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Lexus LS 600h L to retail for $104,750 USD

Toyota first showcased its Lexus LS 600h L nearly a year ago at the New York International Auto Show (NYIAS). At the time, the vehicle was billed as one of the world's most advanced luxury cars with its hybrid powertrain and AWD system.

Now, the company has finally announced pricing and an on sale date for its luxury flagship. Early estimates had pegged the LS 600h L as coming in around the $125,000 USD mark, however, the vehicle will be priced at $104,750 USD when it arrives in June. This will also make it the first Lexus vehicle with an MSRP that crosses the $100k USD threshold.

The 5.0 V8 hybrid powertrain will have a combined horsepower rating of 438HP and will deliver performance on par with V12 luxury sedans from BMW and Mercedes. Thanks to the hybrid powertrain, however, the LS 600h L will sip gas like a V6-powered all-wheel-drive luxury sedan and is also rated as a Super Ultra Low Emissions Vehicle (SULEV).

So what does $104,750 USD get you these days? The LS 600h L will feature LED headlights, four-zone climate control (with a dedicated A/C unit for the rear passengers), voice-activated HDD-based navigation system with XM real-time traffic directing, 19-speaker Mark Levinson sound system, rear DVD entertainment system with 9" LCD screen, automated parallel parking system and an Advanced Pre-Collision System (APCS).

For those looking to get your hands on an LS 600h L in June, don't count on it. Over 1,850 pre-orders for the vehicle have already been taken and the first-year allocation for the vehicle is almost depleted.

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Feel Good
By TheTerl on 4/10/2007 11:10:31 AM , Rating: 3
The engine technology sounds impressive, but really, $104,750? For anyone even thinking about buying a car in that price range, fuel economy is no issue. I know we can go back and forth about whether hybrids are worth the investment in the long run, but I think everyone can agree that this targets those who want to go hybrid just to make a statement--as opposed to making a real difference.

RE: Feel Good
By lagomorpha on 4/10/2007 11:34:36 AM , Rating: 4
A lot of the people I see buying hybrids around $22k seem to be people who not only can afford much more expensive cars but also tend to have much more expensive cars parked beside it. It seems like they're more feel good status symbols than practical money savers. I imagine if this car can give them the feel-good "look at me I'm helping" of a hybrid without sacrificing much on luxury it will sell very well. It could probably get 15mpg and still make people feel good about themselves for buying a hybrid as much hype as they've gotten.

RE: Feel Good
By lagomorpha on 4/10/2007 11:36:49 AM , Rating: 4
Please tell me I'm not the only one that's seen plenty of garages with a Toyota Prius parked beside a Corvette/Pathfinder Armada/Porsche Cayenne.

RE: Feel Good
By KTLA on 4/10/2007 12:12:09 PM , Rating: 2
<eyes squinted>



RE: Feel Good
By therealnickdanger on 4/10/2007 1:08:47 PM , Rating: 2
*eyes closed*

Good for youuuuuuuu!

RE: Feel Good
By jtyson on 4/10/2007 1:22:06 PM , Rating: 2
Dammit! You both beat me to the South Park reference!


RE: Feel Good
By FITCamaro on 4/10/07, Rating: 0
RE: Feel Good
By Chillin1248 on 4/10/2007 5:08:51 PM , Rating: 5
Speaking of Al-Gore, here is a very amusing fact I came across this "enviromentalist":

House #1:
A 20-room mansion (not including 8 bathrooms) heated by natural gas. Add on a pool (and a pool house) and a separate guest house all heated by gas. In ONE MONTH ALONE this mansion consumes more energy than the average American household in an ENTIRE YEAR.

The average bill for electricity and natural gas runs over $2,400.00 per month. In natural gas alone (which last time we checked was a fossil fuel), this property consumes more than 20 times the national average for an American home. According to the Associated Press, the Gore's 10,000 square foot Belle Meade residence consumes electricity at a rate of about 12 times the average for a typical house in Nashville 191,000 kwh versus 15,600 kwh. While there are mitigating factors this is still a surprising number, given that the residence is approximately four times the size of the average new American home.

This house is not in a northern or Midwestern "snow belt," either. It's in the South.

House #2
Designed by an architecture professor at a leading national university, this house incorporates every "green" feature current home construction can provide.

The house contains only 4,000 square feet (4 bedrooms) and is nestled on arid high prairie in the American southwest. A central closet in the house holds geothermal heat pumps drawing ground water through pipes sunk 300 feet into the ground. The water (usually 67 degrees F.) heats the house in winter and cools it in summer.

The system uses no fossil fuels such as oil or natural gas, and it consumes 25% of the electricity required for a conventional heating/cooling system. Rainwater from the roof is collected and funneled into a 25,000 gallon underground cistern. Wastewater from showers, sinks and toilets goes into underground purifying tanks and then into the cistern. The collected water then irrigates the land surrounding the house. Flowers and shrubs native to the area blend the property into the surrounding rural landscape.

House #1 = Al-Gore
House #2 = G.W. Bush


RE: Feel Good
By Chillin1248 on 4/10/2007 5:09:51 PM , Rating: 2
Oops, forgot to throw in link:


RE: Feel Good
By grenableu on 4/10/2007 7:29:24 PM , Rating: 3
House #1 = Al-Gore
House #2 = G.W. Bush
Bet you won't find that fact playing on CNN anytime soon. :)

RE: Feel Good
By TheGreek on 4/11/2007 1:37:37 PM , Rating: 1
Just as you won't find Cheney's deals of our well spent national energy plan for the rest of us. Its all cloaked by national security.

Actions speak louder than homes.

Bush speaks, yet Cheney's lips don't move. How is that possible?

RE: Feel Good
By fic2 on 4/10/2007 1:01:57 PM , Rating: 1
This is for the Al Gore's of the world that preach one thing, but practice another.

BTW, what is the mpg of this car - not even listed in the article.

RE: Feel Good
By fic2 on 4/10/2007 1:09:22 PM , Rating: 3
MPG - found my own answer: better than 25 mpg. That is pretty d*mn good. My Subaru gets a little better than that, but is a 4 cylinder with less than half the horsepower and probably less room.

RE: Feel Good
By FITCamaro on 4/10/2007 2:25:27 PM , Rating: 2
Better than 25-29(i found) mpg huh. Yeah thats good....Chevy's Corvette gets 29 mpg(many drivers report over 30) as well with a 6.0L V8, 400hp, and for nearly half the cost. And if you say it still puts out a lot of emissions, the LS2s high compression ratio helps cut down on that as well. Higher compression = a more complete burn = lower emissions, better mpg, and more power.

Maybe not better than a hybrid for emissions, but a hell of a lot more fun. And their LS7 with 505hp gets 26mpg at a still $25,000 difference. This will be nothing more than a toy for the rich to say "Look at me! I'm saving the planet". Then they'll mash the pedal, roast the tires off, drain the battery pack, and use gas like every other sports car. You don't buy a car with 440hp to drive it like a Prius.

RE: Feel Good
By boobot on 4/10/2007 4:11:50 PM , Rating: 4
Put the Vette's 6.0 engine and tranny in the Lexus's 5000lb chasis and it WILL NOT get 29mpg!

RE: Feel Good
By TheGreek on 4/11/2007 1:39:35 PM , Rating: 2
True, and the Lexus won't have nearly as many recalls or paint issues.

RE: Feel Good
By Brandon Hill on 4/10/2007 4:45:31 PM , Rating: 3
Why are you comparing a 3200 pound sports car to a 4300 pound LS 460 L luxury sedan (likely a few hundred pounds more for the LS 600h L)?

That same 6.0 liter engine in the CTS-V (weight 3,500 pounds) gets EPA ratings of 16/25 with a six-speed manual (14/22 with the revised 2008 EPA ratings).

The Pontiac G8 with the revised 6.0 liter engine (weight ~ 4,000 pounds) is likely to be the same or slightly worse.

GM can't work miracles with RWD large sedans with big engines. In fact, Maximum Bob announced today that it has suspended all of its future RWD platforms/vehicles with the exception of the Camaro (which is too far along to kill now).

Lutz blames it on this:

RE: Feel Good
By theapparition on 4/10/2007 6:49:06 PM , Rating: 2
When a corvette engine is brought up, you know I have to chime in!

While there is no comparison on the weight, I can design any car to have max fuel economy. If I properly gear/tune either of my corvettes, I could easily acheive over 35mpg highway. Performace would be awful, but that is the trade off. There is a balance of power/emmissions/economy that must be made, all within a cost envelope. While FITcamaro's comparison is not dead on, he has a point in that what owner is going to be looking at this, other than the "look at me crowd". If they truely wanted to increase efficiency, they would have reduced weight as well. I agree that the CTS-V would be a more apt comparison, but I can buy a lot of gas with the price disparity between those two cars. That's 20 years of gas.

The G8 will use the Vortec variant of the Gen IV with displacement on demand. Fuel economy should be respectable.

RE: Feel Good
By Yeah Yeah on 4/12/07, Rating: 0
RE: Feel Good
By BZDTemp on 4/10/2007 3:30:11 PM , Rating: 3
25 MPG is a start and I guess it's not bad thinking about many of the soccer mum SUV's having a hard time making half of that. However 25 MPG would not be considered good mileage in Europe where anything below aprox. 40 MPG is bad and you'll need to go 50 MPG for anyone to call it good mileage.

If you want to be really fuel efficient over here there are cars which will do about 75 MPG and I'm not talking Hybrids or anything like that.

The European cars would likely be just as Gas guzzling as the US ones was it not for a long tradition of Gas being taxed meaning a Gallon is costing more than $5.50.

RE: Feel Good
By Ringold on 4/10/2007 4:45:35 PM , Rating: 1
High mileage 'cause it's taxed? Or perhaps because this thing would be a goliath compared to a 75mpg european car of which you speak? :)

Asides from the social engineering aspect of creating a culture in Europe that is virulently pro-small-car (to the point of demeaning American's different taste), all I see as a benefit of high gas taxes has unfortunately been big tax revenue. There's been conservation from that culture shift, but it hasn't spawned the innovation that it should've.. which means it's caused plenty of pain but not created a solution.

So comparison to Europe and European cars just can't really be made, I don't think.

RE: Feel Good
By BZDTemp on 4/11/2007 7:12:36 AM , Rating: 3
It seems I need to elaborate a bit here :-)

I did not really comment on anything but the 25 MPG as being a start moving towards fuel efficient motoring. That and the fact that the average MPG is a lot higher in Europe plus that our use of fuel efficient cars is likely more because our taxes than because we love trees.

Why you can't see any benefits from the high gas taxes is beyond me!? Firstly the gas taxes mean that those using the roads are paying for them and secondly it means a lot less gas is used which equal less pollution and less dependency of oil (In fact the country I live in is exporting oil but if we drove US cars and had no wind mills we would be importing big time).

Finally as for gas taxes causing pain I don't see it. If you mean that our cars are less fun to drive you are certainly wrong. They may look small but due to small engines and more space efficient construction there are bigger on the inside than you would think. Also just as important they are not so heavy so they are more agile and fun to drive less like sofas :-)

RE: Feel Good
By bldckstark on 4/13/2007 12:09:03 PM , Rating: 2
In Europe they use the imperial gallon.
That is equal to .8 of U.S. gallons

75mpg Euro = 60mpg U.S.
25mpg cited in the article is 30mpg Euro.

RE: Feel Good
By therealnickdanger on 4/10/2007 1:12:31 PM , Rating: 2
BTW, what is the mpg of this car - not even listed in the article.

It must really be that bad! jk
I'll take a wild guess and say 21ci/32hw in actual use.

Also, what's the life expectancy of this battery? Still 100K miles?

RE: Feel Good
By Kuroyama on 4/10/2007 12:40:20 PM , Rating: 2
Fuel economy and being "green" have nothing to do with Toyota selling this vehicle. They don't have a V12, so this is their way to edge into the high horsepower market using technology that Toyota already has. The only people who will care one way or other about this being hybrid are probably those who want the newest technology in their fancy shmancy super expensive car.

RE: Feel Good
By Brandon Hill on 4/10/2007 12:54:45 PM , Rating: 3
Toyota does have a 5.0 V12, albeit a rather dated one in their home market Century sedan

RE: Feel Good
By caqde on 4/10/2007 12:55:43 PM , Rating: 1
Toyota does have a V12 they just don't sell vehicles that carry a V12. The engine is called the 1GZ-FE google it up. It was in a vehicle they released in 1997 the Toyota Century. So technically if they wanted they could make a V12 based car..

RE: Feel Good
By Kuroyama on 4/10/2007 1:06:49 PM , Rating: 2
The Century is sold only in Japan and used primarily for dignitaries and others who want a chauffeured vehicle. The car has only had one major revision in 30 years, so it hardly fits the mold of someone wanting the latest high tech luxury car. Likewise the engine has probably had little development over the years and hence is unlikely to be suitable for any other market without major work. So while my claim was technically incorrect, I still think the hybrid is only being used to add more power to the vehicle and has nothing to do with fuel economy.

RE: Feel Good
By hubajube on 4/10/2007 1:12:47 PM , Rating: 1
So while my claim was technically incorrect, I still think the hybrid is only being used to add more power to the vehicle and has nothing to do with fuel economy.
I think Toyota is just cashing in on the hybrid "craze". I'm sure they know who actually makes up the hybrid market. As others have noted, a typical hybrid owner has other high end cars in the stable. Hybrids are nothing more than a status symbol.

RE: Feel Good
By Kuroyama on 4/10/2007 1:38:13 PM , Rating: 2
Really? Maybe in CA where you can drive in the carpool lane and Hollywood types play with their fancy toys, but here in MA all the hybrid owners I know (self included) don't have a fancy second car.

RE: Feel Good
By The Boston Dangler on 4/10/2007 8:25:47 PM , Rating: 2
here in MA all the hybrid owners i don't know seem to absolutely loaded. just my observation in the not-too-shabby South Shore and Metro West.

RE: Feel Good
By Kuroyama on 4/11/2007 5:00:29 PM , Rating: 2
I'll certainly agree that Prius owners have fairly high incomes, but when I drive through Lexington/Bedford area I see nary a Prius in front of the big mansions but plenty of Porsche, Lexus, Mercedes and the like. I'll even agree with other posters that someone with a Prius and a Porsche SUV (or the like) is a hypocrite.

In my case my wife was worried about driving in the snow (we moved from Atlanta), so we wanted traction and stability control, and of course side air bags to (sort of) protect us from the SUVs, and some rear space (small wagon size) to transport the occasional moderate sized item. Subject to these conditions the Prius is one of the cheaper cars available; the 4WD Matrix/Vibe is perhaps a bit cheaper but doesn't have as many safety features and has significantly worse fuel economy.

RE: Feel Good
By goku on 4/14/2007 4:03:20 AM , Rating: 3
Why does having a porsche SUV and a Prius hybrid make you a hypocrite? Maybe they want an SUV for when they actually need it and a hybrid for everyday grocery shopping.. It makes sense to have a car and SUV, but to have only an SUV to do mundane tasks is stupid.

RE: Feel Good
By theapparition on 4/10/2007 10:17:04 PM , Rating: 2
If you could spend over 100K for this, second cars are not a concern.

RE: Feel Good
By masher2 on 4/10/07, Rating: -1
RE: Feel Good
By The Boston Dangler on 4/10/2007 8:15:03 PM , Rating: 2
I totally disagree. Toyota brings this car to market to demonstrate the flagship of flagships. Beneath the gadgets and gizmos, I'm sure the hybrid powertrain enables Toyota to reach new goals in the luxury car parameters: power, quietness, velvety smoothness and of course gee-whiz.

RE: Feel Good
By Samus on 4/10/2007 6:10:56 PM , Rating: 2
The same car can be had with a 5.0l V8 for nearly half the price. Same interior and same features (except the dual AC condensors)

Waste of money for an additional 80hp and slightly better gas mileage.

RE: Feel Good
By The Boston Dangler on 4/10/2007 8:21:19 PM , Rating: 2
lol, you're talking about $50 - 100K cars, and only one is a waste of money?

1. any car under $50,000 has exponentially better practical value

2. you don't roll like i roll

I am sure...
By retrospooty on 4/10/2007 10:57:10 AM , Rating: 2
that it is a nice car, being a high end Lexus and all, but why does Toyota have such a pension to create ugly. The past decade has seen Toyota's designers all overdosing on ugly pills.

RE: I am sure...
By Brandon Hill on 4/10/2007 10:59:54 AM , Rating: 2
What exactly is ugly about it? It looks rather elegant IMHO.

I guess a better question would be, what do you think is a good-looking car in the luxury segment?

RE: I am sure...
By RussianSensation on 4/10/2007 11:05:49 AM , Rating: 2
People who buy $100k US luxury sedan don't necessarily buy them for looks alone but looks can be destructive to the image of the vehicle (Bangle butt 7 series). However, Lexus is both unable to match the elegance of the A8 or the status of the brand new S-Class. In fact, the S-Class is so much head and shoulders above everyone else in its class based on styling and status, there is really no point in getting anything else, other than the rare Maseratti Qaudraporte for exclusivity or a used A8 due to high depreciation. Lexus on the other hand is just a blend card with lots of toys.

RE: I am sure...
By Bluestealth on 4/10/2007 11:06:43 AM , Rating: 2
The backend of that car is hideous. I really don't like the new Camry or any derivatives of the frame. I will admit that I don't really like Toyota's styling as much as Honda's but at least most of Toyota's cars are fairly aesthetically pleasing.

RE: I am sure...
By FITCamaro on 4/10/2007 11:45:22 AM , Rating: 1
Not only that but it looks like they tried copying a Mercedes front end but left the Toyota look on it. Doesn't go well together.

Personally I think the new Cadillacs look awesome. Nice sharp lines. The new BMWs don't look bad but I like the Cadillacs more. If I were buying a luxury car these days it'd be the Cadillac STS-V (I think) with the supercharged DOHC 4.4L V8. The Cadillac CTS-V is also nice as its basically a luxury Corvette.

RE: I am sure...
By Brandon Hill on 4/10/2007 11:57:30 AM , Rating: 2
Personally I think the new Cadillacs look awesome. Nice sharp lines. The new BMWs don't look bad but I like the Cadillacs more. If I were buying a luxury car these days it'd be the Cadillac STS-V (I think) with the supercharged DOHC 4.4L V8. The Cadillac CTS-V is also nice as its basically a luxury Corvette.

But then again, you've already stated your GM bias in previous posts ;-)

For me, it'd be:

Compact: BMW 335i Sedan or Lexus IS350
Mid-size: Infiniti M45 or Lexus GS430
Full-size: Lexus LS460 or Audi A8

RE: I am sure...
By GoatMonkey on 4/10/2007 1:02:18 PM , Rating: 2
It's sad that BMW made their new 5 and 7 series cars so weird looking. The 3 series is still great though.

Of course he likes GM cars, his name is Camaro.

Cadillac has massively improved their styling over the last few years. They have also massively improved their quality from what it was in the 80's. It's tough to get a good reputation again when they were bad for a long time. Hopefully Cadillac can maintain high quality for the long term and earn back some buyers.

Cadillac is putting in some very powerful engines now. The styling is pretty good. The interiors look dated compared to Lexus.

The best thing about Cadillac at this point is their value as a used car. The depreciation is fantastic for used car buyers. Lexus can't match it there, but if you buy it new that's a good thing.

I would add a Mercedes to the list of good looking full sized cars. I don't remember the model number, but the one with the cool sloping roofline. Otherwise I agree with that list.

Lexus is much stronger at making interiors than exteriors though. A lot of the recent Lexus cars look like a large Camry. The SC430 was a styling departure for them, but to me it just looks like an inverted bathtub and not in a good way like some classics.

RE: I am sure...
By hubajube on 4/10/2007 1:10:01 PM , Rating: 2
I thought the SC430 was beautiful. I still think it's beautiful. A welcome departure from their other cars.

RE: I am sure...
By GoatMonkey on 4/10/2007 1:32:20 PM , Rating: 2
The SC300 and SC400 were much better looking cars. I like the idea of the SC430. Hard top convertibles give great flexibility. The SC430 just looks weird to me. They need to update the styling soon.

RE: I am sure...
By BillyBatson on 4/10/2007 12:23:06 PM , Rating: 2
actually i like the way it looks other than the front grill it is either too plain or just doesn't go well with the car, but otherwise i like it

About the LS460L - first hand observations
By povomi1 on 4/10/2007 1:46:04 PM , Rating: 5
My friend's mom got a fully loaded LS460L recently (2-3 months ago). They moved out to a new house, 3-4 times as big as the previous one they lived in, and he wanted to show me the car, which was parked in the garage. I can definitely state that it is AMAZING-ly luxurious. Now my friend's father is a Dentist (much loot but works 24/7, 12-hour shifts, 5 days a week) and they were deciding between a BMW 7 series, BMW M5, and the LS460L and the two BMW vehicles were just a step down in luxury.
(Our conversation about the M5 was pretty funny, "Dude! Wtf!?!?!? Your mom's getting an M5?" lol, thats coming off of a 2001 Camry. But he did convince her to get an M5... and then they ended up getting the LS460L)

I'll describe the interior a bit if anyone is interested or curious. Fully leather seats, climate control in/on every seated passanger. NAVi, HDD surround sound 7.1 sound system and DVD, Mark Levinson 19 speaker (if anyone is interested or curious just look up Mark Levinson, if for no other reason as to the insanely high priced audio equipment that they offer), Parallel parking, DVD screens in the back with the LS460L Presidential package. Well, there's alot, alot more to this car and I figure most people have read or heard about most of the things. Fridge, cooler, w/e else that I didn't find in it lol.

About the so called PARALLEL PARKING. First off, its not “just a gimmick”, nor is it something thats meant to absolutely differentiate Lexus from the competition, maybe just a little bit. It’s absolutely necessary for most people who will be driving this car. The car is so big that my friend who is 6'1" couldn't tell/see wtf was going on behind him when he was looking into pulling out. It’s like driving a truck but for really really rich folk who don't have the skill base. The dimensions of the car are really huge. I personally don’t know how I would even be able to pull out of a parking spot, going reverse, if not for the video camera in the rear, which displays on the DVD/Navi screen.

The sound system is incredible. When I was told that it sounded like being in an orchestra or concert, I didn't believe it. I was thinking “yeah that’s nice, ok”. Wrong!

*** Now I have a very nice sound system installed in my car, a Toyota Corolla (why I installed it, very very cheap for me). I have the Pioneer MP7800 headunit, with Infinity Kappa Perfect 6.1 component speakers (Infinity's top component speakers) in the front, and their 3-way 6x9 in speakers (Infinity's top 6x9 model) in the rear, with the Infinity Baselink T sub (self-contained sub unit 300watt RMS being enough for me to even out the lows) in the trunk and Infinity's 4-channel amp for the speakers. This setup was bought curtesy of my BEST BUY employee discount & Infinity accommodation, total I spend on the equipment was about $650, not counting the headunit or remote start/sec. system. My point is that its really good stuff. Sound is amazing for me. I got s Viper 791XVR remote start/sec. system (~$179 employee discount, as compared to ~$500 standard pricing, MARGIN) with it as well since I was spending the dough. Anyways, I'd say that I've heard great sound with my setup, really great sound. Coming back to the LS460L's Mark Levinson sound system. ***

To say that I was blown away by the audio of the Lexus would be lying (sorry to disappoint if I build up some excitement/anticipation). But I was thoroughly impressed. Very much impressed. The sound was crystal clear, powerful, and it absolutely sounded like a live performance. Not one of those aftermarket (crappy) DSP bull**** preset(s) "live performances" but something like from the Symphony or a Concert, live and front row seats. Think of where the singer is actually using studio style recording equipment and sounds good, unlike many of the concerts where it’s just for the volume of the sound but quality is far from superb. No rattling (I have a little rattling after the volume gets really high, but I have no distortion at any volume level, at all, just a tiny bit of rattling when it’s insanely loud.). The doors and insulation of this vehicle are top of the line, which is 0 vib. (it better be for the price/class).
It definitely sounded better than what I have as aftermarket. The difference between high-end and luxury/audiophile-end is definitely there, but its not ginormous or even big. Like I said, its there but it isn't anything that the price difference would lead one to believe.
(I doubt anyone could ever be blown away by actual sound differences unless its comparing reference & stock with any high-end and/or luxury-audiophile sound systems, whether its car or home. Impressed is what I would say.)

What I think would be better or could be better, a DSP. From the 45min. to 1hr. that we spent messing around with the car, as my friend had never really investigated anything more than marginally, that was perhaps one of the few or maybe even only gripe. The 3 adjustments for Treble, Bass, Mids just aren’t good enough in this type of vehicle. Customization just doesn’t exist without a DSP and adjusting +/- for the highs, mids, and lows doesn’t cut it for me, not when it’s $90k - $100k for a vehicle of this class and luxury. Having everything done for you is nice but being able to put your own touches and adjustments on things is also important. Most people didn't 'inherit' money, they earned it and are alot smarter and savyier than what others give them credit (Underestimating people is a big mistake, History has numerous examples).

Before I get bashings, yes BMW does make very very nice cars. Anything that you pay $50k+ is going be good car, and get better. It’s what differentiates one car from another that will define it. Lexus = Luxury. The LS460L was recently declared the top car of 2007 in of the Auto Shows (don’t remember which one, sorry). That’s out of all of the ones released in '07.

Lastly, this car isn’t for everybody. Nor are many of the Mercedes, BMW, or even Rolls-Royces. Just because you have or don’t have the money doesn’t mean that someone else will or won’t spend theirs. I really like the LS460L. I think it is incredible for everything that it offers. But even if I did have the money I don’t know (quite frankly I doubt) if I would buy a car as expensive as this. Sending my kids to a private school and prestigious university would be a higher priority than driving such a car, a nice Accord (2008 Accord Coupe?), Camry, or even Acura would suffice. If everything was covered and still mad loot leftover after investments and donations and all else, perhaps then yes. But I it all depends on many factors, and I'm not in a such a position to say what I would do.
(Its mostly BS to say what one would do when you are only daydreaming and imagining, cause the moment you think that you get the opportunity, life throws a curveball... in your face! Lawsuits and losing your job and w/e f**k else. Maybe even a new car that comes out, Mercedes S600 isn't gonna be ride of choice for Russian gangstas forever. But yes its so nice to daydream sometimes... :D )

Unless you've experienced this car first hand I'd say that it is a bit ignorant to say anything bad about it, other than perhaps judgements about its aesthetics. Yeah it could probably look a little bit better, but I think its sexy in its own way (using sexy to describe a car? Yep! Some people have issues, lol).

- Sorry about the long post, my first one after lurking for 1-2 years.

By feelingshorter on 4/10/2007 2:20:33 PM , Rating: 2
Thanks for the very informative post. I have to agree about not judging a car before experiencing it. Its not as though everyone is buying this car just to "feel good." Its a good car and people buy Lexus just because.

By df96817 on 4/10/2007 5:03:15 PM , Rating: 2
I'd have to agree that the interior of Japanese luxury cars are much more comfortable than that of their German counterparts. But Germans win hands down when it comes to driving and performance.

Not Just A Status Symbol
By Verran on 4/10/2007 1:50:52 PM , Rating: 2
So many people have jumped on the hybrid-bashing bandwagon that it's not even funny. Yeah, I saw the South Park episode and while funny it also made some great social commentary, but it doesn't describe ALL hybrid owners.

This is a very expensive car and it's safe to assume that the buyer isn't likely to take too much notice of any savings from the fuel efficiency, but that doesn't mean they're buying it for a status symbol. Besides, how much sway does the hybrid card really hold in a society of people who spend six figures on a car? Probably not much.

Buying this car gets you at least two things besides a status symbol. First, it gets you a Super Ultra Low emissions car in class of vehicles you're used to shopping in. (Let's face it, these people probably aren't going to go buy a Civic if they have 100k to spend.) Now I don't know for sure, but I'd be willing to bet that the BWM and Benz's that they stack this thing up against aren't SULEV. Now as cheesey as it sounds to "do your part for the environment", this car does without sacrificing the luxury of this class of cars. Your typical H2-driving American may not care about emissions, but some people do.

The second thing this car gets you is a contribution to the hybrid movement. Every new hybrid on the road is one step closer to getting the technology into the mainstream. The more they can build, the cheaper they'll get and the better the benefits will get.

RE: Not Just A Status Symbol
By walk2k on 4/10/2007 2:24:37 PM , Rating: 2
It also lets you drive in the carpool lane which around here are practically empty during rush-hour when every other lane is clogged.

RE: Not Just A Status Symbol
By isaacmacdonald on 4/10/2007 3:34:36 PM , Rating: 2
This is a huge selling point here (Long Island, NY). Qualifying for the carpool lane is wildly valuable during rush hour--it could save 30% on travel time. If someone has the money to spend for a high end car, this would be an attractive alternative to the other hybrid sedans.

By mmcdonalataocdotgov on 4/11/2007 1:06:54 PM , Rating: 2
Isn't buying a hybrid about doing something, anything, to help conserve resources and green up the planet a little (even though Venus, Mars and Jupiter are experiencing global warming to the same extent as the Earth due to solar maximum)?

I have a Camry hybrid *sniff*, and I reduced the amount of fuel I use each week by half. I had a Toyota Solara V6 and used two tanks of premium per week, and now I use less than one tank of regular per week (same size tank). I had to pay a few thousand more for the hybrid *sniff*, but I ate that to do something rather than nothing.

Anyway, just to pee off the German car drivers, I think people would buy this car so they won't have to put it in the shop as much. =) Toyotas are all about soft ride and RELIABILITY, not sporty. That is why Camry owners are on average 5 years older than Accord owners, for example. (47 versus 52). Not that Accords are sporty, they just look that way. (Too much caffeine, I think.)

By Lupinicus on 4/13/2007 4:08:59 PM , Rating: 2
I'm glad someone brought up this point. Getting a hybrid is not always about saving money by buying less gas. It's also about *using* less gas overall, regardless of how much the car cost. Unfortunately, I'm a poor grad student who won't be able to afford a hybrid for many years.

By rsmech on 4/13/2007 9:27:22 PM , Rating: 2
Isn't buying a hybrid about doing something, anything, to help conserve resources and green up the planet a little

Regardless of which side of global warming you come down on conservation is a good practice. The only problem with the hybrid is all the hype. I'd like to see a breakdown on the projected impact of the car as a whole. I'm sure someone here can give the link to an article about a hybrid driven 100,000 miles would have the same impact as a hummer driven 300,000 miles. The public is sold on just a slice of the big picture (mpg). But if you take into account the environmental impact of the transport & production of materials & assembly of a hybrid not to mention proper disposal of the used batteries, the mpg becomes insignificant in the whole scheme of things.

I'm not trying to knock hybrid owners, there intentions were good. But like many global warming solutions the overall impact or end results may be worse than the intentions.

Carbon credits- I don't fully understand what it is they do. You pay money to someone who gives you the ok to pollute but this carbon credit says you conserved. How, your consumption never changed. It's like saying if the US Gov't bought a bunch of carbon credits for it's citizens we wouldn't be criticized by Europe anymore because we all have these credits now & haven't done anything for conservation. If thats what these credits do I'm all for using my tax money for them. Just think how much we would be doing to save the planet.

Another is banning good old Edison's light bulb. Depending on what you use as a replacement wouldn't some of these newer bulbs be considered hazardous. Don't some have mercury? How safe would it be to clean up a broken bulb. How would you dispose of these safely.

There are many more examples & probably some better ones. The point is that conservation is a good thing. I don't know anyone who says lets pollute. The difference I see in the global warming debate is that some people over react emotionally before seeing the whole picture. And there is some serious money to be made. If you are "doing something" for the environment somehow you are no longer an evil corporation, your intentions are pure. Al Gore is pure, he sure knows how to spend it.

Sorry for the rant. I'm not getting into how global warming is produced, that's for another time. I'm just saying yes it's nice to see technology progress, but the most green your going to see come out of this is money.

Is there any way to suggest news?
By bobsmith1492 on 4/10/2007 1:08:39 PM , Rating: 2
Microsoft co-founder heads into space for 12 days on the ISS:

By Brandon Hill on 4/10/2007 1:11:59 PM , Rating: 3
There is a little link at the top of each article that says "Suggest News"

lol @ hybrids
By shiznit on 4/14/2007 11:11:20 PM , Rating: 3
my VW TDI crushes hybrids in mpg. unless you live in stop and go trafic, diesel is the answer for now.

Real Horsepower?
By kyleb2112 on 4/10/2007 9:06:03 PM , Rating: 2
will have a combined horsepower rating of 438HP and will deliver performance on par with V12

I smell a fudge factor in how they've been touting their horsepower specs. Are the two engines cumulative to the point where you can just combine their separate horsepower ratings? When I see some independent dyno tests I'll believe it.

"Young lady, in this house we obey the laws of thermodynamics!" -- Homer Simpson
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