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Print 37 comment(s) - last by xenol.. on Jun 24 at 11:17 AM

The Nexus 9 is being manufacturers by HTC and features an aluminum body

The Google I/O conference is kicking off this week, and Google is set to announce a new 8.9” Android-powered tablet at the conference. The so-called Nexus 9 tablet was reportedly designed by HTC, and like its flagship One (M8) smartphone will be constructed of aluminum.
 
At the heart of the 0.31” thick, 418-gram device is a 64-bit NVIDIA Tegra K1 processor (with 2GB RAM). The aforementioned 8.9” display features a resolution of 2048x1440 (281 ppi), and 16GB/32GB storage options will be offered to consumers along with Wi-Fi/Wi-Fi + LTE versions. Other features include an 8MP rear camera with optical image stabilization (OIS), a 3MP front-facing camera, and front-facing stereo speakers.


[Image Source: Android Police]
 
For comparison’s sake, Samsung’s new 8.4” Galaxy Tab S comes with either a Exynos 5 Octa processor (1.9 GHz quad-core + 1.3 GHz quad-core) for Wi-Fi models or a Qualcomm Snapdragon 800 processor (2.3GHz quad-core) for LTE models — each paired with 3GB of RAM. The 8.9” display features a screen resolution of 2560x1600, and like the Nexus 9, it will be available in 16GB and 32GB storage capacities and include LTE connectivity on the options sheet.
 
The new 8.4” Galaxy Tab S doesn’t come with a swanky aluminum body, which allows it to top the scales at just 294 grams.
 
According to Android Police, the Nexus 9 will be priced at $399 for the 16GB model and $499 for the 32GB model, which mirrors pricing for the 8.4” Galaxy Tab S.

Source: Android Police



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Tegra?
By atechfan on 6/23/2014 6:55:53 AM , Rating: 3
When are people going to stop falling for the NVidia hype? Every Tegra so far has over promised and under delivered. Based on past performance, I see no reason to believe the new one will be any better. They have always ran hotter and used more battery power than NVidia promised. Other than that, looks like an incredible tablet for the price.

Before anyone points out that the none-pro Surface's have Tegras, I know that. And I think they suck there too. My biggest beef with the Surface was that they didn't go with Qualcomm.




RE: Tegra?
By bug77 on 6/23/2014 7:12:25 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Every Tegra so far has over promised and under delivered.


Do you have a link for that?
They had a problem in that there was no on-die LTE modem and discrete solutions inherently sucked more battery juice. But that's the only problem I'm aware of. Qualcomm to this day doesn't include LTE in all their products, because there are still WiFi-only things.


RE: Tegra?
By retrospooty on 6/23/2014 8:18:40 AM , Rating: 2
Nvidia has a long LONG history of this going back way before the Tegra. They do this constantly. With any Nvidia product (and they aren't all bad) you just cant rely on anything Nvidia says about it. They often consume more power, run slower, and hotter than the early hype. They then modify the specs before release, so it almost appears to operate as designed, but doesn't live up to the hype. This is why many OEM's are reluctant to deal with them. With any Nvidia product, wait for independent reviews of actual shipping product before you buy.

Anyhow, It's early and we could easily be looking at an eval unit that will choose a different chip. It's all rumor right now.


RE: Tegra?
By Spuke on 6/23/14, Rating: 0
RE: Tegra?
By BRB29 on 6/23/2014 9:58:25 AM , Rating: 1
NVDA manipulate these things through software. They own most of the dGPU market, they also force developers to optimize codes via programs like Gameworks. There's a lot behind the curtain that you don't know.

Theoretically, there's not much difference between NVDA and AMD cards but the software impact makes the difference. Ever wonder why NVDA doesn't give developers their source codes for game or benchmark development? Why issue developers DLLs when you can give them source code and they can really optimize the game.

Ever wonder why they overuse tessellation on the dog's fur in COD Ghost or Batman's cape in Arkham series? It makes 0 difference in graphical details from the gamers' eyes at 1080p or even 1440p. Why does a cape need millions of triangles? and why does a dog needs so more tessellation than the rest of the game?

It's all trick of the trades in the business. While every business tries to cheat, NVDA seems to take it a step further than anyone else.


RE: Tegra?
By retrospooty on 6/23/2014 10:16:59 AM , Rating: 2
You must be pretty young, or just be new to tech news. Yes, the current Titan lineup of the past couple years is a much improved model, prior to that, it was really hit and miss for a decade. They have had those same issues with Tegra.

Like I said, not all NV products are bad, its just that you cant believe a thing they say until products are released and those production models are independently reviewed. Then and ONLY then should you buy an Nvidia product.


RE: Tegra?
By Spuke on 6/23/2014 11:21:07 AM , Rating: 1
quote:
You must be pretty young, or just be new to tech news.
I just know how to read. It's all over the internet "bro". You do realize that reviewers do their own testing right? That's the whole point of review websites, right? "Here" on Anandtech they do video card testing. Are you saying that Anandtech lies? What about the other review sites? Are they liars too? Dude, sometimes you really make me wonder.


RE: Tegra?
By retrospooty on 6/23/2014 12:52:28 PM , Rating: 2
What are you even talking about? I honestly cant make sense of anything you just wrote.

"". You do realize that reviewers do their own testing right?"

Yes, I do. What does that have to do with the comments at hand?

""Here" on Anandtech they do video card testing. Are you saying that Anandtech lies? "

Where did this come from? I didn't say that, I said the current NV VC lineup from the past 2 years is actually quite improved, but they have a long history of over promising and under-delivering and having issues on chips that cause them to have to throttle back or deal with heat or power drain issues. Since you didn't seem to be aware of that, I thought maybe you werent into tech or at least not paying attention for the past 15 years. A valid thought, not an insult.

"Are you saying that Anandtech lies? What about the other review sites? Are they liars too? "

No, in fact that is where all this info came from over the past 15 years. Hello!

Whatever man, I am not trying to start a flame war over Nvidia, I really couldn't care less... If you want to trust Nvidia, go for it. Like I said, I personally wouldn't recommend it until production (not pre production "gold units hand picked by Nvidia) have been tested by independent sites like Anandtech and many others before buying any Nvidia product based on their history, right up to and including the current Tegra 4 chip that is currently in almost no products because it runs hotter and sucks more power than expected and OEMS are aware of Nvidias tricks.


RE: Tegra?
By Spuke on 6/23/2014 1:32:08 PM , Rating: 2
You JUST said,

quote:
Nvidia has a long LONG history of this going back way before the Tegra. They do this constantly. With any Nvidia product (and they aren't all bad) you just cant rely on anything Nvidia says about it.


Does that not imply video cards or any other product they've produced? What are YOU talking about?


RE: Tegra?
By retrospooty on 6/23/2014 1:49:06 PM , Rating: 2
"You JUST said, quote:
Nvidia has a long LONG history of this going back way before the Tegra. They do this constantly. With any Nvidia product (and they aren't all bad) you just cant rely on anything Nvidia says about it."


Yes, I did say that and I stand behind it...

"Does that not imply video cards or any other product they've produced? "

Yes, it applies to potentially all products, VC's included... But I also said " the current Titan lineup of the past couple years is a much improved model"

It's not that all NV products have issues, some are great. The current "Kepler" generation is an example of Nvidia doing extremely well. It's not that all NV products are bad, its that you never know and can't trust what Nvidia says about them prior to launch. Thus my statement, and my whole point here "I personally wouldn't recommend it until production (not pre production "gold standard" units hand picked by Nvidia) have been tested by independent sites like Anandtech and many others before buying any Nvidia product based on their history

In other words, rely on reviews of sites you trust, not on anything Nvidia says prior to launch.


RE: Tegra?
By Spuke on 6/23/2014 4:40:10 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
In other words, rely on reviews of sites you trust, not on anything Nvidia says prior to launch.
Thank you for the clarification. I didn't get that at all from your post obviously.


RE: Tegra?
By retrospooty on 6/23/2014 4:49:51 PM , Rating: 2
No worries... I should have started out with Nvidia always talks the talk, but doesn't always walk the walk.


RE: Tegra?
By TheJian on 6/24/2014 7:53:28 AM , Rating: 2
So about like AMD then huh? Retail cards that couldn't do top speeds, changing fan speeds via drivers to get 290 up to snuff and asking review sites to re-do their benchmarking because of it, mantle that's now been proven pointless even by a DX11 NV driver update, let alone OpenGL they discussed having like features for years (as mantle, see the OpenGL speech a few months ago). Enduro problems, drivers in what phase3? Never going to fix dx9/dx10 for older cards etc. Claiming freesync is free when someone has to pay to upgrade the scaler tech, and it won't be FREE. Their awesome desktop cpus just sort of shriveled correct? Each rev was going to be awesome and crush Intel, but they ended up giving up the race. I could go on but you should get the point.

In another 2yrs they'll be giving up the gpu race as whatever was in the pipeline from the engineers that got laid off is about to end and they'll have to make due with 30% less engineers from here forward. We are seeing signs of this crap already kicking in with drivers in phase3 (if they even bother). R&D went from 1.7B 4years ago to 1.2B now which is below Nvidia now. When 290x debut, HardOCP said it should have been made on 20nm. Toms saw clocks tank to 750mhz, while NV cards don't run UP TO, they run AT or ABOVE advertised speeds right?

So to use your words AMD always talks the talk, but doesn't always walk the walk.

You could probably insert any company name there...LOL.


RE: Tegra?
By retrospooty on 6/24/2014 8:20:37 AM , Rating: 2
AMD fits that mold sometimes too, for sure. Not "most conpanies". If you dont see Nvidia being worse here than any other company in the tech industry you simply haven been paying attention for the past 15 years. No matter, OEM's have.


RE: Tegra?
By xenol on 6/24/2014 11:15:09 AM , Rating: 2
AMD is in the same boat. They keep promising and promising but fail to deliver the promised results.

The point is, you shouldn't trust any one's marketers, and a lot of trade show showing-off is usually a bunch of hacks to get the thing to work impressively that wouldn't otherwise be used in the real product.


RE: Tegra?
By bug77 on 6/23/2014 9:56:13 AM , Rating: 2
Ok, but early hype is not a technical specification. Sometimes the sources go overboard, sometimes production and/or physics put a break on some of the plans. It happens.
I've been in an exclusive relationship with nvidia when it comes to video cards for years and I never felt they were underperforming. Then again, I only buy mid-range, the story may be different at the top. That's why I asked for a link, I'd like to read more about this.


RE: Tegra?
By retrospooty on 6/23/2014 3:26:05 PM , Rating: 2
"Ok, but early hype is not a technical specification. Sometimes the sources go overboard, sometimes production and/or physics put a break on some of the plans. It happens."

It does happen, it just happens to Nvidia alot more than most chip makers. If Intel, Qualcomm, Samsung, most others, says "our next gen chip coming in 6 months will hit X performance at X watts", you can pretty much believe it. Not that it is always the case, but usually. With Nvidia, it's all smoke and mirrors, you simply cant believe a single word of it until shipping production parts are independently reviewed. This is why OEM's are so reluctant to get thier chips. This is why Nvidia has to make thier own tablet, and thier own gaming device. OEM's are tired of the smoke and mirrors. This is also why it's kind of shocking to see Google/HTC going with it... OF course, it can always be a home run product like the current Kepler/Titan Nvidia chips. They are very good. Google/HTC may know something we dont, but still like I said, wait for independent reviews to prove it.


RE: Tegra?
By Spuke on 6/23/2014 4:42:30 PM , Rating: 2
Google COULD just simply make sure Nvidia performs. Afterall, their name (Google) is on the line. That said, I tend not to believe any of them anyways, good track record or not.


RE: Tegra?
By UpSpin on 6/23/2014 9:00:22 AM , Rating: 2
The issue is the lack of an on-die modem, which caused a higher power consumption. So Tegra is more suited for tablets than for smartphones. In tablets it's competive. For smartphones they developed Tegra 4i which addresses the modem issue.
The other issue was the mediocre GPU and memory interface. A decision they took to keep the SoC size small and the production costs low. Compare the size with an Apple A6 and you'll see the difference.
Because the Tegra SoC is so small and thus cheap it mainly got used in cheaper tablets with cheaper components.
Their CPU part was fast and thanks to 4+1 ahead of their time, both regarding performance and efficiency.
Not so the GPU, but this changed with Tegra K1:
http://www.engadget.com/2014/06/05/project-tango-t...
quote:
If that all sounds like overkill for a tablet, it's because the team wanted to make it extremely difficult to hit a ceiling in terms of computing power.
The NVIDIA chip inside uses desktop GPU architecture, making it easier for companies to port over complex programs that they've already spent years developing on PCs


So I think we can expect some great performance, this time for both CPU and GPU.


RE: Tegra?
By hpglow on 6/23/2014 12:05:33 PM , Rating: 2
I would agree with you in regaurds to the first 3 Tegra specificly the GPU performance, but the most recent two tegra have been quite competitive in every area but power consumption. There must also be a cost disadvantage as well because they don't tend to get many design wins.


RE: Tegra?
By hubb1e on 6/23/2014 1:16:53 PM , Rating: 2
Can confirm. I've owned both Tegra 2 and Tegra 3 and both performed poorly in real world use. I think it was related to their lack of memory bandwidth.


RE: Tegra?
By Wolfpup on 6/23/2014 3:06:58 PM , Rating: 1
Even the Surface 1 with Tegra 3 runs great. Bear in mind that Windows RT runs circles around Android's performance...


RE: Tegra?
By michael2k on 6/23/2014 4:59:39 PM , Rating: 2
People? These are OEMs with access to NVIDIA hardware, which is distinctly different than hype.

You mention Qualcomm as an example, yet in this case Qualcomm specifically doesn't have their Snapdragon with 64 bit A8 support scheduled until next year; even those utilizing ARM cores aren't expected to be out until next quarter:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/7925/qualcomms-snapd...

So if you want a 64 bit ARM SoC you really only have one choice right now; NVIDIA.


RE: Tegra?
By xenol on 6/24/2014 11:17:05 AM , Rating: 2
I have a Tegra APX2500 based product that works really well even with all the games and apps it had.


inches and grams?
By drewsup on 6/23/2014 8:22:14 AM , Rating: 2
Can we please pick one standard and stick to it? Grams and inches don't mix, and while the new tablet has a 64 bit processor, no mention of core count like in the compared tablet.




RE: inches and grams?
By retrospooty on 6/23/2014 8:42:17 AM , Rating: 2
The K1 is a quad core "4+1" with an additional low power core.

http://www.nvidia.com/object/tegra-k1-processor.ht...


RE: inches and grams?
By UpSpin on 6/23/2014 9:03:44 AM , Rating: 2
No, if it's the 64-bit edition it's a dual core without a companion-core
http://www.anandtech.com/show/7622/nvidia-tegra-k1...


RE: inches and grams?
By retrospooty on 6/23/2014 9:14:04 AM , Rating: 2
Ah, I see. NV is light on the details on their own site. Anyhow, 2 powerful cores is fine if the performance and thermals are there... I just don't trust Nvidia to be there. If it performs without drawing too much power it will be sweet though.


RE: inches and grams?
By TheJian on 6/24/2014 8:02:43 AM , Rating: 2
K1 speaks for itself as it does very well against S805 as the benchmarks everywhere show. The denver version takes it in house while Qcom goes off the shelf this round. That's going to hurt battery and perf. Denver should drop power enough to allow i500 to be outside and still win a few top phones even if they don't integrate quickly. S810 is off the shelf IP so won't be anything special. It will take another year to fix that. The dual denver at 2.5 already matches Quad A15 at 2.3 in the same tablet form factor so clearly the Oregon team knows their cpu's.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/patrickmoorhead/2013/1...
"Let’s look at Nvidia’s processor team. They have been in existence since 2006 and have hardened multiple, “off-the-shelf” ARM cores. Unknown to most, Nvidia’s engineers have been working on their ARM 64-bit Denver for at least three years, since before the CES 2011 announcement. Hailing out of Portland, Oregon, the team consists of former CPU jockeys from Intel, AMD, HP, Sun, and Transmeta with experience in superscalar, OoO (out of order) execution design, micro-code, VLIW, hyper-threading, and multi-core."

Now that discrete has met mobile with K1, it isn't about the modem now, it's about the games and that means GPUS.


RE: inches and grams?
By retrospooty on 6/24/2014 8:17:50 AM , Rating: 2
"K1 speaks for itself as it does very well against S805 as the benchmarks everywhere show...... Now that discrete has met mobile with K1, it isn't about the modem now, it's about the games and that means GPUS."

I am not doubting it's gaming speed, I am doubting its heat and power consumption in a mobile device. Not even "doubting" so much as simply not believing anything until its independently reviewed in a shipping product (meaning not a "cherry picked" chip Nvidia sent to a reviewer).


Really?
By bug77 on 6/23/2014 3:49:13 AM , Rating: 2
How many models sold well at $400+?




RE: Really?
By bug77 on 6/23/2014 6:12:41 AM , Rating: 3
Also, it seems to include a much sought-after feature: $100 for an additional 16GB of storage. Boo!


RE: Really?
By retrospooty on 6/23/2014 8:10:39 AM , Rating: 2
I wouldn't put too much weight into this, it's an early rumor. If if does come out with 16/32 for an additional $100, that would suck though... I just don't see it considering the Nexus 7 is $40 to jump from 16 to 32.


Do I really need this?
By bupkus on 6/23/2014 1:21:55 AM , Rating: 3
I was looking forward to a new nexus 9 after selling my nexus 7(2012) and then purchasing a nook hd+. I knew I would have a hard time justifying a $400+ purchase over my $150 nook and yes, I am.
Mostly for reading, checking the weather, OCW and youtube videos, I'm not feeling the need to upgrade still.
Nope, I don't think so. Except, my OS, a cm4.4.2 is a little bit of a disappointment.




By letmepicyou on 6/23/2014 12:30:29 PM , Rating: 3
$100 extra bucks for 16 gig of extra storage? 16 gig flash drive is what, $12? How about if we start emailing these tablet makers en masse and demanding more realistic storage capacities?

32 gig should be an absolute minimum, 64 gig should be standard, and the upper end should be 128 or 256 gig.

I say this as an owner of a Galaxy Tab 4. Love it but darn thing should have way more cap.




32GB
By flyingpants1 on 6/23/2014 12:56:52 AM , Rating: 2
How many gigs for the $499 version Brandon?




Not enough to woo me
By TheJian on 6/24/2014 7:27:04 AM , Rating: 2
Let me know when it comes with 64GB, 13in+, and 1080p so I can really game on it, or worst case 1920x1200. Anything above that you're making my games slower. My desktop with radeon 5850 can't even do 1200p in many games maxed (I could probably count those on my hand), so what they heck do they keep doing this crap high res stuff for? My desktop looks great on a dell 24 at 1200p. A 13in tablet won't look worse in my hands. These ridiculously high resolutions are pointless until 14nm or 10nm (lower? 7nm?) when there will be more tricks (large caches like iris etc) to get the job done that desktops do in 100-200w cards today. I hate my dad's nexus 10. Looks great, but what is the point when you can't really game on it?

I'm planning 1600p for my next 27 or 30in monitor, so why would I want that res on a 10in tablet? You're merely sucking the life out of the battery pushing the screen, and slowing down any gaming I plan to do, not to mention raising the price due to those high end screens (surely 1080p/1200p is cheaper than 1600p etc). They came down a bit here, but not enough. It's still stupid on 9in.




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