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Dr. Andrew Wakefield's paper linking the MMR vaccine to autism launched the British doctor to fame and fortune. However, new reports reveal that he may have faked the data, and in publishing the fraudulent report is responsible for the deaths of at least two children who failed to get vaccinated due to the scare.  (Source: Independent UK)
Investigative reporting sheds light on what may be a shameless case of medical alarmism

There's plenty to be worried about when it comes to medicine.  From toxins, to cancer, and even medicines with unexpectedly nasty side effects, doctors have their hands full dealing with real problems.  While some in the medical and scientific community tend to ignore such dangers, sometimes to gain esteem or funding, others gravitate to the opposite extreme of spreading alarmism.

The latter may be the case with Dr. Andrew Wakefield, the British physician who fathered the scare about the possible link between the measles-mumps-rubella (MMR) vaccine and autism.  According to extensive investigative reporting by Sunday Times of London, a British newspaper, Dr. Wakefield falsified data and lied to make his case in his 1998 Lancet journal paper.

In his paper, Dr. Wakefield claimed that 8 of 12 families of autistic children who attended the clinic at his hospital began to show signs of the illness immediately after getting the "jab" -- the British name for the MMR vaccine.  In the paper, he claimed that the measles virus infected the children's bowels, giving them inflammatory bowel disease, which in turn triggered the autism.

However, the Sunday Times of London found a far different story.  Investigative reporter Brian Deer, who has been covering the story since its start, found that hospital and other records showed signs that the children were already developing autism before they had received any injection.   And while that difference might be attributable to innocent oversight, the newspaper discovered even more shocking allegations.

According to Mr. Deer, the physicians working under Dr. Wakefield were unable to find signs of inflammatory bowel disease in many of the children, but Dr. Wakefield ordered his team to falsify the data to indicate they had.  Furthermore, one of the children deemed to have the condition was taken by a parent to three other labs which were unable to find signs of the illness.

The reporter also discovered that Dr. Wakefield's interest in a MMR vaccine-autism connection began when he was retained as an expert witness two years earlier by a lawyer representing the parent of an autistic child. The parents were planning to sue the MMR vaccine makers because they believed the vaccine caused their child's illness.  According to Mr. Deer, Dr. Wakefield then launched the Jabs program, the name for clinic that led to the study.  The program was advertised by the lawyer's firm, and the clinic was not a routine screening, accuses Mr. Deer.

There had already been some signs that tomfoolery might be afoot in the paper.  By 2004, 10 of the 13 original authors on the Lancet paper asked to have it withdrawn.  They stated that "no causal link was established between MMR vaccine and autism because the data was insufficient."  Dr. Wakefield however, refused to back down from his theories.

England's General Medical Council has brought charges of medical misconduct against Wakefield and two other co-authors, Dr. John Walker-Smith and Dr. Simon Murch (the authors who continued to support the paper).  The charges revolve around the ethics of the researchers testing on children, not the new accusations.  The paper, though, has forwarded its results to the board and expects new charges to be forthcoming.

Dr. Wakefield's attorneys vigorously denied the preexisting charges as well as the newspaper’s accusations, but refused to give a formal statement.

In Britain, thanks to the scare, vaccine rates dropped from 92% to below 80%.  This led to the number of measles cases in England and Wales to soar from 56 in 1998 to 1,348 in 2008.  Two children died as a result of the disease.



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Irresponsible Ass
By marvdmartian on 2/11/2009 9:59:57 AM , Rating: 5
If these allegations are true, I hope they can find some way to punish this so-called doctor. The sheer audacity of his alleged actions deserve no less!

Bottom line: irregardless of the small percentage of kids who might have a negative effect from any one of the many vaccines they receive, the positive effect of these vaccines far outweigh the negative. Only an irresponsible ass would falsify data that would cause people to question whether they want their children inoculated or not.




RE: Irresponsible Ass
By SoylentG on 2/11/09, Rating: -1
RE: Irresponsible Ass
By Aloonatic on 2/11/2009 10:23:42 AM , Rating: 5
I think you'll find that irregardless is a perfectly cromulent word, the use of which embiggens us all.

There hasn't been a pedantic comment about spelling or grammar for a while, it's good to see DT return to a state of normalcy.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By AvidDailyTechie on 2/11/2009 12:05:34 PM , Rating: 4
life is a process of learning... although I would probably be embarrassed, I would be glad someone pointed it out to me sooner rather than later.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By zinfamous on 2/11/2009 1:01:35 PM , Rating: 1
I wish that I could vote your post up to 11.

as for the article, this is further points to the validity of scientific vetting through peer-review, and why the method works.

In all likelihood, this Dr. will lose his license to practice and will find it very difficult in the future to receive funding within the legitimate community for clinical studies. Of course the anti-science kooks will welcome him with open arms, but it does them no greater good when such an individual is publicly exposed for malpractice and charlatanism.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By tastyratz on 2/11/2009 2:16:36 PM , Rating: 2
Sounds to me like he made himself the jack thompson of the medical world.

This extends beyond just the UK. I know several people here in the usa and many others who blame autism on vaccinations and in turn did not properly or fully vaccinate their child.

Education on the reports fallacy needs to be spread for awareness.

There is no doubt in my mind that the staggering rate of autism's growth in society is due to something in our environment, its just a question of what.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 2/11/2009 4:44:56 PM , Rating: 2
I have to think that the only reason autism is "climbing" is because we have broadened the definition of "autism".

The same goes for psychological disorders.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By invidious on 2/12/2009 12:59:42 PM , Rating: 3
My cousin is genuinly autistic, it is a terrible condition. But I am sick of hearing these parents whos kids simply have a low IQ claiming its autism or ADD or whatever the media happens to be kicking up a storm about at the time.

It is completely normal for some people to learn slower than others. Misdiagnoses only divert funding and attention away from the people who really need it.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 2/12/2009 1:28:45 PM , Rating: 1
Ditto.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By Bubbacub on 2/11/2009 4:45:44 PM , Rating: 4
this asshole got struck off the gmc register a year or 2 ago.

i'm a doctor (in the uk) and i believe that 99% of doctors saw through the stream of bullshit wakefield was spitting out.

the problem was the media which completely spun the whole story as a big medical cover up - portraying wakefield as a saintly wistleblower.

there are always going to be con artists and frauds in science. the key is having intelligent scientifically literate people in the media who have the ability to objectively assess data. currently the media is filled with arts students who have very little idea on how to responsibly cover many health stories.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 2/12/2009 7:12:58 AM , Rating: 5
quote:
currently the media is filled with arts and business students who have very little idea on how to responsibly cover anything that isnt sensational or outright false .

There, fixed that for you.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By Aloonatic on 2/12/2009 11:08:24 AM , Rating: 3
Good lord, I agree with you twice in one day :)

May I also add "Media Studies" students to the list of know nothing graduates?


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 2/12/2009 4:18:17 PM , Rating: 2
Absolutely!


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By cscpianoman on 2/11/2009 2:05:27 PM , Rating: 2
Classic, absolutely classic, kudos to you, sir!


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By unrated on 2/11/2009 2:13:16 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
I think you'll find that irregardless is a perfectly cromulent word, the use of which embiggens us all. There hasn't been a pedantic comment about spelling or grammar for a while, it's good to see DT return to a state of normalcy.


I know what irregardless means, but I have no idea what cromulent, embiggens or pedantic mean.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By rcc on 2/11/2009 3:02:15 PM , Rating: 3
Main Entry: pe·dan·tic
Pronunciation: \pi-'dan-tik\
Function: adjective
Date: circa 1600
1 : of, relating to, or being a pedant
2 : narrowly, stodgily, and often ostentatiously learned
3 : unimaginative , pedestrian
— pe·dan·ti·cal·ly \-'dan-ti-k(?-)le\ adverb

The others are garbage words created by TV for the unwashed masses.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By plowak on 2/11/2009 5:07:03 PM , Rating: 2
That's no way to talk about Fox News!


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By phxfreddy on 2/11/2009 11:51:08 PM , Rating: 2
Fox News is great. Its not like CNN is regards this doctor and global warming. Both falsities.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By someguy123 on 2/11/2009 6:35:05 PM , Rating: 1
they're from a single simpsons episode. shows how popular the simpsons used to be, and still is.

pretty sure he was being sarcastic to annoy the grammar nazi. if you're going to critique something, critique the opinion or message, not the damn grammar, unless it's deliberately incorrect or insanely incorrect.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By rcc on 2/12/2009 6:06:28 PM , Rating: 2
I wasn't critiquing anything. He said he didn't know what it meant, I provided information.

Read, understand, then comment.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By anotherdude on 2/11/2009 5:22:05 PM , Rating: 3
Irrespective or regardless but not irregardless. I wonder though if irregardless will ever become a 'word' due to its repeated use?

BTW If anyone ever tells you 'mute point' is not an accepted expression show them this:

Mute Point
This is the condition that exists when the RF signal to a receiver has degraded to a such a degree that it produces excessive noise. The muting circuitry then silences the receiver. Similar to the squelch on a two-way radio.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By BansheeX on 2/11/2009 7:13:26 PM , Rating: 3
quote:
Irrespective or regardless but not irregardless. I wonder though if irregardless will ever become a 'word' due to its repeated use?


The prefixes "ir-" "in-" "im-" and "il" are equivalent to "not." For example, "irrelevant" means "not relevant." Thus "Irregardless" is a double negative that means "not regardless," even though people use it in place of "regardless." It's a stupid error, case closed.

There are far better candidates to make words. I always try to use "simulatable" before stopping myself realizing it's not a word, and then wondering why.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By twjr on 2/12/2009 7:03:20 AM , Rating: 2
I don't see why simulatable shouldn't be a word. I mean why can't anything be a word so long as the target understands the meaning. By limiting what are and are not words we are merely limiting the evolution of language.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 2/12/09, Rating: 0
RE: Irresponsible Ass
By twjr on 2/13/2009 7:34:24 AM , Rating: 2
Only for bespectacled people with thin moustaches and stiff collars.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By jadeskye on 2/13/2009 1:27:39 AM , Rating: 3
Give this man a 6, please! i'm begging you XD


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By tastyratz on 2/11/2009 10:41:12 AM , Rating: 2
Definition of Irregardless:

regardless; a combination of irrespective and regardless sometimes used humorously
SRC: Princeton.

It appears in a wide range of dictionaries including: Webster's Third New International Dictionary of the English Language Unabridged (1961, repr. 2002),[4] The Barnhart Dictionary of Etymology (1988), The American Heritage Dictionary (Second College Edition, 1991),[5] Microsoft Encarta College Dictionary (2001), and Webster’s New World College Dictionary (Fourth Edition, 2004).

To correct you, Irregardless is a word some people refuse to recognize, while others do not.

But on the post actually related to the comment you replied to, I agree with the mans stance and comments.... IRREGARDLESS of your short jab post :-)


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By AvidDailyTechie on 2/11/2009 12:59:59 PM , Rating: 2
Irregardless of what you may think, the magical place where words come from is the Oxford English Dictionary--without exception.

It is, in fact, recognized as a word, but should only be used in the context of "non-standard or humorous use".


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By zinfamous on 2/11/2009 1:08:36 PM , Rating: 5
To be fair, such adoption of an improper word is nothing new with the English language. irregardless has a long history of not being a word, and as your link shows, only "adopted" through a particular dictionary's decision to include it within their pages.

I can't honestly complain about the practice as that simply is the method of how new words enter our Lexicon; but many of us will fight for such "unacceptable" inclusions of previously deplorable and "immoral" words until the day we die.

As in all instances of social and cultural revolution, novel ideas need only wait the death of the aging generations to become accepted as normal. ;)

besides, here is the OED entry, which really is the only acceptable resource for a word being accepted into the English language:

Chiefly N. Amer.

In non-standard or humorous use: regardless.
1912 in WENTWORTH Amer. Dial. Dict. 1923 Lit. Digest 17 Feb. 76 Is there such a word as irregardless in the English language? 1934 in WEBSTER (labelled Erron. or Humorous, U.S.). 1938 I. KUHN Assigned to Adventure xxx. 310, I made a grand entrance and suffered immediate and complete obliteration, except on the pay-roll, which functioned automatically to present me with a three-figure cheque every week, ‘irregardless’, as Hollywood says. 1939 C. MORLEY Kitty Foyle xxvii. 267 But she can take things in her stride, irregardless what's happened. 1955 Publ. Amer. Dial. Soc. XXIV. 19, I don't think like other people do and irregardless of how much or how little dope would cost me [etc.]. 1970 Current Trends in Linguistics X. 590 She tells the pastor that he should please quit using the word ‘irregardless’ in his sermons as there is no such word. 1971 M. MCSHANE Man who left Well Enough iv. 96 The sun poured down on Purity irregardless of the fact that it received no welcome.

Simply put: if the OED labels it an instance of dialect, it is not a word. Doesn't mean it won't be adopted as such within the next decade or so.

As for now, "irregardless" remains, as it always has, unaccepted.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By rcc on 2/11/2009 3:12:21 PM , Rating: 2
It's a bit like "ain't". People that don't know the English language start saying it, then rather than admit they were incorrect, want it added to the language.

Unfortunately, it often works.

Speaking of fun and games, grab an old reading/English text book from the early 1900s and see how many words you know.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By rdeegvainl on 2/12/2009 7:37:23 AM , Rating: 3
There isn't a word that exists today, that at one point was not a word.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By twjr on 2/13/2009 7:39:40 AM , Rating: 2
No I am pretty certain "ugg" has always been a word.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By threepac3 on 2/11/09, Rating: 0
RE: Irresponsible Ass
By FaceMaster on 2/13/09, Rating: 0
RE: Irresponsible Ass
By Aloonatic on 2/11/2009 10:20:30 AM , Rating: 2
I agree with you entirely about him.

However, one thing that is odd about all this is that (as far as I know from the extensive media coverage this has received over the years in hte UK) there have been very few supporters of the study and yet it has been given such prominence that it has made it appear to be more "valid" than perhaps it was or should ever have been made to appear.

The guy's clearly more interested in himself rather than public safety and should be punished but the media have a responsibility to check and report the facts, yet most of the time all I heard over here in the UK was people asking if Tony Blair had given the MMR "jab" to his kid.

This is almost as much of an indictment of how poorly researched journalism is these days and how unwilling a lot of program editors, journalists and presenters are to question a sensational story rather than run with it a whip up hysteria and panic.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By Dribble on 2/11/2009 10:34:49 AM , Rating: 2
Didn't you know? - if news papers produce enough stories on something it must be true!

Not that you can really blame the papers - it was a medical article in a respected publication that had implications for many of it's readers. Lots of papers get sold reporting stories like that.

Dr Wakefield should get put away for murder.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By kelmon on 2/11/2009 11:11:26 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Dr Wakefield should get put away for murder.


I believe that would be difficult to prove in court unless you can get the dead children's parents to state that they failed to immunise their children because of the advice given by Dr. Wakefield. It should also be noted that MMR is simply a combined vaccine - the individual ones were still available and could have been used by the parents.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By zinfamous on 2/11/2009 1:52:20 PM , Rating: 2
I don't see how this would be difficult. As willing as parents are to blame vaccinations for their child's unrelated sickness, those parents that have chosen to withhold vaccinations based on spurious data would likely be as willing, if not more-so to blame a bad MD as the reasoning for the death of their child due to lack of immunization. It's either blame the doctor, or accept your own parental negligence.

I think we know enough about modern society to realize that there are hordes of individuals out there more apt to unload guilt through cash settlements, rather than accept responsibility for their own ineptitude.
And, to be fair, we are a culture that is expected to trust the medical advice of our physicians. I don't think it's a bad thing, but it raises a serious problem when bad doctors are given "positive" exposure that they never should have had. It's sad that such people can prey on and exploit the fears of parents.

I think there is a legitimate argument, in this case, for ignorant, but otherwise well-intentioned parents following this kind of advice and suffering because of it. It simply isn't fair to blame them fully when you consider the oftentimes lofty esteem within which we hold our medical professionals.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By Schrag4 on 2/11/2009 2:16:18 PM , Rating: 2
How about negligent homicide then? He didn't KNOW that his so-called 'advice' would be directly responsible for the death of any specific person, but he knew full well that someone might die eventually (more like probably would die).

Kinda like the tainted peanuts over here. Anyone who knew about that deal and helped cover it up should go to prison. Or better yet, lock them in a room for an hour with the families of those that died as a result of their greed. Anyone care to venture a guess at what happened to those reponsible for the baby food that contained toxins? Here's a hint, that was in China...


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By JAB on 2/11/2009 11:23:00 AM , Rating: 2
I have been involved in this kind of research and it is sickening. You get the results you want nothingness more noting less. Try to avoid people fixing the results and you get accused of interferance. There is a lot of money to be had from the err correct result hard to fight big money.

It also is telling on the quality of medical research. That this qualified in the first place is truly saddening but not exactly unexpected.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By kelmon on 2/11/2009 11:04:37 AM , Rating: 2
Being "struck off" and having his license to practice medicine removed is about as much as you can hope for.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By Machinegear on 2/11/2009 11:51:53 AM , Rating: 3
quote:
While some in the medical and scientific community tend to ignore such dangers, sometimes to gain esteem or funding...


Immoral guy? Sure. However I am not convinced that he lacks responsibility. A doctor under a socialized medical system is only responsible for himself by ensuring proper funding continues to flow from his customer, the government. If said doctor was actually to be accountable for his patient care, patients must be the check guaranteeing the value of the service provided. This can only be accomplished by patients paying directly for their doctor provided services. A doctor being paid through socialism can never be completely trusted as they are not accountable to the patient, and patients always suffer for it.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By Jharne on 2/11/2009 12:05:45 PM , Rating: 4
"A doctor being paid through socialism can never be completely trusted as they are not accountable to the patient, and patients always suffer for it."

As he was being paid by a private lawyer, not by state funding, I take it your argument proves the superiority of social care?

vitun ääliö


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By Machinegear on 2/11/2009 1:55:13 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
As he was being paid by a private lawyer, not by state funding, I take it your argument proves the superiority of social care?


The ambulance chasing lawyer was not a patient and not interested in patient care either. Lawyers, like the bought off socialist doctor were interested in money. False concern for patients and their care is just the vehicle for their own enrichment. Therefore my conclusion still stands. Without direct payment for services accountability will not exist. So don’t expect it.

Socialism fails wherever it is practiced; including medicine, as it incorrectly assumes people naturally look out for the best interests of others.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By erple2 on 2/11/2009 5:42:54 PM , Rating: 2
Curiously, Capitalism fails by the same reason. It incorrectly assumes that people will self-regulate. Credit Default Swap, anyone?

Though even in Capitalism, it shows that people can't even look after their own best interest...

:)

Though I suppose taking the far view, the stodgy conservative business winds up surviving in the end, so maybe Capitalism does work afterall - the meteoric rises seem to always end in a meteoric implosion.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By BansheeX on 2/11/2009 8:59:12 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Curiously, Capitalism fails by the same reason. It incorrectly assumes that people will self-regulate. Credit Default Swap, anyone?


The fundamental mistake you are making here is that credit default swaps require massive amounts of credit to exist. In other words, it requires fractional reserve banking to exist, which is legalized fraud that allows banks to create checkbook money ontop of actual deposits. In the old days when money wasn't debt-based, but backed by gold, it was essentially akin to creating redeemable notes for which no metal existed and loaning them out at interest. Few depositors actually redeem physical metal, they just trade the notes, which is what spawned the idea and caused all those bank runs. The average person understands none of this, which is why it's so easy for the people benefiting from it to buy politicians who keep the system in check by posturing themselves as regulators of all the gambling it begets.

This is standard practice in all banking models today. Instead of illegalizing it in 1913, we backstopped it with a central bank, a socialist solution. These debt instruments where people offload a bank's risk of lending that checkbook money for a fee wouldn't be lucrative if banks couldn't counterfeit credit. So your contention that free markets cause greed to spiral out of control is incorrect. Free markets don't legalize fraudulent activity for banks, the model assumes government is doing what it should: enforcing rights, upholding contracts, and offering recourse in courts. Counterfeiting certificates people think stand for real metal is not a mutually agreeable transaction, yet government stands by and does nothing and never will. The people who win positions in government are the same people who benefit and desire the "privilege" of creating money.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cy-fD78zyvI
http://www.financialsense.com/fsu/editorials/amerm...


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By Machinegear on 2/12/2009 2:11:26 PM , Rating: 2
+1

Agreed. Thank you for your eloquent post.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By rodrigu3 on 2/11/2009 4:52:47 PM , Rating: 2
If there is a negative effect, autism is not one of them.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By Motoman on 2/12/2009 1:01:24 PM , Rating: 2
There are always stupid people looking for an easy place to place the blame for their problems. And they will always glom on to whoever gives them the chance to do so.

Autism is a terrible affliction to have to live with...for the patient as well as the parents. I can't even imagine what they go through.

It's the same thing as what happens when people start to believe in wackier and wackier "alternative therapies" like acupuncture, aroma therapy, homeopathy, etc. If actual medicine can't just snap it's fingers and fix it, desperate people latch onto something else, and by a combination of self-delusion and placebo effect, convince themselves that it works.

This guy and Jenny McCarthy can both rot in hell. They are directly responsible for increasing the suffering (and death) of children worldwide for spewing this moronic stupidity. They should label this manslaughter and throw them both behind bars forever.


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By snownpaint on 2/12/2009 3:48:21 PM , Rating: 2
First.
STAY ON TOPIC..

Second,
To think that Autism is related to these Vaccines is beyond me. Just looking at the dates that the vaccines were required and introduced and the recent growing cases of Autism, if they were related we would see more of a relation and much sooner. (unless it is mutant-gene based that carries over to the next generation, doubtful).

However, Autism cases increase does seem to have a correlation to the consumer plastic packaging boom of recent times. Whether it is from the secondary environmental contact or direct influence, I don't know, but many autism cases increased during the plastic water bottle boom and other plastic packaged boom. Now, Plastic bottles show released chemicals, and I'm sure many mothers/babies were drinking bottled water/milk (worried about tap water) and other plastic packaged goods. Epigenetics are showing to be a big factor in genetics. I believe this is a gene issue, that gets flipped on much like a child developing a allergy to shellfish, but comes into play when chemicals are introduced to certain predisposition.

On the side note.
Alternative Therapies can hold merits, to discount due to plain ignorance and faith in modern medical science is to error. I'm sure there are treatments that are and were reexamined and refined from the way past. We all know the mind is very powerful over the body. (convince yourself your sick and you will feel poorly, convince yourself your well and you we behave that way.) One of the reasons heavy faith based people recover faster. Smell is very powerful in memory. So there for finding smells that relate to times of peace and comfort in your life will lead to lower stress. Stress is proven to be bad for the body and mind.
Also some of those old school cures do work. like oatmeal baths for basic skin aliments and leaches to suck out bad blood in reattached extremities. Though I am not religious belief is a powerful thing; if you were sick and the doctor said he will fix it and did, would you care it was a sugar pill?


RE: Irresponsible Ass
By Motoman on 2/12/2009 4:21:45 PM , Rating: 2
First.
HOW AM I NOT ON TOPC?

Second, I think I get it - you're expressing pro-nonsense views. People of faith don't heal faster. Believing a sugar pill helps you doesn't make it so. No one discounts this out of ignorance - it is discounted out of knowledge - i.e. clinical trials demonstrating "alternative" and "faith-based" BS to be exactly that - BS. Anyone suggesting any differently is no better than the good doctor which this article is about, and his acolytes like Jenny McCarthy. Science heals. Belief kills. It's as simple as that.


You lost me
By bighairycamel on 2/11/2009 10:02:44 AM , Rating: 1
Interesting stuff... but how exactly is this technology news?




RE: You lost me
By kkwst2 on 2/11/09, Rating: 0
RE: You lost me
By bighairycamel on 2/11/09, Rating: 0
RE: You lost me
By Seemonkeyscanfly on 2/11/2009 12:05:07 PM , Rating: 3
Technology, not just for electronics anymore...

I image your type has always been around…. Setting 3,000 b.c. A man (caveman cm1) is blogging on his cave wall about his new advancements in fire. 1) One – how to start them. 2) How to use a control substance (piece of wood) to safely transport fire from one location to another, thus spreading the fire. Enter CM2.

CM2: ugg, ugg, what fire have to do with technology. Ugg, ugg
CM1: Ug, Ug Learn to control fire very powerful and will lead to other advancements.. UG, grunt Ug.
CM2: Ugg Ugg, no, fire powerful, but control of fire not important technical change, Ug snurt , ug…
CM1: Ug, Ug Me understand you problem. Ugg, Let me show you second use of fire stick…. *a loud thud follows with little glowing hot ambers flying through the air…. UGg ugg not important..
CM2: UGGGGG!!, Hot! Uggggg, Ouch!!! Ugggg (as he jumps around with flames in his hair)
CM1: Uggg, ugg away from my wall you flaming troll…. Uggg. Suggest you study effects of fire and water Ugg ugg…


RE: You lost me
By Jharne on 2/11/2009 12:07:39 PM , Rating: 5
CM2 must have got something right, as so many people seem to be descended from him.


RE: You lost me
By Seemonkeyscanfly on 2/11/2009 12:12:08 PM , Rating: 4
He learned to reproduce at a higher rate then CM1. Of course CM2 offspring have been known to make statements like this just before they died. "Hey guys, watch this!!"


RE: You lost me
By killerb255 on 2/11/2009 2:36:19 PM , Rating: 2
Reminds me of the movie "Idiocracy". :)


RE: You lost me
By ice456789 on 2/11/2009 10:09:48 AM , Rating: 2
Forum Police... PULL OVER!


RE: You lost me
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 2/12/2009 7:25:50 AM , Rating: 2
Dailytech is Science & Tech. Vaccinations clearly fall under Science, and this asshat doctor clearly falls under bad science, so he gets a double whammy.


another view...
By sugabean on 2/11/2009 10:01:16 PM , Rating: 1
i work with children who have autism, and personally, i know many of the parents believe that the mmr vaccine contributed in some way to their child's diagnosis. i'm not saying that the vaccine causes autism, more that many parents i know believe that it somehow triggered the autism or helped bring out the characteristics necessary for diagnosis. Not all parents believe this - i also know many parents that saw characteristics and signs of autism before their child was vaccinated.
what the doctor did was wrong - obviously. but i still think that you can't completely discount his theories just because he turned out to have falsified some documents. there are many parents out there that have concerns when it comes to vaccinating their child, and their concerns don't neccessarily stem from this one doctor. likewise, the concerns aren't strictly limited to autism. like anything else, autism is worthy of far more research and inquiry so that we can better understand what causes it, how to prevent it, and how to better address the needs of those living with and touched by autism.




RE: another view...
By PrinceGaz on 2/12/2009 12:24:42 AM , Rating: 3
That does not affect the fact that this doctor is guilty of gross mis-conduct by falsifying information to link autism with the MMR vacine in order to boost his own income.

At the very least he should be struck off for life, and given the long-term effect of his crime (which is continuing to make children very ill, and possibly die), if it can be proved he delibrately altered information to support his fake MMR/autism link, then he should be charged with manslaughter in a criminal court, because as a doctor, he would know what the effect of reduced vaccine take-up would be.


RE: another view...
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 2/12/2009 7:46:06 AM , Rating: 1
quote:
i know many of the parents believe that the mmr vaccine contributed in some way to their child's diagnosis. i'm not saying that the vaccine causes autism, more that many parents i know believe that it somehow triggered the autism or helped bring out the characteristics necessary for diagnosis.

Most parents do not want to consider the possiblity that their child just might be screwed up at birth and it simply became aparent as they got older. Frankly what parents believe is not relevant to the facts.

quote:
Not all parents believe this - i also know many parents that saw characteristics and signs of autism before their child was vaccinated.

These are the parents that pay attention and were not stupid enough to believe they were incapable of producing an autistic child. These parents have accepted responsibility for it.

quote:
but i still think that you can't completely discount his theories just because he turned out to have falsified some documents.

Yes we can. Every other piece of evidence on this subject proves beyond any doubt that there is no link between autism and vaccinations, MMR or otherwise. This guy was the only one that made the claim and tried to falsify data to back up the claim. At this point the issue should be dead and burried.

quote:
there are many parents out there that have concerns when it comes to vaccinating their child, and their concerns don't neccessarily stem from this one doctor.

Again, parents are to the most part utterly lost when it comes to the science and reasoning behind vaccinations and proper medical care. If they don't want to vaccinate their kid? Fine. I don't want to see them in the hospital or crying when their kid catches something and dies because he didn't get his vaccination like everyone else. The same goes for school, if you want your kid to attend school with all the other kids, you will get them vaccinated. Not vaccinating your kid is irresponsible to your kid and other people around your kid.

quote:
likewise, the concerns aren't strictly limited to autism. like anything else, autism is worthy of far more research and inquiry so that we can better understand what causes it, how to prevent it, and how to better address the needs of those living with and touched by autism.

Touched by autism? People need to stop acting like this is some sort of special quality. Most autistic kids diagnosed as autistic are screwed for life. Some of the mild cases can and will be productive members of society. They might not be the next Bill Gates, but they can still hold down a day job and make a living. On the other end of the spectrum though we need to recognize these kids as the drain on society and their family that they are. We need a better solution to dealing with them as the current method does nothing but cost large sums of taxpayer money and that of the family they are a part of. Not to mention the inconvenience of public schools who have to tolerate these kids during the schoolday because the parents insist their kid can complete a 12 year education "if only they get lots of extra help, and special treatment to the Nth degree".


RE: another view...
By sugabean on 2/12/2009 9:07:32 PM , Rating: 2
so you think that children with autism are screwed for life? A drain on society? Does this belief extend to all children with special needs? Cerebal palsy? Downs? Asperger's? What should be done with these drains on society then? Should we save the taxpayers money and simply line the children up and shoot them? That would certainly save money, wouldn't it? How about the fact that we should teach acceptance and not tolerance? The school system is there to teach individuals how to become functional members of society and life skills. Children with autism and other forms of special needs are equally deserving of learning these same skills as "normal" children. I understand everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and I appreciate the fact that you shared yours. I find it very unfortuate however, that you view children with special needs as simply a drain on society. If your child had autism, or another special need, would you still have the same views? Would you view your own child as a drain on you? Would you enroll your child in the school system knowing how you feel about children with special needs? If not, what would you do with your child? Would you quit your job so that you could stay home with your child so that the school system wasn't required to tolerate them?


RE: another view...
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 2/13/2009 3:28:38 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
so you think that children with autism are screwed for life? A drain on society? Does this belief extend to all children with special needs? Cerebal palsy? Downs? Asperger's?

The really bad cases, yes.

quote:
What should be done with these drains on society then? Should we save the taxpayers money and simply line the children up and shoot them? That would certainly save money, wouldn't it?

Good question, my current answers are illegal under federal law at the moment. I would not be opposed to euthanization however. We do it for animals that are screwed up, why not humans? What makes us holier than thou that this isn't an acceptable answer for humans but is for everything else?

quote:
How about the fact that we should teach acceptance and not tolerance?

You can teach tolerance. Acceptance will never happen. If your working on a team and its you and an autistic person, do you babysit them all day because they just "don't get it" and were hired simply through one of these "programs" that place such people in jobs? You will be pretty frustrated after a while because your doing his/her work too because they just can't do the job as well as a regular person. This same scenario works for extremely stupid people as well, but I digress.

quote:
The school system is there to teach individuals how to become functional members of society and life skills. Children with autism and other forms of special needs are equally deserving of learning these same skills as "normal" children.

At the expense of all the other kids at school. Send these "special" kids to "special" schools and stop shafting the regular kids because teachers need to spend 10x more time and effort on them neglecting the other 15-20 kids in class. I can't stand parents that force the issue, they need to get back to reality. For the record, I had these types of kids in school, I know first hand the crap everyone else puts up with at our own expense thanks to them. And most of these kids will NEVER be functional productive members of society. It's the minority of them that make it, and I believe a special needs school would be more appropriate since it can be geared specifically for them to do that in life. Shoehorning them into a general public school so they "can be like the other kids" is bullshit. They are NOT like the other kids, stop pretending they are.

quote:
I understand everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and I appreciate the fact that you shared yours. I find it very unfortuate however, that you view children with special needs as simply a drain on society.

They are, the facts are self evident. Anyone saying otherwise is trying to take a very rational problem and add all this feely touchy emotion to it. The problem is cut and dry, lets stick with cut and dry answers shall we?

quote:
If your child had autism, or another special need, would you still have the same views?

Absolutely. I don't deal in double standards.

quote:
Would you enroll your child in the school system knowing how you feel about children with special needs?

No. I would not send them to regular public school at the expense of everyone else. If I had such a kid, they would be going to a special school or "home" where they belong.

quote:
If not, what would you do with your child?

If legal, give them away. If not legal, put them in a nursing home.

quote:
Would you quit your job so that you could stay home with your child so that the school system wasn't required to tolerate them?

I would do neither, see my above post.


RE: another view...
By sugabean on 2/14/2009 4:12:40 PM , Rating: 1
I work with children with autism and I have seen how successful they can be. I have seen a child with such severe autism that, as a six year old could barely talk, graduate high school as valedictorian and is in fact starting his first year at university in september with plans (and the marks) to go into med school. This is a child, that according to you, is a drain on society and should have been shot if that option was legal. I sincerely hope this person treats you or your children so that you can see how capable they really are.

quote:
What makes us holier than thou that this isn't an acceptable answer for humans but is for everything else?

One of the things that makes humans better than other mammels is the fact that we don't run around killing other members just because they're different. If you really want to live in a society that kills those that are different from them, then I suggest you find some wild animals that are willing to let you join them and do so. That way you won't have to worry about children with special needs being a drain on your society since you will have willingly removed yourself from a society where they exist.

Acceptance does happen. You are obviously the exception to that, which is so far beyond unfortunate. Children exposed to others that are different from themselves don't see the physical differences. They see the person and what the person is like. I do work on a team where it's me and a person with autism, and no, I don't babysit them. They do "get it". Some of the smartest people I know have autism. They still hear, and understand things. They just understand things differently. It's kind of like they speak a different language. If you don't know russian, but you visit Russia, you either need to find someone that speaks english everywhere you go so that you can meet your needs, or you adapt and learn russian. Since you don't step off the plane and automatically know russian, it has to be taught to you. Some people learn faster than others (general rule - has nothing to do with special needs). Autism is the same - some children with the disorder learn faster than others. If you are one of the slower ones to learn russian, should you be shot simply because it took you a month instead of a week? Maybe your teacher wasn't so good. Maybe you were hungry and couldn't focus. Just like "normal" people can sometimes not "get it", children with special needs are the same. We don't give up on "normal" children, why should we with special needs?

quote:
Send these "special" kids to "special" schools and stop shafting the regular kids because teachers need to spend 10x more time and effort on them neglecting the other 15-20 kids in class.

First off, there are special schools for children with special needs. I'm not sure what it's like in other countries, but in Canada we follow a "best case scenario". The child is placed in the school setting that is best for them. If a "special" school is what's best, then the child is placed there. If a public school is best, the child is placed there. The needs and abilities of the child are assessed, as well as what the parents would like the child to learn and become capable of. Second, the teacher doesn't "shaft" the child. The child has an aide, full or part time, depending on the child's abilities. If the child is in a special school, they might not have their own personal aide - there might be one aide shared between two children in a class, or something similar, but generally, if the child requires one, the child will get an aide. I'm not sure how old you are, but trust me, at least in Canada, things have changed. I've been in the school system now and witnessed how it works with children with special needs. If the classroom is constantly distracted by the child, or if students are suffering at the expense of the child, something will be done. The child will get an aide, the child will change rooms, or the child might change schools.

quote:
And most of these kids will NEVER be functional productive members of society. It's the minority of them that make it, and I believe a special needs school would be more appropriate since it can be geared specifically for them to do that in life. Shoehorning them into a general public school so they "can be like the other kids" is bullshit. They are NOT like the other kids, stop pretending they are.

The use of the word never is such a generalization. Many children with autism or other special needs become funtional members of society. True - not all of them become doctors, or lawyers, or Bill Gates, but the vast majority of them get jobs, hold them down, live successful lives. Very few wind up useless individuals sucking down welfare money like it's candy. Today, we accept that children with special needs aren't like everybody else - they're special. They need different things. Everyone needs different things. The educational system has acknowledged that and has shifted to better meet the needs of everyone, special or otherwise.

quote:
They are, the facts are self evident. Anyone saying otherwise is trying to take a very rational problem and add all this feely touchy emotion to it. The problem is cut and dry, lets stick with cut and dry answers shall we?

It seems you consider most individuals a drain on society. Individuals with special needs = drain. Stupid people = drain. What is your definition of stupid? Or extremely stupid, to quote exactly? IQ below 120? 110? 50? Does IQ even matter to you? Book smart or street smart? Where do you draw the line? And whose definition do we follow? Yours? Mine? The governments? Which member of the government? Your little cut and dry issue isn't so cut and dry. Besides, how can you not add "touchy-feely emotion" to a situation involving children? They're human beings. Part of what makes us superior to monkeys or dogs or rats is our ability to understand and empathize with others. You want us to ignore that? It's very difficult to remain "cut and dry" when dealing with people. It's in our nature to get emotional or attached, and that's a good thing.

In regards to your comments on your own children - I'm sorry. I'm sorry that you feel that way, I'm sorry that you would devalue your own children simply because of something neither you or they could control. Getting a child with special needs is luck of the draw. It's not a guarantee. I'm not trying to convice you or anyone that children with special needs are normal human beings who deserve the same chance given to the rest of us. To be totally honest, I don't think anyone should require convincing.

*Please keep in mind my experiences are from Canada - if things are still the same in the States as twenty years ago, that is the fault of the government and the educational system and they need to change.

**
quote:
If your working on a team and its you and an autistic person, do you babysit them all day because they just "don't get it" and were hired simply through one of these "programs" that place such people in jobs? You will be pretty frustrated after a while because your doing his/her work too because they just can't do the job as well as a regular person.
It's you are, so the appropriate word is you're. Not your, you're.


RE: another view...
By rodrigu3 on 2/12/2009 9:49:23 AM , Rating: 2
Do you have any evidence to show that autism in these children was caused directly by immunization and that it did not just develop at the same time that they were receiving immunizations? How do you account for the fact there are millions of other children receiving the same immunization schedule and not developing autism? Also, how do you account for the fact that the exact compound in question, Thimerosol, is no longer used as a preservative in immunizations? All the data points to NO CORRELATION between autism and immunizations, specifically MMR.

The fact that the doctor falsified information in his report discounts his ENTIRE paper, and basically anything else he says from that point onward. There is no room in science for fabrication, especially when it results in the deaths of children due to negligence and incompetence.

While it is necessary to better understand autism, using immunizations as a scapegoat is counterproductive and DANGEROUS. Real research needs to be done and resources are too scarce to be using them on investigating fabricated information.


RE: another view...
By sugabean on 2/14/2009 7:35:00 PM , Rating: 2
I don't have evidence that autism is caused by immunizations. I never meant that it is. I suggested that perhaps the immunization is a trigger that allows autism characteristics to surface. Maybe immunizations are one of many causes. The statistics right now state that about 1 in 150 children will be diagnosed with autism. Factor in genetics, mother's health during pregnancy, baby's health at birth, environmental surroundings, etc and the odds per individual either increase or decrease. For those children whose odds were increased because of a variety of factors, perhaps the immunizations were just another factor. Maybe not. I'm not saying immunizations are a cause.

quote:
How do you account for the fact there are millions of other children receiving the same immunization schedule and not developing autism?
How do you account for the fact that millions of people smoke but don't all get cancer? Basically same argument. Not all people with cancer have smoked, and not all smokers have cancer, just like not all children immunized have autism.

I agree that the doctor was wrong in fabricating evidence. He might very well have done it for noble reasons, but that doesn't excuse his conclusions and fabrications. However, the deaths of the children not immunized is not something you can blame singley and solely on the doctor. The parents were also negligent by not immunizing their child. One doctor out of how many claiming there's a link between mmr and autism doesn't mean that the mmr isn't important. All children should be immunized - no doubt about that.


Hopefully
By Desslok on 2/11/2009 10:48:02 AM , Rating: 5
I am hoping this will stop people like Jenny McCarthy from getting on their soapbox. I really doubt it, but one can hope.




RE: Hopefully
By FDisk City on 2/11/2009 11:03:05 AM , Rating: 2
Not to mention the guy in the title picture. But that's mostly due to Jenny McCarthy.


RE: Hopefully
By Danger D on 2/11/2009 4:14:14 PM , Rating: 2
I agree. They could kill children with that kind of talk. I never could figure out why they want to get more kids off vaccines. Their own non-vaccinated children’s health depends on the fact that most viruses can’t spread because the large majority is vaccinated.


RE: Hopefully
By GTVic on 2/11/2009 6:02:57 PM , Rating: 2
And the Dixie Chicks...


Doctor Who
By TheMan876 on 2/11/2009 2:15:54 PM , Rating: 2
Am I the only one that saw this article and thought immediately about the British TV show Doctor Who?




RE: Doctor Who
RE: Doctor Who
By TheMan876 on 2/12/2009 4:35:39 PM , Rating: 2
What does this have to do with what I said?


RE: Doctor Who
By HaB1971 on 2/11/2009 2:40:36 PM , Rating: 2
I guess you did not read the post 2 hours before yours?


RE: Doctor Who
By TheMan876 on 2/12/2009 4:39:10 PM , Rating: 2
I looked around before and after I posted, and I still haven't seen anything regarding confusion with the article name and a british tv show


SAMPLE SIZE of 12!
By dever on 2/11/2009 11:49:02 AM , Rating: 2
It's just ridiculous the amount of publicity for a study that had a sample size of 12. Maybe journalism schools should require a minor in statistics. It's sad that every parent in the civilized world was inundated with "vaccines may cause autism" over and over. I even saw idiots with bumper stickers saying as much... while I muttered to myself "12 kids, 12 kids."




RE: SAMPLE SIZE of 12!
By rodrigu3 on 2/11/2009 4:51:11 PM , Rating: 2
The power of the media lies in its ability to communicate with idiots.


RE: SAMPLE SIZE of 12!
By Motoman on 2/12/2009 12:56:30 PM , Rating: 2
No...the power of media comes from the idiots who uncritically believe everything they read.


RE: SAMPLE SIZE of 12!
By twjr on 2/13/2009 7:53:14 AM , Rating: 2
No...the power of media comes from the idiots who uncritically believe everything they see on television .

Think that's closer to reality.


Some not all
By stilltrying on 2/11/09, Rating: 0
RE: Some not all
By Reflex on 2/11/2009 1:06:03 PM , Rating: 4
As both have been medically used for more than a century, and banned in the US and EU nine years ago with zero reduction in rates of autism or other supposedly vaccine related disease, I don't think I'm going to lose any sleep over whether a shot contains it or not. As pointed out in Ars Technica's Nobel Intent column, your average glass of water from the tap has more mercury than a vaccine shot.


RE: Some not all
By Desslok on 2/11/09, Rating: 0
RE: Some not all
By rodrigu3 on 2/11/2009 4:41:48 PM , Rating: 2
Here's some information I gleamed from medical school. Most immunizations use aluminum sulfate as the conjugate for viral and bacterial antigen delivery, not thimerosol. Mercury on its own is banned by the FDA for use in immunizations. You can ingest a higher dose of mercury by eating tuna or other large, salt-water fish. Thimerosol exists only in trace amounts (<0.01%) in some influenza vaccinations. In addition, the current immunization schedule has been shown to have NO AUTISTIC EFFECTS on children. Jenny McCarthy is full of shit, so is this "doctor," and anyone else that tells you immunizing your child against disease is a bad idea.


RE: Some not all
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 2/12/2009 7:30:11 AM , Rating: 2
Well said. /clap


just look at his face..
By Dreifort on 2/11/2009 9:51:15 AM , Rating: 5
If watching star trek never taught you the moral values of life... it at least should have taught you that you can't believe anything Q says.

(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Q_(Star_Trek))




By Brandon Hill (blog) on 2/11/2009 9:54:51 AM , Rating: 2
And people believed this guy why?
By Some1ne on 2/11/2009 4:42:39 PM , Rating: 2
To quote from the article:

quote:
In the paper, he claimed that the measles virus infected the children's bowels, giving them inflammatory bowel disease, which in turn triggered the autism.


Now I'm no doctor, but even I can see that his claims are completely implausible. Autism is a developmental disease of the brain. Inflammatory bowel disease, as its name would indicate, is a disease of the digestive system. Without further explanation of how in the hell a disease that affects the digestive system could trigger developmental issues in the brain, his claims make no sense.

It's sad that so many people were either not perceptive enough to spot that the guy's claims were completely nonsensical, or not willing to question what he was saying just because he happened to be a doctor. At the same time, he's not the only one to blame, as to a certain extent, individuals are responsible for the stupid things they allow themselves to believe.




RE: And people believed this guy why?
By rodrigu3 on 2/11/2009 4:48:36 PM , Rating: 1
While it is a stretch, some inflammatory diseases can become septic and spread to the central nervous system, but only in very severe cases. The patient would probably experience paralysis first, then coma due to increased intracranial pressure. I'm not supporting the doctor, I'm just saying that the reasons his paper is bullshit are different than from what you're referring to.


RE: And people believed this guy why?
By Some1ne on 2/11/2009 7:36:46 PM , Rating: 2
Right, sepsis can cause all sorts of problems. However, there was no mention of that in his claims.

Further, if the vaccine were causing sepsis, then that would have been a serious concern in and of itself, autism or no.


By rodrigu3 on 2/12/2009 9:37:57 AM , Rating: 2
Again, I was just correcting the post suggesting that there the connection makes no sense. Whether or not the "doctor" included that in his "paper" is not at issue here. My point is that although it is possible to incur some kind of CNS disease via IBD, it 1) is HIGHLY unlikely 2) would cause much worse symptoms other than autism 3) is DEFINITELY not related to immunizations. I am not defending that douche, I am merely commenting on the logic of the post.


Dr. Michael Savage called it!
By Indianapolis on 2/11/2009 10:29:15 AM , Rating: 2
Anybody here listen to Michael Savage? He's been at the forefront of debunking the myths and legends surrounding autism scares that are being shoved down our throats by the mainstream media and the medical community, including the MMR connection, and he has taken a lot of heat for it. I'm going to be sure to listen to his show tonight.




RE: Dr. Michael Savage called it!
By scavio on 2/11/2009 3:53:02 PM , Rating: 2
Savage took a lot of heat because he said 99% of the kids diagnosed with autism were the victims of bad parenting and nothing else. If he took flack for saying the MMR wasn't the cause, I doubt it was from anything more than a small group of people who are passionate about it. I guess it's easy to judge when you don't actually have to raise an autistic child. He doesn't get credit for anything but trying to get in the news from me.

I have to admit that I was second guessing the choice to have my daughter (born last year) vaccinated because our six year old is autistic. I think the whole theory I flawed, but I asked myself if I was being a good parent by taking a chance and having her "jabbed" (in spite of what I like to think, I'm not always right).


By Indianapolis on 2/11/2009 4:17:18 PM , Rating: 2
Anybody who listened to the entire show understood that he was using 99% to mean "most" or "very many", not literally 99 out of 100. Anybody who pointed the finger and said "He said 99 percent!" was being infantile.

I would say that 99 percent of the time that somebody uses the phrase "99 percent of the time", they don't literally mean 99%. :-) But the problem was, his enemies used that one line, leaving out everything else of value he said, to attack him.


...but there is a point
By OoklaTheMok on 2/11/2009 6:34:04 PM , Rating: 2
While I think that falsifying test data in order to scare a group of people is reprehensible, I do personally have issue with the MMR vaccine. My main issue is that many vaccines use mercury as part of a preservative, to give it a longer shelf life. Last time I checked, mercury is one of those things you really don't want in your body, especially an infants body.

So while I think what he did was wrong, he did help bring out the fact that there are ingredients in many of these vaccines that do not belong in the human body.




RE: ...but there is a point
By Nihility on 2/11/2009 7:51:19 PM , Rating: 3
You know how when you put a lot of carbon atoms together you get a diamond, But when you just take 2 of those carbon atoms and add oxygen you get a colorless gas?
Saying Mercury is used in vaccines is like saying human beings exhale diamonds.
You clueless,anti-science,weirdo lunatic. And it's not even used anymore, it was banned because of people like you.


Time Lords giving out vaccines now?
By HaB1971 on 2/11/2009 12:18:47 PM , Rating: 2
That was my initial thought upon reading the title.

I was disappointed to not see Tom Baker's grinning face in the picture for the article.

I guess seeing the words Doctor and Who so close together caused me to go into a BBC centric spin. Though of course, not having almost every word start with a capital letter helps in the title.

Back on to the topic. What a jerk, inject him many times over with the vaccine using dirty needles. Let him get a taste of his own medicine.




By Aquila76 on 2/11/2009 12:38:52 PM , Rating: 2
ROFL. Me too. I wondered what he had to do with vaccines, unless it was for the Ood.


If it is true...
By Oralen on 2/11/2009 10:18:55 AM , Rating: 2
Someone should treat the good doctor... With an axe blow to the head.

After all, do you know that even an unsharpened axe can cure 100% of the diseases know to man?

Of course, my old biology teacher used to say: "Medicine is the art of killing the disease... Without killing the patient."

But that guy is obviously all for advanced research in the domain, so let's forget about the old traditions...




Do they have
By corduroygt on 2/11/2009 12:02:08 PM , Rating: 2
Federal PMITA prisons in UK?
They should open one for this guy if they don't.




By stubeck on 2/12/2009 7:09:03 AM , Rating: 2
Jab is the term used in the UK for getting a shot, of any vaccine. You get a flu jab for example.




irresponsible ass
By frozentundra123456 on 2/12/2009 8:08:58 AM , Rating: 2
This is terrible. I dont know how such a responsible journal could publish an article with such a small sample.

Concerning the mercury in vaccines, even though the amount was (is??) relatively small, mercury does accumulate in tissues, and I would be concerned about receiving a lot of shots, such as for allergy desentisization or something like that.

However, like everything in life, one must consider the risks versus benefits of immunizations, and I am sure the benefits greatly outweigh the risks.




Who cares?
By FaceMaster on 2/13/2009 9:08:41 AM , Rating: 2
I'm not going to risk my child(ren, I have lots since I'm a real player) getting Dyslexia from these vaccines. As long as everybody else's families vaccinate their children, mine should be safe, any way. Survival of the cleverest, people! Screw the suckers who would rather put their children at risk.




Who's lying now?
By toxicmess on 2/12/2009 1:05:24 PM , Rating: 1
Thimerosol was used as a preservative in multi-dose vials and is still present in many flu vaccines. It is a seperate issue from the MMR "jab". Pregnant women are discouraged from eating tuna but encouraged to get flu shots. Thimerosol is mercury - a know neurotoxin and one of the most toxic substances on the planet. Ingesting mercury and injecting it into your bloodstream are both bad ideas but one is obviously much worse.

The immune system of autistics is compromised to begin with. Add environmental insult whether from vaccines or another source and you've got the recipe for disaster.

The studies that show no causal link between autism and vaccines are flawed. That is why we need well-designed INDEPENDENT scientific studies to discover the truth. Why doesn't the IACC want those studies done?

Money corrupts and vaccines are big money. Follow the money and tell me who is being truthful. I am not anti-vaccine. I am pro-safe-vaccine.

If you believe everything you read, read this:
http://www.spectator.co.uk/melaniephillips/3346281...

and this:
http://childhealthsafety.wordpress.com/2009/02/11/...




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