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Ford Focus Electric
Ford Focus Electric won't come cheap

We first brought you news of the production Ford Focus Electric earlier this year when it was officially unveiled at CES 2011 in Las Vegas. Now, Ford has spilled the beans on how much the all-electric car will cost when it debuted next year.
 
According to Ford's new online price configurator/reservation page, the Focus Electric will have a base price of $39,200 plus a destination charge of $795 bringing the total to $39,995. Since the U.S. government is handing money out left and right for "green" vehicles, the price of the Ford Focus Electric drops to $32,495 after a $7,500 federal tax credit.
 
To put this pricing in perspective, the all-electric Nissan Leaf has a base MSRP of $36,050 while the Chevrolet Volt has a base MSRP of $39,995. Both of those figures are before the $7,500 federal tax credit is taken into consideration.
 
The Focus Electric is powered by a 123hp (181 lb-ft torque) electric motor and a 23 kWh lithium-ion battery pack that was co-developed with LG Chem. Top speed for the vehicle is a relatively meager 84 mph.
 
There’s no word on how far the Focus Electric will go on a charge, but we’re guessing that it will be targeting the Nissan’s Leaf’s EPA rating of 73 miles on a charge.

Source: Ford Focus Electric Homepage



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By Keeir on 11/2/2011 5:41:52 PM , Rating: 3
First, lets compare apples to apples. The Ford Electric is more like an electric version of the 22,000+ Titanium with Navigation. My best guess is ~24,000 is the required price for an ICE version.

So the difference is 24,000 --> 32,500 or 8,500 dollars.

Even the SFE versions get only 33 Miles per Gallon (combined)

The Ford Electric will likely get 3 miles per kWh

Overall, adding in the required oil changes, the Electric will cost ~8 cents less per mile in terms of fuel. Thus, ~105,000 miles the Ford focus Electric will be a better "deal" than the closest outfitted Ford Focus. Your personal value of a navigation system will impact somewhat this perception of "value"


By YashBudini on 11/2/2011 5:56:25 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
The Ford Electric will likely get 3 miles per kWh

Here we pay appx 20 cents/kwh, so figure 7 cents per mile.

Gas at $3.60/gallon divided by 40MPG = 9 cents a gallon (highway only), can be twice that in stop and go traffic in the winter. But then factor in ICE maintenance, oil changes can account for as much as 1 penny per mile, transmission fluid changes, air filters, spark plugs, timing belts, as applicable.

I wonder how soon people stealing power right off the pole becomes a major problem for utilities companies. That's not even addressing grid capacity issues.


By Keeir on 11/2/2011 6:31:09 PM , Rating: 2
Read the OP remark? I was using his values

Of course here we pay .08 dollars per kWh, so you know that varies all across the world and the US.

quote:
I wonder how soon people stealing power right off the pole becomes a major problem for utilities companies. That's not even addressing grid capacity issues.


Doom and gloom! You know the big TV craze? or even the original TV craze?

An electric car is likely to use ~11 kWh a day. Adoption rate suggests that at most 500,000 will be added a year for the forseable future. A large plasma TV that is on 8 hours a day will add more than 10 kWh a day to electric bill of a home. Yet I hear no one pronouncing gloom even though people buy millions of ever larger/hungier electronics ever year.

Even at 20 cents/kilowatt hour, the 12,000 mile average driving will amount to just 800 dollars a year. Far below what the average person pays for gas right now at (12,000/25*3.6)= 1,700. (Your numbers, mine are significant greater difference. Today I would pay 320 electric versus 1920 gas in my current car.)


By YashBudini on 11/2/2011 7:48:47 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Read the OP remark? I was using his values

Whatever. I never invalidated them. I was simply adding another example for comparison purposes.

quote:
A large plasma TV that is on 8 hours a day will add more than 10 kWh a day to electric bill of a home.

I informed a friend that his TV was using over 1 horsepower 750+ watts just to watch the news.

quote:
Doom and gloom!

Are you sure you've addressed the state of the US grid to any degree? Even 65 inch plasmas take a back seat to electric resistance heaters, hot water heaters, electric dryers, and soon some number of EVs.


By corduroygt on 11/2/2011 5:56:47 PM , Rating: 2
You're conveniently ignoring the loan interest costs, opportunity costs, the costs to rent another vehicle any time you want to go more than 100 miles, and depreciation (more expensive cars depreciate more) in your computation. I'm sure when you add all that up, it takes a hell lot longer than 105k miles to make up the difference.


By Keeir on 11/2/2011 6:44:09 PM , Rating: 2
Not really.

But I concede, without knowing how you personally would use the car, I couldn't possibly predict how long it takes to pay back.

Cost to Own over 150,000 miles

Assumptions:
2% Opportunity Cost^10 year=1.22
All Cash Purchase
2x Rentals a Year: 100 per Rental
Oil Change ever 5,000 Miles - 50 Dollars
Brake Change every 30,000 Miles - 250 Dollars
Major Ice Maintainence every 50,000 Miles - 500 Dollars
Major Electric Service every 100,000 miles - 1,000 Dollars
Resell Value - 25% of initial price (post rebate)
Gas: 4.00 (Slightly Above US Average Today)
Electric: .15 (Slightly Above US Average Today)

Titanium ICE:
Purchase Price: 24,000
Fuel: 18,100
Opp. Cost: 5,280
Service: 4,250
Salvage Value: -6,000

Total Cost = 45,630

Electric:
Purchase Price: 39,500
Fuel: 7,425
Rentals: 2,000
Opp. Cost: 8,690
Service: 1,500
Rebate: -7,500
Salvage Value= -8,000

Total Cost: 43,615

Seems if I am accounting for Opp. Cost, some rentals, etc, the Electric is probably going to pull ahead between 100,000 to 150,000 miles. Now if you drive 150 miles once a week, the Electric Focus is not a good choice for you. Duh. But there is a fairly large segment that rarely drives that far very often.


By Spuke on 11/2/2011 10:32:59 PM , Rating: 2
According to Ford, the maintenance costs over the lifetime of the gas Focus amounts to $721.55. I'll just round it down to $720 for simplicity.


By Keeir on 11/3/2011 2:58:37 AM , Rating: 2
Errr... could I sell you some "waterfront" property?

Spunk, looking at the face of it, it seems nearly impossible that a Focus will need less than 1,000 dollar maintenance over 150,000 miles. Especially when I was including Oil Changes, Time Belts, Major Inspections, Brakes, etc.

Even if they have 15,000 mile syn. oil changes, its going to 750 over 150,000... just for oil changes.

I'd read what the consider "maintenance" costs. It is clear doesn't include tires, brakes, or oil changes.


By Spuke on 11/3/2011 3:56:10 PM , Rating: 2
The Focus doesn't have a timing belt (very few if any new cars do and no DI cars do) and Ford's numbers not far fetched at all. At least they listed their scheduled maintenance. You're just pulling stuff out of your butt. My cars maintenance is LESS than Ford is quoting for the Focus. And considering that Ford is figuring auto transmission maintenance, that's understandable. I don't have an auto trans. I have 94k miles on my car. First "major" service is 100k miles when I get new spark plugs. All regular servicing for my car is just oil/oil filter and air filter changes. That's it. There isn't any more to it. Most new cars are like this. I will say that in the next 50k miles I'll have to change my coolant thermostat, brake pads, and maybe my clutch. But you'd have to do that to the EV's too. If you're going to throw unscheduled maintenance, you need to do it to both cars (unless the Focus EV doesn't use brake pads or tires or coolant temp sensors...oh that's right it does).


By Keeir on 11/3/2011 5:50:03 PM , Rating: 2
Spuke,

I can not believe over 94k miles you haven't incurred nearly 500 dollars in oil changes unless your doing it yourself. Even then I believe you have a Syn. Oil type that probably should be changed ever 10,000 miles for a minimum of 9 changes. At ~40 dollars for the oil and filter, even doing it yourself is 360.

Though you bring up a good point. Using a manual can extend your brake life AND reduce repair costs (though I wonder what the clutch replacement will cost).

Here are what 'professional' TCO estimates are saying

Motortrend estimates over 60,000 miles that maintenance for a Ford Focus Titanium Hatch will be 1,600 and repairs 600. Total of 2,200

Edmunds estimates over 75,000 miles that maintenance will be 1,900 and repairs 700. Total of 2,600

Yahoo Auto estimates over 75,000 miles that maintenance will be 2,100 and repairs 1,400

quote:
unless the Focus EV doesn't use brake pads or tires or coolant temp sensors...oh that's right it does


Ideally you use the engine to brake. Brake pad life ought to be super extended on an EV in compared to an ICE. Repairs to the regions probably cost more.

Coolant sensor where again? Oh yeah, the battery coolant system? No where near as complicated as the ICE version. No Oil, No Emissions, etc, etc, etc. (The Ford Engine still has a few serpentine belts)

Post a link to the ford estimate, I'd be curious to read thier fine print.


By YashBudini on 11/3/2011 12:18:27 AM , Rating: 2
quote:

Oil Change ever 5,000 Miles - 50 Dollars
Brake Change every 30,000 Miles - 250 Dollars
Major Ice Maintainence every 50,000 Miles - 500 Dollars
Major Electric Service every 100,000 miles - 1,000 Dollars

Oddly enough each of these is about a penny per mile. Note the brake cost shown is per axle, so multiply by 2. Tires are close to a penny a mile for good ones. And ironically the occasional battery replacement.

Notably missing from the EV:
fuel filters
gas tank leaks and replacements
high pressure fuel pumps, inside the gas tank
fuel line leaks
catalytic converter/O2 sensor and exhaust replacements (probably about a penny per mile)
spark plugs
Chevron Techron on a regular basis
Cold gas station bathrooms with no running water or toilet paper


By retrospooty on 11/3/2011 8:40:36 AM , Rating: 2
"Cold gas station bathrooms with no running water or toilet paper"

- priceless


By Dr of crap on 11/3/2011 9:16:56 AM , Rating: 1
Really?
Now we're down to adding in oil changes and such.
Who's to say there won't be breaks downs in these EVs?
What possible problems might these also incounter?
Don't foget plugs go 100,000 miles now. Oil changes every 5-8,000 miles.

Maybe you should include reduced range in the winter months.
Oh, that's right the ones that buy these won't live around here where it gets below zero. This is where gas rules the land.


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