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Steve Wozniak  (Source: cultofmaccom.netdna-cdn.com)
He said we lose ownership of the content once it is stored in the cloud

Apple co-founder Steve Wozniak recently said that he isn't a fan of the cloud because no one really owns the content that it stores.
 
Wozniak, who co-founded Apple with former CEO and the late Steve Jobs in 1976, spoke at "The Agony and the Ecstasy of Steve Jobs" in Washington recently, where Mike Daisey hosted a two-hour expose of Apple's suppliers' factory working conditions in China. 
 
At this event in Washington, Wozniak spoke about several topics, including the controversial conditions for the company's workers in China. But the former Apple guru also had plenty to say about his dislike for cloud computing. 
 
"I really worry about everything going to the cloud," said Wozniak. "I think it's going to be horrendous. I think there are going to be a lot of horrible problems in the next five years.
 
"With the cloud, you don't own anything. You already signed it away. I want to feel that I own things. A lot of people feel, 'Oh, everything is really on my computer,' but I say the more we transfer everything onto the Web, onto the cloud, the less we're going to have control over it."
 
Apple's iCloud is a cloud storage and cloud computing service that was released to the public in October 2011. It stores data such as music and photo files on remote servers for download to multiple devices like the iPhone and iPad. Other tech giants have released cloud services of their own as well, such as Amazon's Cloud Drive/Cloud Player and Google's Drive Cloud Platform
 
Aside from cloud talk, Wozniak went on to discuss matters like China's labor conditions for Apple's suppliers. He said he expects labor conditions to evolve as nations become more wealthy. 
 
"We know we (citizens and consumers) have a voice," said Wozniak. "We can speak (about labor conditions), but we can't act like, 'Oh, Foxconn is bad' or 'Apple is bad.'"
 
Back in January, The New York Times published a lengthy report accusing Apple of standing by while its supplier's factories in China repeatedly violated the code of conduct. Problems like long hours, too much overtime, factory conditions (a build-up of aluminum dust led to an explosion in a Foxconn factory that built iPads), and crowded dorms were just a few of the issues cited in the article. 
 
Apple CEO Tim Cook fired back at the Times, saying that he was outraged by these claims and that Apple cares about each and every one of its workers. Apple then voluntarily joined the Fair Labor Association (FLA), which exposes the company to rigorous, random checks of each factory throughout China. 
 
From there, the results are a little fuzzy. Auret van Heerden, president of the FLA, said in February that the Foxconn plants were "not so bad." However, a little over a month later, other FLA investigators found overtime, pay and safety violations in the Foxconn plants in China. 

Source: Google



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5 Years???
By msheredy on 8/7/2012 12:09:03 PM , Rating: 5
Try now




RE: 5 Years???
By Hyperion1400 on 8/7/2012 12:59:26 PM , Rating: 2
Fact!


RE: 5 Years???
By FITCamaro on 8/7/2012 1:18:53 PM , Rating: 2
Yup. I like having my own copies.


RE: 5 Years???
By othercents on 8/7/2012 4:01:17 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Yup. I like having my own copies.


Copies vs Licenses. The cloud has given us the ability to be licensed for a product and not have to store physical copies of the software. Take Xbox 360 for instance. Is it better to place a DVD into the drive for each game, or have your games available based on licensed to your console or account?

The DVD makes it easy to go to your friends house and play the game, but the downloaded licensed version keeps you from having to handle all the games.


RE: 5 Years???
By augiem on 8/8/2012 4:53:18 AM , Rating: 3
And it lets them cut you off X years from now when they don't want to support that game anymore, you stop paying for a subscription, you break their terms of service, etc. Nostalgia gaming will be a thing of the past. Think you're gonna be able to get roms for any of these games 10-15 years from now? Then there's forced patching... Think they can't turn a paid game into a freemium-style in-game-purchases game? Think again. Game Loft did it with Oregon Trail. And then there'll be in-game ads that update in real time and a host of other grossness.


RE: 5 Years???
By MrBlastman on 8/7/2012 1:34:03 PM , Rating: 5
No cloud for me!


RE: 5 Years???
By augiem on 8/8/2012 4:24:17 PM , Rating: 2
If you have a smartphone you're already fueling the flames leading creating an ever bigger cloud.


iCloud
By name99 on 8/7/2012 12:41:18 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Apple's iCloud is a cloud storage and cloud computing service that was released to the public in October 2011. It stores data such as music and photo files on remote servers for download to multiple devices like the iPhone and iPad.


This statement misses the larger point of iCloud. iCloud is not a clone of DropBox or SkyDrive; it is a synchronization service based on a set of APIs. The fact that it operates by storing some of your data on remote servers is a means to an end, it is not an end in itself. In many ways the most important part of iCloud is the part that is in no way attached to individual files --- the key-value store and the CoreData store.
Like any large new project, there were initial problems, but those are being fixed. The fluidity with which something like Reminders just keeps data in sync across some Macs, an iPhone and an iPad, shows the larger goal.

The point is: if one wishes to be an educated observer of the tech scene, it is worth starting by understanding what a company is really doing, rather than starting by insisting that a company is following the model you think is following. Apple's goal with iCloud is to look forward to a future where
- we all have multiple devices
- we all want those multiple devices to interoperate seamlessly
- we want this seamless data experience to still work when we are offline and for 3rd party developers.
Google have part of this in place, but their solution is not as general for 3rd party developers, nor is it as robust for off-line data. I am not aware of APIs that MS has in place for this problem. As far as I know, they are at the same place as a company like DropBox, where what they provide you with is remote storage, but not the synchronization and history-based conflict resolution that Apple provides.

You may all now forget this and go back to your regular fact-free bashing of Apple if you wish.




RE: iCloud
By geddarkstorm on 8/7/2012 1:12:04 PM , Rating: 2
Everything you describe for iCloud sounds the same as Dropbox. It uses APIs too; syncs files across devices; the files are on your harddrive directly, and the folder is treated as a normal folder by the OS. Both also use remote servers for this purpose which have a copy of the files on them.

So... I'm not sure what difference you are trying to say from the descriptions you use. Do you have any more specifics on what makes iCloud so different and not applicable to the statement from the article?


RE: iCloud
By Natch on 8/7/2012 1:22:26 PM , Rating: 3
It's simply a matter, I'm sure, of the magical fairy dust that permeates everything Apple built, that makes the difference. That, and a healthy treatment from the Reality Field Distortion Generator!


RE: iCloud
By Cheesew1z69 on 8/7/2012 1:49:27 PM , Rating: 2
LOL! I was going to say that it was Apple and that was the difference.


RE: iCloud
By name99 on 8/7/2012 1:38:19 PM , Rating: 2
I already answered these points:
(a) iCloud synchronizes three types of data
- key-value store (think things like prefs --- where is my scroll position)
- core data (think database, with only relevant record being updated as necessary)
- files
All of these have version history also retained so that conflict resolution can utilize that version history (three-way merge)

As far as I know DropBox only stores files.

(b) DropBox does NOT offer equivalent APIs. See here for example
http://fletcherpenney.net/2012/05/dropbox_vs_iclou...
As I said, the issue is APIs for STORAGE, SYNC, and CONFLICT-RESOLUTION. DropBox appears to offer only APIs for the first of these three tasks.


RE: iCloud
By geddarkstorm on 8/7/2012 4:43:06 PM , Rating: 2
But Dropbox also handles conflict resolution, and it also syncs files. I don't think it does key-value store, although the Steam cloud does that. Dropbox definitely acts like that core data description, in that it only will update files that are noticed to have been changed, and re-syncs them.

Dropbox also keeps some version histories, and you can look at how a file has changed. Nothing you are saying seems to apply to iCloud differently from Dropbox except the key-value store. Not a big difference so far.

On the other hand, maybe you are talking about APIs in the sense of having other programs be aware of iCloud and use it in a dynamic way? Dropbox only seems to interface with the OS's filebrowser, in which case it acts like any old folder you've got.


no cloud for me
By ssobol on 8/7/2012 12:48:50 PM , Rating: 3
It's may be no big deal to put snapshots of your kid's 6th birthday into the cloud so all your friends can see them (or maybe it is). But to put any information that is important, sensitive, or confidential into the hands of some entity you don't control or even know its location seems very foolish to me.

You'll have no control if the company decides to give away (e.g. sell) your data (yes you could sue them, but how long is that going to take). The cloud company can also go out of business with no warning making your data unavailable. If the company does liquidate, what happens to the data on the servers which can be sold off to anyone.

Additionally, you could lose access to your information just because the cloud company servers go down for awhile. It wouldn't matter for your snapshots, but it could be a huge deal for a lot of other things.




RE: no cloud for me
By geddarkstorm on 8/7/2012 1:15:53 PM , Rating: 2
Thankfully, Dropbox is compatible with TrueCrypt. So you can encrypt your files, and no one can touch them but you with your key. So, there are ways around the problem with the Cloud, in that regard (at least with Dropbox, don't know for any others as I haven't used them).

Also fortunately, since the files are also on your devices and can be accessed offline. So, if Dropbox's servers were lost, you wouldn't lose your data. It's more like a convenient way to transfer files between computers through duplication. Can't say the same for other services if they act as a "steaming" hub, rather than just a synchronization system.

That's my understanding of it all from my daily use and experiments.


RE: no cloud for me
By JediJeb on 8/7/2012 6:55:16 PM , Rating: 2
I believe it is the Google service that has as part of their terms that anything you upload becomes their property and they can use it however they wish. Say you upload a photo of your child at a birthday party, if Google wants to use that for an advertising campaign you can't sue them because you already gave them permission to use it when you signed up for the service.

I wonder if you are a company storing data there, if you put trade secret information about your product on their servers could they use it without having to worry about patents or copyright since you gave them permission by agreeing to their terms of service?


RE: no cloud for me
By theapparition on 8/8/2012 9:32:01 AM , Rating: 2
No, that's facebook.

Google does handle your data a little more securely and doesn't treat it as their property, unlike facebook.

However, Google does monitor your data and then looks to target ads toward you. In laymans terms, they read your diary but don't try to sell that information directly.


RE: no cloud for me
By Dug on 8/8/2012 1:56:30 PM , Rating: 2
So you don't do online banking, online shopping, online regristration (car, boat, etc), online insurance?


RE: no cloud for me
By JediJeb on 8/8/2012 5:18:10 PM , Rating: 2
If those services run their own servers ( my bank has their own servers on site ) then it isn't using the Cloud, it is simply using a remote login to a local service. Now if you copy your data from there and store it on Google's Cloud servers then you are using the Cloud. Cloud computing is not simply using network connected systems, it is having your data and sometimes even your programs located on a remote server. True cloud computing would make it impossible to operate with a computer that isn't connected to the network since you would not have anything but the basic OS installed on your local machine.


FUD
By Ammohunt on 8/7/2012 9:29:51 PM , Rating: 1
The cloud and how it is used is ever evolving people now have reservations about putting everything in the cloud but kids nowadays will grow up knowing nothing different. Their usage and acceptance will drive its form and substance not us. The age on a single global computer/network is at hand i imagine that most major computing will be done remotely in 10-15 years and our kids will wonder in amazement at our archaic multi computer ways.




RE: FUD
By JediJeb on 8/8/2012 5:20:02 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
The age on a single global computer/network is at hand i imagine that most major computing will be done remotely in 10-15 years and our kids will wonder in amazement at our archaic multi computer ways.


Just as we wonder in amazement how a generation ago people used mainframe/terminal computing.

Everything old is new again :)


Cloud is overrated anyway
By jardows on 8/7/2012 2:17:23 PM , Rating: 2
What "the cloud" seeks to achieve is nothing new, I could setup sychronization and remote access to data over 10 years ago. The only difference is "the Cloud" is someone else doing it for you, rather than configuring your own servers. Makes it a lot easier for individuals to take part, but from a corporate network side, I'd rather not let my data be the responsibility of a company that has no vested interest in mine!




Cloud Disaster
By Isidore on 8/7/2012 8:35:34 PM , Rating: 2
I absolutely agree with Woz about the cloud. Furthermore, from a non US resident's point of view, and a very large proportion of Apple customers are not in the US, there are many further problems. Not only are you giving your data to someone else, in our case it is a foreign someone else subject to foreign laws. This enormously increases the risks and problems of keeping your data safe and getting it back. There is no way I would countenance using such a service even if it was secure. Once your files are not in your possession they're lost.




Whatcha Gonna Do...
By greywood on 8/8/2012 1:17:53 AM , Rating: 2
When your favorite flavor of cloud storage, where you have put all your irreplaceable photos goes out-of-business and dark forever? What if they decide to "monetize" all your personal documents by selling them to a bunch of sleezeball marketeers? What if all your files get "dot-commed" by the Feds. Whatcha gonna do then.... besides piss and moan, that is? I wouldn't trust cloud storage on a bet.




Woz could become annoying within 5 seconds
By invidious on 8/7/12, Rating: -1
By Misty Dingos on 8/7/2012 1:25:28 PM , Rating: 1
Dancing With The Stars!
How more relevant can a human be on this planet!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoiGJMZjs0o

OK so he wasn't very good. Really not good at all.

Hell maybe you are right.


RE: Woz could become annoying within 5 seconds
By woody1 on 8/7/2012 1:55:49 PM , Rating: 2
It's been longer than a decade, I would have thought. I think it's his name. People just love to say 'Woz'. If he were named Fred, he'd have faded away a long time ago.

He's the Apple version of Paul Allen, who's also famous mostly by association.


RE: Woz could become annoying within 5 seconds
By Cheesew1z69 on 8/7/2012 2:01:22 PM , Rating: 2
If he wasn't the BRAINS behind Apple in the early years, he'd have faded long ago...


By woody1 on 8/8/2012 4:57:20 PM , Rating: 2
WAS being the operative term. He left apple over 30 years ago. A lot has happened since then.


By Camikazi on 8/7/2012 2:15:15 PM , Rating: 2
I think you might be right about the name, Woz is kind of fun to say. Dammit now I am saying it over and over just cause and it kind of looses all meaning after a while.


By B3an on 8/7/2012 6:10:46 PM , Rating: 5
I'd much rather hear about Woz than that massive a-hole Jobs. And unlike Jobs, Woz isn't smug at all, he's a nice guy.


By Shadowself on 8/7/2012 6:58:46 PM , Rating: 3
Yes, Woz had been out of it for almost two decades. Today Woz is pretty much harmless and irrelevant.

However, that does not negate the impact he had on early computer designs. He almost single handedly designed the Apple 1 and Apple ][. His designs for some chips and circuits were still used in Macintoshes up through the late '90s. Just think of the circuits that allowed Macs to support not only 5 1/4 floppies (through external drives) but also both Apple/Sony's variants of the 3 1/2 inch drives (400k, 800k, 1.6M) and Microsoft's variants too (360k, 720k and 1.44M). No other system at that time natively supported all variants. The Super Wozniak Integrated Machine (or SWIM chip) is just one example of Woz's long impact on the personal computer world.

Finally, Woz is pretty much the antonym of smug.


By FaaR on 8/7/2012 7:56:20 PM , Rating: 5
Woz is a really, REALLY smart guy, so when he speaks about topics like these, at least I would listen.

And even if you were to be right in your assessment about his recent accomplishments (which I doubt is correct), he'd still have accomplished easily 10x more than you ever will in your entire lifetime.

So pipe down with the hate, OK. Woz is smarter, richer and better than you, even though he might not dance worth a damn.


"It's okay. The scenarios aren't that clear. But it's good looking. [Steve Jobs] does good design, and [the iPad] is absolutely a good example of that." -- Bill Gates on the Apple iPad














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