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PlayStation 3 will soon double as a DVR, but not in the U.S.

Sony had been hinting at adding expanded DVR capabilities to its PlayStation 3 console on more than one occasion. At the Leipzig Games Convention, Sony Computer Entertainment Europe made it official by announcing the new PlayTV product.

PlayTV will enable the PlayStation 3 with TV tuner and video recorder functions, allowing users to watch, pause and record TV programs. The TV tuner with PlayTV will be capable of processing and capturing high-definition signals in 1080P.

PlayTV will utilize the built-in hard drive inside every PS3 to store the recorded files. The recordings can then be viewed later from the TV or the PSP handheld via the Remote Play feature.

Controlling PlayTV will make use of the SIXAXIS controller, coupled with an on-screen menu that will scale according to the resolution of the display. PlayTV will also support the Blu-ray Disc remote accessory.

"The introduction of PlayTV really will extend the already broad entertainment credentials of PS3, and makes it an exceptionally attractive proposition for the whole family," said David Reeves, President of Sony Computer Entertainment Europe. "PS3 already provides High Definition gaming, Blu-ray Disc movies, music, video, photo album, web browsing and PlayStation Network support. With the introduction of PlayTV's state of the art TV tuner and PVR functionality, PS3 is now the best choice of home entertainment hub for the whole family."

As the announcement took place during a European gaming convention, Sony only announced that PlayTV will be available in UK, France, Italy, Germany and Spain early in 2008. Unfortunately, for those in North America looking forward to this product, Phil Harrison of Sony Worldwide told Kotaku that the product is not planned for the U.S. due to the region’s lack of terrestrial digital television.

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Nice
By DingieM on 8/23/2007 8:48:21 AM , Rating: 2
Nice development, but not yet for my home country.

The leaked fall 2007 Xbox360 firmware update says IPTV support for the DirektTV service will be added, hope it will extend it to TV services in Europe very soon.
Unless DirektTV is available in Europe. Funny thing is, I really don't remember if it was DirektTV or some other name. Thus fellas correct me if I'm wrong...




RE: Nice
By Flunk on 8/23/2007 10:14:08 AM , Rating: 2
A heads up for Canadians but we can expect the Xbox 360 to be made compatible with the IPTV services of a major national Canadian TV provider (can't say who right now) in the near future.


RE: Nice
By omnicronx on 8/23/2007 10:19:21 AM , Rating: 2
Cool, thanks for the info. Theres only so many providers available though so i wonder who it could be.. theres no direct tv so i would guess either rogers or bell ;)


what?
By johnsonx on 8/23/2007 12:31:19 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
the product is not planned for the U.S. due to the region’s lack of terrestrial digital television.


Ok, I guess I need someone to explain that to me. I have an HDTV with an ATSC OTA tuner. I get lots of digital HD channels from my little RCA indoor antenna, to say nothing of what I would get if I put an 'real' antenna on the roof. Is this not terrestrial digital television?




RE: what?
By otispunkmeyer on 8/24/2007 3:55:47 AM , Rating: 2
not sure...

terrestrial TV to me (i live in the UK) is free, over the air transmission of tv channels. there is no service provider per se, you just get an antenna and a digital tuner and thats it...and it doesnt matter where you live in the country you can still have the ability to recieve all the channels, ours isnt HD though.

is that what your tv is like? you see with the US being so large, you might have free, OTA digital tv, but it might only be in your state or you might get channels others dont that might not like you recording stuff. the neighbouring state might not be the same. whereas in the UK everyone gets the same channels.


RE: what?
By Bladen on 8/24/2007 6:52:01 AM , Rating: 2
I thought in the UK a TV licence is required to own a device capable of receiving TV signals (if it is being used as such)?


Meh...
By DokGonzo on 8/23/2007 8:52:53 AM , Rating: 3
How about giving us MPEG4 ASP support (Divx, Xvid, etc.) instead??




RE: Meh...
By DingieM on 8/23/2007 10:50:14 AM , Rating: 1
Xbox360 Fall 2007 update appears to get official support for Xvid!


thanks but it is to late dont ya think
By pekingu on 8/23/07, Rating: 0
By quiksilv3r on 8/23/2007 3:20:32 PM , Rating: 4
Good job on speaking for all of Europe. I'm sure every single European user has a bad perception of Sony. And I'm positive that such a [i]useless[/i] feature such as DVR functionality won't sway any European users into buying a PS3. At all.

Give me a break.


Excellent news :)
By probedb on 8/23/2007 9:38:40 AM , Rating: 2
Another reason for me to get a PS3, maybe by the time it's released I'll have enough reasons to buy one! Could do with a PVR.




Enough!
By DokGonzo on 8/23/2007 5:09:33 PM , Rating: 2
Would you all please stop this chest thumping crap and stick to the topic? Thank you.




Games PLEASE?
By enlil242 on 8/23/07, Rating: 0
I need a 380W power hungry PVR...
By halcyon on 8/23/07, Rating: 0
The End of the USA is coming closer...
By daBKLYNdoorman on 8/23/07, Rating: -1
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 8/23/2007 9:31:35 AM , Rating: 4
Keep dreaming.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By Amiga500 on 8/23/2007 9:42:02 AM , Rating: 2
Your thread title is a little sensationalist.

There are some things I prefer about here (Ireland) compared to what I've seen of the US on my visits, and visa-versa.

I'm sure most people are the same, it doesn't exactly spell doom and destruction for the unfavoured location as regards any specific preference.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By Polynikes on 8/23/2007 10:56:18 AM , Rating: 2
I agree, I think both Europe at large and the US have their strong points. Europeans aren't obsessed with gigantic vehicles, Americans always keep their drinks ice cold. Technology-wise I'd have to say Europe's a tad bit ahead, especially when it comes to cell phone tech.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By Hawkido on 8/23/2007 11:57:25 AM , Rating: 3
Yep way ahead... how many cent's per minute do they pay for Internet again?


By heffeque on 8/23/2007 11:15:28 PM , Rating: 2
Actually... a maximum of 1.2 euros a day for me. And it's 3G and 3.5G, not EDGE ;-)


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By omnicronx on 8/23/2007 9:53:57 AM , Rating: 2
Europe didn't overcome anything, and anyone who knows what freeview is knew this was coming as previous articles specifically said 'freeview tuner'. Nobody is going to use their ps3 for a pvr if you can only watch analogue tv, which is what it would have been in the US. Freeview is only available in Europe so amazingly the pvr versions will only be available in Europe =P.

What i want to know is why they there isn't an OTA HD digital tuner version. That could potentially sell like hotcakes in the US. Then again who is to say there isn't an OTA version in the works ;)


By probedb on 8/23/2007 10:22:27 AM , Rating: 2
Exactly :) You guys will probably get a shiny nice OTA HD tuner while we get lovely low-bitrate standard def Freeview because most channels on Freeview are pants.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By philsworth on 8/23/2007 10:24:33 AM , Rating: 2
omnicronx, AFAIK the device IS a dual OTA HD digital tuner.

The only reason Europe is getting this over the US is simply the convenience of leveraging the Freeview system.

Things are a lot more complicated because of the US's capitalist system and therefore all the competing companies/standards.

The UK isn't actually capitalist, it and other parts of Europe are a 'mixed economy' which allows the promotion of socialist initiatives like Freeview(downside is: in the UK you have to pay for a license to own anything capable of picking up a TV signal)

Currently Freeview broadcast in SD but will be moving to HD soon. In London the BBC are currently trialing BBC HD with programmes like Planet Earth etc.

Once they go HD PlayTV will be able to handle that also.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By omnicronx on 8/23/2007 10:44:08 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
omnicronx, AFAIK the device IS a dual OTA HD digital tuner.

Do you have a link for this? It doesnt make sense that sony would be doing it this way. With Xbox360 IPTV service coming you would think they would have released a US version if it had OTA HD. From what i have read, all i have seen is 'Freeview digital tuner'.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By philsworth on 8/23/2007 11:00:11 AM , Rating: 3
Sorry, I don't have a link, a lot of sites are blocked at work.

Just google "PlayTV", I think Kotaku specify it pretty well.
It is a small device that connects to the PS3 thru USB and has two HD digital tuners.

From your post I sort of got the impression that you thought it was a new type of PS3. It just an add on and a firmware update.

Again, Freeview is an OTA digital service that broadcasts in MPEG2, soon to be in HD.


By omnicronx on 8/23/2007 12:43:53 PM , Rating: 2
After looking into it, as i said, they are not OTA digital HDTV tuners, they are OTA terrestrial digital television(DVB-T format), which is totally different, and not available in north america. Just the fact they are full 1080p compliant shows this, as 1080p is not part of the FCC OTA atsc spec which only goes up to 1080i.

heres a little quote from digitalhome.ca (amazing site for us canadians)
quote:
ATSC is not compatible with the DVB-T standard used in all other countries except Japan, which has its own ISDB-T standard.


And i fully understood it is a small addon ;)


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By psychobriggsy on 8/23/2007 10:54:09 AM , Rating: 2
Freeview is the UK name for terrestrial digital TV using DVB-T.

It's only free because the initial commercial terrestrial digital TV offering "On Digital" crashed and burned and there was no commercial desire to try again. It's not as if the government actually did something useful to give us free digital TV, like any decent socialist government would.

And the TV license, whilst mandatory for TV owners (grrr!), does fund the advert-free BBC, which overall isn't a bad deal for £135 a year if you actually make use of it. I'd rather it was called the "BBC Funding License" or similar rather than "TV License" because the latter conveys no benefit to paying for it, thus creating large discussions starting with "oh, you have to pay for a license just to watch TV" posts.

I very much doubt we will ever see much high definition OTA digital over here however, despite the trials in London.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By philsworth on 8/23/2007 11:03:17 AM , Rating: 2
All good points.

With regards to HD freeview it might come sooner than you think, I read somewhere that they have developed a satellite service!


By psychobriggsy on 8/23/2007 11:14:18 AM , Rating: 2
Oh, I used FreeSat for a couple of years on an old Sky receiver that recently died. Satellite (DVB-S) is great in general, hundreds of channels, decent quality, free porn, wide choice, 200 shopping channels, etc, but you do need an MPEG4 capable receiver for the HD channels (BBC HD), and the others would require a subscription to Sky.

But over the air HD ... maybe in metropolitan areas by 2012...


By onereddog on 8/23/2007 7:32:40 PM , Rating: 2
Freeview is also avalible in New Zealand... if anyone cares.

So I guess that there is a chance the PVR thing will come to NZ as well. I just saw the Europe PS3 bundle here.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By Nfarce on 8/23/07, Rating: 0
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 8/23/2007 10:31:43 AM , Rating: 2
They can't compete with the F-22. Thats why the F-35 program contains some aspects of the F-22 but will be available for sale to our allies. No question the F-22 would wreck the F-35 in a matchup, but the F-35 is more of a Fighter Bomber than an Air Superiority Fighter like the F-22.

Notice also the F-22 will not be sold to foreign nations, we like to keep superiority in the USA. But the F-35 is more than enough for most foreign governments


By mars777 on 8/23/2007 3:28:08 PM , Rating: 1
This is exactly why most Europeans hate the US people. It's a difference in mentality. They don't need to have the biggest dick or have the best.
Most of them need to have a good one.
And if there was no USA or China in the current situation F-fighters would hardy be needed in the world :P


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By DingieM on 8/23/2007 11:04:00 AM , Rating: 1
Europe, which by many is considered to be much more intelligent, educated, healthier lifestyle then the average ignorant american citizen, has a slower adoption rate to technology and lifestyle.

There is no added value to a high adoption rate of new technology (and mostly cheap), no added value for having a shallow lifestyle.

Though USA makes some really cool defensive "apparatus", like F-22/F-35...

Back to the IPTV thingy, the whole IPTV space in all over the globe (save South-Korea I think) is a mess and I do hope they clean it up, bringing us some nice HD channels...


By Hawkido on 8/23/2007 12:36:31 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
which by many is considered to be


Never good to use that phrase when trying to make a point... It is baseless and without merit. It is a swaying statement, not a proving statment.

All the world's attrocieties are started with someone beginning a statement much like that.

Might as well say "For the Betterment of Mankind..."

Things that have been approved and/or triggered by popularity:

Slavery
Genocide
Aggressive Wars
Riots
Lynchings
Inquisitions
Domination
Subjugation
Oppression
Socialism
Communism

These things were all VERY popular by those who benefited from them. Those who opposed them, were denied the right to speak out about them, and therefor didn't get to voice their dissent.

In Saddam's last election, he won by 100% of the Vote. He was very popular, but only to those who survived the voting process, see in Iraq (during Saddam's reign) If you didn't survive to get out of the Voting Booth, your vote didn't count. There were Soldier's there who observed your vote. This information is from all four of my Iraqi Arabic Teachers (One of Which was a 4-Star Iraqi General who defected to overthrow Saddam). Popularity is a very dubius thing, it is not to be trusted. America is a Democratic-Republic, which helps mitigate some of the stupidity of the popular crowd.

"What's popular is not always right, and what's right is not always popular. We must always do what's right and suffer the damnation of being uppopular, because the consequence of the other is unthinkable..." --Aristotle


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By psychobriggsy on 8/23/2007 11:10:30 AM , Rating: 2
"behind" is a strong word, and your whole post is simplistic.

Of course I'm not going to resort to some primitive warmongering argument like "who's killing machines are better than the others" here, as a European we are far more civilised than that.

America pulled itself ahead in the 50s and 60s, and stayed there. Obviously Europe had a big rebuilding programme, and ironically it was West Germany that benefited the most and thus grew to be a financial powerhouse at the time. Since then things have changed, and the important countries in Europe (i.e., Britain, Germany, and to a less extend Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Holland, ...) are pretty well off, albeit expensive. France is full of French people and militant farmers and thus will never redeem itself.

In terms of technology however, since the 80s things haven't been that far different. Europe has had better mobile phones than the US, faster uptake of new technologies such as satellite and digital TV, and so on. Not in every marketplace of course. Of course Europe isn't behind in terms of free health care, decent public transport, etc (let's not talk about the UK here, ho hum).

And there's reasons for this - America is huge, Europe is very old. Both have their own costs for instigating new technology.

As for lifestyle, I think that it's been downhill in Europe since the uptake of American style fast food outlets, and large monolithic corporations that stifle innovation. If you desire your lifestyle to be consumerist, then you would think that the USA might be ahead on lifestyle, but you have to consider that different peoples value different things, and maybe quality of life, health, fun, social interaction, ... would be more important to them.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By Hawkido on 8/23/2007 12:15:16 PM , Rating: 3
quote:
I'm not going to resort to some primitive warmongering argument like "who's killing machines are better than the others" here, as a European we are far more civilised than that.


Givin that the 2 bloodiest wars in the World's History were started in Euorpe by Europeans, and ended by Americans, I believe you should revise your wording. Civilized is not a good word. Plus is you look back through time you will see that since America's founding Europe has participated in more attrocieties, and stripped rights from more people than America. America has black spots on it's history as well. However, comparing America to Europe is like saying a dalmation is Black when comparing it to a Witch's Cat.

quote:
Of course Europe isn't behind in terms of free health care


Ah, Socialism... How's that been treating ya? Capitolism and a free market doesn't allow socialism. Funny, the timeline you give Europe's recovery (from the wars it caused in the 20th century) is about the point when Socialism really starts failing in Europe... When you give stuff away for free you destroy the wealthy and make everyone poor, except, of course, the Governments that lord over you. *Sigh* the cycle in Europe will start again... World War 3 will begin once France surrenders again.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By Nfarce on 8/23/2007 12:30:10 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Givin that the 2 bloodiest wars in the World's History were started in Euorpe by Europeans, and ended by Americans, I believe you should revise your wording. Civilized is not a good word.


Amen to that brother. I was just going to bring that up. They were all "civilized" when watching Hitler run over every nation, weren't they? Perhaps we should have done nothing for the ingrates (I know it's mostly newer, younger, and ignorant generations). It must be the lack of real history they teach over there to develop mentality like that. One day they are going to get a very real threat again, and maybe on that day we should just sit back and watch the "civilized" Europeans get conquered.

As far as their argument on "free" health care for all and other socialist policies considered "better" than what Americans have, they probably don't want to compare tax rates and unemployment rates with the US, especially France.

We left Europe/UK to find better lives. We damn sure left the UK and claimed our Independence because of oppressive taxation policies.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By omnicronx on 8/23/2007 1:22:10 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Givin that the 2 bloodiest wars in the World's History were started in Euorpe by Europeans, and ended by Americans, I believe you should revise your wording. Civilized is not a good word.
Thanks for the history lesson, but heres another..

WW1 -started August 8th 1914, America enters war - April 6th 1917, because of a U-BOAT attack on a mainly American ship killing most on board. War essentially ends October 1918. Time in war: less than year and a half.

WW2 -started sept 3 1939, America enters war Dec 8 1941 but first troops dont arrive in europe until Jan 1942, war ends 1945. Time in war, realistically 3 years.

I'm not saying America doesn't deserve a lot of respect for what they did, but they entered both wars because of attacks on US civilians and military outposts, not because they wanted too or were willing to help. In fact most Americans opposed the war, especially in world war 2 because of the mass casualties of world war 1, and if not for the Japanese attacking, it is debatable if they ever would have entered the war at all.

I am not trying to bash America here, i just want to state the facts of what actually happened, not all this America is superior, America always saves the world propaganda.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By Nfarce on 8/23/2007 2:05:47 PM , Rating: 3
quote:
I'm not saying America doesn't deserve a lot of respect for what they did, but they entered both wars because of attacks on US civilians and military outposts, not because they wanted too or were willing to help.


Ah yes. More revisionist history. Is that what they are teaching you folks over there? In the mid-30s when Hitler (and Mussolini to a lesser extent) was rising to prominence, only one US military leader saw fit to raise a concern about the US being behind the German war machine. General "Hap" Arnold said we must build up our war machine. At that time we still had fabric biplanes in our Army Air Force and Navy.

It wasn't until 1940 when France surrendered to Hitler and then he turned toward Britain with his Luftwaffe that the U.S. realized the threat was real. We got involved initially by giving arms to Britain and others via the Lend and Lease Act. Essentially we were just giving our allies weapons instead of sending men. Now that's real protective of all those alleged outposts and US civilians that were supposedly over there as alleged for our reason for going over there, huh?

Further, much of our military hardware, especially advanced fighters like P-51 Mustangs, were still on paper. So for the first couple years while Hitler steamrolled everyone, we weren't well equipped to fight a war until Jane and John America went to work building ships, tanks, aircraft, and armament. We didn't start being effective on BOTH fronts until late 1942.

Anyone who thinks we invaded Hitler's Normandy or went to North Africa to fight against Mussolini alongside the British to save a few American civilians and alleged "outposts" is someone who has thoroughly had a misguided history lesson. I speak as an American who's grandfather was THERE in France fighting for European liberation.

I love all European nations, but I will not stand down for degrading and misrepresenting what we did over there.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By omnicronx on 8/23/2007 2:22:19 PM , Rating: 2
blah blah blah.. propaganda *cough*
quote:
Anyone who thinks we invaded Hitler's Normandy or went to North Africa to fight against Mussolini alongside the British to save a few American civilians and alleged "outposts" is someone who has thoroughly had a misguided history lesson. I speak as an American who's grandfather was THERE in France fighting for European liberation.
You are kidding yourself man, sorry to tell you. Your own president wanted to enter the war but he knew the American public would never agree. Some even debate your own president knew about the coming attacks on pearl harbor and let it happen so they could enter the war.

My grandfather was a Canadian soldier that fought in Dieppe, he didn't do it because his troops were attacked, he didn't do it because Canada was still loyal to Britain, he did it because he thought it was the right thing to do, and that if Hitler wasn't stopped now, he would later try to conquer the entire world. It was a thoughtless act, he didn't think twice. If you really believe the citizens of the united states wanted to enter world war two, you are seriously in denial.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By Timeless on 8/23/2007 2:53:31 PM , Rating: 2
Whether our president knew of Pearl Harbor is debatable, one thing is for sure. We didn't start those European wars, but we sure as hell ended them. That's good enough for us.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By omnicronx on 8/23/2007 3:30:47 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
We didn't start those European wars, but we sure as hell ended them. That's good enough for us.
And i came into the soccer game with one minute left yesterday and scored the winning goal, but i refuse to take credit for the win in a game i played 1 minute in ;)

And for all that people like you make fun of countries such as 'the french' you fail to recognize that your country would not exist if not for France. You may have started the war with the British, but the French sure as hell helped you end it. (Atlantic ship blockades, mass amounts of weapons provided.. etc etc..) That doesnt make them superior, does it?


By Nfarce on 8/23/2007 4:13:00 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
You may have started the war with the British, but the French sure as hell helped you end it.


Well that's a no-brainer. France was at WAR with England during our Revolution. There's an old Arabic saying: "The enemy of my enemy is my friend." France wanted us to beat the British, and they helped us out. If you look back into history, the 1770s were the one and ONLY period of time when France did anything for us.

And you have to keep something else in mind, history guru: we were fighting to GET AWAY from British Monarchy tyranny and establish our own nation, not CONQUER another one. Sheesh what an idiot.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By SandmanWN on 8/23/2007 4:18:57 PM , Rating: 2
You seem to have forgotten that the US entered the war after Pearl Harbor and instead of serving its own self interest in immediately retaliating against the Japanese decided to devote its full forces in the European conflict when there was little reason to do so. The US went on the defensive in the Pacific and put its self at risk to save Europe first. And what help if any did we receive in return after saving Europe, nadda. And you seem to have forgotten that those same forces stayed in Europe long after WWII and still exist there to this day to protect those lands from Russia.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By omnicronx on 8/23/2007 4:50:57 PM , Rating: 2
please lets not debate the tactics of the united states during the war, germany and japan were allies, germany was considered the bigger threat. Roosevelt knew what hitler could possibly do if he wasnt stopped. It was a domino effect, take out hitler and japan will fall. With Germany defeated everyone would be focused directly on japan, in fact nobody every thought japan would fight as long as they did after VE day. They never expected they would have to use the atom bomb and only feared severe troop losses if they chose a full scale invasion into japan. (see IWO JIMA)

Once again I am not making fun of America, i just find it funny you not only think the united states would have gone to war anyways. If america was so gunho about doing things for the greater good they would have joined the war from the get go, not when they were attacked.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By SandmanWN on 8/23/2007 5:48:08 PM , Rating: 2
oh but lets do debate the tactics.

In all your careful and thoughtful analysis I only wonder what you believe the outcome would have been if the US said screw all you folks we are going on the defensive, protecting our own lands, and to hell with the rest of you? What happens to Europe and what happens in the Pacific? Germany overtakes UK, Russia overtakes Germany, Japan conquers a large portion of China.

You are completely wrong about Japan by the way. They controlled the entire Pacific rim and was laying waste to China. US military pilots had to drop out of the military and join the Chinese air defense as civilians to keep Japan from further incursions into China.

In the end you are way off base and still haven't explained how the US was supposed to fight with no weapons? Can't fight an army until you actually have one to fight back with. Yes we probably could have died by the thousands like the Russians did with a handful of ammo and rusty old bolt action WWI era rifles but I think we have a little too much brain mass for that.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By Timeless on 8/23/2007 6:54:57 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Russia overtakes Germany

quote:
could have died by the thousands like the Russians did with a handful of ammo and rusty old bolt action WWI era rifles


I find that the funniest contradiction I have ever read.


By onereddog on 8/23/2007 7:54:37 PM , Rating: 2
It doesn't have to be a contradiction. Even if thousands died there was still more to take over Germany.


By SandmanWN on 8/23/2007 9:37:12 PM , Rating: 2
what contradiction? thousands died on either side and yet one side had to win. wtf are you talking about?


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By Timeless on 8/23/2007 6:50:51 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
And i came into the soccer game with one minute left yesterday and scored the winning goal, but i refuse to take credit for the win in a game i played 1 minute in ;)


For your case, I believe you were tied or were already winning then if you scored the winning goal in 1 minute. You weren't LOSING were you? Then it's a different case. Europe was getting their ass handed to them. The UK was the only country left that still had a fighting chance. A very SLIM chance. Your chances of winning the soccer game was 50% minimum depending on if you were tied or not. The Allies chances of winning the war without America's help were WAY below that.

quote:
And for all that people like you make fun of countries such as 'the french' you fail to recognize that your country would not exist if not for France.


I never said that Americans took France for granted. In fact, Americans made up the main body of soldiers that liberated France from Germany in World War II.


By Amiga500 on 8/24/2007 12:15:53 PM , Rating: 2
Europe was getting their ass handed to them. The UK was the only country left that still had a fighting chance. A very SLIM chance. Your chances of winning the soccer game was 50% minimum depending on if you were tied or not. The Allies chances of winning the war without America's help were WAY below that.

To be honest, Hitler overextended himself the moment he set foot in Soviet territory.

The Americans prevented communism from spreading from Soviet Russia all over mainland Europe, but the Soviets engaged and destroyed the vast majority of the Wehrmacht/SS while the Americans/UK/etc had to deal with a mere fraction of the Nazi war machine (and I am not trying to be-little their contribution).

It could be stated the US intervention in the european war did not change the result (a Nazi defeat), but it changed the fallout from the war.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By Nfarce on 8/23/2007 4:05:30 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
My grandfather was a Canadian soldier that fought in Dieppe, he didn't do it because his troops were attacked, he didn't do it because Canada was still loyal to Britain, he did it because he thought it was the right thing to do, and that if Hitler wasn't stopped now, he would later try to conquer the entire world.


You said America didn't go to war to help win liberation for Europe and England and instead only went because US civilians and "outposts" were there (the BIGGEST pile of poppycock I believe I've ever read from a wingnut about America and WWII). Are you changing your tune or changing the subject?

quote:
If you really believe the citizens of the united states wanted to enter world war two, you are seriously in denial.


Nobody in their right mind "wants" to go to war. When you have to, you HAVE to. You insinuate Americans were AGAINST going to war. That could NOT be further from the truth. Like I said, I come from a family of experience with WWII. Men and women volunteered for service, men and women volunteered to go to work in factories, and Americans sacrificed obtaining things like food, gasoline, and even aluminum foil so those things could be used for World War II. Americans also purchased war bonds to fund it. You aren't even an AMERICAN and I have relatives still alive at the TIME of WWII and were even THERE and you are attempting to tell me about the state of America back then? You only kid yourself with your foolish indoctrination. I knew Canada, like Europe, was teaching an ignorance of history, but I really didn't need to see it proven.

Mindlessly bringing up Pearl Harbor and leadership "allowing" it to happen further diminishes your argument. Why the hell would we have done that when we had no capability to invade or even BOMB Japan directly? Even Doolittle's raid was minimal and it was two years before the war in the Pacific turned in our favor (again, for reasons as mentioned why we were late into WWII success). Conspiracy theories are as old as Biblical times. Besides, listening to a Canadian attempting to give Americans a history lesson on World War II is laughable. So "cough" it up, because that's about all you can refute with. Oh, and typical left wing propoganda.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By omnicronx on 8/23/2007 4:34:24 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
You said America didn't go to war to help win liberation for Europe and England and instead only went because US civilians and "outposts" were there (the BIGGEST pile of poppycock I believe I've ever read from a wingnut about America and WWII). Are you changing your tune or changing the subject?
Then please tell me sir, why did the united states wait so long? I've given you a reason with dates and facts, all youve given me is 'THATS THE BIGGEST PILE OF POPPYCOCK' and your word that americans really 'cared'. And i dont see how i am 'changing' the subject.

quote:
You aren't even an AMERICAN
yes i am ;) born and raised in canada with american citizenship, (my dad is from long island and moved to canada when i was born)

As for the rest of your rant..
quote:
You insinuate Americans were AGAINST going to war. That could NOT be further from the truth.
You just keep telling yourself that.. go check out some old news paper articles and tell me that again
quote:
You only kid yourself with your foolish indoctrination. I knew Canada, like Europe, was teaching an ignorance of history, but I really didn't need to see it proven.
Both my grandfathers fought in WW2, one for the American navy, one for the Canadian army, unlike you i got versions from both sides to come up with my point of view.
quote:
Mindlessly bringing up Pearl Harbor and leadership "allowing" it to happen further diminishes your argument. Why the hell would we have done that when we had no capability to invade or even BOMB Japan directly?
And you said i don't know what I am talking about. Japan attacked the U.S for the sole reason that the united states navy controlled the pacific.

quote:
Oh, and typical left wing propoganda.
Snap did an american just call canadians left wing? Are you a moron?
Our conservatives are your democrats, in lehmans terms that the farthest left wing party in canada is equivalent to your 'liberal but not so liberal' democrats. Nice try though..


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By Nfarce on 8/23/2007 5:10:56 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Then please tell me sir, why did the united states wait so long?


NO less than THREE TIMES now I have explained to you WE WEREN'T READY WITH FULL MILITARY HARDWARE. The HELL were we going to go fight with? 19 freaking THIRTIES hardware?

quote:
yes i am ;) born and raised in canada with american citizenship,


Well you are ignorant, so I guess it really doesn't matter.

quote:
You just keep telling yourself that.. go check out some old news paper articles and tell me that again


Clown, I have a GRANDFATHER I talk to every week. I don't HAVE to read a newspaper.

quote:
Both my grandfathers fought in WW2, one for the American navy, one for the Canadian army, unlike you i got versions from both sides to come up with my point of view.


Your point of view is a bald face denial of the truth. I told you what civilian Americans did to SACRIFICE for the war and you said Americans didn't want the war. I'm not going to bang my head up against ignorance.

quote:
And you said i don't know what I am talking about. Japan attacked the U.S for the sole reason that the united states navy controlled the pacific.


There is no direct evidence of that, Mr. Black Helicopter Conspiracy theorist. And you can't even come up with a good reason FOR us doing it other than "going to war with Japan" when we weren't even freaking close to being READY from a military perspective. Again, I refuse to bang my head up against ignorance and delusional thoughts.

quote:
Snap did an american just call canadians left wing? Are you a moron?


I base ideology on THOUGHT processes, not labels. You think like a liberal left wingnut in America, and that's all I need to know.

I do, however, find it interesting that you continue to deny that America actually was FOR fighting in World War II from 1941 through 1945. Oh yeah, and like someone else said, that doesn't include the BILLIONS spent rebuilding Europe AND Japan for a decade afterwards and CONTINUING to spend money today in those regions for defense purposes.

Believe what you want, kid, but I know history, and I know what we did in World War II.


By Nfarce on 8/23/2007 5:18:58 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
There is no direct evidence of that, Mr. Black Helicopter Conspiracy theorist. And you can't even come up with a good reason FOR us doing it other than "going to war with Japan"


Oops, I confused your post about Japan attacking us because we controlled the Pacific thinking you were back to the "allowed Japan to attack" BS. Neither here nor there though. I'm on the right side of American history. You are not.


By Nfarce on 8/23/2007 5:27:55 PM , Rating: 2
One other thing sport:

quote:
Your own president wanted to enter the war but he knew the American public would never agree.


When you say ^^that^^ with "your president" exactly how does that make you an American besides on a piece of paper? It doesn't. I'm right again.


RE: The End of the USA is coming closer...
By onereddog on 8/23/2007 8:00:58 PM , Rating: 2
Just because you talk to your grandfather every week doesn't mean you have an accurate picture of the whole situation.

And your argument seems kinda weak when you are confronted with more evidence and have to resort to claiming that the other guy is lying.


By weskurtz0081 on 8/23/2007 11:32:46 PM , Rating: 2
Funny,

Europe is in a sad state. The youth culture has an entitlement mentality. They do not want to work and feel that the Government owes them something. It isn't the result of Socialism, but more the result of a bureaucratic government run amuck. The UK isn't really as bad as the rest of Europe but, it is getting there.

So, before you clowns start talking crap about the US, take your own advice and try cleaning up some of your own problems you damn hypocrites.


By Legolias24 on 8/24/2007 11:03:23 AM , Rating: 2
Just to start off this post, I am Canadian and I really hate seeing that Canada's contribution to WWII gets marginalized as much as it does. Has anyone ever considered that if it wasn't for Canada running supplies, troops (especially pilots)...I heard from one of my Univ. history profs that the Canadian content of the RAF during the battle of Britain was close to half of all the pilots...that Britain would have been over run and there would not have been much of a war left to fight? Just my 2 cents.

quote:
I do, however, find it interesting that you continue to deny that America actually was FOR fighting in World War II from 1941 through 1945

I will agree with you that from 1941 to 1945 America DID want to fight the Germans...but that was only after Roosevelt convinced the rest of government to go to war and then the propaganda machine started up that the American public was convinced that joining the war was the right thing to do.

quote:
NO less than THREE TIMES now I have explained to you WE WEREN'T READY WITH FULL MILITARY HARDWARE. The HELL were we going to go fight with? 19 freaking THIRTIES hardware?

Yes you are partly right that America was unable to enter the war because they didn't have the military fire power. But consider this, Roosevelt wanted to join the fight...rather badly too because his mother (I think it was his mother) is/was British; as such he had ties back to the Britain. He empathized with what the British were suffering through, but he STILL had to convince the rest of government to declare war on Germany...AFAIK the US President can not just declare war on any other country without backing from the rest of the government i.e. senate, congress

Now the reasons why the rest of Government, and the American people for that matter, did not want to go to war is because the foreign policy of the US was and to a certain extent still is based on Isolationisism. I believe it was the founding fathers of your country oultined how the US would not get involved in world conflicts given the bloody revolution that they had just gone through. I don't remember it all exactly (I've been 2 1/2 years removed from that class) but the US had made a point of avoiding conflicts that did not directly involve the US.

Nfarce, I totally respect what your grandfather and family did to contribute to the war effort, but please don't speak as if your family is the voice of a nation. When you have 150+ million people (I'm guessing that's how many people were in the US during the 30's and 40's), the voice of 1 family can not speak for the nation. Just the same as my grandfather, who also served in the Canadian navy, and my grandfather's cousin, who served in the RAF, and my Grandfather's brothers who served in the military, and my Aunt's father who served in the British navy can not tell me how the entire country felt.

So, to sum up; war sucks and WWII affected everyone in lots of ways both positive and negative (a lot of negative though). But I would also like to say way to go Sony to offer more value for the price tag...although some new games would be nice, I'll take anything that could add to the value of the platform. Even though living in Canada probably means I'll never see this feature, I still think it's good to see Sony adding to the feature list of their machine via software updates. Hooray bangs for the bucks! :P

Cheers!

-Legolias


By Amiga500 on 8/24/2007 12:08:20 PM , Rating: 2
Further, much of our military hardware, especially advanced fighters like P-51 Mustangs, were still on paper.

Can I just point out that the P-51 was a response from North American Aviation (a company) to a British design specification.

It was not the result of American military planning, although its eventual success (the original Allison engined planes were underpowered) could be traced to the laminar flow aerofoil work performed by NACA.


By Hawkido on 8/27/2007 2:49:37 PM , Rating: 2
American Citizens, veterans, military members volunteered to go to Europe and fly as British soldiers, from almost the start of the war.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eagle_squadron

Funny it seems alot of those "Canadians" that fought in Europe were actually US citizens who went to Canada to enlist in the RCAF or the RAF to fight in Europe...

How many thousand US Pilots were in the Eagle Squadron or the RCAF or RAF? How many were on the ground? How many US military members died in Europe in WWI and WWII?

Your form of thanks is "Yeah, but they were late!" You don't even realize that the US had no standing army at the time. Just eager volunteers. Once we rolled out of bed it was "Game On!"

Funny the dipsticks that complain the US was too slow to respond in the First and Second World War are the same ones THE VERY SAME ONES that say the US is going around putting their noses in everyone's business trying to be the World police! LOL they are so transparent, You can just see the America Hate and Jealousy through their brittle glass skin.

Eh, omnicronix, should we look back through your past comments and count how many times you have said the US should just keep to itself? Now we have to count in both directions... How many times have you said in this thread the US failed to respond fast enough. Typical Liberal... Let's count your socialist posts, free medicine (never mind how you pay for it), Anti-Oil companies (Cause they are profitable), Anti-America and Anti-America Military power.

Bleh you are a Communist... just admit it.


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