backtop


Print 37 comment(s) - last by BBeltrami.. on Jan 24 at 11:50 AM


The micronation of Sealand
PirateBay's plans threatened as Sealand's sovereignty is called into question

Earlier this month, the people who run PirateBay.org announced plans to purchase the man-made island called Sealand. Michael Bates, Prince and heir to Sealand, said in a CBC interview that he has no intention of selling his micronation to any cause that violates international treaties. Oddly enough, Sealand was once home to nation founder Paddy Roy Bates’ pirate radio broadcasting operation.

When the interviewer asked Prince Michael about his awareness of PirateBay.org’s intentions, he spoke quite clearly on how he was against file sharing. “It’s theft of proprietary rights, it doesn’t suit us at all,” he said. “In fact, I’ve written a book and Hollywood is making a movie out of it, so it would go right against the grain to go into the file sharing thing.”

The estate agent hired to handle the sale of Sealand has also gone on record to say that PirateBay.org would not be a suitable buyer. “We might not be able to sell to them, since one of the conditions imposed by the actual occupants of Sealand is that none of the activities to be carried out on Sealand should be an action against the UK, and potentially this group does not comply with this condition,” Sealand said a statement issued to InmoNaranja. “The final decision lies with the current representatives of Sealand at the time of seeing the purchaser's proposal.”

Legal online publication Out-Law consulted a Dundee University lecturer in constitutional and international law, who thinks that Sealand isn’t its own sovereign nation after all. “It is within 12 miles of the coast of Britain and in 1987 the UK extended its territorial waters to 12 miles. That means that UK law applies, including the law of copyright, which could be extended to Sealand without any legal problems whatsoever,” said Professor Robin Churchill.

The final nail in the coffin for independent operations such as PirateBay is the asking price for rights to Sealand. According to Prince Michael, his micronation is valued at €750 million ($971 million), putting it out of reach to all small time buyers. At the time of writing, a total of $19,941 has been raised at PirateBay.org’s BuySealand.com.



Comments     Threshold


This article is over a month old, voting and posting comments is disabled

Piracy is lazy
By KristopherKubicki (blog) on 1/22/2007 7:42:16 PM , Rating: 5
quote:
According to what Prince Michael said, his micronation is valued at €750 million ($971 million), putting it out of reach to all small time buyers. At time of writing, a total of $19,941 has been raised at PirateBay.org’s BuySealand.com.

I just thought I'd say I found that funny.




RE: Piracy is lazy
By S3anister on 1/22/2007 7:58:18 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
According to what Prince Michael said, his micronation is valued at €750 million ($971 million), putting it out of reach to all small time buyers. At time of writing, a total of $19,941 has been raised at PirateBay.org’s BuySealand.com.


When I first read that, I misread it thinking it said that the asking price of sealand had gone up, lol upon further inspection of this paragraph, i laughed my ass off :D


RE: Piracy is lazy
By Oregonian2 on 1/22/2007 8:25:15 PM , Rating: 2
Its value is set by the marketplace. If $20K is the biggest offer they've gotten, then perhaps that is its value. I can say the asking price for my house is twelve trillion US dollars, but that doesn't make that its valuation. Only upon sale is that value determined. So we'll see. :-)


RE: Piracy is lazy
By Oregonian2 on 1/22/2007 8:27:03 PM , Rating: 1
P.S. - How much would it cost to make a brand new "nation" at the 12.1 mile mark off the UK coast (nice and shiny, etc) ?


RE: Piracy is lazy
By Martin Blank on 1/22/2007 8:31:32 PM , Rating: 2
You can't. International agreements prohibit recognition of "constructed" land as actual territories, either for the purpose of extending one's territory or building new territories. It has to happen naturally, which is almost always through volcanic means.


RE: Piracy is lazy
By KristopherKubicki (blog) on 1/22/2007 8:43:31 PM , Rating: 5
Queue Superman titles.... now!


RE: Piracy is lazy
By Ringold on 1/22/2007 8:56:02 PM , Rating: 2
Then there's some people in Western Europe living on.. illegal land? Definitely not 'natural'.


RE: Piracy is lazy
By KristopherKubicki (blog) on 1/22/2007 9:06:33 PM , Rating: 2
The difference is that land is already in preformed territories.


RE: Piracy is lazy
By glennpratt on 1/23/2007 12:42:12 AM , Rating: 2
A: The land was within existing boundaries
B: In most cases, the land is natural. The lack of water is the unnatural part.


RE: Piracy is lazy
By masher2 (blog) on 1/23/2007 10:47:19 AM , Rating: 2
> "International agreements prohibit recognition of "constructed" land as actual territories, either for the purpose of extending one's territory or building new territories..."

Almost. Look at the huge complex of artificial islands Dubai is building. Legally, they're part of Dubai and under their jurisdiction. They are, however, not eligible for independent status and they cannot be used to extend the 200nm EEZ of the parent nation.


RE: Piracy is lazy
By Pythias on 1/23/2007 11:05:24 AM , Rating: 2
So if I offer you $20 for your house its mine right? :P


RE: Piracy is lazy
By Oregonian2 on 1/23/2007 2:43:19 PM , Rating: 2
If I've got to sell it for some reason, and your offer is the highest, then yes, you've got it!




RE: Piracy is lazy
By deeznuts on 1/23/2007 2:01:39 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Its value is set by the marketplace. If $20K is the biggest offer they've gotten, then perhaps that is its value. I can say the asking price for my house is twelve trillion US dollars, but that doesn't make that its valuation. Only upon sale is that value determined. So we'll see. :-)


While I think the price is outrageous, you are confusing Fair Market Value vs. Inherent Value. As anyone who has done any valuation studies or practice knows, there are several definitions of valuation.

If I overbid on someting, does that raise it's value? No it just raises the price I paid on it.


RE: Piracy is lazy
By Oregonian2 on 1/23/2007 2:46:01 PM , Rating: 2
Yes, one of the other valuations is "salvage value", which may be a negative amount in this case, and IMO is the most appropriate one to apply. :-)


RE: Piracy is lazy
By masher2 (blog) on 1/23/2007 9:54:28 PM , Rating: 2
> "While I think the price is outrageous, you are confusing Fair Market Value vs. Inherent Value...."

"Intrinsic Value" is the commonly used term in economic theory. Most items, according to any reasonable economist, have no intrinsic value whatsoever. " The value of an item is what it will bring", as the saying goes.


Not really suitable anyway
By Azsen on 1/22/2007 9:27:24 PM , Rating: 1
How was Sealand going to be suitable for the Pirate Bay anyway? Where were they going to get their high bandwidth data connections from? Run their own fibre to Sealand maybe at a cost of only a few million?

Also half the idea of running a pirate network is the secrecy of your whereabouts so the authorities can't find out where your base is. With it being in Sealand, -everyone- is going to know where they are. What's to stop the U.S. from firing a cruise missile at it, or sending a single jet to bomb it back to the stone ages? Even a small Navy Seals team would do the job fine. No-ones going to cry over the loss of a few pirates. Lawyers and the U.N. won't help you, you'll need some serious military hardware to defend your little pirate nation.




RE: Not really suitable anyway
By Lifted on 1/22/2007 10:02:15 PM , Rating: 4
Navy Seals? Seriously, we're talking about nerd pirates here. A few highschool football players could seize control of their entire nation/island/platform. Perhaps even pee wee leaguers.


RE: Not really suitable anyway
By angryhippy on 1/23/07, Rating: -1
RE: Not really suitable anyway
By Oregonian2 on 1/23/2007 6:03:04 PM , Rating: 2
Don't know. If just one "native" is bumped overboard and dies, that would be pretty close to genocide in that "country".


RE: Not really suitable anyway
By akugami on 1/22/2007 10:06:00 PM , Rating: 3
Only the fact that every single nation on earth would be opposed to such actions. Now, they can call for sanctions against a nation that is doing illegal activities but you can't just blow them into the stone age.


RE: Not really suitable anyway
By l3ored on 1/22/2007 10:22:36 PM , Rating: 2
Now, you can suggest democracy as a form of government, but if a country is a dictatorship, you can't just blow them into the stone age.


RE: Not really suitable anyway
By Mels on 1/23/2007 9:33:47 PM , Rating: 1
Sure you can, the US is doing it right now.


RE: Not really suitable anyway
By BBeltrami on 1/24/2007 11:50:27 AM , Rating: 2
Navy Seals?! Heck just send Chuck Norris.

"Remember the Soviet Union? They decided to quit after watching a DeltaForce marathon on Satellite TV."


Mhmm...
By Soviet Robot on 1/22/2007 7:44:17 PM , Rating: 2
TPB's "plan" is just a big joke. If they actually got that $20k from donations, they're just gonna pull a lokitorrent.




RE: Mhmm...
By fil6786 on 1/22/2007 8:49:33 PM , Rating: 2
I wonder how the people who donated all the money are going to feel when they don't buy the island. With all the money they could have just bought their downloads legally.


RE: Mhmm...
By fxnick on 1/22/2007 10:26:11 PM , Rating: 2
there going to buy a smaller island somewhere else i think


RE: Mhmm...
By Nach0 on 1/23/2007 1:55:23 AM , Rating: 2
They can camp out at my back yard, as long as they pay for DSL :)


Not under U.K law
By Zurtex on 1/22/2007 8:12:05 PM , Rating: 3
While the U.K did extend their territorial waters to 12 miles off the coast in 1987, under international treaties extending your off coast territorial waters does NOT give you the claim to land of other countries.

By 1987 a U.K court had already decided that Sealand was not bound by British law and the U.K government refused to deal with foreign diplomats over Sealand, directing them to negotiate treaties directly with Sealand.

The history of Season is hilarious :P




RE: Not under U.K law
By nothingtoseehere on 1/22/2007 9:07:07 PM , Rating: 2
I guess it has to suck to go to Dundee University to supposedly learn law and then to discover that they have lecturers that talk nonsense.


RE: Not under U.K law
By latrosicarius on 1/23/2007 12:47:00 AM , Rating: 3
I was thinking the same thing.

In today's news, the U.S.A. has decided to extend its borders 25,000 miles, and now owns the entire world.


just promoting his book?
By Kuroyama on 1/23/2007 8:44:41 AM , Rating: 3
quote:
In fact, I’ve written a book and Hollywood is making a movie out of it

As numerous people have commented, the $1 billion MSRP is ludicrous and probably indicates that there's no real intention to sell. I would like to suggest that the "For Sale" sign was just hung out to get free media attention so that people will go out and buy his book and/or watch his movie.




RE: just promoting his book?
By aguilpa1 on 1/23/2007 9:00:38 AM , Rating: 3
That rusting pile of debris is hardly worth close to 1B..., whatever.

If software pirates want a nation to support their cause..., there's a huge one out there already..., its called CHINA!!! just rent a small office space condo there, its cheaper


Hmmm...Sealand
By feraltoad on 1/23/2007 5:22:37 AM , Rating: 2
Does anyone else think "Sealand" looks like the biggest piece of sh!t they have ever seen? That the 'card table on barrels' has survived is a craptastic miracle.




By rika13 on 1/23/2007 5:40:48 AM , Rating: 2
anybody remember havenco? they specifically allowed warez servers, black market operations, anything except terrorism after 9/11 and child porn

havenco also had some pretty tight defenses, nitrogen flooded server rooms, you have to bring your own air or else the atmosphere will KILL you, AA guns, and heavily armed guards; definately would require a military operation (aka, an act of war) to get in and with the same defense that kept england safe from nazi germany (its called being a dinky island) means you need a vehicle (those AA guns would tear a helocopter or boat apart) or a few cruise missiles (a blatant and overt act of aggression)

england must defend sealand if it wishes to claim the mirconation legally (which means if sealand is attack, england MUST counter-attack), something they aint going do for the RIAA; so either it must enforce british law on sealand which it cannot do without sealand's permission (sealand was claimed before england expanded her borders to 12km, and I believe the UK has ex post facto prohibitions as well) or it must attack sealand (which will be seen as an outrage by many, since it's the UK bullying another nation) and an act of war would force the crown to recognize sealand as a seperate entity

of course selling out to hollywood is definately worth more than $20k




Only $970,999,980,059 more to Earn
By Nik00117 on 1/23/2007 8:50:12 AM , Rating: 2
I thought it was a laughable causee at the start. And to think Priatebay already has 20k of poeples money in their hands.




By Delegator on 1/23/2007 9:11:01 AM , Rating: 2
Lost in all this discussion of territorial waters and sale prices is the real tragedy: if PirateBay.Org is unable to become a sovereign nation, then there will continue to be no country in the world in which Talk Like a Pirate Day (http://www.talklikeapirate.com/) is an official state holiday.




Oh Brother!
By z3R0C00L on 1/23/2007 12:38:29 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
“It’s theft of proprietary rights, it doesn’t suit us at all,” he said. “In fact, I’ve written a book and Hollywood is making a movie out of it, so it would go right against the grain to go into the file sharing thing.”


Ahhh yes... a bet ya they'll make those file sharers into terrorists and some hero cop will fight them for the good of the planet thus saving the good people of hollywood who are just trying to make ends meat.




"You can bet that Sony built a long-term business plan about being successful in Japan and that business plan is crumbling." -- Peter Moore, 24 hours before his Microsoft resignation











botimage
Copyright 2014 DailyTech LLC. - RSS Feed | Advertise | About Us | Ethics | FAQ | Terms, Conditions & Privacy Information | Kristopher Kubicki