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The Chinese navigation system will include an encrypted channel as well

People all over the planet depend on the GPS satellite positioning system for all sorts of things from navigating in their cars to keeping up with equipment and personnel. China says that it intendeds to have an operational GPS system covering all of Asia by 2010.

Despite the 2010 date specified, Chinese officials aren’t giving up much information. In fact officials from Japan say that it and China have had no talks concerning interoperability of the two nations GPS satellite systems. This is despite the fact that both China and Japan are members of the International Committee on Global Navigation Satellite Systems (ICGNSS) that was founded to ensure global interoperability of navigation satellite networks.

China has also not yet completed frequency coordination with the other ICGNSS member nations including the U.S., Europe, Russia and others. According to Space.com, Chinese officials said at the Toulouse Space Show that China’s global Compass/Beidou system would be fully compatible with the U.S. GPS, European Galileo, and Russian Glonass global navigation constellations.

Japanese officials are concerned about the Chinese Asia regional system because Japan is developing its own regional system called the Quazi Zenith Satellite Systems which will have three satellites in a highly elliptical orbit with an apogee over Japan and Asia. According to Satoshi Kogure from the Japan Aerospace Exploration Japanese Agency some in Japan feel the Chinese navigation satellite system is an important issue for Japanese national security.

The head of the Galileo unit at the European Commission financing the development of the Galileo constellation notes that when the U.S., Russian, Chinese and European medium Earth satellites are added together there could be 120 operational navigation satellites in medium Earth orbit.

The Chinese satellite system will also reportedly include an encrypted channel, presumably for use by the Chinese military.



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"G"PS
By mjcutri on 5/8/2008 2:31:04 PM , Rating: 2
I thought GPS stood for "Global" Positioning System. If GPS is global, why do all these other countries need their own systems?




RE: "G"PS
By dagamer34 on 5/8/2008 2:35:51 PM , Rating: 3
In the future, the US might get pissy and turn it off for these countries, so they feel they need their own. Plus, other countries don't like relying on the US for stuff.


RE: "G"PS
By Ananke on 5/8/2008 3:05:37 PM , Rating: 2
The first thing in a war conflict is to shut down your opponent's telecomunications. China shoot twice low and high orbit satelites successfully last year. They need GPS system too, for modern warfare operations. They develop cyberattacks successfully too. Chinese military budget balooned recently and the fact affects the rapid development of modern warfare technics. So, yes, they need and will place their GPS satelites.
Also, don't forget that GPS satelite may perform additional spy functions. Low orbit satelites are the best way for noticing a wing-rocket or balistic nuclear launch, and to track down nuclear submarines. The careers and support ships you don't need to count, they will be the first thing wiped out by tactical nuke :) ...Very bright future we have, don't you think so?


RE: "G"PS
By tastyratz on 5/8/2008 4:45:58 PM , Rating: 5
quote:
and to track down nuclear submarines

Why would they need their own gps for that? They could just use google for free!!
:-)


RE: "G"PS
By lompocus on 5/9/2008 3:23:00 AM , Rating: 1
You forget one important fact: You are not Chinese. They do not need their own satellites.

Would you trust a homocidal monkey who's just gone from living in a cage to inheriting Bill Gates' private island... would you trust them with high tech?

Besides, never count nukes. If anything their satellites will be the first thing targeted by the US in the event of war. China is not friendly, therefore deny them satellites.

Then, people like you come along and say the rest of the world should have teh same thing the US has and we shoudl not interfere :_.

...Eh, oh well. China wouldn't last an hour in open conflict with the US. They buy and build big stuff and train their people how to use it afterwards :_ .


RE: "G"PS
By wordsworm on 5/9/2008 9:44:59 AM , Rating: 3
quote:
...Eh, oh well. China wouldn't last an hour in open conflict with the US. They buy and build big stuff and train their people how to use it afterwards :_ .


That might be true. However, it didn't stop them from beating the US and France in Vietnam, or forcing a draw between N and S Korea.

quote:
Besides, never count nukes. If anything their satellites will be the first thing targeted by the US in the event of war. China is not friendly, therefore deny them satellites.


If America has a hard time dealing with Iraq, how in the heck do you think it will fare against China? China is as old as time. In any case, China doesn't need to ask for permission to put satellites into orbit.

quote:
...Eh, oh well. China wouldn't last an hour in open conflict with the US.
Al Qaeda is causing all kinds of trouble for the US. Al Qaeda would be a walk in the park compared to China. Nobody has ever conquered China. Taking a little rock and forcing narcotics into China (referring to England in Hong Kong) or taking a few beaches (Japan) is a far cry from actually taking all of China. It also demonstrates a poor working knowledge of their beliefs in how to win a war - time is a weapon that they wield very well, and consequently it's the west's biggest weakness. China's been around forever, as they say. Whereas the west has amnesia whenever a new president with a different mandate is elected. I'm not Chinese, however I admire their mind boggling contribution to mankind.

Al Qaeda doesn't have the power to hit the US. China, on the other hand, very well might. China's just strong enough that a conflict with them could very well reach America's shores.

quote:
Would you trust a homocidal monkey who's just gone from living in a cage to inheriting Bill Gates' private island... would you trust them with high tech?


China is developing its own technologies. To deny their contribution to world inventions is absolutely blind. You couldn't get a rocket into space without Chinese technology (see ceramics, the compass, and steel as just a few of the technologies that they pioneered.)


RE: "G"PS
By Noya on 5/9/2008 10:40:55 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
If America has a hard time dealing with Iraq, how in the heck do you think it will fare against China?


quote:
Al Qaeda is causing all kinds of trouble for the US.


Again, Iraq is not open warfare involving massive air, land and sea power. It's simple guerrilla warfare (think Vietnam)...but in crowded cities packed with civilians who look just like the enemy = the most difficult ground fighting IMO.


RE: "G"PS
By wordsworm on 5/9/2008 11:34:52 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Again, Iraq is not open warfare involving massive air, land and sea power. It's simple guerrilla warfare (think Vietnam)...but in crowded cities packed with civilians who look just like the enemy = the most difficult ground fighting IMO.


Al Qaeda is tough, but I just can't see them being the equal of a full Chinese vs. Anyone conflict. China's pretty good at whatever it puts its mind to.


RE: "G"PS
By masher2 (blog) on 5/9/2008 1:30:01 PM , Rating: 2
> "Al Qaeda is tough, but I just can't see them being the equal of a full Chinese vs. Anyone conflict. China's pretty good at whatever it puts its mind to"

At current rates of expansion, China's economic and military might will exceed the US within the next three decades.


RE: "G"PS
By SiN on 5/10/2008 11:28:25 AM , Rating: 2
3 decades is a large estimation. I wouldn't be supprised to see it surpass within 10 years. The USA has some good tech, but china are incredible at doing big things at a fast pace.

Anyway, I don't think china would be a threat unless provoked. Military research tends to be the catalyst for discovery and invention.


RE: "G"PS
By wordsworm on 5/10/2008 1:00:35 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
3 decades is a large estimation. I wouldn't be supprised to see it surpass within 10 years. The USA has some good tech, but china are incredible at doing big things at a fast pace.


I agree. It's not just China's growth, but also America's diminishing that may bring the two to equal footing in the not so distant future. Bush really has messed things up pretty bad for the US. I think McCain and Obama are both decent people, with a slight nod going to McCain. Both of them seem fairly intelligent and earnest in their desire to make America a better country - but I'm worried either one will be too little, too late. What can be done to save America now? This is an important question, not just for Americans, but for folks around the world. A depressed America is a danger to everyone and everything. Let's hope that it can recover quickly.


RE: "G"PS
By MGSsancho on 2/22/2013 11:37:55 PM , Rating: 2
China shot down two low Earth orbit sats not geosynchronous orbit GPS ones. the downed sats were at around 500 miles from Earth not 22,200 miles needed for geo-sync. Missiles needed to shoot down L.E.O. objects are relatively small as the U.S. did a mee-too thing with a ship fired apparatus. A massive rocket is needed to reach the outer ones. Still someone could launch a nuke and detonate a regular ICBM at it's apex altitude do serious damage to just about everything https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZoic9vg1fw


RE: "G"PS
By the goat on 5/8/2008 3:04:48 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
If GPS is global, why do all these other countries need their own systems?

The USA's GPS system is capable of calculating much more accurate positions then we allow with the "free GPS" signals. There are additional (more accurate) encrypted signals from our (USA's) GPS satellites which our military use. But we don't allow other militaries to use these more accurate signals.

Why does Mainland China want their own system? They want unrestricted access to and full control to their own accurate GPS system for their military.

Why does Japan want their own system? The Japanese love gadgets so they can't resist making their own system just so that they can play around with it.

Why does Europe want their own system? If I was a cynic I'd say, "Because they are a bunch of socialist elitists and they envision a USA vs. European political and social rift developing over the next few decades." But that is a pretty big what if. . .


RE: "G"PS
By KristopherKubicki (blog) on 5/8/2008 3:24:01 PM , Rating: 2
Don't forget GLONASS either :)


RE: "G"PS
By martinrichards23 on 5/9/2008 5:17:05 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Why does Europe want their own system? If I was a cynic I'd say, "Because they are a bunch of socialist elitists and they envision a USA vs. European political and social rift developing over the next few decades." But that is a pretty big what if. . .


The European system is - by virtue of being newer - FAR superior to the American one, plus it seems crazy to rely on a single system to do something so important.


RE: "G"PS
By the goat on 5/9/2008 7:32:07 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
The European system is - by virtue of being newer - FAR superior to the American one, plus it seems crazy to rely on a single system to do something so important.

Newer = better. Sorry but the USA's GPS is just as new and good as any other system. We continue to add new satellites to the constellation every other year or so. The new satellites have more accurate clocks and stronger transmitters. There is no reason to invent a new wheel. There is no better design then round.


RE: "G"PS
By SiN on 5/10/2008 11:37:25 AM , Rating: 2
At the end of the day the USA GPS is property of the USA, leaving it up to the USA to do what it wants. By the time the EU has theirs up it will be more "advanced" but by how much is debatable.

In reality, USA wouldn't depend on anyone else, why should anyone else depend on the USA? Or depend on anyone else for that matter?

However, unfortunatly for the EU, China will have theirs up first (and will probably be more advanced).

Completely off topic can anyone tell me if pot is legal in China?


RE: "G"PS
By FITCamaro on 5/8/2008 3:07:03 PM , Rating: 1
The US GPS system is also getting a bit dated.

As far as us turning it off for others, doubtful that it will ever happen unless we are at war with said country.


RE: "G"PS
By KristopherKubicki (blog) on 5/8/2008 3:48:38 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
The US GPS system is also getting a bit dated.

This just isn't true. The US has 58 GPS satellites, and since 2005 it already launched 6 L2C birds.

GLONASS, probably the next best system, is sort of a hybrid of Cold War satellites, with 14 current generation birds, 7 much older satellite sand a few spares.

Single band resolution:
GPS: 15 meter horizontal resolution
GLONASS: 57 meter horizontal resolution
Galileo: 15 meter horizontal resolution

Of course, when you take into account the L2 band (which will be added to GLONASS and Galileo, someday...) and multi-signal processing, the *civilian* bands of GPS do sub-1m resolutions.

Just cause we have lots of stuff flying around up there doesn't mean its dated. :)

Makes you wonder what sort of insane capabilities the 33 IIF Air Force satellites are going to add to military-only GPS when they launch next year.


RE: "G"PS
By sapster86 on 5/8/2008 4:50:14 PM , Rating: 2
Using RTK corrections it possible to achieve +-3cm in real time using GPS.


RE: "G"PS
By FITCamaro on 5/8/2008 5:21:27 PM , Rating: 2
I wasn't trying to knock our GPS.


RE: "G"PS
By Apoxie on 5/8/2008 6:31:13 PM , Rating: 2
Galileo starts with both bands, so you can drop the someday...

The free of use service will achieve an accuracy of <4 m horizontally and <8 m vertically if they use both OS bands.

The fee based encrypted service will offer an accuracy of better than 1 m.

But its strange that China now wants their own system. They are already a partner in the Galileo program and paying for it.


RE: "G"PS
By Ringold on 5/8/2008 9:36:19 PM , Rating: 2
They're probably trying to ingratiate Europeans. If the bombs start to fly, however, they don't want to rely on American signals, as we are a likely target, and they don't want to rely on Europeans, because, beyond being a supposed US ally, they wear their morality on their sleeve and could do something stupid, like shut down the system to avoid it being used in conflict.

Thus, I can see why China, and any other respectable power, may want one.

I still don't see why Europe would want one; their security completely relies on the blank check of US support by way of NATO. They're too weak to act alone, so if they ever crawl out of our bed they'd have to crawl in to some one elses who would likely have a system of their own as well.

Well, actually, I do know why Europe wants one, but I mean a reason other than pride.


RE: "G"PS
By SiN on 5/10/2008 12:12:54 PM , Rating: 2
We have the best special tactical unit in the world at present, the SAS, Bristish. We have a joint venture into trade with one another and security.

The EU is not weak; United Kingdom, Sweden, Spain, Slovenia, Romania, Portugal, Poland, Netherlands, Malta, Luxembourg, Lithuania, Latvia, Italy, Ireland, Hungary, Greece, Germany, France, Finland, Estonia, Denmark, Czech Republic, Cyprus, Bulgaria, Belgium, Austria. Add in Turkey Croatia and The Former Yogoslav Republic of Macedonia when they fully join.

Why do people say the EU is weak. We do not supply china with weaponry due to a treaty which cam eunder scrutiny recently due to Chinas wish to buy weaponry from Germany.

The EU defence budget is 311,920,000,000 Euros (2007) ,2008 USA =583,283,000,000 Euros, 2008 China =59,000,000,000, 2008 Russia =40,000,000,000 Euros

It gets to me how people play down the EU defence.

We also have the Eurofighter Typhoon, although the F22 is better.

Given we could be easily wiped out by nukes.

EU Active Military Personnel = 1,582,605
Add in Turkey the total becomes = 2,097,445
USA = 1,426,026
China = 2,255,000

But then again, we aren't interested in war. We are interested in development, trade, technology and Defence. And trade future is with eastern europe (Russia, China, India etc...)


RE: "G"PS
By Lonyo on 5/8/08, Rating: 0
"Spreading the rumors, it's very easy because the people who write about Apple want that story, and you can claim its credible because you spoke to someone at Apple." -- Investment guru Jim Cramer











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