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Wal-Mart's decision could be the final nail in the coffin for HD DVD

The HD DVD Promotional Group is going to have a hard time recovering from today's announcement from Wal-Mart. The enormous retail giant announced on its Check Out blog that it has chosen Blu-ray as its high-definition platform of choice.

The company says that HD DVD players and movies will continue to be sold at its stores through the spring of 2008. However, the retailer will no longer carry HD DVD merchandise once the month of June rolls around. From June on out, Wal-Mart will only stock Blu-ray players and movie along with traditional DVD players and movies.

"Not sure of the short term pricing plans, but history tells us that as more people move to a new technology prices typically go down," said Susan Chronister, a buyer in the movie category for Wal-Mart. "So... if you bought the HD player like me, I'd retire it to the bedroom, kid’s playroom, or give it to your parents to play their John Wayne standard def movies, and make space for a BD player for your awesome Hi Def experience."

It appears that the writing is on the wall for HD DVD and the HD DVD Promotional Group -- the loss of Wal-Mart is huge blow.

This latest news from Wal-Mart comes just days after Netflix announced that it would abandon HD DVD altogether and Best Buy announced that it would give Blu-ray preferential treatment in its stores. Following the announcements from Netflix and Best Buy, the HD DVD Promotional Group could only muster the following:

We have long held the belief that HD DVD is the best format for consumers based on quality and value, and with more than 1 million HD DVD players on the market, it's unfortunate to see Netflix make the decision to only stock Blu-ray titles going forward. While the Best Buy announcement says they will recommend Blu-ray, at least they will continue to carry HD DVD and offer consumers a choice at retail.

Strangely enough, Michael Bay predicted that Wal-Mart would "go blue" following Warner's decision to side with Blu-ray. "Blu ray is just better. HD will die a slow death. It's what I predicted a year ago. Now with Warner's down for the count with Blu Ray, said Bay in early January. "That makes it easier for Wal-Mart to push Blu Ray. And whatever Wal-Mart pushes - wins."

More recently, Bay proclaimed "I told you so" with regards to the sharks circling the struggling HD DVD format. "Am I thrilled? It really wasn’t my fight, but remember what I said in the press? I was kind of saying HD [DVD]’s going to lose," Bay remarked. "No one believed me."

The HD DVD versus Blu-ray battle was fun while it lasted, but it looks as though we can all finally sit back and relax as the Blu-ray library expands while the remaining studios switch from "red" to "blue".



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The Fat Lady Sings
By BansheeX on 2/15/2008 12:07:06 PM , Rating: 5
It's over.




RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By geddarkstorm on 2/15/2008 12:12:28 PM , Rating: 5
Walmart certainly is fat... Yeah, you called it.


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By Hiawa23 on 2/16/2008 11:07:14 AM , Rating: 2
Am I the only one not surprised by this? Sony absolutely made the best decision to put the Blu Ray drive in the PS3, as this is what put BR over the top, the huge sales of the PS3 worldwide did this. I will always believe MS only supported HD DVD to stifle Sony & BR, & actually to me in a sense the Xbox 360, & MS is what killed HD DVD, cause had every 360 launched on the format atleast it would have had a chance to battle BR, as there was noway HD DVD standalones were going to sell more than BR standalones + the PS3. I have the HD DVD add on for the 360 & love it, so I plan to get more HD DVD mvies on cheap & enjoy Blu Ray on my PS3. Toshiba can think MS in part for the early downfall of HD-dvd


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By SavagePotato on 2/15/08, Rating: -1
RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By retrospooty on 2/15/2008 12:24:39 PM , Rating: 5
Ya, that was not at all gloaty... LOL

Anyhow, it looks like a lot of final nails lately. I think the real final nail was last month with Warner bros backed out, and Paramount threatened too. The rest is just inevitable from there. I am surprised, I thought the cheaper would win, but at least its over. Now we can all buy BR... Hopefully it will get cheap quickly.


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By SavagePotato on 2/15/08, Rating: -1
RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By retrospooty on 2/15/2008 12:41:49 PM , Rating: 3
Thank you for showing such grace and maturity.


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By BrownJohn on 2/15/2008 2:59:02 PM , Rating: 1
you know, i felt like rating you up just so others can rate you down again.


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By SavagePotato on 2/15/08, Rating: -1
RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By daftrok on 2/15/2008 3:33:41 PM , Rating: 5
I'm a Blu ray fan but I still think you're a douche.


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By SavagePotato on 2/15/08, Rating: -1
RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By retrospooty on 2/15/2008 4:07:30 PM , Rating: 2
I dont usually agree with daftrock, but he has a compelling argument on this one.


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By SavagePotato on 2/15/08, Rating: -1
RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By retrospooty on 2/15/2008 5:59:25 PM , Rating: 2
Actually you were at -1 when I posted it. I find it funny, that you are so paranoid that people are creating multiple accounts just to rate you down... It cant be that you are such a putz and so obnoxious with the way you post that most people find you irritating... Nope, it must be just a few haters rating you down.

Good luck with that thought. LOL @ you


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By SavagePotato on 2/15/08, Rating: -1
RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By retrospooty on 2/15/2008 7:40:15 PM , Rating: 2
You are sad, and I am done.


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By mikeyD95125 on 2/15/08, Rating: 0
RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By retrospooty on 2/15/2008 10:32:56 PM , Rating: 2
"For the 3 months of reading DT comments I find that FITCamero can be a front-runner for the DT-Douchebag award"

No, its just the liberals and left wing democrats lying to make him appear that way. =)


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By tastyratz on 2/15/2008 5:02:40 PM , Rating: 1
That's just it. HD-DVD WAS cheaper, but they were greedier. Notice all the fire sales on Hd-dvd media now? Amazon selling movies for 15 bux a pop buy 2 get 1 free style? Shoulda been from the beginning. Hd-dvd touted affordability, easy expansion/rollout, and low media costs- None of which were passed on to the consumer until it was too late!
Fighting on an equal pricing field Hd-dvd couldn't hold a candle to Bluray and they chose not to really exploit their advantage.
I for one have a ps3 and preferred Bluray since the beginning. Having more movies available for cheap will be a benefit however a little competition could have been nice to drive things down fast for a bit more.

After all the anti Sony comments I think there's a lot of foot in mouth going on now - Beta max wins.


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By BansheeX on 2/15/2008 12:39:51 PM , Rating: 5
HD-DVD Knight: "Have at you!"

King Blu-ray: "You stupid bastard, you've got no arms left!"

HD-DVD Knight: "Chicken!"

(THWACK)

HD-DVD Knight: "Right! I'll do you for that!"

King Blu-ray: "What are you gonna do, bleed on me? Come, Michael Bay!"

HD-DVD Knight: "Ohhh, I see! Runnin' away!? Come back and get what's coming to you, you yellow bastards! I'll bite your legs off!"


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By onwisconsin on 2/15/2008 2:02:30 PM , Rating: 3
It's only a flesh wound!


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By Goty on 2/15/2008 2:56:44 PM , Rating: 3
Shouldn't the last line be, "Come back and get what's coming to you, you 'Blu" bastards!"?


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By PitViper007 on 2/15/2008 4:36:29 PM , Rating: 2
This whole thing HAS felt rather like a Monty Python movie hasn't it???


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By geddarkstorm on 2/15/2008 4:38:39 PM , Rating: 2
We are the Knights who say... HD!


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By omnicronx on 2/15/2008 1:13:39 PM , Rating: 1
It was over a month ago, HD-DVD fans have accepted defeat, are you done?

quote:
Instead just bask in the joy of the final nail in the coffin.
If thats not gloating, I don't know what is..

p.s Im pro VHS, and its over! its over! BETA LOST.. not that im gloating..


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By SavagePotato on 2/15/08, Rating: -1
RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By OxBow on 2/15/2008 1:43:00 PM , Rating: 2
If you've ever nailed a coffin shut, it takes a lot of nails.

Then again, this is a pretty solid nail to keep HD-DVD in it's coffin. Now all that's needed is the walk to the cemetery (the studios caving) and a short graveside service (at petty tirade from Toshiba).

It's been an ugly little episode, but for all those Sony fan-boys who stayed loyal through that dark night, good on ya.


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By wempa on 2/15/2008 12:22:37 PM , Rating: 3
Yup, once Warner sided with BR, it was just a matter of time .... no matter how much the HD-DVD folks were claiming it wasn't. I was never a BR fan, but at least the next gen format has been decided.


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By walk2k on 2/15/2008 12:23:57 PM , Rating: 5
th-th-th-th-THATS ALL FOLKS


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By 777 on 2/15/2008 1:26:04 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
It's over.


HD-DVD Buh Bye!

We can finally move forward.


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By sgtdisturbed47 on 2/15/2008 4:20:16 PM , Rating: 1
Not until the porn industry goes with BR will this be completely over. The porn industry siding with VHS vs beta max greatly helped THAT format war.


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By psypher on 2/15/2008 4:48:02 PM , Rating: 5
The only reason the porn industry decided the betamax vhs war was because the internet did not exist. Now let me hear from everyone here... How many of you guys have bought porn on a DVD or HD-DVD or Blu-Ray recently? And how many of you have downloaded your porn in private and have hard drives full of the stuff? I bet everything I am worth that more porn is acquired over the internet.

Porn is not a factor in this format war.


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By Oregonian2 on 2/15/2008 5:34:23 PM , Rating: 2
Do porn DVD's bought over the internet count in any particular direction (eBay in particular)?


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By Noliving on 2/16/2008 10:08:58 AM , Rating: 2
It helped greatly in deciding the format but some analysts say the key deciding factor was recording time. How many times did you record a movie that was on tv? I know my family recorded might ducks1 and back to the future series that way. Well with betamax you only had 1 hour of recording time vhs had over 2 hours.


RE: The Fat Lady Sings
By Hiawa23 on 2/16/2008 1:37:00 PM , Rating: 2
No offense to Walmart, but their clientèle isn't exactly the ones I would trust to embrace this format.

if clientele you mean like me, college grad, family man, home owner, then this is one of the most ridiculous statements I have seen. I think most people that shop at Walmart are middle or lower class wich make up most of America. Walmart is probably one of the most successful retailers, ever, based on this clientele you speak of. Many of us po folks have already embraced both formats waiting for one to fail. I buy wherever the product I am looking for is the cheapest, sometimes it's Walmart, sometimes, it's Best Buy, Circuit or other, so there are a variety of shoppers that shop at Walmart.


The Fat Lady has left the building.
By goodstuff on 2/15/2008 12:09:37 PM , Rating: 5
Forget Walmart dropping HD-DVD. It looks like Toshiba is getting ready to as well:

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr/content_displa...

Toshiba to drop HD DVD, sources say
Company says no decision has been made

By Thomas K. Arnold and Erik Gruenwedel

Feb 15, 2008

The format war has turned into a format death watch.

Toshiba is widely expected to pull the plug on its HD DVD format sometime in the coming weeks, reliable industry sources say, after a rash of retail defections that followed Warner Home Video's announcement in early January that it would support only the rival Blu-ray Disc format after May.

Officially, no decision has been made, insists Jodi Sally, vp of marketing for Toshiba America Consumer Products. "Based on its technological advancements, we continue to believe HD DVD is the best format for consumers, given the value and consistent quality inherent in our player offerings," she said.

But she hinted that something's in the air. "Given the market developments in the past month," she said, "Toshiba will continue to study the market impact and the value proposition for consumers, particularly in light of our recent price reductions on all HD DVD players."

Immediately after the Warner announcement, the HD DVD North American Promotional Group canceled its Consumer Electronics Show presentation. The following week, data collected by the NPD Group revealed Blu-ray took in 93% of all hardware sales for that week.

Toshiba subsequently fired back, drastically cutting its HD DVD player prices by as much as half, effective Jan. 15. But a hoped-for consumer sales surge never materialized; retail point-of-sale data collected by the NPD Group for the week ending Jan. 26 still showed Blu-ray Disc players ahead by a wide margin, 65% to 28%.

Software sales have declined as well. The latest Nielsen VideoScan First Alert sales data show the top-selling Blu-ray Disc title for the week, Sony Pictures Home Entertainment's "Across the Universe," sold more than three times as many copies the week ending Feb. 10 as the top HD DVD seller, Universal Studios Home Entertainment's "Elizabeth: The Golden Age." Blu-ray Disc titles also accounted for 81% of all high-def disc sales for the week, with HD DVD at just 19%.

Toshiba had been pitching its discounted HD DVD players toward the standard DVD crowd as well as high-def enthusiasts, noting in its ad message that the new players would make DVDs look a lot better as well. And as a last-ditch effort, the company ran an ad during the Super Bowl -- a 30-second spot that reportedly cost $2.7 million.

But in the end, sources say, the substantial loss Toshiba is incurring with each HD DVD player sold -- a figure sources say could be as high as several hundred dollars -- coupled with a series of high-profile retail defections has driven the company to at last concede defeat.

"An announcement is coming soon," said one source close to the HD DVD camp. "It could be a matter of weeks."

Microsoft is the other big player in the HD DVD equation. Last fall when Paramount Home Entertainment announced it was dropping its dual-format strategy and would release titles only in HD DVD, giving that side a brief resurgence, a pitch to journalists for interviews came from a Microsoft email address.

Several phone calls to Kevin Collins, Microsoft's normally accessible "HD DVD evangelist," were not returned. Nor were calls to Ken Graffeo, the Universal Studios Home Entertainment executive who doubles as co-president of the HD DVD North American Promotional Group.

When Warner abandoned HD DVD in January, the format was left with just two of the six major studios backing it, Universal Studios Home Entertainment and Paramount Home Entertainment. Blu-ray support among independents is rising. ADV Films, Tai Seng Entertainment, Topics Entertainment and National Geographic have all confirmed they are going Blu-ray exclusive, while more than one indie that was releasing titles just on HD DVD, including Surround Records and Opus Arte, will now offer Blu-ray as well.

This week, two key retailers, Best Buy and Netflix Inc., both got off the fence and threw their support behind Blu-ray exclusively, citing widespread studio support and consumer preference. Both companies said Warner's decision was a turning point in their strategies.

"We've listened to our customers, and we are responding," said Best Buy president and COO Brian Dunn.

Netflix spokesperson Steve Swasey said it appeared the format war had been won by Blu-ray for the benefit of everyone.

"We wanted to put an exclamation point behind that," he said.

Industry observers are closely watching Amazon, but there's been no movement, other than a 50% off sale for 150 HD DVD titles, including "Transformers," "Zodiac" and "Stardust."

Blockbuster Inc. last summer already decided to offer only Blu-ray Disc titles at its company-owned rental stores.

Chris Tribbey, Home Media Magazine senior reporter, contributed to this report.




By TheDoc9 on 2/15/2008 12:18:47 PM , Rating: 2
Now I'm REALLY worried about getting the 5 free dvd's. Haven't bought any HD-DVD's because the writings been on the wall but it would've been nice to have a few...


By Staples on 2/15/2008 1:11:27 PM , Rating: 2
It is about time. After Warner left, it just about impossible for HD DVD to make a rebound. If Toshiba invested as much money into HDDVD as Sony did BD from early on, the land scape may look a little different now. Blu Ray has always been winning this fight and the news just got worse and worse. The only good news HD DVD has ever had is that the prices were falling as fast as the prices of BD players and that they were able to buy an 18 month exclusive offer with Paramount. Other then that, Blu Ray has been gaining ground every month and it seems that any reaction Toshiba had to it was months too late.


RE: The Fat Lady has left the building.
By BladeVenom on 2/15/2008 1:14:28 PM , Rating: 5
On the bright side, I'd rather have a Toshiba Blu-ray player than one made by Sony.


By omnicronx on 2/15/2008 1:22:21 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
On the bright side, I'd rather have a Toshiba Blu-ray player than one made by Sony.
There are already like 5 brands of BD players. Of course they all cost almost the same, and many are really just re badged products, but thats a different story ;)


By jadedeath on 2/16/2008 7:08:14 PM , Rating: 2
I'd rather have a PS3 that plays Blu-Ray's than a 360 with an add-on that's being shipped back to the factory with the add-on as a placeholder in my entertainment rack.

Then again, I've heard some rumors that HD-DVD players are now doubling as doorstops. I guess they ARE useful for something.

Logan


RE: The Fat Lady has left the building.
By omnicronx on 2/15/2008 1:17:59 PM , Rating: 1
I wonder if they could keep the HD-DVD line for now, and create their own dual format players. Maybe this would possibly minimize the damages?

If they are going to adopt BD as their format anyways, they might aswell..


RE: The Fat Lady has left the building.
By geddarkstorm on 2/15/2008 2:02:32 PM , Rating: 4
Yeah, but what movies would be on HD-DVD if all the studios go exclusive with Blu-Ray?


RE: The Fat Lady has left the building.
By hisyn on 2/15/2008 2:54:33 PM , Rating: 1
They could create an inexpensive HD DVD burner (with relatively inexpensive media) and push the format as the format that consumers use to burn their own movies & data backups.


By geddarkstorm on 2/15/2008 4:31:56 PM , Rating: 3
Considering Blu-ray has higher density per layer than HD-DVD, and that apparently making HD-DVD burnable has been a long standing problem...


By jadedeath on 2/16/2008 7:13:39 PM , Rating: 2
Unlikely, considering that dual format players are pushing the $1000 mark and don't seem to be dropping any time soon.

Logan


By KamiXkaze on 2/16/2008 2:10:32 PM , Rating: 2
The end is near for the format wars once Toshiba announce it's pull back.

KxK


BD player sales about to spike
By pomaikai on 2/15/2008 12:17:50 PM , Rating: 4
This should increase the sales of PS3 as it is the best BD player out and will be upgradeable to profile 2.0. Everyone that jumped on HD-DVD bandwagon will now be looking for a new player.




RE: BD player sales about to spike
By mcnabney on 2/15/2008 12:30:16 PM , Rating: 3
Actually, the people who bought based upon the cheap entry price will be thinking:

Gosh, my old DVDs look pretty good upconverted. Why pay another $300?

So until BD gets down to $100-125 for players, the old DVD has nothing to fear in losing its crown. Warner may discover that picking the pricey format may further muddy the waters. BD players on Amazon are now priced higher than they were before Warners announcement - so J6P may have a two year wait for truly inexpensive BD players.


By omnicronx on 2/15/2008 1:20:33 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
BD players on Amazon are now priced higher than they were before Warners announcement - so J6P may have a two year wait for truly inexpensive BD players.
I have noticed in Canada that sales(as in price reduction) on BD players alone are all but non existent since the start of january. Only deals i have seen is if you buy a Sony TV. Meanwhile, HD-DVD players now cost 100-150 at Bestbuy..


RE: BD player sales about to spike
By OxBow on 2/15/2008 1:55:51 PM , Rating: 3
The PS3 should see a bump from this over time. Those folks who want a high def player to go with that cheap high def TV they got from Wal Mart are gonna eventually get some type of Blue Ray player. The PS3 is an excellent Blue Ray player with a lot of ancillary potential, the whole gaming console thing not withstanding.

Sony's stategy of using Blue Ray and the PS3 to get into peoples entertainment centers is starting to pay off. This Christmas season will probably see the PS3 fly off the shelves and by 2010 Sony will have a dominant location in the entertainment center.


By tallcool1 on 2/15/2008 2:07:03 PM , Rating: 2
You could have said the same thing about LPs and 45s. CD players where very expensive when they came out, in the end they took over the market.

It's ok, let it go...


RE: BD player sales about to spike
By aju on 2/15/2008 1:22:50 PM , Rating: 2
I doubt it, I have a feeling that the minute it is officially over (Toshiba concedes) Microsoft will make available an external Blu-Ray add-on. It will be cheaper than any stand alone player or PS3. It will most likely be close to the current price of the HD-DVD external player ($130). Blu-Ray players for PCs are already under $200 and since a external player for a 360 would be based on one, it should be easy for Microsoft to do. I doubt you will get any crossovers from the 360. Chances are that they will be sure to price it so that the entire package is less than a 40 gig PS3. Since the 360 has a far more extensive HD game library than the PS3 I doubt they will pull any higher percentage of gamers their way then they already have.


By imaheadcase on 2/15/2008 1:59:26 PM , Rating: 2
Nevermind the fact SOny has stopped making 80gig ps3's (at least in the USA). Wal-mart stops carrying 80gig ps3 on the 20th...after that its "supplies last".

They will carry ONLY 40gig ps3 until sony gets more new sku out.

Guess what else? PS3 is the fastest selling console in the store now..not counting DS because those sell out before we can put them on counter. :P


Just goes to show you...
By Hawkido on 2/15/2008 12:32:05 PM , Rating: 5
Add-in components to video game platforms (HD-DVD add-on for XBox360) never work. You pretty much doom the attachment to failure if you do not include it in the original product. Sony DID get that part right.




RE: Just goes to show you...
By aju on 2/15/2008 1:38:58 PM , Rating: 2
That is simply BS. I have a HD-DVD add in for my 360 and it works beautifully. It even has all the online features the overpriced Blu-Ray players do not. If Blu-Ray wins, I will buy an external on for my 360 as I am sure Microsoft will make one available. What is funny is that I have been enjoying HD gaming content for significantly longer and for less money than PS3 users (since 11/05). Even if I buy an external Blu-Ray player for the 360, I will still have saved money in the long run because it will be cheaper than a stand alone player or buying a PS3. I should be able to have both formats for less than $400 and that is cheaper than stand alone Blu-Ray players and significantly less than a combo player.


RE: Just goes to show you...
By mrEvil on 2/15/2008 3:11:51 PM , Rating: 4
aju - quote me the price you paid on 11/05 for your HD-DVD add-on and quote me the price you paid for your 360, then tell me you paid less (my thoughts are at least $399 and $199).

I hate it when people say "I paid less for this or that" and show no proof. By your own time line, you paid as much, or more than, a similarly equipped 20GB PS3 that did BR. True it was a year earlier, but don't spew things out that are lies to try and make a point.

I'm just waiting for the guy who belittled me to apologize when I said that the format war would be decided shortly after xmas 07. I never said who would win, just that it would be decided. Chalk 1 up for me, 1 million up for Dr. Evil.


RE: Just goes to show you...
By Hawkido on 2/15/2008 3:45:43 PM , Rating: 3
You obviously have NO IDEA what I am talking about... But thanks for playing.

What I was referring to is this:

Sega Genesis had an add on CD player - Failed
Super Nintendo had a Modem - Failed
N64 had a Ram upgrade - Quasi failed (closest to succeed as I can remember, but it was hardly an add on more an upgrade)
PS2 had an addon HD and Modem/Ethernet card - Both failed... (the micro PS2 revision had the Ethernet built in and it almost suceeded... if only it had been there to begin with!)
the XBox360 had the addon HD-DVD drive - Failed (plus the technology died to boot)

Now the included techs in game platforms that one included and the other didn't:

CD-rom on the PSone (versus N64 without)- Suceeded
Network on XBox (versus add-in Network on PS2) - Succeeded
PS3 with builtin HD player (versus XBox360 with add-in HD player) - Suceeded

Now here is the kicker... the 360 has so many varients some with HDs and some without, some with HDMI and some without, Some with big HDs and some without. All the addins are killing the XBox the game developers don't know if they can make a game with alot of HD utilization or only alittle or none at all. If they choose the wrong one how many customers do they have to leave out? What if the demographics change and more people buy HDs and a different developer utilizes more and therefore looks better and they don't make as many sales? How frusterating is that!!

If you want addons then buy a PC! If you want a consistant gameing platform then buy a console.

Face it MS was trying to bilk you out of more money than you were originally wanting to pay... Alittle bit at a time. Or alot with prices like $200 for HD-DVD drive add-on... $200 for a little bit bigger HD...

Boo Hoo the PS3 only comes with a 20 or 60 (now 80 gig HD), but it always had a HD! It didn't see much use for offloading large quantities of game data onto it as the BR medium could hold it all without swaping, and for $100 or so, you can buy a large Commercial Off The Shelf 2.5 HD and pop it right in there. Or if you have a Sata cable extender you can use a 1 TB 3.5 HD with it (warning requires some work and may void warrenty).. The HD player is integrated so you don't have to pay more for it...

Sony tried to get all the money up front. MS tried to slow bleed you. Oh and the RRoD, don't forget that, how many people were turned away from warrenty repairs till enough pressure was put on MS?

I am sorry the MS model of business in the console market is flawed. There may be alot of XBox fans and gamers out there, however MS really isn't making alot of money on the franchise are they? Sony lost alot on the PS3 gambit so far, but now they OWN the market. They will recover WAAAY more than they lost and MS will be back at the drawing board either working on the XBox 720 or yet another failed spin of the 360. Let's hope for the 720 and while we are at it lets hope they make an affordable, capable, and consistant platform (with BR player built in as a game medium and a movie player).


RE: Just goes to show you...
By poothedrew on 2/15/2008 5:36:44 PM , Rating: 1
Actually YOU have no idea what YOU are talking about.
How do define failure of HD-DVD? Selling less than 300K?
The add-on is ONLY for playing movies not games, so why would game developers care.

The 360 will ALLWAYS use DVD9 as a game format, you have eated too much Sony marketing if you actually think game develpers need more space than than that.
Vista a progam with more lines of code that the top ten games combined easily fits on one.

Please if I want big movies scenes in my games I can download them but why give developers an excuse to write bloated code.

Some 360 have HD and others don't? They ALL are HD like I said the add-on is only for movies and if they do blue it will be the same. You simply just don't get the nature of the add on do you?

I dare you to buy only a PS3 and play games in HIDEF on your hidef display. (This simply cannot be done) (ya that composite cable cant do hidef)($ 399 plus $50 - $80 for a cable)

A new 360 owner can go home with just the box and play games in HI-DEF without any additional cost. ($299)

The 360 is a less expensive hi def game player that you can use for entertainment and suppliment with HD drives.

Not a blueray player that plays games but does not give you a cable to actually play those hidef games or movies.

It's called choice. I like having the choice of better games. :)

Now I just have to rip my 40 hddvd discs to my puter and go buy a ps3 PLUS the friggen cable ...


RE: Just goes to show you...
By poothedrew on 2/15/2008 5:45:42 PM , Rating: 2
OWN the market what market are you talkeing about because it's not the next gen gaming one.

Have you seen the game sales?
The PS3 is now JUST starting to sell at a margenally better rate per month (remember is was a year later than the 360) you would have thought the 360 would have trailed much earlier.

I also hear that it was only because the 360's have been drained out of the supply chain because 4 MILLION people got them over the holidays.

The 360 has sold more consoles and people buy more games for it than the PS3 how does this spell ownership for the PS3?


On the bright side...
By ultimatebob on 2/15/2008 1:13:50 PM , Rating: 5
You'll be able to pick up an HD-DVD player from Woot for about $60 in a few months :)




This can;t be right
By Aloonatic on 2/15/2008 12:10:39 PM , Rating: 2
I bought a PS3 as a console and a BD player

I never normally pick the winning side ion these things, something's afoot.

I'm surprised at how quickly momentum has shifted to BD though.

I honestly thought we'd be made to wait forever and ever. Still time for something strange to happen I guess.

It would appear that there's light at the end of the format war tunnel and like a house of cards they've fallen like dominoes, check mate.




RE: This can;t be right
By TheDoc9 on 2/15/2008 12:32:58 PM , Rating: 2
I'm not surprised, both formats were on weak ground towards the end of 07'. Having seen these types of things play out before I knew because I just know that one little thing would tip the scales in favor of a certain format. Had both in this case but was pulling for blu-ray.

In any case that's how these things go, as soon as a general view is formed in the public eye everything contrary falls apart like a house of cards when you turn on the damn ceiling fan.


By TerranMagistrate on 2/15/2008 12:32:57 PM , Rating: 3
Well, you can't make an omelet without breaking some eggs. It cost them time, money and some marketshare early on but it looks like their risk-taking has payed off in dividends. And that momentum will likely only increase exponentially as time goes on.

Now it's time to focus on really taking the fight to the Wii and Xbox 360 because at heart the PS3 is most definitely a gaming system. Judging from the worldwide sales of the PS3 and and the unrivaled caliber of AAA exclusives coming this year, it looks like Sony is already on that too.




Outrageous
By DOSGuy on 2/15/2008 4:58:39 PM , Rating: 1
So Wal-Mart had a huge sale on HD-DVD players late last year, and they're going to stop selling media for them in June? That's outrageous! Wal-Mart's customers have a right to be furious about this. Millions of people shop at Wal-Mart because they're in a low income bracket or on a budget, and yes, some of those people have HDTVs and bought HD-DVD players, enticed by the idea of having high definition movies for Christmas. They had a right to expect that Wal-Mart would support the format for more than a few months! A lot of those customers don't have the money to turn around and buy a Blu-Ray player, and even if they do, why should they have to?

I've been burned by Wal-Mart before, like those Chinese light bulbs with counterfeit UL certification that were recalled for being a fire hazard, and the DVD player that couldn't close the tray properly unless I pushed it in just a few months after I bought it. Wal-Mart has always been synonymous with poor quality, and even counterfeit products, but now it seems that loyalty to their customers is just as cheap. Pushing a format, and then ending their support for it almost immediately afterwards is really, really low.




RE: Outrageous
By kilkennycat on 2/16/2008 3:09:48 AM , Rating: 2
So, why do you still shop there? Vote with your wallet instead of your words.


Bummer
By ikaika on 2/15/2008 1:03:23 PM , Rating: 2
Well, the inevitable is officially here unfortunately. I've been enjoying all the sales on HD-DVD's and will continue to do so. I was pulling for HD-DVD, but it was pretty obvious where everything was heading shortly after the 3rd gen players came out.

Meanwhile, I await a sub-$200, 2.0 capable standalone to add to my setup. The sooner the better!




Sorry to See HD-DVD Die
By mercilessming on 2/15/2008 2:54:23 PM , Rating: 2
Is it just me, that sees
1) With everyone against monopolies, then why is it seen as a good thing that A Movie/Music/Electronics Company and the same company thats its foot in everything entertainment based owns the proprietary technology for physical media delivery?
2) Since it is popular to Hate Microsoft I would have loved to have seen Microsoft come out with a spec exactly technically the same but cheaper and/or better and see what excuses people would have come up with against them as opposed to the same monopoly Sony is trying for with Blu-Ray. Really ask yourself why a Company as big as Sony wants to make a media format?.
3) When someone like Wal-Mart whole heartedly backs a company be very worried, after all Wal-Mart supports slave labor of Old People.




We've moved beyond nails...
By sgtdisturbed47 on 2/15/2008 4:17:57 PM , Rating: 2
The common analogy for this format war is the "nails in the coffin". Well, this is more than a nail. This is a steel strap wrapped around the coffin, and welded onto itself. No way out now.




By kilkennycat on 2/15/2008 7:41:43 PM , Rating: 2
A Blu-ray external drive for the current Xbox360 is either going to need lots of internal smarts (read - expensive) or not be upgradeable, as the Blu-ray standard continues to evolve. The PS3 gets its Blu-ray "upgrade-smarts" effectively for free, since the drive is fully integrated into the console.

So what is Microsoft going to do ?

Releasing a new version of the Xbox360 (Xbox720?) with an integrated Blu-ray drive capable of BOTH movie playback AND (future and present) games is the obvious answer. An excellent opportunity to also upgrade the 3-year-old graphics silicon for more graphics horsepower and DX10.x, plus redesign the physical packaging and ventilation of the Xbox360 to totally eliminate the hot-spots causing the RROD. In fact, take a technology jump over the PS3. Pity that will need another ~ $500 or so from the current Xbox360 owner who would like to take advantage of these new offerings....

At least, such a refreshed version of the Xbox360 would most certainly be fully backward compatible with current Xbox360 games.

I sure cannot see Microsoft offering anything but a token rebate for owners of the current Xbox360 HD-DVD drive regardless of what they do about Bluray upgrades for the Xbox360. Such is the life of the "early-adopters".




By Belard on 2/16/2008 8:40:00 AM , Rating: 2
Well... looks like Walmart won't be selling HD-DVD anything much longer... firesale what they have for 50% off is by guess. $50 players...

Its OFFICAl - TOSHIBA is out of the HD-DVD business. No future HD-DVD developement, whatso ever. No combo players, nothing.

http://www.reuters.com/article/rbssConsumerGoodsAn...




About time
By IceTron on 2/15/2008 12:30:46 PM , Rating: 1
Seriously, enough of this two standard bullshit. This war needs to end now so the consumer and the industry can move on.




So...
By Joz on 2/15/08, Rating: -1
Big, but also 'meh'
By protest the hero on 2/15/08, Rating: -1
RE: Big, but also 'meh'
By TerranMagistrate on 2/15/2008 12:38:29 PM , Rating: 5
No offense to Walmart, but their clientèle isn't exactly the ones I would trust to embrace this format.

If only 0.1% of consumers shopping at Wal-Mart ever buy anything related to Blu-Ray, it will be a MASSIVE boost for the format.

IIRC, somewhere around 60 million people are in a Wal-Mart store at any given day.


RE: Big, but also 'meh'
By Hawkido on 2/15/2008 12:40:14 PM , Rating: 3
I bought a 1080P 42" Poloroid LCD (very nice by the way, I normally wouldn't think Poloroid when I think HDTV's) for ~$800 on Black Friday at Wal-Mart. They are still carrying the 1080P's and have been for quite a while. Don't knock Wal-Mart. They may not be the electronics superstore, but for some of us they are the only place for impulse electronics purchases. Wal Marts aren't just for the lower income peoples, They just cater to them more.


RE: Big, but also 'meh'
By Chris Peredun on 2/15/2008 12:41:59 PM , Rating: 5
quote:
No offense to Walmart, but their clientèle isn't exactly the ones I would trust to embrace this format.


I assume you've heard of the phrase "Strength in numbers." Regardless of what you may think of Wal-Mart's clientele, they represent a very, very large market - and putting an inexpensive Blu-Ray player in their hands will seriously drive media sales.

Consider it a Zerg Rush on the part of Blu-Ray.


RE: Big, but also 'meh'
By masher2 (blog) on 2/15/2008 12:56:54 PM , Rating: 1
> "...putting an inexpensive Blu-Ray player in their hands will seriously drive media sales."

Now, all they need to do make that inexpensive BD player available. I rather doubt its going to happen this year though.


RE: Big, but also 'meh'
By omnicronx on 2/15/2008 1:38:09 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
Now, all they need to do make that inexpensive BD player available. I rather doubt its going to happen this year though.
Walmart did it with HD-DVD, why not BD? My venturer walmart HD-DVD player is still running strong ;)


RE: Big, but also 'meh'
By OPR8R on 2/15/2008 2:33:11 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Now, all they need to do make that inexpensive BD player available. I rather doubt its going to happen this year though.

Based on what we've seen from Sony in the past, I'd agree. Unfortunately, without a competing format to force Sony to lower prices, I don't think I'll be buying a 1080p player this year.


RE: Big, but also 'meh'
By Belard on 2/15/2008 8:24:02 PM , Rating: 2
BluRay prices will continue to fall as more units are made.

Toshiba's super-low prices were at a LOSS to gain market share. There are 20 different BluRay players to choose from (not including PS3s). Now that the FORMAT war is over (95% over) - we'll see more movies + more players and lower prices. Companies have already announced $300 BR players this spring. And some people get FREE players with their HD-TVs. I would expect $200 BR players this cristmas.

Keep in mind Toshiba's "$200" player last christmas wasn't 1080p. You paid $300 for that Toshiba model...


RE: Big, but also 'meh'
By theflux on 2/15/2008 2:48:03 PM , Rating: 2
Don't forget the lengthy blog post you owe me.


RE: Big, but also 'meh'
By masher2 (blog) on 2/15/2008 3:52:08 PM , Rating: 1
I'm not quite ready to concede just yet :) Remember I never disputed that BD would dominate. I simply believed dual-format players would predominate, keeping both formats alive.

We'll know for sure probably around Christmas time, when see if BD can start posting solid sales. So far, BD's market share growth has primarily come at HD-DVD's expense, i.e. the total size of the pie isn't growing as much as BD is just getting more of it.


RE: Big, but also 'meh'
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 2/15/2008 4:45:36 PM , Rating: 1
Aye, I'm just miffed that I can't find a cheap BR player. If the studio's want to push adoption of High-Def, they need to help spur adoption of the players.


RE: Big, but also 'meh'
By theflux on 2/15/2008 5:04:39 PM , Rating: 2
Aye, like you said at the time, you were cautious in your prediction.


RE: Big, but also 'meh'
By DigitalFreak on 2/15/2008 1:09:28 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
Regardless of what you may think of Wal-Mart's clientèle, they represent a very, very large market


Walmart stores always smell like feet and old people...


RE: Big, but also 'meh'
By BladeVenom on 2/15/2008 1:13:10 PM , Rating: 2
I think Walmart was the number one seller of hi def televisions.


RE: Big, but also 'meh'
By clovell on 2/15/2008 2:05:34 PM , Rating: 2
That needs a +6

Fully upgraded zerglings rush will rock your socks.


RE: Big, but also 'meh'
By ATC on 2/15/2008 12:45:24 PM , Rating: 3
I have to say that I don't generally shop at Walmart but I have purchased most of my DVDs there and will most likely buy most of my BDs there too as they seem to always be a few bucks cheaper than everywhere else and their collection isn't half bad.

The term Walmart clientele is vague and vast in scope.


RE: Big, but also 'meh'
By OxBow on 2/15/2008 2:03:57 PM , Rating: 4
WallMart reshaped the high def TV market two years ago by starting to sell Vizio's cheap. They single handedly brought high def TV prices down across the board to a range that the average consumer could consider them. Since then, WallMart has been one of the leading merchants for selling hdtv's and will continue to dominate this category for a good long while.

While I don't agree with a lot of what WallMart does, I do have to respect their ability to dominate.


RE: Big, but also 'meh'
By sweetsauce on 2/17/2008 1:16:40 AM , Rating: 2
Im pretty sure Costco outsold walmart in visio sales.


frown
By logaldinho on 2/15/08, Rating: -1
RE: frown
By tallcool1 on 2/15/2008 2:24:38 PM , Rating: 3
quote:
I remember reading an article that said for every Bluray movie sony makes about 10-15 dollars


That has got to be completely false information.

Considering you can buy some Blu-Ray movies for under $15.
Terminator 2 (Blu-Ray), $13.95 at Amazon.com
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B000...


RE: frown
By KamiXkaze on 2/16/2008 2:52:29 PM , Rating: 2
ditto unless there is something afoot here.

KxK


Hey HD-DVD fanboys!
By IntelGirl on 2/15/08, Rating: -1
RE: Hey HD-DVD fanboys!
By ikaika on 2/15/2008 3:04:51 PM , Rating: 3
Is that because they mysteriously stopped working or something?

In other news, despite the eminent death of HD-DVD, posts such as yours are still completely useless, and do nothing but support the poster's high level of douche-baggery. This in fact is regardless of which format they are for/against.


RE: Hey HD-DVD fanboys!
By 306maxi on 2/17/2008 2:41:54 PM , Rating: 1
I feel sorry for you. Oh wait no I don't!


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