quote: And on the other hand you have an overwhelmed and incompetent Patent Office, which issues patents on absurd things such as the right to manufacture a thin rectangular tablet with one button or flipping your finger across a device...
quote: What is "unreasonable" FRAND charge?
quote: why do you feel it's fine to simply take and use something ESSENTIAL to mobile phones and not pay anything because you don't agree with the price because you think it's not "fair"
quote: at the same time sue you're competition for really petty and pathetic patents that are NON-ESSENTIAL, such a shape, number of buttons, etc.
quote: Motorola was attempting to force Apple to pay ABOVE FRAND RATES (in their own words) for the FRAND patents, and seeking to ban their products if Apple didn't pay.
quote: If you're saying that the patents Apple has are non-essential, then they can easily be worked around, and thus no ban should happen provided the competition is innovative enough.
quote: It's absolutely bizarre that you don't see that seeking to ban devices over FRAND patents is simply illegal, and logically or morally clearly far far worse than protecting your normal patents.
quote: In direct retaliation of Apple attempting to have all Motorola smartphones under the sun banned for imitating basic design principles of iPhones.
quote: If banning something with FRAND is ridiculous, what do you call Apple getting everyone else banned via design patents?
quote: Pot, meet kettle.
quote: quote: If you're saying that the patents Apple has are non-essential, then they can easily be worked around, and thus no ban should happen provided the competition is innovative enough. Epic logic fail.
quote: Apple can simply move the goal posts and sue them for trying to be slightly different.
quote: Every Apple patent has lots of prior art.
quote: provided said patents are valid (which I wont provide any opinion on )
quote: Apple thinks it invented everything, thus everything, down to very broad and widespread tech used daily by pre-historic humans, can only be created by Apple.
quote: You create something and file a patent on it? Nope, Apple copies what you know, wraps it with fancy marketing and legalese, and sues YOU for violating their new patent - which, ironically, is a direct derivative of your own work.
quote: Apple using obvious, overly-broad design patents to sue others is simply illegal. Argue away, tester-Swash, you will never win.
quote: It is quite simply outrageous that you think that a completely distinct and separate legal case can IN ANY SITUATION justify FRAND abuse. Here's a top tip for you - it DOESN'T.
quote: Once again, it is quite simply outrageous that despite my very clear, concise explanation above to this very question
quote: that you still just don't get it
quote: Design patents, on the other hand, which are every bit as valid have NO SUCH OBLIGATIONS WHATSOEVER.
quote: I'm struggling to understand how anyone can be so stupid not to realise that it's easier to workaround non-essential patents.
quote: It's simply a logical fact.
quote: Um.... no? Do you know how patents work? The patent is the patent. Whatever you filed for, and had approved, is where the 'goalposts' are fixed. If anyone does something in a different way, it isn't covered by the patent.
quote: While this sentence has no basis in fact whatsoever and is merely your irrelevant opinion, it also doesn't address a single claim I made.
quote: Simply nonsense.
quote: If I've got a patent, I'm already protected so nobody can copy. Similarly, you can't successfully file for a patent if there is already an existing patent for the same thing.
quote: What actually did happen is that Apple patented technology which hadn't been patented by anyone , after they developed it, and they proceeded to sue people who infringed upon that patent after it was filed.
quote: Thus, any successful patent or court case must by definition, NOT be illegal. Thus your sentence, while true, is completely irrelevant since it's not what is happening.
quote: Ritualm, meet monkey.
quote: So how do you justify Apple suing people left and right with design patents? Except you can't. You are already intoxicated by that cyanide-flavored Apple Kool-Aid to see the difference.
quote: Bullshit. Design patents are so overly broad, they can be applied on anything and everything. Getting Galaxy Tabs banned just because it's a tablet... that looks like a tablet. Gee, why haven't we banned every television screen out there? They all use inch-thick bezels, exactly what is being used on the iPad!
quote: What exactly are these workarounds? Do something different than Apple, thus ensuring they will fail commercially?
quote: Yes I do know how they work. You don't. Apple's patent filings are so vague and ambiguous, they leave a lot to interpretation. Hence the goal posts.
quote: What valid patents? Design patents? Those are invalid.
quote: But keep arguing they are valid because you could not afford to lose arguments.
quote: provided said patents are valid (which I wont provide any opinion on )
quote: 1 - Sony did a wedge design on some of their laptops but did not file a patent on it. They don't see a need for it. 2 - Apple made their Macbook Airs look like a wedge and wanted to patent that. 3 - What are they gonna do next? Of course, sue every manufacturer under the sun for violating the wedge design patent! 4 - You cannot make something look like a wedge because it is patented by Apple. 5 - You cannot make something with beveled edges because it is patented by Apple. 6 - You cannot make something with rounded rectangles and inch-thick bezels because it is patented by Apple. 7 - Of course you think these are perfectly valid patents because Tim Cook says "Do or else". Apple plays as a victim when it is actually a bully. Copy features directly out of Android and call them "invented by Apple", but Google doing the same and you sue them for piracy.
quote: Wrong, as Apple has already proven otherwise with its COPYCAT patents.
quote: What actually did happen is that Apple patented technology which had ALREADY been patented by someone else , and they proceeded to sue people who infringed upon that copycat patent after it was filed.
quote: Admission of guilt - you have confessed that whatever Apple's been doing in court is illegal. Therefore, what I said is completely relevant since it's what is happening.
quote: They didn't fail to keep up with Apple.
quote: Apple simply took all the patents and ideas from those companies, either claimed them for itself, or simply used the essential technology without paying (claiming it was fair to pay).
quote: It's worth remembering that Apple had never been in the phone industry before the iPhone. When it released that, it did so on the shoulders of all those before it.
quote: What people fail to understand is that Apple is in no way "innovative", "cutting edge" or "the standard". What they are is by far the best marketing company the world has ever seen. It's reached the point where even intelligent IT people get sucked into it.
quote: but trying to reduce the drama of this period of transformation to simple stereotypes of evil and good, or to stubbornly refuse to see why Apple is crushing everyone means you cannot ask the important questions or even contemplate the interesting answers.
quote: In some places what you just said is reason enough for me to drill a hole into your temple and fill it with battery acid.
quote: Apple's primary innovation to the industry = prevent everyone from producing anything with rounded rectangles, beveled edges, capacitive multitouch and a who's who of technological features Apple never invented.
quote: It's reached the point where even intelligent IT people get sucked into it.