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Sony takes a few blows to the head over $49.99 "Fresh Start" option.

"Bloatware" is a term that is familiar to many new computer buyers. Most new computers come saddled with HDD and memory-robbing applications like trial versions of antivirus programs, various desktop search and chat applications, or perennial offenders like Adobe Acrobat.

Computer makers rely on these add-on programs to generate additional revenue in the age of decreasing computer prices -- bloatware can add as much as $60 in additional revenue for each computer sold.

Consumers, however, typically aren't amused by the overabundance of bloatware and typically 1) live with the bloatware if they are inept at removing the applications, 2) remove the applications one by one, or 3) perform a clean install of the operating system using an OEM CD/DVD and the product key on the bottom of the machine.

Neither option is an easy endeavor for computer buyers, so Sony wisely made the decision to offer customers the option of having bloatware removed from new VAIO computers before even leaving the factory. The option, called "Fresh Start", proclaimed that it would "free up valuable hard drive space" and "conserve memory and processing power".

Sony, however, made the unwise decision to charge customers a $49.99 fee for the bloatware removal. Whether the charge was intended to somewhat makeup for the estimated $60 windfall from the application publishers or just an effort to squeeze more money from its customers remains to be seen.

News of the $49.99 Fresh Start fee quickly spread around the Internet Saturday with sites taking Sony to task over the blunder. Sony quickly recoiled and removed the Fresh Start fee.

“We didn’t intend that to happen,” said Sony VAIO division Senior Vice President Mike Abary to ZDNET. “We’re removing the $49 charge."

Abary blamed the Fresh Start fee on a simple internal miscommunication within the company. He went on to confess all of Sony's sins with regards to bloatware on VAIO machines. “We heard the message loud and clear,” continued Abary. “VAIO is the poster child for negative experiences people had [with trialware]. We recognize that, and we acknowledge it. We’ve been really beat up by this issue. We’re listening and we’re taking action.”

The decision to offer Fresh Start was no doubt an excellent move on Sony's part, but the “internal miscommunication” left the company with egg on its face. Hopefully, other large computer makers will feel compelled to offer customers similar options – free of charge of course.

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The corporate dollar
By hp685685 on 3/23/2008 11:29:25 AM , Rating: 5
Wow that was quick. And the customer has spoken.




RE: The corporate dollar
By Gul Westfale on 3/23/08, Rating: -1
RE: The corporate dollar
By DASQ on 3/23/2008 12:59:19 PM , Rating: 4
*spew* What? Priced reasonably? When did this start happening?


RE: The corporate dollar
By feelingshorter on 3/23/2008 2:37:15 PM , Rating: 3
They are expensive but compared to what? People are so used to buying these crappy 500-600 dollar laptops and using it as their main desktop for HOME USAGE. I'm sorry but apparently your not lugging around a 5+ pound laptop to go to school with. If you want a laptop under 3lb with a 5 hour dvd play time (meaning it will have a very high MS word usage time), then Sony is the right choice for its price.

Compared to what? A macbook air for example? Whats the battery life on a macbook air? Not 5 hours of 10-12 hours or MS word usage? Yet it weights the same 3 lbs as the sony laptops? Thought so.

It started happening long time ago, its just people don't notice because when buying a PC you always look for 500-1000 ranges since PC laptops are so ridiculously cheap now. But i can't emphasis enough that the people that rate you up OBVIOUSLY doesn't lug around a 5 pound laptop that has a horrible 4 hour battery life. I would know since i bought into the 500-600 dollar range of laptops. My family has 3 but none of them are or can be used for real world usage outside the house. Such as business and for dedicated students.

If your going to bash Sony, give a solid example of the alternative. Don't even say macbook air! I swear, artists/musicians/writers are not corporate customers with the same needs are the expensive IBM/Sony laptops.


RE: The corporate dollar
By murphyslabrat on 3/23/2008 4:20:01 PM , Rating: 4
Erm, I happen to be lugging around a $525 Dell Vostro 1000 (memory increase). Considering that I have about 30 lbs. of textbooks in my pack, those 6 lbs aren't any sort of issue at all. Furthermore, considering that I am often working on homework or browsing for extended periods (I have a hefty commute to school, and no internet at home), I bring the AC adapter with me.

If those extra 2lbs are a problem, maybe you should spend some time in a gym.


RE: The corporate dollar
By pauluskc on 3/24/2008 9:19:04 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
If those extra 2lbs are a problem, maybe you should spend some time in a gym.

I second this motion! Stop whining about how light your laptop isn't and go to the gym. Do it. Do it. Just do it(tm).


RE: The corporate dollar
By headbox on 3/23/2008 9:16:13 PM , Rating: 5
So how long have you worked for Sony?

P.S. There's no Vaio that gets 10-12 hours of battery life.


RE: The corporate dollar
By Samus on 3/24/2008 7:18:40 AM , Rating: 2
I'd take any IBM Thinkpad over any Sony VAIO. Think hard about what I just said.


RE: The corporate dollar
By Joz on 3/24/2008 3:06:32 PM , Rating: 2
*lenovo thinkpad

Specific: x300 :D


RE: The corporate dollar
By Gul Westfale on 3/23/2008 4:30:45 PM , Rating: 1
http://www.bestbuy.ca/catalog/proddetail.asp?sku_i...

i paid $1200 for a toshiba with similar specs only a year ago, so i consider the sony above to be very reasonably priced.


RE: The corporate dollar
By Jedi2155 on 3/23/2008 5:30:42 PM , Rating: 2
Perhaps, you just needed to be a better shopper and research more. Unless you are rich, then every everything would usually be "reasonably well priced"


RE: The corporate dollar
By Gul Westfale on 3/23/2008 9:00:48 PM , Rating: 3
nope... laptops (like most tech goods) just happen to decrease in price over time.


RE: The corporate dollar
By See Spot Run on 3/23/2008 1:10:46 PM , Rating: 2
*cough* root kits *cough*


RE: The corporate dollar
By KaiserCSS on 3/23/2008 4:32:17 PM , Rating: 5
quote:
Priced reasonably...


*monocle*

Good Sir, I find it necessary to point out the fallacy of your statement.

Tally ho, gents!


afraid of bad press
By freaqie on 3/23/2008 11:30:34 AM , Rating: 3
so obviously they are afraid of the bad press.
and so they should btw...

anyway a victory for the consumers




RE: afraid of bad press
By jadeskye on 3/23/2008 11:42:48 AM , Rating: 2
I think sony thinks they're invinciable when it comes to customers. Customers are just large walking dollar signs.

Chances are that even they realised in this case they're batshit crazy and can't charge people to NOT perform a service.


RE: afraid of bad press
By MrPickins on 3/23/2008 11:47:53 AM , Rating: 1
How is this "not performing a service"?

Sony is taking a loss, so is passing the cost along to the buyer. Business 101...

Oh, and if you think any corporation looks at consumers as anything other than dollar signs, you're fooling yourself.


RE: afraid of bad press
By ElrondElvish on 3/23/2008 3:14:28 PM , Rating: 3
Business 101?

Hardly. Pissing off potential customers by having headlines all over the net tell how you they remove bloatware for cash is hardly Business 101. Any *other* company's PR department would have flagged this from the get go. Instead, they'd have slightly increased the price of each component for a $50 gross increase in price then touting how they were the first to remove bloatware from their systems.

Win-Win.

This was clearly boneheaded.


RE: afraid of bad press
By Schrag4 on 3/23/2008 7:24:17 PM , Rating: 2
Actually, I kind of agree with MrPickins. However, I think they should have taken the opposite approach. The 'Fresh Start' option should be the standard option, as everyone here would agree. However, you should have the option of loading the PC up with bloatware and taking a price cut. Of course only the most strapped-for-cash would choose this option, and the average price for a PC would go up rougly 60 bucks, but who cares.


RE: afraid of bad press
By wordsworm on 3/23/2008 9:44:42 PM , Rating: 2
I was thinking along the lines of what you said. However, I was thinking more in terms of a mail in rebate for the bloat loaded PCs. Certainly the way they went about it was a mistake that could have easily been avoided.


RE: afraid of bad press
By dever on 3/24/2008 3:43:31 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
a victory for the consumers
I'm not convinced of this. It is definitely a victory for tech-savvy customer such as those who might read this, but your average Sony shopper probably won't know to request this option, or will buy it pre-installed with bloatware from a retail outlet.

Conclusion? Those buying a Sony WITH bloatware, will now pay even MORE, because the tech-savvy few will not be adding to Sony's bottom line with the $60 that bloatware brings to the party.

PS Mr article-writer... the bloatware is not a "windfall." It's just a business decision... and probably a poor one. A windfall implies some random event. Poor word choice.


fooled?
By Iketh on 3/23/2008 12:22:49 PM , Rating: 3
this $50 will just reappear in another form, probably in the price for the laptop itself...




RE: fooled?
By HrilL on 3/23/2008 1:47:10 PM , Rating: 2
I was thinking the same thing. This might raise the price on all of their models even the ones with the bloatware. That way they'll make even more since most buyers still won't opt out of the bloatware.


RE: fooled?
By Polynikes on 3/23/2008 3:02:31 PM , Rating: 2
Yeah, I doubt Sony's just gonna let that $50 or $60 disappear.


RE: fooled?
By Scott66 on 3/23/2008 10:51:33 PM , Rating: 2
That 50-60 dollars would be a large part of their profit margins. The shareholders will revolt if Sony loses that money on every machine.


RE: fooled?
By ImSpartacus on 3/23/2008 4:12:03 PM , Rating: 2
i say they raise the price and then allow customers to save 50$ if they opt into putting the stuff on. It's a lot better to the average customer than having to pay to remove the stuff.


RE: fooled?
By FITCamaro on 3/24/2008 9:39:22 AM , Rating: 2
So you're proposing that they essentially charge to you put crap on your computer (plus making money off it from the makers of the applications) and then give you a "discount" for not getting it?

You sir need to go work for Sony. You'd fit in perfectly.


They'll just bury it, and I dobn't balem it
By Nik00117 on 3/23/2008 3:58:35 PM , Rating: 5
Those "select" computers will have "select" features which are 'required" which will cost more.

I worked in a PC shop, our margins were razor thin. We taking 6-7% profit margins. As in if we had a computer for sale for 1,500 we made anywhere from 90 to 105. Now with this we had to do the following

1. Pay the employees
2. Pay the rent
3. Pay the electricy, water, gas
4. Maintain our equipment

Now we'd typically move 3-4 PCs a day. But can I tell you what kept us afloat? The service, 40 bucks to plug in a IDE cable. Know why we charge that much? Because if we don't we ain't eating. USB cables were always a big profit margins for us, we'd buy USB cables in bulk for pennies and selling for 10 or so dollars.

The PC industry which invovles selling of workstations is not a overly profitable business venture.

I believe the avg business makes 20-40% margins which is decent, PC market is one of the worst.

Sony will simply have "high quality" cases and "batteries" and it'll bumpt he price up to 50 bucks.




RE: They'll just bury it, and I dobn't balem it
By ImSpartacus on 3/23/2008 4:10:26 PM , Rating: 2
I agree, anything to bring prices down for either party. Is it that hard to go in and uninstall a half dozen or so programs?


By JoshuaBuss on 3/23/2008 7:07:01 PM , Rating: 3
depending on the apps some can be particularly nasty actually.. pretty close to malware if you ask me.


By FITCamaro on 3/24/2008 9:41:44 AM , Rating: 3
Even after you uninstall it, a lot of the time there's still a ton of crap in your registry from it and files left on the hard drive.


What's the problem?
By MrPickins on 3/23/2008 11:45:20 AM , Rating: 2
People need to be more aware that the extremely low price of OEM pc's is subsidized by this bloatware. Any pc Sony ships without it is money lost. I really see no problem charging $50 for that (especially if it recoups less than the money lost).

All that does is bring the pc up to the price it really should be.




RE: What's the problem?
By Flunk on 3/23/2008 11:52:57 AM , Rating: 3
People see an increase in price and instead of wondering why, they immediately scream NO! That is the problem.

Sony has failed to realize the great power of consumer short-sightedness.


RE: What's the problem?
By rudy on 3/23/2008 2:00:07 PM , Rating: 2
Um that would be true if we were talking about an entry level dell/hp but these are sonys ridiculously priced laptops.


RE: What's the problem?
By ImSpartacus on 3/23/2008 4:08:36 PM , Rating: 4
I think that PC's should come stock with no bloatware, but if you are customizing them you should be able to save ~50$ if you allow the stuff to be put on.

It makes it come across as a much more positive thing.


RE: What's the problem?
By pauluskc on 3/24/2008 10:20:52 AM , Rating: 1
Any way you want to wrap it, sounds like deceptive business practice to me. And if you really see no problem with that, then you really don't see the problem.

Did I get anything with my ole KayPro other than CP/M ? No. Once the evil mastermind Bill Gates came around, I started getting screwed with my software and bundles. He started it. Bastard.

The whole point of the software is that aparently the hardware isn't worth hardly anything and so they have to make you believe you are getting a value with the added software. Hence the names "value-added-software" or "value-added-retailer". One big industry-wide conspiracy against the steadfast, complacant, apathetic consumer.


Sony's the worst?
By RjBass on 3/23/2008 9:11:01 PM , Rating: 3
Now I know all big name manufacturers are pretty bad when it comes to the bloatware, but I hardly think Sony is the worst. I am a reseller for many different computer brands and from what I have seen, the company's with the best hardware usually have the most bloatware. Especially Lenovo and HP. Sony has a good amount, that can't be denied, but the only way I could get a recent Lenovo ThinkPad to work properly was by formatting the hard drive and starting over with a fresh install.

With a Lenovo they preload the machine with three different Antivirus programs (with Norton being the worst as one of them) and then give you the option of which one you want to try. After spending over two hours getting updates and removing all the crap software it still didn't work properly.




RE: Sony's the worst?
By Schadenfroh on 3/24/2008 9:00:26 AM , Rating: 3
The only modern laptop that I own is a Toshiba branded one. It is (was) their "gaming laptop" that creeped along at a slow pace when it was shipped to me because of all the crapware that Toshiba shipped on it. (I nuked it with one of my own Windows XP discs and used the license key that Toshiba provided. They (Toshiba) only sent me a restore disk that was only capable of restoring to factor state (IE: Crapware installed and everything).

Bashing Sony individually for shipping crapware on their PCs does not make much sense considering that the rest of the industry does it.


WHAT?
By iFX on 3/24/2008 8:10:42 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
“VAIO is the poster child for negative experiences people had [with trialware]. We recognize that, and we acknowledge it. We’ve been really beat up by this issue. We’re listening and we’re taking action.”


The Sony line of notebooks have been filled with this bloatware for the better part of ten years! They are just now addressing the problem?

The VAIO has always been in the same category as Mac notebooks. Flashy hardware for "trendy" people. Over priced, underpowered, unreliable and full of bloatware.

No thanks Sony!




yeh
By Visual on 3/24/2008 9:39:00 AM , Rating: 2
the "internal miscommunication" most likely was someone ordering to add a "fresh start" option to the system and rise its price by $49 to recoup the lost advertising revenue - unconditional price increase, hidden in the "base price". then someone misunderstood it and made it so its $49 extra only for those that select fresh start.

now that it's "fixed", i guess those $49 are again hidden inside the "base price" :(

you see, one way on another, sony will take its money. just, somehow, customers seem to be happier if they are kept clueless about for which component exactly they are being charged so much...




Class Action Lawsuit, Please
By pauluskc on 3/24/2008 10:04:45 AM , Rating: 2
So if I relate this to CAN-SPAM (essentially the software spam but in terms re: email), ALL computer manufacturers who install any software other than what I have specifically requested are deliberately and maliciously spamming me right up front. And it's nearly impossible to OPT-OUT. If I don't double-opt-in on an email system, I have an option to get them in trouble. But with computer hardware systems, it's perfectly OK to spam me?

I say maliciously because it affects not only my computers' performance but also the network's performance with all this unwanted software checking for updates. Especially that derned anti-virus software, frickin' bandwidth leeches - would rather have a nice'n'small 1K virus going around the whole internet than weekly+ 6-20 MB anti-virus updates. Geeesh! </digress>

Can we get a class action suit? We've put up with this industry-wide practice for way too long. And the argument "but all computer manufacturers do this" doesn't mean the consumer should have to put up with it.

I don't want anything spammed onto my computer. I want a clean Windows install without Internet Explorer. I want to make every single choice on the software that is installed (except drivers, duh). I can do it with Linux, but all the rest want to install their own choices for me, like they really know better? </rant>




Now if only....
By JonnyDough on 3/25/2008 3:56:00 PM , Rating: 2
Now if only the standardized non-Linux OS came without bloatware. I'd love to have NLite help Microsoft produce their next set of operating systems. I'll have the stripped down version of Windows for $50 please.




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