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This time, expect the BDP-S1 in late October

DailyTech reported a couple of weeks ago that Sony's BDP-S1 Blu-ray player had been delayed until around August 15th. Compatibility issues have been batted around by a number of pundits as to the reason for the delay, but no one has been able to confirm with the Sony the exact reason behind the missed launch dates. Well today, we hear word from Gamesindustry.biz that the BDP-S1 has been delayed yet again -- this time until October 25th.

At this rate, Sony's first commercial Blu-ray player will hit the market just weeks ahead of the PlayStation 3's official launch. That pretty much puts a nail in the coffin for Sony’s own plans of getting a head start on Blu-ray market penetration before November. From Gamesindustry.biz:

However, with the ongoing delays to the BDP-S1, it now appears that the PlayStation 3 is set to be a very early standard bearer for the high definition Blu-Ray discs - which may reflect simply a failure by Sony to get its hardware manufacturing timescales right, but equally could represent a change of strategy on the part of the Japanese consumer electronics giant.

With a price tag of $999.95 in the United States, the BDP-S1 is priced even higher than the PlayStation 3 ($499 for the 20GB version and $599 for the 60GB version) which has been constantly attacked by industry analysts and gamers alike for its high price of entry. And at least with that machine, you can play all of the latest games on the market along with your high definition movies.

While Sony's BDP-S1 may be delayed and delayed…and delayed, the company can at least take comfort in the fact that at least one Blu-ray player is shipping: the Samsung BD-P1000.

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This is heartbreaking news
By bigboxes on 6/22/2006 6:30:17 PM , Rating: 2
I'm having trouble sleeping what with the constant delays in getting Blu-Ray out to the masses. It just chokes me up. *sniff*




Blu-Ray = Betamax + UMD
By tenguman on 6/22/2006 6:34:40 PM , Rating: 2
I'll Paypal anyone here $20 that the PS3 doesn't come out until March 2007...


RE: Blu-Ray = Betamax + UMD
By dmoore764 on 6/22/2006 7:05:26 PM , Rating: 2
Is that a bet or are you just going to give us $20? I could use it to put my first BR-D movie on layaway. Exciting!


RE: Blu-Ray = Betamax + UMD
By tuteja1986 on 6/23/2006 12:27:50 AM , Rating: 2
Well according to most Blu-ray review i have read , they all say its not better than HD-DVD in quality and some some Blu-ray movie are just terrible in quality like 5th element.

They also say that HD-DVD has more feature and option than blu-ray and most movies look better in image quality than current Blu-ray Titles.



RE: Blu-Ray = Betamax + UMD
By probedb on 6/23/2006 5:29:32 AM , Rating: 2
The Digital Bits said the 5th Element was a big pile of poo. Sony in their infinite wisdom decided using MPEG2 as a codec would be best when they can't even produce dual-layer discs yet! I was really hoping Blu-Ray would win but at this rate I doubt it.


Sony Burn in Hell !!!
By SaintSinner1 on 6/23/2006 10:58:26 AM , Rating: 2
Blue ray is technology from hell as a good christian I'm boycoting SONY products. Sony burn in Hell ... Just throw some holly water on your Sony TV it will start burning ...:))


How can...
By GGA1759 on 6/22/2006 7:06:47 PM , Rating: 2
How can Samsung get it right, when the originator can't?

Do you think this will really put a dent into Sony's strategy to dominate with Blu-Ray?




RE: How can...
By nowayout99 on 6/22/2006 7:18:47 PM , Rating: 2
I'm not sure it's more than a tiny blip on the radar. As far as format adoption goes, there's still only a small fraction of people that'll pony up the cash for an HD player this year. It's a small pond.

They're probably banking more on the PS3 to push BRD ahead.


RE: How can...
By OddTSi on 6/22/2006 8:00:02 PM , Rating: 2
The other problem is that apparently they're having problems with yields for dual-layer discs, so they're stuck at 25GB for the moment. Looks like their earlier claim of having 50GB discs at launch turned out not to be true. Remember months ago when MS came out and said that technically HD-DVD has higher capacity since the 50GB Blu-Ray discs weren't ready for release and Sony replied with "they'll be ready before launch." Looks like MS was right.

Wasn't there also some talk about quality problems with the movies because for some reason they're using MPEG2 and not H.264 or VC-1?

Honestly, if I was looking to get an HD player right now, with all of the problems Blu-Ray is having I'd definately have to go with an HD-DVD player. I'm sure these little issues will be fixed sooner or later, but if they're fixed later rather than sooner then HD-DVD might have a big enough market share that Blu-Ray won't be able to catch up.


RE: How can...
By masher2 (blog) on 6/22/2006 10:30:19 PM , Rating: 2
> "Wasn't there also some talk about quality problems with the movies because for some reason they're using MPEG2 and not H.264 or VC-1? "

Yes. The first Blu Ray movies are smaller than HD-DVD, and using a codec that requires a higher bit rate. Not a good combination..and one that's already led to complaints about the image quality.


RE: How can...
By Shivian on 6/22/2006 8:39:31 PM , Rating: 3
Samsung can follow a spec :)


constantly attacked?
By lwright84 on 6/22/06, Rating: 0
RE: constantly attacked?
By Shivian on 6/22/2006 8:40:23 PM , Rating: 2
For a console it has a high price.


RE: constantly attacked?
By lwright84 on 6/22/06, Rating: 0
RE: constantly attacked?
By abhaxus on 6/22/2006 10:18:38 PM , Rating: 2
as a console, the price is not reasonable.

as a console and a blu ray player, the price is reasonable.

if the ps3 is anywhere near the same quality bluray player as the ps2 was a dvd player then sony is going to have some problems on their hands.


RE: constantly attacked?
By lwright84 on 6/24/2006 1:35:26 PM , Rating: 1
even as a console the price is reasonable, imo.


RE: constantly attacked?
By Alexvrb on 6/25/2006 2:31:01 AM , Rating: 2
As you said, if I want a console, it is an unreasonable price. Offer me a PS3 that doesn't have Blu-ray. I'd be happy with DVD9, two discs if you've got something twice as big as Oblivion. Oh wait, I forgot. It's not a console. It's a launch platform for Blu-ray. I have this strange feeling they've been planning this since the success of the PSX, like a "Revenge of the Betamax" plot.
If they were serious about it as a console: They could have it both ways, squish Xbox 360 with a $300-400 price tag, and also offer models with Blu-ray (modular drive for later upgrades too?) for less than many Blu-ray players. But they aren't playing to win the console market. They feel they've already done that, and so they can use the market (that they've already won) to take over another market. Only time will tell if they are wagering too much, but unfortunetely they probably aren't.

Also, you're quite right about the PS2 DVD playback. Especially bad on earlier models, but even with my little PSToo I remain unimpressed.


RE: constantly attacked?
By Cunthor01 on 6/23/2006 12:48:12 AM , Rating: 2
Its not a console, its a PC.

No wait, it is a console.


Ouch
By nowayout99 on 6/22/2006 6:55:10 PM , Rating: 2
Ugh. Maybe they really want the cheaper PS3 to be their first BRD player, to try to guarantee demand? Meh, who cares.




RE: Ouch
By rrsurfer1 on 6/22/2006 7:01:39 PM , Rating: 2
Yea. I see this as a stategy to provide greater value to the PS3. I dunno if it's a good strategy, I guess that depends on how many other manufacturers can get players on the market, and how fast movie studios get the media out.


RE: Ouch
By smilingcrow on 6/23/2006 3:46:49 AM , Rating: 2
The original PS2 was a lousy DVD player as it was so noisy. The PS3 has some pretty hi spec components in a fairly compact case, so surely that’s going to be hard to cool quietly! So you’ll be sitting there being under whelmed by the MPEG2 HD footage on your Blu-ray disc, whilst your PS3 makes like a vacuum cleaner. Oh, I can’t wait. Microsoft must like Sony, as they’re so bad that they make MS look good :)


RE: Ouch
By jimmy43 on 6/22/2006 9:23:31 PM , Rating: 2
Sony has too many eggs in one basket... Not such a good idea for a company in their position. Look at samsung and their portfolio, they are some of the biggest suppliers of LCD screens, Flash memory, AND consumer devices. Sony is tying down all their divisions to Blu-Ray, they better hope for the best or this might be the end of them.


Can BluRay Win?
By PitbulI on 6/22/2006 8:53:01 PM , Rating: 2
Toshiba has the HD DVD player out, Sony keeps delaying their drive, higher capacity discs are having yield problems, The PS3 has been delayed to November at the earliest. Ouch. Sony could be hurting next year.

Then again, The PS3 could be a winner even though it is priced around $700 dollars CAD which is pricey when you have Nintendo coming back with almost a sure winner and Sony losing some exclusive deals for games to Microsoft like the WWE game. What's next? Tekken?




RE: Can BluRay Win?
By xit2nowhere on 6/22/2006 9:33:45 PM , Rating: 2
Let's call Ms. Cleo. Maybe she'll tell us when to expect the first real player to appear on store shelves. :)


RE: Can BluRay Win?
By Alexstarfire on 6/23/2006 1:33:40 AM , Rating: 2
While you're at it why don't you ask her when Duke Nukem: Forever is coming out.

I think it's all a big ploy. Make up some BS "delay issues" just to get the PS3 to sell better. I can't say it's a bad idea, yet. If too many other companies relase blu-ray players and/or HD-DVD players then Sony could be looking at a huge loss. Basically, the plan could backfire big time. Sony is counting on way too many assumptions, and you know what they say about making assumptions.


RE: Can BluRay Win?
By Xeeros on 6/23/2006 8:44:28 AM , Rating: 2
It's a horrible idea and Sony should probably fire the person who thought of it, if in fact they are thinking that the PS3 will save blu-ray. Okay im sure everybody here knows that all game consoles are sold at a loss and that is recouped by the game sales. Now if everybody ends up buying PS3 for a blu-ray player and not primarily for games then what makes you think the outcome will be any different then that of betamax. I mean the launch titles for PS3 don't interest me much now add in the limited number of units and the answer becomes alittle clearer. Perhaps the delay serves two purposes one being of course the crappy playback reviews on the launch units and two being that they are holding more bluray drives for PS3. Of course when taking into account the bad Sony Movie discs and that other movie studios did a better job, perhaps Sony isn't triing to push bluray this year and is in wait since the 5th element and others were disappointing I can't imagine Samsung being too happy that the only blu-ray player news is bad news.


MPEG2
By Alphafox78 on 6/23/2006 8:23:26 AM , Rating: 2
Blueray has little benefits as it is, why the HECK would you want it if they are using MPEG2 for the movies?? isnt the whole point of it using MPEG4 (in its different forms), so if they start out with crappy mpeg2 and just rencode it it is totaly worthless. its called up-converting..




RE: MPEG2
By abhaxus on 6/23/2006 10:19:12 AM , Rating: 3
low quality mpeg2 is what is used on DVDs. similar mpeg2 compression at higher bitrates is used for HD television. mpeg2 at a high enough bitrate will look just as good if not better than mpeg4. however, as HD-DVD has shown, mpeg4 at high bitrates looks incredible. i can't really understand why they went with lossy mpeg2 for bluray's first movies. i havent seen them yet, but i can't imagine they would look better than HD-DVD.


RE: MPEG2
By masher2 (blog) on 6/23/2006 11:19:44 AM , Rating: 1
> "mpeg2 at a high enough bitrate will look just as good if not better than mpeg4."

Um, take ANY codec at a high enough bitrate, and it looks good. Take the bitrate high enough, and your codec is essentially just spitting out raw, uncompressed video...which is as good as it gets. The challenge is to look good at LOW bitrates.

At similar bitrates, Mpeg2 underperforms Mpeg 4 and VC-1.


isn't it funny...
By vtohthree on 6/22/2006 9:36:13 PM , Rating: 4
Sony "invents" Blueray yet they can't even released a player for it before a third party does. I think it's halarious that Samsung already released a blueray player to the market before the inventor of the technology does. Maybe they should go to Samsung and ask them how to make their player properly.




The Only Way...
By qdemn7 on 6/22/2006 8:16:50 PM , Rating: 2
I would have either format if I were given one. Other than that, no way. Let someone else be the sucker this time.




What time is it?
By RyanM on 6/22/2006 11:04:01 PM , Rating: 2
Time to do a little jig in celebration!




Big news!
By fishbits on 6/23/2006 9:27:36 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
And at least with [PS3], you can play all of the latest games on the market along with your high definition movies.

Sure, Sony's had problems, but this news that it will offer XBox 360 and Wii compatibility is HUGE! :P




Yay
By gramboh on 6/23/2006 11:04:07 AM , Rating: 2
Yay! Always a good day when you read about bad news for Sony and Blu-Ray.




By techhappy on 6/25/2006 7:36:24 PM , Rating: 1
I really hope the better technology wins out this time, or we might have a repeat of the Beta vs VHS wars in the eighties. In which case, I'm going to wait this HD-DVD vs. Bluray battle out until there is a clear winner.

Good luck to both sides!




"Game reviewers fought each other to write the most glowing coverage possible for the powerhouse Sony, MS systems. Reviewers flipped coins to see who would review the Nintendo Wii. The losers got stuck with the job." -- Andy Marken











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