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New iPhone dock connector  (Source: techcrunch.com)
The new iPhone will now have a 19-pin port instead of the 30-pin port

It looks like the new iPhone's dock connector has received a makeover from past versions, cutting the number of pins from 30 to 19.

New photos and videos indicate that the new iPhone will now have a 19-pin port instead of the 30-pin port that Apple devices have traditionally offered since the third generation iPod.

According to Tech Crunch, the new 19-pin port looks similar to Apple's Thunderbolt port seen on MacBooks, but manufacturers have told the web publication that the new iPhone's pin-out will be different from Thunderbolt's.

Lots of new iPhone rumors have been circulating lately, such as videos showing the unibody casing and leaked photos presenting the longer screen and metal backplates. These leaks confirmed a few new iPhone specs, such as the relocated headphone jack and metal antenna molded into the backplates.

However, some other specs remain unclear, such as the size of the SIM card. A video showing new iPhone specs revealed a smaller SIM card holder piece, but no measurements have been released.

Source: Tech Crunch



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Micro-usb
By chmilz on 6/21/2012 11:27:21 AM , Rating: 2
Apple hates the environment and still burdens us with proprietary cables for the $$$. But their tree-hugger hipster fanboys aren't bright enough to see through that ruse.




RE: Micro-usb
By Digimonkey on 6/21/2012 11:35:30 AM , Rating: 2
Using Micro usb wouldn't really work as the current connectors on iphones offer video out. I believe there is a standard for phone cables however that offers both data and video, but maybe apple has future plans that don't fit into those specs.


RE: Micro-usb
By Solandri on 6/21/2012 4:20:01 PM , Rating: 2
The EU has mandated that all phones be chargeable via a micro-USB port. This was to eliminate the huge number of incompatible chargers which people were paying for and throwing away with each new phone. Apple still hasn't complied with this requirement - instead they'll sell you an adapter which plugs into the iPhone port that lets you charge it with micro-USB.

What's really going on here is that Apple doesn't want to do the obvious thing and split the connector into two ports - a micro-USB for charging and digital communications (and compliance with EU law), and a second port for high-speed video and analog. I dunno if their designers don't want to mar the beauty of a single symmetric connector, or they think their users are too stupid to figure out two different ports. But there really is no technical reason why the iPhone lacks micro-USB.


RE: Micro-usb
By DJ Brandon on 6/22/2012 2:01:20 AM , Rating: 2
1. HD Video Stream
2. No need for two ports on a phone.


RE: Micro-usb
By Kiffberet on 6/25/2012 9:16:07 AM , Rating: 2
"Apple doesn't want to do the obvious thing and split the connector into two ports..."

Beacuse obvioulsy having 2 separate ports/wires is a stupid idea when 1 can recharge and transfer data.


RE: Micro-usb
By theapparition on 6/25/2012 1:33:23 PM , Rating: 2
Yeah it's called MHL.

Physically and electrically compatible with MicroUSB, and also offers HDMI out. Many phones already are shipping with it and it works fine.

But Apple has to be different.


RE: Micro-usb
By michael2k on 6/25/2012 4:48:31 PM , Rating: 2
How many times does this need to be brought up?

MHL doesn't support component/composite (analog) video nor line-in/out (analog) audio.


RE: Micro-usb
By theapparition on 6/26/2012 10:38:21 AM , Rating: 2
Yeah, yeah. We all know, it's time to cut the cord with the old tech.

If they can put electronics in the new cables to verify approved devices, they can also put in a digital-analog decode circuit as well.

You think you know something but you don't. Your comment about reducing the number of grounds in one of your posts clearly indicates that.


RE: Micro-usb
By michael2k on 6/26/2012 12:47:31 PM , Rating: 2
Why? What's the point of adding D2A in the adapter when you can just use the existing hardware in the phone and give it a couple pins?


RE: Micro-usb
By theapparition on 6/26/2012 3:23:30 PM , Rating: 2
Why? Did you really just ask why?

Well gee, then it would be compatible with every other phone charger. And accessories could be standardized that work across a variety of phones.

That would be great for the consumer, but lousy for Apple. We see which side you're on.


RE: Micro-usb
By michael2k on 6/26/2012 6:19:48 PM , Rating: 2
With the dock-mUSB cable they are already compatible with every other phone charger.

If you want accessories standardized across all phones, you need every phone manufacturer to pick a standard other than USB so as to gain host support, video and audio support for cheap component and composite, and HDMI support.

Note, I know that On-The-Go was added as a supplement to USB2 and USB3, but audio support, video support, and HDMI are still not "standard" and require custom HW such as MHL to implement.

Better to convince everyone else to do something like a new microDisplayPort or microHDMI connector to gain audio, video, analog, digital, charging, ethernet, and host support.


RE: Micro-usb
By michael2k on 6/21/2012 11:45:06 AM , Rating: 3
USB doesn't work because the Dock connector has to support analog signals; composite, VGA, component, audio-line out, and audio-line in, which USB cannot currently support, as well as the ability to supply 1.1A power, which requires either a nonstandard USB port (which Apple provides on their Macs) or a Y-shaped USB header.

So even if they did adopt USB, it would still be a proprietary cable with two heads for analog audio-video and power+data on one side and two heads for two USB ports on the other side.


RE: Micro-usb
By nafhan on 6/21/2012 12:36:52 PM , Rating: 3
Why does the dock connector need to support analog signals? By going to 19 pins instead of 30 they've already lost electrical compatibility with anything that uses the old connector. It seems like this would be a good time to make a a clean break with the analog stuff and go all digital. In fact, it seems like a micro USB3 connector would solve most of the issues you mentioned, and the rest of them could be solved by a dongle. Analog + 30 pin support could be added via a dongle that integrates a USB sound card, for instance.

Regardless of your rationalizing, I'm fairly certain that technical concerns are not a primary reason why Apple will avoid industry standards in this area.


RE: Micro-usb
By michael2k on 6/21/2012 2:05:11 PM , Rating: 2
Duh, seriously?

How do you expect the iPhone to connect to VGA, RCA, component, speaker, or mic without it?

Do you expect people to buy new TVs, projectors, speakers, etc?

People would much rather buy a $29 dongle to maintain compatibility than buy new equipment in the thousands of dollars.

The micro USB3 connector solves none of those issues because it has no analog hardware and would require a dongle that is more expensive than a simple passthrough to convert digital to analog; instead of a $29 dongle it will be a $99 dollar dongle to convert digital to analog.

So even if you discount technical concerns, there are several significant technical concerns Apple has to deal with including the price of the dongles.


RE: Micro-usb
By The Raven on 6/21/2012 2:32:25 PM , Rating: 2
Why can't they just use a composite connector like the headphones on a DS or walkman etc. Obviously that tech is not that complicated.
quote:
The Nintendo DS Headset is the official headset for the Nintendo DS. It plugs into the headset port (which is a combination of a standard 3.5mm(1/8-inch) headphone connector and a proprietary microphone connector) on the bottom of the system.

This is the problem I always had with the cable ports of the past...I just want to do one of the simple functions of the interface (charge, headphones, connect to USB port on PC, etc.) but I don't have a proprrietary connector to do it!!!


RE: Micro-usb
By The Raven on 6/21/2012 2:37:14 PM , Rating: 2
Pics for reference. And yes you can use any old 3.5mm headphones if you don't need the mic on your headset. Which is my point.

http://imgs.inkfrog.com/pix/kabicy/V8220BL-3.jpg
http://techgage.com/reviews/gaming/nintendo/ds_lit...


RE: Micro-usb
By michael2k on 6/21/2012 5:18:26 PM , Rating: 2
They already do that:
http://www.amazon.com/Monster-iSoniTalk-Microphone...

The problem is that you can't ALSO overload that with composite video, VGA, and component video (component alone requires 3 separate channels on top of the audio components)


RE: Micro-usb
By The Raven on 6/25/2012 5:54:47 PM , Rating: 2
No no you missed my point. They can have micro usb, hdmi and whatever else they want all combined into one cable. Standard connections, unique grouping.


RE: Micro-usb
By michael2k on 6/25/2012 7:12:23 PM , Rating: 2
You're saying do something like the dock connector, but extending from a common port like micro-USB.

Then you have the problem that using one precludes the use of the other unless you have a dock adapter cable... at which point why not just use the dock cable in the first place?


RE: Micro-usb
By The Raven on 6/26/2012 2:56:01 AM , Rating: 2
No as I said (with the NDS as example) I can use any 3.5mm headphones I want. I only need the special headset if I want to use the microphone. Did you look at the picture? Your idea is not at all what I am talking about.

There are Android devices that use micro hdmi and micro usb. I don't have one (such as pictured. This is a more relevant picture lol)...
http://st2.gsmarena.com/vv/pics/htc/htc-evo-sprint...
...so I don't know if they make docks that utilize both ports, but they very well could. And it is commonplace for one to just want to simply connect their phone to show off a couple vids on their friend's tv without need for a usb connection (or a dock) or to simply charge via usb in the car where you don't need hdmi.

On the other hand I of course see where one would like to have everything connected. But my point is that you don't need a proprietary connection to do that.


RE: Micro-usb
By nafhan on 6/21/2012 3:47:47 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
The micro USB3 connector solves none of those issues because it has no analog hardware and would require a dongle that is more expensive than a simple passthrough to convert digital to analog; instead of a $29 dongle it will be a $99 dollar dongle to convert digital to analog.
In addition to being rude, you seem to be incapable of proper reading comprehension (although, both are more funny than insulting). I specifically said something about this. However, since you're bringing up prices, USB -> 3.5mm headphone converters can be had for $5 on Amazon, and real USB sound cards can be found starting a little above the $20 range (although, the nice ones with volume control and stuff are like $50). Basically, adding analog audio to micro USB3 to 30 pin adapter wouldn't cost much.

Considering that Apple DOES sell simple pass through adapters for about $30, and they have incentive to encourage everyone to move away from the old 30 pin, $99 is a reasonable guess. However, my guess is $50-$60 as that's around the price of the active Thunderbolt adapters.
quote:
So even if you discount technical concerns, there are several significant technical concerns Apple has to deal with including the price of the dongles.
I think I know what you're trying to say here... and I'll go ahead and say you've just given a great example of why you're wrong: you feel like $30 is a reasonable price for a 19 pin pass through cable. Apple would be able to sell an active adapter at a price where they could make money, and very few users of their products would complain.

Again, they're not going to use USB3 anyway, it'll be similar, yet proprietary. The extra pins (19 instead of 11?) may even be to carry analog audio. I was merely listing a possible alternative that WOULD work, without being prohibitively expensive, while providing a full digital path and backwards compatibility.


RE: Micro-usb
By michael2k on 6/21/2012 5:24:17 PM , Rating: 2
How am I being rude?

Anyway, Dell does sell a $55 USB to VGA adapter:
http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.a...
(USB to VGA)

Couple that with a $90 VGA to composite/component adapter:
http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.a...
(High Resolution VGA to Composite / S-Video Converter)

Miniaturize it into an inline cable, cut the price in half, throw in Apple's margin, and you've got your $99 cable.

It's not like I'm making this up.


RE: Micro-usb
By nafhan on 6/21/2012 7:22:17 PM , Rating: 2
Since you'd only need to do a single level of conversion... it'd probably be something pretty similar to that USB to VGA adapter - probably a single chip, even. I also think Apple could price it however they want, and that price would have more to do with how much they want people to move away from the 30 pin vs. how much they want to avoid pissing people with lots of 30 pin peripherals off, than anything else.

Also, sorry if mistook your (sarcastic?) "duh" as rudeness, when it wasn't. Text: not the best way to concisely portray emotion :)


RE: Micro-usb
By michael2k on 6/21/2012 7:50:45 PM , Rating: 2
Ah, yes, I can see that VGA carries the same data as component video. It is composite (and specifical PAL/NTSC/SECAM) that requires a little bit of extra work.

So on top of the USB, you now need approximately a $50 dongle-cable to convert it, which is no different than the dock->composite or dock->component or dock->VGA you already have today.

The difference is that, if Apple uses USB, everyone would need to buy new cables, instead of a $30 dock adapter to make the new dock compatible with the old dock.


RE: Micro-usb
By nafhan on 6/21/2012 11:17:54 PM , Rating: 2
You're still not getting it. If Apple went with micro USB3, the cable/adapter would contain an ASIC that would output the same exact signals as the current 30 pin connector... with a 30 pin connector. You'd have USB3 on one end and 30 pin on the other. That's it.
quote:
The difference is that, if Apple uses USB, everyone would need to buy new cables, instead of a $30 dock adapter to make the new dock compatible with the old dock.
I'm not seeing where you're going with that. Everyone who upgrades to a new iDevice will need to buy new cables or a dock adapter (they'll probably get one cable for free). In my hypothetical situation those cables and connectors would be industry standard instead of proprietary. That's the only thing that would be different.


RE: Micro-usb
By michael2k on 6/21/2012 11:29:14 PM , Rating: 2
Oh, I see, instead of a $10 provided dock to USB cable, which all iPhones already ship with, you want a USB port and a straight USB cable, forcing people to buy a $60 USB to Dock adapter as opposed to a $30 Dock to Dock pass through.


RE: Micro-usb
By nafhan on 6/22/2012 8:55:38 AM , Rating: 2
I think you're missing something: you generally can't turn 19 pins into 30 with a pass through. There will already be some sort of active adapter.


RE: Micro-usb
By michael2k on 6/22/2012 3:17:51 PM , Rating: 2
You can if you're dropping unused pins.

http://pinouts.ru/PortableDevices/ipod_pinout.shtm...

You can see several redundant unnecessary pins:
19, 20, 22, 24, 26, 28, 29, & 30 are for FireWire, which means 30 down to 22.

14 & 17 are reserved, but if unused can be dropped to bring you down to 20.

1, 2, 15, and 16 are all GND and probably can be reduced by one (and if 14 & 17 are used, maybe even three) to bring you down to 19 pins. 7 is unknown, and may also be expendable.

You might also be able to "EOL" old iPod lines such as 12 & 13.

So, actually, yes, you can turn 19 pins into 30 in this case.

Apple has stopped supporting Firewire since the 3G:
http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1476


RE: Micro-usb
By aliasfox on 6/22/2012 4:04:14 PM , Rating: 2
I wonder why Firewire's 8-pin when the plug was only 6 pin (4 for data, 2 for power).

But yes. Completely getting rid of the original Firewire pins would get Apple most of the way to 19 pins.


RE: Micro-usb
By michael2k on 6/22/2012 5:24:23 PM , Rating: 2
4 pins for power and ground, 4 pins for data.

Firewire, being a much more robust connector, probably only had 2 pins for power and ground.


RE: Micro-usb
By nafhan on 6/23/2012 12:25:04 AM , Rating: 2
Very nice research! And, exactly why I included the word "generally" :) Although, technically, you've described a 19 pin to 19 pin connector since you are obsoleting 11 of the 30 pins. If your sources are correct (not going to take the time to research myself), I believe there's a pretty good chance what you are describing may be exactly how the new 19 pin connector will work - and you'll be charged $30 to get an adapter for it (if you need one).

Still, doesn't change my mind, I feel fairly certain that if they had incentive to do so, they could sell a Micro USB3 to 30 pin connector for whatever price they wanted.


RE: Micro-usb
By NellyFromMA on 6/22/2012 8:40:43 AM , Rating: 2
They don't want to see through it, they actually like buying things that are 'exclusive'.


Finally a reason to break out of the trap
By TacticalTrading on 6/21/2012 11:36:21 AM , Rating: 2
I'm not an iPhone user, but I know many. A common reason for sticking with the iPhone is all the equipment they have accumulated that works with it (read: that fancy connector on the bottom.)

So if this new port is not backwards compatible, all their equipment has been rendered ... Worthless!

Throw that on top of the number of them that complain about iTunes, and suddenly that upgrade decision becomes... well, complicated...




RE: Finally a reason to break out of the trap
By Digimonkey on 6/21/2012 11:41:00 AM , Rating: 3
Knowing Apple there will probably be a $30-$50 adapter you can buy to make your old peripherals compatible.


By WalksTheWalk on 6/21/2012 2:51:55 PM , Rating: 2
This is exactly why I stay away from proprietary connectors when at all possible. I'll stick with Bluetooth, MHL adapter or DLNA over WiFi thank you.

Why do i need a phone dock on a stereo that has a remote that controls the phone through the dock? I can just use Bluetooth, keep the phone on me and use it as the remote.


RE: Finally a reason to break out of the trap
By troysavary on 6/21/2012 11:50:05 AM , Rating: 2
Apple probably thinks this will mean they can sell another bunch of accessories, and while it is true the Tony Swash types will go for more Apple sodomy, I think it will have an opposite effect on the less die-hard iUsers.


By FaaR on 6/21/2012 4:56:42 PM , Rating: 3
I own an iPhone, and all I ever use that dock for is charging. Same thing with the vast majority of all the other iPhone users. It's not as if anyone who buys an iPhone is some kind of brainless zombie with a siphon in their wallet that Apple can tap at will you know. Couldn't care less about that dock connector or however many pins it has; I'm not buying anything for it anywy. Why should I?

Not that you haters would understand anyway.


By kmmatney on 6/21/2012 11:50:27 AM , Rating: 2
I'll probably still stick with Apple devices. I do have a lot of cables and accessories, but I also have a lot of Apps. My kids often get iTunes cards for their birthday, which we have pooled into a single account, so we can share Apps across several devices. I would consider breaking out of the Apple mold if Jailbreaking stopped, as I have many invested Cydia Apps (MyWi, RetinaPad, Emulators with Wiimote control, custom lock screens, etc...).


RE: Finally a reason to break out of the trap
By Tony Swash on 6/21/12, Rating: 0
RE: Finally a reason to break out of the trap
By themaster08 on 6/21/2012 12:41:57 PM , Rating: 2
Tony, you don't need to endorse Apple at every opportunity that arises. The last paragraph alone would have done just fine.


RE: Finally a reason to break out of the trap
By Tony Swash on 6/21/2012 1:36:36 PM , Rating: 1
I like to bring real world evidence to bear whenever possible otherwise people just spin off into weird parallel universe type discourses and drift ever further from reality into a wish fulfilment dream world.

I too like to day dream but I try to remember that they are day dreams and not reality.


By The Raven on 6/21/2012 2:19:22 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
...and drift ever further from reality into a wish fulfilment dream world. I too like to day dream but I try to remember that they are day dreams and not reality.


quote:
If Apple do indeed change the connector port design then I suspect they will address the issue of backwards compatibility with older peripherals.

I also think that they will eventually allow me to do what ever the hell I want to with the things I paid for with my own money...oh wait that is a daydream. Sorry I thought we were all saying things based on reality there for a second.


RE: Finally a reason to break out of the trap
By The Raven on 6/21/2012 1:46:48 PM , Rating: 2
I haven't done that much research into this but from what I can tell that survey should be taken with a grain of salt (or I guess I should say, 'the survey was taken with a grain of salt.'
4 things to consider (and I am sure I am not some genius so there are probably more to consider)
1) Brand loyalty, which you have pointed out yourself on occasion and others have pointed out (as a cult of sheep) would heavily skew this satisfaction survey.
2) If someone is looking for an iPhone-like device and buy a Sammy..."Hey this isn't as much like an iPhone as I thought!" Or "This LG sucks since I can't bring all of my iApps over onto it and it doesn't work well with iTunes."
3) The survey is a simple 1-10 level of satisfaction survey which doesn't explain WHY they are satisfied. There are a lot of people in N. Korea who are very satisfied with their gov't as well. Without a clear explanation as to why, the info is useless. You can't adjust based on the factors of 1 and 2 with a simple 1-10.
4) Manufacturer offerings. The survey was not limited to smartphones from what I read. Also, LG, et al offer more than 1-2 phones like Apple does. So while Sanyo might make a phone that is rated at satisfaction score of 100, they might have another that gets a 50. The aggregate score for them would be 75 if they theoretically only made 2 models.

I'm not saying that Apple isn't on top in customer satisfaction here, but these scores are bupkis in my estimation.


RE: Finally a reason to break out of the trap
By matty123 on 6/21/2012 2:14:44 PM , Rating: 2
Not to mention that this survey only covers the United States which {to my knowledge at least} has a much larger amount of iphone users than the global average suggests...

Also their are other studies where other brands are rated substantially higher than apple...

quote:
BOSTON, Jun 06, 2012 (BUSINESS WIRE) -- Samsung is the most preferred consumer technology brand, ahead of Sony, HP and Apple , according to ConsumerMetrix Technology Brand Preference Index just released by Strategy Analytics. In a survey of more than six thousand consumers in the US and Europe, "Technology Brand Preferences," Samsung received the highest overall preference rating of +41 percent, followed by Sony at +29 percent, HP at +20 percent and Apple at +19 percent. The lowest brand preference ratings were given to Lenovo (-37 percent), RIM (Blackberry) (-28 percent) and Sanyo (-26 percent). Respondents were asked to consider how likely they would be to choose each of more than twenty global brands when buying technology products such as computers, mobile phones and TVs.


Link: http://www.marketwatch.com/story/strategy-analytic...


By The Raven on 6/21/2012 2:22:21 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
The lowest brand preference ratings were given to Lenovo
Really?? Now I find this study dubious as well lol. Well I guess this adds to my point in two ways lol...

...Lies, damned lies, and statistics.


Cha Ching
By karndog on 6/22/2012 5:43:11 AM , Rating: 1
So now all current iphone accessories become incompatible, obsolete and soon to be landfill.
Gee Apple must be in some real financial trouble to resort to making a dick move like that just to make some extra cash at the expense of their loyal customers...Oh wait..




RE: Cha Ching
By Belard on 6/22/2012 9:20:58 AM , Rating: 2
Not really... buy an adapter (not the first time) and be done with it... or phase out. Its not that critical.

People can also sell their OLD stuff on ebay and buy new stuff.

The new connector has thunderbolt.


old
By Nortel on 6/21/2012 11:34:58 AM , Rating: 2
Wasn't this 'news' out over a week ago?




By Belard on 6/22/2012 9:38:00 AM , Rating: 2
The Apple connector used today and the upcoming one in the near future was designed for easy of use and functionality. They DO more than the 4 pin USB connector! Some out-dated functions are removed, some are added for the newer smaller port.

Now, here is the kicker... remember ease of use? If anyone ever tried to DOCK a micro-USB connector... it SUCKS. Even the connector for my android requires angle-aim-insertion to get it in. A USB dock for external HD... same thing, if you are not aligned perfectly, pull out- shift a bit and try again. Same with my Logitech Pro MX Mouse, its far more difficult to plug it in that the apple design.

It easily takes 2-5x the effort to plug in/dock a Micro-USB connector. The bigger connector is also less likely to be damaged.

Considering that Apple owns the tablet and a big chunk of the cell phone markets, this is a none issue. It *IS* great that all other phones use the standard USB connector. I know that I've gone through 4 different SONY connectors over the course of 10 years... Samsung 2-4 (ex-GF).. ooops, doesn't fit. etc etc.

Another example: Old-style game consoles before they went wireless. They have big-rounded connectors to handle the abuse. They work a lot better than the standard DB9 / DB15 connectors of old style joysticks (Atari / Amiga / PC).

I'm sure Apple is happy to move to a smaller (but not too small) a connector to work for the next 5~10 years. They didn't DO IT "just because". They know its a bit of a headache with the 3rd party products.

But WE ALL go through this all the time. How many AMD and intel sockets are in the market? Anyone notice that SDR, DDR, DDR2, DDR3 memory do NOT fit each other? Socket 940 doesn't fit with socket 939 or socket AM2 (940 pins) or FM1... and now FM2 has rendered FM1 & AM3+ into dead platforms.

Personally, I would love to see a better USB port standard that what we have now... but already, there are at least 7 different USB plug types... ugh!




Firewire
By aliasfox on 6/22/2012 12:29:07 PM , Rating: 2
I'm going to bet that the new dock connector is electrically compatible with the old one, and that only a few seldom/non-used pins were removed. Six pins were originally set aside for Firewire (back when iPods supported both), and those have probably gone unused for the past five years. That leaves another 5 pins that were removed. It's possible that some rare accessories may have used these pins, but most things should work with a dumb adapter.

... it's not going to stop Apple from charging you $19 for it though.




"And boy have we patented it!" -- Steve Jobs, Macworld 2007














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