Print 22 comment(s) - last by Alexvrb.. on Nov 15 at 12:24 AM

New Honda hybrid systems target three different vehicle types

Honda Motor Company has announced the development of a new Sports Hybrid Intelligent Dual Clutch Drive system. The company has three different version of the Sport Hybrid system to accommodate different vehicle characteristics.
The new one-motor Sport Hybrid Intelligent Dual Clutch Drive system is optimized for small-sized vehicles. Honda has a two-motor hybrid system called the Sport Hybrid Intelligent Multi-Mode Drive that is optimized for medium-sized vehicles. The third Sport Hybrid system is called the Sport Hybrid SH-AWD that features three motors. That last system is optimized for large vehicles and has been tipped for the new Acura NSX sports car.

The one-motor system uses a newly developed in-line four-cylinder 1.5-liter Atkinson cycle engine mated with a seven-speed dual clutch transmission. The hybrid system also uses a high-output lithium-ion battery and promises to improve efficiency by over 30% compared to conventional one-motor systems.

2014 Honda Accord Plug-in Hybrid

The two-motor system will be first used in the 2014 Honda Accord Plug-in vehicle and uses a lockup clutch and lithium-ion battery pack. The system will offer three different profiles depending on the driving situation, including EV Drive for electric only use, Engine Drive for medium to high-speed cruising, and Hybrid Drive for urban driving conditions.

The three-motor system combines a V6 engine and a high-output three-motor electrical system providing acceleration performance equivalent to that of a V-8 engine. The big benefit with this system is that despite the V-8 performance, fuel efficiency is reportedly better than that of an in-line four-cylinder.

Acura NSX Concept

The system will be mated with a 3.5-liter V6 engine and a seven-speed DCT transmission with its own built-in motor. The system uses independent motors for the right and left rear wheels with positive torque applied to the outside wheel and negative torque applied to the inside wheel allowing for independent control of torque distribution. The system is designed to help improve cornering performance – this makes the NSX the perfect application for such technology.

Source: Honda

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By AssBall on 11/13/2012 11:32:12 AM , Rating: 3
I get that Honda makes some very reliable cars. I liked the steering and throttle response in the Hondas I have driven. I just wish they made some exciting cars. Like a TL with a twin turbo V8, or a prelude with rear wheel drive. Something besides their super efficient under steering family sleepers.

When the NSX does finally come, it will not even be as exciting as the LFA, and that was honestly kind of a yawner.

RE: Honda
By FITCamaro on 11/13/2012 12:23:01 PM , Rating: 2
Heck a TL with a twin-turbo 6 would be good. Or even a single turbo setup so that the turbo would only be spooled above like 2k rpm so you could mostly cruise without it being spooled up.

RE: Honda
By mellomonk on 11/13/2012 12:49:17 PM , Rating: 2
Potato, potato I guess. I personally find these performance orientated hybrid systems interesting and exciting. I haven't much of a Honda fan the last decade or so, but it is great to see them thinking outside the box again. The SH-AWD systems, using torque-splitting to enhance handling is fascinating.

There is nothing wrong with twin-turbo V8s and the like. But there isn't much of a market for such a vehicle, and unless the vehicle has a three pointed star on it, very little profit in it as well. I once upon a time built a stroked Mopar big block with more then 500 cubic inches of displacement, so I am not oblivious to the excitement of power and torque. But I also understand how unpractical many performance setups are. Practical performance is not an easy engineering problem. Honda makes real cars for real people and it is not exactly a huge company. They haven't excited me for a long time, but I admire their engineering prowess.

And dude, if you find the LFA a yawner, you need to re-align your expectations. Geeshh.

RE: Honda
By dubldwn on 11/13/2012 1:18:24 PM , Rating: 2
I personally find these performance orientated hybrid systems interesting and exciting.

I do, too. I was surprised that the 2005 Accord Hybrid didn't sell very well: 255HP, 0-60 in 6.5, and over 30mpg. It'll be interesting to see what these new more advanced systems put out.

RE: Honda
By Alexvrb on 11/14/2012 2:19:24 AM , Rating: 2
BS. 0-60 was 7.5 seconds in ideal conditions. BIG difference. You'd need closer to 300HP to make that car do 6.5 seconds, probably stickier tires too.

It didn't sell well because they tried to push it as a fuel saving Hybrid Accord, but the fuel economy was not all that impressive. The performance was there, somewhat, but not the mileage. My friend's dad owns one. It was expensive and didn't get the impressive mileage people were expecting of a hybrid.

In fact in real world usage, if you actually tapped into the power or had to commute in a daily highway sprint (where everyone is headed to DC or wherever at 80-100+ MPH) mileage was not vastly better than the non-hybrid V6. Perhaps due in part to the added weight.

If they offered a L4 hybrid option at the time, it would have sold better.

RE: Honda
By Alexvrb on 11/14/2012 2:24:00 AM , Rating: 3
Also, the ride wasn't all that good. It's been years since I've been in it. But ride and handling were mediocre. The regenerative braking was poorly balanced with the conventional friction, and made the brake pedal feel like mushy garbage until you actually pushed hard enough to get the pads to start clamping down on the rotors.

They gave him a can of fix-a-flat as a spare, too. Did I mention it felt like a tin can, at titanium can prices?

RE: Honda
By dubldwn on 11/14/2012 3:23:16 AM , Rating: 2
Hybrid car guide claims 0-60 in 6.5, motortrend 6.6, and car and driver 6.7; I've never driven one. I remember the car marketed as a hybrid that didn't sacrifice performance. Also, I'm taking for granted the EPA numbers as a baseline like I do all cars; not sure what folks individual experiences are.

RE: Honda
By Alexvrb on 11/15/2012 12:24:02 AM , Rating: 2
Maybe with a rolling start. When I first read your post, just looking at the number, I knew it smelled wrong. Even before doing any additional research. But a quick search gave me the info I was looking for. I guess I should have posted the link before, but I didn't think you'd persist in thinking this thing was a full 1.5 seconds faster than the non-hybrid V6 in the 0-60 sprint.

7.5 seconds. Which to be fair is an improvement over the stock V6 by 0.5 seconds, although the difference shrinks the faster/further you go. I think in the 1/4 mile the non-hybrid might even be a hair faster but I haven't researched that heavily. Depleting the battery causes it to lose that extra 15 ponies.

RE: Honda
By NellyFromMA on 11/14/2012 9:19:46 AM , Rating: 3
Honda Hybrid systems are expensive to maintain compared to Toyota and the milage ioncrease is simply not worth it for any value-minded consumer.

It didn't sell because it doesn't have a market.

RE: Honda
By AssBall on 11/13/2012 4:25:41 PM , Rating: 2
I just don't get how you can make some of the craziest and coolest performance motors (r1000, Formula 1 V10), and yet make most boring cars.

LFA was exciting from an engineering and design perspective, don't get me wrong, but so is an Aventador. From my personal market perspective, though, they are too low production and too high cost. The new NSX will most likely follow suit (which means, like the LFA, it doesn't truly compete with real-world proven ass kickers like the Nissan GT, Audi R8, Boxter, and CTS coupe, to name a few.

RE: Honda
By shadowamazon on 11/13/2012 2:11:45 PM , Rating: 2
My 2003 Honda Accord EX purchased brand new was a total piece of s***. Multiple issues driven under normal conditions. Never again. Strictly Toyota now.

RE: Honda
By freedom4556 on 11/13/2012 5:22:10 PM , Rating: 2
Because they're sooo much better.

RE: Honda
By aurareturn on 11/13/2012 5:05:22 PM , Rating: 2
NSX doesn't compete with the LFA. It competes with the R8.

RE: Honda
By AssBall on 11/13/2012 6:20:12 PM , Rating: 2
This one will not, it will cost too much and have too much electronic toys in it. It will compete with the LFA.

RE: Honda
By AssBall on 11/13/2012 6:25:32 PM , Rating: 2
Correction: It will compete with a slower, uglier, higher maintenance LFA.

RE: Honda
By freedom4556 on 11/13/2012 5:26:41 PM , Rating: 2
I'd settle for something in the vein of the BR-Z/FR-S or the Celica, Supra, MR-2, 3000GT turbo, S2000, or the old CR-X/del Sol. The import guys used to know how to make sports cars, what happened? The CR-Z doesn't count, it's a please-the-hippies stunt.

RE: Honda
By Alexvrb on 11/14/2012 2:34:25 AM , Rating: 2
They got too big and forgot their roots.
The big benefit with this system is that despite the V-8 performance, fuel efficiency is reportedly better than that of an in-line four-cylinder.
Hmm they must be talking about the performance of an entry-level V8 Challenger, and the fuel efficiency of a heavily boosted Subaru H4 with fat injectors.

RE: Honda
By inperfectdarkness on 11/14/2012 2:44:47 AM , Rating: 2
The 3000GT is arguably one of the most under-rated cars of all time. Twin-Turbo v6 with 300hp and AWD. Essentially except for cylinder configuration, it was a more refined Nissan Skyline that actually made it to the states.

I wish at least one of these Japanese companies would revisit the idea of a 2-door, v6tt awd coupe--and without an impossibly high price-tag.

The only decent things on the market currently are the Genesis coupe and the BR-Z/GT; both RWD. And the BR-Z doesn't even have 6 cylinders or forced induction. Great to compete against the Miata, but not against the likes of a Corvette.

"What would I do? I'd shut it down and give the money back to the shareholders." -- Michael Dell, after being asked what to do with Apple Computer in 1997

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