backtop


Print 80 comment(s) - last by DeluxeTea.. on Jan 27 at 2:28 AM

Verizon takes a loss, but grows customer base, solidifying its #1 spot

Maybe Sprint Nextel Corp.'s (Sbold iPhone gamble wasn't such a bad idea after all.  At a time when many predicted Apple, Inc. (AAPL) to be fading in the smartphone race after getting outsold by Samsung Electronics Comp., Ltd.'s (KS:005930) slick Android handsets, Apple surged back with the launch of the iPhone 4S and its iconic voice-controlled assistant, Siri.  Analyst numbers place Apple in a near dead heat with Android in December U.S. smartphone sales.

And the situation is looking even better for Apple based on the just-announced earnings of Verizon Wireless, the joint venture between Verizon Communications Inc. (VZ) and Vodafone Group Plc. (LON:VOD).  

For Verizon Wireless it was a lukewarm quarter as a pension charge and another one-time expense brought a net loss of $2.02B USD ($0.71 USD/share), versus the $1.48B USD profit ($0.52 USD/share) it would have recorded without these charges.  The company did solidify its American lead, adding 1.2 million new contract subscribers (and 1.46m total new subscribers) bringing its total (contract and non-contract) customers to 108.7m and its contract customer base to 87.4m.

Smartphone sales rose from 39 percent in Q3 2011 to 44 percent in Q4 2011.  And the iPhone was king at Verizon.  Of the 7.7m smartphones sold by the carrier in Q4 2011, 4.3m (~55%) were iPhones.  Again, take that figure in -- the iPhone outsold all Android phones combined on America's largest carrier.

iPhone Lines Verizon
The iPhone remains a top draw at Verizon. [Image Source: Reuters]

Of course Verizon pays more for iPhones that the initial carrier AT&T, Inc. (T) did.  And Sprint is reportedly paying even more -- so maybe it isn't such a good deal, after all.

It's certainly a good deal for Apple, though, who reportedly pulled in almost $600 USD per Verizon iPhone sold, on models that retail for $200 USD with contract.  Verizon is doing its best to recoup this capital expenditure, with a slew of overage fees.  Reportedly the average iPhone bill on Verizon was around $100 USD with all the taxes and fees added [source].  Verizon likely pockets $80 of this, meaning that it will haul in $1,920 over the duration of a contract.  But it has to deal with the significant costs of network upgrades, power use, land use, employee pay, and more.  

Some analysts are convinced that a net profit on an iPhone may be a fatalistic quixotic fantasy.  Sanford Bernstein analyst Craig Moffett says Verizon is following in the line of AT&T in deluding itself that it will someday see a profit, but consistently failing to do so.  He writes, "The earnings pop will always be a year away."

Still, if America's third and fourth largest carriers -- Sprint and Deutsche Telekom AG's (ETR:DTE) T-Mobile USA -- collapse under their respective debt, Verizon and AT&T could soon be able to significantly unilaterally increase contract rates, solving both companies' iPhone profitability dilemma.

T-Mobile iPhone
The collapse of T-Mobile and Sprint -- a possible scenario -- may hold the key to AT&T and Verizon finally profiting off of their expensive iPhone commitments. [Source: T-Mobile]

Apple is also extremely well positioned under such a scenario, given that it's the top selling model at Verizon and likely near the top at AT&T, as well.  The first major test for Apple, though, will be how it responds to the inevitable need to reinvent iOS.  On the one hand it can't sit still as Google Inc. (GOOG) unveils its slick latest Android build, Android 4.0 "Ice Cream Sandwich".  On the other hand, Apple must tread the fine line of avoiding alienating its largely non-technophile customer base with too gaudy an interface.

Android 4.0 Ice Cream Sandwich
Android 4.0 "Ice Cream Sandwich" [Image Source: Google]

For now, though, Apple and its fans can simply savor the thrill of being back near the top of the U.S. smartphone market -- even if challenges await.

Source: Verizon Wireless



Comments     Threshold


This article is over a month old, voting and posting comments is disabled

In Q3, Q4, or both?
By quiksilvr on 1/24/12, Rating: 0
RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By JasonMick (blog) on 1/24/2012 4:37:13 PM , Rating: 4
quote:
4.3 million sold in what time span?

From the piece...
quote:
Smartphone sales rose from 39 percent in Q3 2011 to 44 percent in Q4 2011. And the iPhone was king at Verizon. Of the 7.7m smartphones sold by the carrier in Q4 2011, 4.3m (~55%) were iPhones. Again, take that figure in -- the iPhone outsold all Android phones combined on America's largest carrier.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By quiksilvr on 1/24/2012 4:46:28 PM , Rating: 2
Don't know how I missed that. Guess there were a lot of numbers, but there you go.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By JasonMick (blog) on 1/24/2012 4:59:20 PM , Rating: 3
quote:
Don't know how I missed that. Guess there were a lot of numbers, but there you go.

It'skay I sometimes miss a number or two here or there myself. :)

This is definitely an interesting turn of events. I think the release of the pent-up iPhone upgrade demand was accentuated by iPhone 4's early hardware issues, which lead to some loyal iPhone users sticking with the 3GS.

If I were Verizon Wireless I'd be trying to hard sell the Galaxy Nexus. I don't know how much VWZ is giving Samsung per Galaxy Nexus, but I guarantee you it's nowhere near $600... Apple's brilliant in jacking up its profit margins so high and still selling at such high rates.

Definitely a testament both to the appeal of the brand among the general public, and a rebuke on the business minds at Verizon, Sprint, and AT&T for sacrificing their own margins to try to gobble up these subscribers, fantasizing that will eventually turn into profit.

Apple is financially brilliant -- you'll get no argument from me on that.

However, how long it can keep guessing the "next big thing" smartphone-wise with Jobs gone remains to be seen. Both Windows Phone and ICS slick GUIs make the current iOS build look like it belongs on a Palm device of the 90s.

But in the short term Apple will do well as it has the brand image cornered. It's easy for us technophiles to get overly caught up in our own world and forget that. It all gets back to the P.T. Barnum quote. Savvy customers are in the minority; Apple knows how to stroke the egos of the unwashed masses like none other.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By Reclaimer77 on 1/24/2012 5:06:07 PM , Rating: 3
quote:
However, how long it can keep guessing the "next big thing" smartphone-wise with Jobs gone remains to be seen. Both Windows Phone and ICS slick GUIs make the current iOS build look like it belongs on a Palm device of the 90s.


Apple hasn't done that since 2007 when the iPhone first launched. Compare that model to this one. Where's the innovation Apple is supposed to be famous for? Same screen, same form factor, same EVERYTHING. Only the hardware improves and that's something expected in new generation phones, not a bonus.

Oh I guess I forgot Siri, yeah man, that TOTALLY transformed the way people use smartphones. Umm no.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By mevans336 on 1/24/2012 5:50:33 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
Same screen, same form factor, same EVERYTHING. Only the hardware improves and that's something expected in new generation phones, not a bonus.


This is a non-sequitur.

Quite a bit has been improved model-to-model hardware-wise, as well as to iOS.

http://www.apple.com/iphone/compare-iphones/

There's an old saying, "If it ain't broke ... don't fix it." Apple's sales numbers clearly show that so fair, it ain't broke.

Disclaimer: I own a Droid Bionic and feel like I'm holding a toy when I play with my daughter's iPhone 4S.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By ltcommanderdata on 1/24/2012 6:11:08 PM , Rating: 3
Taking the iPhone is the "same EVERYTHING" statement at face value, given the iPhone seems to remain the top or near the top selling smartphone and continues to grow and remain profitable, doesn't that indicate that Apple got the size and form factor right the first time? ie. the size and form factor of the iPhone appears to be the sweet-spot for what the average consumer wants. Should Apple arbitrarily switch to a 4.5" screen and throw in a keypad for the sake of change? There will probably come a time when major change is needed, but now is apparently not it.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By Reclaimer77 on 1/24/2012 6:20:20 PM , Rating: 2
Oh I knew it, here comes the sales argument. I'm just surprised it didn't come from Tony or Takin first.

We're talking about innovation, not profits. Sure they've gotten by the past 4 years with their typical cult-like persona and market appeal, but just sitting on your hands relying on that is NOT innovative at all.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By ltcommanderdata on 1/24/2012 7:04:00 PM , Rating: 4
I'm not a tech visionary, so I don't know what the correct definition of innovative is. If Apple increased the screen size as the vocal critics seem to push for, would that really be innovative?

I'd argue that moving from cheap TN panels to IPS for wide viewing angles and color accuracy and being able to push past 300 dpi was a major change from the original iPhone. I don't think anyone would confuse the display between the original iPhone and iPhone 4/4S.

What was probably the major innovation post-iPhone launch was the App Store. Previously, the carriers controlled development access to mobile phones so one middle-man was eliminated. Ability to self-publish, flexible pricing, and a well defined distribution channel were all major changes from how things were before. Apple taking a stand against carrier bloatware and Apple offering a consistent stream of OS updates are also noteworthy differences to how most smartphones operate.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By TakinYourPoints on 1/24/12, Rating: -1
RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By idiot77 on 1/25/2012 10:22:31 AM , Rating: 1
And what did the piles of PDA's look like before the iPhone? I have an HP Windows Mobile 5 that looks awfully like an iPhone did. The difference is I bought sometime in 2003/4. So.... another pointless "article" convincing people like you that Apple innovated something.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By TakinYourPoints on 1/25/2012 7:19:29 PM , Rating: 2
You'd think that someone else would have done fully touchscreen smartphones before Apple, rather than waiting for them to do it and then copying it instead.

Hell, you should have started a company and done it yourself, it's so simple! Maybe Google would have copied your execution instead and you'd make a fortune from the licensing.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By TakinYourPoints on 1/25/2012 7:28:01 PM , Rating: 2
Also, Windows Mobile 5 was trash.

Stop looking at things in such a superficial manner, execution matters.

Comparing iOS or Android or WP7 or any other mobile OS to it is ridiculous, as is bringing it into the conversation.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By BSMonitor on 1/25/2012 9:26:55 AM , Rating: 3
Innovation is making a footprint that is bigger than what people actually want?? It's making a screen so big that it requires twice the depth of the case for extra battery??

Other than that, what have they done? Make the camera grow to 10M ??

Don't be bitter that my 2 y/o iPhone4 is still thinner and gets better battery life than your POS Android phone that crashes every 5 apps you open on it.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By DeluxeTea on 1/26/2012 12:02:48 AM , Rating: 2
Funny name. You should monitor all the BS that you spew around here. My Android hasn't crashed, and has a larger screen but at the same time thinner than your iPhone 4.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By testerguy on 1/26/2012 7:01:32 AM , Rating: 2
Your Android is in the minority then.

Your Android also has a lower DPI screen and a far, far slower GPU (at least 2x slower) than the iPhone 4S.

It also has no access to Siri, no integrated wireless streaming to TV, a smaller app store (missing various key apps depending on your country) and worse battery life.

Being a brick width wise makes the 'thin' argument a bit irrelevant too.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By DeluxeTea on 1/27/2012 2:28:49 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Your Android also has a lower DPI screen

Like that changes anything. Unlike you, I don't bring my phone up to my face to lick it.

quote:
far, far slower GPU (at least 2x slower) than the iPhone 4S.

LOL for what? Infinity Blade? If I want to game, I have my laptop.

quote:
It also has no access to Siri

Glorified voice commands.

quote:
no integrated wireless streaming to TV

In my country, you would prefer to avoid watching any TV. Besides, I have loads of videos I can put on my numerous SD cards.

quote:
a smaller app store (missing various key apps depending on your country)

I have all the apps I need. I don't need another fart app.

quote:
and worse battery life.

This point I wont argue. Apple is known to have good batteries on their devices.

quote:
Being a brick width wise makes the 'thin' argument a bit irrelevant too.

Let's see:

My phone's dimensions are 122 mm x 64 mm x 9.2 mm, has a 4" screen and weighs 109 grams. The iPhone 4S is 115.2 mm x 58.6 mm x 9.3 mm, has a 3.5" screen and weighs 140 grams. Yup, that extra 6.8mm in height and 5.4mm in width is soooooo huge it won't fit in my pants pocket.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By testerguy on 1/26/2012 7:08:44 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
We're talking about innovation, not profits. Sure they've gotten by the past 4 years with their typical cult-like persona and market appeal, but just sitting on your hands relying on that is NOT innovative at all.


Their massive growth and outselling every other Android handset combined, is not the result of any 'cult'. It's normal, rational people making logical conclusions.

iOS (The OS Android essentially copied)
App Store (Innovation & Still Biggest)
Retina Display
Longest Battery life (Look at the comparisons to Android)
Bluetooth 4 (iPhone 4S first phone to have it)
PowerVR SGX543MP - Fastest GPU in any phone, ever (and still)
Siri (Innovative in terms of integrating it into the handset and allowing it more power)
iCloud - First phone manufacturer to integrate cloud storage

So, you're accusing the best selling (despite being more expensive) and fastest phone ever made, of not being 'innovative'? Please, if it's not innovative to pack that much power into such an attractive package why hasn't anyone else done it yet, even several months after its release?


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By Cheesew1z69 on 1/26/2012 11:34:44 AM , Rating: 1
quote:
The OS Android essentially copied
No, no it didn't...

The rest of your post....blah blah blah...who cares..


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By tayb on 1/24/2012 6:46:10 PM , Rating: 3
I think they would be served well by offering a regular iPhone and an XL iPhone and letting the market decide which size it prefers. There are a lot of people (myself included) that prefer iOS to Android and buy it even though there isn't a larger screen offering.

And before you call me a sheep keep in mind that my current phone is a Droid X. I've owned it for 15 months. I'll give ICS a shot before I ditch Android but as of right now iOS or WP7 both seem superior to Android. That's a personal opinion folks.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By bupkus on 1/24/2012 11:43:46 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
I think they would be served well by offering a regular iPhone and an XL iPhone and letting the market decide which size it prefers.
Henry Ford: Sure, you can order any color you want just as long as it's black.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By holyc2a on 1/25/2012 10:34:12 AM , Rating: 2
One reason Apple is so profitable is they have very few ski or models and this allows them order parts in huge volumes. In fact this quarter Apple said they were able to get components at lower costs. Where as their competitors because they offer endless models have to order components at smaller volumes which raises their costs.

So apple is innovative in areas other than tech, such as supply chain.

The fact that the iPhone looks and behaves as a toy is its strength to most users. In general the power users either come from a technical background or are just good with technology and Android is probably best for them. I argue also in general (I am sure there are exceptions) that its best that the people who prefer Android not be Apple customers. These are people who want everything for free or cheap, leave these customers to Samsung and other and let them try to wring money out them. That will leave Apple the people who don't mind spending money on smart phones or tablets.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By Jeffk464 on 1/25/2012 1:39:21 PM , Rating: 2
I payed $360 for my samsung nexus, hardly free.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By x10Unit1 on 1/25/2012 5:03:37 PM , Rating: 2
Would everyone stop using the word innovate and it's various forms, please? I understand it is the favorite keyword of the past few years because of Apple but trying to say that everything they do is "innovative" proves to me that you are a victim of marketing techniques.

"So apple is innovative in areas other than tech, such as supply chain."

Holc2a, no, no they are not. You honestly think that Apple created the concept of standardized parts among various products to reduce parts cost? I just figured since we are past the second industrial revolution era that this was a common concept.

"These are people who want everything for free or cheap, leave these customers to Samsung and other and let them try to wring money out them. That will leave Apple the people who don't mind spending money on smart phones or tablets."

Wow. So you equate Android users as cheap? What about all of those people that jumped on that great iphone 3G sale a few months back? Are they cheap too? Maybe they are lower than you since you clearly have an iphone 4S, which means you are much better than them, right? Your last sentence makes my head hurt because of how ignorant and arrogant it sounds.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By TakinYourPoints on 1/25/2012 7:16:38 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Holc2a, no, no they are not. You honestly think that Apple created the concept of standardized parts among various products to reduce parts cost? I just figured since we are past the second industrial revolution era that this was a common concept.


Yeah, "innovate" is the wrong word for many things they do. "Execution" is the word people should be using. In the case of this thread they have the tightest and best run supply chain in the tech industry. It is how they can manage the profit margins that they do against other hardware companies making high end mobile devices. They pre-order much larger number of components which drives down their wholesale prices, they're able to retool or make final adjustments very quickly by producing in China (the glass screen was an 11th hour change with the iPhone), they're able to do this on a much larger scale than anyone else (Apple was the largest purchaser of semiconductors last year), all while keeping the lowest unsold inventory out there (unsold inventory is like milk that spoils the longer it sits there).

They certainly didn't innovate. It is like anything else in their business though (R&D, marketing, product launches): tight precision execution.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By Jeffk464 on 1/25/2012 1:37:37 PM , Rating: 2
You will definitely miss the 4.3" screen.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By TakinYourPoints on 1/24/2012 6:50:37 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
But in the short term Apple will do well as it has the brand image cornered. It's easy for us technophiles to get overly caught up in our own world and forget that. It all gets back to the P.T. Barnum quote. Savvy customers are in the minority; Apple knows how to stroke the egos of the unwashed masses like none other.


Yeah, having some of the fastest hardware out there and the best developer support on any mobile platform are pretty shady ways to fool suckers into buying your product.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By GotThumbs on 1/25/2012 3:43:25 PM , Rating: 2
Whats interesting is....that the cost of the Iphone will eventually cost consumers more in higher rates.

Apple passing the buck and keeping the money. Typical.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By Jeffk464 on 1/25/2012 1:30:36 PM , Rating: 2
I don't get it android gives you the option of a bigger screen and LTE 4G network. Even if you prefer apple's OS you are missing out on a lot of functionality/features. Only explanation I see is non tech savvy people buying it on name. There is no way the iphone is as nice as my samsung galaxy nexus.


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By GotThumbs on 1/25/2012 3:48:20 PM , Rating: 2
Exactly,

Even Steve Wozniak said he preferred the Android voice recognition better than SURI.

Google: steve wozniak likes android

since I can't insert the link here...


RE: In Q3, Q4, or both?
By GotThumbs on 1/25/2012 3:37:57 PM , Rating: 2
Not impressed. I know what I like, and I'm going to continue to use Android devices. I'll never own an Apple product.

I believe statistic is flawed...how many are new subscribers and how many are upgrades.

Apple is the KING of reselling it's products to it's followers.


Wait for it...
By The Insolent One on 1/24/2012 4:54:30 PM , Rating: 2
When I can use data and voice at the same time via an LTE iPhone on Verizon, I'm going to gladly pay an early termination fee at AT&T.

I would guess I'm not alone and Verizon will see a ton of people flood in.




RE: Wait for it...
By JazzMang on 1/24/2012 4:59:18 PM , Rating: 2
Should be just a matter of time until an LTE iPhone will be among us. I'm sure they're working on the battery drain conundrum.


RE: Wait for it...
By mevans336 on 1/24/2012 5:56:43 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Should be just a matter of time until an LTE iPhone will be among us. I'm sure they're working on the battery drain conundrum.


The iPhone won't solve the problem of simultaneous voice and data on an EVDO or LTE network, you need Voice-over-LTE (VoLTE) for that. On all 4G LTE phones, voice calls still go over the 3G EVDO or 1xRTT CDMA network, not the LTE network.

FWIW, Verizon just delayed VoLTE deployment until 2013: http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/Verizon-Delays-...

As far as an LTE iPhone, we'll probably see one in the 4th Quarter of this year when 28nm SoC LTE chips are available: http://www.anandtech.com/show/4925/why-no-lte-ipho...


RE: Wait for it...
By sprockkets on 1/24/2012 7:05:58 PM , Rating: 2
You can always do voice over the usual CDMA and data over LTE at the same time. It's already done this way with Sprint.


RE: Wait for it...
By tayb on 1/24/2012 7:12:25 PM , Rating: 2
Yeah but the battery life is horrendous. I have no desire to own a 4G phone right now because I actually value battery life on my phone and I have yet to see a 4G model get positive reviews for battery life.


RE: Wait for it...
By sprockkets on 1/24/2012 7:31:35 PM , Rating: 2
Just flip the 4G on when you need it - problem solved. That and those tests are browsing 100% of the time.


RE: Wait for it...
By Chaser on 1/25/2012 8:37:03 AM , Rating: 2
I have to chime in here because I agree with you completely. well until now. I have the new AT&T GII Skyrocket in an LTE city, Washington DC. LTE stays on all day, I use the phone moderately, and it easily goes 16 hours with battery life to spare.

Compared to other 4G phones I have had the Skyrocket does a remarkably well with battery life. And I might add I'm getting 30Mbps downloads and 10Mbps uploads here too. :)


RE: Wait for it...
By sprockkets on 1/25/2012 1:38:43 PM , Rating: 2
Once that phone gets ICS it's the phone to get IMHO, especially the white one :-) I hate Att though.


RE: Wait for it...
By sprockkets on 1/24/2012 9:13:18 PM , Rating: 3
Why the hell would someone rate down a factual post on how the EVO works???


RE: Wait for it...
By Jeffk464 on 1/25/2012 1:40:52 PM , Rating: 2
Qualcomm's Krait S4 looks to be the most promising solution to LTE battery drain. Of course apple wont use it.


*Yawn*
By wpodonnell on 1/24/2012 4:29:23 PM , Rating: 4
"Again, take that figure in -- the iPhone outsold all Android phones combined on America's largest carrier."

Is this really that much of a surprise, given the pent-up iPhone demand at Big Red? Sustaining that next year will be noteworthy. This year? Not so much.




RE: *Yawn*
By seamonkey79 on 1/24/2012 5:52:42 PM , Rating: 2
Combine that with the fact that there are thousands and more that were early first time Android buyers with the Incredible and the couple that came out after that... we're just waiting for our upgrade to roll through before buying getting a new one. I know of nine people in my relatively small circle that have upgrades coming up in the next few weeks (mine's next week) that are heading out to buy a new phone as soon as the day rolls around.

I think we'll see the tables back to where they were as the year rolls through. Pent up angst at the lack of a new iPhone for 'so long' combined with staggered upgrades due to lack of phone availability early/mid 2009 will catch up.


RE: *Yawn*
By tayb on 1/24/2012 6:07:23 PM , Rating: 2
Your logic precludes a scenario where there are people waiting to upgrade their current Blackberries or Android devices to iPhones on Verizon. I know quite a few people, myself included, who bought Android devices (on Verizon) between July 2010 and December 2010 simply because it was the only reasonable smart phone available. Where these people land when their contracts are up throughout this year is anyone's guess but if I had to put money on it I would say these current numbers will hold true for the next 6 months, taper off in anticipation of the next iPhone, and then leap back to the top.

Time will tell.


RE: *Yawn*
By nafhan on 1/25/2012 9:22:42 AM , Rating: 2
Actually, I think the "iPhone outsold..." numbers were true for the fourth quarter only - the quarter in which a new iPhone was released. At least over the next couple years, I would be surprised if the iPhone was NOT the best selling phone in quarters where a new model is released (i.e. 4th quarter every year). Unlike most other devices, there aren't discounts on a given model until it's replaced by a newer one, and there aren't any alternative manufacturers. So, you're going to have a pretty significant % of your upgrades happening as soon as a new model is released - it's certainly when I would upgrade if I were on the iPhone bus.


RE: *Yawn*
By testerguy on 1/26/2012 7:20:19 AM , Rating: 2
Try telling this to people who compared Samsung smartphone sales to Apple smartphones sales last quarter (before the iPhone 4S was released), and reached ridiculous conclusions on it.

iPhones overall in the year outsold any other phone, so whether you look at just this quarter or overall, it tells a positive story about Apple.


RE: *Yawn*
By VahnTitrio on 1/26/2012 10:21:08 AM , Rating: 2
And that Big Red was very slow when it came to getting the Galaxy Nexus to market; and even when it did arrive the $300 price point was not all that attractive to those accustomed to paying $200 for the latest and greatest Android.


funny how that heading is a lie
By Jetster220 on 1/24/2012 7:17:48 PM , Rating: 5
As the iphone did not outsell Android Verizon this year.
http://www.droid-life.com/2012/01/24/verizon-sold-...




By cmdrdredd on 1/24/2012 9:54:45 PM , Rating: 3
THIS PEOPLE!!! THIS!!!!

Read the numbers as they truly are.


By Alexstarfire on 1/25/2012 5:31:23 AM , Rating: 2
Well, the heading is actually true for the given quarter, 4th Q 2011. You're comparing apples and oranges here.


Wake up Geeks
By bull2760 on 1/25/2012 10:26:34 AM , Rating: 2
Reading these threads it's like a broken record the Apple fans praise Apple and the Android fans rip Apple nothing new here. What you don't realize, for the sake of argument, is that Apple could give a rats ass about geeks like you that want to jail brake their phone, have bigger screens, a cool ui and so forth. You make up such a small percentage of the market as a whole nobody cares. Apples products have always been and will always be simple in function, cause users just want their shit to work I've had both Android and IOS devices, currently I have an iPhone 4, I use it for email and taking pictures, and an occasional social update. What the fuck more do you need? It's a frigin phone, quit trying to replace your home computer, xbox, or playstation with an all in one device, ain't going to happen. Just amazing how geeks think they know it all and everyone else is a dumb ass. Oh and the reason I switched to Apple my phone kept locking up for no apparent reason and I got tired of it.




RE: Wake up Geeks
By zlandar on 1/25/2012 10:55:18 AM , Rating: 2
Ditto. I'm comfortable building my own PC rigs so I'm not a total tech nub. I've owned Windows Mobile phones in the past and they are utter POS when it comes to ergonomics and battery life.

Yeah the Androids are much better than my POS Windows phones in the past but they suffer from the same problem of a bazillion products, all with different pros/cons. Non-tech folks can't tell the difference between a low and high-end Android phone and just buy whatever looks good.

I opted for the iPhone 4 and have no regrets. Most of my co-workers who had Android phones have switched to the iPhone because of crap battery life or they simply don't know how to use all the features on their phone.


RE: Wake up Geeks
By x10Unit1 on 1/25/2012 3:33:22 PM , Rating: 2
Hmmm.....you are all over the place with this comment. Let's break it down:

Fan boys will be fan boys. I get that, you get that, and most everyone else gets that.

I believe Apple does care if you jailbreak their phones. This is based on Firmware updates stopping jailbreaking and comments Apple has made. Apple does care about geeks. Why do you think they have their Apple Genius tech guys/gals?

Enough with this "it just works" BS. Apple, Android, any other OS have their fair share of problems. Check variou support forums for more details. Honestly, amazed at market skills Apple has though. I wonder if it is or will be studied in marketing classes.

Funny you mention that Apple is simple in function. I have non tech users that use Android phones just fine. I guess it depends on the user?

This is my favorite part of your post:
"currently I have an iPhone 4, I use it for email and taking pictures, and an occasional social update. What the f### more do you need? It's a frigin phone, quit trying to replace your home computer, xbox, or playstation with an all in one device, ain't going to happen"

You are aware that there was a time when a phone was just that....a phone? Now a phone can do a lot more that just call someone. They do what you listed and more. In fact, why can't a smartphone(iOS, Android, or other) replace a PC or console? If all you are using a PC for is media consumption(web browsing, listening to music, viewing pictures and movies), a smartphone can do that. While there are still some issues, it is improving with every OS/application update. Did you know that android phones can play GTA 3? Wasn't that a PS2(console) game? Tell me why it ain't happening?

I am amazed at all of the zealot fan boys out there that blindly believe their device of choice is perfect and everything else sucks. That they looks for any reason to praise their device and curse all others.

Sorry that your phone locked up all of the time. Technology can be a pain in the rump like that no matter what the device. I have seen my fair share of "X product has never worked for me, so I switched to Y and never ever had an issues."


RE: Wake up Geeks
By zlandar on 1/25/2012 3:47:01 PM , Rating: 2
Most people are not looking to replace all their electronic equipment with a smartphone. The problem of trying is you end up with a big fat power-hungry smartphone that runs out of juice.


RE: Wake up Geeks
By x10Unit1 on 1/25/2012 4:31:13 PM , Rating: 2
Zlandar - Very true.

I wasn't clear on the point I was trying to make. Let me try again.

The poster says that he uses a smartphone to emails, takes pictures, and updates social networks. Then goes to claim "it's a frigin phone" and you shouldn't look to a phone to replace a PC or console because it ain't going to happen.

The point I was trying to make is: smartsphones are not phones. They are little computers that make calls. This might show my age but my phone right now has more processing power than the PC I used in high school and has a better internet connection! My mother and sister uses their phones to play a variety of games. In their case, the phone would replace a dedicated video game machine. I have a friend that uses the Droid Bionics webtop software and a hdmi connector to hook up the phone to his TV and uses that to browse the internet and use netflix when 4G wants to works. In that case, it replaces a home PC for him.

Maybe it was because the poster drew a line in the sand that said a phone can never replace certain things without realizing that in certain ways, it has. Just a side note, just how many people replaced their tomtoms or other GPS devices with their new smartphone?

It might not be that a smartphone can replace a PC or console but the practically of it. If he would have made that point, I would have agreed. But to say that it can't just doesn't make sense.


suckers
By Chaser on 1/25/2012 10:37:41 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Apple surged back with the launch of the iPhone 4S and its iconic voice-controlled assistant, Siri.
4S? The 3G iPhone 4 that was the non iPhone 5 let down of 2011? Versus say an ultrafast Verizon or even AT&T LTE smart phone?

I guess theres no shortage of rich teenage girls wanting an overkill text messaging device, or better yet: There's a Sheeple born every minute.




RE: suckers
By zlandar on 1/25/2012 11:04:22 AM , Rating: 2
You just don't get it do you?

If LTE means crap battery life or a big bulky phone then no I don't want it on my smartphone.

It is a PHONE. A phone is useless to me if I have to recharge it before the end of the day.

If Android is an OS that appeals only to geeks then it's going to get massacred in the marketplace because guess what? Most of the people out there don't give a rat's a$$ about LTE or all the other gee whiz features.


RE: suckers
By Chaser on 1/25/2012 11:49:40 AM , Rating: 2
You might want to actually look at other phones battery performance with LTE so that your "IF" might have an ounce of credibility.

I understand under your intoxicating suckling of Apple milk you have a limited knowledge base of competitor phones with "gee wiz" features like "LTE". Which happens to be on commercials and billboards nationwide? and is offered in over 20 markets with Verizon and 15+ with AT&T. Golly gee.

Try getting it yourself genius.



RE: suckers
By zlandar on 1/25/2012 1:43:46 PM , Rating: 2
"You might want to actually look at other phones battery performance with LTE so that your "IF" might have an ounce of credibility."

Galaxy Nexus:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/5310/samsung-galaxy-...

Barely half the browsing time compared to a iPhone 4 (even worse compared to the 4S) is pretty crappy in my book. Yeah you can argue the display is bigger but the regular consumer doesn't care. All he/she knows is the phone does not last as long.


RE: suckers
By Jeffk464 on 1/25/2012 1:46:01 PM , Rating: 2
LTE does pull the battery down pretty fast so I loaded cyanogen 9 on my nexus and can toggle the LTE radio on or off. If I'm going to be out and about and want my charge to last the day I turn off LTE, GPS, and bluetooth. Basically if you want a smartphone to go all day on a single charge you pretty much just have to use it as a phone and not do all the data stuff.


Apple will be scared....
By zlandar on 1/25/2012 8:44:33 AM , Rating: 2
When Android can offer a smartphone in the same form factor that is as good as the newest version of the iPhone.




RE: Apple will be scared....
By Jeffk464 on 1/25/2012 1:50:04 PM , Rating: 2
what? nobody argues that android phones aren't as good hardware wise.


By TakinYourPoints on 1/25/2012 7:23:57 PM , Rating: 2
Sure they do. The fastest tablet hardware with the Tegra 3 is slower than an iPad 2 from almost a year ago, and the smartphones don't fare much better. This is before you get to not being guaranteed an OS update without a Nexus phone, despite the fact that you're still stuck in a 2 year contract.

I'd argue that Google taking control away from carriers in the same way that Apple and Microsoft have done is even more important than faster hardware. Centralized app market, total control over OS updates, unifying the base hardware, all of these are major strikes against the platform. Take those problems away and the practical advantages of iOS and WP7 are substantially reduced.


RE: Apple will be scared....
By testerguy on 1/26/2012 7:25:29 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
what? nobody argues that android phones aren't as good hardware wise.


What are you talking about Jeff?

The iPhone 4S is, FAR AND AWAY, the fastest hardware (CPU/GPU) of any phone ever made, 3x faster GPU than Nexus Prime (the 'flagship' Android phone) and 2x faster than Samsung Galaxy S2. It also has the best battery life, and one of if not the best camera.

Android handsets are way behind.


T-mobile in debt going to collapse???
By AEvangel on 1/25/2012 11:05:00 AM , Rating: 2
Where is all this imaginary Debt that T-mobile USA has??

Also where is this they are set to collapse coming from??

Last I checked they are quite profitable and one of the few area of Deutsche Telekom AG, that is doing well.

I think you need to keep the doomsaying to Sprint, the recent merger of T-mobile and At&t had more to deal with Deutsche Telekom AG wanting to turn a quick profit and At&t wanting to secure up the networks as well as more customers. it had nothing to do with T-mobile not being successful, if that was the case they would have not made the sweet offer they had made.




RE: T-mobile in debt going to collapse???
By mellomonk on 1/25/2012 1:21:59 PM , Rating: 2
I would have to find the link, but DT has as much as said, that it will 'un-burden' itself of T-Mobile USA one way or another over the next three years. It was really hoping to merge it with Att, but alas....

Supposedly they are shopping for a buyer, merger partner or some combination. The analysis I read speculated that they will probably be parted out, with spectrum & resources going in chunks to other carriers to avoid much Governmental scrutiny. To bad, great customer service, loyal customers, but it is a brutal business.


RE: T-mobile in debt going to collapse???
By mellomonk on 1/25/2012 1:28:05 PM , Rating: 2
Here is a T -Mob article from Dec. in WSJ;

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100014240529702047...


By AEvangel on 1/25/2012 3:11:41 PM , Rating: 2
Zactly...nothing in that article mentions it debt burdened...they are actually quite profitable.

It's not all doom and gloom for T-Mobile: It's still profitable, and AT&T will be sending it $1 billion worth of wireless spectrum allocations by the year's end. A roaming agreement with AT&T will also help expand T-Mobile's coverage to 50 million more Americans.

That's a nice parting gift, but it's not even close to enough for T-Mobile to build out a 4G network. And the real prize, the $3 billion break-up fee, will go towards paying down parent company Deutsche Telekom's debt, not to T-Mobile USA, Deutsche Telekom announced on Tuesday.


http://money.cnn.com/2011/12/20/technology/t-mobil...


Bigger picture
By Trisped on 1/24/2012 5:20:49 PM , Rating: 2
It is expected that fans of the device which is updated once a year will do so when the update comes out.

The iPhone is king for one quarter, but how does it compare to the rest of the year?




RE: Bigger picture
By zlandar on 1/25/2012 2:04:43 PM , Rating: 2
What would be interesting to see is the retention rate of iPhone vs Android users when it's time to pick a new phone. I have not seen that data except for RIM, where everyone is jumping ship.


RE: Bigger picture
By TakinYourPoints on 1/26/2012 2:29:31 AM , Rating: 2
We'll see. A big thing not being talked about is that the #2 and #3 devices were the iPhone 4 for $100 and the 3GS for free. This is the first time Apple has sold such inexpensive devices. A large percentage of Android activations have been made on free to $100 smartphones. Now that Apple is on all major carriers except T-Mobile, and they sell in the budget range, it'll be interesting to see how and if the percentages shift around.


By GotThumbs on 1/25/2012 3:33:06 PM , Rating: 2
What a laugh this is. Apple even has companies taking losses in order to sell their product. I'm sure this is expected to be a long term gain...but we'll see if that is a reality.

I find it interesting how spellbound Apple has these people. It's almost like....If Apple says "Drink the Cool-aid"....millions of blind followers would do just that.

Hey, I think I've got a solution to population control, :-)




By Roffles on 1/25/2012 9:08:57 PM , Rating: 2
I've always been amazed by people's reaction to Apple.

But it is what it is. I honestly couldn't recommended a BB or Android phone to anyone during Q4. The only Verizon Android phone truly worth a contract was/is the Galaxy Nexus...and they released it at the dead end of the quarter. All the other Android LTE phones are carrier bloated and tainted with modified UI's.

If it's Verizon's intent to only release a pure Google phone every 2 years like their current trend dictates....you can expect Android to lose market to Apple on the Verizon network.


By testerguy on 1/26/2012 7:29:06 AM , Rating: 2
I think you are exactly right.

The main reason for Apples success is that the iPhone 4S moved up the hardware standard to a new level, and no Android handset has matched it yet, it's the failure of all the other manufacturers just as much as it is the success of Apple.

The SGX 540 in the Nexus Prime is 2 years old, and 3x slower than the SGX 543 in the iPhone 4S, so even the Nexus Prime is a slower phone with worse battery life (and of course the issues all Android phones have). It also only has a 5 megapixel camera compared to the higher quality 8 megapixel camera in the iPhone 4S. There simply is no better alternative right now.

Lets see what 2012 brings :-)


Good timing?
By n0b0dykn0ws on 1/24/2012 4:48:29 PM , Rating: 2
In which quarter did the iPhone 4S officially become available?

If the 4th then I would surmise that it's upgrades to the new iPhone versus first time iPhone buyers.

n0b0dykn0ws




Apple = New York Yankees
By hiscross on 1/24/2012 8:56:11 PM , Rating: 2
Steve Jobs = Babe Ruth

Andriod = Boston Red Sox September 2011




Apple = New York Yankees
By hiscross on 1/24/2012 8:56:21 PM , Rating: 2
Steve Jobs = Babe Ruth

Andriod = Boston Red Sox September 2011




RE: iPhone Q4 Sales
By Azaraith on 1/25/2012 8:13:03 PM , Rating: 2
Pent up demand (many iFans thought there would be one in the Summer) + new iPhone release makes this obvious. Though I can't understand why an iPhone 4 user would think the 4S is a significant upgrade... Literally nothing that didn't already exist and missing several features that other phones have (bigger screen, 4G, etc). I'd have waited, personally, if I were an iFan.




Pointing out the bias
By testerguy on 1/26/2012 7:12:11 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
For now, though, Apple and its fans can simply savor the thrill of being back near the top of the U.S. smartphone market -- even if challenges await.


Yes, Apple can savour the thrill of being 'back' 'near the top', after continuing their overall year-on-year smartphone sales lead and outselling every other Android phone combined, they are definitely 'back' 'near the top'.

Where's your glorious, sensationalist title claiming that Apple is the 'biggest smartphone manufacturer in the world' like you did after Samsung had a good quarter?




RE: Pointing out the bias
By testerguy on 1/26/12, Rating: 0
"My sex life is pretty good" -- Steve Jobs' random musings during the 2010 D8 conference














botimage
Copyright 2014 DailyTech LLC. - RSS Feed | Advertise | About Us | Ethics | FAQ | Terms, Conditions & Privacy Information | Kristopher Kubicki