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Print 38 comment(s) - last by retrospooty.. on Apr 2 at 4:09 PM

End of support is coming April 8

Windows users are a good example of "newer isn't necessarily better," as many continue using Windows XP despite the upcoming end of support.
 
The folks over at Neowin noticed that the latest Net Applications figures show that 27.69 percent of PC users still run Windows XP. In fact, it's the second most-used operating system in the world.
 
This may seem a bit surprising, considering Microsoft will stop delivering patches for the OS starting April 8, 2014. The number of XP users only fell slightly from February's 29.53 percent. 
 
The stats show that Windows 7 tops the list with 48.77 percent of PC users. Windows 8 and Windows 8.1 -- Microsoft's latest versions of Windows -- fall far behind both Windows 7 and Windows XP. Windows 8 grabbed 6.41 percent of the OS market while Windows 8.1 had only 4.89 percent, for an 11.3 percent combined share. This was a slight increase from February's 10.68 percent.

 
Windows XP is still getting some love more than a decade after its launch
 
It's a bit surprising that Windows 8 has more users than Windows 8.1, considering it was a free upgrade that featured many improvements over 8. 

Windows XP, which was released in 2001, has proved to be a popular OS that Windows users want to hold onto (especially since the next available version was Vista in 2007, and many opted to stick with XP). Windows 7 sold better than Vista, but now, with Windows 8, many are upset again with the complete user interface redesign -- mainly the addition of live tiles and the loss of the Start button. 

Last month, Microsoft said it would give customers $100 to get rid of their Windows XP PC and upgrade. It's likely hoping to boost Windows 8/Windows 8.1 software sales and PCs -- and maybe even some homegrown Surface sales. 

Sources: Neowin.net, Net Applications



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Windows 8.2...so simple
By titanmiller on 4/1/2014 3:10:27 PM , Rating: 2
If Windows 8 completely dropped the tile desktop and brought back the Windows 7 start button/menu then it is a very good OS. I'm using Windows 8.1 now with Start8 (which brings back the start button/menu) and I'm perfectly content with it. No issues whatsoever. Why can't MS at least give us a simple option to have the start menu? It boggles the mind.




RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By retrospooty on 4/1/2014 3:36:53 PM , Rating: 3
"Why can't MS at least give us a simple option to have the start menu? It boggles the mind."

That was on purpose. It was there in the dev preview, and removed for the final release. It was taken out on purpose to try and force MS's agenda down our throats. The underlying code is still there, which is what start 8 , classic shell and the others use (with some minor mods).

Any time a company gets too big and starts forcing things like that it turns out bad. I don't know why they bother. Natural or chosen product synergy is fine, forcing horrible products (in this case a touch UI on non touch PC's) in the name of that synergy never works well.


RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By karimtemple on 4/1/14, Rating: 0
RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By Solandri on 4/1/2014 6:09:07 PM , Rating: 5
Microsoft wasn't stupid. They knew exactly what they were doing. They drooled over the iOS App Store model where Apple was getting 30% of all software revenue, and decided they wanted that for Windows. So they made it so the only way you can buy/install Metro apps is through their Store, then they made Windows 8 dump you straight into Metro to get you to use it instead of the desktop.

Users rebelled and demanded the start menu back. So in 8.1 Microsoft brought back a start menu which... dumps you straight into Metro. Oh, and how do you get the 8.1 update? You go into Metro and download it from their Store.

Everything they're doing is to force you to use Metro and their Store. Because if they can get a critical mass of Windows users to use Metro apps, then will start raking in a 30% cut of all Windows software sold. That's why they're ignoring customer demands - your wishes and needs are secondary in importance to them getting you to use Metro. 30% of all Windows software sold is a bigger carrot than 100% of all Windows and Office copies sold. At least until people start dumping Windows for alternatives.


RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By karimtemple on 4/2/2014 12:57:05 AM , Rating: 2
You say Microsoft isn't stupid, but then everything you say after that is to the contrary.

Not only was it stupid to try to adopt the iPhone's business model to Microsoft Windows , but even if it wasn't stupid to do that, it's still stupid to adopt it using a clueless interface that's from left field.

They made a fairly interesting (though not too compelling) tablet interface, but then decided to integrate it with desktop and neglected to do any actual integration. Which, as I said, was stupid.


RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By Milliamp on 4/2/2014 12:00:10 PM , Rating: 2
It's wasn't stupid because if you look at statistics their main competitor is just some other version of Windows.

If people flat out reject Windows 8 being forced on them they will buy Windows 7 instead and if windows 9 is good you have a market of people 2 version behind at 7 and people who bought 8 and hated it BOTH looking to upgrade and sales do great.

They are in a win win situation because many people only buy every other release anyway. If they get every other release terribly wrong the ones they get right look like solid progress.

They have been doing this for a while and its been highly profitable for them so far.

98 good, ME bad, XP good, Vista bad, 7 good, 8 bad


RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By atechfan on 4/2/2014 5:24:31 AM , Rating: 2
Vista was far better than XP. Windows 7 is pretty much Vista. The vast majority of problems with Vista at launch were incompetent companies, like NVidia, who couldn't write a proper driver, even though they had plenty of warning about the driver model change. (Sorry to offend NVidia fans, but the largest percentage of Vista crashes were NVidia drivers.)

The next biggest issue was PC makers who shipped Vista on PCs with 512MB of RAM. By time 7 shipped, 1GB was the minimum shipped, and 2GB was common even on budget machines.


RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By Spoelie on 4/2/2014 6:35:19 AM , Rating: 2
I saw vista at launch, it was horrendously slow. And I'm not talking about benchmark numbers, but everyday tasks like opening an application, browsing through folders, ... . You can blame it on the hardware or NVIDIA all you want but that has nothing to do with it.

Memory usage was also out of control. Remember this?
http://www.anandtech.com/show/2281

Maybe after some patching & tweaking, Vista became usable. But 7 is what Vista should have been in the first place.


RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By atechfan on 4/2/2014 7:49:39 AM , Rating: 2
I had Vista at launch too, and it worked fine if it had enough RAM. Vista reserved a lot of RAM for caching, and it speeded things up substantially over XP if you had enough RAM. It sucked if you were RAM starved, I agree. Part was MS's fault for liting 512 MB as minimum, for sure.


RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By NellyFromMA on 4/2/2014 8:47:52 AM , Rating: 2
Exactly. Vista's problem was essentially Microsoft's capitulating to Intel regarding Vista Ready. This Since then, Microsoft has had a very difficult time recovering PR-wise. Apple really took advantage during that time period and this marked the beginning of Apple's relevance in the consumer space. And yes, that means I don't think Apple was relevant there before; it was niche at best.


RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By inighthawki on 4/1/2014 4:59:11 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
The underlying code is still there, which is what start 8 , classic shell and the others use (with some minor mods).

I'd love to be proven wrong, but I was pretty sure that that was not the case, and that they reimplemented their own versions. There seem to be too many behavioral and structural differences between them all for that to be the case.


RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By marvdmartian on 4/2/2014 7:32:01 AM , Rating: 2
Careful. Last time I brought up any points like this, I was downrated!

MS wants to control what you use to get your "info-tainment". They're doing this by trying to get people used to Windows 8 on computers, which they hope will then lead them to buy W8 tablets and W8 phones, so that you have all your devices running basically the same OS.

I can't blame them for wanting this, as they've seen it be successful first with Apple and iOS, then Google with Android.

However, I CAN blame them for the way they're accomplishing it, mainly by shoving Windows 8 computers down our throats, by basically not allowing the OEM's to put out too many Windows 7 models, even though (I'm guessing) W7 is a MUCH more popular OS than W8.

Quite honestly, Microsoft is starting to remind me a little bit too much of Apple, in their BORG mentality!


By inperfectdarkness on 4/2/2014 3:19:06 PM , Rating: 2
It's because MS started focusing on HARDWARE. Kin, Zune, Xbox, Surface, etc. MS just can't deliver game-winning hardware (as defined by it stands head and shoulders above the competition), and in doing so, it completely drops the ball on software--it's long time bread & butter.

Go back to playing your Xbone and complaining about Windows 8...as though there's no correlation there whatsoever. Lol!


RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By Mitch101 on 4/1/2014 3:52:56 PM , Rating: 3
I agree for those who are comfortable with start let them have classic view if there are free and $5.00 apps that do it Microsoft can certainly provide it as well to those who prefer it. Still its hard to complain when there are free apps that one can run to do it.

Me Personally I dont see a need to have start return since I started using 8.1.

Right click on 8.1 start icon is just awesome.

Unload the pre-installed apps. Not having the X to close these apps is a problem. Just uninstall them. Nobody needs a full screen calculator.

Make the tiles small and only have the important ones listed. This is essentially just a desktop full of all your useful apps icons now. Although I found a use for some tiles to be large and leave the start menu on my right monitor at times.

Turn off the exit app to start menu and have exiting an app take you to the desktop.

After doing that Im really liking Windows 8.1 now over Windows 7. Having the ability to mount an ISO and pause copy jobs is a dream. Task manager is much better its also faster than Windows 7 here and there.

Windows 8.1 is free to upgrade from Windows 8 so anyone not using 8.1 and sticking with 8 is just torturing themselves.


RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By Spuke on 4/1/2014 4:27:36 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Turn off the exit app to start menu and have exiting an app take you to the desktop.
Is this just for start menu apps or desktop apps too? None of my desktop apps ever exited to the start menu. Also, I don't use any start menu apps.


RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By Mitch101 on 4/1/2014 5:13:00 PM , Rating: 2
In Windows 8 it felt like every app dropped you into the Start menu. Painful when you just wanted to get back to the desktop. Its on by default in 8.1 but you can tell it to drop you back to the desktop now.


RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By retrospooty on 4/2/2014 8:35:08 AM , Rating: 2
"anyone not using 8.1 and sticking with 8 is just torturing themselves."

Weren't you here last year defending Windows 8 to the end? Now suddenly its "torture" and the minor improvements in 8.1 are bliss? Pretty far fetched man.


RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By NellyFromMA on 4/2/2014 8:52:04 AM , Rating: 2
He's speaking relatively.... I too defended Win8 as I am not offended by Microsoft's direction, although I do think it needs tuning still and will for at least another generation or two of Windows IMO.

Still, it wasn't broken nearly as much as people scream about.

What Mitch is saying, which I agree 100% with, is that 8.1 is better in every way. Seriously, its free, so if you stick with 8, you are torturing yourself because it only makes the experience better, not worse.

Here's to hoping 8.2 maintains the direction of enhancements for the PC.


RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By retrospooty on 4/2/2014 10:48:04 AM , Rating: 2
"Still, it wasn't broken nearly as much as people scream about."

No, it wasn't "broken". It worked as planned for the most part. The issue is that the plan was complete and utter BS to force a touch UI for kb/mouse based PC's.

I agree, 8.1 is better. I have actually set up a few servers here running 2012 r2 (the server equivalent of 8.1) and I dont have any complaints. It did fix alot of UI pain from the previous 2012 (Win 8 eq.).

Still, it was a horrible idea. The millions of unhappy customers prove that. The fact that MS has publicly announced they will bring back the old start menu in hte next Windows release proved MS heard it.


RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By retrospooty on 4/2/2014 4:09:10 PM , Rating: 2
"Here's to hoping 8.2 maintains the direction of enhancements for the PC"

OK, I am impressed. I actually kind of like this new combo being shown. It seems to combine the few things I do like about the new and the unobtrusiveness of the old.

http://www.theverge.com/2014/4/2/5574830/windows-9...


RE: Windows 8.2...so simple
By Kefner on 4/1/2014 5:32:30 PM , Rating: 2
Start8 is great! I've used some of the free one, but for 5 bucks, liked Start8 better. (though classic shell will get the job done for free) I also use 8Gadgetpack, restores gadgets if you like (I like my weather/network/process gadgets!)


It's not surprising
By Zak on 4/1/2014 3:41:01 PM , Rating: 3
"It's a bit surprising that Windows 8 has more users than Windows 8.1 "

It's not. Most people who buy PCs have no idea how to change their password much less how to upgrade Windows. This also explains why there are so many XP users still out there.

Many people don't even know what version of Windows they're running. All they know is that they have Microsoft.




RE: It's not surprising
By tjcinnamon on 4/1/2014 3:47:01 PM , Rating: 2
agreed. Also, in order to upgrade a volume license you need a new disc. You can't just update via WSUS or through Windows "store"


RE: It's not surprising
By bah12 on 4/1/2014 4:42:59 PM , Rating: 3
Yep, plus it didn't come down via a normal windows update. The user had to go to the store via metro. Since most users didn't even know what the store was, most would never click on it.


RE: It's not surprising
By inighthawki on 4/1/2014 5:02:23 PM , Rating: 2
Except that since 8.1 was available, you'd get notifications every once and a while telling you the update is available, and clicking OK took you to the store page. It's basically impossible for an 8 user to not know about 8.1. My guess is many of these people are in scenarios where they can't or don't want to upgrade for various reasons.


RE: It's not surprising
By inighthawki on 4/1/2014 8:02:16 PM , Rating: 2
I'm not sure why I am being rated down. Do people disagree with my guess so much that they are offended? It's not like I'm lying about the popup, every Windows 8 user should know about the 8.1 update:

http://fud.community.services.support.microsoft.co...


RE: It's not surprising
By domboy on 4/2/2014 9:22:58 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Except that since 8.1 was available, you'd get notifications every once and a while telling you the update is available, and clicking OK took you to the store page. It's basically impossible for an 8 user to not know about 8.1. My guess is many of these people are in scenarios where they can't or don't want to upgrade for various reasons.


I find it rather annoying to be bugged about upgrading. But you're right about having reasons to not upgrade. I refuse to upgrade to RT 8.1 until a new jailbreak is found.


"Free upgrade to Windows 7 for 1 week only!"
By quiksilvr on 4/1/2014 2:37:28 PM , Rating: 2
Give them that option and see how quickly that number drops.




By spamreader1 on 4/1/2014 3:13:34 PM , Rating: 5
It would also drop the number of Windows 8 users lol.


Upgrading To 8.1
By Egglick on 4/1/2014 5:27:47 PM , Rating: 2
"It's a bit surprising that Windows 8 has more users than Windows 8.1, considering it was a free upgrade that featured many improvements over 8."

Probably because it's a confusing and convoluted process. I spent a good 45 minutes trying to upgrade my boss' laptop to 8.1 the other day, and ran out of time before I could even get it started. Windows Update does not show the 8.1 update (it always handled Service Packs in the past), and the Windows Store had some sort of bug which prevented it from being displayed. I also couldn't find any standalone install online, which MS has offered for every service pack in the past.

So in this case, you have a highly experienced user who is not only aware of the update, but who took time aside for the sole purpose of installing said update.




RE: Upgrading To 8.1
By sheh on 4/1/2014 8:48:52 PM , Rating: 2
I'm holding off because it doesn't seem like a simple SP-like update, but more of a "install new OS on old OS" thing, with the potential mess that entails. Doesn't seem to be much gain, so no rush.


RE: Upgrading To 8.1
By NellyFromMA on 4/2/2014 8:53:58 AM , Rating: 2
Upgrading to 8.1 takes no more effort than installing Angry Birds.


Half truths, lies, and statistics.
By drycrust3 on 4/1/2014 4:36:17 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
The folks over at Neowin noticed that the latest Net Applications figures show that 27.69 percent of PC users still run Windows XP.

Oh look: 1.49% of users use a Linux distribution.
Actually, there isn't any mention of Android or iOS either. I would have expected Android, with its 1 billion plus activations, to at least to have appeared in these statistics. There must be a ton of stuff running Windows XP if selling hundreds of millions of Android OS units per year doesn't even qualify for an individual slice of the pie.
Now that I look at these statistics again, there is no mention of sample size, no mention of how these statistics were gathered, no mention of margin of error ... and Tiffany's article is dated 1st of April!!! Hmmm.




RE: Half truths, lies, and statistics.
By Argon18 on 4/1/14, Rating: -1
By atechfan on 4/2/2014 5:17:12 AM , Rating: 2
If you want to bring in devices not even relevant to the discussion, QNX has a lot more traction in the embedded market than Linux. But there is obviously very little actual revenue in those licenses, or Blackberry would not be in financial trouble.


A market exists ...
By drycrust3 on 4/1/2014 5:23:06 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Microsoft will stop delivering patches for the OS starting April 8, 2014.

There is another option for Microsoft, which is they sell upgrades for XP (or contract out the right to sell upgrades). Supposedly there are about 1.6 billion computers still running Windows XP. Okay, most of these are boot leg versions, so those owners won't be interested in an upgrade, but if you think about the millions or so that are legitimate and need to run legacy software for a business (or just don't like other versions of Windows), then maybe a reasonable percentage of those would be willing to pay for upgrades, especially if the cost wasn't excessive.




Microsoft's (apparent) vision...
By croc on 4/1/2014 5:37:46 PM , Rating: 2
One kernel to rule them all, and one (touch-based) gui across all CPU's that kernel will work on. Possibly run 'in the cloud', certainly only ever 'subscribed to', never owned.

Unfortunately, reality seems to have bitten that dream in the politically correct rear end... It seems that if you build a kernel for a SoC, you have to leave out some bits that would be nice to have in, say - a quad Xeon server. Or a high-end CAD station. Or an animation-based workstation




"Paying an extra $500 for a computer in this environment -- same piece of hardware -- paying $500 more to get a logo on it? I think that's a more challenging proposition for the average person than it used to be." -- Steve Ballmer














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