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  (Source: Techcetera)
Shakeup will consolidate previously separate units, reportedly

A report by Bloomberg cites sources at Microsoft Corp. (MSFT) as saying that Chief Executive Steve Ballmer's leadership change will start be consolidating all of Microsoft's hardware products -- including Surface and Xbox -- under a single new unit, which would be headed by Windows chief Julie Larson-Green.

The Xbox unit (formally the interactive entertainment division) had been left leaderless after Don Mattrick, its former chief, jumped ship to become CEO of Zynga Inc. (ZNGA).  Some reports suggested Mr. Mattrick was fired for making comments about digital rights management (DRM) and the Xbox One.  In an interview Mr. Mattrick had told gamers who didn't have 100 percent reliable internet to not buy an Xbox One, a suggestion many disgruntled gamers took to heart.  Microsoft eventually backed down from that policy.

Microsoft's CIO Tony Scott also recently bailed, prior to the upcoming shakeup.

It is unclear whether Mr. Ballmer would then appoint a new Windows President, or if Ms. Larson-Green would fill both slots.  One source says that Terry Myerson -- the current Windows Phone chief -- will likely be put in charge of all operating system development, including desktop Windows.  That move would likely mean a continuation of Microsoft's "Metro" (aka Modern UI) assault on the desktop/laptop market, much to the chagrin of critics of that design direction.

Terry Myerson
Windows Phone chief Terry Myerson will report lead all OS development at Microsoft.
[Image Source: Reuters]

Marketing for various units (Windows, server, hardware, etc.) would also be consolidated into a single unit, which would be headed by Tami Reller, who currently is marketing chief for just the Windows unit.  Another shift from a financial perspective would be that the chief financial officers (CFOs) of the new units would report directly to company CFO -- Amy Hood -- versus the current situation the CFOs the present units report to their unit chief.

Julie Larson-Green
Julie Larson-Green will reportedly manage all Microsoft HW development. [Image Source: AP]

A final new unit would be tasked with managing acquired/merged-in businesses and with wooing developers.  That unit will be headed by Skype president Tony Bates.

Sources say the exact roles are still being finalized and may be shuffled before an official announcement comes.  Overall the changes are designed to reposition Microsoft as a "devices and services" firm, Microsoft's long term vision.  The shift towards first party hardware and cloud services would make Microsoft look a lot more like Apple, Inc. (AAPL), a radical shift for a company that started off with a narrow focus on software.

Source: Bloomberg



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the hate here
By mchentz on 7/3/2013 5:48:04 PM , Rating: 1
I really don't know whats going on here I like W8 and my W8 phone. I don't understand why you all do not. My computer runs excellent and I can play my games on W8.




RE: the hate here
By greenchinesepuck on 7/3/13, Rating: -1
RE: the hate here
By Cheesew1z69 on 7/3/2013 6:48:12 PM , Rating: 2
Oh looks, Pirks is back under a new name...


RE: the hate here
By retrospooty on 7/3/2013 7:26:23 PM , Rating: 3
Great... Nice laptop. Too bad it sucks on non-touch screens, especially those over 24 inches.


RE: the hate here
By greenchinesepuck on 7/3/13, Rating: -1
RE: the hate here
By Cheesew1z69 on 7/3/2013 7:54:42 PM , Rating: 3
Hopefully, this account with any luck, will be banned as well.


RE: the hate here
By greenchinesepuck on 7/3/13, Rating: -1
RE: the hate here
By Reclaimer77 on 7/3/2013 8:48:38 PM , Rating: 3
Lol he was? How did I miss that!?


RE: the hate here
By Cheesew1z69 on 7/3/2013 8:56:16 PM , Rating: 1
I believe so, he is posting under a new account so I would assume he was :)

And it's funny, because all it took was one post of his to show it was him, he is the ONLY one who uses "oldfag"... and then his response to me, sealed it. No doubt it's him.


RE: the hate here
By Samus on 7/4/2013 12:17:39 AM , Rating: 2
I wonder if he'll regret all the time he wasted in his life posting all the crap, all the hate here on DT, when he lies on his deathbed...

What a waste.


RE: the hate here
By Cheesew1z69 on 7/4/2013 7:52:32 AM , Rating: 1
No way, he'll think "i sure pwned those oldfags!"


RE: the hate here
By cyberguyz on 7/4/2013 8:00:37 AM , Rating: 1
lolz. oldfags ftw!


RE: the hate here
By mcnabney on 7/4/2013 12:31:51 PM , Rating: 4
They need to board-up 4Chan so the freaks can't get out and bother the rest of the internet.


RE: the hate here
By althaz on 7/3/2013 8:23:33 PM , Rating: 2
I would like to agree with you simpy because Pirks MkII is disagreeing with you, but you are, unfortunately, wrong.

Windows 8 is BETTER than Win7 on desktops, especially for multi-screen users.

Metro Apps are not better of course, but thankfully they are 100% optional.


RE: the hate here
By Reclaimer77 on 7/3/2013 9:25:48 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
Windows 8 is BETTER than Win7 on desktops


Maybe on the planet you live in...

Seriously that's such an insane statement it cannot even be quantified. Windows 7 is the quintessential desktop experience in the Windows world, there's nothing else even close. Sure as hell isn't Windows 8.

The only way your statement even comes close is if you're talking a touchscreen monitor paired with a Windows 8 PC. Even then that's such a tiny minority of the market, it can't be used to back your opinion.


RE: the hate here
By althaz on 7/3/2013 10:00:48 PM , Rating: 2
Care to elaborate on how Win7 isn't worse than Win8 on the desktop?

You don't think improvements to libraries, cloud backup and significant speed improvements are worth having? You don't like the "Up" button in File Explorer? Or is it the improvements to multi-monitor support you don't like? Maybe you hate the improved class drivers? Or perhaps the storage pool options seem like a waste of time to you? Does the dramatically improved start-up speed rub you the wrong way, or is it instead the new backup features that don't sit well with you?

The only other difference to the desktop experience is a vastly improved app-launcher which allows the use of muscle-memory to launch apps, as well as the traditional search-based option (you do lose the completely useless, slow and antiquated hierarchical menu, but that is actually a very good thing).


RE: the hate here
By StevoLincolnite on 7/3/2013 10:36:02 PM , Rating: 4
quote:
significant speed improvements are worth having?


The speed improvements aren't noticeable on a decently equipped PC.
I'm running a Core i7 3930K @ 4.8ghz, 32Gb of ram and a couple of SSD's in Raid 0, I noticed zero difference, but that's to be expected.

However, throw Windows 8 on a Netbook or low-end Laptop with a slow 5400rpm HDD and the difference becomes more pronounced.

Personally, I went back to Windows 7, Windows 8 isn't for me.


RE: the hate here
By althaz on 7/3/2013 11:25:51 PM , Rating: 2
I'm running a similarly specced PC (4.5Ghz Ivy Bridge, 16Gb RAM, 240Gb Intel 520 SSD) and the performance difference is definitely noticable to me.

Of course the difference is more pronounced the crapier your hardware, but if you didn't notice any improvements, I suspect it's because you didn't spend much time switching back and forth (I had a near identical machine that felt a bit sluggish by comparison under Win7) or you used the Previews (all of which ran like crap compared to RTM).


RE: the hate here
By Reclaimer77 on 7/3/2013 11:30:37 PM , Rating: 2
lol I love how he brings up these under the hood changes while we have the huge gnarled cock of Metro beating us over the head...


RE: the hate here
By althaz on 7/4/2013 12:01:50 AM , Rating: 4
I love how I listed virtually every change to the desktop experience in Win8 and you failed to point out anything bad with any of them.

Metro is an optional extra with Win8. If you don't like Metro apps, don't use them (I don't).

If you mean the start screen, I'm yet to hear a compelling argument for it not being a MASSIVE improvement on the positivly antique start menu - which was vitually useless as an app launcher. If for some reason you hate change, the start menu can be brought back in Windows 8 with any of several apps (most of them free).


RE: the hate here
By Reclaimer77 on 7/4/2013 1:28:17 AM , Rating: 1
Nothing is "bad" about those changes at all. They don't have to be "bad" for my argument to have merit.

They just aren't good ENOUGH to warrant switching to Windows 8.

As far as your "app launcher" nonsense, my goodness. A desktop PC isn't a mobile device. I sure as hell don't need a full screen "environment" to take over my desktop in Windows 7 just to run programs.

quote:
I'm yet to hear a compelling argument for it not being a MASSIVE improvement on the positivly antique start menu


Then you either haven't been listening, or have just dismissed these arguments out of hand. I'm getting really tired of people like you claiming "nobody" has made good arguments, when there's an entire Internet full of them out there. Just because you don't agree, doesn't mean they are not compelling.


RE: the hate here
By djcameron on 7/4/2013 1:57:20 AM , Rating: 2
I don't really like the metro apps, so I don't use them. However, after about a week learning the new interface and keyboard commands, I'm far more productive with Windows 8.


RE: the hate here
By mackx on 7/4/2013 2:36:14 AM , Rating: 2
the point is in the end we decide how much use these features are to us based on our own usage of our PCs

i hardly ever reboot so the boot up time is not a feature to me.
i despise the start screen
i dont use metro apps and removed the folder
i find it worse in multi screen use
i find that i cant right click on a folder anymore and hit 'r' to bring up properties. i can't click file and hit n to create a new folder anymore.

changes that don't benefit me in anyway. takes more clicks to do what i wanted to do in the 1st place. there's more but i can't remember them

the only benefit in win8 for me is the performance tab in task manager (cancelled out that to end a process tree takes more clicks now) and the fact i can pause a copy/move.

microsofts AV is less integrated oddly since i can't right click on a folder and scan - no context menu addin. it doesn't auto update like the old one. i have to run windows update manually to install it.

etc etc etc.

you may like it, a lot of us don't.


RE: the hate here
By bigboxes on 7/4/2013 8:13:51 AM , Rating: 2
Agreed. I reboot about once a month. Other than that, my pc stays on all the time, as does my file server. There's absolutely no reason to put Win8 on any of my PCs. It's just like WinME. As soon as I tried it out I was like "Oh crap! Can I get this thing off and get things back to the way they were??" Microsoft just seems doomed to repeat its mistakes.


RE: the hate here
By althaz on 7/4/2013 7:57:26 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
i find it worse in multi screen use

This actually doesn't make sense, everything to do with multi-screen displays is worse, unless you don't like the new default options (which are configurable).

quote:
i find that i cant right click on a folder anymore and hit 'r' to bring up properties.

This still works...you obviously haven't tried it.

quote:
i can't click file and hit n to create a new folder anymore.

This doesn't work in Windows 7 either...I know because I'm on Win7 right now and I just tried it.


RE: the hate here
By althaz on 7/4/2013 8:21:39 PM , Rating: 2
lol, I wrote "worse", but I obviously meant "better". Damn you DailyTech, still no edit function?


RE: the hate here
By althaz on 7/4/2013 7:57:30 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
i find it worse in multi screen use

This actually doesn't make sense, everything to do with multi-screen displays is worse, unless you don't like the new default options (which are configurable).

quote:
i find that i cant right click on a folder anymore and hit 'r' to bring up properties.

This still works...you obviously haven't tried it.

quote:
i can't click file and hit n to create a new folder anymore.

This doesn't work in Windows 7 either...I know because I'm on Win7 right now and I just tried it.


RE: the hate here
By LazLong on 7/4/2013 9:54:37 AM , Rating: 1
quote:
by althaz on July 4, 2013 at 12:01 AM

Metro is an optional extra with Win8. If you don't like Metro apps, don't use them (I don't).


How is Metro an optional extra? It's where you get dumped when you log in. And don't get me started on the Metro Start Screen. Gone is a hierarchical structure. All of the app shortcuts get dumped all over it like a file manager with explosive diarrhea.

I may be an 'oldfag' 'cause I started my computer use on a ][+, but I've had experience using several different CLI- and GUI-based interfaces. This isn't the first time I've had to learn a new interface paradigm. But 8's half-baked, neither here nor there abortion of an interface is the worst piece of shit I can ever recall using. Releasing something that is so radical of a change, without having all of the OS apps moved to it was a very big mistake. Inconsistency is the only constant, and users are totally lost when put in front of an 8 desktop. Computer enthusiasts may be willing to stumble around trying to figure out how to use this pile of dung, but most people just want to get stuff done with a minimal amount of hoops to jump through between them and the completion of their task.


RE: the hate here
By InsGadget on 7/5/2013 9:00:13 AM , Rating: 2
Good lord you are the king of hyperbole. You need to learn that your opinions (yes, they ARE opinions) aren't the end-all/be-all of the universe.

Win8 IS better than Win7 on the desktop. Been using it for months, love it. The Modern Start screen matters about as much as the old Start menu does--not very freaking much at all.

Seriously need to get over yourself ...


RE: the hate here
By Scannall on 7/3/2013 10:02:41 PM , Rating: 2
I think you forgot the /s tag. I know some people out there actually like windows 8. And if you do, great. I'm not one of them.

With 2 2560x1440 monitors on my desk, Win 8 is a failure. Hated it on my laptop as well.


RE: the hate here
By greenchinesepuck on 7/3/2013 10:21:55 PM , Rating: 1
Two 1920x1080 monitors on my desk and Win8 works like a charm on both. Feel sorry for you.


RE: the hate here
By djcameron on 7/4/2013 1:59:49 AM , Rating: 2
I have two 24 inch, and a 20 inch on my desktop and Windows 8 works great.


RE: the hate here
By cyberguyz on 7/4/2013 8:04:47 AM , Rating: 2
I have a single 2560x1440 and Win8 works great ....

... on a phone.

For my desktop it sucked donkey turds.


RE: the hate here
By Flunk on 7/4/2013 9:49:49 AM , Rating: 2
I like how you can have the taskbar on multiple screens on Windows 8, maybe you just didn't try some of the new features.


RE: the hate here
By LazLong on 7/4/2013 9:21:47 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
by althaz on July 3, 2013 at 8:23 PM

Windows 8 is BETTER than Win7 on desktops, especially for multi-screen users.


Could you elaborate how it is better in multi-screen environments? I'm it with two 24" displays and I haven't noticed its awesomeness. Right off I was annoyed that the taskbar was duplicated across both displays.


RE: the hate here
By althaz on 7/4/2013 7:54:06 PM , Rating: 2
Taskbar on both displays is a) Totally frickin sweet and b) entirely optional. Multiple-resolution setups are also handled better, the afore mentioned taskbar on both screens is a godsend(finally! but optional for the crazy people like you who don't want it for some reason).

I also like that the start screen and search are usable on both screens, also multiple desktop wallpapers (as in different ones on each screen), etc.


RE: the hate here
By InsGadget on 7/5/2013 9:04:15 AM , Rating: 2
Right-click on the taskbar and click on Properties. Options are your friend. :)


RE: the hate here
By WinstonSmith on 7/4/2013 9:29:58 AM , Rating: 2
"Microsoft to Put Windows Phone Chief in Charge of All OS Development"

Well, that's entirely appropriate since Win8 is a smartphone OS created and forced upon users in their dominant segment, the desktop, because Microsoft either begins to compete in the fastest growing computing segment, mobile, or they'll become irrelevant at some point in the not too distant future. A common UI across desktop and mobile is their goal and desktop users suffer because of it.

And for a small introduction to why Win8 (actually Tiles v1.0) sucks, Google the keywords "usability experts win8" without the quotes.


RE: the hate here
By retrospooty on 7/4/2013 2:16:34 PM , Rating: 2
"Windows 8 is BETTER than Win7 on desktops, especially for multi-screen users."

I am going to go out on a limb here and say that you don't multitask much.

Things that makes W8 suck.

- The Start screen is full screen, and no way to turn it off
- The Start screen icons are far too large to fit enough apps
- The Start screen takes your focus away from your other windows, kind of killing the whole point of the once aptly named "WINDOWS"
- The Start screen cant embed folders , it can only do one shortcut at a time.

Notice a theme here? Its ALL start screen. The rest of 8 is great. It just doesn't work well with large screen/non-touch screen devices. I use W8 at home, and its fine. At work, I multitask alot. I have TONS of things going on at once and it makes me soooo much less productive I cant stand it. A great OS for touchscreen tablets. OK for light use home desktops... Awful for large and heavy multitaskers.

The shame of it is it was done on purpose. The start menu WAS there on the W8 developer preview and they purposely removed it for the official release. Nice move Ex-LAx. Now 1/2 of your customers hate it. It was already the best of both, then you took out the 1/2.


RE: the hate here
By althaz on 7/4/2013 9:46:59 PM , Rating: 1
quote:

- The Start screen is full screen, and no way to turn it off
- The Start screen icons are far too large to fit enough apps
- The Start screen takes your focus away from your other windows, kind of killing the whole point of the once aptly named "WINDOWS"
- The Start screen cant embed folders , it can only do one shortcut at a time.


- The Start screen being full screen is GOOD, surely? It makes it a lot more useful, displaying a lot more information and giving you quick access to a lot more programs than the start menu, without interupting your workflow like going to your desktop does.
- You can fit a LOT more apps than you can on the start menu...
- Not sure if this argument makes any sense at all, tbh?
- This is a very GOOD thing - if it's buried in a folder it's effectively impossible to intuit its location, plus it's extra clicks, meaning you should either a) Move it to the start screen (if you use it often enough) or b) Use search to get to it.


RE: the hate here
By retrospooty on 7/4/2013 10:25:25 PM , Rating: 2
"giving you quick access to a lot more programs than the start menu"
No. It gives you less. If you have everything on the start menu on the start screen, you would have to scroll 4-5 screens over to the right if not more. The old menu gives it all on one screen, not needing to scroll to get everything.

"without interrupting your workflow like going to your desktop does"
What? It totally interrupts my workflow. I am on the screen, need to start a new app, and now I am on a totally different fullscreen menu- totally interrupting my workflow.

- You can fit a LOT more apps than you can on the start menu...
Not even close. Way less, unless you want to scroll over to the right several pages. Even less efficient - although with 8.1 you can make them much smaller so its better in 8.1.

"Not sure if this argument makes any sense at all"

I am not sure if you have even seen Windows 8. I cant see any way you would think anything you just said. IF you say you like it better, I believe you. If you say its more efficient for you, I believe you and am glad you are happy with it, but you cannot possibly say it gives you "quick access to a lot more programs" or "without interrupting your workflow"

It just doesn't work for me at work. I do way too many things as a system admin. Too many remote desktop sessions to servers and various software I am running and troubleshooting at any given moment. Like I said, I use it at home, but its not good enough at work. HUGE loss in efficiency if you multitask heavily. At home I dont, and it works fine.


RE: the hate here
By Xplorer4x4 on 7/5/2013 12:59:43 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
What? It totally interrupts my workflow. I am on the screen, need to start a new app, and now I am on a totally different fullscreen menu- totally interrupting my workflow.

If your attention is already focused on launching an app you are not focused on the other open programs are you? As soon as you launch the new program you need, there it is on your desktop right along side the apps you already had open. How does that interrupt your work flow any more then having your eyes focus on the lower left of the screen to click the start button, and browsing through the nested folders to find the program you need? Once you choose the app from the start menu the end result is the same, it is right there along side the other apps you already had open.

I am Kubuntu linux user. I rarely use Windows, but I find the start menu to be quite nice compared to the clunky old start menu.


RE: the hate here
By retrospooty on 7/5/2013 8:16:57 AM , Rating: 2
" I find the start menu to be quite nice compared to the clunky old start menu."

Cool. Then YOU use it, I dont, and the slow adoption rate of 8 and multitudes of people that dont like it would tend to agree. It's simpy a difference of opinion. Fortunately 7 works perfectly so everyone can be happy.


RE: the hate here
By Belard on 7/9/2013 1:08:21 PM , Rating: 2
Face it... for most of us (and it IS the majority) wouldn't spend $5 for the POS Windows 8 to put on our own computers.

I won't support it. My clients won't support it.

Its an ugly, ill-designed product... its fine that you like it. Hey, some people like the Yugo and eat worms.


RE: the hate here
By datdamonfoo on 7/5/2013 8:02:07 AM , Rating: 2
I disagree that it "sucks" on non-touchscreens, or those over 24 inches.
Windows 8 actually looks and performs like Windows 7, just with a new start screen. I have Windows 8 on my non-touch laptop, my desktop with two 27 inch monitors, and my 47 inch t.v. I can use it just fine, and I only see the start screen when I want to (just like the start menu). Otherwise, it looks just like Windows 7.


RE: the hate here
By CaedenV on 7/3/2013 10:02:52 PM , Rating: 2
Ya, I think I am with you. Personally I think that their whole transition of rebranding things so that MS finally has (more or less) a unified look and feel across product lines is a great move.
Metro UI is not bad at all. It is great on mobile and touch devices, and on the desktop it is not bad... but merely not needed (and easily avoided). On my desktop I do spend 99% of my time on the desktop, but when it comes time to change settings I much prefer metro UI to the disaster that has always been Control Panel. MetroUI in 8.1 is much improved, but still needs refinement before it is going to really catch on for an application interface.

I just hope that this new leadership means that we will be seeing closer integration between platforms. I want to play XB1 games on my desktop. I want desktop file management on my phone. I want a windows version of Airplay to show my phone or tablet content on a PC (specifically power point presentations). I want WP speech commands to invade the desktop space. I just want all of my devices to work together seamlessly as a single unit. That could not be done under the old management style.
The new management may not have the skill to pull it off... but at least the internal infrastructure of MS is changing to make it possible.

Anywho... that's my 2 cents.


RE: the hate here
By BaronMatrix on 7/5/2013 4:11:21 PM , Rating: 2
It's not hate.. W8 doesn't fill my needs for a multi-mon desktop.. Removing Aero makes overlapping windows a pain...

Then it killed my USB3 controller with HyperV... Flash in IE10 would crash the whole system...

Then the damn Modern apps kept moving around and don't put an entry in the Volume mixer...

It's mostly taking out Aero... I felt like it was a step backwards in visuals...

My desktop has NO power limitations so it's stupid to not have Aero still for the ACTUAL MULTI-MON DESKTOP...

IOW, every developer in the Windows EcoSystem... SOme have more monitors than I do at three...


Right......
By morgan12x on 7/3/2013 4:00:05 PM , Rating: 2
This will fix everything.




RE: Right......
By Reclaimer77 on 7/3/2013 4:40:59 PM , Rating: 1
Omg...I'm seriously concerned for the future of this company now. This decisions is just...I just...wow!

1. Flat UI ("Modern") design universally rejected by consumers and enthusiast alike on every device it's featured.

2. Windows 8 least popular OS since Windows ME, it's a disaster.

3. Put guy running Windows Phone, arguably the biggest failure software-wise Microsoft has ever had, in charge of everything. Where he will no doubt continue forcing horrible flat Modern UI design where it doesn't belong.


RE: Right......
By retrospooty on 7/3/2013 4:53:31 PM , Rating: 1
Ya, I really dont get it. You would think after the Vista debacle, then LISTENING to what customers wanted and the Windows 7 unanimous approval would have taught them something... I thought it did, and it seemed they got at the time. 7 was great... What happened?


RE: Right......
By BaronMatrix on 7/5/2013 4:21:56 PM , Rating: 2
Some genius fired all the testers and made the SDETs code AND test their automation.. A horrible thing to do...

They tried to replace that with Consumer Previews, but it obviously didn't matter what people thought..

I liked it on my laptop but not on my three monitors... Especially the way I use the monitors...


RE: Right......
By Integral9 on 7/3/2013 4:56:44 PM , Rating: 1
After reading the headline, I had Cartman in my head saying: Ah, Son of a Bitch!

Then I read the story and... well, *double face palm* is all.


RE: Right......
By kleinma on 7/3/13, Rating: 0
RE: Right......
By Cheesew1z69 on 7/3/2013 6:46:23 PM , Rating: 2
You mean woman right? ;)


RE: Right......
By althaz on 7/3/13, Rating: 0
RE: Right......
By althaz on 7/3/2013 8:17:30 PM , Rating: 2
Also, I'm not sure why anybody would give a damn about the future of the (or any) company. If Microsoft go out of buisiness it'll be because somebody better has come along, to which I say: "Awesome!". Not to mention that right now, Microsoft simply have too much money to die (though this could obviously change in the next 10 years).


RE: Right......
By Reclaimer77 on 7/3/13, Rating: 0
RE: Right......
By cyberguyz on 7/4/2013 7:59:18 AM , Rating: 2
Ditto to spooty.


RE: Right......
By rs2 on 7/3/2013 9:31:06 PM , Rating: 5
As usual, the truth lies somewhere between the two extremes.

Metro works well in the context of touchscreen devices like mobile phones and tablets. It is an absolute disaster on a standard desktop when using only a keyboard and mouse. Microsoft didn't imagine all those angry users who wanted 1) to avoid Metro completely by booting directly into "desktop mode" and 2) to have the classic start-button behavior back and who are 3) now very angry that Microsoft gave them a start button that just kicks them back out to Metro ( http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2013/06/28 ).

Windows 8 has sold a lot of copies, thanks to the normal OEM channels. But that doesn't mean that it is actually popular amongst consumers/end-users. High sales != popularity.

Windows Phone got generally positive reviews, yes. But it hasn't earned a ton of market share. So it's a technical success, but not yet a commercial one. The ultimate verdict is still pending for Windows Phone. If people don't adopt it, then it doesn't matter how much technical praise it receives from reviewers.


RE: Right......
By andrewaggb on 7/4/2013 12:29:07 PM , Rating: 2
Well. 8.1 addresses my main annoyances. So long as they don't legacy the desktop too soon or figure out a way to make metro a suitable desktop replacement I'm good. I'm not certain metro can fill that role, but if they can port visual studio and office to metro and show a productive workflow, then I'll be a believer. Until then metro is just a tablet, game, netflix environment.


RE: Right......
By cyberguyz on 7/3/2013 6:25:18 PM , Rating: 3
All I can say is....

... I want whatever it is they are smoking. Looks like really good sh!t.

All Right Microsoft! I get it. You don't want me buying your software. Fair enough. You win.


W8 tablet UI is terrible
By Nephelai on 7/3/2013 9:20:40 PM , Rating: 3
Bought a Surface Pro two weeks ago and am ready to ebay it.

While in desktop mode its just like a W7 PC in tablet mode its just horrible. It's form factor isn't the best as it doesn't work in portrait well. It's too slippery without some sort of case and the only ones available are freaking huge and ugly. Having to sign into a Microsoft account to get apps to work is stupid, the store I understand but apps? The app store is absolutely pathetic. The tiles spanning across one long panel is un-tidy in my view why cant it be pages? Browsing is awkward. No status panel for battery, WiFi etc? Things are there if you dig but I'm finding I'm having to do more (swiping) to do same with other tablets.

Its like whoever designed the tablet version of W8 only used it sitting at a desk and didn't realise the whole idea of a tablet and tablet OS is portability / comfort and being able to use it on the run, lounge or while in bed etc.

I absolutely hate the restrictiveness of Apple but I have to say out of my Droid, IOS and W8 tablets IOS does it far better (or more convenient).




RE: W8 tablet UI is terrible
By inighthawki on 7/3/2013 11:57:39 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
It's too slippery without some sort of case and the only ones available are freaking huge and ugly.

Not sure if your hands are covered in lubricant or something, but I've never had an issue holding my surface...

quote:
Having to sign into a Microsoft account to get apps to work is stupid, the store I understand but apps?

This is because the data is synced to your account over the cloud. Maybe it was foolish to not let them work locally, but if you use an account then things like your calendar events are synced to whichever pc you are on.

quote:
The app store is absolutely pathetic.

Just curious i you mean the feature set of the store app itself, or the number of apps? Being fairly new I don't think it's very wise to assume there will be as many apps as something like iOS.

quote:
Browsing is awkward.

Explain?

quote:
No status panel for battery, WiFi etc?

Do you want a constant status bar to waste space on the screen or something? Otherwise you see it when you access the charms bar.

quote:
Things are there if you dig but I'm finding I'm having to do more (swiping) to do same with other tablets.

Like what? I have yet to find any tasks that are significantly easier to access on other devices.


RE: W8 tablet UI is terrible
By Xplorer4x4 on 7/5/2013 12:53:57 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Do you want a constant status bar to waste space on the screen or something? Otherwise you see it when you access the charms bar.

On a tablet I do not see this being a huge issue. We are talking a tiny amount of space over all. On a phone I can understand. On my RAZR HD, I like pie and turn the status bar on autohide. While it is a nice size screen, it is still a phone so I find that when you disable both, it is quite nice. However, on a tablet, we have enough real estate to combine these in to a single bar on the screen.


RE: W8 tablet UI is terrible
By inighthawki on 7/5/2013 7:14:20 PM , Rating: 2
See I disagree. I find the opposite true. Regardless of how little space it takes for a status bar, it is a waste of space for something so easily accessed with alternative methods.


RE: W8 tablet UI is terrible
By Belard on 7/9/2013 1:11:57 PM , Rating: 2
Window 8 TIFKAM is a waste of space... it UI is horrible, its like a sharper version of 1980's tech... the whole thing is like 640x200 x 4 color type technology, like Windows 1.0.


RE: W8 tablet UI is terrible
By InsGadget on 7/5/2013 9:07:21 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Having to sign into a Microsoft account to get apps to work is stupid, the store I understand but apps?

All app stores are this way. The benefit is that you can install these apps again quickly if you get a new machine.

Older-style Windows applications still work fine without an account.


In other news...
By Cheesew1z69 on 7/4/2013 7:55:35 AM , Rating: 2
The inventor of the mouse has died.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/03/tech/mouse-inventor-...




RE: In other news...
By Donkey2008 on 7/4/2013 3:53:10 PM , Rating: 2
"Good riddance"

- Windows 8 dev team


RE: In other news...
By Belard on 7/9/2013 1:54:56 PM , Rating: 2
2014, Windows 8 dies.

Good Riddance
- Humans


So that's where the start button went.
By SAN-Man on 7/3/2013 4:41:08 PM , Rating: 2
They hung it on the wall.

Can we have it back, pretty please? You don't seem to be using it...




By retrospooty on 7/3/2013 4:51:17 PM , Rating: 2
ROFL. N1.

Your MS rep called, he plugged his ears and said to tell you "lalalalalalala I cant hear you, I cant hear youuuuuu" ;)


By inighthawki on 7/3/2013 6:53:20 PM , Rating: 1
They did give it back, I think you mean to complain about the start menu.


this is the "genius"
By jnemesh on 7/3/2013 5:28:25 PM , Rating: 2
Who said that all PCs will be touchscreens within the next few years! She obviously has never actually sat at a DESK and tried to use a touchscreen PC! KHAAAAAAAN! Someone REALLY needs to get Ballmer the hell out of there...if this keeps up, there wont BE a Microsoft in 10 years!




RE: this is the "genius"
By cyberguyz on 7/4/2013 9:01:46 AM , Rating: 2
Unfortunately it will be up to the board and Microsoft shareholders to pry Ballmer out of the nice thorny nest he made for himself.

Let's just hope he will look back at how badly he frakked up Microsoft and leave on his own from sheer embarassment.


I don't even know where to begin...
By cmdrdredd on 7/3/2013 5:37:39 PM , Rating: 2
I'm just shaking my head here. Really have no idea why they decided this or how they can remotely believe it's a good thing.




By Lord 666 on 7/3/2013 7:07:11 PM , Rating: 2
Having the unit CFO's report to the corporate CFOs is the only logical thing I read.


Microsoft, the new RIM?
By Bateluer on 7/4/2013 12:49:23 AM , Rating: 1
How far will they have to drop before they turn the ship around? They're basically buying 'success' with WP8 and their majority control with Windows forces Windows 8's sales. Thats not a good long term strategy. And 8.1 doesn't appear to actually resolve any of the complaints with Windows 8 either.

Although, they've implemented Boot to Desktop, a slight positive. Thats less you have to see the horrid Start Screen on your desktop or laptop. But if you click that start button, bam, Start Screen. So much fail there its mind boggling.




RE: Microsoft, the new RIM?
By Donkey2008 on 7/4/2013 3:49:41 PM , Rating: 2
"But if you click that start button, bam, Start Screen. So much fail there its mind boggling"

Agreed.

Microsoft is becoming so inept on the sales/marketing end that it defies reason. "Customers want a start button. Let's put it back in!". No assholes, we want our nice, efficent start menu back, not a fucking button that goes to Metro. Jesus H Christ are you that stupid?


RE: Microsoft, the new RIM?
By retrospooty on 7/4/2013 5:44:07 PM , Rating: 1
"No assholes, we want our nice, efficent start menu back, not a fucking button that goes to Metro. Jesus H Christ are you that stupid?"

The only logical answer to that question can be... Yes they are.


Some Reports...
By Arsynic on 7/5/2013 10:56:43 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Some reports suggested Mr. Mattrick was fired for making comments about digital rights management (DRM) and the Xbox One.


Which reports? Your ass? Mattrick has been in talks with Zynga for months and it's a promotion to CEO with a $50 million compensation package.

The author needs to stop getting news from Playstation fanboy sites.




RE: Some Reports...
By Cheesew1z69 on 7/6/2013 5:49:13 PM , Rating: 2
50 million? No wonder they are in trouble....


Bailed?
By inighthawki on 7/4/2013 12:00:06 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Microsoft's CIO Tony Scott also recently bailed, prior to the upcoming shakeup.

You make it sound as though he "jumped ship" from a dying company. Considering you wrote the article you referenced, you should realize that it was for personal reasons, not business. Hardly describable as "bailing"




This Reorg Is a Good Move
By Arsynic on 7/5/2013 11:35:29 AM , Rating: 2
Microsoft has always seemed like a mishmash of competing products and interests. Their IED division seemed like the Island of Misfit Toys where they put the products and projects where they weren't sure where they belonged. Now everything under the same division can have a cohesive design language and a coherent direction.




"And boy have we patented it!" -- Steve Jobs, Macworld 2007














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