Print 49 comment(s) - last by Phoenix7.. on Jan 28 at 10:06 AM

Ford's F-Series only manges seventh place

The Prius is often the butt of automotive jokes for its oddball styling, pokey acceleration, and tree-hugging persona, but it appears that Toyota is having the last laugh -- at least in California. When the sales numbers were tallied up for 2012, the Prius reigned supreme as the best-selling vehicle in California with 60,688 units sold. In fact, over one-quarter of all Prii sold in the United States for 2012 were purchased in California.
Economical cars from Toyota and Honda made up the top five sold cars in California with the Civic, Camry, Accord, and Corolla taking second, third, fourth, and fifth place respectively. The Ford F-Series, which is the best-selling vehicle for the entire United States, only managed to place seventh on the sales list in California.
Toyota's Prius is rated at 51/48/50 (city/highway/combined), which makes it a perfect fit for California's congested highways.

“Environmental consciousness and changing trends are large contributors,” said Peter Welch, Chief Executive of the California New Car Dealers Association. “Eight years ago everyone was driving sport utilities and trucks, now it’s almost trendy to drive a fuel-efficient hybrid or plug-in.”
Toyota's Prius may be sitting high on its throne right now, but there are plenty of challengers to its hybrid dominance. Volkswagen is looking to win over some consumers who aren't sold on its TDI diesel engines with the Jetta Hybrid, and Ford has two competent hybrids -- the Fusion Hybrid and the C-MAX -- in its stable that promise 47 mpg combined (although real world results suggest otherwise).
All three of the aforementioned models achieve lofty fuel economy numbers with conventional styling that is more appealing to the masses.

Source: LA Times

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By ppardee on 1/23/2013 12:04:24 PM , Rating: 1
I was going to make a joke involving San Francisco and the Prius' ability to remove heterosexual tendencies, but most drivers in California spend most of the time stopped on the freeway. Having a car that uses no power when you're not moving (under most circumstances) is fantastic for them.

Although, if they were smart, they would move somewhere where you don't spend 1/3 of your life in a stopped car, but there really is no hope for people that would repeatedly elect Nancy Pelosi and Maxine Waters.

RE: Maybe...
By CCRATA on 1/23/2013 12:25:25 PM , Rating: 4
The traffic isn't that bad, at least in the bay area. Also the bay area is where you want to be if you work in tech. No other place in the US has anywhere near the job market. Seattle only has Amazon and Microsoft. Austin only has Dell and AMD, both of which are failing. RTP has almost no one. There is no where else if you want a good job market. Maybe 'alpha' males like yourself should learn to respect the environment more and stop destroying our planet to proving your heterosexual tendencies.

RE: Maybe...
By kmmatney on 1/23/2013 12:38:04 PM , Rating: 3
Yeah - it's great until you need to buy a house. I work in tech (Fab industry) and love the Silicon Valley area, and I'm out there for work all the time (10 times last year). But it's so much easier to buy a house in Colorado. And I have to say that the commute in Silicon Valley is really bad at rush hour.

RE: Maybe...
By Dr of crap on 1/23/2013 12:43:10 PM , Rating: 1
Isn't that bad - ??

How many times and for how long are you at a stop in your commute?

For my commute - that would be 0.01%. I have come to a stop but that is rare. I go the 60mph speed limit most of my way. Can you say that in your wonderful Bay Area?

RE: Maybe...
By V-Money on 1/23/2013 1:22:55 PM , Rating: 2
To bring an alternate perspective to this, I think it has to do more with weather. I was born and raised in the Bay Area (Born in San Jose, grew up in Santa Clara) and just moved from just north in Santa Rosa so I know how the traffic is. It isn't great by any means, but it's also not the worst. I currently live about 10 miles from D.C. in Maryland and I much prefer the traffic back home then here. I've also lived up in CT and it turns out the traffic is absolutely atrocious in New York at rush hour and Boston is a mess, it is the reality of living near a city.

Back to the topic at hand though, I didn't own a Prius back in Cali (I had a sports car) but I did have a motorcycle that got 70 MPG and because you can split lanes legally in Cali its perfect for commuting. The thing is though, I could ride my motorcycle year round there without a problem, I cant do that here. Because of that I swapped the car for a truck when I moved here so I have the 4 wheel drive for when I need it and the motorcycle when I don't. As for the Prius, I would never own one, but for people who want to buy one it makes sense in Cali where you can drive it year-round without any issues, whereas I wouldn't want one where it snows at all ever. Also, hybrids offer the best benefits in stop/go traffic so if you have an easy commute there is little reason to by one.

The other issue is that a lot of people in Cali are too worried about image than they should be, so instead of doing actual things to help the environment (like reducing consumption) or helping the poor (like volunteering at a soup kitchen) they buy Prius's and talk about all of the problems in the world (while offering no solutions) and live in this cloud of smugness. Don't get me wrong, I love the state and it will always be my home, but sometimes I need to just get away from the people. Prius drivers were my favorite because they would give me crap for my V-series car and how its such a waste, then I would inform them that my combined mileage (due to my motorcycle being my primary driver) was better then theirs and how it produces much less waste material when I'm done with it.

RE: Maybe...
By Samus on 1/23/2013 2:06:02 PM , Rating: 3
Chicago statistically has worse traffic than anywhere in California.

In fact Dallas, TX has worst traffic than LA.

RE: Maybe...
By Jeffk464 on 1/23/2013 10:36:19 PM , Rating: 2
Chicago has the worst everything.

RE: Maybe...
By Samus on 1/24/2013 4:18:53 AM , Rating: 2
LMAO. True, except for water!

RE: Maybe...
By JediJeb on 1/23/2013 5:55:57 PM , Rating: 2
How many times and for how long are you at a stop in your commute?

When there is a cow standing in the road once or twice a year!

Gotta love being a chemist and living in Kentucky. Even our tech jobs are out in the country.

RE: Maybe...
By Schrag4 on 1/23/2013 1:04:02 PM , Rating: 2
I don't mind visiting the bay area from time to time but that's one of the last places I'd want to live. It sounds like your state is representing you well so I'm happy for you. I can't speak for everyone, but while many of us may not live somewhere as exciting as the bay area (tech or otherwise), it's worth it in other ways.

RE: Maybe...
By stm1185 on 1/23/2013 1:15:39 PM , Rating: 1
Commute not that bad? What commute are you doing? I am doing San Jose to Palo Alto. Which is about 17 miles, yet some mornings it takes me well over an hour driving up the 101.

There are a crap ton of Prius's out here though. It's replaced the Camry as the ugly slow piece of shit that is doing 55 mph on a 65mph freeway in the far left lane.

RE: Maybe...
By OCedHrt on 1/23/2013 1:22:25 PM , Rating: 2
Why are you taking the 101 from San Jose to Palo Alto anyways?

RE: Maybe...
By sleepeeg3 on 1/23/2013 10:01:38 PM , Rating: 2
It took me around an hour to go 10 miles in Atlanta. Take it from a Californian - there is worse traffic than California. We typically just have to drive further to get where we are going, which makes it worse.

RE: Maybe...
By Jeffk464 on 1/23/2013 10:40:51 PM , Rating: 2
I drive professionally through almost every city in the US. I was born in raised in Los Angeles county and can say LA is about as bad as it gets traffic wise and tops it off by having the biggest A hole drivers.

RE: Maybe...
By arazok on 1/23/2013 1:22:33 PM , Rating: 2
If you define “the market” as being easily recognized consumer brands then perhaps you have a point. Last time I checked I could find great IT work in almost any major city in N.America. I’ve worked with some great IT companies in New York, Boston, Phoenix, Austin, Denver, and Atlanta. All places that are far less crowded and overpriced then California.

I’m thinking of making a permanent move to the US in the next couple of years. My only criteria on where I go is that it must be warm most of the year, and not be in California. I’m not worried about my prospects.

RE: Maybe...
By Reclaimer77 on 1/23/13, Rating: -1
RE: Maybe...
By arazok on 1/23/2013 8:42:10 PM , Rating: 2
I don't think so.

-Dirt cheap housing
-Between lower prices and lower taxes, I'll have 30-40% more disposable income
-Fantastic weather (Canada)
-Far Better healthcare
-I can buy booze in non-government run stores like a real adult

-Crime and guns
-Heavy handed justice system
-Public Education isn't as good, but not much worse either
-Bible nuts

Crime is the only downside, and I'm hopeful I can avoid that by choosing a good neighbourhood.

RE: Maybe...
By Spuke on 1/24/2013 10:23:12 PM , Rating: 2
Crime is the only downside, and I'm hopeful I can avoid that by choosing a good neighbourhood.
That's easy to avoid. You won't have a problem there.

RE: Maybe...
By 91TTZ on 1/23/2013 3:36:22 PM , Rating: 1
Also the bay area is where you want to be if you work in tech. No other place in the US has anywhere near the job market.

It definitely has a great job market and I was really impressed when I went out there and saw all these huge computer companies that I heard about every day.

The downside is the housing market. When you go home from work where are you going to live? For instance, take Steve Jobs' modest house growing up. This is the stereotypical suburban Californian home from the 50's

The houses in that development all go from 1.3 to 2 million dollars.

My house in PA is much bigger, I have about 4 times the amount of land, and to top if all off it's about a sixth of the price of the houses in that development. There are plenty of tech places to work around here although not nearly as many as out there.

My point is that there's more places to work out there but it's more difficult to build a life because you'll never be able to make up for the price of housing. The end result is that your standard of living will be lower.

RE: Maybe...
By JediJeb on 1/23/2013 6:01:36 PM , Rating: 2
Wow, and I thought I didn't get much of a deal when I bought my house with three acres of land for $42k.

RE: Maybe...
By Spuke on 1/24/2013 10:35:16 PM , Rating: 2
Wow, and I thought I didn't get much of a deal when I bought my house with three acres of land for $42k.
Dude I'm in the desert where it seems no one in CA wants to live and my 2000sf house on 2.5 acres costs just over $300k (today's prices...bought in 05, it was $400k then). Go 30 mins south and my same house/land is $700k. 30 more mins and it's over $1 million. We sold a horse a couple of years ago. The buyers could not believe how "cheap" our house was. In their town (Camarillo), our place would cost $8 million easy.

RE: Maybe...
By cjc1103 on 1/23/2013 11:26:25 PM , Rating: 2
Not to mention Barbara Boxer and Dianne Feinstein. I remember an on-camera interview with these idiots during the Democratic convention last year - nothing they said made any sense at all.

RE: Maybe...
By Paj on 1/24/2013 8:46:54 AM , Rating: 2
I was going to make a joke involving San Francisco and the Prius' ability to remove heterosexual tendencies,

I guess driving F-series overcompensate for said tendencies? Wouldn't want anyone to get any ideas!

Although, if they were smart, they would move somewhere where you don't spend 1/3 of your life in a stopped car

Wrong. If they were really smart, they could do what the rest of the world does, and invest some money into a decent public transport system. LA only has two underground lines! Madness.

RE: Maybe...
By Spuke on 1/24/2013 10:40:31 PM , Rating: 2
Wrong. If they were really smart, they could do what the rest of the world does, and invest some money into a decent public transport system. LA only has two underground lines! Madness.
They've tried numerous times but it literally costs 10's of billions to get done and that's just for a partial solution. The environmentalists throw up lawsuits at everything and if the city plays their game, the costs go up astronomically. It's just not that easy.

RE: Maybe...
By Phoenix7 on 1/28/2013 10:06:06 AM , Rating: 2
most job opportunity in general is in densely populated areas, hence the crowd

By Richard875yh5 on 1/23/2013 11:52:01 AM , Rating: 2
If you want to constantly be afraid you might be stepping too hard on the gas so you won't hurt your gas mileage added to an underpowered engine, then the Prius is for you.

RE: Prius
By GulWestfale on 1/23/2013 11:52:35 AM , Rating: 2
this is a sign of the impending apocalypse; at least for proper petrol-blooded DRIVERS it is.

RE: Prius
By othercents on 1/23/2013 12:11:21 PM , Rating: 2
You could always go with a Tesla Roadster to get 4 hours of fun, but after that your charging.

RE: Prius
By boeush on 1/23/2013 12:22:36 PM , Rating: 4
Then again, most normal people aren't "DRIVERS": they are commuters who actually hate spending time behind the wheel when they could actually be doing something far more worthwhile and/or interesting and/or entertaining and/or pleasurable...

RE: Prius
By GulWestfale on 1/23/13, Rating: -1
RE: Prius
By FaaR on 1/23/2013 2:06:07 PM , Rating: 2
I love hearing you crappy-american-engineering V8 car talibans blowing your top over the prius. Your reaction is a classic defensive posture, you know you're being outclassed, so you lash out instead.

Tsk tsk. How sad.

To most people, the percieved size of one's genitals is not connected to the displacement of their car's engine block. You should try a good therapist for that issue, mate.

Now be a good kneejerker and vote me down. :D

RE: Prius
By GulWestfale on 1/23/2013 10:21:28 PM , Rating: 3
i'm german, not american.
i do not equate engine size with penis size.
i am simply someone who enjoys automobiles (and motorcycles) as fine pieces of engineering and art, like a fine mechanical watch.
to me, a prius is to a ferrari F40 what a timex is to a patek philippe: an insult to the craft.
i don't have enough money for a ferrari (or a patek, for that matter), but that doesn not prevent me from ejoying them whereever i see them. i have never found myself glancing at a prius (or any toyota) in awe, and have never felt any emotion at all when looking at one. they might make for great commuting appliances, but they're not what i would look for in a car. i want something with more personality than a microwave oven.

RE: Prius
By Paj on 1/24/2013 8:56:36 AM , Rating: 3
See, I think the Prius is also a fine piece of engineering. It will go down in history (and already has) as the world's first successful mass market hybrid vehicle.

If you judge automotive engineering merely on how fast a car can go, then certainly supercars are successful. But if you judge them by other metrics - efficiency, energy requirements per unit of output, technological innovation - then they don't look as good.

Whether the Prius pretty/sexy/desirable is purely subjective - for the record, there are certainly better looking cars out there, but its certainly far from being the worst.

But to deny its successes as an engineering project is pretty myopic.

RE: Prius
By GulWestfale on 1/25/2013 5:48:39 PM , Rating: 2
i'm not saying that it isn't well-engineered.
the bugatti veyron is also well-engineered. but it is not desirable to me, because it represents... nothing, other than VW's desperate attempt to make the marque relevant again. i'd never chose one over a ferrari F40, or a mclaren F1.

By sleepeeg3 on 1/23/2013 9:59:39 PM , Rating: 1
"Environmental consciousness and changing trends are large contributors,” said Peter Welch"


"[High gas prices] and [corrupt politicians] are large contributers," said Peter Welch.

By Argon18 on 1/23/13, Rating: -1
RE: perfect!
By Pirks on 1/23/2013 1:37:21 PM , Rating: 2
without actually doing so
Stop spreading bullsh1t. It consumes twice less gas in the city compared to any other modern middle sized gas-only sedan. This is "actually doing so", you lying troll.

RE: perfect!
By Quadrillity on 1/23/2013 1:43:35 PM , Rating: 1
At the cost of MASSIVELY toxic battery banks.... it's a complete trade off. More gas mileage, horrific manufacture process.

RE: perfect!
By Samus on 1/23/2013 2:07:47 PM , Rating: 4
Horrific demanufacturing process as well.

RE: perfect!
By FaaR on 1/23/2013 2:09:23 PM , Rating: 2
NiMH batteries are not "massively toxic".

RE: perfect!
By Quadrillity on 1/23/2013 2:21:41 PM , Rating: 2
They aren't? Then I guess you would have no problem with me dumping one near your water supply, right?

RE: perfect!
By ChronoReverse on 1/23/2013 4:36:18 PM , Rating: 3
Go ahead? I mean, I'd be annoyed at the _trash_ in my water, but if you had tossed an oldschool nickel-made Nickel into my water supply I wouldn't freak out either.

NiMHs aren't NiCads after all (which do have the heavy metal cadmium to worry about).

RE: perfect!
By Samus on 1/24/2013 4:26:46 AM , Rating: 2
So let me get this straight.

You're "OK" with someone tossing NiMH cells into your water supply? Yes, they lack cadmium and the positive electrode is nickle, but the negative electrode?

Are you "OK" with lithium in your water supply too?

RE: perfect!
By ChronoReverse on 1/24/2013 2:27:45 PM , Rating: 3
The negative electrode is potassium hydroxide. So I'm not terribly concerned either.

Again, this is the WORSE CASE SCENARIO and it's actually not that bad.

So don't be an obtuse idiot.

RE: perfect!
By JediJeb on 1/23/2013 6:04:15 PM , Rating: 2
It consumes twice less gas

How the heck do you calculate twice less usage? Formula or it didn't happen.

RE: perfect!
By ritualm on 1/23/2013 7:08:59 PM , Rating: 2
Why do you even need one? It's California, where most drivers spend much of their driving time being stuck in traffic gridlock. The Prius doesn't run its gas engine when all you're doing is crawl along the 101 at an earth-shattering five miles an hour.

Stop trying to win the prestigious "America's Most Inbred Idiot" and use your head for a change.

RE: perfect!
By Reclaimer77 on 1/23/13, Rating: -1
RE: perfect!
By sleepeeg3 on 1/23/2013 10:03:17 PM , Rating: 1
Right as usual.

RE: perfect!
By m51 on 1/24/2013 9:55:10 AM , Rating: 2
The population in the greater Los Angeles area is about 18 million, which is larger than most states and about half the population of California. The Bay area has most of the rest of the people in the state.

I think the subsidies and free snow cones have less of an effect than the perceived status and group think associated with hybrids. Another effect is gas in California is always more expensive than most of the rest of the country. Coupled with the extended commutes people probably really are saving money driving hybrids.

"The whole principle [of censorship] is wrong. It's like demanding that grown men live on skim milk because the baby can't have steak." -- Robert Heinlein

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