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Sega exec believes Nintendo's luck will one day run out

The Nintendo Wii is outselling the Sony PlayStation 3 and Microsoft Xbox 360 in the next-generation console war and it is still virtually impossible to find a Wii anywhere in North America, but not everyone is impressed. Sega U.S. vice president of marketing, Scott Steinberg, unimpressed with Nintendo.

"I am a little concerned about the creative depth of the Wii pool," Steinberg said in an interview with Reuters.  "The Wii will start to look really dated in a couple years when developers get more value from the 360 and learn more and more about the PlayStation 3," he added.

While that is a point many people would agree with, Steinberg had a bit more commentary to add.  "How much value can developers and creative folks get out of this wrist motion two years from now, or five years from now, or 10 years from now?"

Overall, Steinberg expects the PlayStation 3 to one day win the console wars.

After the Reuters article quickly circulated on gaming forums, he decided to clarify his original statements.

"Sega has fully supported the Wii since day one and we continue to do so -- it's no secret that we are close partners," Steinberg clarified in a statement to GameDaily BIZ.

Regardless of what comments are made by game executives, they apparently realize it would be asinine to not make at least a few game titles available for the Wii.  The Nintendo Wii easily outsold both the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 last month -- outselling the PS 3 5-to-1.



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he's right....
By Moishe on 6/18/2007 1:36:53 PM , Rating: 3
quote:
"How much value can developers and creative folks get out of this wrist motion two years from now, or five years from now, or 10 years from now?"


He is right. I have none of the consoles, and I think the Wii is genius but the wiimote alone is not something that will continue to sell the console by itself. However, if they can come out with a list of good, fun games and if they don't sit on the current Wii hardware too long, they could really be on top.

I think ideally, Nintendo should make 50/50 kid/adult games with their fun and inventive flair. They should should make some long, in depth games to offset the huge number of mini games they see to love so much. In 2-3 years they should release Wii2 with 720p and modern graphics (instead of waiting a full generation cycle (5+ years).




RE: he's right....
By Verran on 6/18/2007 1:55:40 PM , Rating: 2
But who ever said it would last ten, or even five years?

Just because Sony's cocky enough to tell me I'll still be using a PS3 in 10 years doesn't mean I believe it. And much more importantly, it doesn't mean that we need to hold all consoles to that standard.

Nintendo's smart enough to consider the buying habits of regular people, and that's where their success has come from. Most people would be more likely to buy a $250 console every year than one $600 console every three years. That's because the typical paycheck-to-paycheck Average-Joe never has $600 to spend. And even for the people that could spend that much, most won't.

But I'd be willing to bet that if in three years the Wii was showing signs of "obsoletion", most current owners wouldn't think twice about dropping another $250 on a Wii-2. That's because it's not an incredibly large amount of money.

The Wii doesn't need to last as long as a PS3 and 360 from either standpoint. From the customer side, it's a relatively small investment, so they don't need to "milk it" for a decade before they feel justified in buying it. From Nintendo's side, they aren't gambling on future success in order to make a profit (unlike the others). Nintendo's already making their money back and more. Wii could tank tomorrow and Nintendo would still be in the black.


RE: he's right....
By SeanMI on 6/19/2007 8:16:37 AM , Rating: 2
I'd like to think you're right, but the truth is most people who have a Wii have MUCH more than $250 sunk into it. The games, controllers, etc. all make it a rather expensive proposition for only a few years of use. Now, if they'd make everything backwards compatible on the next console...but their track record for that is...well...


RE: he's right....
By Verran on 6/19/2007 11:07:28 AM , Rating: 4
But again, you're missing the point. You're looking at totals. By doing that, you've already missed the perspective of a paycheck-to-paycheck shopper. (This is a credit to you, btw. It means you're intelligent. However, most people are not.)

A paycheck-to-paycheck shopper is willing to spend whatever they have, but is practically incapable of saving. They'll spend $100 every week for 52 weeks a year, but they won't spend $600 for a 5 year investment, because they never have it. They'll buy 20 games and 3 extra controllers, but they do it all $50 at a time, so they never get sticker shock. You may think these people are stupid for not doing the math (and I'd generally agree), but they are a huge demographic in the console market.


RE: he's right....
By Spivonious on 6/19/2007 11:08:31 AM , Rating: 2
Wii controllers and games are cheaper than their MS and Sony counterparts, so even if Wii owners do have accessories, the total cost is still cheaper.

Case in point: I have a Wii ($250), 3 extra remotes ($60) and 1 extra nunchuck ($20), component video cables ($20), and 5 games ($250). Total cost: $600.

I have a complete multi-player experience for the same cost as just the system for the PS3. If I did the same with Sony it would cost $600 (system) + $150 (3 extra controllers) + $300 (five games) = $1050.

Let's say Nintendo comes out with the Wii-2 in three years. That's $200/year spent on gaming. Let's say PS4 comes out in 5 years ( I know they say 10, but they can't sit on one console for 10 years and expect to stay competitive). That's $210/year spent on gaming.

I fail to see how your argument is against Nintendo.


RE: he's right....
By darkpaw on 6/19/2007 12:35:45 PM , Rating: 2
Where exactly do you get Wiimotes for $20 ea? Considering thats half the actual price, they really are not much cheaper then the PS3 controller (about same after getting batteries).

I have a Wii, and I think it already looks dated. Doesn't mean it isn't fun to play, but I'm sure a lot of people would love better graphics (myself included).

Nintendo could really win big if they end up releasing a Wii 1.5 with 720p graphics but compatible with all current Wii games and accessories in two years or so.


RE: he's right....
By omnicronx on 6/19/2007 1:02:06 PM , Rating: 2
i dont think the article is talking about hardware really, i think what hes trying to say although the controller idea is great now, how many games can you make with only moving your wrist before it becomes even more repetative than computer shooter games.

I have a wii and im not saying its bad, but after 6 months of owning one, im already starting to get bored and i am back to almost fully playing my 360.

I think Wii will have the market for atleast the next 1 1/2 to 2 years until game developers really start using the untapped capabilities of the 360 and ps3

and about the 720p idea.. i think its pretty obvious wii buyers dont care about the graphics, i have my wii setup with component cables and it looks great.. i dont know how much better the wii would look just by changing the resolution a bit, its not like the poly count is going to go up or anything.


RE: he's right....
By Spivonious on 6/19/2007 1:51:35 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
I think Wii will have the market for atleast the next 1 1/2 to 2 years until game developers really start using the untapped capabilities of the 360 and ps3


And by then Nintendo will be coming out with their next system. This is the good thing about not losing money on your system for two years. Win-win for everyone!


RE: he's right....
By RubberJohnny on 6/20/2007 9:19:41 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
and about the 720p idea.. i think its pretty obvious wii buyers dont care about the graphics, i have my wii setup with component cables and it looks great.. i dont know how much better the wii would look just by changing the resolution a bit, its not like the poly count is going to go up or anything.


Omnicronx can i ask what sort of TV you own? I have seen a wii with component cables on a recent model 32inch 720p samsung LCD and it looked like Crap (notice the capital 'C'). I'm just wondering if 720p DLP or plasma sets handle the wii any better?


RE: he's right....
By Spivonious on 6/19/2007 1:50:02 PM , Rating: 2
Oops, sorry about the price there. That brings it up to equal the PS3 in per year cost.

I have to admit that since I got an HDTV, the Wii graphics are noticeably worse than 360/Ps3. But, the games are still fun, as you said, so I keep playing it. And the graphics are improving as developers start developing for the Wii from the ground up.

My point was that if Nintendo comes out with Wii 1.5 in two years, most current Wii owners would buy it (and thus continue their yearly gaming expense). Especially if it's still $250. PS3 owners are investing for the long haul and if the PS3 is replaced before 2011 it will leave a sour taste in the mouths of those who bought it.


RE: he's right....
By omnicronx on 6/19/2007 2:06:51 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
My point was that if Nintendo comes out with Wii 1.5 in two years, most current Wii owners would buy it


i really do not think this is the case. wii owners obviously care more about gameplay than graphics.
so unless this 'wii 1.5' offers something totally new or maybe the graphics power of a 360(which could not sell for 250) it just wont happen.. many people dont realize the wii is just an overclocked gamecube.. as they cpu and graphics core are almost identical except for clock speed. its funny what a nice sex shinny white case can do for you ;)


RE: he's right....
By Verran on 6/19/2007 2:29:24 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
many people dont realize the wii is just an overclocked gamecube..

I think you're wrong. I think they just don't care.

Hard-cores sit back and bash all day because it's technically inferior, but no one ever claimed it wasn't. Hard-core gamers are a drop in the bucket when you look at the market the Wii and DS have opened up. The sales numbers prove this. Most people don't care about HD or performance figures. Sub-par graphics in a fun game still sells. That's why people still play Zelda:OOT and GoldenEye.

If you don't believe this, no problem. You go ahead and gamble on the longevity of your console. If you think you'll still be playing PS3 in ten years, more power to you. But I don't. I've already gotten my money's worth out of my Wii, and I'd gladly buy a Wii2 in a year and a half.

Nintendo's "obsolete" hardware is outselling everyone else by leaps and bounds. On top of that, they're making money on every sale, unlike the 360 and PS3. You can nitpick and forcast all you want, but I know which pair of shoes I'd want to put on every morning...


RE: he's right....
By omnicronx on 6/19/2007 3:16:31 PM , Rating: 1
i think you jumped the gun a bit here and didnt read what i wrote.. i am basically saying the same thing as you.. people dont care about the graphics of the wii so why would people buy a theoretical wii 1.5 with better graphics if they are focused on gameplay


RE: he's right....
By Martimus on 6/19/2007 3:09:12 PM , Rating: 3
quote:
"How much value can developers and creative folks get out of this wrist motion two years from now, or five years from now, or 10 years from now?"


How much value can developers get out of a simple gamepad with buttons? It seems simple, yet the orginal Nintendo had thousands of games, with many different game concepts. The movement idea is pretty new, so there will probably be a whole lot of things you can do with it that no one has thought of yet. Why would someone call a concept obsolete when it just got started? Obviously the original gamepad concept lasted for over 20 years now, and the joystick for even longer. This is a brand new concept, and there is almost no chance that it has already maxed out its potential.


Another Wii Controller?
By Mitch101 on 6/18/2007 2:36:53 PM , Rating: 3
I will give you an exaple of guitar hero. Its silly but cool and its not your typical controller. But its a hell of a lot of fun. The Wii is like that with all games because of the motion controller. But its not limited to forever using the Wii controller. Nintendo can make a 360 or PS3 style controller or you can just use a Nintendo DS controller.

My 5 year old can play games on the Wii. I doubt there are nearly as many kids games between the PS3 and 360 my kid can pick up and play instantly without a 3 hour learning curve.

You cant convince a 5 year old that GTA4 is more fun than something like Mario Kart. Its not all about graphics.




RE: Another Wii Controller?
By ioKain on 6/18/2007 3:41:49 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
I will give you an exaple of guitar hero. Its silly but coo


There is nothing cool about playing a plastic guitar.


RE: Another Wii Controller?
By Bioniccrackmonk on 6/18/2007 4:28:27 PM , Rating: 2
I am sure he means playing the game, which is fun, and not playing with a plastic guitar by itself. Now if you know how to play a guitar then maybe not, but for the most part it is fun.


RE: Another Wii Controller?
By omnicronx on 6/19/2007 1:07:48 PM , Rating: 2
and thats why you arnt the ceo of sony ;)
im guessing half the reason ps2 sales are so high right now is because of guitar hero.. i admit i hate that damn game.. but i know many of people who went out bought a mini ps2 and guitar hero without ever planning on buying another game


RE: Another Wii Controller?
By ioKain on 6/19/2007 2:48:35 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
and thats why you arnt the ceo of sony ;)


Just because the masses do it does not make it cool. I never said it wasn't selling well. :)


RE: Another Wii Controller?
By omnicronx on 6/19/2007 3:20:29 PM , Rating: 3
i know ;) i just wanted to point out how guitar hero is selling like hot cakes right now.. and in doing so increasing ps2 sales.. i wasnt trying to poke fun =D

i guess im just mad that i suck at the game because of my stubby fingers


RE: Another Wii Controller?
By mircea on 6/19/2007 12:54:22 PM , Rating: 2
They don't even need a new controler. They already have the classic, plus it has ports for the GameCube Controller. It won't be wireless but it works.


RE: Another Wii Controller?
By Spivonious on 6/19/2007 1:45:37 PM , Rating: 2
And with the Wavebird, even the GC controller can be wireless.


Many a Wii owners I know...
By enlil242 on 6/19/2007 7:49:25 AM , Rating: 2
I'd like to point out that most of the Wii owners I know, own a 350 as well. I think the charm and innovative controller got them to pick one up in addition to their next generation console.

I am curious how many other existing next-gen owners are getting a Wii as a second device and how this would translate to future cross-platform titles.

Most of these said friends play the included Wii sports. I think it would take a lot more of these types of titles to get people to continue to buy the games. If I had a choice of getting a truly next-gen game on the Wii or 360 (paste ps3 here as well) I would definitely go for the 360 (ps3) title.

Wii for me is not a next-gen console in terms of Graphics, it's more of a cute novelty to complement the game consoles you already own. This is not a knock on the Wii either. I do not own one, but I do recognize that it offers a truly unique gaming experience.




RE: Many a Wii owners I know...
By omnicronx on 6/19/2007 1:14:58 PM , Rating: 1
good post,
I would also like to point out, many big wii games out truly do suck.. mario party is kind of cool but i have more fun with previous versions as there is nothing new, COD3 controls were just plain hard.. and tiger 07 was the gamecube tiger 06 with new controls..
zelda was cool but you could tell it was for kids. i know this is only a few games but i really wonder what will happen if nintendo actually releases an amazing game.

*crosses fingers for mario galaxy*


RE: Many a Wii owners I know...
By XToneX on 6/19/2007 1:59:30 PM , Rating: 2
Waiting for nintendo to make a good game?? Everyone else is talking about how Nintendo is the only one making good games...


RE: Many a Wii owners I know...
By omnicronx on 6/19/2007 2:26:12 PM , Rating: 1
ok i should restate what i said.. yes the games are selling yes the games some of the games are fun.. but as i pointed out, some games are the exact same game as on gamecube but with new motion controls.. so yes they sell, and yes people are having fun for now, but just imagine if they released a real franchise must have game, with great gameplay, controls, and a game that anyone would play..
like mario galaxy ;) now that would screw ms and sony for sure.

im not trying to knock the wii as i love mine.. but you have to admit some of the games are crappy ports with new controls.. and it kind of gets tiresome after a while.. for one i played and beat tiger 06 on gamecube, and i wasnt too thrilled that it was the exact same game when i turned 07 on, thinking OMG YOU CAN SWING LIKE REAL GOLF.. 30 min later the novelty wore off and i realized it was exactly the same. marioparty is the same thing... same old same old


RE: Many a Wii owners I know...
By jconan on 6/19/2007 8:13:45 PM , Rating: 2
A lot of companies only port the games over to another platform but fail to to make sure that everything is usable. Tekken 5 and Virtua Fighter 5 are examples of ports from a psp overt to a ps3. Only the D-pad is usable and the joysticks are dead.


RE: Many a Wii owners I know...
By Mitch101 on 6/20/2007 11:36:24 AM , Rating: 2
I never owned a dreamcast so for me its not entirely about the Wii games. I enjoy having the library of gamecube games to play as well. Gamecube games are very cheap too. Typically $9.00 or less.

If Microsoft does drop the 360 I will be adding one of them to my collection but more so to extend my Media Center.


Nintendo's official response.
By peldor on 6/18/2007 2:02:21 PM , Rating: 1
"You're with Sega. The Saturn? The Dreamcast? Remember those? STFU about hardware."

Well, it should be the official response.




By Bioniccrackmonk on 6/18/2007 4:31:07 PM , Rating: 3
I will give you the Saturn, but the Dreamcast was an awesome piece of hardware when it came out. Crazy Taxi, Marvel vs. Capcom, that is just naming a few titles that were fun to play. The reason they quit selling the Dreamcast is because of how easy it was for people to rip the games, burn them, then play them w/o the use of a mod chip.


RE: Nintendo's official response.
By SeanMI on 6/19/2007 8:07:49 AM , Rating: 2
Seriously...the Dreamcast had the best games ever. Eternal Arcadia, Grandia 2, Marvel vs Capcom, Test Drive LeMans, Power Stone, Crazy Taxi...I could go on and on...I still play my Dreamcast.


RE: Nintendo's official response.
By Malhavoc on 6/19/2007 12:01:17 PM , Rating: 3
Oh man, you are making me want to find out where I packed mine up.


I don't know
By Lightning III on 6/18/2007 7:37:17 PM , Rating: 2
the wii is really hot and hot = fad

fad = here today gone tomorrow

bleh

build a gaming rig now thats fun

and what keeps sony and xbox from developing slightly diffrent controllers that utilizes motion but is customized for induvidual games but with great graphics and a compelling storyline

and then where will wii be

sorry had to do it

]:P>




RE: I don't know
By Spivonious on 6/19/2007 11:11:20 AM , Rating: 2
Why would I want to buy a separate controller for each game? That would be a nightmare.


RE: I don't know
By omnicronx on 6/19/2007 1:04:56 PM , Rating: 1
ya i think the ps3 and 360 are past the point of no return in respects to controller changes.. when it comes to full motion controls that is.. i wouldnt surprise me if developing the wii controller cost nintendo more than developing the wii console it self.. as its basically just an overclocked gamecube


By Tanclearas on 6/18/2007 7:37:52 PM , Rating: 2
Sega's Scott Steinberg says, "I can't see beyond the horizon, so it must follow that nothing exists beyond it."




Hmm
By shinojic on 6/18/2007 9:58:34 PM , Rating: 2
Your post actually had me lol iokaine.




Wii controller
By wallijonn on 6/19/2007 1:22:04 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
"How much value can developers and creative folks get out of this wrist motion two years from now, or five years from now, or 10 years from now?"


How much do you think they will wring out of the 6-axis controller? Or rumble feedback? Or a flight stick? Or a light gun? Or a steering wheel? Or a mouse and keyboard?

Why can't Nintendo refine their controller so that it evolves and morphs into something more useful?

The plain fact is that people are used to using TV remote controls, therefore the Nintendo is merely an extension of what people already are accustomed to doing. What if tomorrow Nintendo comes out with a flat keypad, one where the thumb swipes and the fingers touch like playing a piano? What if they replace the nunchuck with a car shift type device? People are used to engaging gears on a car, so a controller can be built around that idea.

If the Wii controller can emulate all the motions that the human body can already do, then there can't be any end of the "creative folks" to come up with a game which will appeal to some people.

Me, I'm waiting for the wireless headphones which have motion sensors in them, since people are used to using headsets for iPods and telephones. So a driving game can be created whereby to turn left you tilt your head to the left. Just like you so in real life.

It'll be awhile before they come out with the glasses which will detect eyeball travel.




By mircea on 6/19/2007 1:48:07 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
"How much value can developers and creative folks get out of this wrist motion two years from now, or five years from now, or 10 years from now?"


I find interesting that he believs that a brand new motion controller can't be more creative than better graphics. I know more power can bring inovation in control, but I cant believe it's more than a new way of doing it all together.




Yeah...
By gradoman on 6/20/2007 3:26:06 PM , Rating: 2
Cause it has the worst graphics of the bunch...

...oh please. Their IPs > the rest of the damn video game industry.

As for Sega, if they hadn't made the dumb decision of making the Saturn ridiculously difficult and unusual to program for, we might have still had Sega around as a top-notch console manufacturer. Sometimes, it pays to appeal to "casual" users and try something different from the typical grafix wh0re approach and biggest ePen0r mentality.

That being said, I can't say I want to reeally play any console games at this point. Oh well.




Wii2 the real next gen winner
By Adsski on 6/22/2007 4:16:42 AM , Rating: 2
Ok, so this is pure speculation on my part but I have a feeling the nintendo boys are still gonna win the next generation, but with the Wii2 in a couple of years.

Let's be honest before the Wii lauched there was a lot of commentary that it would be a flop. Nintendo were taking a big risk with the wiimote / nunchuck control mechanism and so decided to mate this with hardware that they could make at a profit and cheaply engineer games for. From what i've read the Wii hardware / SDK are direct evolutions from the GC only twice as powerful etc etc.

Now heres the interesting bit, so were sold on the wiimote and the game play mechanism. Now Nintendo can increase the horsepower in a couple of years with the Wii2 but also take full advantage of other advances. It's new processors will likely be on 45nm (IBM power pc dual g5 maybe), GPU also on 45nm but I suspect with horepower akin to todays 8600gt / hd2600xt and easily able to do 720p / 1080i resolution (i'm not expecting the HDTV standards to change by then!). Add to this that by then blue laser diodes will be cheap as chips and it'll also have a next gen drive. It'll run with minimal increased power requirements, still be tiny and hopefully still $250. And backwards compatible with Wii1 and GC and VC games. who knows they may even give the next gen drive movie playback facilities! I think then we'll have our winner.

Just my thoughts




Duh!
By Supersonic3474 on 6/18/07, Rating: -1
RE: Duh!
By blckgrffn on 6/18/2007 5:37:06 PM , Rating: 2
So what are you saying, exactly?


RE: Duh!
By peldor on 6/18/2007 7:17:30 PM , Rating: 5
Clearly he's saying the Gamecube outsold the PS2.


RE: Duh!
By Holytrinity on 6/19/2007 4:37:05 AM , Rating: 2
Your logic is flawed, as the above post has pointed out.


RE: Duh!
By tkSteveFOX on 6/21/2007 7:04:54 AM , Rating: 2
The case for the Saturn will be the case for the PS3.The Wii isn`t an overclocked gamecube,people.It`s a new console with new instructions.Can an overclocked gamecube produce titles such az Super Mario Galaxy.If you`ve seen footage of that game ,well i can say that it looks about next gen as most of the X360 PS3 games out there.I`m crossing fingers for a new StarFOX game.The Wii doesn`t require that much horsepower due to the lowe resolution.If the PS3 and 360 only displaied 480p the Wii would be outdated yes , but thats not the case here.As the developers are learning new ways to exploit the consoles hardware,so will the graphics rise.PS2 is an extreme peace of s*** hardware cause of the low texture cache.Seriously the PS2 was outdated graphicly when Unreal 2 came out.I`m not even talking about Half Life 2 two years ago that litteraly sunk the PS2.But they still make games for it , and good games despite them being ugly as hell:)Look at Odin Sphere (it`s a 2D game for gods sake and the PS2 hick`s up to it).Some people i remember said that the PS2 is even more powerfull than the Gamecube(funnt isn`t it:)).SUch a shame for the Dreamcast it really couldnt keep up with the loss Sega had with the Saturn.The DC could have lasted another 2 years at least.


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