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Limits were reduced days after Netflix said it would enter streaming market in Canada

Many consumers in the U.S. have access to broadband service from either cable or phone providers that offer unlimited data consumption each month. Some providers do limit bandwidth that a user can consume in a given month without overage charges in a fashion similar to that of wireless providers.

Unlimited bandwidth is a great thing for consumers who like to stream content online from services like Netflix and others. Streaming video does consume lots of bandwidth and some providers are looking to make money on streaming content as it gains popularity from overage fees. One such provider is Rogers in Canada.

CBC News reports that Rogers, the second largest ISP in Canada, announced this week that it is lowering its allowed download limits. Customers who sign up for Rogers Extreme service after July 21 will get 80GB of monthly bandwidth rather than the 90GB that people who signed up before that date are allowed. 

Buyers who opt for the Lite service will get 15GB of bandwidth per month rather than the 25GB offered before. Rogers is offsetting the reduction in monthly allowance for Extreme service customers by upping speeds to 15Mbps from 10Mbps before. The Lite service maintains its existing speed. Users who go over their data allotment for the month are charged an extra $50.

The announcement of reduced data allowances comes only a few days after Netflix announced that it would be entering into the Canadian market with its streaming service. 

John Lawford, a lawyer with a consumer watchdog group said, "It's easier to make money from [data] overage charges because those aren't really advertised rates. You're going to make more money from those overages, eventually, than your regular monthly rates. It also kind of wrecks [Netflix's] business model if the cost to the end user goes up after they've subscribed and then they cancel it a month later because they can't afford it."

The move is also seen as a way for Rogers to put a damper on Netflix's viability in the Canadian market. Rogers offers a streaming service similar to Netflix's streaming service in Canada already and the two will be competitors in the market.



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What the .....
By IamJedi on 7/23/2010 9:43:32 AM , Rating: 5
So, let me get this straight, they cut the amount of bandwidth you can use in a given month, but they increase the upload/download rate of your connection; therefore, getting you to the cap limit faster, depending what you do.




RE: What the .....
By Botia on 7/23/2010 10:05:29 AM , Rating: 1
I'm no expert, but it seems like you could hit 15GB in a little over 2 hours at 15gbps.


RE: What the .....
By barjebus on 7/23/2010 10:14:06 AM , Rating: 4
With rogers you need to divide the advertised speed by 5. So it would actually take you 10 hours ;)


RE: What the .....
By Flunk on 7/23/2010 11:11:14 AM , Rating: 2
I have rogers highspeed express and I really get the advertised 10mpbs down. Now that means the bandwidth limit is laughably low but I can't say I've ever had an issue with the actual speed of the connection.

I live in the middle of the biggest city in Canada so it may be worse out in the sticks.


RE: What the .....
By wuZheng on 7/23/2010 11:58:14 AM , Rating: 2
I used to get the advertised link speed, then it kinda dropped for a bit, now its back up again. What can I say, DOCSIS 3.0 over some aging sections of Rogers' network might not be the best idea. Looking forward to getting that friendly warning as I approach the monthly limit in August.


RE: What the .....
By GaryJohnson on 7/23/2010 10:36:46 AM , Rating: 3
At 15Gbps you would hit 15GB in 8 seconds.


RE: What the .....
By quiksilvr on 7/23/2010 11:11:07 AM , Rating: 2
I think he meant to say 15 Mbps.


RE: What the .....
By gamerk2 on 7/23/2010 3:53:17 PM , Rating: 2
8 bits in a byte people, so 8Mb = 1MB.


RE: What the .....
By MrFord on 7/23/2010 10:46:25 AM , Rating: 5
Another funny thing is that they had no problems giving you 90Gb/month before, but now that they know people will use it, all the sudden they bring it down.

Sounds like those unlimited calling plan, that is until people started using more than 500-600 minutes a month, then it was deemed abusive.

It's all you can eat, as long as you limit yourself to 1 serving.


RE: What the .....
By Uncle on 7/23/2010 1:49:54 PM , Rating: 4
Its all coming to the forefront.We made these arguments for years and the CRTC wouldn't believe us. First convince everyone that P2P and pirates are the problem. Then introduce throttling and caps. When really its about holding on to your monopoly. All of a sudden their is no bandwidth problem. Rodgers will give you faster d/l so you can reach your cap faster, which also means their going to dump throttling. All the previous issues were non issues and Rodgers is admitting it. The other monopolies are going to get on board.


RE: What the .....
By Iaiken on 7/23/2010 4:04:25 PM , Rating: 3
Not just that.

Their competing products to Netflix "On Demand" and "On Demand Online" do not count towards your data usage.

This is a clear cut case of Rogers using their position as an internet provider to damage, impede and derive profits from direct competition to it's multimedia business.

Honestly, it's downright despicable.

I've already filed a complaint with evidence to the CRTC and to Minister of Industry, Tony Clement. If this concerns you, I suggest you do the same.


Sasktel
By barjebus on 7/23/2010 10:05:59 AM , Rating: 5
I live in the province of Saskatchewan in Canada and we have a government run telecom called Sasktel. I used to be a Shaw snob, but decided to finally give Sasktel a shot. When I asked the tech installing my line about what the download caps were, he just laughed...his words: "Download as much as you want. Hell, just leave it on, download constantly, we don't care". I knew I'd found the provider I wanted :)

Cheaper than Shaw/Rogers, better service, and no download caps...yes please.




RE: Sasktel
By MrTeal on 7/23/2010 10:42:00 AM , Rating: 2
I've never had a problem with Sasktel phoning about excessive usage; same goes for Telus. Not sure what there tolerance is these days since my bandwidth usage is probably 1/20th what it was in its prime, but they've been good to me.

But then, what's a few GB between friends who have a TV/Inet/Mobility/Security bundle?


RE: Sasktel
By gmyx on 7/23/2010 11:39:58 AM , Rating: 3
Nice, time to move. Do you have any nice hills I could set my house on? (JK)


RE: Sasktel
By MrTeal on 7/23/2010 12:37:11 PM , Rating: 2
Are you kidding? We have mountains all over the place!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackstrap_Ski_Hill


RE: Sasktel
By gmyx on 7/23/2010 1:39:49 PM , Rating: 2
Nice. 45 meters high... lol.


RE: Sasktel
By barjebus on 7/23/2010 5:34:16 PM , Rating: 2
Haha :D Blackstrap! Its a former garbage dump, and about the only hill in sight in that area.


RE: Sasktel
By BruceLeet on 7/23/2010 1:34:25 PM , Rating: 2
Yeah I've got the same kind of provider, there are no download caps but it's only a 4.2mbps adsl connection. You just wait for the CRTC to muck this up for us though barjebus, haha.


Slightly inaccurate
By GreenEnvt on 7/23/2010 9:37:15 AM , Rating: 2
Customers who go over are charged UPTO a max of $50, but they pay a set amount per gigabyte until they hit that $50.
I believe extreme users pay something like $0.50 per gigabyte, and express users pay like $5.00 per gigabyte.

It does stink, seems they did this just as Netflix announced it is coming to Canada.
I am on Cogeco, and while I love my 14meg/1meg connection for $45/month, I dislike the 60GB cap. I haven't hit it as of yet, but was planning on ditching my normal cable TV for netflix when it arrives, which might not be possible on 60GB.




RE: Slightly inaccurate
By HotFoot on 7/23/2010 10:36:05 AM , Rating: 2
Still, a reduction in services provided while keeping the same price is a bad deal. I can't figure out why I was able to get 10 Mbps connection with unlimited data usage for about $35 eight years ago, while today the same speed with a 60 GB cap costs $49. Everywhere else in the computer world, costs have been decreasing while performance goes up.

At the very least, the computers on the back-end of Rogers' service are a cost that should be going down over time.


RE: Slightly inaccurate
By Exodite on 7/23/2010 11:53:19 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
I can't figure out why I was able to get 10 Mbps connection with unlimited data usage for about $35 eight years ago, while today the same speed with a 60 GB cap costs $49.

I can answer that easily enough.

The business model currently employed by all major service providers does not allow for spending any of their revenue to actually improve the network infrastructure.

It's all about getting the users to pay increasingly higher rates for the existing bandwidth, until they've reached the point where the pricing turns away enough users to make it actually reduce revenue.

At that point they'd have to actually improve the network, though by then it's going to be by far too late.


RE: Slightly inaccurate
By Mitch101 on 7/23/2010 12:54:47 PM , Rating: 3
Internet TV will be the next big thing.

I watch a lot of HD streams through the web. This is nothing more than the cable companies trying to keep their monopoly by limiting where you get your video from.

They will hide behind illegal file sharing but the reality is they could lose cable and pay per view to streaming services. So they implement caps so they get a cut of the pie when you exceed your limits.


RE: Slightly inaccurate
By Flunk on 7/23/2010 11:13:29 AM , Rating: 2
It's very easy to hit a 60Meg cap with two gamers in the house. xbox live and steam are huge bandwith hogs, add that to the actual games and maybe some youtube and you have a problem without even considering much else.


RE: Slightly inaccurate
By Ytsejamer1 on 7/23/2010 12:13:32 PM , Rating: 2
I use Netflix streaming here in NH (Comcast), while also temporarily ditching my DirecTV. I stream all my TV watching (DailyShow, ESPN, various networks) and average about 35GB used per month...according to Comcast's online usage meter.

I spoke to one of my friends who upgraded to Comcast business because he hit his 250gb cap by streaming netflix through his playstation in adddition to normal net usage. He's not a gamer or heavy torrent downloader in any stretch of the imagination. I myself use a media pc hooked up to my televisions.


RE: Slightly inaccurate
By Solandri on 7/24/2010 1:06:06 PM , Rating: 2
Netflix HD streaming maxes out at 3800 kbps, which is 1.6 GB/hr. To hit the 250 GB cap, you'd have to watch 156 hours of HD movies in a month, which is over 5 hours a day. He may not be a heavy gamer or torrenter, but he's definitely a movie junkie.
http://blog.netflix.com/2008/11/encoding-for-strea...

That's not to say I think these caps are a good thing. I wish the FTC would get off its butt and sue all these companies selling "unlimited" service into actually providing it. If they want to go with tiered bandwidth caps, fine, go ahead. But quit lying about it and calling it unlimited.


Well in the UK....
By vertigo1 on 7/23/2010 11:46:45 AM , Rating: 5
I pay 10 pounds ~ 17 dollars for a 20Mbit ADSL line with unlimited bandwidth (O2).

This article just shows how greedy Rogers is.




RE: Well in the UK....
By bobsmith1492 on 7/23/2010 12:01:53 PM , Rating: 3
I think that 20% VAT has something to do with it... subsidies just hide the actual costs of doing business.


RE: Well in the UK....
By Hieyeck on 7/23/10, Rating: -1
Anti-competitive
By TallCoolOne on 7/23/2010 10:33:25 AM , Rating: 2
If this adversely effects Netflix's business they should sue for anti-competitive business practices. Rogers also supplies cable TV service and digital movie rentals in Canada so directly competes with Netflix.




RE: Anti-competitive
By HrilL on 7/23/2010 7:08:08 PM , Rating: 3
This was my exact thought. The article also mentions that Rogers offers a streaming service like netflix. I'm betting their service doesn't get counted in your bandwidth usage. If that is the case I doubt they'd be able to get away with that in even the US and in Europe they'd be ripped a new one.

This is just more proof that caps have nothing to do with network strain and more to do with keeping out any kind of competing services with the Telco's offerings.

Also the fact they dropped the cap after netflix came to market is a red flag. Not to mention that price of bandwidth is constantly going down.

At my work we got 70Mbps for about 2750 a month that works out to 22,680GB of download bandwidth that can be consumed in a month bring the price per GB to about 12 cents. The fact that we also have the same amount that can be uploaded in a month drops the price to 6 cents per GB. So with this logic it costs a National ISP most likely less than .05 cents per GB. Rogers is a complete sham. $45 for 80GB is a complete joke. I feel bad for those poor souls that have that as their only option.


Dammit.
By wuZheng on 7/23/2010 10:40:27 AM , Rating: 2
Looks like Rogers is pulling out the anticompetitive cards again, but thats all fair game here because its freaking Canada and we love monopolies/oligopolies in all of our primary consumer service based industries.




RE: Dammit.
By gmyx on 7/23/2010 11:42:21 AM , Rating: 2
Amen. Your choices are limited to who the government (a.k.a. the CRTC) allows to service you. Rules: Only one... screw the customer. You don't like it, too bad.


Misleading headline is misleading
By oldscotch on 7/23/2010 11:24:21 AM , Rating: 2
"cutting" limits sounds like the limits are being removed, not becoming more stringent.

Download limits are a farce. Advertising 15Mb/s is all well and good, but useless if you're not allowed to use it. I'd much prefer to have my bandwidth around 5 Mb/s with no cap.




RE: Misleading headline is misleading
By HrilL on 7/23/2010 7:16:31 PM , Rating: 2
same here. with 5Mbps you can download up to 1620GBs. ISPs shouldn't cap the amount of data you use. Just the speed you're allowed to use at a given time.

So Rogers gives you a connection that can download 4860GBs in a month yet you're only allowed to use 80GB. That seems logical.


I See
By btc909 on 7/23/2010 10:43:55 AM , Rating: 2
So you can end up charging more as customers decide to watch streaming movies & don't realize they went over the cap yet you provide enough bandwidth to be able to watch streaming movies.




Pricing by usage rates
By The Raven on 7/23/2010 11:39:00 AM , Rating: 2
I really wouldn't mind the ISPs doing this if they charged us fairly (on a bit by bit basis and not these artificial tiers) and let us know the actual costs of using all that bandwidth. Just like any other utility. I mean it isn't cool that my mother-in-law uses less than 1/100th of what we do, yet we pay the same price. We put more demands on the infrastructure but she has to pay for it.

But that will never happen, so this move sucks. Unlimited usage at a cheap price please.




I used to
By raphd on 7/23/2010 1:49:04 PM , Rating: 2
I used to have Shaw before I was forced to have Rogers. When Rogers finally got 10mbit I started to get the same download speeds as I did with Shaw in 1997, but with a much greater price.

Netflix needs to partner with Bell to crush Rogers.




Bell Aliant
By Titanius on 7/23/2010 10:26:37 PM , Rating: 2
No its not Bell Canada, its Aliant, or Bell Aliant they call it now. Zero download limits per month...oh yes, Bell Aliant all the way...and they are bringing Fiber to the Home, screw Rogers, and all hail Bell Aliant!




It's high time...
By integr8d on 7/24/2010 5:38:24 AM , Rating: 2
...for Netflix, Google, etc to get into the broadband business. Networks represent/protect their dying business model.

Google's trial program will be interesting to watch.




sucsk to be in canada
By poohbear on 7/25/2010 10:33:13 PM , Rating: 2
Canadians get raped by their ISPs, and the thing is they just keep taking it without raising hell. a cap on how much u can download???? its 2010 for sH$ts sake!!! the 10mbps is useless w/ a cap. grow some balls canucks and raise hell!!!




Switch to TekSavvy?
By Hoser McMoose on 7/26/2010 12:51:17 PM , Rating: 2
If you want better download caps, TekSavvy is starting to offer cable internet in many of the areas currently served by Rogers. Up to 10Gbit/s speeds and 200GB monthly cap or an unlimited download option for $12 more. This is in addition to the DSL service they have been offering for a while. Note though that it's not in every Rogers-served city yet, so you gotta call to see if it's in your area.

I don't work for them, just been a customer (on their Dry-loop DSL service) for a few years now and am very happy with the service.




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