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Print 112 comment(s) - last by Cheesew1z69.. on Oct 24 at 6:49 PM

Google is looking to one-up that iPad's Retina display

Apple may be looking to crush the competition's hopes of taking over the 7" tablet market with its upcoming iPad Mini, but Google is looking to grab a few headlines of its own on Monday, October 29.
 
According to The Next Web, Google will officially unveil a 32GB version of its popular Nexus 7 tablet. The device has already turned up in stores across the U.S. and some lucky people have even been able to purchase the device, which is priced at $249 (the same price as the previous 16GB model). In addition, there will also be another 32GB Nexus 7 that will feature 3G connectivity. This device will most likely be aimed right at Amazon's 8.9" Kindle Fire HD LTE 4G (say that three times fast).

 
The star of the show, however, will be Google's new 10" tablet that was developed in conjunction with Samsung. This tablet will come bearing Android 4.2 (still operating under the Jelly Bean codename) and a Retina-surpassing resolution of 2560x1600 (300 ppi). Apple's "New iPad" features a screen resolution of 2048x1536 (264 ppi).
 
The device will likely be called the Nexus 10. We don't have any specs to report on at this time other than the screen, but we can only assume that it'll be packing a quad-core processor and at least 64GB of storage space at the high-end.

Source: The Next Web



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No
By damianrobertjones on 10/21/2012 1:33:36 PM , Rating: -1
It really is just all numbers :(

If they released a Windows 8 tablet with the resolution above it would run at that resolution and we'd all go blind. We'd then increase the DPI and then wonder why we did it. Pointless (Other than to say that you have it or to say, 'ohhh look how clear everything is' while STILL not being as nice as a typical screen that was featured on the really old HP Envy 13 (Radiance)




RE: No
By EnzoFX on 10/21/2012 2:24:28 PM , Rating: 2
No. Are you one of those that don't understand the other benefits of a higher ppi? This isn't about fitting more on the screen like it was on desktops and laptops.


RE: No
By inighthawki on 10/21/2012 2:29:29 PM , Rating: 2
There's a point where being able to see clarity while holding it 3" from your face is beaten out by the processing power and battery drain required to render everything on the screen at that level of clarity. High res displays come at a pretty high cost in those departments.


RE: No
By Samus on 10/21/2012 5:30:52 PM , Rating: 2
Exactly. Anything over 240-260ppi is really surpassing the limits of the human eye at viewing distance.

It's not like the average user is going to be looking at the text under a magnifying glass like searching through the obituaries in a newspaper...thats what pinch or tap-to-zoom is for.


RE: No
By mcnabney on 10/22/2012 10:35:10 AM , Rating: 2
Remember - raising the resolution has a cost besides dollars.

More pixels means more power to run the screen and an incrementally more powerful GPU in the SoC to maintain performance - which in turn eats more battery. The iPad 3 is a giant battery - doubling battery size of the iPad2 just to maintain the same amount of useful time.


RE: No
By someguy123 on 10/21/2012 6:11:33 PM , Rating: 4
The other benefits like reduced pixel edge visibility and edge rounding for games only make sense if the hardware and battery life are there. People grossly overestimate the power of these processors, and most of the time they never reach full load to save battery life. Even with apples walled in garden you run into performance problems/dumbed down visuals to meet retina, if not half internal resolution. Most developers will probably not even try to meet native until hardware catches up, but it's not like you can swap out a SoC later if you purchase a tablet now. All of your video will need to be upscaled as well if you want to full screen.

This type of push makes sense on something plugged into a wall socket, but it seems like the wrong priority for portables.


RE: No
By tayb on 10/21/2012 9:41:05 PM , Rating: 3
I don't know about everyone else but when I use my tablet I hold it about two inches from my face.


RE: No
By TakinYourPoints on 10/21/2012 4:46:44 PM , Rating: 2
It isn't about fitting more on screen, it is about smoothing out text and graphics by the use of larger assets.

An iPad has a resolution of 2048x1536, but the proportions and layout of the UI are still based around 1024x768. The benefit is much cleaner graphics and text. Google will use the same method with this new tablet.

Windows 8 not properly rendering at such high resolutions is a shortcoming of desktop operating systems. Once it gets to rendering things properly at such high resolutions, then higher DPI displays will make sense on the desktop and laptop. It'll happen on the PC side, just watch. Apple just got this working on the retina MBP. You can drive the OS X desktop at 2880x1800 and things aren't tiny because they use 2x res or scaled up assets to make up for the increased resolution.


RE: No
By TweakEn on 10/21/2012 5:17:27 PM , Rating: 1
This PPI war needs to stop. Cell phones and tablets should not have a PPI over 250. I have a GNex with 316 PPI, and a Nexus 7 with 210 PPI. I have perfect eye sight and my Nexus 7 is just fine, because I don't hold my tablet 6 inches from my face like a retard. Apple has created a race in a market that should not exist. All this war is doing is making it so we need faster processors and GPUs to handle all these pixels, which in turn adds to higher costs for consumers. It's just silly. 2560 x 1600 at 10 inches is 301.887 PPI according to my calculations. Use your brain and tone it down to 1920 x 1080, which is 220.29 PPI and save the consumers some money on something we can't even see in the first place. Apple's Retina laptop is retarded. 5 million pixels that the graphics card can barely drive that many pixels. Facebook on this laptop reaches 20 frames per second when scrolling because the GPU can't handle the pixels. WAKE UP MANUFACTURERS! STOP FOLLOWING APPLE'S LEAD! Why do you think their stock is on a huge decline? Because they haven't been innovative in 3 years.


RE: No
By michael2k on 10/21/2012 6:50:30 PM , Rating: 5
Nonsense! What we really need is the PPI wars to grow until all laptops, desktops, and LCDs are all 300 PPI.


RE: No
By inperfectdarkness on 10/22/2012 2:53:47 AM , Rating: 2
+6

Stop holding innovation back. Push the displays and the hardware will have to follow.


RE: No
By retrospooty on 10/22/2012 8:50:06 AM , Rating: 3
Tweaken, believe me, I am no Apple fan but thay DO do a great job pushing standards. They did it in 2007 with the great multitouch UI and again again recently with retina displays. It is innovation? No, it is utilizing existing tech better than the competition (of course that ebbs and flows). But this is a good thing. It is forcing other makers to raise the bar and it is ushering in the end of the 1366x767 laptop. I agree over 300 ppi is overkill, but it beats the hell out of the "underkill" we have lived with up until recently. I thank Apple for this, its something that we all benefit from.

If not for Apple's retina pushing the specs up, I wouldnt be using my Nexus 7 with 1280x800 , it would still be 1024x600 and I wouldnt have bought it.


RE: No
By aliasfox on 10/22/2012 11:33:34 AM , Rating: 2
For once I agree with you - bringing 300dpi to mainstream is a good thing. It forces the competition to do use better screens, it forces SoC manufacturers to increase performance while holding power consumption as close to constant as possible, and it results in better products for all of us. Are they more expensive than products with lower specifications? Yes. But without higher specification devices pushing down the price of lower specification devices, even crappy 1024 x 600 tablets would still be higher priced.

Retina iPad comes out at the same price as the iPad2, which gets pushed cheaper. iPad2's cheaper price should then drag Galaxy Tab and Transformer Prime prices lower, which will then depress the prices of entry level 7" tablets. No matter where in that market you're looking to buy in at, the appearance of the Retina iPad and (hopefully) the new Nexus 10 is a benefit.


RE: No
By retrospooty on 10/22/2012 11:56:43 AM , Rating: 2
"It forces the competition to do use better screens, it forces SoC manufacturers to increase performance while holding power consumption as close to constant as possible, and it results in better products for all of us."

Exactly... And for those that complain and don't want a 2560x1600 10 inch tablet, don't buy one. Because of this, you can get a lower res one for even cheaper, because its specs have been surpassed and therefore its a lower end cheaper model now.

"For once I agree with you"

For once? I am full of wisdom, you should pay more attention ;)


RE: No
By aliasfox on 10/23/2012 11:32:34 AM , Rating: 2
"For once I agree with you"

For once? I am full of wisdom, you should pay more attention ;)


I happen to appreciate my iPhone4 taking up less space in my pocket, and considering it's nowhere near a 'primary' computing device for me, I'm happy with the level of functionality/reliability/screen size provided by it. Podcasting, music, tracking my running, texting, and the very occasional surfing when I'm on the john covers about 99% of my smartphone use ;-)


RE: No
By TweakEn on 10/23/2012 5:02:53 PM , Rating: 2
No, it's unnecessary. You can't see those pixels, no one holds their device that close. Battery life is more of a concern and should be the primary goal right now of all manufacturers. You're beating a dead horse when you go past 250 ppi, trust me. You wanna make a brighter display so you can see it in sunlight? fine. You want to make it use less power? Great. You wanna make it so you can't see the pixels when you hold it 2" in front of your face instead of 3"? WTF? Who cares?


RE: No
By testerguy on 10/24/2012 5:23:23 AM , Rating: 2
Wow, retro - one of the first comments of yours I've ever agreed with :-)


RE: No
By andre-bch on 10/21/2012 7:40:40 PM , Rating: 2
Windows 8 scales pretty well. If it doesn't, then it's a video driver issue, linked with identifying correct EDID values.


RE: No
By TakinYourPoints on 10/21/2012 7:54:01 PM , Rating: 1
It isn't 100% there yet, but no desktop OS is.

http://techreport.com/review/23631/how-windows-8-s...


RE: No
By andre-bch on 10/21/2012 8:39:30 PM , Rating: 2
As I said, it has to be a driver issue.

http://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/en/W8IT...

While desktop can be scaled manually, start screen and metro apps can't. They rely solely on EDID.

I agree that we are not exactly there yet, but I'm sure MS will sort things out in the coming months. After all, windows 8 isn't even available in retail.


RE: No
By TakinYourPoints on 10/21/2012 10:43:48 PM , Rating: 1
Manually scaling to 125% or 150% on the desktop is not a good solution. Text rendering isn't accurate and in many cases it throws off the proportions and layouts of application UIs.

Again, going to higher res displays means that we either need resolution independence or 2x graphical assets and fonts in order to look correct with increased pixel density. There appears to be no solution in sight but hopefully this gets rolled into a service pack. I would be shocked if it wasn't addressed by Windows 9.


RE: No
By andre-bch on 10/22/2012 4:32:43 AM , Rating: 2
Actually software developers are to blame here.

http://www.kynosarges.de/WindowsDpi.html

MS can't do anything about a badly coded program.

Windows does in fact do some automatic scaling for desktop. It was even mentioned in the article you provided:

"By default, the operating system applies a 125% scaling setting on the Zenbook Prime."

Metro is another matter entirely. Metro apps are resolution independent. Now it comes down to drivers to detect the correct display size/DPI.


RE: No
By Moishe on 10/23/2012 11:55:35 AM , Rating: 2
I agree, kind of.

Software devs need to take DPI into consideration. They're not, so MS is trying to provide decent work-arounds.

Like other posts have said, Apple uses a very controlled ecosystem to handle their high DPI screen by having exact resolutions that are easy to handle (4x is easy to scale).

That being said, MS should have put the new UI on a dozen different types of devices and fixed every single issue. The DPI issue should have been noticed and fixed by building a robust DPI into Windows. They're going to need it more and more and it's a worthwhile investment.


RE: No
By cbf on 10/22/2012 4:40:19 PM , Rating: 2
That Techreport article is almost entirely focused on web pages that don't scale properly. That isn't a Windows 8 problem -- that's a problem with web designers and web design tools that do pixel layout. This issue is present across all operating systems. There are plenty of pages, which is viewed at 1:1 pixel resolution on an iPad 3, would render entirely in a postage-stamp sized space in the upper left corner of the screen (well, OK, maybe postcard-sized space).

Unfortunately, this is all too common -- specifying width and height in pixels (for tables, divs, etc.) instead of percent, inches, ems, cms, etc.

Of course, it's hard to get away from pixels when using bitmaps, but it can be done if web designers were willing to do the work (use SVG, or provide at least 3 sizes of bitmaps adjusted according to the PPI).


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