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  (Source: ComputerWorld)
Windows 8 not at popular as Windows 7 so far

Microsoft has a lot riding on Windows 8 operating system. The software giant is hoping that Windows 8 will bring a slew of consumers upgrading from older computers and older versions of its operating system. Microsoft is also betting that Windows 8 will get a strong foothold in the tablet market as well
 
So far, users are currently five times less likely to be running Windows 8 as they were Windows 7 at the same point before its launch. The new statistics come from research firm Net Applications and indicate a lukewarm reception of the Windows 8 operating system by consumers.
 
Windows 7 was a follow-up to Windows Vista, which was one of the more maligned versions of Microsoft's operating system in recent years. Windows 7 lured many upgraders not only from Vista, but from the older XP operating system as well. Windows 8 doesn't have the luxury of following an unloved version of Windows like Windows 7.
 
The statistics offered by Net Applications only count computer users who installed preview versions of Windows 8 and preview versions of Windows 7. The statistics are believed to provide a clear indication of consumer interest in the operating system rather than a desire or need for new computer hardware.
 
In September, only 0.33% of all computers using Windows relied on Windows 8. That works out to 33 out of every 10,000 Windows machines using Windows 8. By the end of September 2009, with very similar time remaining before the launch of Windows 7, the operating system accounted for 1.64% of all Windows PCs working out to 164 out of every 10,000 units. 
 
Analysts are beginning to believe that Microsoft won't see the uptick in OS sales that it hoped for with Windows 8. Gartner recently advised clients that it predicts the operating system would top out at only 20 to 25% share in the corporate environment. 
 
Windows 8 went RTM in August and will launch this month.

Source: ComputerWorld



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Because it is terrible, IMO...
By jjlj on 10/2/2012 10:47:22 AM , Rating: 5
I tried using the RTM version on my htpc and it sucked compared to windows 7. With win 7 I can keep the resolution at 1920X1080 on my 52" lcd, adjust the DPI and font sizes and I'm able to read text from 11' away or so without hurting my eyes.

I could not do the same with the windows 8 tiles. The text font size was too small to read from the same distance even after doubling the size of the tiles. And the fact that the icon/tile for everything you install is always visible was just plain annoying.

The fact that WMC was missing was the nail in the coffin for me.




RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By kleinma on 10/2/12, Rating: -1
RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By damianrobertjones on 10/2/2012 10:55:52 AM , Rating: 3
Your personal opinion on WMC is NOT shared. Sorry.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By andrewaggb on 10/2/2012 12:26:49 PM , Rating: 2
I really liked WMC as well. We can't use cablecard in canada (afaik) so we're stuck with pvr's from our tv providers or recording analog cable..., which means I don't really have a use for WMC anymore. I'm using plex.

I also had problems with WMC not seeing all my content sometimes which was really annoying.

I think MS really dropped the ball on WMC support in windows 7 (could have been so much more) and then abandoned it for windows 8 (more or less). WMC was way ahead of it's time, just now appletv, googletv, netflix, etc is all finally becoming mainstream. Seems silly that MS abandons it now.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By Varun on 10/2/2012 1:57:22 PM , Rating: 2
You can also use a Hauppauge Colossus to capture HD TV in Canada. It's not ideal, but it's what I do.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By EnzoFX on 10/2/2012 1:59:06 PM , Rating: 1
MS dropping a push for WMC makes complete sense.

This from someone that used it heavily. However it is painfully obvious that it was always a niche product, and it's one that is shrinking quickly. With people dropping their cable/satellite subscriptions for online services, coupled with overall desktop use, with the rise of tablets/smarter phones, etc. The user of tuners with computers is dropping. It's a dying niche. I'd rather they get out of it so they can focus on things that matter, though they seem to be dropping the ball on those things as well... sigh.

I don't see Win8 doing too well, maybe in their low end stuff that's arm based and priced comparable to Android/iPad offerings. In the high end, I don't see it since Ultrabooks have always seemed a tough sell to me (overpriced).


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By EnzoFX on 10/2/2012 2:14:13 PM , Rating: 2
Oh, and on the other end, people that do stick with their cable/satellite subscriptions, their dvr offerings have caught up significantly in terms of overall features, so they too are sticking more to what their providers give them.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By andrewaggb on 10/2/2012 2:33:18 PM , Rating: 3
But I think MS could have evolved the WMC concept, built it into tv's, got it into pvr's etc. Stuff like airplay, netflix, etc could all have been in WMC years ago and licensed etc. To me it's just another market MS dabbled in (like tablets) before it's time, only half committed to, and ultimately finds itself an insignificant player.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By EnzoFX on 10/2/2012 4:12:25 PM , Rating: 1
but it would still be a shrinking niche. Only now is that stuff solidly in TV's, and only android is making headways with certain tv manufacturers, because it's free probably (apple TV and set top boxes are a niche, apple always says it's their pet project). It's just a tough marriage, coming from a computing side, and trying to merge it into another companies' manufacturing side. That's probably the challenge, and that's probably why Win never had their own phone or tablet, etc.

Nevertheless I agree, it's a lack of commitment, though I wish this uphill battle would have significant results for those that are fighting it. I want serious headway made here by such players, but I do realize it's an uphill battle for them, that most don't have the stomach for. Think about TV's and set top boxes. 90% of people use the boxes their providers give them, and TV's are purchased every few years, and they're not very update friendly, they end up connecting them again, to whatever they happen to subscribe to, or maybe a console. The rise of the smarter console is also to blame here haha. They too can offer many of those services. So again, it's a dying niche. They should update it in a serious way for the Xbox maybe. Get the market that way, then offer their own set top boxes and spin it off into tv integration.


By NellyFromMA on 10/2/2012 3:07:15 PM , Rating: 2
http://betanews.com/2012/10/02/windows-8-is-not-ab...

Sorry to link to another news site, but perhaps DT would like to get on the ball with the concensus shared by anyone not trying to sensationalize tech and enflame its comment board usage?


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By jjlj on 10/2/2012 11:06:34 AM , Rating: 2
XBMC didn't work with tuner cards in win 8 yet, at least I couldn't get it to work. I couldn't watch antenna TV with win 8. I am fully aware of XBMC and use it.

I could have also said no WMC was the last straw. I too know it will be available at some point. It wasn't available in the RTM pro version I used.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By Mitch101 on 10/2/2012 12:01:05 PM , Rating: 3
The difference is WMC doesnt ship with Windows 8 you have to download it Microsoft was going to charge a fee for it since its rarely used but later decided to make it a free download.

How to add Media Center to Windows 8 Release Preview
http://news.cnet.com/8301-10805_3-57445533-75/how-...

Im about to explore doing this as an HTPC option.

I use WMC with a Silicon Dust Dual HD tuner with a cheap antenna hiding in my attic. WMC is excellent at recording video and the guide I dont want to give that up.

With that I love XBMC you can add it as a menu option on your WMC menu
http://xbmcwmc.teknowebworks.com/

Be sure to add the additional ones at the bottom of that link

HULU Desktop Integration 2.1 - HULU Windows Media Center Integration
Boxee Integration 2.1 - Boxee Windows Media Center Integration
My Music At Home - Leave your MP3s at home and listen to them through a web browser

I plan on using an X-Box 360 controller with the USB wireless adapter and adding the gaming option under XBMC
http://lifehacker.com/5523672/turn-your-xbmc-media...

If your into WMC you know it recently lost support for items like CBS but Im hoping that someone will pick up the ball and make it a add on for XBMC for easy navigation but who knows we could see an x-box pluging as well.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By jjlj on 10/2/2012 12:25:36 PM , Rating: 2
I couldn't add WMC to the Win 8 Pro RTM. Not sure it you can now or not.

As a DVR and guide WMC works perfectly for watching OTA channels.

Have you tried the Free Cable plugin for XBMC? I never watched any of the CBS videos in WMC.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By Mitch101 on 10/2/2012 2:46:26 PM , Rating: 2
I haven't loaded the RTM yet I just got the hardware together for it but it seems that WMC will be available again for Win 8 on launch (Oct 26th). I recall hearing the same as you and yelling NOoooo but someone told me Microsoft changed their stance and its a download now. They were gonna charge $12.95 for it but decided to make it free.

Totally agree WMC as a DVR is great. Some of the TV networks made it easy to access content like Big Brother and a bunch of other shows in WMC but now you have to go to their websites for the streaming content.

No haven't tried the free cable plugin for XBMC Ive seen some very interesting things on it like torrent tv which might be interesting. I haven't used it much since the X-Box 1 days.

From what I understand there are No changes to it since Win 7 because its not popular. I really have no problem just running Windows 7 with WMC if needed especially since nothing changed in WMC with Windows 8.

What else I liked about WMC is it synced shows well with my Phone it recoded it to a format that was small and also that it works with the X-Box 360.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By kmmatney on 10/2/2012 3:53:13 PM , Rating: 1
It's not exactly free if you have to buy the Pro version of Win8 to get it.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By dark matter on 10/2/2012 11:27:20 AM , Rating: 2
Who cares what you think. Go view the stats, you're in a minority.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By kleinma on 10/2/2012 12:06:05 PM , Rating: 2
Im in the minority? MS statistics showed that something like 1% of windows users ever even opened WMC, and then it was said that something like 50% of that 1% never opened it twice. If it was popular and used by lots of people, it wouldn't have been yanked from the OS. It will be available from the app store for free to pro users at some point around RTM, mostly so people can't complain that a function from win7 upgrades was removed.

I used WMC for a long time as a HTPC solution, and it was horrible for me. I don't use a tuner card, I have a personal home collection of movies and shows (which WMC can't even ff/rw on) then I switches to XBMC and was pissed at myself for not using it sooner. There are dozens of plugins to get streaming content from the web, auto DB popultation of video/audio meta data from online databases, etc.. it just works in every way better than WMC. I can't speak to tuner card capabilities (since in the US most are crippled, and cablecard is just waiting to die) but everything else sucks about WMC


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By jjlj on 10/2/2012 12:26:57 PM , Rating: 2
I've heard about those statistics before and thought about it, but I think they may be flawed. How does MS know I use WMC? I didn't turn anonymous reporting and generally opt out of any kind of anonymous reporting for programs that crash. So the numbers may be a little skewed.

There are some pretty active discussions about WMC on various forum sites.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By p05esto on 10/2/2012 5:17:06 PM , Rating: 2
VERY good point. Most all power users turn off all reporting functions. MS has no clue what the power users do with their computers - none. I hope MS realizes that people who know turn off all tracking ans tats gathering.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By DFranch on 10/2/2012 9:45:44 PM , Rating: 2
If all you use it for is to stream movies, there are better options out there then Media Center. I used Sage TV for years, but when they sold out to Google, I switched to MCE. I have 4 clear QAM and 4 Cablecard tuners. I can record virtually any channel local or cable. You can't do that with XBMC since it doesn't support cablecard. I also use my Xbox as a media extender so I don't have to have a noisy computer sitting in my family room. Can XBMC do that? Now since XBMC is useless to me, that doesn't mean it sucks, it just means MCE is the better option for me just like XBMC is a better option for you.


By NellyFromMA on 10/2/2012 12:56:21 PM , Rating: 2
I mean, do we only care about what the majority of peopel think nowadays? C'mon seriously?

Here's a fact: the majority of people in the united stated, and in the world, are stupid, dependant, and often do not think for themselves or properly evaluate facts before making decisions.

So, telling someone 'who cares what yoou think because you're in the minority' is frankly akin to who cares if someone thought the world was round because the majority of people thought it was flat.

It's self defeating. I thought we liked technology, which implied a certain level of open mindedness. Wth.


By GreenEnvt on 10/2/2012 12:01:40 PM , Rating: 2
WMC is great.
Gives my family a single spot to watch Live TV from cable and OTA, plus movies stored on our file server.
All from a nice remote on the couch.

I'll take another look at XBMC, but last time I looked it was not as nice as WMC.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By zlandar on 10/2/2012 12:17:06 PM , Rating: 2
I like XBMC. I use it for all my MKV movies/videos. However XBMC can't do jack with a cablecard.

Inability to display cable (or even nonprotected OTA) programming through a tuner like HDhomerun/Ceton is a huge gaping hole IMO.


By jimbojimbo on 10/2/2012 4:25:55 PM , Rating: 2
You can get XBMC to play live TV from HDHomeRun now but it's clunky.
Why are people picking one or the other? I run XMBC normally but if I want to watch recorded shows I run WMC. I run it on my desktop which records shows for me.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By augiem on 10/2/2012 1:52:18 PM , Rating: 2
WMC rocks for OTA TV.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By chizow on 10/2/2012 2:41:00 PM , Rating: 2
WMC may rock for OTA, but its absolutely amazing with a CableCard. Too bad MS and the CableCos have fought so hard to keep it under wraps for so long. If CableCard went mainstream 5 years ago WMC would have much better traction.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By damianrobertjones on 10/2/2012 10:55:13 AM , Rating: 2
"tile for everything you install is always visible was just plain annoying." - right click the tile and you can then remove.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By jjlj on 10/2/2012 11:09:19 AM , Rating: 2
But then where do the shortcuts go? I only spent a day or 2 with windows 8 so I don't really know the answer to that.

The real problem for me was the font size on the tiles.


By damianrobertjones on 10/2/2012 11:35:15 AM , Rating: 2
Right click the interface and click (Bottom right) 'All Apps'.

You can add them back whenever you feel like it


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By Arsynic on 10/2/2012 10:56:45 AM , Rating: 1
In my opinion, it doesn't suck. I love that the Start Menu has been replaced by the Start Screen and all of my applications work. When I'm on the desktop, it's just like I'm using Windows 7.

And that may be the problem. For people running Windows 7, there's no reason to format and install Windows 8 unless you have a touchscreen AIO PC. Windows 7 is fine for most vanilla PCs.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By jjlj on 10/2/2012 11:11:38 AM , Rating: 2
I really see the benefit to win 8 on a touch screen device. For me on the HTPC it was more of a hassle. I really can't wait to see it on a tablet or convertible laptop.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By Mitch101 on 10/2/2012 12:06:41 PM , Rating: 4
2 Minutes hope this helps solve all your navigation needs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rDN_R4j1FM

If you like keyboard shortcuts:
WinKey = Toggle between metro and desktop mode
WinKey + F = File manager
WinKey + D? = Desktop mode (Windows 7)
WinKey + W = Apps List
WinKey + I = Settings and customization panel
WinKey + L = Lock screen
WinKey + X = Administrative tools
WinKey + C = Right panel (Settings, Search, Share)


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By jjlj on 10/2/2012 12:29:11 PM , Rating: 2
I generally use keyboard shortcuts, especially win key + L at work. I'll have to keep those in mind next time I use win 8. Thanks!


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By Mitch101 on 10/2/2012 2:50:47 PM , Rating: 2
No prob. Like most I hated Win 8 when I first started using it I kept doing the mouse scroll wheel and getting annoyed it took a little training but now I like it a lot.

Think this weekend I'll try and install the RTM version and make it official.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By nikon133 on 10/2/2012 5:25:11 PM , Rating: 4
Or you can right-click on Start Screen corner (low-left).

Uber-geek menu will give you following options:

Programs and Features
Power Options
Event Viewer
System
Device Manager
Disk Management
Computer Management
Command Prompt
Command Prompt (Admin)
Task Manager
Control Panel
File Explorer
Search
Run
Desktop

I don't know if there are pre-requirements (part of domain, local admin rights..?) or if this menu is always there... but it is brilliant.

I know this is completely personal opinion, but: I'd rather upgrade my home Pc to Win 8, than downgrade my office PC back to Win 7.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By Belard on 10/2/2012 6:37:44 PM , Rating: 2
Like... WOW. A "touch based" UI that requires a keyboard to bloody use. Do you see the logic in this?

So what worked fine before with a mouse, now requires a keyboard, mouse and maybe touch screen?

This is why Windows8 = fail. Its a crappy design.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By nafhan on 10/2/2012 11:35:46 AM , Rating: 1
quote:
For people running Windows 7, there's no reason to format and install Windows 8 unless you have a touchscreen AIO PC. Windows 7 is fine for most vanilla PCs.
Exactly. Windows 8 really just isn't aimed at upgraders, it'll be most useful for new systems (especially touchscreens and tablets), and I think that's fine. I do think, however, that Metro apps will start becoming the norm at some point, and Win 7 users will probably want to upgrade then. That point is years away, and probably will coincide with the release of Windows 9.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By dark matter on 10/2/2012 11:39:14 AM , Rating: 2
All of your applications work on Windows 7.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By kmmatney on 10/2/2012 4:04:18 PM , Rating: 2
The built-in email App is terrible on the desktop...Holy cow! Lots of wasted space, and you have to go a loooong way to select and then delete a message. totally made for tablets, but terrible on a desktop with 24" screen.


By inighthawki on 10/2/2012 6:05:23 PM , Rating: 2
Then don't use it?


By NellyFromMA on 10/2/2012 1:00:56 PM , Rating: 2
Honestly, I think this is effectively MS's silent approach. They have THE best desktop OS hands down in Win 7. It's indisputable even. Why would they REALLY have to (once again) shove another desktop OS down our throats that we DONT EVEN NEED.

They never said they aren't selling Win 7 anymore. If you have it, you don't get it taken away. The WPF/SVG design language isn't going away going forward.

Truth is, Win 7 is NOT GOOD ON MOBILE DEVICES. They tried, they failed.

So, why not make the best mobile OS? They tried, I'm betting the scuceeeded. No one has ANYTHING negative to say about Win8 as a mobile OS. Rave reviews actually.

So guess what? Now MS has the BEST DESKTOP OS (Win 7) and the best mobile OS soon-to-be IMO any many others (Win 8).

Sounds like a win strategy to me. Why peoples heads implode on this topic is beyond me.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By martyrant on 10/2/2012 11:10:29 AM , Rating: 2
I do hate the new start menu, but it's a lot less annoying when you have multiple monitors which allows you to use the new start menu minimally.

That said, the improvements in cold boots, restarts, time to sleep and time to wake, memory handling, task manager, file transfers, etc. are much better in Windows 8 than they were in Windows 7.

I still think they should give the user the option to use the old style start menu as the new one is simply a pain in the ass most of the time. Almost everything else I can use just like Windows 7, except the start menu.

Also, launching items from the Start Menu creates like a "Virtual Window" for that program, which is also annoying when you have multiple monitors because there's no reason for Chrome to be isolated when I constantly have it open on one of my 4 monitors.

WTB ORIGINAL START MENU M$, otherwise, you did a pretty good job.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By jjlj on 10/2/2012 11:15:58 AM , Rating: 2
If I could have a tablet with the start menu on it and the monitor connected to the HTPC be strictly a desktop that would be killer.

My computer only goes to sleep and is rebooted very rarely.

I would be ok with windows 8 start screen / tiles if I could specify that when I hit the windows key that the desktop come up as opposed to the start screen. I already pin my frequently used programs and hardly ever go into the control panel or anywhere else so I don't use the start menu much with win 7 as it is.


By martyrant on 10/2/2012 11:56:38 AM , Rating: 2
I don't know what your Windows key does, but mine either brings up the Start Menu if I'm at the desktop or if I tap it while at the Start Menu it brings me to my desktop...so...have you ever tried your windows key at all?


By NellyFromMA on 10/2/2012 1:02:48 PM , Rating: 2
Word on the street is Win 8 tablets can interface with Win 8 PC and be used as the start menu. It's a very interesting synergy I'm hoping to hear more on soon.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By kmmatney on 10/2/2012 3:59:07 PM , Rating: 2
I'm sort of glad they didn't have the start menu, as I would have never tried "ClassicShell" if they did. ClassicShell is an opensource program which gives you a start Meni in Windows 8, and best of all you can choose the style - Windows 7, Vista, or even Windows XP. I use the Windows XP style, as it lets me find and launch programs much faster than the newer start menus. It a really nice, unbloated, piece of software.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By nikon133 on 10/2/2012 5:11:40 PM , Rating: 2
I agree with you on everything, except that I don't mind new start menu. I simply accepted that Start Screen is Start menu, and right-click/all apps button on start screen is All Programs on Win 7 start menu.

I have installed Win 8 on my work PC as soon as it became available to partners. Took me an hour to get used to it (I did an upgrade so all the apps were already there, including taksbar shortcuts etc.), and had a smooth ride ever since. Re start screen, I've configured "Metro" Mail, People, Messages... for my personal email and FB account - work account is on Outlook - and like how I can check new personal emails, FB updates etc by just opening Start Screen. Plus, right-click on lower-left corner is a gift from heaven.

My office desktop cold-boots in 21 seconds, 10 of which is pre-boot (post screen etc.). Awesome.

And have I mentioned right-click on Start Screen corner? Brilliant.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By OoklaTheMok on 10/2/2012 12:43:07 PM , Rating: 2
Are you serious? I had zero problem adjusting the DPI in Windows 8. It's done the same way is in Win 7. I am running with large, easy to read tiles on my 47" from about 12' away @1920x1080.

All I can say is that you must not doing it right.

Once you get it going, the big tiles on a tv are brilliant! Metro visually scales so well.

WMC is still around, but it needs to be revamped for the Windows 8 "Metro" style, include an improved programming model and get content partners onboard. But I doubt that we will see that since XBOX is the preferred media hub.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By jjlj on 10/2/2012 1:52:00 PM , Rating: 2
I honestly couldn't get the text on the tiles to scale. It always stayed the same. I may have to give it another go. I'll load it as a VM and just play with it more.


By TakinYourPoints on 10/2/2012 11:13:36 PM , Rating: 2
You're correct, scaling in Windows 8 hasn't improved: http://techreport.com/review/23631/how-windows-8-s...

This really surprised me, I thought they would have started to catch up with OS X and iOS in this regard, especially since tablets are going to have higher and higher DPI going forward.

Perhaps this is why the Surface has such low resolution for a tablet, so that text and images render properly given the limitations of the OS.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By NellyFromMA on 10/2/2012 12:51:09 PM , Rating: 2
Seeing as how Windows 8 is geared towards something arguably complete different than the PCs currently running Windows 7, I think its kind of like comparing oranges and grapes. It's a totally different measuring stick I'd say. Maybe compare the switch from Dos to Win 3.1?


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By kmmatney on 10/2/2012 4:01:58 PM , Rating: 1
I hardly see it that way. I've been using Windows 8 a little bit, and it just seems like Windows 7, with a new "not-Metro" start screen, and no start menu. Once you run a desktop App, it goes into desktop mode, and looks exactly like Windows 7, but without Aero (at least for me). There are some improvements overall, but it's just Win 7 with a new, unavoidable, start screen.


RE: Because it is terrible, IMO...
By Moishe on 10/3/2012 4:22:13 PM , Rating: 2
I agree that WMC is a big loss. I won't upgrade my desktop until I get a decent WMC replacement. Period. I don't own a TV, and I use my PC for everything except BluRay. Maybe that's a niche, but it's a niche I like.


will windows 9 be the same?
By lolmuly on 10/2/2012 10:37:00 AM , Rating: 3
microsoft's decisions as of late make me fear that 15 years from now the only option for enterprise will be linux.... that really sucks.

I'm not incapable of writing my own linux drivers, but I'm lazy and prefer not to...




RE: will windows 9 be the same?
By damianrobertjones on 10/2/2012 10:57:02 AM , Rating: 1
Or we can update the Group Policy templates like we've been doing for a long time and lock the new interface into a business fashion.

It's business as usual with Windows 8 and nothing has been taken away.


RE: will windows 9 be the same?
By StevoLincolnite on 10/2/2012 11:29:20 AM , Rating: 4
quote:
It's business as usual with Windows 8 and nothing has been taken away.


Except... Gadgets, Aero (Which I like the look of personally!), Start Menu (Meh. Doesn't bother me.), removal of DVD codecs, Media Center is now a downloadable program if you have the Pro version or higher, DVD maker is gone, Blue-screens of death show allot less information...

For dual-booters, the ability to directly boot into another OS besides Windows 8 is slowed down because the new Windows 8 boot shell/loader reboots to load the other operating system.

Internet Explorer won't run in a pure 64-bit mode unless enhanced protected mode is enabled which disables your addons, otherwise tabs are 32bit.

You are also no longer told when new updates are available when on the Desktop, you have to check manually or go into Metro which can be a security risk.

The Ribben interface actually removes allot of options and features like Compatibility Files, View Remote Printers etc and others for special folders and namespace extensions and is much much more difficult to use with only just a keyboard.

The "Compatibility" option for an application's properties does not include "Windows 2000" and "Windows NT 4.0" options anymore.

So yes, some things have been taken away, mostly of which are unimportant in the business world.

However, I intend to throw Windows 7 on all my systems except for my main gaming rig running Eyefinity, Metro' just isn't as efficient on the desktop as the Windows GUI, you can't run several dozen programs and have them spread around your screens in positions you want.

Also that built in email App? Take a look at the wasted space that could have been used to actually make it useful in metro.

Just remember though, companies listen to money not consumers, so if Windows 8 isn't a big hit, they may just throw metro out the Window when Windows 9 comes along and keep Metro in it's mobile SKU's like Tablets, Phones etc'.


By damianrobertjones on 10/2/2012 11:49:19 AM , Rating: 2
Good points there.


RE: will windows 9 be the same?
By FastEddieLB on 10/2/2012 11:59:21 AM , Rating: 2
Uh, what? Aero is still there last I checked, I don't know what you're talking about.

The rest is true though.


RE: will windows 9 be the same?
By inighthawki on 10/2/2012 6:09:50 PM , Rating: 2
He was referring to glass, a common mistake that a lot of people make because it was more often than not referred to as Aero to distinguish the themes in Vista/7 - Aero vs Aero Lite.


RE: will windows 9 be the same?
By Pirks on 10/2/12, Rating: -1
By StevoLincolnite on 10/2/2012 12:57:02 PM , Rating: 2
Gadgets are dead to me when I stop using them, I find them highly useful, especially the notepad gadget.

Secondly, I don't stream movies because that costs me money, here in Australia we have Data caps on all our internet connections if you didn't know.
Besides, I like to have a Physical copy of all my movies and games, anything wrong with that? Nope, my choice though.

I did mention Media center was available as a download, but I shouldn't have to download it or even repeat that I mentioned it to begin with.

I haven't had a Blue-screen with Windows 7 or 8 yet, however when the time comes, it would be nice to be able to have all the information available so I can diagnose it.

As for using that homophobic insult... Grow up, Pirks.


RE: will windows 9 be the same?
By GoodBytes on 10/2/2012 12:36:03 PM , Rating: 2
I agree fully with you, and to add:

No more XP Mode.
Well you have Hyper-V, but you need a Windows XP license. That means businesses or school which are forced to use some old software that isn't updated (no newer version exists), can make Win8 switch difficult.

Personally, the Start Screen I like a lot. And XP Mode, I really don't care.


RE: will windows 9 be the same?
By Moishe on 10/3/2012 4:30:41 PM , Rating: 2
Agreed completely. I understand the need for action in the tablet space. I agree with it and expect it... but I expect the interface on top of Windows to be selectable to fit the working mode.

MS actually does a good job of innovating, so I think the evolution will be successful. It will just take time.


Does not surprise me
By Chriz on 10/2/2012 11:15:07 AM , Rating: 4
This information does not surprise me at all. There is just not as much incentive for people to upgrade to Win 8 as there was to Win 7. I know a lot of techies like Win 8, but there are also just as many that do not like it. This was not the case for Windows 7. Personally, I think Microsoft made a big mistake by forcing the touch screen UI (Metro) on desktops and laptops. That interface is just way more cumbersome when you're using a keyboard and mouse. They made an even bigger mistake by removing the start menu and the ability to boot to desktop.

If you think there's a lot of unhappiness about Win 8 now, wait until your average user starts working with it. I think it is going to fail, big time. I just hope MS realizes their mistake and fixes things.




RE: Does not surprise me
By Snoop on 10/2/2012 11:39:06 AM , Rating: 2
Like you stated, all that would need to be changed to make Windows 8 a success would be the ability to boot directly to desktop and re-add the start menu.

MS is attempting to force users into their new paradigm in hopes that it will make them more likely to purchase an MS phone or tablet. It will be interesting to see if it works.


RE: Does not surprise me
By Ammohunt on 10/2/2012 2:12:09 PM , Rating: 2
I agree, but if they did that no one other than users of touch screen interface users would use the new windows 8 interface.
Looking back i was running Windows 7 RC for months before it was released i couldn't get off XP fast enough at work Windows 7 hands down the best OS Microsoft has ever released. For me there are way more negative to moving to Windows 8 mainly due to the parity between Microsoft operating systems and Gnome/KDE linux close enough that i have recently started the process to relegate Windows 7 to play games and handle iTunes media only. While my day to day computing needs will be handled by Fedora Core.


RE: Does not surprise me
By damianrobertjones on 10/2/2012 11:39:39 AM , Rating: 1
"That interface is just way more cumbersome when you're using a keyboard and mouse. T" - I and the other four, so far, testers have no issue with the new interface while using K/m


RE: Does not surprise me
By Chriz on 10/2/2012 11:56:16 AM , Rating: 3
You may have no issue with it, but doing various tasks in Win 8 using Metro is slower than doing the same tasks in Win 7. The UI does not make things easier with k/m, with the exception of search.


RE: Does not surprise me
By inighthawki on 10/2/2012 6:15:30 PM , Rating: 1
That's a silly point. Windows 8 still has a fully functional desktop environment, so using the excuse that "performing task <x> in metro on a keyboard and mouse is slower than on Windows 7" is just completely ignoring the other ways to do it. You're imposing an artificial restriction on how you perform that task for the purpose of complaining about metro.


RE: Does not surprise me
By Snoop on 10/2/2012 11:58:49 AM , Rating: 2
I have no 'issues' with the new interface other than it does not work as well for what I do on my computer. I do not need anything to be full screen ever. Especially something which was as simple as the start button.

I have spent enough time testing windows 8 to know that the majority of the UI changes were not intended for me. It is frustrating as it looks like the core of the OS has been polished and would be a nice upgrade if not for the UI.


RE: Does not surprise me
By Moishe on 10/3/2012 4:33:45 PM , Rating: 2
Agreed! With Win 7 being such a great OS, Win 8 will have a harder time against it.

I feel like Microsoft should adopt the Intel tick-tock concept with incremental updates every year and only major changes every 3+ years.


Show me a Win 8 feature that means anything
By zlandar on 10/2/2012 12:19:39 PM , Rating: 2
As someone who uses Win 7 for browsing, gaming, and HTPC use Win 8 offers nothing.

Might as well call it Win 7 Me.




RE: Show me a Win 8 feature that means anything
By corduroygt on 10/2/2012 12:27:58 PM , Rating: 2
Faster, gorgeous file copy interface, better task manager are just a few that comes to my mind.


By Milliamp on 10/2/2012 3:46:06 PM , Rating: 2
I will spot you the task manager thing but there were 3rd party task managers available for wind 7 that are nearly as good. The new task manager seems like it borrows some functionality from Sysinternals (A company MS acquired) Process Explorer.


RE: Show me a Win 8 feature that means anything
By MrBungle123 on 10/2/2012 9:24:20 PM , Rating: 2
Moving from Windows 7 to Windows 8 is like trading in a perfectly good 2009 car for a 2012 car that has no doors...

too many negatives to make up for the few extra gadgets they tacked onto the dash...


RE: Show me a Win 8 feature that means anything
By corduroygt on 10/2/2012 9:32:05 PM , Rating: 2
Have you used it? I used to be prejudiced about windows 8 before I installed it as well.


RE: Show me a Win 8 feature that means anything
By MrBungle123 on 10/2/2012 9:39:47 PM , Rating: 2
Yes, and it made me want to vomit. That interface has no business on anything with a display over 13" or that is not a touch screen...

To add to the whole touch thing, its fine on my smart phone, or on a slate, but keep your greasy fingers off my computer monitor.


RE: Show me a Win 8 feature that means anything
By corduroygt on 10/3/2012 12:35:03 AM , Rating: 2
Interesting, I used it on a notebook connected to a large external monitor and have no issues with it. I use the metro screen as a shortcut for launching programs and could not care less about metro apps, so it works fine for me.


By MrBungle123 on 10/3/2012 1:33:47 AM , Rating: 2
Its too in your face, I could deal with it if it only took up say.. 1/4 of the monitor, at least then I wouldn't feel like I had to give it all my attention... although it has such low information density that it would probably be useless for anything but the search at that size.

The fact is that MS is doing what they are doing not because metro is a superior desktop interface (its not) what it is is a way for them to cram their app store down the throats of the windows user base. They are hoping to get a 30% cut of all software sales on PCs and if metro is a big hit Windows 9 will probably have an even more crippled version of the desktop than windows 8.


Unhappy or Happy
By Misty Dingos on 10/2/2012 10:43:22 AM , Rating: 4
This is pretty simple to understand. If you are a corporate client of MS operating systems you don't change unless it benefits you.

In the highly regulated and software integrated pharma sector there are many companies still using XP. No benefit to upgrade to Vista or Win 7. Windows 8 with its catchy interface is going to leave this sector cold. And if the new OS can't be used with validated software without rework and revalidation it will simply not be used until there is no other option.

Windows 8 is so obviously different the only place it will get adopted is day care centers. Its eye catching colors and playful interface will be a big hit there.




RE: Unhappy or Happy
By damianrobertjones on 10/2/2012 11:01:24 AM , Rating: 1
Maybe the 'Pharma' business sectors will learn that they can now present their 'facilities' using the new interface and have the rest of the computer locked down via policy.

Thing of the advantages AS WELL as the negatives.


RE: Unhappy or Happy
By tastyratz on 10/2/2012 11:32:46 AM , Rating: 2
there are always new features and advantages in a newer version of msos. Difference here is that the cost to recertify applications with legal and medical implications will far outweigh the benefits of upgrading.
Windows 8 brings far less to the table than windows 7. Microsoft always seems to gather an every other release upgrade cycle on major upgrades typically by users. Win 7 is a BIG upgrade to xp. win 8 is NOT to win 7.
Win 7 really brought a lot to the table vs xp without the problems and stigma of vista. With microsoft's new micro release plan dare I say we might see 3 generation skips?

The only reason many companies ditch xp at all is new hardware support as well as security patching support schedules.
We have an interesting road ahead


RE: Unhappy or Happy
By ctodd on 10/2/2012 1:42:22 PM , Rating: 2
I work at a government agency with an ms enterprise agreement and we have already decided to skip Windows 8 entirely! We're usually on top of all the updated software, but Windows 8 is a no go. I'm hoping the metro fad dies soon. I've switched to VS 2012 which uses metro as well and although it is a better tool, the metro theme is crap.


Windows 8 is fine for me
By corduroygt on 10/2/2012 11:09:14 AM , Rating: 2
I have the RTM installed and it's a better OS than windows 7. I do not even like Microsoft that much but Windows 8 runs so much faster than Windows 7.

And right clicking on the bottom left corner made me forget about the start menu instantly.




RE: Windows 8 is fine for me
By damianrobertjones on 10/2/2012 11:10:40 AM , Rating: 2
Yep! I'm constantly amazed at the negativity towards Windows 8.


RE: Windows 8 is fine for me
By corduroygt on 10/2/2012 11:24:22 AM , Rating: 2
I hated it before trying it as well, not to mention there's always a way to add the start menu back if you want. I didn't bother to add it on mine.


RE: Windows 8 is fine for me
By Trisped on 10/2/2012 8:50:45 PM , Rating: 2
If you use it for a day or two on an x86/x64 device the reasons will become clear.

For the few steps forward, they took some major steps backwards. I do not think anyone would have minded the start screen if they had left the start menu in. If they had provided the start screen with truly equivalent functionality (in addition to the features the start screen brings) I would not mind the change.

There are a number of advantages to Windows 8 over 7, it is just that productivity and ease of use take major hits.


By Maximilian on 10/2/2012 11:48:43 AM , Rating: 2
Im sticking with 7 for now but if this crap UI is all MS has to offer then maybe 5 years down the road ill switch over to ubuntu, all the games i play are platinum or gold rated in WINE anyways so they should work without too many problems.

Metro can suck it lol.




By damianrobertjones on 10/2/2012 11:51:00 AM , Rating: 2
So... for how long did you use the new interface?

Please don't lie :)


By Milliamp on 10/2/2012 3:43:22 PM , Rating: 2
I've been using it for several months. I don't like it.


By OoklaTheMok on 10/2/2012 1:09:11 PM , Rating: 2
If you think Windows 8 is only about the "Metro" UI, then you are sadly mistaken. Take a look at the "Building Windows 8" series where numerous features and improvements, unrelated to Metro, are detailed.


Still on XP, unfortunately
By edge929 on 10/2/2012 10:50:49 AM , Rating: 4
The Fortune 25 company I work for is still riding high on XP. My particular IT division (400) within the company had to get an exception to use Windows 7 for our programming needs, 64-bit and 8GB of RAM to run JVM/JBOSS. We could have gone XP 64-bit but the backwards compatibility wasn't as good as Windows 7 for our usual apps. My wife who works elsewhere in the company is still rocking XP as is 90% of the company. Supposedly there is a plan in motion to upgrade to Windows 7 but they're obviously in no hurry.




RE: Still on XP, unfortunately
By chmilz on 10/2/2012 1:37:18 PM , Rating: 3
That's exactly it. Windows 7 is good and it works, so there's no mega rush to 8 regardless of what the individual view is of the operating system.

There won't be mass adoption of another version of Windows until there's a feature that absolutely must be had, or 7 simply gets too long in the tooth, like XP did.


LOL! Win8 = FAIL
By Belard on 10/2/2012 7:35:47 PM , Rating: 3
MS can boast all they want...

Windows 8 = failure.
Finally, MS has found a way to make a pirate-proof version of Windows! I'm about to do my next build, after 3 years of my current Win7/Core2 setup. I could do the $40 upgrade licence using my old retail XP... but since I have Win8 on a notebook I still can't find much of anything to like about it. My only option is the $140 Win7Pro OEM.

Boot up times.. yeah, they are super-fast, but so what? I'm at 15s with Win7 using an SSD. I rarely every reboot the PC. Sleep mode works. The new Task manager, Explorer, file-copy/delete windows are very very nice. I *REALLY* want them... but.

I hate metro, I hate the charms bar, I hate the useless Start Screen (if Start Menu was so un-used, why make a full-screen version of it?!) with it useless tiles. Hey, if you are on your start screen where is your battery, clock and other info... oh yeah, its on the log-off screen or desktop. really good... not. And on top of that, MS made the Desktop as UGLY and bland as possible. 1987 era skin-job.

Win8 = not worth $1.

Now... how long before someone makes a Win8 style "copy progress window"? There is already a way to add the UP button for explorer...




RE: LOL! Win8 = FAIL
By MrBungle123 on 10/2/2012 9:35:28 PM , Rating: 3
Windows 8 actually got me to spend a lot of money on microsoft products...

I purchased 4 copies of the retail edition of Windows 7 Ultimate off Amazon recently for around $1000 which should allow me to completely avoid Windows 8 all together and upgrade my PCs as many times as I need to while keeping everything legal...


Not surprising at all
By siconik on 10/2/2012 12:06:29 PM , Rating: 3
Regardless of the merits of Win8 (or the lack thereof), the simple fact of the matter is most companies I deal with have just begrudgingly started their XP->Win7 upgrade cycle having held off on Vista. One CFO told me that straight up that XP was the best investment they made and he is looking for many years of Win7 usage. That coupled with the fact that Win7 is very highly regarded will result in much slower Win8 uptake rates. Those looking to bury Win8 will seize on any numbers that seem to support their point, but the slopes of these charts has a lot more to do with economics of IT procurement cycles than whether the new OS is a failure or not.




RE: Not surprising at all
By nedsand on 10/2/2012 4:33:43 PM , Rating: 2
If it wasn't for new hardware with quadcore processors we would be in the same boat. We still have a good percentage that will stay on XP until we can kill our Novel system. Prior to our 7 roll out we upgraded to SCCM for imaging and I love it.


Windows 8 needs to fall on it's face
By Motoman on 10/2/2012 11:09:37 AM , Rating: 1
Microsoft needs to learn that putting the Metrosexual interface on a desktop/laptop OS is simply butt-slappingly stupid.

They need to take a massive hit in the P&L on this one and hopefully learn a lesson.




RE: Windows 8 needs to fall on it's face
By damianrobertjones on 10/2/2012 11:38:38 AM , Rating: 2
Did you overlook the many posts from people on here and other forums that do actually like Windows 8?


By Motoman on 10/2/2012 3:14:05 PM , Rating: 1
Many people think "new" is necessarily better than "old."

And there's at least an equal, if not larger, number of people who think it's a stupid idea.

Ultimately sales figures will tell.

Personally, I'm hoping MS eats it big time.


Microsoft's direction
By hood6558 on 10/2/2012 11:28:17 AM , Rating: 2
However one feels about Microsoft, they are an integral part of our culture now, and their decisions affect millions of people. That means they must weigh every major decision carefully and to the benefit of the majority of users. They also have to be a leader, to take us in new directions we hadn't considered, without alienating the ones who resist change. It's not an easy task, and whenever MS is perceived as less than perfect, the haters come out of the woodwork for another round of abuse. Windows 8 has many new features that make it better than it's predecessor, and a couple things that make it different and confusing to new users who are used to XP or 7. MS should perhaps be more open to user criticism, and I think they should at least include a "classic mode" to make it easy to set it up to feel more like Windows 7. The real reason for the slow uptake is probably like the article says, it's not coming after a disastrous failure like Vista, so there's no great rush to upgrade. It's time for them to give everyone exactly what they want; it's not that hard for them to make a slightly different version for desktops, and by doing so they'd gain unprecedented amounts of public approval at a time when it's in short supply. I have been using their products since I bought my first computer, with varying amounts of success and frustration, so I guess I approve of them for the most part or I wouldn't still be using their OS's. There's always room for improvement, though.




RE: Microsoft's direction
By damianrobertjones on 10/2/2012 11:42:16 AM , Rating: 2
It's only a matter of time before OSX moves towards the same type of interface. In all honesty it's already on the way... .


No way.
By dark matter on 10/2/2012 11:34:17 AM , Rating: 2
Might be the reason that Windows 8 is absolute shit on a desktop PC.

Oh, and enough of people telling me I'm wrong and "just don't get it" and I'm stuck in my ways, and I'll get used to it.

Bollocks. There is enough people who with agree with me to say YOU ARE WRONG.

Now do one. And take your POS Windows 8 with you.




RE: No way.
By damianrobertjones on 10/2/2012 11:41:28 AM , Rating: 2
There might be people that will agree and there are people that don't. Neither are correct or equally wrong.

Your post shows the kind of person that you may or may not be.


nah
By damianrobertjones on 10/2/2012 10:54:20 AM , Rating: 2
"Windows 8 is winning over fewer early adopters than its predecessor"

In all honesty a whole load of Vista owners wanted off of that platform whereas now we're in a different situation. Change can take time and there's a whole load of people out there that simply cannot think for themselves. Give Windows 8 time and along with new hardware it'll catch on.

After all you can either go Apple (Which a lot of youngsters are doing anyway) or Linux/Ubuntu.

The choice is yours




Not a reason to pre-adopt
By Lonyo on 10/2/2012 12:05:52 PM , Rating: 2
I pre-ordered Win7 when it was getting ready to be released.

I have no pre ordered Windows 8.
Why? Nothing to do with Windows 8.

I wanted Windows 7 for my existing computer.

I want Windows 8. But I also want a new computer to go with it, with a touchscreen.
I can't pre-order Windows 8 because the devices for which I want to use it aren't available either.

In many ways Windows 7 is good enough for 90%.
For some of the sort of people who might have early adopted Windows 7, they might also be waiting for a Windows 8 device, rather than upgrading their Windows 7 device to Windows 8 without necessarily gaining all that much from doing so.




It's out?
By Lochness22 on 10/2/2012 12:33:01 PM , Rating: 2
Windows 8 is out? Awesome marketing campaign Microsoft!




By GatoRat on 10/2/2012 12:42:26 PM , Rating: 2
Last week, I was able to play with Windows 8 on a pure touch system. It supports my view that touch and non-touch interfaces are so drastically different they should only be mixed where everything is custom designed and even then you'll always compromise one of the UI types.

Metro seemed to work well with a pure touch, but it was a pain otherwise. Microsoft has pushed metro into web pages and other places and I dislike it everywhere I have to use it. So I avoid doing so, which is only hurting Microsoft.




By Roffles on 10/2/2012 1:30:38 PM , Rating: 2
I'm personally holding out for the Surface Pro...or at least the opportunity to play with a demo unit. There hasn't been many stellar reviews for new ultrabooks and notebooks that would be using win8 (usually any one or a combination of a sub par screen resolution, bad tracking pad, bad keyboard, some other random design flaw and/or poorly chosen hardware).

All I'm really certain of is that I've seen enough videos on youtube of experienced people proficiently using win8 on a touch screen and it's obviously more advanced and functional than win7 as a whole. To hear people whining about losing the start menu and not accepting the new UI is pretty sad. Get over it...technology changes and so must you!




Why is this news?
By Concillian on 10/2/2012 1:49:41 PM , Rating: 2
Win 7 followed the Press nightmare of Vista... people actaully wanted a new OS... they were ready for it. Those who had not yet tried Vista were looking at Win7 as their first 64 bit OS. Directx11 too. It had features people wanted.

Win 8 has... a UI that people don't want and... uh...

uh...

You can make it work mostly like Win 7 if you use desktop mode! Seriously, the best argument I've seen to use Win 8 is that you can make it like Win 7 if you don't like Metro.

OOOokay... sounds like a good reason to hand a hundred bucks to Microsoft.




Good
By augiem on 10/2/2012 1:53:35 PM , Rating: 2
Thank God. Maybe people with brains will prevail for once.




I hate windows 8
By Milliamp on 10/2/2012 2:43:22 PM , Rating: 2
I just wanted to say that I have been using windows 8 for a while and I hate it.




It's a tablet OS
By BifurcatedBoat on 10/2/2012 8:36:45 PM , Rating: 2
Probably a pretty decent tablet OS, from the look of it, but a tablet OS nonetheless. Why would you want to put it on a desktop computer? Metro doesn't even have windows. Everything is full-screen. Irony in product naming, isn't it?

How does this fit onto my desktop where I actually want to increase the number of screens I have soon, so that I can display more windows at the same time for more productivity? It doesn't.




kindergarden OS
By cyberserf on 10/3/2012 5:56:13 AM , Rating: 2
so is this OS made for 1st graders or kindergartners?
LOL
just look at the new logo. real smart.
How the mighty have fallen.
I bet a lot of this crap has to do with MS outsourcing their programmers.




Metro
By blzd on 10/3/2012 3:19:28 PM , Rating: 2
I love the metro interface on my phone, it works great and the live tiles make complete sense.

I hate the idea of the metro start screen, and it is pretty obviously designed to create a closed ecosystem for which MS can take a cut, and an attempt to shut out 3rd party systems such as Steam.

Live tiles on the desktop would still be great though, why can't we just have better shortcuts with Live Tile abilities?




pos
By p05esto on 10/2/2012 5:15:04 PM , Rating: 1
I would rather run Apple OS than Win8 (and I freaking hate Apple). Win8 UI is just horrible and stupid, it hurts my brain to think someone thought that was a good idea.

Why force people into computer grade school? I don't want that stupid ass start screen, I want one-click access to my desktop apps. Take all that other BS and stick it!




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