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The Psystar machine actually got delivered and came actually slightly better than described, with a snazzier memory card.  (Source: Engadget)

The Psystar computer runs OS X 10.5.2 and performs admirably, albeit very noisily.  (Source: Engadget)
Psystar hopes to prove its haters and doubters wrong by shipping units for preview

Earlier this month, DailyTech reported on a brewing legal battle between Apple Inc. and a small Mac-clone startup, Psystar.  Later it was reported the whole site appeared to be a major sham and that the address it was registered to was a home address.

However, it appears to some extent that Psystar is on level as it shipped Engadget its newly renamed Psystar Open Computer. The system will allegedly soon ship to customers for $399.  After some hurried benchmarking, one thing appears clear -- Psystar is producing serious machines that can indeed run OS X, despite having some flaws.

The Psystar shipped to Engadget featured a Gigabyte motherboard with an Intel G31 Express chipset.  It features rather strong graphical power, using the NVIDIA GeForce 8600GT.  The card is reported on the site to be 256 MB, but the shipped card actually featured 512 MB of memory -- and unexpected bonus.  The computer features a decent 2.2 GHz Core 2 Duo processor, similar to previous generation/low-end iMacs.

The box runs on OS X Leopard 10.5.2, build 9C31.  Currently Apple is on build, so this is slightly behind the curve.

Now for the bad and the ugly -- first, the machine has a very noisy fan setup.  The noise, likely exacerbated by a cheap case, is so loud that it is reportedly hard to make phone calls when the computer is in use.  Also, while Leopard is included with box, reinstalls do not appear to work, as it would not recognize the disk at boot.  Also the DHCP lease drops every 15 minutes, requiring a manual renew.

A couple more issues that aren't quite as severe include the fact that there is no iPhoto or iLife, as these don't come with Leopard, but are purchased separately.  Also, memory and audio don't properly show up in the Apple System Profiler.  This is not a horrible problem, as the memory and sound work fine,  but it might become a roadblock to upgrades.

The initial benchmarks show a rather solid performer.  In CPU tests, it only comes up short to the pricier Penryn-sporting MacBook Pros and 3.06 GHz Core 2 Duo iMac.  In memory, its roughly meets or beats all Mac's desktop and notebook offerings, besides the high end 3.06 GHz Core 2 Duo iMac.  Graphically it noticeably beats almost every Mac offering, notebook or otherwise, only being barely edged out by the 3.06 GHz Core 2 Duo iMac.  Finally, hard drive performance is, unsurprisingly (due to rpm speeds) ahead of the notebooks from Apple, though it trails just slightly (and likely unnoticeably) behind Apple's desktop offerings.

Overall, if you can deal with the noise, the system seems to be a relatively good deal for those wanting a Mac.  Given that you can use boot camp to dual boot, likely (was not tested), this could be a good all around system with a Windows install for gaming. 

This said, the apparent small scale nature of the operation and looming threat of legal action from Apple offers a sort of Catch 22 for prospective buyers -- should they jump on it, despite fears that the setup might not be completely legitimate or production ready, before Apple can shut them down, or should they wait and make sure the company can actually deliver to customers, risking possibly missing the opportunity due to potential legal action from Apple.

A tough question indeed, but at least for now it appears like Psystar may be on level, and may actually be delivering a decent product and a lower price than Apple.



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For real?
By JustTom on 5/1/2008 11:29:26 AM , Rating: 2
So basically we have evidence they slapped together one machine. This is hardly evidence that this is a real on going operation; I hope it is because opening up the Mac market would in my mind be a great thing. But I will believe it when customers start getting the product.




RE: For real?
By lightfoot on 5/1/2008 11:49:02 AM , Rating: 5
What really matters is that they proved that they can produce the product - that is a HUGE first step. Duplicating what they have already done should be a fairly simple and straight forward process.


RE: For real?
By Reclaimer77 on 5/1/2008 11:56:21 AM , Rating: 5
quote:
But I will believe it when customers start getting the product.


Your assuming there is a market for this. Companies have done this before and failed because nobody wants a cheaper half broken Mac.

The Mac isn't a computer, its a social club. Spending more money for less is part of the requirements.


RE: For real?
By jimbojimbo on 5/1/2008 12:48:12 PM , Rating: 3
Not to mention most Apple owners don't care if their running OSX. They care that it's got a big apple symbol on it.


RE: For real?
By headbox on 5/1/2008 12:57:09 PM , Rating: 1
Based on what evidence?

OS X is the PRIMARY reason people want to use a Mac.

I can understand being an Apple fanboi because it's trendy, but I'll never understand the motivation behind being a Microsoft fanboi.


RE: For real?
By 16nm on 5/1/2008 3:05:12 PM , Rating: 2
I don't want to argue with anyone regarding OSX vs MS. I just want to point out that all the free press Psystar is getting must really be helping the bottom line of this new company. What a boon! I wish them the best.


RE: For real?
By Reclaimer77 on 5/2/2008 1:02:14 AM , Rating: 1
quote:
I can understand being an Apple fanboi because it's trendy, but I'll never understand the motivation behind being a Microsoft fanboi.


So its better to be trendy then sensible ?

I didn't know I was a fanboi. I'm using Windows because its always been able to run any and all software I could possibly want. Its guaranteed to be 100% compatible with any piece of hardware I have or will have. And, of course, its great for gaming.

quote:
OS X is the PRIMARY reason people want to use a Mac.


The intricacies of an OS are likely far beyond the average Mac user's knowledge. I hate making sweeping statements like that, but I have a feeling those people would buy anything as long as its got an Apple logo slapped on the side.


RE: For real?
By Locutus465 on 5/1/2008 1:42:56 PM , Rating: 2
You're wrong here... Most Mac people I know love Mac because OSX is so easy to use as is the prepackaged software they get with their computers. This is one point I can't argue with, due to Apple's closed box solution it is in fact easier to use. There's just a whole lot more choice for Windows, not to mention a host of other "PC" advantages including at least nearly every (includeing Windows now with Vista) PC OS ACTUALLY being more secure than OSX.

That said, if I ever find my self with the disposable income I'll probably end up buying a Mac to toy around with and such. There's no denying that apple does have a nice thing going with that OS... And I'm sure it would work better wtih my iPod than the crapware that itunes windows is :P


RE: For real?
By Smartless on 5/1/2008 3:14:11 PM , Rating: 3
I agree. Forgive the overall generalizing but its a simple tradeoff. Apple's sell because they're highly innovative, user friendly, trendy Monarchy. You trade-off user-friendly with less freedom. PC's are much more flexible in terms of price, software, hardware, security, but you run the risk that it won't work the first time you set it up.

I know I've said the same thing before. Maybe I'm over-compensating for my in-laws who are so smug about their macs. lol.


RE: For real?
By Reclaimer77 on 5/2/2008 12:57:37 AM , Rating: 3
quote:
Apple's sell because they're highly innovative


I don't know about that. They run Windows now and use Intel CPU's. They just started using two button mice last year. And most software people credit them with came from companies which Apple simply bought. Innovative ? I don't know.


RE: For real?
By afkrotch on 5/2/2008 12:15:16 PM , Rating: 2
I'd say majority of their "innovation" came from someone else. Not to mention, they're usually late on it too.

Timemachine, been done. Windows 3.1 had built-in backup utilities.

Spaces, been done. Unix, Linux, and apps for Windows.

Widgets, been done. Actually by some randomly dude. So Apple took that idea, refined it, then released it.

Stacks, WTF is that aside from having a start menu? A little late on that one. Unix and Linux has that crap.

The only real innovation coming from Apple is their innovative means of getting ppl to actually spend more money on less and make them happy to do so.


RE: For real?
By nitrous9200 on 5/1/2008 5:25:17 PM , Rating: 2
I still don't get what's "easier" about the Mac OS. After having used them for about 4 months for a video production class, all I have to say is that it's just different and filled with eye candy, but no less difficult than Windows. I wasn't even able to save a Word document onto my flash drive or move it from the hard drive. There were no error messages, it looked like it moved, but it never showed up. And no, I'm not an idiot, I can figure these things out. (I ended up emailing the file so I could move the file onto the flash drive from a Windows machine.) Not to mention they have crashed on random occasions for no reason at all. People continue to boast about how easy their Mac is, and I just tell them that they're spouting BS.


RE: For real?
By VashHT on 5/1/2008 5:38:41 PM , Rating: 3
Totally agree with you there, Macs are not easier to use, just different, its just popular rhetoric to spout it as being more intuitive and easier to use, maybe because its an often used marketing line. Anyway in the end they're both different, whichever OS you're used to is the one that will be easier to use, and neither have a big learning curve as far as I'm concerned.


RE: For real?
By pxavierperez on 5/1/2008 6:49:20 PM , Rating: 3
I've been using XP for a long while and had just been recently given a chance to install OS X. I admit in some ways it is easier to use. It also handles multithreading better than XP. Although I like it mainly because it is so much easier to develop and program applications, especially server and client side applications with OS X. Everything you need comes right out of the box.

Still the bottom line is whatever get the job done. If you work faster in XP then XP it is. Both ways are the same. That's how I view any OS. If it helps me get the job done then I am all for it. That's why i never get into useless emotional debates about which OS is better than this or that. I see it as a tool, not someone i go to bed with.

As how one could fail to copy files onto a flash drive that is completely beyond me. I never had that problem with such a simple task in OS X.


RE: For real?
By Ksyder on 5/1/2008 9:54:46 PM , Rating: 3
Well, I can relate with the person who had trouble copying files to a flash drive. I had a similar problem recently when a customer asked me to create MS Word shortcuts on the desktop of an old G3 tower they had. After spending 15 minutes or so trying to find the executable (or whatever Mac uses) it took me another 15 minutes of searching the help files to find out you had to hold down the ctrl + apple key (or whatever it was) while dragging the file in order to make a copy instead of moving if you just dragged it by itself. If you just moved it the program would not work. I don't really have any problem with Macs but that is just lame.


RE: For real?
By pxavierperez on 5/2/2008 12:53:58 AM , Rating: 1
er, it's the same with XP. you move the icon of an app to another directory it won't make a copy of it. Unless you move it to another directory in another drive which then again works exactly the same in OS X. Then there's the right click pull down menu to copy a file which works similarly in both XP and OS X.

i'm beginning to wonder whether knowledge of basic usage of computers in general or the lack of is the problem here rather than the specific OS functionality.


RE: For real?
By FITCamaro on 5/2/2008 7:40:22 AM , Rating: 3
Except its hard to right click on a Mac when you don't have a second mouse button. Macs are too good and expensive for these simple, commoner features.


RE: For real?
By audiomaniaca on 5/2/2008 7:53:23 AM , Rating: 3
Easier to use?? Haha, tell me more about it.

I've been using computers for almost three decades (macs, pcs, silicons, apple IIs, C64s and the list goes like that), and i've never found anything easier and faster to use than Windows. Of course, if for you "easy to use" means connecting the ipod cable to the usb port, I agree.

Let's face reality without distortion and delirium:

Windows is faster
Windows is better
Windows is cheaper
Windows is easier to use
Windows is less cool looking
Windows is not fashionable or trendy
Windows is 1000x more useful, in any way.
MS does not innovate, as apple doesn't. Both just copy and re-invent things other companies invented before.

I've got the iphone. Interface is amazing (cool), but my old nokia could be used 10x faster in an easier way.

I'm not a MS fanboy, I'm just a computer expert who cannot be affected by marketing and trendisms. Sorry.


RE: For real?
By Runiteshark on 5/2/2008 11:59:57 AM , Rating: 2
quote:

Windows is faster
Windows is better
Windows is cheaper
Windows is easier to use
Windows is less cool looking
Windows is not fashionable or trendy
Windows is 1000x more useful, in any way.
MS does not innovate, as apple doesn't. Both just copy and re-invent things other companies invented before.


I'm not sure about the first one. Being a hacksawed up version of BSD it does have certain advantages in threading and performance over the NT kernel, however, with all the crap that they've throw into the kernel (for Mac) I'm not so sure on who's better now (2.6 or any BSD kernel humiliates both in threading performance)

As for it being better, thats more of an opinion (which I agree with) but, to each their own.

As for it being cheaper, well thats a damn "duh". Are you kidding? Supporting those stupid macs is nothing like supporting a Unix deployment or windows. You have so much crap to work around and deal with, and it isn't nearly as flexible as Nix (If something needs to be done, it can ALWAYS be done), and has no issues integrating with Windows security models. Macs on the other hand if you've had the pleasure of experiencing it are a nightmare to implement into a Windows environment.

I use the Royal Noir theme (with the black) and its actually pretty decent. On my home setup I use WindowBlinds with the StealthOS theme. I'd say it looks quite a bit better then anything Apple has come out with, and at one point I was running Gnome + Compiz on top of windows with cygwin. It was totally awesome but I had some issues with it replacing explorer with it so I eventually switched back but yeah.


RE: For real?
By Locutus465 on 5/1/2008 1:39:11 PM , Rating: 2
I seem to remember other companies trying, being fairly successful at it and then getting shut down by apple in the courts. I'm not a mac person, but the music dept at my college was all mac and I remember the dissapointment there when the cloan program ended.


RE: For real?
By cmdrdredd on 5/1/2008 7:20:06 PM , Rating: 2
Right, Powercomputing was outselling Apple on new systems and actually released systems using newer and faster components before Apple could market them. Apple was bleeding money, Steve Jobs took over and shut them all down.

Apple is a joke IMO, I was looking for a laptop and I checked all the major OEMs, managed to find a 2Ghz Core2Duo system with 2GB memory, Vista x64, DVDRW, GeForce 8400 256MB, Intel pro wireless card, 15.4" screen, and 120GB HDD. The total cost was about $900 with free shipping. The closest equivelant Mac was $1999 before I added any options. Ridiculous. That doesn't even have a graphics card that I can game with on the go either...


RE: For real?
By aliasfox on 5/1/2008 7:28:08 PM , Rating: 2
as i mentioned in the other thread, the macbook pro is what you get for $2k, and it outguns the machine you listed there quite handily - but for twice the price, it oughta...


RE: For real?
By FITCamaro on 5/2/2008 7:45:15 AM , Rating: 2
For $1500 you can get a performance laptop that outguns the $2000 Macbook Pro quite handily. It just doesn't have an Apply logo on it and doesn't come in a stylish aluminum case.

And why should I have to pay $2800 to get a laptop with a 17" screen when you can get them with a Windows laptop starting around $1000.


RE: For real?
By BiffRapper on 5/2/2008 12:25:18 PM , Rating: 2
If Apple ever wanted a chance to become popular, their biggest mistake was, and still is - refusing to allow people to clone their machines.


EULA
By headbox on 5/1/2008 11:26:52 AM , Rating: 1
The EULA is the only thing preventing OS X on your PC. It's not really enforceable by law, so it will be interesting to see what Apple can do about this.

However, this computer has some major flaws. Psystar could have built a much more compatible system for the same price. I know I did :)

Also, they install OS X for you using a disc that is hacked- not the retail disc. If your machine runs into trouble, you can't reinstall OS X yourself.

I'm waiting for the MSI "Efinity" board which was due out last month. It's supposed to use EFI instead of BIOS, which would eliminate the need for EFI emulation on a Hackintosh.




RE: EULA
By JustTom on 5/1/2008 11:31:03 AM , Rating: 2
Were you able to install OSX without hacking the disc?


RE: EULA
By headbox on 5/1/2008 11:59:37 AM , Rating: 2
No, it's not possible. EFI has to be emulated.


RE: EULA
By mmntech on 5/1/2008 11:41:58 AM , Rating: 2
The EULA is a legally binding contract so I would think it would be enforceable in civil court.

I tried the Hackintosh thing once on my Athlon64 X2 3800+ rig with an ASRock 939Dual mobo. I remember having some problems with it such as no sound and LAN issues. SATA also apparently doesn't work with that board.

I definitely would not buy one of these Psystar OS X systems because there's simply too much that's questionable about them. I think if you want a cheap Mac that badly, there are plenty of used/refurbished systems out there. I would like to see OS X legally run on PC hardware someday though but I don't see it happening. Psystar does legally offer this system with Ubuntu, Vista, or XP if you like the system itself.


RE: EULA
By lightfoot on 5/1/2008 11:59:19 AM , Rating: 5
quote:
The EULA is a legally binding contract...

The only way to know if the EULA is legally binding is if it has been tested in a court. There are many clauses that are placed in EULA's that are NOT legal. Virtually every contract has a severability clause to ensure that parts of the contract that are found to be unenforceable do not void the entire contract. EULA's are typically coercive contracts (you can't read the contract until you've bought and opened the product, but can't return the product if it has been opened) that are not modifiable by both parties - this alone brings the legality of the entire contract into question.


Sorry.. Still skeptical...
By SpaceRanger on 5/1/2008 11:28:25 AM , Rating: 3
Just because they shipped one computer to Engadget, doesn't make me feel more comfortable about Psystar.

Caution is probably still warranted when dealing with Psystar.




RE: Sorry.. Still skeptical...
By Cobra Commander on 5/1/2008 11:39:57 AM , Rating: 2
But of course! Not holding a leased IP for >15 minutes?! If people don't 'get' the implications of that, in relation to ANY application that relies on your home network, that's basically having to restart your car every mile you're driving it... What a crock. Cool to see a clone but a crock.


RE: Sorry.. Still skeptical...
By Leomania on 5/1/2008 12:29:48 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Cool to see a clone but a crock.
Let's stop calling this thing a clone, shall we? It is clearly an OSx86 Hackintosh. If it were a clone, you could boot the OSx DVD and install the OS on it with no workarounds, and System Profiler would work with each and every piece of hardware in the machine. Not to mention the crazy loud fans should be controllable. Hell, that's a BIOS setting in many motherboards, for cryin' out loud!

As has been stated by others, you could do MUCH better building your own Hackintosh after a bit of reasearch on the 'net. If the reviewed system is the best that Psystar can do, then they should simply cease and desist; it is clearly not a "best in class" OSx86 system, let alone even baseline acceptable.


RE: Sorry.. Still skeptical...
By AlphaVirus on 5/1/2008 4:41:43 PM , Rating: 4
Stop being so defensive, the Prystar is $399 so compared to Apple its a very affordable alternative.
Of course the company is questionable, nobody has heard of them, they are small compared to the Dell and HP most are used to.

Small steps before running, running before driving, driving before flying, and flying before being the man on the moon.
It takes steps to reach the perfection we want.


DHCP Lease
By Screwballl on 5/1/2008 11:57:51 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
the DHCP lease drops every 15 minutes, requiring a manual renew.


ok so go in and change the network settings to allow the lease forever or 2 weeks or whatever... this story was obviously done by someone not very Mac savvy (of course neither am I but at least I know this much)




RE: DHCP Lease
By bldckstark on 5/1/2008 12:45:09 PM , Rating: 2
I am currently testing the Mac waters with a VMWare desktop running OSX 10.4.? on my Vista machine. It is slow, but everything works. I even installed iLife 08, and Office 2008 on it yesterday.

I have found the difference in the systems baffling to some degree, and am still acclimating to the Mac environment. The only reason I am even bothering with it is for iLife.

A cheap version of a reasonably powerful Mac like this Psystar offering (if it actually worked) would likely part me from my money. I hope they keep things rolling and fix the problems. If so, I will buy one.


RE: DHCP Lease
By jimbojimbo on 5/1/2008 12:52:46 PM , Rating: 2
The DHCP lease is given out by the DHCP server so you can't just change the duration of the lease.

This is definitely something intolerable in any machine though. Sure, I use static for everything at home and it might work fine for this since it's a desktop and most likely staying put. However, it's strange that they would sell a product that does this. Perhaps a buggy box?


Mine just arrived
By oldman1 on 5/1/2008 12:11:18 PM , Rating: 2
Mine just arrived!

It was packaged well really did cost $399 plus the cost of the PS. The case and power supply are made by asus, the drive is a deskstar 7200RPM. You also know the MOBO is gigabyte, which may well be the best in the world.

Yes, this is real! I am going to ghost the drive prior to starting it JUST to have a way to get back to ground zero if I need to,

More to follow!




RE: Mine just arrived
By headbox on 5/1/2008 12:59:35 PM , Rating: 2
If you ghost it, you have to do all sectors, not just the partition. There is a hidden EFI emulation partition.


RE: Mine just arrived
By oldman1 on 5/1/2008 1:03:39 PM , Rating: 2
Yes, I ordered the EXACT model HDD that came with the unit. I will run disk to disk and then use the clone disk while keeping the original in a safe place. I plan to use fusion to create a VM package of XP for our business. If I can, the unit has paid for itself!


people still don't get it...
By 4blueskies on 5/3/2008 9:54:53 PM , Rating: 2
If you can afford a Jaguar, you aren't going to buy a Ford.Ever. Even if you can't afford the Jaguar (insert high-end auto here) you still want it. WHY? Because every single detail is thought of before you set foot in it. This will always be the case for Macs, whereas PC's are just a slap-dash half-arsed afterthought...Logo does not matter. (Uh, size does though:)




RE: people still don't get it...
By audiomaniaca on 5/4/2008 2:18:52 AM , Rating: 2
Not Exactly. Some people might not want a Jaguar (MBP), but instead, they want a Lambo (Sony Vaio), which has all its details thought of before you set your foot in it.

You're assuming that all PCs are Fords. No! PC is not one single brand or model, PC is a rich, wide and the large family of cars.

You can do anything with them. Make any upgrade, make any change you want. You can have a popuplar PC as you can have a high-end one, like a Lambo.

With Macs, you can only have the "Jag". No customizations, no anything. If you don't like the dash stereo, that's it. If the engine goes down, you cannot open the hood.
If the tire goes down, you need to buy a new "Jag" .


By audiomaniaca on 5/4/2008 2:26:32 AM , Rating: 2
Just to make the analogy better, with the "Jag" you said, you can only go back and forth home/office, using the main highway. With the PC (Lambo or not) you can go off-road, jump into the water, drive up the hill, race on the sand, fly a little bit, make some rally with mud and so on.

With the "Jag", it's only the highway, cos it doesn't do anything else. To make it go at least off-road, you need to add extra $1000 on top of the $2000. To make it run on the sand, add even more $1000 (Total: $4000), and goes like that...

In the end, the price of a popular "Jag" becomes 2x more than the price of a much better high-end "Hummer".

I still don't want a Jag. Not even with the apple logo on it.


I own that case...
By thetinyclam on 5/1/2008 4:37:55 PM , Rating: 2
Man...I recently bought that case on newegg--ASUS TM-210. Thought it would look good with the Samsung 226BW, since it has the glossy faceplate, but now everyone's gonna think I have a fake Mac lol.




RE: I own that case...
By lightfoot on 5/1/2008 5:45:31 PM , Rating: 3
quote:
now everyone's gonna think I have a fake Mac

Better than them thinking you have a real Mac. :)


Dealbreaker
By Reclaimer77 on 5/1/2008 11:48:14 AM , Rating: 4
quote:
Also the DHCP lease drops every 15 minutes, requiring a manual renew.


As far as I'm concerned this is a dealbreaker. Even if I was considering one of these, and I wouldn't, this would kill it for me.

End of discussion. This is an unbearable issue. To even THINK about releasing a retail PC/Mac with this known issue is completely assinine.




Does it run OS X natively?
By Darthvoy on 5/1/2008 1:16:49 PM , Rating: 2
Does anyone know if these run OS X natively, or they hacked to run on them.




By pxavierperez on 5/1/2008 6:19:05 PM , Rating: 2
I'm not sure what you meant "natively." OS X has been running "natively" on intel processor for a while.

As for "hacked," of course it is. OS X employs EFI which if not "hacked" will only allow it to run on Apple branded machine.

On other note. From what I gathered reading Endgadget review, it looked like they slapped this machine just for show.

I have OS X installed on my IBM Thinkpad T43p, it wasn't easy but i got everything to work more than these folks did with their PC. Sound, bluetooth, WiFi, PCMCIA card, all the rest fully functional with OSX. Only Quartz Extreme that didn't work. Now with the current variants of OSX86 installs it's becoming almost as easy as a one click affair.

In the long run, it's still a much safer and cheaper bet to build your own Hackintosh than buying from these guys.


Maybe I'll get a mac?
By Locutus465 on 5/1/2008 11:46:07 AM , Rating: 2
I've beem mac curious (hehe) ever since OSX came out. Perhaps a machine like this might eventually push me over the edge so I can see what the fuss is all about... Peronally I would still love to be able to just run the OS in a Virtual PC type environment. Anyone know of any good way to get OSX going on a VPC type setup? that would be the bomb for me.




Finally
By ysunwoo on 5/1/2008 9:41:34 PM , Rating: 2
Apple got greedy, ($2700 expandable computer, $300 mp3 player , $600 cell Phone ) and ignored the peoples' plead for a expandable and affordable system has made conditions for an alternate product path. Apple was supposed to be for the creative, risky, and for that nerdy kid in the apple commercials. What happened to those days? Jobs has gone neck tie corporate. Yes, our machines are upgradable, you just buy a whole new one.G5 has no CPU upgrades! Thank You Psystar! Apple! Don't even think about spoiling this party, you had your chance! Dude!




"If they're going to pirate somebody, we want it to be us rather than somebody else." -- Microsoft Business Group President Jeff Raikes




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