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Steven Sinofsky  (Source: ABC News)
Sinofksy wasn't seen as a team player according to reports

There seems to be something afoul in the tech industry in recent weeks, and the stench seems to be coming from the executive ranks of two of the computing industry's top players: Apple and Microsoft.
 
Earlier this month, we learned that Scott Forstall, Apple's Vice President of iOS Software, was shown the door after 15 years of service. According to reports, Forstall was the most "Jobsian" of Apple's executive team and was notorious for being hard to deal with. It was also reported that Forstall often butted heads with Apple design guru Jony Ive.
 
Now it appears that Microsoft has its own executive shakeup in the works. Steve Sinofsky, President of Microsoft's Windows and Windows Live division, left the company today. The move comes somewhat as a shock considering that Windows 8 just launched last month.
 
“It is impossible to count the blessings I have received over my years at Microsoft. I am humbled by the professionalism and generosity of everyone I have had the good fortune to work with at this awesome company,” said Sinofsky of his departure in an email to Microsoft employees.
 
I. First Forstall, Now Sinofsky

While the timing of Sinofsky's departure is a bit startling, the writing has been on the wall for some time with regards to his chemistry with other Microsoft employees. Sinofsky's inability to be a team player is cited as a major reason for his departure, and is reminiscent of Forstall's dismissal.


Sinofsky (left) shows off Microsoft Surface [Image Source: Kevork Djansezian/Getty Images]
 
AllThingsD reported this afternoon that there was growing tension between Sinofsky and other top Microsoft executives. This news comes weeks after CNET ran a piece detailing Sinofsky's rise to power at Microsoft, and his rather combative style of leadership. CNET's Jay Greene had this to say about how former and current Microsoft execs viewed Sinofsky:
 
Most requested anonymity because they feared potential repercussions. They paint a picture of an executive who is incredibly smart and passionately driven to ship quality software on time. But some also say Sinofsky can create a toxic work environment that has chased talented employees away from a maturing company that's in desperate need of innovative thinking.
 
Sinofsky's leadership style and compartmentalization of tasks and "reporting lines" within the Windows division lead his approach to be labeled as "Soviet Central-Planning." In fact, the toxicity within Microsoft was humorously detailed in an organizational chart comic by Manu Cornet:

 
[Image Source: Manu Cornet]
 
II. Steve Ballmer heaps praise on Sinofsky, points to new leadership

Microsoft CEO Ballmer sent a memo to his staff regarding the departure, and praised Sinofsky's 20+ years of service:
 
As we enter this new era, and with the successful launch of Windows 8 and Surface behind us, Steven Sinofsky has decided to leave the company. Steven joined Microsoft in 1989 as a software development engineer and has contributed to the company in many ways from his work as a technical advisor to Bill Gates, to leading the evolution of the Microsoft Office business, to his direction and successful leadership of Windows and Windows Live as well as Surface. I am grateful for the work that Steven has delivered in his time at our company. [Full memo here]
 
Sinofsky will be replaced by Julie Larson-Green. Larson-Green has been with Microsoft since 1993 and has had a hand in program management, and UI design/research for Windows 7 and Windows 8.


Julie Larson-Green [Image Source: Microsoft]
 
“Leading Windows engineering is an incredible challenge and opportunity, and as I looked at the technical and business skills required to continue our Windows trajectory — great communication skills, a proven ability to work across product groups, strong design, deep technical expertise, and a history of anticipating and meeting customer needs — it was clear to me that Julie is the best possible person for this job, and I’m excited to have her in this role,” said Ballmer of Larson-Green.

Sources: Microsoft, The Verge, AllThingsD, CNET



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Wow
By Varun on 11/12/2012 10:52:10 PM , Rating: 5
This news is shocking. He basically WAS Microsoft. He lead Office to be the most successful division, then moved over to Windows to clean up the mess that was Longhorn - and succeeded! He will be missed whether he was a team player or not.




RE: Wow
By AssBall on 11/13/2012 1:39:50 AM , Rating: 5
Exactly, they didn't need a "team player" to go in and be everyone's little friend. They needed someone to go in and kick all their crappy ideas in the face and come up with a profitable product.


RE: Wow
By Taft12 on 11/13/12, Rating: -1
RE: Wow
By masamasa on 11/14/2012 3:00:52 PM , Rating: 2
No doubt. Still churning out a lot of crap though.


RE: Wow
By Milliamp on 11/13/2012 2:29:06 AM , Rating: 2
IMHO Metro is Microsoft's Apple Maps. Tablet shmablet, I want my desktop back.


RE: Wow
By ShaolinSoccer on 11/13/12, Rating: -1
RE: Wow
By Milliamp on 11/13/2012 3:48:33 AM , Rating: 1
I said I want my desktop back, not "I want my start menu back"

It is metro itself that annoys me far more than the lack of start menu. I mostly used the windows key to access the start menu even before Metro so that really isn't in my way.

"How many times do people have to repeat it?!"

That is a pretty arrogant tone considering you weren't even on point.


RE: Wow
By safcman84 on 11/13/12, Rating: -1
RE: Wow
By cyberguyz on 11/13/2012 7:35:57 AM , Rating: 2
The very last thing I would call Metro is "Fancy".

Reminds me of the old DesQView and TopView DOS task switchers from the '80s.

Why would I want to have that even running in the background chewing up precious system resources? No thanks!


RE: Wow
By safcman84 on 11/13/2012 8:11:31 AM , Rating: 4
lol, how much resources does it use up? have you seen win8 footprint vs win7?

You cant have done, otherwise you wouldnt be saying that.

at the end of the day the common user is going to like it.


RE: Wow
By safcman84 on 11/13/2012 8:19:33 AM , Rating: 2
oh, it might be a british-english thing, but "fancy" i don't necessarilly mean good. just that it is a start menu with more to it.


RE: Wow
By inighthawki on 11/13/2012 12:09:34 PM , Rating: 2
I don't believe it's a British thing, he probably just never heard someone say that before though.


RE: Wow
By immortalsly on 11/13/2012 5:30:26 PM , Rating: 4
DESQview was the bomb!! QEMM386 anyone? Ah, good times.

Kids these days missed out on the joys of ekking out every last usable byte of the UMB.

<We now return you to your regular kiddie banter>


RE: Wow
By DeepBlue1975 on 11/15/2012 3:18:10 AM , Rating: 2
Best part of that was putting this line in CONFIG.SYS:

DOS = HIGH

Or getting error messages like "HIMEM.SYS is broken"

You could just tell that DOS programmers had fun while performing their jobs :)


RE: Wow
By espaghetti on 11/13/2012 9:11:34 AM , Rating: 5
quote:
Business users and non-technical home users are the biggest market, not power users - though windows 8 doesnt make windows any worse to use for power users, only different.

Wife called yesterday to ask me how to shut down windows 8.
I told her to look it up.
Wife asked how to close browser she opened in "fancy" crap app area.
So, hitting the escape key, messing with disappearing/ reappearing menus flip flopping between styles of GUI are more efficient?
This is bullshit and you know it. Your defense of this goofy OS irritates me.
They need a way to flush metro off of desktop PC's.
I've got my own way...installed Window 7 on wife's new PC.

quote:
Windows 8 is good for 95% of PC users.

Did you take a poll?
Look around the "comments" area.


RE: Wow
By robinthakur on 11/13/2012 11:40:29 AM , Rating: 3
Completely agree with you 100% and I've been using the RTM Windows 8 for ages. Other users of my PC no longer understand how to use it, or why there are 'other' versions of apps like Media Player and IE on the Start Menu screen which seem to run concurrently to the proper versions and sometimes associate with file-types, but not other times. Why some programs like the aforementioned media player disappear on closing to the top left and what those tile things do, and why they aren't shown on the desktop. The whole desktop flipping thing is baffling as well as the multi-monitor weirdness with the hot corners and having to hover in the top right to get to a menu from where you have the option to shutdown.

Getting to Control Panel seems a lot more difficult too. Sometimes it is in the top right hover menu and other times it disappears...and there is another System settings dialog styled like Metro, but seems to duplicate some of the control panel functions but not others.The quickest way I have found is to right click Network Sharing Center in the system tray then open it then navigate up a couple of levels in the breadcrumb. I could probably place a shortcut on the main start menu screen thingy, but...meh. I'm thinking that the head Windows guy leaving is not a good sign for MS or indeed for Windows 8 right now.


RE: Wow
By tamalero on 11/13/2012 12:46:16 PM , Rating: 2
to resume..

Microsoft Windows 8 is just for trying to lure Mac IOS clients into a windows environment.. it is NOT for windows users.


RE: Wow
By NellyFromMA on 11/13/2012 3:48:42 PM , Rating: 2
If Win 8 wasn't for Windows users, don't you think they would have stuck with W@in RT and been done with it. The whole coexistience of the modern UI with the desktop enviornment is because it IS for Windows users. It just maybe isn't for closeminded change-resistant types.


RE: Wow
By DiscoWade on 11/13/2012 1:05:47 PM , Rating: 2
Have you tried to uninstall a program? I have a TechNet Windows 8 version that I upgraded from Windows 7. When I typed "uninstall" all I got was program that had an uninstall icon on the old start menu. In Windows 7, you get a link to the Programs and Features when you type uninstall in the start menu. So now I type "control panel" and search for Programs and Features. For me, what was once one quick step is now two.

I then tried system restore. I typed "system restore" and nothing appeared. It took me a long time to figure out how to run this most important feature.

The TechNet versions of Windows 8 are crippled. You cannot install Windows Media Center from the TechNet downloaded Windows 8 disc. So I don't know if what I experienced is typical of Windows 8. From what I read, the TechNet licenses work on retail discs.

I also tried to close Metro IE10. I wanted it so that I couldn't ALT+TAB to it and when it opened it would go to my home page. There are, after all, times when I don't want the last page I browsed to to be visible. I never did figure out how. Does anybody know? Yes, I did try ALT+F4.

One thing I did like was how the first Windows Home Server is compatible with Windows 8. It would continue to back up without incident. I also liked a settings menu that was streamlined like those on tablets and smartphones. But I grew tired of not knowing what to do and being confused, so I used Windows Home Server to revert back to Windows 7.


RE: Wow
By MrRuckus on 11/13/2012 2:05:10 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
You cannot install Windows Media Center from the TechNet downloaded Windows 8 disc.


I did that this weekend. Win7 Ultimate upgraded to Windows 8 Pro via Technet and installed WMC for Win8 Pro with no issue.

Where did an issue pop up in the install of WMC? I installed it via the directions here:
http://howto.cnet.com/8301-11310_39-57540793-285/h...

When you choose to "add new features to Windows 8" it asks for your WMC product key and automatically knows what it is and downloads it and installs it. It needed one reboot and done here. No issues.

I will add it took me 2 entries for my email before they sent me a key for some reason. But it was within minutes that I received an email the second time around with the WMC key. I know some people have stated it has taken days to get the email.


RE: Wow
By MrRuckus on 11/13/2012 2:16:42 PM , Rating: 2
I will also add I purchased StarDock on the first day of using Windows 8.

I can commend Microsoft on one subject of Windows 8, and thats the license price. The price being less then half or even a 3rd of previous versions of Windows gives it a better chance of a faster adoption rate. The price is right for sure. Should also cut down in piracy as well.


RE: Wow
By Grast5150 on 11/13/2012 3:00:26 PM , Rating: 1
OK Well welcome to Windows 7 not windows 8. To uninstall a program is no different than Windows 7. Hit Start button, just type "Programs", select "Programs and Features", select the application and uninstall button.

windows 8 is basically Windows 7 with a fancy start menu. the only issue that people need to learn is to un-pin the IE and other apps from their start menu and PIN Desktop IE and every other app to the START menu.

COMPLAINT: I do think that Windows 8 on a laptop or workstation should have the default applications for IE, media and such for the desktop versions rather than apps. But that is easily fixed in 10 minutes.

Issue solved.

As far as multi-monitor setup. Windows 8 is the best OS out there for out of box support. I run three monitors. I have choices.... one taskbar on each monitor or only a taskbar when app running on that screen, or just a single taskbar as in previous versions of windows. I can now run Netflix on one Monitor, a game in center monitor, and chat/email on another monitor with no issues are special setup. If you have more than one monitor, Windows 8 is for you!!!!!

I just do not understand the confusion. You want to find an application or control panel. Hit Start button on keyboard or click lower left hand corner of screen, start typing the name of app and select program and/or app. which ever you want.

How difficult is this? Better the MAC OS X which is still using List view menu bar which changes depending on what app is running and such.

Later.


RE: Wow
By NellyFromMA on 11/13/2012 3:42:35 PM , Rating: 2
Uninstalling is the same......... go to settings -> control panel -> add remove programs. It's not different. Any time you want the control panel, just go to the bottom or top right corner and you will see settings there. It's easy once you do it.

When in doubt, just seek a corner. Thats actually better odds than most poorly written software in terms of usablity.


RE: Wow
By tayb on 11/13/2012 12:25:39 PM , Rating: 1
I'll preface this by saying what I've BEEN saying... Microsoft is not doing a very good job educating users. People shouldn't be asking how to close Metro windows or how to shut down their computers. These aren't difficult tasks, in fact their both incredibly easy, but there aren't simple instructions that walk you through these new things... and there should be.

There is a learning curve to Windows 8. It doesn't behave exactly the same way previous versions of Windows did. Things are a bit different. If you can't handle the change, stick with Windows 7. You sound just like the people who whined and moaned endlessly about the ribbon in Office 2007. For new users or users who didn't mind learning new things it was an improvement but for people with concrete at their feet they stuck with Office 2004.

Windows 8 has numerous workflow, performance, and usability improvements over Windows 7. It's a huge upgrade. Once you understand the mouse gestures and the keyboard commands it's far more efficient to use than Windows 7. The desktop improvements are actually substantial but listening to the whining on THIS SITE you would think the desktop is gone and Metro is all you have to work with.

If you aren't interested in learning mouse gestures and keyboard commands to accomplish tasks quickly, stick with Windows 7 for the next decade.


RE: Wow
By espaghetti on 11/14/2012 1:56:57 AM , Rating: 3
I will stick with Windows 7.
You stick with "fancy" crap app screen.
Everything else about 8 I really do like.
I can make Win98, Me, NT, XP, Vista & 7 look like Win95.
Why can't they give me a similar option with 8?
Why do you people freak out like I'm asking them to shave my privates?


RE: Wow
By NellyFromMA on 11/13/2012 3:30:56 PM , Rating: 2
Uh, you do realize the best way to shut off a Win8 Pc is exactly the same as every other consumer device right? Hit the power buttom. Wow...


RE: Wow
By espaghetti on 11/14/2012 1:33:53 AM , Rating: 2
Pressing the power button made it hibernate.
Uh, needed it to shut down.
Yeah, I know to go in power settings, etc...
Uh, thanks for your input.


RE: Wow
By Donkey2008 on 11/29/2012 8:12:31 AM , Rating: 1
So the new interface is so good that I have had to teach almost every new Windows 8 user at my company how to use the new "start menu"? Are you kidding me? My company has over 1,300 users at my site and over 15,000 globally. Do you people understand what a colossal waste of time this will be?

It is not whether Metro is good or bad, it is the fact that users will have to learn a new interface after almost 20 years of being perfectly happy. And for what benefit? "Users will be more productive"? What a joke statement.

By the way, I use Windows 8 at home and have no issues with it as a home or tablet OS.


RE: Wow
By wordsworm on 11/13/2012 8:08:09 AM , Rating: 5
Windows 8 on my machine with a regular 7200 rpm hard drive boots faster than Windows 7 on an SSD. So, I have to click on a program I want to use to get into desktop... wow, so tough to do.

W8 takes a little getting used to... but, I would have to say I'm very impressed with a lot of the ways it handles apps and programs. The desktop now seems more like a virtual desktop... which isn't a bad thing, imo.

Considering all the negative reactions I've read about W8, I have been pleasantly surprised at how good it actually is. IMO, it is the best OS MS has made to date. The power stuff *is* there, you just have to dig around for it or pick up a book to figure out where the power goodies are.


RE: Wow
By wasteoid on 11/13/2012 10:18:58 AM , Rating: 3
Why should users have to dig around for stuff they already know how to use or pick up a book to figure out where the goodies are? Your argument actually proves that the new Windows 8 interface was a bad idea.


RE: Wow
By inighthawki on 11/13/2012 12:13:30 PM , Rating: 1
Right, we so we should never switch operating systems either, because once you learn how to use Windows, Linux, or OSX, you should never switch to another, it'll take WAY too much work to figure out the differences.

If you don't like the changes in Windows 8, the concept is simple, stick to Windows 7. Otherwise if you want all the new features of Windows 8, just spend 10 minutes to adapt to your new environment instead of expecting everything else to adapt to your wants and needs.


RE: Wow
By wordsworm on 11/13/2012 8:48:10 PM , Rating: 2
You must be new to the Microsoft party. I've been onboard since MS DOS. Every major iteration has required folks to relearn how to do things. If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. Don't be afraid of books; they're good for you.


RE: Wow
By MrBungle123 on 11/14/2012 5:08:20 PM , Rating: 2
Yes that is how its been... It's also adds to the stereotype of PC's being difficult to use and could very well cause them to lose users... if you gotta completely relearn everything why not try something else.


RE: Wow
By wordsworm on 11/14/2012 8:15:11 PM , Rating: 2
I think that reputation is old. I don't think people under the age of 35 would say that. Most people at that age and younger have had experience with word processors, games, and the Internet.


RE: Wow
By tayb on 11/13/2012 9:17:23 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
I want my desktop back.


It never left. I can't believe people are still so confused by this. Windows 8 has been out for a few weeks I would have thought people would have FINALLY figured this out. Apparently not.


RE: Wow
By NellyFromMA on 11/13/12, Rating: 0
RE: Wow
By NellyFromMA on 11/14/2012 2:14:08 PM , Rating: 1
It's always especially fun for me when I'm downrated for nothing other than hurting someones feelings. It's a good indication I was right ;)


RE: Wow
By NellyFromMA on 11/13/2012 2:59:02 PM , Rating: 2
You never lost it. Go install Windows 7. See, now you can go about your business. Unless, you were trying to propose a better way to combine the realities of Windows legacy with the realities of touch-driven consumer experiences.


RE: Wow
By Moishe on 11/14/2012 3:10:21 PM , Rating: 2
Uh... no.

Metro works. Apple Maps don't work. Your comparison is less based on fact and more based on the fact that you just don't like Metro.


RE: Wow
By Tony Swash on 11/13/2012 6:40:07 AM , Rating: 2
Check out the comments from Microsofties at MiniMicrosoft.

http://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=7555958&po...


HOT woman as a Windows President *thumbs up*
By Pirks on 11/12/2012 10:49:05 PM , Rating: 2
If rumors are true that she's all for holistic experiences, uniformity, simplicity, ease of use and shit, then I expect bright future for the Windows 9. She'll take Tony Swash's pwnage in the new interesting directions woohoo! I'm a happy camper here. Who's with me?




RE: HOT woman as a Windows President *thumbs up*
By Milliamp on 11/13/2012 2:49:59 AM , Rating: 2
My guess is Windows 9 will give people the option to use it pretty much like Windows 7. The enterprise will skip 8 and deploy 9. This direction was predicted as soon as people saw Windows 8.

Using a touch UI with a keyboard and mouse is just as stupid as using classic UI with touch screen.

Declaring the normal windows UI is "legacy" and will be supported in a non-native way (and moved away from in the future) is just stupid.

Bundle Metro but let people choose which UI they want to be using at that time. One the desktop I want classic and if I undock I can switch it to Metro, is it that hard to figure out?


By ShaolinSoccer on 11/13/2012 3:24:38 AM , Rating: 2
You're missing the point. Touch is "popular" so MS is trying to take advantage of it. If anything, they need to make an OS that is built for touch AND mouse/keyboard and give you the option to boot into either/or/both (when I say built for touch and mouse/keyboard, I mean to the point where noone complains about it). We should all have touch screens where we have apps/games that are built for both touch and mouse/keyboard so that IF you feel like touching your screen, you can. If you feel like using the mouse/keyboard, you can. Hell, if I want to wave my hand or move my eyeballs in a certain way and make the computer do what I want, it should do it. This is the future and the future should be "now". Just be glad that companies like MS, Apple, Google (and Linux) are striving to make their OS's as good as they are. It's only getting better and thanks to competition. MS may not hit a homerun with Windows 8 but I think they are definitely moving in the right direction!


RE: HOT woman as a Windows President *thumbs up*
By Milliamp on 11/13/2012 4:03:18 AM , Rating: 3
>You're missing the point. Touch is "popular"

It doesn't appear that I missed the point that touch is popular to me. I only said it was important not to abandon the traditional UI because many people still prefer it for keyboard and mouse which I am assuming you disagree with?

>Hell, if I want to wave my hand or move my eyeballs in a certain way and make the computer do what I want, it should do it.

Should they neglect the hardware people are using today to support this utopian hand waving eye ball reading future? My opinion is no but if you disagree you are welcome to throw away your mouse and keyboard and type your response to me with your eyeballs. Maybe Microsoft just created an opening for a man of your talents. You should eyeball a resume over to them right away.


By NellyFromMA on 11/13/2012 3:45:58 PM , Rating: 2
How did they abandon the traditional UI? That's exactly what they did NOT do.


RE: HOT woman as a Windows President *thumbs up*
By Arsynic on 11/13/2012 9:25:47 AM , Rating: 1
Touch isn't just "popular" it's the new standard and won't go away. Microsoft doesn't want to create different interfaces for each form factor. Their vision was of a consistent interface across multiple devices which means that users won't have to relearn Windows as they go between devices.

This is a good long-term strategy as users will go with what they're familiar with when it comes to new devices. I see the Desktop as an olive branch from MS. It will eventually go the way of the DOS prompt.

These people whining about the Desktop remind me so much of the DOS geeks.


By schnazzer on 11/13/2012 8:31:16 PM , Rating: 2
I actually got my hands on a Windows 8 machine over the weekend while out shopping.. I've had 8 in a VM for quite a while now but what really got me interested is when you have not only the traditional keyboard and mouse (which work just fine) but also a touch monitor as some of the machines on display had. forget tradition, what it does is changes the dynamics of how a computer is used, PC or otherwise. Did not though get to play with a Surface since they did not have any available.


By MrBungle123 on 11/14/2012 5:14:27 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Microsoft doesn't want to create different interfaces for each form factor. Their vision was of a consistent interface across multiple devices which means that users won't have to relearn Windows as they go between devices.


Thats a great idea but anyone with 2 neurons to rub together knows that every form factor and interface has been designed differently because the devices are used in different ways. There is a reason why a bicycle, a bulldozer, and a 747 all have different interfaces and unifying them is a bad idea.


By Moishe on 11/14/2012 3:13:20 PM , Rating: 2
Continuing to ignore the fully functional desktop begs the question of whether you are really clueless, or just choosing to act clueless?

I agree that metro should be a choice on all PCs except tablets.


RE: HOT woman as a Windows President *thumbs up*
By Tony Swash on 11/13/12, Rating: -1
RE: HOT woman as a Windows President *thumbs up*
By Helbore on 11/13/2012 7:39:51 AM , Rating: 2
And how exactly did you feel about Scott Forstall's departure from Apple? Was that them comically floundering about on a beach? Or was that a sign of their unstoppable rise into the stratosphere?


RE: HOT woman as a Windows President *thumbs up*
By retrospooty on 11/13/2012 7:43:30 AM , Rating: 2
ROFL... I see you have his # too. Pretty transparent these days. Its amazing the different spin he gives the exact same story at 2 companies when 1 of them is "the precious" ;)

Tony, as I have been telling you, you are outed here. No-one believes a thing you write.


RE: HOT woman as a Windows President *thumbs up*
By Tony Swash on 11/13/12, Rating: 0
RE: HOT woman as a Windows President *thumbs up*
By Helbore on 11/13/2012 10:51:47 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
I didn't say Microsoft was floundering because of dumping Sinofsky.


So your post had no relevance to the topic at hand. It was just a random fanboy rant at a competitor you don't like.

Got it.


RE: HOT woman as a Windows President *thumbs up*
By Tony Swash on 11/13/12, Rating: 0
RE: HOT woman as a Windows President *thumbs up*
By Helbore on 11/13/2012 12:41:24 PM , Rating: 1
Well its good to know you still don't know what you are talking about, but are just a fanboy. It's actually nice to see you come out and say it so openly.

I'm wondering if you have actually used the "shitty hack" of Office on a Surface. I'm guessing not, because it works very well (this said by someone who is actually using one for work).

I'm also guessing you haven't heard that Office is coming to iOS and Android. Microsoft have developed software for Apple platforms for years. They're still doing it. It's not an either/or situation where they either abandon Windows or the develop only for Windows. They're doing both.

It's also hilarious that you think iOS and Android are going to dominate. I seen loads of iOS devices and Android devices in business today. I have yet to see one that has actually replaced a Windows PC. Sure, their numbers have grown and Microsoft are not happy that it isn't their software underpinning those devices, but they're not crushing Microsoft out of existence like you seem to think. Microsoft have still sold more copies of Windows 7 than Apple have sold iPads. We're nowhere near a point where a tablet can replace a PC in all situations. Compliment them, yes - but not replace.

The problem with you is not something anyone needs to say. You've admitted it right there in the first and last paragraph of that post. Everything you accuse "Apple-haters" of doing, you yourself are guilty of doing when looking at Microsoft - because you are a fanboy for one company and you hate the other. Every time you laugh at someone, saying they have blinkers on because they hate Apple so much, just swap Apple for Microsoft and apply the same statement to yourself.

You are too biased against them to see anything objectively. You simply jump on any detail that might support your pre-conceived hope and will just as easily dismiss anything that doesn't support it. It's pretty crazy behaviour when all we are talking about it two obscenely rich companies selling tech products.


By retrospooty on 11/13/2012 12:51:35 PM , Rating: 2
"You are too biased against them to see anything objectively"

Exactly... They are not "the precious"

"preciouuuuuuus"


By Twistedbro5 on 11/13/2012 12:58:04 PM , Rating: 1
Indeed I am as well biased in this matter. I Will always hate Apple and relish Microsoft. Even though Apple is a big part of our future and could send mankind into a new age of technology potentially making it Deus Ex for real, When Steve died and they started suing everyone, making themselves look like desperate ass's, I lost the small shred of respect I had. There things most certainly DO NOT just work, and just because its smooth and the fps stays high, doesn't mean shit for Quality. As a techie i like windows and Microsoft products mostly because I have for power over my own things, more options, easier to modify, but they have fallen behind, and Win8 may "boot" faster, but i Don't like it. Sticking with Win7 for now until more Updates have improves its functionality. Not to mention not everything's compatible with it yet.


RE: HOT woman as a Windows President *thumbs up*
By Tony Swash on 11/13/2012 1:43:42 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
I'm also guessing you haven't heard that Office is coming to iOS and Android.


No official announcement, just a rumor, so neither of us know.

quote:
Microsoft have developed software for Apple platforms for years. They're still doing it. It's not an either/or situation where they either abandon Windows or the develop only for Windows. They're doing both.


If MS really think they can become a serious OS player on mobile devices then they won't do Office for rival platforms. This not like Mac versus PC where Mac never threatened the Windows hegemony. This time Microsoft is starting way too late and is up against players with gigantic footprints in the market so if MS want to break into the mobile OS market they will need to keep Office as a USP for their mobile OS. I don't think they will and I think the balance of probability is for an iOS version of Office.

quote:
It's also hilarious that you think iOS and Android are going to dominate. I seen loads of iOS devices and Android devices in business today. I have yet to see one that has actually replaced a Windows PC.


Who was talking about PCs and the desktop market? That's yesterday. Tomorrow is mobile devices. That doesn't mean that Windows on PCs will go away but it will become commercially and logistically a minority player. Mobile devices are rapidly approaching Windows installed base and will pass them very soon and grow much bigger. Mobile devices are a vastly larger commercial space than the desktop. Apple's iPhone business is already bigger than the whole of Microsoft. So far Microsoft has nothing viable and of any consequence in play in these new markets. Android and iOS dominate the new markets. The choice Microsoft has to make is how much does it shape it's efforts to try to lever the remaining clout of Windows/Office in order to secure a foothold as an operating system purveyor in the new markets and how much does it abandon that ambition. If it abandoned that ambition (of being a vendor of a mobile OS) it could concentrate on exploiting these new markets, which will be inevitably dominated by OS made by other companies, as markets into which it can sell it's software.

Personally I think that Microsoft has probably lost the mobile OS space for good. I just cannot see how it can be anything other than a bit player as an operating system vendor in the mobile device market.

quote:
The problem with you is not something anyone needs to say. You've admitted it right there in the first and last paragraph of that post. Everything you accuse "Apple-haters" of doing, you yourself are guilty of doing when looking at Microsoft - because you are a fanboy for one company and you hate the other. Every time you laugh at someone, saying they have blinkers on because they hate Apple so much, just swap Apple for Microsoft and apply the same statement to yourself.


Possibly. There is a difference however. Nobody, so far, is forced to use an Apple product. During the long dark period when Windows/Office dominated the tech world I spent years in various work environments where I had to use Microsoft's shoddy, ugly and dysfunctional crap. I earned the right to actively dislike them and gloat at their failures. Apple haters on the other hand seem to get all frothed up about products they never use and will never be forced to use. It seems so puerile.


RE: HOT woman as a Windows President *thumbs up*
By Helbore on 11/13/2012 2:25:11 PM , Rating: 2

quote:
If MS really think they can become a serious OS player on mobile devices then they won't do Office for rival platforms.


Not true. You assume they expect to dominate the market in the same way they have always done. ie 95% market share and everyone else in the toilet. Again, its not an either/or situation where Microsoft's only options are complete failure or a total monopoly. They could have a successful, but only moderate platform that they own and then a piece of the pie on everyone else's platforms, too.

quote:
Who was talking about PCs and the desktop market? That's yesterday. Tomorrow is mobile devices. That doesn't mean that Windows on PCs will go away but it will become commercially and logistically a minority player. Mobile devices are rapidly approaching Windows installed base and will pass them very soon and grow much bigger. Mobile devices are a vastly larger commercial space than the desktop. Apple's iPhone business is already bigger than the whole of Microsoft. So far Microsoft has nothing viable and of any consequence in play in these new markets. Android and iOS dominate the new markets. The choice Microsoft has to make is how much does it shape it's efforts to try to lever the remaining clout of Windows/Office in order to secure a foothold as an operating system purveyor in the new markets and how much does it abandon that ambition. If it abandoned that ambition (of being a vendor of a mobile OS) it could concentrate on exploiting these new markets, which will be inevitably dominated by OS made by other companies, as markets into which it can sell it's software.


See, this is the problem. Mobile devices won't replace PCs, unless they can achieve everything a PC can. So unless hybrid form factors kick off (and right now, Microsoft are the only ones who are offering a hybrid mobile/desktop platform), then mobile devices will simply be a different market segment. It doesn't matter if mobile device sales outpace PC sales. They aren't replacing PCs.

Here's an example that you'll like as its pro-Apple. It's like when people say that Apple are failing because their smartphone market share is declining. But we all know that is only because the market has grown. Apple's actual sales numbers have increased, even though the share has decreased. Other offerings on the market have not destroyed them, nor made iOS an irrelevance.

Similarly, increasing mobile sales are not taking away from PC sales in any great number. Again, we just need to look at Apple's massive recent success - they have sold 100 million iPads since 2010. Microsoft have still been making record sales of Windows 7, though - to the tune of 650 million copies since 2009.

That's not a company sinking into irrelevance.

If Windows ended up as a platform that was ONLY used in businesses, then it would not be anywhere near an irrelevance - and you cannot compare the amount of smartphones that are being sold to the amount of PCs being sold. Again, they are complimentary devices that belong to different segments.

quote:
Possibly. There is a difference however. Nobody, so far, is forced to use an Apple product. During the long dark period when Windows/Office dominated the tech world I spent years in various work environments where I had to use Microsoft's shoddy, ugly and dysfunctional crap. I earned the right to actively dislike them and gloat at their failures. Apple haters on the other hand seem to get all frothed up about products they never use and will never be forced to use. It seems so puerile.


See, that's where you are making random, unfounded generalisations. For one, you don't know what some people may have been forced to use. Unless you know these "anti-Apple," folks personally, you don't actually know what their problem is with Apple. You are just making an assumption and attacking that. A strawman argument, they call that.

Also, as someone who has used MacOS in versions prior to OSX, I can attest that shoddy, dysfunctional software is not something that only Microsoft is guilty of.

I'd also finish off by saying that your use of past-tense (you "spent" years, you "had" to use), I would assume you no longer have to use Microsoft software. Consequently, you are now just as guilty of the reasons you are deriding other of. You are taking pleasure in slagging off a firm who's products you do not have to use.

.....and yes you are right. That is puerile.


RE: HOT woman as a Windows President *thumbs up*
By Tony Swash on 11/13/12, Rating: 0
By Helbore on 11/13/2012 4:00:20 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Yep the Mac OS prior to MacOSX had lots of problems. At the time it was still better than Windows though. We used to call Windows 95 'Mac 89" :)


No disagreeing that MacOS had features prior to Windows, but that wasn't the point. The "spinning beachball of death," is an example of what I mean. Apple had just as many software issues as Microsoft.

quote:
OK - hands up who hates Apple because they forced to use Apple products?


You're still making assumptions. You assuming that its not the case does not make it fact.

quote:
Microsoft poisoned the world of computing with their ghastly badly made crap for a generation and in the process disempowered countless millions of users who think that computer viruses, the BSOD and the loss of precious data is an unavoidable part of computing and that they were stupid for finding their computers hard to use. I am so glad their hegemony is over but I will forever relish their every pain. And boy have they got a lot of pain coming. The cliff looms.


Sorry, but you know that's bull. Even OSX is susceptible to malware. You know that, because you've argued against its importance due to the lack of infections in the wild. I know you are not so stupid that you don't realise that Windows suffers from a high infection rate because it has such a large market share. Had Apple held a similar position, they would be just as infected.

MacOS (even OSX) suffers from Kernal panics, which is all a BSOD is. It is not unique to Microsoft.

Data loss is also not something that is unique to Microsoft. Remember the issue about OSX wiping out user data due to a bug in the software a few years ago?

See, all you do is continue to prove your bias. With every post you make, you show up that you unfairly judge Microsoft due to a personal hatred of them and unjustly hail Apple as if they were perfect, even though they've made as many mistakes as Microsoft. They were just less successful with their products in the past.

You admit your bias and you admit it is possible you are unfair. You cannot know that those you accuse of being puerile are any different to you, but on the other side - yet you refuse to accept the possibility.

The fact is, you are everything you criticise in others. you don't even have an argument against it.


By momorere on 11/13/2012 11:02:04 AM , Rating: 3
I'm assuming that this is just one other way that other companies are "copying" crApple huh ? Everyone's top execs are leaving and are just following that of the all knowing and perfect crApple.


Future job?
By CityZen on 11/12/2012 11:08:01 PM , Rating: 2
From the portrait they paint of him, he may be a great fit for Apple ;)




RE: Future job?
By Xplorer4x4 on 11/13/2012 12:09:37 AM , Rating: 2
I realize this was a joke, but if Jobs was there, yes he would. I think it would be interesting if him and Frostall worked together to create a new OS if it eventually competed with Windows and OsX, or jumped to linux. :)


RE: Future job?
By publicspace on 11/13/2012 12:40:27 AM , Rating: 2
If the guy was running Windows OS for the past 20+ years, I don't see how he would be a good fit with the open source linux community..


RE: Future job?
By Milliamp on 11/13/2012 2:22:32 AM , Rating: 2
Unity drove me away from Ubuntu and Metro will drive me off Windows. If he didn't make more than most the Ubuntu team combined he might be a good fit there.


RE: Future job?
By drycrust3 on 11/13/2012 9:51:29 AM , Rating: 3
quote:
Unity drove me away from Ubuntu

I totally agree. I just can't understand how it got through beta testing, let alone being on the production model. What is the point of a desktop when you can't see what concurrent applications are running?


RE: Future job?
By inperfectdarkness on 11/13/2012 2:41:28 AM , Rating: 2
first thing i thought of. they evey look alike.


Damn...He Was Supposed to Be Ballmer's Heir Apparent
By Arsynic on 11/13/2012 9:17:52 AM , Rating: 1
I guess the Gen X and Millennial generations have a zero tolerance policy of douchebag managers. Gone are the days when employees believe they have to suffer under a manager with an iron fist. The "mean boss" is now an endangered species. People will quit and go to the competition in a second.

I have no problem with that.




By p05esto on 11/13/2012 9:52:58 AM , Rating: 2
I have a BIG problem with that. Bosses need to rule with an iron first and keep the underlings not thinking so much of themselves. All the stupid ass ideas always come from the new and young people as they try to compete with folks who have 20 years of background with a company. The touchy feeling management sdoesn't work. You must be some young kid yourself if you made that comment, lol.


By Arsynic on 11/13/2012 12:32:51 PM , Rating: 3
I'm 34 years old and a manager myself. You don't inspire people by being an overbearing hard-ass. My employees aren't children. They're creative professionals that I want to inspire the best out of. Today's professionals can vote with their feet so to speak and don't have to tolerate toxic work environments where fear rules the day and teammates compete against each other instead of working as a team.


By 91TTZ on 11/15/2012 1:29:57 PM , Rating: 2
I like my boss to act like Stalin. When several coworkers enter a meeting and only a few back out, it makes me want to work harder.

Also, eating axle grease increases productivity.


By NellyFromMA on 11/13/2012 3:50:36 PM , Rating: 2
LOL!!!!!! This comment is the perfect example of my greatest fear in terms of our society. GROW UP!!!!! Life has harsh realities, the least of which si that you may ::GASP:: NOT LIKE YOUR BOSS.

I guess Gen X and millenial generations are as we've come to expect them: Totally Effed!


A good move
By MartyLK on 11/13/2012 10:39:35 PM , Rating: 2
I think this is a positive move for MS. I'd like to see more women in authoritative roles in MS. Not that I know this one - or any of them, I just believe that the proper balance of genders is a very good and productive thing.




RE: A good move
By 91TTZ on 11/14/2012 8:14:22 AM , Rating: 2
In other words you don't know anything about this person's skills or fit for the role, but you support hiring a person because of their gender.

How is that not discrimination? Their gender should have nothing at all to do with their hiring decision. If you say that you encourage companies to hire people of a certain gender then you're actually discouraging them from hiring someone else of the opposite gender.


RE: A good move
By MartyLK on 11/14/2012 10:10:40 AM , Rating: 2
I didn't know anything about Sinofsky either. In fact, I don't know anything about any of the people leading any of these major companies. Is that being counter-sexist? Or maybe sexist against men?

I personally think you are secretly sexist yourself and are trying to make a mountain out of a molehill.


RE: A good move
By 91TTZ on 11/15/2012 1:17:38 PM , Rating: 2
I'm not sexist, I'm elitist. I think the most qualified people should be given the jobs. I wouldn't give a pass for second best just because I'm trying to meet some quota.

Affirmative Action should be outlawed in my opinion. Race/Sex/Everything else is completely irrelevant to the task at hand and shouldn't be part of the hiring decision. In fact, applications shouldn't even include fields for that because they only serve to discriminate.


RE: A good move
By Moishe on 11/14/2012 3:20:41 PM , Rating: 2
Her gender is completely irrelevant...

Any smart organization should be primarily concerned with capability. Can she get the job done?


By Lord_Conrad on 11/13/2012 3:07:04 AM , Rating: 2
I'm guessing he was the only executive who had the guts to say that Metro doesn't belong on the desktop. Microsoft wouldn't want to admit that one of their own disagreed with Windows 8, so they just labeled him a trouble maker.




Blame it on Windows 8
By cyberguyz on 11/13/2012 7:33:10 AM , Rating: 2
If this is the guy that is responsible for putting that Metro crap on an operating system that is installed on desktop systems, then I am not surprised that he is disappearing now.

My desktop is not a touchscreen. I don't need that ugly crap fouling my system.




By wind79 on 11/13/2012 10:04:14 AM , Rating: 2
The UI in Win8 was one of the worst, I wish MS good luck!




ROARRRRR! Said the Dinosaurs!
By mellomonk on 11/13/2012 1:10:22 PM , Rating: 2
Wow. Reading the comments about Win8 and the 'interface formally known as Metro' here, I had a serious case of Deja Vu. It is just like the days when Windows first came out, and the DOS users where it utter revolt. GUI? We don't need no stinking GUI! Computers don't need a 'playskool' interface! I just want my command prompt back!

You see how that went. Evolution is a b!*%h!




.
By H0rnet on 11/13/2012 8:35:25 PM , Rating: 2
The only thing keeping me on Windows type product from Microsoft is Direct X. I wish the EU or the DOJ would take them to court over it's handling. It's a much larger issue then WMP or IE ever was.




By 91TTZ on 11/14/2012 8:29:32 AM , Rating: 2
Before Windows 8 was launched, a huge chunk of the Windows user base enthusiastically proclaimed their hatred for Windows 8. I'm one of them. It simply is not a good fit for desktop users, it belongs on a tablet.

A smaller, clueless minority of users claimed that Windows 8 was fantastic and that users who didn't like it were just afraid of change.

Well, here's your change. The man who forced the Ribbon in Office 2007, the man responsible for the dissapearance of the Start menu in Windows 8, the man behind the Metro push has been ousted from Microsoft.

Apparently not even Microsoft liked the direction that Microsoft was heading. I wholeheartedly support this decision. I hope his replacement sees thing differently.




windows 8 metro is useless
By SPOOOK on 11/14/2012 6:28:38 PM , Rating: 2
i have a new notebook that has win 8 the metro it the worst piece of junk that i ever was it is useless as a operating system are they kidding me that wont support pop email they tell me to get another email account get lost i had me email pop account for 8 years what do i to trash me email for them i have over 2,000 web address in folders how do i use folders for web scroll most web sites will not play video keeps crashing web is useless email useless and i have to log in with a email account i dont even have to do that with apple the list of failyours is longer then a book
and my win 8 crashes every hour metro is a gross failure as a operating system for a pc and to puse this junk on servers
this garbage will bankrupt them




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