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Print 45 comment(s) - last by TimTheEnchante.. on Jun 27 at 10:51 AM


Panasonic DMP-BD10
$1,300 asking price puts it on the high side of announced players

Although we have seen delay after delay for Blu-ray players, interest in the next generation HD format hasn't died down from hardware manufacturers. Panasonic has announced its plans for a September launch of its new DMP-BD10 Blu-ray player.

The DMP-BD10 features a 296MHz, 14-bit video D/A converter which supports 4x oversampling on 1080i/720p output. It is of course backwards compatible with current DVDs and CDs and it also upconverts regular DVDs to 1080P via HDMI.

While Samsung's BD-P1000 is already on the market for $999, Panasonic's player is going to retail for $1,300 -- that $499 base-level PlayStation 3 is looking like quite the bargain these days. By the time the DMP-BD10 hits the streets, the market should be a little bit more crowded (barring any more delays) -- Pioneer's BDP-HD1 should be on the market by then with Sony's BDP-S1 not too far behind. There's also a possibility that we may see Samsung's hybrid Blu-ray/HD DVD player in the closing months of 2006.

Panasonic will also offer a matching receiver (SA-XR700) and speaker system (SB-T1000) for $999 and $2999 respectively.



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I wouldn't mind...
By bob661 on 6/26/2006 10:59:38 AM , Rating: 2
a blu-ray player if the cost of entry wasn't so damn steep. Which is why I'll go with HD DVD. Not to mention that there are WAY more interesting titles right now with HD DVD.




RE: I wouldn't mind...
By TomZ on 6/26/2006 11:03:37 AM , Rating: 3
Yea, it seems like Blu-ray manufacturers might be pricing themselves out of the market. Given two competing technologies that are "basically equivalent," consumers will surely choose the one that is cheaper, even if one is technically better.


RE: I wouldn't mind...
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 6/26/2006 11:06:03 AM , Rating: 1
Betamax anyone?


RE: I wouldn't mind...
By TomZ on 6/26/2006 11:48:53 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Betamax anyone?

The difference here is that there are a good number of other manufacturers on board besides just Sony. So I think it's not really the best analogy.


RE: I wouldn't mind...
By BZDTemp on 6/26/2006 3:25:04 PM , Rating: 2
Enough with the "Betamax" thing allready. I'm betting you was not even born back then and know nothing about the whole thing.

In fact the world would have been a better place if Betamax had won since it was better than VHS. At least do some reading on wiki and stop throwing mud!


RE: I wouldn't mind...
By Xavian on 6/26/2006 5:46:27 PM , Rating: 2
Maybe but Sony held all the keys to Betamax, if it won it could have turned out real bad for consumer choice. VHS was supported by the majority of the Industry. Technically best will not always win the format war.


RE: I wouldn't mind...
By masher2 (blog) on 6/26/2006 11:12:37 PM , Rating: 2
> "if it won it could have turned out real bad for consumer choice."

Um, we wound up with one choice in VHS. Had Betamax won, we would have had a single choice as well.

1 = 1 in my math. How about yours?


RE: I wouldn't mind...
By masher2 (blog) on 6/26/2006 11:14:11 AM , Rating: 1
> "Yea, it seems like Blu-ray manufacturers might be pricing themselves out of the market"

I paid a little more than $1300 for my first DVD player. Of course, there wasn't a cheaper alternative at the time.


RE: I wouldn't mind...
By TomZ on 6/26/2006 11:25:04 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
I paid a little more than $1300 for my first DVD player.

But if there was a competing technology that offered basically the same thing at half the cost, I assume you would have bought the cheaper one?


RE: I wouldn't mind...
By masher2 (blog) on 6/26/06, Rating: 0
RE: I wouldn't mind...
By IMPoor on 6/26/2006 3:06:52 PM , Rating: 3
why not wait half a year or a year to buy either format. Unless your rich and can afford it.

Oh yeah enough with the betamax/minidisc/etc crap. Sony is putting the Blu-Ray in the PS3. The PS3 will sell out faster than they can stock them. Unless your a jackass you can see that on PS3 launch day Sony will have put more blu-ray players in homes worldwide than HD-DVD will be able to do for the next year. So in the short term sony has already won the format war. Of course the short term is not what will decide the format war. It will be many years from now. Plus there will be dual format hybrids by then. But my point is Blu-Ray is not betamax so get over it.


RE: I wouldn't mind...
By TimTheEnchanter25 on 6/27/2006 10:51:33 AM , Rating: 2
I think that it is funny that everyone complains about Blu-Ray players costing more than HD-DVD players and PS3 costing more than Xbox 360. Try comparing the PS3 to HD-DVD players. Toshibia's 2 HD-DVD players are priced at $500 and $800. You can get a PS3 for $500 or $600, so for the same price (or cheaper) as the HD-DVD players you can watch High Def movies and be able to play High Def games. I see the PS3 more as a cheap Blu-Ray play than an exspensive console.

As for the 360, do people really think when they come out with their add on HD-DVD drive (who the hell wants an external drive?) that it will cost less than $200? I bet that MS's choice to start shipping with just a DVD drive will hurt them in the long run.

If you don't have (or plan to have in the near future) a HDTV, why do people care about HD movies and games? If you did shell out a couple thousand dollars extra to buy a HDTV for a small amount of HD channels, are you really not willing to spend $500 to enjoy HD movies and games?

I saw a Blu Ray demo a couple months ago and the difference from normal DVD to it is truely amazing. If you haven't seen it or HD-DVD in person, you can't complain about the price not being worth it. As for the 1080P comments, I believe that it is required for all Blu-Ray players and optional for HD-DVD.

Personally, I plan on waiting 6 months after the PS3 comes out to make sure there isn't any major problems before buying one. Then I will just use that until someone wins the format war, or there is a good universal player.


WTF
By gramboh on 6/26/2006 12:53:04 PM , Rating: 3
$1,300 and no 1080p support? What a joke.

The long term impact of launch prices will be nil in my opinion. Only hard core enthusiasts would buy an HD-DVD or BluRay player at launch, it's just too expensive (well, HD-DVD isn't outrageous, BluRay is).

I think this format war will go on for a few years until mainstream starts adoption. And for that to happen we need more HD penetration in the market.




RE: WTF
By DigitalFreak on 6/26/2006 1:35:39 PM , Rating: 2
With Toshiba supposedly taking a $250-$300 loss on each player sold @ $499, you have to wonder how much the Blu-Ray camp is losing on theirs if they have to sell them at $1000.


RE: WTF
By masher2 (blog) on 6/26/2006 3:14:21 PM , Rating: 2
I seriously doubt Panasonic has enough of a vested interest in Blu Ray to sell at a significant loss.


RE: WTF
By bob661 on 6/26/2006 2:03:10 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
$1,300 and no 1080p support?
Really? I didn't know that. That $1300 seems more rediculous by the minute.


RE: WTF
By BZDTemp on 6/26/2006 3:30:46 PM , Rating: 2
It has 1080p just fine. The dude saying otherwise can't read and is seeing the mentioning of oversampling to 1080i as a statement saying there is no 1080p!

Here is a review

http://reviews.cnet.com/Panasonic_DMP_BD10/4505-64...

And if you read it you'll learn that it's the HD-DVD players that are lacking 1080p not the Blue-ray ones.


Yes...PS3 at $499 is a steal!!!
By clementlim on 6/26/2006 3:24:42 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
that $499 base-level PlayStation 3 is looking like quite the bargain these days


Oooo...PS3 is cheap!!! I knew it!!! I will get it to play the suped up Tetris and Pong once it comes out!!! But wait, even better!!! I am going to use it as a Blu-Ray player to watch all that hair on King Kong "dance in the graceful flow of the zephyr" in clear 1080p HD display (the $599 version, that is)!!!




By masher2 (blog) on 6/26/2006 3:26:53 PM , Rating: 3
If you're not a fan of better graphics and more realistic games, feel free to keep using your Sega Saturn console for the rest of your life. No one here's going to stop you.


RE: Yes...PS3 at $499 is a steal!!!
By clementlim on 6/26/2006 3:35:59 PM , Rating: 2
Lightened up man. I was just pounding on that statement...which seems to be almost true. I remember the days when Sony advertised on the Net and Mags when they were trying to promote the sales of PS2 and were saying, "Psst, tell your mom it's a DVD player". Guess we'll be seeing a lot of, "Psst, tell your dad it's a cheap Blu-ray player."

I will get PS3...once the price drops...


RE: Yes...PS3 at $499 is a steal!!!
By lwright84 on 6/26/2006 8:19:27 PM , Rating: 2
the price is already "dropped".. $500 below any other available Blu-Ray player.


By clementlim on 6/26/2006 8:50:45 PM , Rating: 2
The price, according to you, may have "dropped" IF it is considered as a a Blu-ray player instead of a gaming console, of which, it is INDEED a cheap Blu-ray player, hence the statement above. But if compared to other gaming consoles, the price is yet to be "dropped"...


HD-DVD is not full feature HD
By rykerabel on 6/26/2006 4:32:34 PM , Rating: 2
HD-DVD does not support 1080p
Blue Ray does

HD-DVD only supports 24 bit color
Blue Ray supports 24,32,40,48 bit color

HD-DVD supports interactive content
Blue Ray supports real time highly interactive content.

HD-DVD is for Walmart
Blue Ray is for E-philes.

I don't care who wins as long as its ANY improvement.




RE: HD-DVD is not full feature HD
By jkresh on 6/26/2006 4:49:42 PM , Rating: 2
HD-DVD does support 1080p (every disc released so far is encoded in 1080p), its just the current Toshiba player that doesnt.


RE: HD-DVD is not full feature HD
By masher2 (blog) on 6/26/2006 5:20:51 PM , Rating: 2
As other posters have pointed out, HD-DVD *does* support 1080p...not that the average consumer eye can tell the difference.

As for "real time highly interactive content", that's not something I want on my movie disks, sorry. The most annoying thing about current DVD technology is when its used to force a person to watch previews and other "extras", with fast-forwarded disabled.

Give me the movie without any "interactive content", and I'll be just fine.


RE: HD-DVD is not full feature HD
By Xavian on 6/26/2006 5:50:28 PM , Rating: 2
i... actually agree with you on this, masher.

look up, i think the sky is falling. :)


RE: HD-DVD is not full feature HD
By TomZ on 6/26/2006 9:06:15 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
As for "real time highly interactive content", that's not something I want on my movie disks, sorry. The most annoying thing about current DVD technology is when its used to force a person to watch previews and other "extras", with fast-forwarded disabled.

QFT.

For once, I'd like to just pop the DVD in and have the darn movie start playing. That is what you want to do 95% of the time, so it should be the default action, and it should make you exit out to the menu if you want to do something different. Most DVDs I've seen are a case study in poor user interface design .


That goes without saying........
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 6/26/2006 11:05:43 AM , Rating: 1
Besides, atleast you will get the better quality. Right now the verdict is that HD DVD is better viewing quality than Blu-Ray. Which incidentally has nothing to do with the format being used, but the retarded sub-par encoding they are using on the Blu-Ray.




RE: That goes without saying........
By kextyn on 6/26/2006 12:28:14 PM , Rating: 2
Who is saying this? That has got to be the most retarded thing I have ever heard. The video on both Blu-Ray and HD-DVD is the same damn format. The only differences being the size of the disc (and obviously the technology involved in that) and the DRM for the most part. I need to go find whatever review is saying the quality is better on HD-DVD. I'd put money on the fact that whoever it is is an HD-DVD fanboy/supporter.


By sxr7171 on 6/26/2006 1:32:26 PM , Rating: 1
You sir are a moron. I'm a Blu-Ray supporter and even I have read the reports at AVSforum about the inferiority of current Blu-Ray releases.

They are only single layer 25GB right now using inferior MPEG2 as opposed to HD-DVD's 30GB superior VC-1 releases. You should know what you're talking about before running off your gob.


RE: That goes without saying........
By DigitalFreak on 6/26/2006 1:32:41 PM , Rating: 2
Uh, no, it's not. Sony/Tristar is currently using MPEG-2 encoding on it's Blu-Ray disks, while the HD-DVD camp are using Microsoft's VC-1. I don't think anyone outside of Sony Pictures has released a Blu-Ray title yet.

The quality issue between HD-DVD & Blu-Ray seems to be related to a hardware issue with the HDMI output on the Samsung Blu-Ray players. If you switch to Component, video quality is pretty close or on-par with HD-DVD.


RE: That goes without saying........
By bob661 on 6/26/2006 2:00:32 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
The quality issue between HD-DVD & Blu-Ray seems to be related to a hardware issue with the HDMI output on the Samsung Blu-Ray players. If you switch to Component, video quality is pretty close or on-par with HD-DVD.
Which is why I'll choose the HD DVD with it's "on par" HDMI connector.


I'll wait to buy.....
By kilkennycat on 6/26/2006 6:48:47 PM , Rating: 2
.... a multiple-format (HD-DVD, Blu-ray, DVD, CD) stand-alone player at <$100 and capable of also reading all formats of 'burned' discs.

And multiple-format reader/multiple-format burners for my PCs, again at <$100 each.

And my thanks to all you "early-adopters" ( er, rich suckers) who will be both financing the speed-up of my objectives and fully debugging the technology. And you sure will be doing some expensive debugging, stepping through the HDCP minefield too.......... Remember that in all of the early HD-DVD or Blu-ray players, much of the hardware is hacked together from programmable logic and generic processor technology. Hot and complex and probably not long-term reliable. Expect software bugs too. Hopefully some mechanism for downloading software updates into the stand-alone players? The standards have been in so much flux that the requisite dedicated silicon and software has neither been finalised nor thoroughly tested.

BTW, I am not adverse to being an early-adopter myself when it makes sense. I was one of the first people in the USA to acquire a CD-player (Sony CDP-101), way back in '84. I had ceased buying vinyl one year before. The huge benefits of CDs were obvious long,long before the first players were introduced. In the case of High-def DVDs, the actual visual benefits are truly marginal over progressive-scan standard- VD and high-quality up-conversion to HD scan-rates makes that margin even thinner. Slick technology marketing always creates the wish for "bragging-rights" amongst the tecnho-suckers and/or deep-pocketed consumers.




RE: I'll wait to buy.....
By masher2 (blog) on 6/26/2006 11:14:56 PM , Rating: 2
> " my thanks to all you "early-adopters" ( er, rich suckers) who will be both financing the speed-up of my objectives and fully debugging the technology"

Don't mention it. And if, while waiting several years for your super-cheap player, you happen to get struck by a car and die without ever getting to chance to experience true HD glory, we promise not to snicker too loudly at your funeral.


RE: I'll wait to buy.....
By kilkennycat on 6/27/2006 3:34:56 AM , Rating: 2
I happen to be in the HDTV industry, and also attend the NAB show, where all the very latest TV technology is on display. I can assure you that YOU might notice the difference, since YOU paid the big bucks, but 99.9% of the general public, including visitors to your home will not. Sure the latter will nod their heads politely and tell you how wonderful your HDTV is, just to calm your incessant raving and thus not offend a friend. Remember that 99.9% of the viewing population do not know how to properly adjust the contrast and brightness on their home TVs. In the minds of many consumers wide-screen is still synonymous with HDTV. And most of the so-called HDTV displays available today have far less than the required 1920x1080 discrete pixel count.


Typo?
By kiyoshilionz on 6/26/2006 11:33:17 AM , Rating: 3
Realeses --> Releases?




RE: Typo?
By RMSistight on 6/26/2006 12:28:56 PM , Rating: 2
Yeah seriously. You would think they would check the spelling in the title.


money to spare
By lucyfek on 6/26/2006 12:10:32 PM , Rating: 2
averybody - thus far - complains on price of the player. and truly, 1k$+ at the beginning is a little bit to much, but hardware should go down in price (sooner or later). this will be movies that i can't see myself paying for at the proposed prices of ~35$+. and the prices of dvds haven't changed much in time, exluding these from the bargain bin at walmart (not that i would like to buy any of them).




RE: money to spare
By bldckstark on 6/26/2006 12:43:06 PM , Rating: 2
I saw HD-DVD's at Wal-Mart last night for $25.


Remove DRM and We Might Be Interested
By porkster on 6/26/2006 12:22:02 PM , Rating: 1
Remove DRM and we might be interested.

HD and Blueray will be flops.





By masher2 (blog) on 6/26/2006 12:28:22 PM , Rating: 2
> "HD and Blueray will be flops. "

Tell you what. I'll bet you any sum you wish this statement isn't accurate...up to a $10K maximum. Dailytech can hold the stakes for us.

So...are you a gambling man?


There is no way...
By Kwincy on 6/26/2006 11:50:06 AM , Rating: 2
I'd pay over 400 dollars for any DVD player at all, actually. I don't need 1080i or p right now, and my TV only has component inputs that'll do 1080i anyways. All this money for a single disc HD-DVD or Blu-Ray is too much money. I'll take a wait and see approach, and wait for prices to come down.




At least...
By nowayout99 on 6/26/2006 12:30:47 PM , Rating: 2
At least it's the best looking BRD player... all of the others look like big, ugly VCRs from the early 80's without a top-loading cassette tray.




Statement
By Alphafox78 on 6/26/2006 12:46:47 PM , Rating: 2
There is a typo:
(Blueray is the) "next generation DVD format"
This is an incorrect statement ;)




Who Cares
By porkster on 6/26/2006 12:19:10 PM , Rating: 1
Who Cares




"Intel is investing heavily (think gazillions of dollars and bazillions of engineering man hours) in resources to create an Intel host controllers spec in order to speed time to market of the USB 3.0 technology." -- Intel blogger Nick Knupffer














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