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Print 27 comment(s) - last by Gurthang.. on Oct 19 at 10:40 AM

Nokia will receive the majority of the cash

According to a report by the UK's Mobile Today, Microsoft Corp. (MSFT) hopes to cast a spell on smartphone buyers this holiday season, pouring $44.1M USD into promoting its new Windows Phone 7.5 "Mango" operating system.  Windows Phone has struggled in sales thus far, due to a variety of factors that including lack of in-store promotion due to smaller sales commissions and the deluge of flashier dual core/4G Android hardware.  Still it has arguably the most innovative interface on the market.

Of that sum, $31.5M USD (~71%) will go to Nokia, Oyj. (HEL:NOK1V), Microsoft new special smart phone partner.  Microsoft also plans to contribute a much larger undisclosed sum in terms of "in-store marketing deals" (promotions) to convince sales staff to evangelize the merits of the Windows Phone platform and, in particular, Nokia's upcoming Windows Phone handsets.

Nokia has recruited advertising talent to help differentiate its products via multi-channel ads placed on TV, on the internet, and elsewhere.

Aside from Nokia, Samsung Electronics Comp., Ltd. (SEO 005930) will receive a large chunk of funding to assist it in promoting its new Omnia W Mango handset.  That funding will go towards co-funding a $12.6M USD international holiday ad push for Samsung's new Mango handset.  Samsung is the world's largest phonemaker and has been relatively supportive of Microsoft's efforts thus far.

Windows Phone Division president Andy Lees would not confirm Mobile Today's exact figures, but did comment, "It’s not good enough to have a ramp that's similar to other guys, you have to ramp faster. That’s what we are aiming to do this holiday season, and particularly into 2012."

For Microsoft the Windows Phone division -- like the Bing search engine -- continues to be a cash-hungry money loser.  However, unlike Bing, which does not appear to have any major momentum towards growth, Windows Phone looks likely to gain at least some market share over the next year as in-store promotion steps up and Nokia's offerings hit the U.S. and international markets. 

Source: Mobile Today



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I don't understand ...
By flybefree on 10/18/2011 11:46:25 AM , Rating: 3
Why do you keep on saying that WP7 has "most innovative interface on the market?" Is Microsoft paying you? I've played with it plenty and I don't see it. As you say in your linked article, the tiles are like Android's widgets. In fact, I don't see how they are different from widgets in concept at all.

I have an Android phone. There are already apps for the iPhone that I want that aren't on Android. This is a constant frustration. While the companies producing these particular apps typically say that they have an Android version coming or already have a less-feature-complete Android version, a WP7 port isn't even on the radar. I can't imagine taking another step down on the app availability ladder.

So since there is absolutely nothing compelling to me about a WP7 phone, I don't understand why you unrelentlessly push it like this. I'm sick of it, and it puts your credibility into question.




RE: I don't understand ...
By Flunk on 10/18/2011 12:05:03 PM , Rating: 2
You have to use it to see how it's different. It's not obvious from pictures because a lot of it is touch gestures and animations.


RE: I don't understand ...
By flybefree on 10/18/2011 12:44:20 PM , Rating: 4
As I said in my post, I have played with it plenty (in the store, of course, since I ended up buying an Android phone). In the end, it's dead in the water without apps, and I'm not just talking about the big obvious ones. It's the large ecosystem of apps that fill the little niches that makes a platform compelling.

I was initially skeptical that I would use anything but the default apps on the phone, much less pay for any apps, but I have found these two assumptions to be heavily wrong.

Using myself as a specific example, I am a professional pilot. There are excellent flight planning apps for the IOS, including Garmin Pilot My-Cast, Foreflight, and FltPlan.com. The first two have very limited Android versions. The third has an incredible Android version which I use on almost every flight. NONE even talk about a WP7 version. There are other niches that are relevant to me in which this exact same scenario plays out. It's this one that frustrates me the most.

To conclude, I feel that there is nothing dramatically compelling about the interface, and in fact I don't feel that there is anything even marginally better about the interface than an Android device. That, coupled with how anemic the app market is for WP7, makes it basically useless to me. So I'm tired of hearing this line from Mick tying to jam WP7 down my throat.


RE: I don't understand ...
By Smilin on 10/18/2011 12:55:26 PM , Rating: 5
quote:
in the store, of course


I can understand why you don't get it then although frankly I'm surprised they even had one out for you to play with.

MS isn't BSing with that "get in, get it done, get out" design. It works.

The app marketplace is actually getting pretty nice for WP7 (have you even looked?) but there are indeed certain niches like yours that aren't yet reached (and in your case may not be for some time).

Android might very well be the best for you. WP7 for me.


RE: I don't understand ...
By flybefree on 10/18/2011 8:57:34 PM , Rating: 2
Where else besides the store are you supposed to try it out before you buy it? I'm certainly not one to buy on hype and *hope* that it works for me.

My point is exactly that the app marketplace doesn't fill in most niches like the iPhone does - Angry Birds might be there, but it doesn't fill my niche, and for someone else, it doesn't fill their niche, etc. The mass market stuff may be there, but WP7 just doesn't have that richness in the depth of apps that are available for it which make the phone much more personal. It's actually looking like an IOS product might be best for me, actually.


RE: I don't understand ...
By Smilin on 10/19/2011 10:10:18 AM , Rating: 2
No, you definately need to see one to get it. Herein lies yet another problem MS has to overcome. Right now the only way to really use one is to play with a friends. But nobody has them.

There is certainly a richness to the app store but I think you overstate the importance of that. Once certain minimum has been reached it becomes good enough for most. Android hit this, WP7 hit this. BB hasn't quite, Palm never did. WP7 hit 30k back in august and are adding 100 per day. What's the magic number when it all becomes junk?

The other unique thing is WP7 just doesn't need many of the Apps that Android and iOS do. The hubs do a better job with anything I do socially.

I don't think WP7 will really take off utnil they get their retail presence in order. They need a good demo unit and a salesman that knows how it works. Right now you'll find one in a drawer and a salesman who is an utter android fanboy because that's a phone that has every possible feature under the sun and phone geeks are the ones that would actually use them.


RE: I don't understand ...
By flybefree on 10/18/2011 9:03:01 PM , Rating: 2
Also, I think that whole "get in, get it done, get out" marketing campaign is idiotic. Why are they claiming to solve a problem that no one complains about? How many people have you heard complain that they spend too much time with their head down in their smartphone. I've NEVER heard this complaint. On the contrary, I have a hard time getting people to get their heads out of their phones, and focus on what's in front of them.


RE: I don't understand ...
By SilthDraeth on 10/18/2011 9:12:27 PM , Rating: 3
You bring up some valid points... about yourself. However, you say "It doesn't interest me, so why are you pushing it!"

As far as I know, this article wasn't written specifically to you. It was written to the community, and obviously the person writing it is impressed with WP7.

So, it isn't just about you. There are thousands of articles that are written that I am sure do not interest you. Do you go into each of them and provide lengthy dialog on how they don't pertain to you, and how the author shouldn't promote the product because it has zero value to yourself?

No... I didn't think so. So just give it a rest.


RE: I don't understand ...
By koenshaku on 10/18/2011 1:10:13 PM , Rating: 2
I agree I have been using iOS since the 2G, but even I am not so blind to see that WP7 is just a superior UI. The use of WP7 just makes sense large titles that I can see in my car with having to lean forword to look at tiny icons. Live titles that you can turn on your phone and see the tile flip for your weather without having to open the app.
The ability to pin anything to your home screen, webpages, people, pictures, apps etc.
A full featured IE9 on the phone equivalent to the desktop counterpart.
free 25gb skydrive and the list goes on. Its the completeness of WP7 that makes it feel like a next generation phone my brother and parents own one and when I use theirs and go back to my iOS it feels outdated.. That is why I am always checking their app releasing and looking to Nokia.


RE: I don't understand ...
By p05esto on 10/18/2011 10:36:07 PM , Rating: 1
Most people don't care all that much about apps at all. For most people the default things the phones come with are all they need. Maybe there will be a handful of apps average people may want to install, but really, how many hundreds of different versions of solitaire do we really need?

Each to his own of course. I for one am waiting a bit longer to get a new phone (it's been 4 years). When Win8 phones hit and they integrate with the desktop/tablet/xbox/etc I'll purchase. MS will have the best overwall integrated experience soon. Patience.


RE: I don't understand ...
By Varun on 10/18/11, Rating: -1
RE: I don't understand ...
By phatboye on 10/18/2011 12:14:14 PM , Rating: 5
I stopped reading your post after you claimed Android stole the idea of a grid of icons from the iPhone, as if the iPhone was the first device with a grid of icons.


RE: I don't understand ...
By Varun on 10/18/2011 12:30:05 PM , Rating: 1
That is true, I guess Windows 3.1 had a nice grid of icons as well.

Also I bet you didn't stop reading and you are just saying you did.


RE: I don't understand ...
By bupkus on 10/18/2011 2:56:50 PM , Rating: 2
Not so with me. I really did stop reading.


RE: I don't understand ...
By aju on 10/18/2011 12:43:58 PM , Rating: 2
While how innovative the interface is may depend to some degree on your personal preferences, the main issue here is that the Windows phones are not getting the same face time in the retail stores as Android and iPhone. If that changes with the new handsets from Nokia and Samsung, there is a strong possibility Microsoft will have serious growth. I am a database admin and I also develop software using Visual Studio. Our mobile division authors apps for our company in iOS, Android and Windows 7.5. As far as development goes, Windows destroys all the rest. It is by far the best development environment. If these devices start making inroads in businesses, I can see these businesses becoming exclusive to Windows. After all it just makes sense to let your developers create proprietary phone apps using the same code base used for in-house apps.
I currently own an Android HTC EVO 3D and love it. However, when my current contract is up, I will be very temped to switch to a Windows phone. By then, Windows 8 will be out and we could see massive integration between phones, PCs, tablets, and Xbox 360s.


RE: I don't understand ...
By bupkus on 10/18/2011 2:53:45 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
I don't understand why you unrelentlessly push it like this.


I don't understand why you relentlessly push it like this.

Fixed.


RE: I don't understand ...
By flybefree on 10/18/2011 10:20:32 PM , Rating: 2
Thanks. I try to pay attention to my grammar when posting. This one got past me.


RE: I don't understand ...
By NellyFromMA on 10/18/2011 3:11:33 PM , Rating: 2
I use 7 Launcher (a significantly inferior launcher compared to Windows Phone 7's for Android) on my Incredible because the interface is just that much better ,for me anyways.

The majority of people that actually get it in their hands agree. It's the consensus. THATS why.


RE: I don't understand ...
By GPig on 10/19/2011 2:15:08 AM , Rating: 2
Well the interface is considered innovative because of it's simplicity - It is consistent and requires less clutter on the screen than any other phone OS.

Android (although I love it) is a mess. Whenever I look at my Mrs SGS2 I want to kill the idiots at Samsung. UI design is not that hard! I have to customise the hell out of my N1 with launcher pro & icon packs to get it to look good. Granted, you can do it. It would be nice to not have too.

WP7 apps are growing faster than iOS or Android in their early days. This is simply because there's a huge amount of us software engineers/developers that use Microsoft products like visual studio. You can now develop first for WP7 in C# and port to iPhone/Android using Mono. This is only going to become more and more common place.

I do agree with you though (in the short term) that it can be really annoying when there's an app you can't get. Thankfully there's an army of us .NET (and former Symbian) guys gearing up to fix that.


RE: I don't understand ...
By TakinYourPoints on 10/19/2011 6:52:22 AM , Rating: 2
Unlike Android, WP7 has a great UI and an excellent SDK. All it needs are more applications and faster hardware and it can stand toe-to-toe with iOS.

It really is a great, polished mobile OS. The fact that Microsoft has failed to properly market a product that is so superior to Android kind of blows my mind.

IMO they really should encourage and market integration between WP7 and the XBox 360. There are millions of 360s in homes, and being able to use a WP7 device as a remote control or even a controller for certain games could be incentive for some people to buy one. I know that using an iPhone, iPod, or iPad as a remote control or audio output for home theater receivers, stereo docks, computers, or AppleTV is a great application.

Then there are third party developers doing this, and there's no reason it shouldn't be possible with an XBox: http://www.engadget.com/2011/10/07/real-racing-2-s...

Microsoft is sitting on entire game studios that they could devote to mobile gaming or applications that drive WP7/360 functionality. It would probably sell well and it would be a really good showcase of the technology.

It's a chicken and the egg situation with applications since they need the customers to drive more third party development. The SDK is great and they have a great app store, so they're like iOS in terms of quality but without the users. Microsoft leading the charge with their software development and building a platform with the 360 could actually help.


RE: I don't understand ...
By Gurthang on 10/19/2011 10:40:14 AM , Rating: 2
What you are missing is the social integration and the phone's focus on making the majority of tasks people use smartphones for faster and easier on WP7.

And while the tiles are for the most part very similar to android widgets, how you can pin active content like a friend or a web page to a new tile and have it act like a its own active widget feed for them is very nice. Also if you are big into social media like Facebook and Twitter how it pulls you friends, their content, and you connections to them in automaticaly is very nice.

Where WP7 fails is the relative immaturity of the APIs that third parties have to write to to create apps and that you can't makes the kinds of changes to the phone like you can in Android.

I can say for me and my general dislike of social media WP7 does not interest me yet. I like the mutablity of Android though to be fair I find the stability, and the basic interface wanting in Android. And don't get me going on custom ROMs or the screwed up update process in Android.

Since it seems the Galaxy Nexus does not appear to be comming to my carrier I think I will hold out with my Galaxy S and reevaluate WP7 and Android in 6 months.


“And I don't know why [Apple is] acting like it’s superior. I don't even get it. What are they trying to say?” -- Bill Gates on the Mac ads














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