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  (Source: LeaseTrader.com)
Driver error cited as cause of fatal crashes in 74 of 75 cases

Toyota, once lavished with praise for its reputation for quality and reliability, took more than a few blows to the chin earlier this year due to concerns of sudden acceleration. The company began recalling many of its popular models – including the Camry, Tundra, Corolla, Highlander, and RAV4 – to replace “sticky” gas pedals.

However, after examining data from 75 fatal crashes which were blamed on “sudden acceleration” due to faulty electronics, the National Highway and Transportation Safety Administration (NHTSA) has come to the conclusion that only one incident was not related to driver error. The incident in question is the high profile crash involving a CHP officer driving a 2009 Lexus ES 350. The vehicle accelerated uncontrollably due to improperly installed floor mats which trapped the accelerator pedal. The crash resulted in the death of four people including the officer.

The NHTSA concluded that the other 74 crashes were a result of driver error -- specifically, drivers were mistaking the accelerator pedal for the brake pedal, according to the Wall Street Journal.

"In spite of our investigations, we have not actually been able yet to find a defect" with Toyota's electronic throttle control said NHTSA associate administrator for enforcement, Daniel Smith.

"We're bound and determined that if it exists we're going to find it. But as yet, we haven't found it."

The NHTSA hasn't completely cleared Toyota, however. The agency still notes that improperly designed floor mats and sticky accelerators that were slow to return to the idle were to blame for some crashes. Toyota itself acknowledged these finding back in January. However, phantom electronic gremlins causing Toyota vehicles to suddenly lose their minds appears to have been tossed out of the equation.

The sudden acceleration drama resulted in the U.S. Department of Transportation fining Toyota $16.4 million for deceiving officials about the widespread nature of stick accelerator pedals. There are also over 100 pending lawsuits against Toyota regarding sudden acceleration.



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What I don't get is...
By bravacentauri83 on 7/13/2010 5:14:32 PM , Rating: 4
I had a 2007 Camry. I had the floor mats that were first recalled (yes, the Toyota branded ones). I looked at them and saw there was plenty of gap between the floor and the mat itself. I still wonder how people managed to get the pedal stuck on the mat. Maybe they had a huge lead foot or something...




RE: What I don't get is...
By SunAngel on 7/13/10, Rating: -1
RE: What I don't get is...
By Aikouka on 7/13/2010 5:41:32 PM , Rating: 3
The (DT) article specifically states "improperly installed floor mats", so I'm assuming they mean that the floor mats were not secured properly. If not secured, it isn't difficult to gradually push a floor mat upward toward the pedals.


RE: What I don't get is...
By bravacentauri83 on 7/13/2010 5:47:57 PM , Rating: 2
Sorry, forgot to mention this in my original post.

I found it kind of hard to "improperly install" the floormats. There are two hooks that go on the part of the floormat nearest the driver. The mats don't really move forward (into the pedals) that easy.

I guess we do have morons that don't know how to push down on the clips with some force to make sure they stay so the mats are positioned right.


RE: What I don't get is...
By Brandon Hill (blog) on 7/13/2010 5:52:58 PM , Rating: 4
If I recall correctly, the officer was given a loaner Lexus ES 350 while his vehicle was being serviced. Someone at the Lexus dealership had installed all-weather floor mats from a completely different vehicle into the vehicle so they didn't fit properly. That is what caused the problem.


RE: What I don't get is...
By dragonbif on 7/13/2010 6:25:53 PM , Rating: 3
Not all all-weather floor mats have holes in them for the hooks. Some people even take out the hooks.


RE: What I don't get is...
By Mojo the Monkey on 7/16/2010 2:03:12 PM , Rating: 2
If you're talking about the 911 call incident with the police officer, I still dont believe that floormats did that. With enough time and wherewithal to be making calls and going that long, you're going to have tried pulling the gas pedal up with your the tip of your foot.


RE: What I don't get is...
By moriz on 7/13/2010 5:54:42 PM , Rating: 3
the floormats on my dad's '03 camary do not have hooks; they stay in place via rubber "spikes" on the bottom that digs into the carpet. it is by no means completely stable and does tend to slide forward.

that being said, the ones in my dad's car are not capable of ever trapping the pedels, since they do not have large bumps on them.


RE: What I don't get is...
By kmmatney on 7/19/2010 12:50:03 PM , Rating: 2
My 1999 Camry (original owner, 93K miles) has a hook for the floor mat...


RE: What I don't get is...
By AssBall on 7/13/2010 5:57:26 PM , Rating: 2
In the recall notice I received it specifically addressed the securing hooks. The same morons ignored the notices too, which came before all the media went crazy with the stories.


RE: What I don't get is...
By Flunk on 7/14/2010 9:06:45 AM , Rating: 3
My 2010 Mazda 3 has these hooks as well. I think most car manufacturers are doing this now, they're afraid of being sued by stupid people who don't pay attention to where the mats are. Now it's mostly foolproof.*

*Some people will still remove the hooks, but then again some people die from arsenic poisoning from drinking cleaners.


RE: What I don't get is...
By chmilz on 7/13/2010 5:50:20 PM , Rating: 5
Exactly. I briefly owned an RX7 and put in off-the-shelf floormats. Later I noticed they had a tendency to ride up and mess with the accelerator, once causing the pedal to stick while city driving. Was scary until I threw it into neutral and shut it off. Floormats were disposed of immediately.


RE: What I don't get is...
By priusone on 7/14/10, Rating: -1
RE: What I don't get is...
By gamerk2 on 7/14/2010 7:59:42 AM , Rating: 2
Sure, you'll probably blow the engine (depending on how much acceleration), but it WILL stop the acceleration of the car.


RE: What I don't get is...
By Flunk on 7/14/2010 9:09:24 AM , Rating: 3
Only if you're a complete idiot. You put it into neutral and hit the brake. Steer to the side and pull the key. Do it all fairly quickly and you're totally fine.

Besides almost all cars have rev limiters now, especially new ones.


RE: What I don't get is...
By funkyd99 on 7/14/2010 11:08:56 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
you'll probably blow the engine


...by shifting into neutral with a stuck accelerator? Ever hear of a "rev limiter"?


RE: What I don't get is...
By hpram99 on 7/15/2010 2:16:47 PM , Rating: 2
This is entirely incorrect and ignorant. Almost every car on the road has rev-limiters to prevent the engine from going into potentially damaging territory. The only potential issues is if you let it bounce on the limit until it overheats (which can take quite a while)

Drivers that lost control are because of their own ignorance, here are 3 solutions:
1. Put car in neutral
2. Turn ignition to "Accessory" to stop engine but retain steering.
3. Don't feather the brakes until they overheat. Hit the breaks HEAVILY to quickly stop before they get too hot.

All of this can be done within a split second. These people should have their licenses revoked until they gain a little knowledge about the 4000lb piece of machinery they barrel down the road in at 60mph.


RE: What I don't get is...
By moriz on 7/13/2010 5:48:18 PM , Rating: 3
the thing that i don't get is, how the hell can people ever mix up the two pedals. they are spaced out far enough that you'd have to rotate your feet to press them individually, unless your feet are ginormous.

or, am i the only one who follows the "foot-on-brake-when-not-on-accelerator" rule?


RE: What I don't get is...
By ajdavis on 7/13/2010 6:17:53 PM , Rating: 4
I don't know where this rule comes from but it seems contrary to proper driving. I hope what you mean is that when you're coasting and think you'll need to either accelerate/brake your foot is over the pedal. People who drive by always stepping on a pedal are doing a disservice to their vehicle and their fellow drivers.


RE: What I don't get is...
By Mr772 on 7/13/2010 8:09:05 PM , Rating: 2
I think they mean that you only press petals with one foot. Not one foot on each petal.


RE: What I don't get is...
By moriz on 7/14/2010 10:50:05 AM , Rating: 2
you are correct. i should've said "over" brake pedal instead of "on" brake pedal. i don't press down on the brake while coasting, obviously.


RE: What I don't get is...
By walk2k on 7/13/2010 6:45:01 PM , Rating: 1
It happens more often than you might think. In an emergency, people panic, when they panic they do funny things. Very easy to press the wrong pedal in that situation, even for half a second, and that's all it takes to turn a near-miss into a horrible mashup.


RE: What I don't get is...
By Danish1 on 7/14/10, Rating: -1
RE: What I don't get is...
By Danish1 on 7/14/10, Rating: 0
RE: What I don't get is...
By kmmatney on 7/19/2010 12:54:46 PM , Rating: 1
Well, you'll probably get downrated, but I agree somewhat. It is usueful to learn to drive with a manual transmission, and there are way too many distracted drivers on the roads in the US these days.


RE: What I don't get is...
By Nutzo on 7/13/2010 7:02:05 PM , Rating: 2
The problem is that cars are SO reliable nowdays, that it's very rare for an accident to be caused by a mechanical failer. I had an Explorer years ago during all the rollovers. I even had the same recalled Firestone tires on it.
Twice I got flats in a rear tire, while driving on the freeway, and I had no problem controlling the car & pulling to the side, even with a complete flat.

One of the Explorers that rolled over and resulted in a lawsuit, was over loaded, with stuff piled on the top of the luggage rack It had 4 mismatched tires, that where re-treads, and they where driving 80+ when the tire blowout happend. How was that ford's fault? Truck tires are usually rated to only 85 MPH under normal loads. If you overload your SUV and drive that fast you asking for trouble.


RE: What I don't get is...
By Alexvrb on 7/13/2010 11:44:22 PM , Rating: 3
It was Ford's fault AND Firestone's fault. They both pointed the fingers at each other, and Firestone recieved most of the blame, even though the fault was about 50/50. Ford demanded dirt cheap tires, Firestone obliged - a little too much, shipping a lot of defective tires. They didn't ALL fail, so just because YOURS was fine didn't mean they shouldn't have issued a recall.

Now for Ford's part in the mess - the first gen Explorer handled like dogshat and was too rollover-happy. What was Ford's brilliant solution? Set the tire pressure specs to 26 psi. That's absurdly low for a vehicle like that. On top of that, how many people do you know that check their tire pressure every day?

So if you're at 26 psi to start with, and you're down a few psi, the tires are hot, and you've got crappy possibly defective tires... bad things are bound to happen. If you get a normal flat, no big deal usually. But catastrophic failure (blowout, tire tread separation, etc) especially on the REAR of an already-unstable SUV, at highway speeds? Even a experienced test driver, who knows it is going to happen, might not be able to keep it under control.

By the way, the ones that suffered from tire tread separation? They weren't all retreads - far from it.


RE: What I don't get is...
By Dingmatt on 7/14/2010 3:23:07 AM , Rating: 2
Only 80mph for a truck? That strikes me as being really dangerous. The lowest speed rating for any tyres in the UK is 81mph with the standard being around 140mph.


RE: What I don't get is...
By Spuke on 7/14/2010 10:21:28 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Only 80mph for a truck? That strikes me as being really dangerous.
I don't know where the other poster got that info. Tires are not blanket rated and no vehicles tops speeds exceeds their tires ratings. He should try actually looking at his tires sometime. There is a speed rating on them. Now if he bought new tires and didn't bother to match the speed (or load) ratings with the OEM's, then he's an idiot.


RE: What I don't get is...
By DominionSeraph on 7/15/2010 8:40:11 AM , Rating: 2
My Grand Prix GTP came with V rated tires, and it'll do more than 149. (Granted, not much more, but it still warrants a W.)


RE: What I don't get is...
By TallCoolOne on 7/13/2010 7:07:27 PM , Rating: 4
Only the right foot should be used when driving an automatic. The left foot should be used only for clutch on a manual. That way in a panic stop you're sure to release the gas before applying the brake. Another problem with using the left foot for brake is that you might "ride" the pedal when resting your foot on it. This causes brake wear and keeps the brake light on constantly, taking away the warning to drivers behind you if you suddenly slow down.


RE: What I don't get is...
By Nutzo on 7/13/2010 6:01:07 PM , Rating: 2
The one fatal crash was due to "incorrect" floor mats installed in the car. i.e floor mats that didn't fit because there where from a different car.

All they had to due was shift the car into neutral or turn the car off, but they didn't.

Since the car had a push button starter instead of a key, and the car was a loaner, they likely didn't know that to force shut down the car they needed to hold down the start button for 4 seconds (just like you would force power down a PC). Ignorance can be deadly.

FYI: I own 2 Toyotas, including an 8 year old Camry, and they've been great. However I do think Toyota has slipped in quality the last few years, not due to the accelerator problem, but due to the number of other problems I've seen.


RE: What I don't get is...
By The0ne on 7/13/2010 6:52:09 PM , Rating: 3
You guys are asking too much of these drivers. If they can't tell the difference between the accelerator and brake then they are far gone in their head. If they can't figure out how to clear the carpet jamming their accelerator, you know like pulling it back with you heel, then they are far gone.

Asking anymore of these type of drivers is near impossible. Seriously, you may cause more problems than trying to resolve. You ask them to put the car in neutral and soon enough you'll have all them in reverse or L1/L2. Don't ask me how, but they will get it there. Just leave these type of people alone and stay FAR away!


RE: What I don't get is...
By wolrah on 7/13/2010 8:46:01 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Asking anymore of these type of drivers is near impossible. Seriously, you may cause more problems than trying to resolve. You ask them to put the car in neutral and soon enough you'll have all them in reverse or L1/L2. Don't ask me how, but they will get it there. Just leave these type of people alone and stay FAR away!


The problem is these are the kind of idiots we have to share the road with. Unfortunately this country sees driving as a right rather than a privilege (really, after I took the driving test when I was 16 my first thought was "anyone who failed this should never be allowed to operate a motorized item of any kind again forever" since it was so retardedly easy.

Computers can't yet drive competently on regular roads (no offense meant to the DARPA GC teams and such but I mean driving on I-71 in rush hour, not closed courses with semi-controlled obstacles), but they could sure pass an Ohio driving test. From what I've heard, the rest of the US is not much different.

Our driver's licensing is like an A+ certification or the "Technician" class amateur radio license; if you have a pulse and a remote interest in the topic you can pass without a question.

In my perfect world, we'd still have a basic license class along these lines since our geographical distribution of people and lack of a usable mass transit system in most areas pretty much requires that most adults be able to drive, but that basic class would not be allowed to drive anything larger than a compact sedan to minimize the damage they can cause.

Next step up would allow all cars and unibody trucks/SUVs below 5000 or so lbs as well as trailers up to the length and weight of the vehicle. This would be what most people would likely have and would require that one pass a proper training course along the lines of the "Teen Driving School" program BMW offers which covers panic stops, emergency maneuvers, etc. and lets the driver experience and get used to how their vehicle will react when pushed to its limit.

The third level would open up the vehicle options to almost everything on the road. Anything with six or less wheels and weighing under 12,000 lbs would be fair game, as well as any trailers compatible with a Class IV ball hitch. Hydraulic brakes only though.

I'm not sure whether the last class before CDL should be a class in itself or an endorsement on the third, but this would be where the largest vehicles on the road not requiring a CDL would be stuck. RVs with air brakes or tag axles, gooseneck/5th wheel trailers, etc.

Lest you think I'm just wanting to regulate others, I myself occasionally drive a 38 foot RV weighing in at over 28,000 lbs loaded with a Caterpillar diesel and an air brake system. The thing is huge, air brakes respond much differently than hydraulics, and it'll plow through anything if you're not careful, yet I'm allowed to drive it on the same license I got from a 10 minute written test and 15 minutes of practical examination in a Buick Regal when I was 16.

In my eyes that is wrong and needs to be solved. There are actually a number of RV-specific exemptions to CDL requirements, since any non-RV vehicle weighing this much or equipped with air brakes would have required a CDL to legally operate. You can thank the AARP for that from my understanding, since a lot of the RVers with the money for these big rigs are seniors.


RE: What I don't get is...
By fleabag on 7/14/2010 12:53:02 AM , Rating: 1
To answer your question... This sudden acceleration thing actually happened to me and it was caused by the floormat. Now you ask yourself, how does this happen? There are anchors on the floormats and sometimes people don't anchor the floormat due to carelessness (in my case it was my dad), so the floormat when it's NOT ON AN ANCHOR will eventually slide up right under the accelerator pedal, getting caught between the floor and the accelerator.

Essentially, it's user error and since most users don't know squat about why something is the way it is, things like this happen. The reason why I didn't crash and maybe other people did is because I was calm and had the frame of mind to workout what was going on, and instead of shifting into neutral for fear of damaging the engine, I thought about the problem a little more (mind you I was having a very hard time keeping the car's speed under control) before I finally just ripped out the floormat, completely resolving the issue itself.

This NEVER would have happened had the floormat been properly anchored.


I'm not surprised
By zmatt on 7/13/2010 11:13:16 PM , Rating: 2
The systems behind accelerator pedals don't exactly change that often. The likelyhood of Toyota using some new and unproven design in a car like the Camry or IS is just silly. I find it far more likely that there was user error involved. Toyota is the largest car manufacturer in the world, or at least was before this happened, so there are logically more Toyotas on the road than of other brands. If this is a question of user error and not mechanical failure than unintended acceleration probably occurs at an equal rate among OEMs. With Toyota being bigger it would make sense that this would happen more often. With more customers you will also have more unqualified and stupid customers. if you pair that with a national media that is of late more pro domestic than the attack on Toyota makes more sense.

This isn't to say that Toyota cannot make improvements. Their push to start should shut the engine off when rapidly pushed, as other manufacturers already do. They should never have cut corners on the valve springs, and their consistently dropping quality has been obnoxious. but even with all of that, there is nothing in there that makes Toyota at fault for a moron who can't use the pedals and can't shift into neutral. I find it deplorable and even a little scary that there are people driving that are so checked out of reality that when something goes wrong they can't properly react. I blame it on our driving culture and on our driving education. A friend of mine is Finnish, when he got his driver's license he had to go through a longer and more difficult course that involved safety maneuvers and recovering from a spin on ice. I think we have a lot to learn from how other places approach driving education and responsibility.




RE: I'm not surprised
By chick0n on 7/14/2010 12:15:12 AM , Rating: 1
sadly, that won't happen.

Your local DMV will get lots of law suits from people who're too dumb to get a DL. and a lot of whining little bitches will cry day n night cuz they're too dumb to drive.

I know that in Hong Kong, they even break the DL into Automatic and Manual. Automatic is somewhat easier, but they still required you to go thru snow cones and all other emergency braking test to test your ability to drive. For the Manual, they even will ask you to park your car on a hill ! one little bump on the curb you get a big fat FAIL.


RE: I'm not surprised
By zmatt on 7/14/2010 7:30:57 AM , Rating: 2
That's pretty sad that in Hong Kong they have a better car education and certification program than in the US.


RE: I'm not surprised
By chick0n on 7/14/2010 8:56:54 AM , Rating: 1
Im not saying there is no crappy driver in Hong Kong,but with a harder test, the chances of letting a "blind,retarded fuxk" to slip thru will be significantly lower.

Hell, when I first got my DL years ago, at the road test site, I was like WOW, this shit is so easy even retards can do it,but that fucker failed my first test cuz he said i didn't check the mirrors and stuff before I start, not because I did anything wronng when driving. I was like what the fuxk? I looked and check every f-ing thing, I guess its not just the drivers thats blind, those instructors are fuxking blind too.


Nothing new
By knutjb on 7/14/2010 3:33:04 AM , Rating: 2
The same kind of thing happened to Audi http://www.newsweek.com/2010/02/09/getting-toyota-... All driver errors. The cars brakes and gas pedal could be held to the floor and the car would not move, drivers wanted to blame someone else for having driven over their kids by pushing the wrong pedal.

As for Toyota's quality rep, I was never that impressed. I know people who have a false sense that the cars are without fault. They didn't go in to get little things fixed but would rip other peoples cars with the same problems. Toyota really isn't any better than other makers and I think most people can see that now. For me, Toyota is analogous to Apple, a good product at a premium price. Though I remember a 2000GT in red going through Goleta Ca, that was the last time a Toyota impressed me.




RE: Nothing new
By superflex on 7/14/2010 12:06:54 PM , Rating: 2
If Toyota could only get rid of the awful LCD displays for the radios, instrument panels, etc. they might not look so damn cheap. Polarizing sunglasses make their displsy impossible to read.
I'll put the reliability of my 2004 Audi A4 up against any Toyota. Not one problem in 6 years of ownership. I chipped the ECU at 35k with an APR Stage 1+ boosting the horsepower from 170 to 235. I replaced the tires at 40K and voluntarily replace the timing belt at 75k. Everything else has been covered by Audi.
My stealership would sometimes put me in a Toyota loaner while the A4 was being serviced. The Prius and Corolla loaners were embarassing to drive and even the Avalon was not up to snuff.


RE: Nothing new
By kmmatney on 7/19/2010 1:15:28 PM , Rating: 2
I have a 1999 Camry, while my co-worker has a 1998 Audi A4. We bought them about 6 months apart, and they are both still running great, although my co-worker has spent quite a bit more money on routine maintenance over the years. In fact, I didn't spend a dime on anything (except for tires, battery, etc..) until 2009, when I finally had the timing belt and EGR valve replaced. So the cost of ownership has been much lower for the Camry.

On the other hand, the Audi has held up great - the paint job still looks perfect (my Camry has some rust spots) and everything still works great on the car. My Camry has a few issues - mostly electrical problems (power seat doesn't go back and forth, and clock and cig. lighter no longer work). I'm willing to put up with the issues - I paid it off in 2001, so like not having a car payment.

So I can vouch for the Audi's reliability, but it does cost more money to keep things running smoothly, compared to the Camry. Of course, the Audi is much more fun to drive.


Figures...Big Media backed Govt Witch Hunt....
By AEvangel on 7/13/2010 5:14:41 PM , Rating: 1
It just amazed me that how all this started soon after the Govt sponsored buy out GM and Chrysler.




By sleepeeg3 on 7/14/2010 2:16:01 AM , Rating: 3
Agreed, but unfortunately for Toyota the damage is already done. We'll see how publicized this is by the MSM...


By superflex on 7/14/2010 11:54:11 AM , Rating: 1
Obongo and his SEIU cabinet thugs extorted millions from Toyota over this media induced fiasco.
BP was next on the extortion block for 20 billion.
I'm sure all this money will be spent wisely on non DNC items. /sarcasm/


Hit the brakes
By jkostans on 7/14/2010 6:48:53 AM , Rating: 2
http://www.caranddriver.com/features/09q4/how_to_d...

The brakes will stop the car even with the throttle wide open. Shutting the car off, or shifting to neutral works too.




RE: Hit the brakes
By gamerk2 on 7/14/2010 8:03:11 AM , Rating: 2
Yeah, first thing I learned was that even when in a moving car, you can shift into neutral to stop accelerating. Its amizing people have no clue how to stop a car in those cases.

Then again, I see people trying to merge into 55MPH traffic [or at least LISTED 55MPH traffic] while moving at 35MPH...


RE: Hit the brakes
By YashBudini on 7/15/10, Rating: 0
RE: Hit the brakes
By chunkymonster on 7/15/2010 12:52:22 PM , Rating: 1
Totally agree! Heck, with a center console automatic, I sometimes have to be careful not to accidentally knock the shifter into neutral.

When the report came out of California with a Prius driver claiming that the did put the car into neutral in an attempt to stop it from accelerating, and it didn't work, I knew the guy was full of shit. And, lo and behold, the guy was called to task and finally admitted that he lied.

Sadly, Toyota paid the US government to leave them alone far too soon. Shame they couldn't have waited for these reports to be released before condemning themselves. Hindsight is 20/20, I suppose.

Proud owner of a 2002 Camry V6 XLE with 130,000 miles that still drives and rides as smooth as the day I bought it.


driver error?
By omnicronx on 7/14/2010 10:51:57 AM , Rating: 2
I opened the article thinking it was going to be about some kind of software error.. I need to get out more..




RE: driver error?
By PrinceGaz on 7/14/2010 2:52:06 PM , Rating: 2
Same here. The first thing I thought off when I read the headline was that a fault had been discovered in the accelerator pedal driver code. I'm glad I'm not alone.


Seems odd.
By dwalton on 7/13/2010 7:11:22 PM , Rating: 3
Seems odd that statistic wise NHTSA blamed it on Toyota drivers'error basically 98.7% of the time when examining fatal cases while only blaming Toyota's floor mats and sticky acelerator for some (what the hell is some?)crashes.

How can floor mats and sticky accelerators affect Toyota autos enough to make sudden accelerator events statistically more likely than any other brand yet only are attributed to a little over 1% of fatal incidents investigated by NHTSA involving Toyotas.

Personally, I don't how the NHTSA can reliably determine anything about this event though no fault on them. I mean 2262 events have been reported since 1999 and over that time Toyota sold like what, 10-12 million cars into the US?

Even with rough math thats like 0.00023% of cars sold by Toyota producing a sudden acceleration event. But there is no telling how many times those drivers pressed the accelerator during the life of those vehicles before the events occured. You're talking millions of cars, driven millions of miles with millions of accelerator presses over a decade. How do you reproduce that in a lab in a few months?

Does anyone knows why this issue never affected Toyota's hybrid lineup including hybrid Camrys and Highlanders (they were never recalled)? Did they come with different sets of floor mats or accelerators?




Public Apology to Toyota?
By bernardl on 7/13/2010 11:14:33 PM , Rating: 3
Based on these evidences, I would think that the Congress owes an apology to Toyota for forcing them to apologize in the first place?

Cheers,
Bernard




yeah but
By sprockkets on 7/13/2010 10:57:09 PM , Rating: 2
Soooooo, why did Toyota blame then recall a faulty part on a brake sensor if no one actually died from said faulty part?

Was it really faulty? Oh, and the floor mat recall too was fun to watch.




Turnabout?
By Ben on 7/14/2010 2:31:11 AM , Rating: 2
So does Toyota now get to sue all these idiots for the bad PR they've spread?

Not saying they should, but it would seem fair.




Big Suprise, wasnt it obvious
By cknobman on 7/14/2010 9:35:51 AM , Rating: 2
that this entire "acceleration" problem for Toyota was just a move by congress to bolster american auto sales for their much troubled GM "Government Motors" division?




The Real Question Is...
By tng on 7/14/2010 10:28:44 AM , Rating: 2
How come Toyota has had this problem and say GM has not? After all unsecured floormats could be a problem in any vehicle.

It may suprise you to know that GM has had 10 times more incidents of "unintended acceleration" than Toyota has in the past 10 years, but you don't see congress grilling them over the fire.

If you listen to the radio, you hear supposed new owners of GM cars tell why they switched from Toyota. In one such ad, they mentioned "safety" no less than 6 times in a 30 second commercial. Other similar comercials by GM where people switched from Honda only mentioned features.

I smell a rat......




It's OK...
By Archibald Gates on 7/14/2010 5:52:56 PM , Rating: 2
... the only thing that a Toyota with a stuck accelerator pedal needs,

are... GO FAST STRIPES!




Bogus
By Gungel on 7/15/2010 1:13:13 PM , Rating: 2
Looks like Toyota planted that story and there is no official finding yet.
http://www.autoblog.com/2010/07/15/report-wsj-unin...

This is really bad news for Toyota.




Stop blaming Toyota
By chick0n on 7/13/2010 11:29:01 PM , Rating: 1
Im with NHTSA, Most of these "cases" were caused by morons who don't deserves their License's drivers in the first place.

The following story has nothing to do with Toyota, just my own personal experience of "how stupid a driver can be"

One day, at my local Mobil Station, I was filling up my own car then I noticed this woman kept trying to open the gas cap. I was like what the fuck? a broken cap really? then about 10 seconds later she came to me for help, and she first said :

"hey, can you give me a hand? my car is out of gas and I can't put gas in cuz the cap is broken, it won't turn, what should I do?"

I went there, PUSH IT IN THEN TURN, whoa! it popped open ! then she was like ohhh how did u do that, I told her just push it in and turn, common sense? then she just said oh I didn't know that u have to push it, she just got her license couple days ago (mind u she is around 16-17, hmm, pretty hot actually)

I was happy that I helped someone (blah), but seriously. WHAT THE FUXK ? How f-ing dumb people can be?

Back to Toyota ...

Now NHTSA said most of the cases has nothing to do with Toyota. but sadly we will never see anything about it on media like Fox news and the patriotic idiots will just keep saying Toyota sucks and crap.

Oh and b4 someone trying to talk crap. I've never owned a Toyota.




No surprise here
By BailoutBenny on 7/14/2010 7:41:24 AM , Rating: 1
Toyota (Government Motor's largest competitor) gets blasted for a statistically insignificant "problem" (unlike the statistically significant problems many U.S. cars have) that cannot be reproduced by anyone at a time when the government is bailing out the U.S. car industry. Then, after U.S. automakers get a boost from all the bad pr to their competitor, the government issues a retraction with little mainstream coverage. The unions, the corporations, and the government won this round. The only losers are the U.S. taxpayers, as usual. I will never buy domestic as long as I live.




Does this mean....
By EasyC on 7/14/2010 7:44:48 AM , Rating: 1
I can finally stop hearing uneducated domestic fanboys talking out their ass about Toyotas now?

Well, atleast Government Motors had a few months to make more sales...




Nice try
By AstroGuardian on 7/13/10, Rating: -1
RE: Nice try
By Smartless on 7/13/2010 5:25:43 PM , Rating: 5
Umm I think the better question is whether or not that fine was deserved. Yes floor mats are bad, but I think some other recalls were much worse, like Nissan Armadas locking steering at high speeds. Will our government go, well you still hid information in which case, what were they hiding if they honestly didn't think there was a problem? Cause we all know we're not going to give them back the money. So what happens now? This thing reeks of scape goats and conspiracy theories.


RE: Nice try
By Stoanhart on 7/13/2010 5:27:30 PM , Rating: 5
Huh? Toyota didn't "try" anything - this is a NHTSA study. Personally, all this nonsense hasn't affected my image of Toyota at all. If I was looking to buy a car, I would definitely consider Toyota.


RE: Nice try
By Gungel on 7/14/2010 8:05:42 AM , Rating: 3
Despite of this good news Toyota's quality is slipping every year. Compare the latest quality studies and recalls with other manufacturers and Toyota is just about average. Now add to that a very boring driving experience and even more boring design and you see why the latest sales numbers are down.


RE: Nice try
By gmyx on 7/14/2010 8:11:47 AM , Rating: 2
Exactly, I had an argument with a co-worker on this. Toyota at the moment is the most scrutinized, so any problems will be found and fixed. If I were in the market for a new car, Toyota would be my #1 choice because of this.


Really??
By shareky on 7/13/10, Rating: -1
RE: Really??
By gixser on 7/13/2010 7:17:51 PM , Rating: 1
Crikey! That's some theory! You must have fantastic dreams.


RE: Really??
By chick0n on 7/14/10, Rating: 0
"The whole principle [of censorship] is wrong. It's like demanding that grown men live on skim milk because the baby can't have steak." -- Robert Heinlein














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