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Mozilla plans on bringing "freedom to hundreds of millions", at the competitions expense -- or die trying.  (Source: Paramount Pictures)
Mozilla deploys messaging subsidiary to take on instant messaging, email markets

The non-profit Mozilla Foundation has made great inroads in the browser war.  As Microsoft exchanges heated words with it, Mozilla's Firefox browser has slowly been nibbling away at Internet Explorer's marketshare lead.  With the release of Firefox 3.0 impending and Internet Explorer 8 only on the distant horizon, it seems a very happy time for Mozilla.  Mozilla today announced more good news -- it's having a baby.

Mozilla has just launched a child company, Mozilla Messaging.  This new company will take up the development of Thunderbird 3.0 to coincide with the release of Firefox 3.0.  Being a separate entity, according to the Mozilla Messaging team, will allow them to better focus their efforts in creating a terrific email client to compete with Microsoft's Outlook client, and IBM's Lotus Notes, another popular business email client.  The new version of Thunderbird will feature integrated calendars with greatly expanded functionality, improved searches, and many other user interface and performance improvements. 

The small staff of Mozilla Messaging hopes to do big things, with the help of open-source developers around the world.  David Ascher, CEO, Mozilla Messaging, emphasizes that Mozilla Messaging intends to stay true to its open-source roots, stating, "We're excited to renew the focus of our open source community on the future of Thunderbird.  Every one of us is committed to building a great email product that people will love to use and that serves as the foundation for choice in a critical area of Internet software."

The Mozilla Foundation fully owns Mozilla Messaging.  Its board of directors includes a couple of former Mozilla Foundation executives, consisting of David Ascher, CEO, Mozilla Messaging; Christopher Beard, VP and General Manager, Mozilla Labs; and Marten Mickos, CEO of open source database vendor MySQL AB.

Marten Mickos, CEO of MySQL AB, the only outsider is extremely enthusiastic about the venture, stating, "Thunderbird email is a vital part of the Mozilla project which brings freedom to hundreds of millions of internet users worldwide.  By joining the board of Mozilla Messaging, I hope to help the world communicate better."

In a separate press release that is an interview transcript with David Ascher, Mr. Ascher hints that Mozilla may step into the instant messaging world.  He states,  "[The company is named] Mozilla Messaging, Inc., to reflect both that this is a Mozilla company, and that we’re focusing on the Internet messaging and communications space as a whole, not just email."

Mozilla Messaging is fully owned by the Mozilla Foundation.  For an interesting read on the field of unified messaging, a pertinent topic, please refer to DailyTech's analysis of the state of unified messaging today.

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Firefox.
By jadeskye on 2/19/2008 3:10:16 PM , Rating: 5
If it's half as good as their browser i'll switch from AIM overnight.




RE: Firefox.
By noxipoo on 2/19/2008 3:13:05 PM , Rating: 2
i use miranda for aim, msn and gtalk. tiny and fast.


RE: Firefox.
By GoodBytes on 2/19/2008 4:00:59 PM , Rating: 2
Trillian FTW... ok FINE! Trillian Astra (coming 2000-never) FTW!


RE: Firefox.
By eye smite on 2/19/2008 6:42:59 PM , Rating: 5
Trillian here as well since 2002. I'll give this a shot though, sounds like it might be worthwhile. If they put the same effort into it they have their browser, I'm sure it will be.


RE: Firefox.
By StevoLincolnite on 2/19/2008 9:45:57 PM , Rating: 2
I don't like Trillian, somehow it combined me and my friends, friend lists together, and now I get messages all the time asking "Who are you?".


RE: Firefox.
By CheesePoofs on 2/19/2008 4:27:50 PM , Rating: 5
Pidgin!! :)


RE: Firefox.
By phaxmohdem on 2/19/2008 6:06:31 PM , Rating: 3
You linux crazies and your birds :) (I <3 Ubuntu + Pidgin BTW)

On a more nostalgic note... I still remember watching my dad "messege" my deaf aunt on her TDD, using the family IBM PC-AT. You could watch individual characters pop up as fast as the lil 2400 baud modem could crank em out.


RE: Firefox.
By Zoomer on 2/20/2008 5:49:25 PM , Rating: 2
I somehow doubt anyone can out-type the Tx/Rx abilities of even a 2400 baud modem. That's at least 2400 bits/s, or 300 Bps.


RE: Firefox.
By GoodRevrnd on 2/19/2008 10:08:38 PM , Rating: 2
I have to whole-heartedly agree that Pidgin takes a crap (pun intended) on all the other IM clients.


RE: Firefox.
By Kougar on 2/19/2008 4:59:35 PM , Rating: 3
I couldn't stand Miranda's interface for long. Pidgin was great, but it simply doesn't offer multimedia support and used outdated IM protocols so file transfers between Pidgin users didn't often work or work smoothly outside of AIM. Trillian was also great, but file transfers with other Pidgin users still sometimes crashes it anyway. And as far as gAIM goes... well that is what turned into Pidgin.

I regret ever using MSN Messenger, but ICQ isn't really any better, not to mention there are not many good AIM clients left out there these days. Maybe I should just do myself a favor and stick to using Google Chat from my Gmail window...


RE: Firefox.
By noxipoo on 2/19/2008 8:51:53 PM , Rating: 3
You can skin miranda's interface, theres tons of addons and skins. It's meant to be plain jane with practically no features base.


RE: Firefox.
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 2/19/2008 3:15:48 PM , Rating: 3
Yea but if its like Thunderbird count me out. It was easy as pie to switch TO Thunderbird from another email client. However trying to switch FROM Thunderbird to another client was a pain in the arse. I switched to outlook 2007 and haven't looked back. Thunderbird is lousy in its current form, and Lotus is even worse. Maybe this will allow Thunderbird to finally improve over the old Netscape mail client.


RE: Firefox.
By jadeskye on 2/19/2008 3:18:18 PM , Rating: 2
thats a good point. i'm in desperate need to get a new email client as it is. my old version of outlook (2000 i think) is horrible when it comes to spam filtering. maybe mozilla will come through for us.


RE: Firefox.
By Nick5324 on 2/19/2008 4:31:32 PM , Rating: 3
I currently use Thunderbird, but tried out Windows Live Mail and thought it was a good alternative. It's free, give it a shot and see if you prefer it to Outlook 2000.

http://get.live.com/wlmail/overview


RE: Firefox.
By murphyslabrat on 2/20/2008 3:19:16 PM , Rating: 2
While you're looking at free webmail, try http://www.gmail.com (same as http://mail.google.com )


RE: Firefox.
By Brandon Hill (blog) on 2/19/2008 5:58:59 PM , Rating: 2
Have you found an easy way to export email messages from Thunderbird? I shouldn't have a problem with my IMAP accounts, but my Yahoo is POP and I have about two years or emails I'd like to export to another client.


RE: Firefox.
By kmmatney on 2/19/2008 8:09:24 PM , Rating: 2
Whoops - accidently rated you down instead or replying..sorry.

Heck - even exporting Thunderbird messages and re-inporting them into a new thnderbird installation is a pain in the rear. I reformatted and reinstalled windows and I remember spending hours trying to figure out how to get my emails back into thunderbird. How do they expect people to backup their email?


RE: Firefox.
By KristopherKubicki (blog) on 2/19/2008 10:09:48 PM , Rating: 2
Commenting nixes your votes for that article :)

I just tried Thunderbird going from Outlook for the first time -- it didn't work as well as I had hoped. I don't doubt that one day it will be the client of choice. I'm just glad someone is putting some pressure on MS to streamline rather than featurebloat


RE: Firefox.
By joemoedee on 2/20/2008 7:39:46 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
I just tried Thunderbird going from Outlook for the first time -- it didn't work as well as I had hoped. I don't doubt that one day it will be the client of choice. I'm just glad someone is putting some pressure on MS to streamline rather than featurebloat


I've tried the same, with similar results. Outlook 2007 is keeping me on board for the meantime. I too hope for more solid competition to Outlook, if not for price alone.


RE: Firefox.
By Oregonian2 on 2/19/2008 8:10:51 PM , Rating: 2
Isn't it the responsibility of the other programs to do the importing?

I've a zillion years of email in Thunderbird (from back in the Netscape ages). It's to about 8-GB or so. Probably not switching any time soon. :-)

P.S. - But it's been working fine for me so I have no reason to switch anyway.


RE: Firefox.
By Scorpion on 2/20/2008 2:35:54 PM , Rating: 2
Sure but do you really think Microsoft cares enough to import other clients emails and contact info? Except a few such at Lotus, which offers some bit of competition to them. They probably see offering support like that validates Thunderbird as a viable alternative. They can continue to stiffle Thunderbird adoptions with these exact complaints. Seems that Thunderbird should take the initiative of Exporting data in an Outlook friendly format for importation, but I'm sure that's far down on the list of things they'd prioritize you know?


RE: Firefox.
By murphyslabrat on 2/20/2008 3:23:16 PM , Rating: 2
Not really, the goal is to get a positive impression. The more you like its features, the more likely you are to give it a recommendation.


RE: Firefox.
By Oregonian2 on 2/20/2008 3:54:16 PM , Rating: 2
Um.. no I think that Microsoft should be blasted for not allowing Thunderbird users like myself to switch to their product. I'll avoid the Microsoft product because they don't provide a path for me to use it. Thunderbird should provide the path for people to drop them? that makes no sense whatsoever to me.


RE: Firefox.
By Alexstarfire on 2/19/2008 3:25:56 PM , Rating: 2
Unless it can connect to multiple IM services, like Pidgin does, then it's not going to be worth it. It's not like IMing has changed much. AIM is like the worst IMing service if you ask me. Can't do video chats, unless that's changed in the past few years. MSN and Google Talk are the best IMO. I believe on Google Talk you can send video, pictures, web chat, and talk to them with mics. It's too bad nearly no one uses it. That's why I've got Pidgin. I can connect to pretty much any IM service. Can't do much else but IM though. Only thing else I can do it send them pictures if they are on AIM. No webcams, no video, no nothing extra. If I need the other services I just use whatever client they are on. Luckily that's few and far between when I need to do that.


RE: Firefox.
By VahnTitrio on 2/19/2008 4:02:02 PM , Rating: 3
Trillian works for me.

I know there is absolutely zero chance of it happening but please let this replace the Sametime/Lotus Notes package at work. Want to search for a database? Oh, Notes froze and now you need to restart your system before Notes can run. What a pain.


RE: Firefox.
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 2/19/2008 5:16:07 PM , Rating: 2
Use Zapnotes, it kills the hung processes allowing you to restart Notes without rebooting the entire system. It's a nifty little application that has been around since Lotus 1.0 for the same reason you cited.


RE: Firefox.
By joemoedee on 2/20/2008 7:38:00 AM , Rating: 2
killnotes.exe does the same thing as well, it's been my friend for awhile now. It's available off of the Lotus Sandbox.

Also, Pidgin's support of Sametime is a wonderful thing. Now to just get rid of Notes... ;p


RE: Firefox.
By tallguywithglasseson on 2/19/2008 5:41:13 PM , Rating: 2
Try hitting Ctrl-Pause/Break when Notes is freezing up. That will cancel whatever Notes is doing oftentimes and you will simply get a message from Lotus stating "operation was canceled by user".

If it's still not responding, but after killing the program, Notes won't open back up, go to your task manager and click the "Processes" tab. Find the one called "ntaskldr.exe". Kill it. Lotus will open back up again.

Not that this is ideal but at least you don't have to restart your system.


RE: Firefox.
By Gul Westfale on 2/19/08, Rating: 0
RE: Firefox.
By ksherman on 2/19/2008 11:10:58 PM , Rating: 2
I only use AIM, so iChat works great for me. Simple and already on my computer.


RE: Firefox.
By Alias1431 on 2/20/2008 3:21:14 AM , Rating: 2
People still use AIM?

I left AIM years ago, and found my true love. Containers.


Lulz
By 1337cookie on 2/19/2008 3:27:48 PM , Rating: 1
Why is microsoft only ever pointed out as throwing nasty comments? Its like people think Microsoft profits from Internet Explorer or that they actually care what browser you use.




RE: Lulz
By hcahwk19 on 2/19/2008 3:35:26 PM , Rating: 2
Of course Microsoft cares which browser you use. why do you think they continue to integrate IE into Windows. If they did not care what browser you used, there would be absolutely no integration of IE whatsoever. MS would simply provide a separate disk containing IE and leave it up to the consumer as to what software is run.


RE: Lulz
By Ringold on 2/19/2008 7:47:14 PM , Rating: 2
They bundle it because it compliments the operating system, and its something customers want out of the box. I always wonder, too, how zealots propose we get other browsers on a fresh install.. This isn't linux (thank god), windows users dont want to pop open a command line and go the apt-get route or whatever.

Once you have your paid-for copy of Windows though, I don't see how they profit from the continued use of their browser.

If a semi-complete out of the box OS that be made to use anything you want by default annoys you, go to an Apple store or get a linux distro. Don't have to whine about it, as if you can't change the browser within probably 2 minutes of first booting.


RE: Lulz
By blowfish on 2/19/2008 7:59:55 PM , Rating: 2
That's a load of BS and you know it. Why don't they bundle a disc partitioning utility into Windows? Now that is crazy, to have to go to third party software for something as completely fundamental as that.

Personally, I hope the EU force MS to make updates available thru other browsers than I.E. - updates is all I use it for.


RE: Lulz
By mechBgon on 2/19/2008 8:23:59 PM , Rating: 2
With Vista, you get at least one of your wishes on any version (Windows Update is now a resident applet in Control Panel, independent of your browser). For Vista Business, Enterprise, and Ultimate editions, you also get your disk-partitioning feature. Enjoy! :)


RE: Lulz
By shadowofthesun on 2/19/2008 11:14:51 PM , Rating: 2
IIRC, Windows Disk Manager has been an integral part of Windows since XP (maybe before). I know that in Vista Home, you can access a partitioner that lets you create, shrink, and extend partitions.

To get there, run “compmgmt.msc” from the command line and select the Disk Management utility.


RE: Lulz
By noirsoft on 2/20/2008 12:42:12 PM , Rating: 2
Or, for those who prefer graphical:

right-click on "My Computer" select "Manage"


RE: Lulz
By JoeBanana on 2/20/2008 2:50:16 AM , Rating: 2
Actually mainstream linux operating systems have the browser installed already(some even more than one). But if you don't in say ubuntu you can click add/remove and click the browser of your choice,(sorry no command line, no browser needed) which is probably easier than finding, downloading and installing a program with browser.

If you only know apt-get(in cli) try some mainstream linux versions.


RE: Lulz
By Darkskypoet on 2/19/2008 9:41:32 PM , Rating: 2
MS Cares what browser you use, because all the MS web creation tools / db's / etc that are made to script / code for IE aren't free. If you have a large enough user base online with 'your' browser, it gives you an awful lot of strength to control / hijack standards. Thats a decent amount of power right there, its also one of the biggest problems with IE (maybe was not sure of current stance on the issue) LACK of standards compliance. There's a standard, then there is how IE does it.

Opera for instance, can't just arbitrarily pick how to interpret / render web pages. IE, can. Now thats power, and profit from development tools. (and licensing, and... and... and...) lol. If you control the browser, you control quite a bit these days, almost like holding a monopoly on the OS...

Thats why MS cares.


RE: Lulz
By noirsoft on 2/20/2008 12:44:10 PM , Rating: 2
Tht's funny, since the latest MS web authoring tool (Expression Web) is completely standards-based and browser agnostic. Spread the FUD!


Yahoo, MS, AIM all FAILED when it comes to IM
By UNCjigga on 2/19/2008 4:40:55 PM , Rating: 2
Seriously, this bunch of buffoons really screwed up when it comes to their consumer IM strategy. They've been talking about integrating their networks for 3-4 years now and nothing's happened! I would venture that Microsoft's IM client has seen lots of feature development, but little growth in the user base because they will never be a truly "open" network. AIM is still bloatware to me, I stopped using it long ago and could care less if they fixed it, made it leaner, etc. Yahoo Messenger is spammerrific--way too much abuse going on.

Basically, through their incompetence they've allowed Google Talk to grow its user base by leaps and bounds. Now almost all of my friends use Google Talk exclusively--it works great from any browser, works great as a lean standalone app, and it works great on my BlackBerry. I don't need anything else.




By Ringold on 2/19/2008 7:48:54 PM , Rating: 2
I guess perspective is everything; I for one don't know anyone that uses Google Talk. :)

Well, except you now.


without lightning.. so what
By kattanna on 2/19/2008 5:14:34 PM , Rating: 2
really.. without good calendaring intergration, so what.

i still sit and wonder ??why?? the open source world hasnt taken on outlook directly. openoffice is great and all, and i use it mostly myself, but then im left installing outlook on windows PC's, or entourage on macs, for those that need calendaring, which is a lot of people in the working world.

i honestly dont need another POP3/IMAP only client.




By Master Kenobi (blog) on 2/20/2008 9:45:02 AM , Rating: 2
Yes, it is indeed odd that nobody has ever taken outlook seriously. Windows Mail in Vista is also very nice and includes calendaring etc....


Links, Links, and more Links!
By mikecel79 on 2/19/2008 4:14:26 PM , Rating: 1
The sheer amount of links to other Dailytech stories in the article is mind boggling. Half of them them have nothing to do with Mozilla forming a messaging subsidary? You've got a link for "new version of Thunderbird" that points to an article from last April! You've got a link to the Microsoft/Yahoo merger talks. What does that have to do with this?

I've complained about this in the past before. I understand you want to provide links to other DT stories but how about you do it when it's relevant? This entire article looks like it was only created to provide links to other DT articles. There's almost no real information in this article....




RE: Links, Links, and more Links!
By Ringold on 2/19/2008 7:56:14 PM , Rating: 2
Well, there is information in it, clearly enough.

I don't fault them for linking to past articles I suppose, it's not a charitable site and probably isn't cheap to run..

That said, I speculate that by 2010, all DailyTech articles will be one large mass of links, with each word leading to a past article, including punctuation -- even otherwise meaningless adverds and conjuctions. :)

At least they don't do that crap where random words are special links to pop-up advertisements and whatnot. That's.. the most vile form of advertisement ever created.


not another IM - email is fine
By Zensen on 2/19/2008 6:31:49 PM , Rating: 2
Outlook is fine for my needs but I prefer to use webmail primiarly as I can get to it anywhere. But I can definitely see areas where Email clients could be improved so here's to them improving that immensely.

But when it comes to IM, I let out another.. "oh not another one". I seriously don't like having to spread applications out just so I can talk to another mate. I guess trillian etc are good for those sorta things but really but with people moving from one to another, its just a pain to keep in contact. I seriously don't think mozilla can do any better with whats out there now. If a mate chooses to use some alternative that I can't reach them. oh well guess there's always email or I'm a mobile phone call away.

Unless they can integrate this better into portable hardware such as how opera is so well done in the wii or mobile phones. its hardly going to make a dent!

I'll stick with MSN messenger/yahoo messenger.




Hopefully
By rdeegvainl on 2/20/2008 8:42:42 AM , Rating: 2
Hopefully, they will bring tabs to messenging. If it does that, I would definately switch, and be grateful to have that unclutter my taskbar.




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