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Jonney Shih on Windows RT: “The result is not very promising,”

ASUS chairman Jonney Shih has announced that his company is pulling away from Windows RT. The chairman says that one of the only bets he's made in the technology industry that didn't pan out was Windows RT.

Shih isn't saying that ASUS is ruling out future Windows RT products, but his company is putting the bulk of its energy and money into devices running Intel chips.

ASUS isn't alone in pulling away from Windows RT; Lenovo recently discontinued online sales of its Yoga 11 Windows RT tablet. Microsoft itself is also facing challenges in selling Windows RT devices and recently cut the base price for its Surface RT tablet to $349 in the U.S.


ASUS chairman Jonney Shih [Image Source: NYT]
 
Microsoft was also forced to take a $900 million write-down due to its inability to sell sufficient volumes of the Surface Tablet.
 
Shih also pointed a finger at Microsoft for missteps with Windows 8, noting that one of its most popular apps is one to bring back the classic Start menu (this “misstep” is being addressed with Windows 8.1).

ASUS recently unveiled a new machine called the Transformer Book Trio running both Windows and Android operating systems. The chairman also noted that ASUS is considering building 10-inch and eight-inch Windows tablets, but admits the 10-inch may be the better choice.

Source: AllthingsD



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RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By ilt24 on 7/31/2013 9:15:07 AM , Rating: -1
quote:
This is not going to alleviate the concerns of users who can't get over the start menu being replaced with a start screen.


While I don't understand Microsoft's decision here, I just don't get why so many think it's an issue with so many third party start button solutions to choose from.


RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By Monkey's Uncle on 7/31/2013 9:29:22 AM , Rating: 5
You should not have to buy 3rd party apps to replace functionality that Microsoft removed.

Sorry but Microsoft effed up pretty hard here.


RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By damianrobertjones on 7/31/13, Rating: -1
RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By hughlle on 7/31/2013 10:00:05 AM , Rating: 2
My parents are a 50+ year old couple, my father recently bought my mother an ultrabook to take around her diocese with her. she tried for a week to adapt from years of cp, vista, 7, and couldn't. Neither could my father. What he could do though was search the internet and find and install one of these 3rd party apps.

Sure they could use the laptop in the normal windows 8 fashion, but they saw no reason for it so changed back to a classic start menu. They wanted the start menu for a reason, as do others.


RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By damianrobertjones on 7/31/13, Rating: -1
RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By Spuke on 7/31/13, Rating: -1
By slunkius on 8/1/2013 2:23:36 AM , Rating: 1
my GF is not the type to visit DT, so no anti MS bias here. last week she got W8 ultrabook, and she keeps complaining that it is not as convenient as WXP. in the shop, when we could not close the application on the demo machine, and sales rep suggested ALT+F4. not as intuitive as close button :) oh, and should down process is wonderfull too.


By ie5x on 8/1/2013 5:08:15 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Quite frankly, the only people I hear complaining about the start menu loss and the UI in general are peeps here on DT and maybe a few blogs. No one else. I really don't understand the incessant whining about this.

And yet Apps which address this "seldom complained" issue are top selling... And Windows 8 fails to take off...

For some reason, your perception of minority needs a second opinion...


By ie5x on 8/1/2013 5:12:43 AM , Rating: 1
Never mind, after reading the rest of your comments, I realized I got baited by a troll.

Pray continue...


RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By retrospooty on 7/31/2013 10:07:17 AM , Rating: 5
"Additionally if a 50+ year old couple, to whom I sold a Surface RT and Ativ Smart PC can get it.. so can anyone."

Its not about "getting" it or not. A trained ape can "get" it and make it work, the point is that alot of people dont like it. Its a touch screen UI that sucks on non touch devices. They took it out and forced a change that no-one asked for and no-one wanted.


RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By damianrobertjones on 7/31/13, Rating: -1
RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By Spuke on 7/31/13, Rating: 0
RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By Mitch101 on 7/31/13, Rating: -1
By Reclaimer77 on 8/1/2013 9:39:43 AM , Rating: 1
"suckered into" what exactly? People sharing a different opinion than yours? Yeah that's totally "trolling".

It just so happens to be that the market has proven some people right, and some wrong. You're on the losing side, fyi.


By LRonaldHubbs on 7/31/2013 1:46:21 PM , Rating: 2
Agreed, except for where you said "starting to get annoying."
It was annoying and childish from day 1.


RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By retrospooty on 7/31/2013 10:43:02 AM , Rating: 3
I dont think they are changing to ones they dont like.

Why is it so hard to grasp that people dont like it? I found it far less efficient for me to use at work, where I multitask a TON. I use it at home and like it OK, but at work, it hampered me to no end. It's a touch screen UI , that just sucks (in alot of people opinions) on non touch devices like 99% of every computer in every company on Earth.

You can rationalize, justify and deny all you want, but you wont make people that don't like it suddenly like it. MS has an issue to deal with here, real, or perceived, its a problem.


RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By kmmatney on 7/31/2013 11:35:54 AM , Rating: 2
Agreed. I hardly ever use the start menu at home - I tend to keep desktop shortcuts. At work, I use the start menu all the time - usually keeping to the most frequently used Apps. I like being able to select the Visual Studio start menu item, and then being able to going into a sub menu to select the project I want. Same with Excel or Word from the start menu. I don't often have go deeper in the start menu than my most frequently used applications, but I like to be able to when I need to. trying to get work done without classicchell would be a PITA.


By retrospooty on 7/31/2013 11:43:17 AM , Rating: 1
That and the forced fullscreen thing... Irritating as hell... It kind of kills the whole point of the once aptly named "Windows" OS. They may have to change the name to the singular "window" ;)

I can see the ad campaign now... "MS Window 8. It better now"


RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By crispbp04 on 7/31/13, Rating: 0
By retrospooty on 7/31/2013 1:01:08 PM , Rating: 2
"I love the start SCREEN on my side by side 24" 1080P NON-touchscreen monitors. Live tiles are the shiz."

Then YOU buy it and use it.

"There are zero use cases where the start menu is advantageous over the start screen."

That is purely opinion.
- You cant fit as many shortcuts on one screen
- You cant embed folders > for example MS Office folder, and 10 shortucts under it. Its all in your face
- Fullscreen menu steals Window focus from your open windows and makes multitasking less efficient

Like I said above "That and the forced fullscreen thing... Irritating as hell... It kind of kills the whole point of the once aptly named "Windows" OS. They may have to change the name to the singular "window"

BY all means, if you like it use it, but dont discount hte opinion of millions and millions of users that dont like it. They dont like it for very good reasons.


By nikon133 on 7/31/2013 6:12:33 PM , Rating: 2
I like it too.

I'm using W8 in different scenarios:

Home gaming PC, 1x 24" 1080p screen, non-touch
Work PC, 2x 22" 1080p screens, non-touch
Personal laptop, 14" non-touch

Granted in my work scenario, most tools I use during the day are on taskbar... so I hardly go to Modern at all. But when I do (I keep some folder tiles and rarely used apps on Start screen), I don't mind. I also use tiles to have a quick look at my personal emails, messages etc (work email, calendar etc are in Outlook, Lync...).

But... I don't have problem accepting that some (many) people don't like it, or even can't stand it. Modern/desktop combination is very... bipolar.

I think 8.1 will soften some more users, new Start screen with all apps and desktop background softens transition between Modern and Desktop reasonably well, and all-apps-Start screen has functionality closer to classic menu... but I don't expect it to be runaway success. Just a step in right direction.

That being said, I will still be using dynamic tiles favourites (rather than all apps) Start screen - for some reason, it really sits well with me.


By JPForums on 7/31/2013 10:13:43 AM , Rating: 2
Some people do actually use the start menu. Personally, I make use of it moderately due to the shear number of programs I use on a regular basis and the fact that I can't stand a cluttered desktop. Professionally, at my workplace, people tend to fill up their desktops with product spec sheets, manuals, and documents they are working on. They don't even bother docking their most used applications to the task bar. You can imagine that they use the start menu quite a lot. Don't dismiss a usage scenario just because it doesn't match yours. Given the fact that there was enough user feedback to make Microsoft rethink their decision, I'd wager more than a few people use the start menu to some extent.

That said, the Windows 8 start screen isn't unusable by any stretch of the imagination (especially by a forum full of techies). Nobody made that claim. What they claim is that the old menu was better. Frankly, there are some measurable metrics to agree with this (others don't). For instance, the old start menu exceeds the Windows 8 start screen for number of applications visible (and readable) it can display on a single display. One could argue that the new menu takes less clicks, but if you have enough programs, you'd waste just as much time scrolling as you would clicking. While the Windows 8 start screen can be organized in such a way as to be quite efficient, for those that don't spend the time to mess with it, the old start menu is better by default. Also, it takes very little effort to arrange things alphabetically to make things even easier.

I do feel like Windows 8.1 has moved into the realm of equal but different by giving quicker access to the applications in list mode and allowing it to be set as default. It would be even nicer if they'd allow a contextual default. I'd use tiles for undocked (typically touch input) and list for docked (precision pointer available). Perhaps they already do this, but I don't have anything to check it out with at the moment. Unfortunately, the advantages still lie with tablets. Even if the desktop interface can be considered roughly on par with the older interface, there still isn't a compelling reason to switch. If convertible style tablets pick up steam, though, the change will be worth it.

All things considered, the hardest thing for me to understand is why any company would be so reluctant to monetize a product that they already have and people want.


RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By KC7SWH on 7/31/2013 10:35:14 AM , Rating: 2
Personally and professionally I don't agree as I use the start menu all the time at work. I have a number of files for excel and word that I constantly use and I have them pinned in the start menu so in 2 clicks I can have the file that I need pulled up. The one thing that I don't use my start button for is to shut down my machine I have an app for that. :)


RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By Spuke on 7/31/2013 10:39:32 AM , Rating: 1
I have my most used apps on the start bar where I can access them with ONE CLICK.


By retrospooty on 7/31/2013 10:44:59 AM , Rating: 2
That really doenst invalidate the millions of people that hate the new UI's complaints in any way. That just shows that you use it in a certain way and seem to like it.


RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By kmmatney on 7/31/2013 11:28:49 AM , Rating: 2
Why can't MS make a proper start menu an option. Those who don't like it can disable it, those who want it can keep it. What is wrong with having options?


By ilt24 on 7/31/2013 12:18:29 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Why can't MS make a proper start menu an option.
I don't know, it totally baffles me.

quote:
What is wrong with having options?
That's the thing you have options, lots of them. While you have to pay for some plenty are free; they just weren't created by Microsoft.


RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By GPig on 7/31/13, Rating: -1
RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By hughlle on 7/31/2013 10:22:16 AM , Rating: 2
Useless to you. De-facto to you. Not to everyone though. I have 2 apps and the user folder button pinned. I will not pin any more. I want space on my taskbar to be able to quickly access all of my open files folder and applications.


By inighthawki on 7/31/2013 11:22:09 AM , Rating: 2
A lot of people who suggest that "you just need to pin 100 things to the taskbar" I don't think realize that some people use taskbar buttons with labels and that pinning that many things severely limits the available space.


RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By spamreader1 on 7/31/2013 11:04:33 AM , Rating: 2
It's not the context menu so much as it is the change from hierarchy to anarchy. Our Paragon suite alone has 34 individual applications. Then we still have PACS, CPACs, LAB, QC, Billing and Reconcilliation apps, Office, etc., etc. Win8 is unsuited for hospital environments, it's entirely too difficult for users to find the app they are looking for. Yes they can eventually find it, but there's no way we wouldn't hear endless whining if we deployed Win8 without a 3rd party start menu. I imagine most professional realms have similar issues.


By JPForums on 7/31/2013 11:50:25 AM , Rating: 2
If you get stuck with Windows 8 (or preferably 8.1), you should create an individual column (you can insert vertical spaces to make it stand out) for Paragon and/or any other suites with a large number of individual apps. The small tiles in Win 8.1 would help here. Standalone apps would be arranged with other related apps in logical order. As long as the setup is uniform across the hospital, it can be made to work pretty efficiently. It just takes some effort and a slight learning curve. Alternately, stick with with Win 7 and get similar efficiency with little setup and no new learning curve.


RE: The start menu hasn't been resolved
By JPForums on 7/31/2013 11:35:39 AM , Rating: 2
I use Windows 8 and I don't use a third party start menu. If you take the time to organize the start screen and you don't overload your computer with applications, then it can be used pretty effectively.

That said, I still see merit in the old approach. I don't see the Win8 start screen as a simple change in form. The tiles compare to the pinned programs list in the old start menu, but there isn't quick and easy access to the application list, which I would consider the equivalent of the program list in the old start menu. It looks like Windows 8.1 could be considered equal, but different, though. It gives you quick access to the application list.

Putting that aside, you still haven't presented a case for why the new start screen is superior to the old one. Changed form is different, not necessarily better. Arguing that the start menu was the most useless part of Win 7 doesn't necessarily make the start screen more useful in Win 8. Yes the search function is improved, but that could've been improved either way. At best I'm hearing equal. Unfortunately, not many people are willing to go through the learning curve without some clear benefit. My benefit was being able to help others out with the new system.


By GPig on 7/31/2013 11:50:29 AM , Rating: 2
I shouldn't really have to put the case forward for why it is superior - touch. The idea of having a separate start screen and start menu is never going to happen - win 8 confuses people enough without splitting the os even more. A consitent experience on all form factors is the point.

You may not have a touch screen device yet but eventually you will - I've been developing on an XPS 12 for some months now and couldn't imagine a touch free world. I hate using my desktop and am thinking upgrading my dual monitor set up to touch.


By kattanna on 7/31/2013 10:20:13 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
You should not have to buy 3rd party apps to replace functionality that Microsoft removed. Sorry but Microsoft effed up pretty hard here.


agreed. im using this free one

http://www.classicshell.net/

works great


"It's okay. The scenarios aren't that clear. But it's good looking. [Steve Jobs] does good design, and [the iPad] is absolutely a good example of that." -- Bill Gates on the Apple iPad














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