just about every day. Other than that, it's a great phone. The webOS is brilliant.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By Moishe on 10/19/2010 3:45:34 PM , Rating: 2
By the way,
iPhone is 3.5"
Pre+ 3.1" (12% less than iPhone, but higher DPI)
Droid X 4.3" (22% more than iPhone)
Fascinate 4"

There are too many to list, but the new smart phones are aiming for >4" and widescreen. I think 4" is about the right size for me, but the idea that 3.1" is "tiny" compared to 4" is just absurd. "Tiny" would be closer to 25% or less than 4", which is around 1 inch.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By augiem on 10/20/2010 1:56:27 AM , Rating: 2
Pre was/is a great phone. Its failure can be attributed almost 100% to horrendous marketing. If you hate the Pre keyboard, you might as well forget a touchscreen. Even though the keys are tiny on Pre, I make FAR fewer mistakes on it vs any touch-only phone or even most of the newer horizontal format sliders. The very tactile bubble shape of the keys makes it much easier to sense which key you're touching than a lot of the flatter keyboards, including the Epic. And it doesn't have the odd angled keys of most of the candy bar QWERTY's out there. I feel like the Pre keyboard is almost ideal for me. If it came in my ideal screen size of 3.7" (roomy enough without going overboard) I'd be very happy. Except one big caveat: HP says it won't license WebOS... Okay, sad to say it, but that's likely the death throe for this amazing underdog. The OS was (and is) the multitasking king when everyone else was afraid to touch it. Unfortunately the one with the better marketing always wins in the end regardless of the product. That story's been repeated so many times throughout history.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By Chadder007 on 10/19/2010 4:10:23 PM , Rating: 2
The form factor was what kept me from getting on in the first place....and thats what stays the same? WTF!

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By johnsonx on 10/20/2010 4:34:07 AM , Rating: 2
can you not comprehend that the form factor is why other people did get one in the first place, and those people don't want it to change in any major way? other form factors are likely coming, so settle down.

RE: That is one tiny screen!
By YerMomma on 10/20/2010 3:45:00 PM , Rating: 2
Was it really a failure of the product? or was it a failure of marketing?

I know many people with the original Pre that swear by it, most of them a real estate agents that were simply attracted the Palm name since that has been synonymous with that industry for a long time. The OS was great, many review sites even say they loved the software, but hated the physical hardware.

But think about the hardware for a second... do MOST users need a 1ghz processor? absolutely not, its just a huge waste of battery life, do they need a 1 billion x 1 billion resolution screen? No, they want to make phone calls, look at maps and calendars and basic things like that, and a low resolution works just fine for those tasks. So while geeks despise the phone due to its "lackluster" hardware, the real end users who actually went out and bought it seem to like it.

True Multitasking
By ThatMatthew on 10/19/2010 3:02:01 PM , Rating: 2
"Then again, the iOS and Android platforms already support true multitasking, so Palm is hardly in a league of its own here."

That's incorrect. iOS only allows certain things to be done in the background (like playing music or completing a download), and both iOS and Android will kill apps without you knowing it. You never know what apps are open or closed on those phones. With webOS, you have all the apps open that you want, and they're all fully alive, not in a suspended state like iOS.

RE: True Multitasking
By MrFord on 10/19/2010 3:53:23 PM , Rating: 2
True. People kind of assume that the Android, or iOS way of doing multitasking is the only way to do it.

Once you got used to the cards system on WebOS, anything else feels like multitasking on Windows Mobile 5, just plain clunky. Add the notifications system to that, and you find yourself really using multiple applications at the same time, something I didn't even see the usefulness on my old BlackBerry. But one you get used to it, you can't go back.

RE: True Multitasking
By Moishe on 10/19/2010 3:58:07 PM , Rating: 2
True... the cards are really good. When I use a friend of family's iphone I forget and get pissed that the apps close completely.

After using webOS for almost a year, I hope that in 6-9 months there will be a newer/better webOS phone out. I don't want to drop the OS, but I do want to get rid of the Palm keyboard.

RE: True Multitasking
By MrFord on 10/19/2010 4:29:55 PM , Rating: 2
I have a love/hate relationship with the keyboard, as most users do. Granted my replacement phone is MUCH better than the original one, barely any double typing, so it seems like a QA problem more than a design one.

I find the keyboard cramped, but at the same time, I wouldn't want a bigger device. The Blackberry keyboard is a bit more easy to type on, but the Palm layout is more logical. I like the rubbery feel of the Palm over the plasticky BB, but the feedback isn't as good on the Palm.

Yes the Pre is small compared to the competition, but it should be seen as a good thing. Not everybody wants to carry a brick around with them, and the round corners makes it feel even smaller than a BB. I also like not having to turn the device around to type on it.

They definitely need to work on the hardware side, and furnish the App store. Also offer different from factors on top of Pre/Pixi.

One last thing: Touchstone charger anyone? Right there is one of the greatest feature.

RE: True Multitasking
By johnsonx on 10/20/2010 4:28:23 AM , Rating: 2
I didn't think the touchstone was such a big deal until I got one, and then another for the car. I can't imagine now what a step back it would seem like to have to actually physically plug in my phone to charge it each night.

RE: True Multitasking
By wolrah on 10/20/2010 11:44:29 AM , Rating: 2
The unfortunate thing with the Touchstone is that it requires a magnetic rear case on the phone, making a compass impossible to support. I thought compasses were useless on phones until trying Google Sky Map on Android, at which point the potential of AR via a phone really hit me.

RE: True Multitasking
By Chaser on 10/20/2010 10:17:36 AM , Rating: 3
and Android will kill apps without you knowing it.
First of all in reality compared to Android and Ios Pre doesn't have any apps. So it probably easy to multitask a phone call and reading an email message.

Second of all Android doesn't "close apps (that the user is running) without you knowing it". Nice propaganda try.

All you Pre revivalists really need to stop worshiping your epicly failed phone.

RE: True Multitasking
By Targon on 10/21/2010 5:43:52 AM , Rating: 2
If the Pre 2 had a 3.9 inch screen, you might be one of the people saying how amazing WebOS is, rather than trashing it. Most people work for a living and don't sit there watching MOVIES on their phone. When you type on a touchscreen-only device, doesn't the on-screen keyboard take up most if not all of your display as you type? The vertical slider concept isn't bad.

Many people find the new Blackberry Torch to be decent, since it is better than previous Blackberry devices, and the Pre 2(and hell, Pre Plus) are better devices all around.

Now, if you eliminate the 20000 fart apps and useless garbage apps, Palm may have fewer apps, but there is continued growth in the Palm app store, and having the apps I WANT is more important than how many apps there are.

You also clearly do not know about Preware, and all the homebrew apps and patches available, which adds thousands of apps to the list of what is available.

RE: True Multitasking
By robinthakur on 10/21/2010 7:33:25 AM , Rating: 2
I agree that when the Pre origginally came ocut the multi-tasking was one of the most unique features delivered in the best way. At the time. iOS's implementation is one of the best, I think in operation however for Apps which are multi-task aware (i.e. all or most of them by now) What exactly do you want to access through multi-tasking which is not already available and what is the utility of it? What impact does this have on battery life? There is a good reason why iOS devices have industry leading battery life (conspicuously so, compared to Android)

Lastly, whilst it is true that iOS can kill apps by itself, in the real world, the times i've noticed that an App I want to switch between has been killed since multitasking was launched back in June? Zero times. A lot of that is to do with iOS launching Apps so fast from scratch anyway, and all the core Apple Apps already did decent multitasking long before June, that seriously I still don't really think multitasking is that big a deal on iPhone. Quite a few people I speak to simply arenv't aware that it even exists...!

Interum Release
By omnicronx on 10/19/2010 11:52:02 AM , Rating: 2
Something gives me a feeling this is an interim release for Palm, just to keep them relevant until their new devices hit next year. (Their have been spotting's of a higher resolution Palm device recently)

I would also like to point out that the Pre screen while small, is quite good :) Unlike most Android phones, and pre iPhone4, it has always had a nice 24bit display and great contrast ratio and colour reproduction. Some Android phones (ex Droid X) do have them, but don't take advantage of it in many of their apps which are only 16 bit.. such as the photo app. The EVO and incredible and Nexus one are just plain old 16 bit displays.

Certainly does the Pre 2 does fall short if this was expected to be their flagship device for the next year, but I don't think that is the case. (Could perhaps even to boost sales during the holiday season who knows).

RE: Interum Release
By VitalyTheUnknown on 10/19/10, Rating: -1
RE: Interum Release
By inighthawki on 10/19/2010 2:28:38 PM , Rating: 3
8-bit? I don't know what year you're living in but I've had 32-bit color on my LCD panels for quite some time now...

RE: Interum Release
By DM0407 on 10/19/2010 3:44:21 PM , Rating: 2
All monitors produce only three colors, RGB. The color pallet is determined by the GPU. 8bit color is only 64 unique colors, which is less than a Crayola box.

How's your NES looking on that new flat screen?

RE: Interum Release
By VitalyTheUnknown on 10/19/10, Rating: 0
RE: Interum Release
By inighthawki on 10/19/2010 7:16:58 PM , Rating: 2
Thanks for copy and pasting information from another website. We all know what color depth and dithering is.

Also, you completely changed the definition of the OP's comment. He referred to 16-bit color as the total color depth, not the 8v6 bit you are talking about. It is you who sounds like an idiot intermixing two definitions then blaming others for not understanding.

RE: Interum Release
By VitalyTheUnknown on 10/19/10, Rating: 0
RE: Interum Release
By inighthawki on 10/19/2010 8:57:56 PM , Rating: 2
I was referring to:
The EVO and incredible and Nexus one are just plain old 16 bit displays.

to which you responded with:
Most LCD panels for TV and computer monitors are 8 bit and you are not satisfied with 16 bit on tiny 3.2-4.3 inch screens, this is ridiculous.

to which you took out of context and changed definitions. Also I would apologize since I did not think before osting that when in fact I meant 24-bit. I am very used to working in 32-bit color models specifying an alpha channel in graphics programming.

RE: Interum Release
By dsumanik on 10/20/10, Rating: 0
RE: Interum Release
By omnicronx on 10/22/2010 2:40:57 PM , Rating: 2
I think he means the digital processor that comes with your LCD.. 8bit was the standard for a very long time. This confuses people all the time.

It refers to the amount of discrete colors (well its more or less levels of intensity for each color) each sub pixel (i.e R, G, and B) can produce. 8 bit (2^8) is 256 variations per sub pixel. 10 bit (2^10) is 1024 and so on..

Not the same thing though as color depth as you've nicely pointed out ;)

Perhaps a 1Ghz Resurrection
By Bruneauinfo on 10/19/2010 5:17:45 PM , Rating: 2
i pretty much hate my Palm Pre. i've been using it for over a year now. my first one was destroyed and i'm on my second. was hoping my first was just defective, before it was smashed of course, but the new one isn't much better than the old one was pre-crushed. not saying there are any hardware defects or battery problems with my Pre. but the thing is clunky and the user interface is poorly designed - i think over-designed for the hardware. touchscreen interface needs a lot of work. and the QC in the apps - both integrated and from the market - is pretty low.

so here's hoping Pre 2 and WebOS 2.0 resolve some of these issues. VERY unlikely i'll get one anytime soon or ever, unless it turns out HP worked some kind of miracle.

RE: Perhaps a 1Ghz Resurrection
By finbarqs on 10/20/2010 12:40:12 AM , Rating: 2
Sure, Linux supports TRUE multi-tasking, but so far, only WebOS managed to pull off true multi-tasking. Try this on your iOS or Android phones:

Open a notepad, and write someone's contact information in. Now go create a new contact, and switch between the apps and copy them back and forth. I can't do that with my EVO device, if I don't finish a contact and switch to another app, that app is outta there!

With the WebOS, I'll just swipe between cards, and voila! I can copy! oh and I like using swipe commands more than looking for buttons. It's just more fun! The only thing I'd say is a disadvantage to this WebOS 2.0 is that it looks dated... Maybe a more updated OS?

RE: Perhaps a 1Ghz Resurrection
By Bruneauinfo on 10/20/2010 9:44:53 AM , Rating: 2
??? what's that got to do with what i said ??

RE: Perhaps a 1Ghz Resurrection
By Targon on 10/20/2010 10:31:11 PM , Rating: 2
The original Sprint version of the Palm Pre had a LOT of build quality issues, and unfortunately, Sprint didn't go back to Palm to replace their original Palm Pre with the Plus version which fixed most build quality issues.

Most Sprint users right now are upset that the Pre Plus never came to Sprint, and are waiting to hear if/when the Pre 2 will come to their cellular provider of choice.

The Pre Plus by the time it came to AT&T really did fix most of the build quality issues, but there will always be people who don't take care of their phones, drop them, etc, and then whine when they break.

The Pre 2 does continue the build quality improvements, so hopefully these improvements continue.

Designed to fail...
By StealthX32 on 10/19/2010 1:26:48 PM , Rating: 2
Didn't the CEO of HP say they wanted Palm just for the intellectual property and were planning to axe Palm anyways?

Well here it is. You can't terminate everyone without release a sub-par product, claim HUGE losses as a result, axe the whole division. Thanks for the IP, now we don't have to pay you either.

RE: Designed to fail...
RE: Designed to fail...
By kumquatsrus on 10/19/2010 5:23:54 PM , Rating: 2
that's incorrect and taken out of context. hp is serious about supporting webos and entering the smartphone market as evidenced by their upcoming webos tablet and webos phones to be announced at ces 2011.

article correction
By kumquatsrus on 10/19/2010 5:27:11 PM , Rating: 2
the pre2 is not the device codenamed "mansion". it was the c40-now roadrunner device long in development before hp picked up palm, which is just being released now. the "mansion" is going to be the high-end hp webos slab phone tba at ces 2011 along with the webos slate and other webos phones, which hp has already mentioned quite a few times before.

RE: article correction
By kumquatsrus on 10/19/2010 5:29:34 PM , Rating: 2
furthermore, the pre2 is just meant to be a stopgap for those who need to upgrade from the original pre/ pre plus before hp releases it's own new set of hp webos branded phones.

RE: article correction
By johnsonx on 10/20/2010 4:13:22 AM , Rating: 2
you are correct: the Pre 2 is not 'mansion'; it's 'roadrunner'. however saying it's going to be a slab phone is pure speculation. it apparently will have a high-res screen, 800x480 I think, but that doesn't make it a slab. likewise it is suggested it will have a virtual keyboard, but that doesn't mean it won't also have a physical keyboard - palm has been very adamant about keeping physical keyboards. so it may be a slab, or it may not.

This release was just in the pre-HP Palm pipeline...
By vortmax2 on 10/19/2010 12:30:29 PM , Rating: 2
As a previous poster stated, this release is just to keep Palm in the game until a newly designed smartphone with competitive specs can be released. Don't knock the power of WebOS 2.0 until you try it. It's miles ahead of Andriod and iOS in many areas...

By Chaser on 10/19/2010 1:09:18 PM , Rating: 2
Yeah. We've heard all that now for too long. Pre was out of the game two weeks after it's first launch and never walked back out onto the field.

The relevance of the article is that this is the first phone release after the grand HP acquisition and the market was expecting something to put Pre and Palm back into competition. This phone might have had a chance as the original Pre.

That being said WebOs is a great device OS and I personally look forward to the tablets that may have it. But today WebOS is going to need some major application support to even have a chance to be the bat boy.

Oh the humanity
By theapparition on 10/19/2010 2:22:29 PM , Rating: 2
Palm supports apps (including Angry Birds and Oprah Mobile !)

Oh crap, she's gone mobile. At first I started screaming, then realized it was just a bad typo.

RE: Oh the humanity
By The Raven on 10/19/2010 2:32:27 PM , Rating: 2
Why wouldn't Oprah have an app? Everyone does. Google Oprah Mobile.

I loved the form factor of the Pre...
By VooDooAddict on 10/20/2010 9:29:47 PM , Rating: 2
I loved the form factor of the Pre... It's a great size and shape for a powerful portable PHONE. I still use one actually.

It's unfortunately not been very reliable. And this new phone has nothing exciting for the Palm loyalists.

I was waiting to see what was next for the Palm and the Pre platform ... looks like I'm going Android.

By Targon on 10/20/2010 10:38:10 PM , Rating: 2
The only reason the Pre 2 isn't exciting is because most of the original Palm Pre phones could be overclocked to 1GHz, and I have not heard many, if any Pre Plus phones that could not hit 1GHz.

Since the Pre Plus already had 512MB RAM and 16 GB of storage, the only real changes here is the glass screen, and a stock 1GHz speed. The OS update will come to the existing Palm Pre and Pre Plus phones.

On the flip side, how many people automatically looked down on the Palm Pre due to the 500MHz stock clock speed? Now, you look at a 1GHz processor, 512MB RAM, and 16GB storage, without taking screen size into account, and does that sound like a sub-standard device? It sounds like it ranks up there with the high end phones out there on the market, doesn't it?

Most people can't handle change, such as moving from "hitting buttons" to using the gesture area, but once you make the transition, the very idea of hitting physical buttons just feels primitive.

So, take the Pre 2, give it a 3.9 inch screen, and suddenly, it becomes an AMAZING phone, just because people can't look beyond the screen size these days.

By tharik on 10/19/2010 1:54:16 PM , Rating: 2
Enough said.

"true multitasking"
By ScotterQX6700 on 10/19/2010 4:46:34 PM , Rating: 2
From what I've read and seen, it is debatable whether you can call Apple's implementation in the iPhone 4 "true multitasking". From what I've read, only PalmOS and Android OS allow for true multitasking unless you jailbreak the iPhone, of course. If the author had just said "multitasking" then I would not have argued semantics. But "true multitasking" seems to beg a bit more stringent requirement, eh?

screen size, virtual keyboard
By ScotterQX6700 on 10/19/2010 5:13:26 PM , Rating: 2
I see writing on the wall. Yes, some prefer a physical keyboard for various valid reasons. However, the flexibility and compact nature of having a keyboard-less phone is compelling enough that we are seeing a rise in popularity of this (keyboardless) form factor. To use hardware real estate for a relatively inflexible function (physical keys) seems antiquated when you consider the alternatives.

And same with the benefits of larger screens and increasing popularity of larger screens. If we are going to be typing on the device, it's typically easier to have bigger virtual keys and more screen real estate that is not taken up by the virtual keyboard. And if you are going to be browsing web sites, clicking on links, etc., it's easier to have a bigger screen.

Of course the drawback at some point is portability. My sweet spot seems to be 4" or 4.3". I'm not sure if the Evo is too big for me. It looks like there isn't a whole lot they could shave off the sides to reduce the bevel. Some room but not much. Definitely some room on the bottom but again, only a bit. The top has a speaker and the video camera built-in so I can see a need to keep that bevel as-is. I'm just thinking out loud about my "dream phone". Those Samsung Galaxy 9000-based phones are a really nice size with their 4" screens. Very light and flat, too. But if I'm going to jump from my current Nexus One 3.7", I want to jump big. Hoping for something like an Evo 2 that has slightly less bevel, higher resolution - although - I'm not sure I would want more than 800x480 on a 4.3" screen. I know Apple does a higher rez (960x640) on their 3.5" screen (which yeah, I admit I think of as "tiny") and people seem to like it - but seriously: remember running 1024x768 on a 15" monitor? I'm thinking something like 1280x720 (720p HD) MIGHT be easy enough on the eyes on a 4.3" screen? What do you experts out there think? And I'm willing to hear someone tell me high resolutions on 3-5" screens doesn't pose any problems if you design the icons, etc. large enough or scalable ... I'm guessing this is what Apple did so that people are not squinting; everything is the right size for that 3.5" screen; and bonus, very high level of clarity and flexibility for games, photo & movie viewing, etc.?

Also: how many of you see a movement toward 16:9 aspect ratio resolutions such as 1280x720 (HD 720p), 1600x900 (HD+), 1920x1080 (HD 1080) ? I would be willing to bet the next crop of high end Android phones will run 1280x720 because it has become such a pervasive standard. Thoughts?

All depends on price
By Murst on 10/20/2010 11:20:44 AM , Rating: 2
Sure, this thing might not compete with the newest iPhone/droid/whatever, but maybe it isn't intended to be in that market?

If this thing sells for $100 unlocked, I bet it would be a pretty popular choice. It might not be good compared to a $600 phone, but it probably doesn't cost $600 either.

Again - this will all depend on the price.

Here's your sign...
By CrazyBernie on 10/19/10, Rating: 0
"Well, there may be a reason why they call them 'Mac' trucks! Windows machines will not be trucks." -- Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer
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