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Hardware Warner's Total HD On Hold for Now
Wolfgang Hansson (Blog) - September 17, 2007 5:01 PM

13 comment(s) - last by abhaxus.. on Sep 23 at 1:02 AM

Warner Home Video President Ron Sanders says Total HD discs on hold for now

At CES 2007, Warner announced they would bring Total HD discs to market by early 2008. These Total HD discs would have both HD DVD and Blu-ray version of the same movie on one disc, allowing playback on any high definition player on the market.

Warner is now saying that Total HD discs are on hold “for now,” coming after being pushed from a mid-2007 launch to early 2008 release. For now isn’t as bad as saying the format will never happen, but in statements, Warner Home Video President Ron Sanders made to TWICE, it sounds like the format may as well be dead.

Sanders told TWICE, “We’re concerned that as the only one publishing on it, it would be hard to make it go. We’re still looking at, though. We’re still talking to retail, but it’s kind of on hold right now.” Sanders also said they were excited about the prospect of dual format DVD players. If adoption of dual format players grows, Warner’s Total HD format would be a redundancy for consumers.

When asked if Warner was entertaining offers to go format exclusive, Sanders told TWICE, “We’re talking to both sides and it’s crazy right now. We remain committed to both for the time being. We’ll see how the fourth quarter plays out. The consumer is still kind of divided, and we still believe that we should offer the content in both formats. Now, we will watch the marketplace very closely, and see how it plays out, but for now we are supporting both.”

One disc with both high definition formats sounds simplistic but in reality, this new format would require custom replication hardware, which is expensive. The format itself would have worked since both Blu-ray and HD DVD use a 405nm laser to read data. One of the key differences in Blu-ray and HD DVD technologies is the depth at which the data is burned to the disc.

Blu-ray data is burned 0.1mm under the surface of the disc while HD DVD is a bit deeper at 0.6mm from the discs surface. The real issue with the technology in the minds of many users is the fact that consumers should know what format they need to buy for their high definition movies.

If you have a Blu-ray version of one movie at $30, the HD DVD version at $30 and a Total HD version at $35, it makes no sense to most consumers to buy the Total HD film for more money when they know their player works with Blu-ray or vice versa. The most obvious place for technology like Total HD to be of value would be in rental situations where movie stores could rent one disc and cover both high definition formats.

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Redundant

By ajfink on 9/17/2007 6:16:41 PM , Rating: 2

Double-sided Blu Ray/HD-DVD discs will be obsolete the day the first dual-format player is shipped. Smart move by Warner, it would be money down the drain.

RE: Redundant

By V2K on 9/17/2007 7:12:49 PM , Rating: 4

you mean like the LG Super Multi Blue player that came out in May and has a version 2 due soon?

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RE: Redundant

By abhaxus on 9/17/2007 11:23:59 PM , Rating: 2

More like the new Samsung and of course the BH200 from LG which will actually play all movies rather than a select few on HD-DVD like the BH100.

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RE: Redundant

By V2K on 9/18/2007 12:34:08 AM , Rating: 3

you've got to start somewhere. Before the LG player, everyone was saying "it will never happen" and "it can't be done" and "you would never survive at those sort of speeds!"

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RE: Redundant

By abhaxus on 9/23/2007 1:02:44 AM , Rating: 2

I still don't know of anyone that has actually survived ludicrous speed :(

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Other problems

By timmiser on 9/17/2007 8:55:10 PM , Rating: 2

In addition to the other issues, most stores now have a Blu-Ray display seperate from the HD-DVD display. The exisiting color coding also makes it very clear what format you are buying so the obvious question is what color do you make the packaging? Both blue & red? Then the question is do you put it in the blu-ray section or the HD-DVD section? Or both?

I'm already confused!!

RE: Other problems

By XtremeM3 on 9/18/2007 6:16:28 AM , Rating: 2

Actually I would think that video stores is where this format would shine.

Instead of getting x amt of HD-DVD movies and x amt of BRD movies, just get 2x of Total HD. That way you don't end up with a bunch of one format sitting on the shelf. (that's not accounting for the fact that some major rental companies are only now stocking one format - or so I've read, been a while since I was back in the states)

Also would be a little friendlier when it comes to people borrowing movies. No more "oh you have it on HD? I only have a BRD player...man, I really wanted to see that too."

Just a couple thoughts. Nice idea but I see it being more of a niche market than a global one. Just me.

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RE: Other problems

By lumbergeek on 9/18/2007 10:49:30 AM , Rating: 2

Fairly obvious - the colour would have to be Purple. The first disc that should be released as such would therefore be "Purple Rain". Oh, and it would be an a shelf between the two.

OK, back to reality - dual format players make this idea an obsolete one. Now if only the price were realistic....

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Do you really feel this is a true statement?

By SunAngel on 9/17/2007 9:25:11 PM , Rating: 4

quote:
The most obvious place for technology like Total HD to be of value would be in rental situations where movie stores could rent one disc and cover both high definition formats.

Hypothetically writing, say you have demand for 100 Hi-Def movies. You buy 100 Total HD movies at $35 for total $3500USD. For the sake of simplicity say demand is split equally 50/50 for Blu-ray and HD-DVD, both costing $30 each. 50 Blu-ray movies at $30 and 50 HD-DVD movies at $30 gives you a total $3000USD. Immediately, you'd see a $500 loss going TotalHD.

Now let's assume demand shifts either way towards Blu-ray or HD-DVD, or even demand is greater than 100 discs, that $500 loss you'd taken with buying 100 TotalHD discs can be spread over increased inventory of either Blu-ray or HD-DVD. Up to the point of the $500 loss.

This is why you won't see TotalHD discs (ever), and the limited production of combo players. The loss generated by integrating the two formats is greater than the return. Particularly true, if the information the gals over in marketing are giving is correct.

Thus, many are saying its too early to tell which format, Blu-ray or HD-DVD, will win. Actually it's not hard to predict. Sony's SPE Unit produces movies. HD-DVD is just a format with no dedicated movie studio standing to lose if it goes belly up. Even if studios bale out on Blu-ray, Sony force in the motion picture industry is undeniable, thus the chance that Blu-ray will disappear is highly unlikely.

RE: Do you really feel this is a true statement?

By McGrath Dot Ca on 9/18/2007 11:16:14 AM , Rating: 2

But what if the movie is only in TotalHD? That's where the article/comment failed. It supposed that Blu-Ray, HD-DVD and TotalHD are available for a movie. My understanding of that format was to have 1 media for both. Also, most video store sell many copies after a few months so they could get their $500 back.

Granted, combo players are the future but it's way too much for now.

I agree with your Sony comment. Blu-Ray won't die soon if the others switch to HD-DVD.

This next holiday season will be a good benchmark to see if a winner(Blu-Ray cough )wins.

I hate that stupid format war.

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Total HD DVD for Video Stores

By BetaUser32 on 9/18/2007 12:31:49 PM , Rating: 2

I can see where this would be a plus for video rental. If they were sold exclusively for video stores, the price could be higher, say $50. This is the model that video stores had with distributors for video tapes in the 80s and early 90s. The tapes you rented in stores actually costed the rental chain about $60 or so (at least in the store that I worked for). These Total HD videos could be the same way. As far as the money that you would spend buying these as opposed to buying separate Blu-Ray or HD DVD's, it is true that you would spend more. However, what you are missing is this. Say you only have shelf space for 100 high definition movies. Now if you were only limited to hd dvd OR blu-ray, then you could only buy 50 of each since you had to carry both (i use 50/50 for simplicity, but the ratio would be determined by demand for a particular format in that area). Now thats only 50 titles you can stock. If people don't want the particular 50 titles you have, you haven't made any money on those titles even though you've purchased them for less money ($5 less from the article). Now say you could buy 100 total hd movies. Now you can stock titles that people would rent and you would spread the price difference out among all titles. So total hd would allow you to better utilize your shelf space which adds to revenue since you have a greater selection of titles.

RE: Total HD DVD for Video Stores

By BetaUser32 on 9/18/2007 12:42:59 PM , Rating: 2

Sorry to double post,
What I think they should do is make the total hd format exclusive to rental and slap the dvd version also on the disk. I guess you would have to remove the cheesy extras and use blu-ray since the disk can hold more. Then the rental chains would slowly get rid of standard definition dvd. This would encourage consumers to "buy in" to high definition since they have a disk in thier hand (lowering high definition player prices would help greatly in this regard). then if they wanted the chessy extras (or is that extra cheese :) they could purchase the format they like best. This would revitalize the rental market, which has to compete against on-demand and such and actually allow them to carry high definition product without giving up shelf space. It would help the consumer by giving them a disk they can play no matter what format they currently have. Then as one format won out, the movie studios could go from producing 3 formats to producing 1. the rental chain however wouldn't loose since their disks would not be obsolete by one format winning.

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Twice

By TomZ on 9/17/2007 5:32:59 PM , Rating: 2

Jeez, does he have to repeat everything and say everything TWICE? I mean, we would get the point if it just said it once!

(usual 'kidding' disclaimer...)