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Xbox 360 ban message detailing the user's violation of Microsoft terms of service. (Source: Xbox-Scene)
The Xbox 360 modders strike back against Xbox Live

In the latest game of cat and mouse, Xbox 360 firmware modders have developed a new drive software version that “defeats all current and some future Xbox Live detection attempts.”

This new release comes less than two weeks since Microsoft started banning Xbox 360 consoles that play copied discs on Xbox Live. “As part of our commitment to our members, we do not allow people that we have detected to have modified their console to connect to Live. This is an important part of our efforts to try and maintain a fair gaming environment for the large majority of gamers that play by the rules,” a Microsoft employee wrote on the banning measures.

Microsoft added the ability in its latest spring dashboard software to detect the running of copied game software. To counteract this new anti-piracy measure, modders released updated disc drive firmware prior to the Xbox update introducing various features, such as disc jitter, in an effort to further the exploit. Such efforts were ineffectual, as consoles running the updated firmware were still being banned.

The latest new firmware released earlier this week appears to have finally masked the playing of “backups” from Xbox Live detection. As noted in by Xbox-Scene, the new firmware boots only purposefully created “Stealth Xtreme” backups.

What the new firmware will not do is re-enable Xbox 360s already banned from Xbox Live to hop back online. For consoles already caught running copied software, it’s game over.

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GET OFF OF LIVE!
By chdude3 on 6/1/07, Rating: 0
RE: GET OFF OF LIVE!
By killerroach on 6/1/2007 9:18:10 AM , Rating: 3
Personally, I'm detecting some sour grapes there... have the people doing the backups been beating you one too many times?

All glibness aside, Microsoft is in their right to do what they want with it; it's in the terms of service, has an established precedent with Xbox banning, and, by nature of it being a closed setup, they can do whatever they want to with it. Those things should be taken into consideration even before buying a 360 (or any system) in the first place, if you ask me. I do back up legitimately-purchased titles (mainly due to my own checkered track record on taking care of discs) as a safety measure, although this is on PC only (I don't own a console, and don't really have much of an interest in any of them).

Now, if there were only some way for Microsoft to allow a legitimate backup system (perhaps through a MS-designed utility that ties backups to a particular console, for example), I would then have absolutely zero sympathy for the firmware hackers. Until then, I just see it as a way for Microsoft to keep a bit more control over its closed platform, which is both an annoyance and standard operating procedure for MS.


RE: GET OFF OF LIVE!
By encryptkeeper on 6/1/2007 10:38:41 AM , Rating: 2
Until then, I just see it as a way for Microsoft to keep a bit more control over its closed platform, which is both an annoyance and standard operating procedure for MS.

Truer words were never spoken. People are going to copy games. It's going to happen. Microsoft is trying to say that people who play copied games have an advantage over people who don't, like their weapons cause more damage or they're harder to hit. Get real, just say, "We don't want people to steal our software". But again, standard MS operating procedure is to bullshit. So I have no sympathy for them when people pirate the software. If you don't want someone to do something for a particular reason, TELL them., and then maybe they'll think "wow. That's a good point. I shouldn't do that because it's stealing". Otherwise, it just comes off as "because I said so". Unless it's a little kid of course.


RE: GET OFF OF LIVE!
By jadedeath on 6/1/2007 1:05:49 PM , Rating: 2
Good point there, and the way I look at it, if you want to make copies {for yourself} then make some copies, just use the original disks when you're on Xbox Live and they'll never know.

Unless they're working on a way to read the disk itself to find out if it's been copied from *LOL*

Logan


RE: GET OFF OF LIVE!
By Tmansport on 6/1/2007 1:17:22 PM , Rating: 2
If people are so worried about their discs being scratched, then pay the measily $3 or so for the Best Buy protection plan. If the disc becomes unreadable, you just take it in and they'll give you a replacement. I've done this with several games. What's funny is that people will bitch about having to pay $3, yet they take the time to mod their firmware, rip the contents of the game, and then burn the game to a DVD+R DL that probably costs $2.

I think Microsoft is doing this as a preventitive measure just as much as to prevent piracy. If a method to replicate or bypass the game signature is found in the future, then we end up with modified games being played and you have the Halo 2 situation all over again.


RE: GET OFF OF LIVE!
By jadedeath on 6/1/2007 1:23:10 PM , Rating: 2
I personally don't get the "make copies to prevent scratching" thing myself. I mean if every system had something like the Gamecube laser which could read ANYTHING, I've seen disks skipped surface down on pavement and read without a hitch. Then they wouldn't have to worry.

Or, if they had a system that didn't have a chance of scratching the disk just by putting it into the reader *LOL*

Logan


RE: GET OFF OF LIVE!
By codeThug on 6/1/2007 4:39:14 PM , Rating: 2
You obviously don't have kids. It's why I spend at least 30 minutes per purchased game looking for and installing no-cd hacks.


RE: GET OFF OF LIVE!
By jadedeath on 6/1/2007 6:18:27 PM , Rating: 2
You obviously didn't shell out the extra 3 bucks for the protection plan at Best Buy.

Like I said, if you want to make copies make copies, just use the store bought copies on Xbox Live, either that or don't buy game systems until your children have more of an ability not to scratch things. That's a heck of an investment right out of the box just to have something damaged.

For the record though I do have experience with children and technological equipment, and I enforce a very harsh rule of "no touching unless I'm there" with the equipment, disks or whatever.

Logan


RE: GET OFF OF LIVE!
By mars777 on 6/2/2007 11:47:52 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
You obviously didn't shell out the extra 3 bucks


You obviously haven't any kids.
Those are 3 bucks per week.
Maybe for an US citizen this is not much, but for most of the world it is enough to hate DRM.


RE: GET OFF OF LIVE!
By Christopher1 on 6/3/2007 4:52:10 PM , Rating: 2
You shouldn't have to pay extra for something that should be included in the first place. I mean, we are paying an average of 20-100 bucks a game now. Plenty enough that the manufacturers could put into their intruction booklets a warranty for life for all CD's and DVD's, where you can send your CD or DVD back to them for another one.


RE: GET OFF OF LIVE!
By chdude3 on 6/1/2007 1:18:13 PM , Rating: 2
Personally, I'm detecting some sour grapes there... have the people doing the backups been beating you one too many times?

Nope, I've got a group of about 10 friends/coworkers who routinely play on Live. It allows us to avoid the unwashed masses out there - I don't have to hear things like "Suck it, Nigga!" or "Not now mom!".

I just hate people who pirate. They ruin it for the rest of us in so many ways. I don't know why they feel so entitled, that they should have all these games for free.

If you look around, games are not that expensive. Up here in Canada, I got Gears of War LE for $30CAD. Blockbuster Video was running a promotion where you could trade 2 360 games for GoW, so I bought two used ones for $10/ea, paid the extra $5 + tax to upgrade, and I'm laughing.

EB Games routinely have "Trade 3" promos for hot and coming releases, and if you look carefully enough, $30-40 will net you a brand new $70 game. It's not free, but it's certainly reasonable.


RE: GET OFF OF LIVE!
By Christopher1 on 6/3/2007 4:53:58 PM , Rating: 2
Think about how much you have spent on most of those games you are 'trading'? Is it really worth it to trade for another game? Answer to me: Hell no!

It's a scam, those 'trade in X games' 'deals'.


Unban
By kristof007 on 6/1/2007 2:52:51 AM , Rating: 2
It wouldn't make sense for Microsoft but I think somehow people should be given a second chance with their consoles. Like if you unmod it, xbox live should check again if its still modded and if not it should let you back on.

Microsoft's permanent ban punishment of course would seem a lot less severe but yea .. just a thought.




RE: Unban
By codeThug on 6/1/07, Rating: -1
RE: Unban
By BillyBatson on 6/1/2007 6:37:45 AM , Rating: 2
In a way I agree with you but I understand why the ban should stay a perm one if MS decides to go that route. Like back on the old ps2 and xbox days it would only be a matter of time before there was a mod you could turn on then off when you wanted to use the online service, or allow you to swam drives somehow. A perm ban would fix that problem as well.


RE: Unban
By iAtticus on 6/1/2007 7:15:40 PM , Rating: 2
" Like if you unmod it, xbox live should check again if its still modded and if not it should let you back on."

Only for them to re-install new mods not detectable yet by XBL's scanning system? I think the only way to deter this is to have them re-buy another 360, after spending at least another $300 (possibly $400 if a new Hard Drive is needed) they'll sure as hell not do it again. If you just let them get off the hook easy then whats the point?


RE: Unban
By mars777 on 6/2/2007 11:53:27 PM , Rating: 2
It would be bad for them because those afflicted people would buy a PS3 instead. 99%

... this kind of stance against people can live only in a monopolistic market... and the console market has 3 choices.


RE: Unban
By Christopher1 on 6/3/2007 4:55:52 PM , Rating: 2
Very good point. This only works in a monopolistic market, and people now have 3 choices of current-generation consoles in the XBox360, PS3 and Wii.

This isn't going to fly for too long, and the first time someone has their console banned when they DON'T have it modded, is the first time Microsoft sees a lawsuit.


RE: Unban
By Christopher1 on 6/3/2007 4:55:53 PM , Rating: 2
Very good point. This only works in a monopolistic market, and people now have 3 choices of current-generation consoles in the XBox360, PS3 and Wii.

This isn't going to fly for too long, and the first time someone has their console banned when they DON'T have it modded, is the first time Microsoft sees a lawsuit.


Not True
By loser311 on 6/1/07, Rating: 0
RE: Not True
By Griswold on 6/1/2007 4:26:50 AM , Rating: 5
Seems like you fell for this urban myth about bans of "innocent" people. You really shouldnt believe everything you read in random forums...


RE: Not True
By NotAok on 6/1/2007 9:19:54 AM , Rating: 1
One of my best friends was banned from Halo 2 for supposedly cheating. He played that game religiously and was insanely good, i know for a fact he was never cheating or modding anything, yet Bungie refused to lift the ban.

Companies who take an aggressive stance are bound to make mistakes. Bungie has, hell even the RIAA has attacked innocent people. Microsoft doing the same thing is easily believable.


RE: Not True
By iAtticus on 6/1/2007 7:12:18 PM , Rating: 2
Yeah, that happened a lot. It's not Bungie's fault really, it's kids who lose a game legitimately in Match Making leaving cheating feedback on the player (the 9 year olds who make up 70% of the Halo 2 XBL population can't take it when someone is better then them, it's got to be hacks). Then XBL's systems read all this feedback and ban then, Bungie has no control over bannings because of feedback, only those banned because bungie found they were using network hacks and even then they just provide a list of names.


Great Fight
By bplewis24 on 6/1/2007 3:09:20 AM , Rating: 2
This back and forth battle is much better than Mayweather vs. De La Hoya.

Brandon




RE: Great Fight
By Goty on 6/1/2007 7:43:23 AM , Rating: 2
Yeah, but that doesn't really take much.


Modders
By Fusible on 6/1/2007 2:49:38 AM , Rating: 2
They will always find a way. It seems avery MS hacker, has been able to get by every trick in the book. And there's million's of MS hacker's.




"Backups"
By phatboye on 6/1/2007 8:21:37 AM , Rating: 2
Funny that the author would put backups in quotations. A lot of us do make legit backups in case something happens to our originals :P




Dailytech promoting piracy again
By Sharky974 on 6/1/07, Rating: -1
By Aikouka on 6/1/2007 8:03:20 AM , Rating: 3
They posted about the original bans... this is an update to the story. Seems quite logical to post it to me.


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