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OGA will join WGA in the fight against piracy. Also, Microsoft adds some new features to WGA

For those of you who have bumped up against Microsoft's Windows Genuine Advantage (WGA) authentication system in Windows XP, you should know that Microsoft plans to carry over a similar system to its Office software.

Microsoft Office already uses the Office Validation Assistant (OVA) to verify if a computer is running a pirated version of the software, but the Office Genuine Advantage (OGA) program will be much more comprehensive. Although OGA is not yet earmarked for the North American market -- a pilot program just launched for Brazilian Portuguese, Czech, Greek, Korean, Simplified Chinese, Russian and Spanish languages -- it's only a matter of time before Microsoft turns adjust the scope of its program. A Microsoft spokeswoman claims "While Microsoft Office is committed to participating in the advantages of Microsoft's overarching Genuine Software Initiative (GSI), there's nothing further to announce at this time."

Furthermore, Microsoft is also adding a new feature to WGA which is sure to add another level of annoyance to persuade users to ditch their pirated versions of Windows.  According to MicrosoftWatch:

Microsoft is adding a new notification facility to WGA, so that Windows XP users who are running a "non-genuine" copy of Windows XP will have notifications sent directly to their desktop warning them they are running pirated software.

But alas, pirates are never too far behind when it comes to the latest anti-piracy solutions from Microsoft. There will likely be a hack to disable OGA and the new features in WGA within a week of its release.


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Alternatives
By littlebitstrouds on 4/25/2006 4:15:11 PM , Rating: 2
Maybe more people will just use alternatives (openoffice.org) causing those programs to get better and office to drop in price. I don't even want to know how much Microsoft makes off of a program that is only updated once every 3 years (talking major updates). No way it deserves the bloated price tag it gets.

Microsoft Word 2003
Microsoft Outlook 2003
Microsoft Excel 2003
Microsoft PowerPoint 2003 = $300 I just don't think so.




RE: Alternatives
By Bluestealth on 4/25/2006 4:41:18 PM , Rating: 2
Speaking of bloated alternatives... have you tried Open Office lately? Size, Memory, Speed, UI... I believe this is why soooo many people including me are still using Office 97/2000/2003 after trying Open Office... Despite their bloat and 3000+ features one person actually uses they are faster then Open Office.

P.S I don't include Outlook 97/2000 in my above statements... they are junk. I don't even use Outlook 2003 for my personal stuff because I don't like it :P


RE: Alternatives
By segagenesis on 4/25/2006 4:50:52 PM , Rating: 2
Not really here to fan the flames but the main issue here is pricing, not speed. Incorporating these sort of features probably would increase OpenOffice's use in other countries simply because they can't afford the full price of MS Office. Likewise, for those of us who own legitimate copies this is yet another hoop to jump through. I can only imagine the day when Office refuses to re-activate if you ever buy a new computer or even upgraded it.

And like the bootnote of the news posting, the workaround would be available within hours more likely. Someone else mentioned this but if they were really serious about piracy why dont they just shut the program down completely or make Windows not boot? Seems to me this is more about control than piracy.


RE: Alternatives
By Trisped on 4/25/2006 6:00:46 PM , Rating: 2
Hackers are going to crack the protection no matter what. The copy right protection is to stop non-hackers from stealing it. The people who have little right to use a computer, let alone pirate software.

As for open office, does it have integrated VB or C++? Most of my office time is spent writing VBA apps for MS Word and Excel.


RE: Alternatives
By breethon on 4/25/2006 6:37:27 PM , Rating: 2
I have to laugh at you...what are you running a 486 processor? Come on! It runs fine on my machine. Loads just as fast as MS office does. And works just as good. Heck, you can even set it up to save as .xls and .doc files if you want. To even spend $100 on their crap is totally stupid. This genuine advantage crap and the activation stuff is really annoying. Yeah, they may stop a few people from running pirated stuff, but come on. Even the least PC savvy person can do a simple search and figure out how to bypass all their "checks and balances". Take their OS, I like Windows XP, but the fact that I have to call MS everytime I reinstall the OS, their so called automated phone system never works, so you end up entering (or saying) your installation id in vain, and then I have to repeat them to some foreign person (whom I can barely understand) read me 64 digits or whatever they are to finish my installation. ANNOYING!


RE: Alternatives
By filibusterman on 4/25/2006 7:10:42 PM , Rating: 2
agreed


RE: Alternatives
By brownba on 4/25/2006 7:22:15 PM , Rating: 3
quote:
Loads just as fast as MS office does


I'm running a 2500+ with 1GB of ram.
I just did a very non-scientific test.
Word loaded in 2 mississippi's,
OOo Writer took 11 mississippi's.


RE: Alternatives
By brownba on 4/25/2006 7:23:19 PM , Rating: 2
and I just tried re-opening each....
Word opened instantly,
Writer took 3 mississippi's.


RE: Alternatives
By meyerds on 4/25/2006 11:51:54 PM , Rating: 2
There's something you're missing about all of this, unfortunately... The reason OpenOffice doesn't open as fast as Microsoft Word is not because it's bloated, or a memory hog, or anything else like that...

It's because Microsoft pre-loads their shared dlls and executables into memory as windows starts (or more accurately, as you log in), which then allows their office applications to appear as though they load instantly (or very quickly, at least).

Is this a good solution? Perhaps. OpenOffice is currently working on their next major version, which will (give the option of?) pre-load in a manner similar to Microsoft's suite. There are also memory optimizations constantly being put in place. You will see OpenOffice's load times decreased significantly, soon. Another thing to consider is that Microsoft Office consumes a CD. OpenOffice is 90MB. More efficient? Less bloat?

Personally, I don't mind waiting an extra 5 seconds for an office app to load... I like knowing EXACTLY what is loaded in memory and what is taking CPU cycles. I prefer to keep my RAM and CPU as free as possible for stuff I want done *now*... not so I can occassionally save 5 seconds opening an office app.


RE: Alternatives
By glennpratt on 4/26/2006 2:20:28 AM , Rating: 2
Link/proof please. If your saying Office uses standard windows libraries, then yes, fine. If your saying office loading some sort of quickstart fearture I have never found it. They used of have a startup program in the past, but 2003 doesn't have it.

Anyway, OO.org 2 brought my 850 mhz P3 laptop to its knees in Ubuntu. Totally unusable unless all you did was open, wait, then type, look but don't touch type of computing. I don't care what excuse you have, If my laptop can play DVD's while I'm coding in another program, I should be able to use a friggen office app. I realize it's free and all, but it's roots certainly aren't.


RE: Alternatives
By meyerds on 4/26/2006 8:34:49 PM , Rating: 2
You are correct that Office uses the preloaded windows libraries. This alone significantly boosts performance. OpenOffice, however, to maintain its multi-platform ability (which may change with the portability of next-generation linux platforms), uses the Java VM. This, unfortunately, does slow performance significantly.

You may see the article regarding OpenOffice optimizations here: http://www.vnunet.com/vnunet/news/2153630/openoffi...

Up to Office 2003 (correct me if I am wrong) there are certain parts of the office suite that are preloaded. As the post below states, however, you have the option of removing the preload feature. This does not change loading time significantly, but it does use up more system RAM and CPU cycles.

So yes, we will see OpenOffice begin to compete with Microsoft Office in the loading time section - however, with convenience comes cost... in this case, available RAM and CPU - as is exactly the case with Microsoft Office. While OpenOffice does lag behind Microsoft Office in this area, one must realize that it is not inferior - with portability also comes cost. Lets see one version of Microsoft Office run natively on every other platform available.


RE: Alternatives
By Trisped on 4/26/2006 12:13:00 PM , Rating: 2
It does not preload on my comp because I disabled that, and word boots in 1 sec or less. Windows will optimize load times for commonly used apps, but it does it with both MS apps and 3rd party apps.

MS just optimized Office sine everyone was always complaining about how long it took to load.


RE: Alternatives
By SEAWOLF607 on 4/25/2006 7:48:27 PM , Rating: 2
I really dislike the close minded Open Source Zealots I've used both products. Open Office has a lot of features but it is SLOW. I have an AMD Athlon 64 3000+ with 1.5 gigs of RAM and Microsoft Office opens noticeably faster. The speed that the Microsoft product exudes is more than enough reason to keep me from wanting to switch to O.O. reguardless of price point.


RE: Alternatives
By Bonrock on 4/26/2006 4:56:59 AM , Rating: 2
I have not used the current version of OpenOffice.org on Windows. However, I have used it on the Linux machines at my school. These are Pentium 4 3GHz systems with 1GB of RAM, and the OpenOffice.org word processor takes at least 10 seconds to start up. MS Word, on the other hand, opens in the blink of an eye. Unless the Windows version of OpenOffice.org is somehow substantially faster than the Linux version, that's pretty crummy performance.

By the way, I thought the main reason OpenOffice.org is slow is because it's written in Java. Or am I mistaken about this?


RE: Alternatives
By Samus on 4/25/2006 8:55:56 PM , Rating: 2
open office is wonderful and all, but it is 1995-technology. calc has some wonderful features over excel, but thats about where it ends.

*it has no exchange-compatible email client (huge problem for businesses)
*it is poorly integrated with itself, it, calc doesn't talk to write, and when it does, its through mali (multiple application link interface) which, again, 1995 technology.
*it is not supported by universities or colleges, ie, no support/tutorial classes, so businesses can't train their employee's to use it
*it doesn't integrate with ANY programs specifically designed to integrate with office programs, such as database software (great plains, quicken, peechtree, ACT, sql programs, etc)
*it has no remote installation and/or management package
*like firefox, it is a huge memory (RAM) hog and has various memory leaks, very bad for old machines
*document compatibility is poor, especially with excel and access files, which is to be expected.


RE: Alternatives
By mushi799 on 4/25/2006 5:18:07 PM , Rating: 2
still using office 2000, its not MS is forcing you to buy the "latest and greatest"


RE: Alternatives
By Shivian on 4/25/2006 6:19:26 PM , Rating: 2
If you have to buy new licenses then you have to go for the current version. Office 2000 is good enough for most people but instead you have to pay for the bloatware.


RE: Alternatives
By Bonrock on 4/26/2006 4:53:12 AM , Rating: 2
Does OpenOffice.org have programs to compete with Outlook, OneNote, and Publisher from Microsoft Office? I find those programs very useful (particularly Outlook and OneNote).


RE: Alternatives
By AstroCreep on 4/26/2006 1:19:46 PM , Rating: 2
Major Upgrades every three years? Not even that soon, as far as I can see.
The latest 'big' upgrade was from 97 - 2000, and I think that this (2007) will be a big one too, so from 2000 - 2007.

Twice in 10 years isn't too bad. ;) $300 for the suite is indeed more than I want to pay though.


RE: Alternatives
By Trisped on 4/27/2006 3:31:32 PM , Rating: 2
Office XP was 2003, so 97 to 2000 to XP to 2007, about 3 years between releases. This will be a big one though, so I expect it will be a little more important to upgrade then it was from 97 to XP.


Lets be honest & practical
By crystal clear on 4/26/2006 10:26:38 AM , Rating: 2
To all those who complain-If you are/were a software writer/producer creating a good software ,you would ensure your hard work is protected in every way.Some people buy your software & some steal/copy it-what would you do,be honest with yourself & answer this question.
The attitude in Asia,former USSR,China,East Europe is "If you cannot buy it steal it" rather than EARN IT.
MS offfers many versions of Office-standard,professional,student, priced accordingly.Vista will be similar-versions/price.Why? to fit every budget or buying capacity.EARN SAVE & BUY IT then you know the REAL VALUE of your software.
I see in the USA hundreds of Indians who have worked & studied themselves out of poverty, to reach top positions in various sectors of the economy.They all come from India-Thats the only way & not BEG BORRROW STEAL.
Another example dont you lock your house/apartment before you go to work or You leave it open for anybody to come in & rip you off your hardearned money?
So why complain about OGA or WGA-accept it or settle for those free versions,you will get plenty in the future from Google.






RE: Lets be honest & practical
By Spinne on 4/26/2006 11:34:09 AM , Rating: 2
I hardly think that even the cheapest version of Office is suitably priced for wide spread adoption in anything other than a first world economy. For example, my girlfriend is volunteering in Honduras for a year. She's getting paid $200 per month. The Hondurans she works with get paid even less. Fortunately the entire organization is well supported here. However, how can you expect the locals to buy software at roughly $100-$200 per software. To compund the problem, you need several different things to have a truely functional PC.
I think the business strategy MS needs to adopt is to turn a blind eye towards piracy in developing and third world countries. Let the people get hooked, annd then a decade or so later, start implementing the anti-piracy steps that we go through here. After all, if they don't grow up using MS, they won't be as tempted to use MSA when they can afford to buy it legitimately.


RE: Lets be honest & practical
By mircea on 4/26/2006 12:25:01 PM , Rating: 2
I don't agree with pirating either, but your description of EARN SAVE & BUY doesn't apply at all to the countries you mentioned.
Because of birocracy and all the middle men trough witch products get here in eastern europe they get quite expensive compared with sorrounding EU countries. Not only that, but compare it to a medium income of $170 a month an almost inexistent student jobs and you sudenly realize that having pirated software is not so much a matter of attitude as of necesity and lack of options on many types of software. And even having legal open source alternative, once a better pirated option of a software appears, is preffered, since as you see by the income not many have performing computers.
I am looked at in amazement by people when they see original CD's for most of the software and games I have.

I still think the people should buy software so the company can invest in improving the software, but Microsoft and the likes should really start adjusting prices and supervise that they stay there afordable to the specific market.


RE: Lets be honest & practical
By NullSubroutine on 4/26/2006 1:04:34 PM , Rating: 2
when corporations take from the public and private indviduals its called profit, when the public or private individuals take from corporations its called theft.

if your 'stealing is stealing' motto were to be applied uniformly corporations are nothing more than organized criminals.


By crystal clear on 4/26/2006 1:44:56 PM , Rating: 2
Fake hardware & pirated software is indeed the work of organized criminals.Computer hardware & software are not like AID treatment drugs,that affect the poor in their millions.You can accuse those drug firms of overcharging ,not computer manufacturers or software.
Yes there are way & means whereby people in third world countries/underdeveloped countries can have access to computers/hardware,software.How-
MS can give older version of windows that we do not use at a dirt cheap price & or free in some cases.
Intel can give their older version of CPUs that we dont use anymore the same way.
Aid organizations/Educational institutions/church organization etc can be actively involved in this effort,also respective Govts in those countries.
There is no justification for theft/fraud


Not really a big deal
By Nekrik on 4/25/2006 9:25:29 PM , Rating: 2
Most software companies are heading in this direction already, with their own similar solutions. Adobe, Symantec, different game companies, they all have increased protection and eventually all commercial software may be that way, requiring online access for validation and/or activation. Not a big deal.

Personally, I don't think it's going to be the final key to push the masses to oo, most 'legitimate' users don't whine about the $500 price of a software app they used every fricken day.




RE: Not really a big deal
By cubby1223 on 4/25/2006 11:01:46 PM , Rating: 2
It is a big deal - especially when companies like Symantec screw it all up. NAV doesn't always install cleanly on every system - and when there's a problem, it's a huge problem that makes re-installation very difficult and time consuming. And I'm sure it's because of their anti-piracy measures. I tell people not to by NAV anymore, because it's just not worth the pain you go through to try and use it.

I'm tired of having my hard earned money paying for the growing pains of anti-piracy measures when I buy legit copies of software.


RE: Not really a big deal
By Nekrik on 4/26/2006 2:22:11 AM , Rating: 2
good point, I was thinking more on the idea of it being a little inevitable. Attempts like symantecs will be gone (hopefully) but there will be more and more companies going to greater measures and eventually they'll have to find some sort of standard.


Pricy
By clementlim on 4/25/2006 10:52:24 PM , Rating: 2
And again...If you earn USD3000 (average salary) a month, USD500 for MSO is still affordable after 2 months (or more) of savings. After all, you use it every day. If you are a student or undergraduate, part time jobs will cover it easily.

Now, let's look somewhere else, Malaysia for instance. If you earn RM3000 (average salary), can you buy MSO at RM1750 after a few months? What if you are a student? You can buy a whole computer with that amount.

Now, let's look at Indonesia. If you earn R5000000 (average salary) a month, can you buy MSO at R3500000 after a few months of savings?

Well...that explains why piracy happens. It is not right, but there is a reason why it happens: price.

Oh btw, OO is slower than MSO. Don't argue, it's been proven by numerous sources.




RE: Pricy
By jconan on 4/25/2006 11:43:52 PM , Rating: 2
3000 is a lot, not a lot of people that i know make that much, more like <900 a week and then after taxes, barely anything.


RE: Pricy
By masteraleph on 4/26/2006 2:03:30 AM , Rating: 2
Errmmmm...you may want to check your math there. $900 a week comes out to $45k/year (assuming 2 weeks of vacation). $3k/month is $35k/year. $700 a month is equivalent to $3k/month.

Now, if we're talking $3k after taxes, then it's obviously a whole different ballgame.


Openoffice is ok
By heedoyiu on 4/25/2006 8:35:54 PM , Rating: 2
Openoffice is decent software, is word better yes but, is openoffice so bad i would run and buy the 100 dollar bs price tag of word, i really think i will stick with the openoffice




By bpurkapi on 4/26/2006 2:46:36 AM , Rating: 2
In all honesty it is quite laughable that anyone will be using microsoft office in 5 yrs. Even now open office is decent enough in a price/performance comparison to beat office, but it will take 5yrs before companies and people take this to heart. Microsoft must think that their product is so superior that people will pay 100x more for it and then jump through hoops to use it, so it is really a simple question: Why do monopolies shoot themselves in the foot?




Office is not THAT expensive...
By Bonrock on 4/26/2006 12:55:07 PM , Rating: 2
Look, Office is not as expensive as people make it seem. You can get the Student and Teacher Edition for $124 at Costco.com, which includes Word/Excel/Outlook/PowerPoint. If neither you nor anyone in your household is a student or teacher (not that they check when you buy it), you can currently get the OEM edition of Office for $154 after rebate on Newegg.com.

Typically, a single computer program that you may use once in a while generally costs $30-50. At the prices I quoted above, you are looking at paying $31-$39 per program for a set of programs that you are probably going to be using on an almost daily basis. Now, I still know a lot of people who pirate Office, so I won't pass judgment on those who do--but unless you're mired in poverty, please don't use the "it's too expensive" excuse.




Online Office Suites
By Fara on 4/26/2006 3:11:02 PM , Rating: 2
Online office suites are not the answer for every user, but they are available. What this anti-piracy program may do is drive some consumers towards online software such as http://gOFFICE.com in an effort to avoid the messages. The online office suites are not as robust as the Microsoft product, but may meet the needs of some users.

Microsoft is doing a great job of pushing people towards alternative products. I couldn't have done a better job of pushing folks towards free software.




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