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Microsoft talks trash about the iPad's business capabilities, in slide form.  (Source: Microsoft via ZDNet)
Redmond's finest hopes to score some tablet business from the corporate sector

After a long road, Microsoft is finally ready to enter the tablet market in earnest during 2011 with a number of Windows 7 tablets running on Intel Atom system-on-a-chip processors.  To date, Microsoft has only released one high profile Windows tablet -- the HP Slate 500 -- and by "high profile" we mean "sold 5,000 units at launch."

Microsoft obviously hopes for much bigger things, with rival Apple selling millions of iPads each month.  But it has its work cut out for it with the impending release of the Apple iPad 2.

In an attempt to counter the iPad's sizable market lead, Microsoft is planning to attack it where it's weakest -- on the business side.  The company has been passing about a slide deck to its partners entitled "Microsoft Commercial Slate PCs".

The slides brag that Windows 7 can do things that Apple's iOS 4.x can't do well, such as "provide remote assistance", "deploy LOB applications", and "secure corporate IP".  Clearly Microsoft plans on leveraging the fact that Windows 7 is a more secure OS, is richer in business software, and (with the help of Intel's chips) offers superior virtualization/networking capabilities.

A recent report by Seattle's TechFlash pointed out that if iPads were factored in to computer sales reports, Apple would jump ahead of Dell to become the world's second largest seller of personal computers.

But its new campaign just might work to some extent.  Many businesses have clearly been interested in the tablet craze, but have been wary of handing out hard-to-manage iPads to the staff.  If Microsoft plays its hand right and manages to offer a decent selection of affordable options, it may just win these slow adopters over.  The only big risk is the fact that Windows 7 tablets are expected to get worse battery life due to the fact that they use Intel, rather than ARM processors.

The real question for Microsoft is what to do next.  The company has to focus on developing a next generation Windows operating system focused on the tablet, and has to try to efficiently offer legacy software support for its newly adopted ARM architecture CPUs in order to close the battery life gap with its rivals.  But it also has to consider whether a full-fledged Windows environment is well suited for its next generation tablet OS, or whether it would be better off adopting its non-traditional Windows Phone 7/Zune OS in a larger form factor.

Microsoft's plans for this year is looking increasingly clear, but its long term plans are far less so.



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So to sum up
By Tony Swash on 1/25/2011 5:36:36 PM , Rating: 2
So to sum up.

According to the digerati sophisticates who post around here

All is well at Microsoft (hence the top executives flocking too the company)

Microsoft will continue to mine its old monopolies for ever - cos that's just it has always been and thus will always be so (based on Demi Moore's Law - nothing ever changes in the world of technology)

Windows tablets that will crush the iPad in the only market that's important which is the enterprise market

or

Windows tablets will not crush the iPad but that doesn't matter because the tablet market is peripheral

or

The tablet market is important but someone somewhere (apparently from the land of OEM) will make something that will crush the iPad

Macs may be outgrowing the PC market by a substantial margin, and have done so for several years in a row but will remain a tiny proportion of the PC market - cos that's just it has always been and thus will always be so (see Demi Moore's Law)

Macs will one day - real soon apparently - catch up to Windows and get some nasty malware infections. Really this time they will.

iPads are not really popular

Even if iPads are popular it just because iTunes is popular, people don't actually want the iPads.

Apple products are so popular that Apple can never get production to catch up with demand so other products will fill the vacuum (presumably products not manufactured in China and hence not also affected by the same production bottlenecks).

Apple are not important

Apple are marginal

Apple are doomed

The world is as it always has been.

We are techies - forward into the past!!




RE: So to sum up
By Pirks on 1/25/2011 6:06:33 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
We are techies - forward into the past
Hehe, now that's why you are afraid to answer my post at http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=20684...

It destroys and ridicules your favorite "25 year old past tech blah blah" mantra. Well, can't fight the truth eh Tony? ;)


RE: So to sum up
By Tony Swash on 1/26/2011 8:30:18 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Hehe, now that's why you are afraid to answer my post at http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=20684...

It destroys and ridicules your favorite "25 year old past tech blah blah" mantra. Well, can't fight the truth eh Tony? ;)


So what's your point? Microsoft is trying to update it's ancient code base. Well whoopee. What do they expect - the world to stand still while they do it?

The tech world was gestating a paradigm shift for a long time. The inflection moment was the launch of the iPhone, that not only showed just what potential the new mobile devices could have but it also pushed the Android team into a reset and they stopped trying to copy Windows Mobile and Rim, and started copying the iPhone. And Android were after the same customer base as Microsoft - the handset OEMs who had been Win Mobile customers.

And what was the response from the Microsoft CE to this major shift in the market? A dismissive laugh.

Microsoft had been trying to push a tablet solution for a decade but their vision had one product killing feature - it ran on Windows. Microsoft's tablet failure was yet another example of how the "Windows Everywhere" vision was killing MS's ability to innovate. Only where it has abandoned Windows has MS been able to innovate.

Even with their non-Windows projects (Xbox, Bing, Kinect, etc) MS innovations have repeatedly failed to create a substantial and profitable business. MS has done nothing that comes even remotely close to something that could replace or match the Windows/Office revenue streams

Lest suppose that even now Microsoft is working away on a new slimmed down OS specifically designed to work with a touch interface and a similarly slimmed down touch based Office app. Lets suppose (even though this is straining the limits of probability a fair bit) when MS finally launches it's new OS and a new Office and they both run on ARM that OEM's flock back to pay the license fees and customers flock back and buy the Windows tablets and the new Office. Where would MS find itself? Well given that the new OS would be competing against a free one (Android/Chrome) thus pushing down license fees and given that Apps seem to sell for a lot less that the old desktop packaged software (and people would expect cheaper unbundled versions for those people who want Word but not, say, Powerpoint) I think MS would find itself with a much reduced revenue flow.

There really is no good place for Microsoft to go - every option has a down side. Personally the best I think they could do would be to ditch Ballmer, ditch the failing chasing Google and Apple silliness and instead retrench into the enterprise market where, if they are lucky, they will be able to salvage a reasonable large and profitable business. Maybe. With luck.


RE: So to sum up
By Pirks on 1/26/2011 11:34:28 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
And what was the response from the Microsoft CE to this major shift in the market? A dismissive laugh.
And what was the response from the Apple CE to this laugh? A 200% drop in price. Look who was right ma! :) Ballmer laughed his butt off when he heard the whopping $600 tag on that new flashy toy, so Jobs was forced to cut the price to 30% of its initial value, otherwise Ballmer would die laughing at this idiocy :))
quote:
Even with their non-Windows projects (Xbox, Bing, Kinect, etc) MS innovations have repeatedly failed to create a substantial and profitable business.
Yeah, that's why they sold like 8 millions of Kinect and their Xbox 360 was outselling every other console in the US in the past few months. What a failure eh? :)))


RE: So to sum up
By Pirks on 1/26/2011 12:10:17 PM , Rating: 2
Apple is trying to update it's ancient code base from NeXT. Well whoopee. What do they expect - the world to stand still while they do it?


RE: So to sum up
By Tony Swash on 1/26/2011 1:08:01 PM , Rating: 2
We could toss this around endlessly. You think Microsoft is in good shape for future challenges I think they are not. You think tomorrow will be like yesterday and I think it won't.

Meanwhile Apple takes third place for global computer sales above Dell.

Times are changing.

http://www.canalys.com/pr/2011/r2011012.html


RE: So to sum up
By Pirks on 1/26/2011 1:20:34 PM , Rating: 2
You think Apple will be in good shape for future challenges when Jobs is gone, I think they won't.


RE: So to sum up
By Tony Swash on 1/26/2011 2:10:23 PM , Rating: 1
Pirks - you know you seem like an old friend to me now ;) I guess I am feeling particularly mellow tonight.

I have several old friends with whom I have many disagreements (mostly about politics) and there is nothing like getting together with them and batting the shit around.

In the spirit of friendship it would be nice to know more about you. So - to get the ball rolling - here are my salient facts

Age: 58

Location: London UK

Occupation: Now retired. I used to run European Union projects (lots of travel ) and before that back in the eighties I ran my own design and printing company.

What's your salient info?


RE: So to sum up
By Pirks on 1/26/2011 3:01:43 PM , Rating: 2
nah, I can't tell you that much since I've been burnt a few times on forums like this one when things got way too personal. I'm just a software engineer and pretty far from retirement too, at the moment I'm in Canada but lived in Germany for a while before that. with regard to IT tech - I've been through a few years with OS/2 and a few years with RedHat Linux, before switching to Windows NT and staying with it since then. hence I lived through at least two revolutions, first was when people were screaming about OS/2 soon killing MS, next was when some other people were screaming about Linux killing MS, now I'm enjoying yet another "revolution" when some people scream about OS X killing MS. "har har har" - says my lifetime experience about all this stuff


RE: So to sum up
By Tony Swash on 1/26/2011 5:49:36 PM , Rating: 2
I had a tremendous walking holiday in Canada in 2006, explored the Rockies from Banff to Jasper. Seriously great country.


RE: So to sum up
By Pirks on 1/26/2011 6:05:12 PM , Rating: 2
you might want to tour Vancouver (and BC in general) someday


RE: So to sum up
By Pirks on 1/26/2011 3:12:12 PM , Rating: 2
haha, design and print company! THAT'S WHY the Apple obsession, NOW it is all clear with ya Tony :)


Um...
By Cheesew1z69 on 1/25/2011 9:48:24 AM , Rating: 4
quote:
To date, Microsoft has only released one high profile Windows tablet -- the HP Slate 500 -- and by "high profile" we mean "sold 5,000 units at launch."
To date, HP released it...Not MS...




RE: Um...
By JasonMick (blog) on 1/25/11, Rating: 0
RE: Um...
By Luticus on 1/25/2011 10:07:14 AM , Rating: 1
agreed.


RE: Um...
By torpor on 1/25/2011 10:43:37 AM , Rating: 5
Not agreed.

Microsoft does sell hardware - typically things like keyboards and mice, but it does sell branded hardware.

Since Microsoft does not control end-to-end platform design, you can't honestly say Microsoft released a tablet.

I know (especially in light of the slide) it's probably easier to describe the whole thing as Apple vs. Microsoft, but that's not really the case. It's Apple vs. Microsoft, Intel and X, which is both the strength and the weakness of the Windows platform.

I know it was a handy stat, but in truth, Microsoft and partners have yet to take a serious swipe at the tablet market.


RE: Um...
By Flunk on 1/25/11, Rating: 0
RE: Um...
By Luticus on 1/25/2011 10:54:40 AM , Rating: 2
mmm, point taken. I agree with you that the phrase "microsoft released" is a bit misleading because it's not like microsoft even did anything new here. There's no new tablet os or anything, it's just windows 7 with a pretty "hp" skin or whatever god awful software layers they plaster on top of windows to make it more "tablet friendly", a joke at it's finest seeing as all you really need to do is tweek the ui a bit and enlarge some buttons and such (something the os does natively... or better yet use windows media center!) But the point is, as far as i can see all Microsoft has really done is "partner" with other vender's to release the hardware that runs their platform. Calling it a "Microsoft tablet" because it runs windows is like calling a car a "Bridgestone" car because it uses their tires. The difference here is that i know and understand that the author of the article wasn't trying to call it a "Microsoft tablet" and was only trying to convey that windows tablets are coming out for the business market, but then I'm not one to sit here and nitpick every freaking minor detail of an article when the authors intent is pretty clear in my opinion.

That being said, sure it's misleading if your a moron and maybe the author should be more careful... but we're all human and it's not like I'm paying to be here. Frankly i like free news and tend to try not to whine so much about things that are free/ad supported.


RE: Um...
By torpor on 1/25/2011 1:13:51 PM , Rating: 1
mmm, point taken, if you're a jag who thinks a point is totally unimportant but you have to write a really dense paragraph on it anyway with like no punctuation or capitalization, i can see where you'd be confused and think it was ok to like say that the cocoa growers of peru sold their 100 millionth nabisco oreo today, but i guess everyone would just kinda know what you meant.

That being said, it's nice to know you think hardware is a skin on software, because of course that's what hp adds to the device to make something to sell, so try not to whine so much about the next thing you buy where the software is awesome but the hardware is crap. And I wouldn't have said anything about it if Jason Mick didn't personally tell you why he thought it was all just ok anyway using a pretty lame line of reasoning.


RE: Um...
By Luticus on 1/25/2011 1:50:06 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
no punctuation or capitalization
See, my other posts are typically punctuated nicely and usually use capital letters. Sometimes I'm in a rush because I'm posting from work; however, for the most part, my sentences are well thought out and at least somewhat reasonably punctuated. This begs the question, why would I go on a rant about how someone's incorrect use of a phrase is not really that important if the over all meaning is still understood, and then not use any punctuation or make much of an attempt to capitalize letters properly?

quote:
it's nice to know you think hardware is a skin on software

Nice random assumption. You see when I buy new hardware I buy just that, new hardware. Software is completely irrelevant regarding my hardware choices, in most cases, because I typically like to load whatever hardware I've purchased with my software of choice upon arrival. Hardware and software are two entirely separate things in my opinion and one should not mean I'm stuck with the other. It is, therefore, necessary for me to point out that your "random assumption" is completely wrong.

Yes, I do think the point is totally unimportant. I wrote a really dense paragraph on it because I think it's pretty sad when people use a free service and then do nothing but complain about the service provider. Sure... Jason was incorrect in the phrasing, and you have every right to point it out, just as I have every right to call you a whiny ungrateful moron for doing so. Isn't freedom great!

This argument is really stupid...


RE: Um...
By torpor on 1/25/2011 3:04:45 PM , Rating: 1
First off, there is no free lunch. This site most certainly is not free, it's simply extracting a cost which you and I do not pay directly, but by viewing (and hopefully interacting with) interstitial advertising. These advertisers pay money to advertise on this site because it has a sizeable, engaged, interest-focused community. Therefore, it is in DailyTech's interest to listen to that community and provide what it wants, because that community is what makes their site (and several jobs, Jason's included) viable beyond the grace of an angel investor.

Therefore, on occasions where the site administration engages the community in a meta-discussion (as above with Jason's post), I feel we, in fact, have a responsibility to give good and respectful guidance. In the meantime, my post - where I did exactly that - has been modded up by the community, while Jason's and yours have been modded down. This amounts to community feedback Jason would hopefully find useful, since growing the community is the main way Jason will grow his career as a journalist. (increasing prominence of site) The rest of our bickering between ourselves has been largely ignored, as it should be.

My individual feelings are not terribly important - note I did not make some silly threat about going elsewhere for news, and I have defended Jason in other places, especially about the Wikileaks coverage. I know that my individual pageviews are nearly meaningless. However, the communal input is the thing, and it does seem to be working.

Beyond that, if you'd like to disavow what you posted previously about HP's role in the value chain, that's fine. It was stupid anyway. But it highlights the logical dissonance you had to endure to post a defense to the "nit".


RE: Um...
By Parhel on 1/25/2011 11:48:02 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Therefore, on occasions where the site administration engages the community in a meta-discussion (as above with Jason's post), I feel we, in fact, have a responsibility to give good and respectful guidance.


I'm more of a "Mick, you suck" kind of guy, myself, but to each his own.


RE: Um...
By vol7ron on 1/26/2011 10:22:12 AM , Rating: 2
Wasn't the Compaq Tablet PC that was released in 2001 relatively successful? I saw a lot of people with them in my area.


Microsoft old hat
By wordsworm on 1/25/11, Rating: 0
RE: Microsoft old hat
By Luticus on 1/25/2011 10:10:38 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
They seem to be on a road to irrelevance

Lol, good luck with that... that's all I'm sayin'.

Meanwhile I'll eagerly await the next gen windows os and tablets that are actually worth something.

Want to know why Microsoft is awesome? http://www.engadget.com/2011/01/24/windows-phone-7...

There's at least one good reason.


RE: Microsoft old hat
By wordsworm on 1/25/2011 10:34:57 AM , Rating: 2
God knows I'm afraid of what that could actually mean, to be frank. I just think that the more people get used to using alternative OSes, the more they'll be willing to walk away from Microsoft altogether.

Meanwhile, in a great deal of the world, people are still using the world's #1 most popular pirated OS: Microsoft XP. Until the day comes when Microsoft releases another pirate-friendly OS, the world will hang onto XP. Or, there may come a day when something better comes along.

I work in an office of technological morons who run XP because of this fact. They still use Explorer 6 because they think that updates will screw up their computers. If it wasn't for some of the stupid software that they need to run on those machines, I could show them Ubuntu and they could leave all that junk behind.

In any case, if I have to choose between a world of MS or Apple, I'll go with MS any day of the week.


RE: Microsoft old hat
By Luticus on 1/25/2011 11:11:00 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Meanwhile, in a great deal of the world, people are still using the world's #1 most popular pirated OS: Microsoft XP. Until the day comes when Microsoft releases another pirate-friendly OS, the world will hang onto XP. Or, there may come a day when something better comes along.
fair enough, and for the most part i agree. That said, i'd like to point out how unbelievable SAD it is that that's probably true. God forbid someone actually pay for something they're using. Honestly it's not like windows 7 is all that difficult to pirate either. I simply choose not to.

quote:
In any case, if I have to choose between a world of MS or Apple, I'll go with MS any day of the week.

Agreed, i'm glad you feel that way :D

One final thought, Ubuntu is ok... at best. Personal opinion though.
For me Debian with kde 4.x is my favorite or at least mint. Ubuntu is nice but it's got nothing on windows 7, granted i haven't tried the latest bleeding edge version yet.

Microsoft has a firm place in the technology world, their products and opinions are of huge importance. Microsoft may not be perfect and sure they've made their share of mistakes but in the end they are a great tech company and they aren't going anywhere any time soon.


RE: Microsoft old hat
By wordsworm on 1/26/2011 8:25:42 PM , Rating: 2
What really drives me nuts about it is that every time the network gets compromised (considering it's a hacked XP... I'd be surprised if it's not already hacked), they have to pay some yokel to fix it. Because of all that, I installed Ubuntu on my machine. I don't want them to have to perform a reinstall, wiping out my work.

One thing I've thought of considering XP, though, is how much more demanding it is now than it used to be. I remember it worked fine on 128MB, but then you needed 256MB. Then, 512. About two years ago, even that wasn't enough. I think you need around 1GB now. By doing this, it has occurred to me, MS has craftily managed to require people to upgrade their computers. Given that these computers had OEM XP, that meant either buying another XP or 'upgrading' to Vista.

I bought Vista twice. In the end, I reinstalled XP (in this case XP Pirate Edition) because it just gave me too many problems. I also used the pirated edition because I felt I'd already paid for Vista (the first motherboard I mucked up because of a Vista crash while trying to update the Bios, so I had to get another Vista.)

To be honest, I still don't like the Windows 7 service agreement. That's why I had to ultimately kick Vista since I wanted to keep that machine offline. I didn't want it to be compromised due to the fact that all my work was on there and it wasn't necessary for it to be online. But Vista ends up not working if it's kept offline for too long.


RE: Microsoft old hat
By omnicronx on 1/25/2011 11:38:51 AM , Rating: 3
Its not just you.. Its just people like you who seem to think that the consumer space is the only market that matters.

No single manufacturer has the production capacity to handle the kind of large scale production that will be required to move tablets into the business space in mass.

This is why OEM centric platforms will always win out in the long run, and why MS is most likely far from being irrelevant.

Apple will most likely continue to garner a huge share in the consumer tablet space, but eventually they are not going to be in the dominant position they are now in the grand scheme of things. The question is, who will be there to fill the gap..


Role of Unisys in Apple Enterprise Sales?
By ltcommanderdata on 1/25/2011 10:07:01 AM , Rating: 2
Does anyone know what type of services Unisys provides to companies? Apple partnered with Unisys last year presumably so that Unisys can use their expertise to bolster iOS in the areas of deployment and Line of Business applications to help corporate IT adopt iOS devices. Unisys is an IT services company with many enterprise and government clients.




By Mitch101 on 1/25/2011 11:29:37 AM , Rating: 2
Apple is trying but they aren't there yet.

Apple taps Navy techie for global security head
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-20029280-37.html

At some point the Apple commercials they made about Windows Viruses, Hacking, and freezing the computer will start to haunt even Apples biggest fans. Most high end techs already know its a joke. Some times you have to let people fall off the cliff to learn the lesson.


By Taft12 on 1/25/2011 1:26:56 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Does anyone know what type of services Unisys provides to companies?


On-site service of all Dell business desktops/laptops/servers in my country. I think they do every HP box as well. I am certain Apple is partnering with Unisys for the same purpose.


woot!
By Luticus on 1/25/11, Rating: 0
RE: woot!
By acer905 on 1/25/2011 12:37:11 PM , Rating: 2
Yeah, having a fully functional computer that you can easily carry around and write notes on, play simply finger games, and watch videos on the go is insane...

Especially if the thing has a usb port, or maybe bluetooth, and runs an OS that you can plug any wireless keyboard/mouse combo into and get all the abilities of a traditional computer...

Nobody would ever be able to use one of those...

Its not like it could... (gasp) replace your existing computers, instead of simply being a toy. The Slate has one real disadvantage... its a bit underpowered in comparison to what it could be (IE using the Z540 instead of the much more powerful D525).


RE: woot!
By Luticus on 1/25/2011 12:54:15 PM , Rating: 2
Thank you! Someone here knows what i'm talking about. Seriously the only real disadvantage to windows on a tablet is the battery life and Microsoft is trying to help rectify that by supporting more processor platforms.

Really all you need to do to effectively use windows 7 on a tablet is enlarge the buttons/interface items which are smaller (this is supported natively and can be done with little to no effort). This makes it thumb friendly. on top of that Microsoft has it's own built in software layer that is GREAT, finger/thumb friendly, and doesn't slow the PC down like the garbage all the 3rd party vender's keep trying to load, think Windows media center!


Windows Tablets
By ZachDontScare on 1/25/2011 3:13:23 PM , Rating: 2
We seem to be getting into the 'big lie' about Windows tablets. There have Windows tablets for over a decade. The HP Slate is hardly the first. Previous editions certainly didnt have multi-touch screens and such, as the technology wasnt available. But to say Windows is just getting into the tablet thing is a flat out lie. But it seems the attention spans of tech bloggers and writers arent long enough to realize that when they are told there arent Windows tablets to realize thats simply not true. There's tons of them, and have been for over a decade. Just google 'Fujitsu Stylistic'.

Apple's not even the first one to put a *mobile* OS on a tablet - Sharp, Vadem, and a few others did that a decade ago with Windows CE slates. I had a Sharp Tripad 10 years ago that folded down to a tablet and supported handwriting recognition. Had a modem, supported PMCIA cards, heck, it even supported a removable CF card (something the iPad cant even do today).

The point is, the iPad, while neat, is just another evolution of technology. An incremental improvement on what already existed. Its not a new concept by any means.




What a lot of hokum in one place.
By Tony Swash on 1/25/11, Rating: -1
RE: What a lot of hokum in one place.
By Pirks on 1/25/2011 12:52:12 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
The world is changing and Microsoft failed to notice
http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=20684...

Quit avoiding my post like a plague Tony, find some strength to stand up and look in the face of truth :P
quote:
Unfortunately although long predicted, and wished for, that day has just never arrived, and never will
Yeah, indeed how can this Big Day Of The Mac Virus come if Mac has just a few percent of market share? Who'd bother to write a virus for such a miniscule platform off the market radar unit share wise? You're right Tony - noone.


RE: What a lot of hokum in one place.
By XZerg on 1/25/2011 1:30:05 PM , Rating: 2
well that 1% of at least 1 billion people on internet would be 10 million. And out of that 10M users most of them are willing to throw $$$$ on whatever Stevie Wonder moves his wand over. So plenty of money to be made going for Mac users given their willingness to throw $$$$.


RE: What a lot of hokum in one place.
By Pirks on 1/25/2011 1:51:17 PM , Rating: 2
This 10 millions is super scarce and well scattered, with so much distance between all these Macs there's zero chance for the spread of infection, which is a total opposite of the super dense population of Windows PCs. No density -> no virus infections that could spread anywhere -> no incentive to write Mac virus. Got it?


RE: What a lot of hokum in one place.
By spread on 1/25/2011 4:23:46 PM , Rating: 2
That's great. So all I have to do is space out my Windows PCs. I put one in the basement and one in the attic.

Virus problem solved. Wow, you're smart. Thanks!


RE: What a lot of hokum in one place.
By Pirks on 1/25/2011 6:10:26 PM , Rating: 2
spread your Windows


RE: What a lot of hokum in one place.
By Tony Swash on 1/25/2011 2:23:17 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
Yeah, indeed how can this Big Day Of The Mac Virus come if Mac has just a few percent of market share? Who'd bother to write a virus for such a miniscule platform off the market radar unit share wise?


Look - if the security through obscurity tosh stokes your fires then keep on believing. Happily the whole thing will be settled empirically. Macs just keep keep growing their market share. Lets see what happens. meanwhile the actual reality is simple and straight forward. No virus/malware on Macs. 99.9% of malware on Windows.

Dems the facts buddy ;)


By themaster08 on 1/25/2011 2:35:01 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Macs just keep keep growing their market share.
http://marketshare.hitslink.com/os-market-share.as...

Dem those facts buddy ;)


RE: What a lot of hokum in one place.
By Pirks on 1/25/2011 2:37:32 PM , Rating: 2
Look - if the MS using 25 year old technologies tosh stokes your fires then keep on believing. Happily the whole thing will be settled empirically. MS will keep Macs away from hurting its market share. Lets see what happens. meanwhile the actual reality is simple and straight forward. No market share on Macs. 99.9% of market share on Windows.

Dems the facts buddy ;)


By sprockkets on 1/25/2011 3:00:03 PM , Rating: 2
Dude, where have you been the last 3 years? Nobody hacks OSes anymore; they hack Adobe Flash, Acrobat and other cross platform apps.


RE: What a lot of hokum in one place.
By acer905 on 1/25/2011 12:57:43 PM , Rating: 2
Just out of curiosity, first i shall poll the readers:

1) How many people have seen an iPad in real life, being used by actual people, outside of stores selling them. I for one have seen one. It was about 2 weeks ago.

2) Of the people you see using them, what are they doing. The person i saw was playing a simple game.

3) How many people, estimate, would be able to fully replace their home/work computer with an iPad?

The problem that i see with the iPad, and the tablets that it has inspired, is in the approach it takes. Being a content viewing device, it is not truly suited to replace a traditional computer. Think of a college student, who instead of buying a laptop or netbook bought an iPad. they would be forced to go to their schools library in order to write a lengthy report that makes up most of their grade for a class.

There are many people who spend more time inputting content into a computer than they do viewing it. For them, the limited abilities of a content viewing device would cause problems, especially if it costs as much as their content input device.

The idea behind the Slate, and the reason its geared for business, is as a mobility content input device. This may not be the thing that sells millions of units to the average masses, but it fills a needed role. At your desk, you dock your tablet, giving it keyboard and mouse functionality, and perhaps a larger screen. Then when you leave your desk, you pick it up and keep working on it with the touch interface.

It is not a fancy new idea, it is the evolution of the portable computing. years ago someone slapped together a device with integrated keyboard, mouse, and screen and created an expensive, yet mobile computer. yet, many people didn't really like using the built in mouse, so at their desk they had another.

I for one am hopeful that, just like laptops, tablet computers will evolve, become more powerful, and have longer battery lives, so that they will be able to phase out their predecessor.

A content viewing device can never do that.


RE: What a lot of hokum in one place.
By Pirks on 1/25/2011 1:02:58 PM , Rating: 2
Answering for myself:
1) One, yesterday
2) Reading PDF file
3) None

Answering for Tony:
1) Bajillions
2) Doing everything
3) Bajillions

He's so predictable eh :)))


By Luticus on 1/25/2011 1:11:33 PM , Rating: 2
1) We give them to our execs at work
2) Playing simple games and surfing the net:)
3) Seeing as you need a computer of some kind loaded with itunes just to turn the thing on for the first time... nobody!

The ipad is a stupid piece of junk for anyone serious about replacing their computer with a tablet. Even if i had my "dream" tablet it wouldn't be a replacement for my desktop!


RE: What a lot of hokum in one place.
By Tony Swash on 1/25/2011 2:28:51 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
ust out of curiosity, first i shall poll the readers:

1) How many people have seen an iPad in real life, being used by actual people, outside of stores selling them. I for one have seen one. It was about 2 weeks ago.

2) Of the people you see using them, what are they doing. The person i saw was playing a simple game.

3) How many people, estimate, would be able to fully replace their home/work computer with an iPad?

The problem that i see with the iPad, and the tablets that it has inspired, is in the approach it takes. Being a content viewing device, it is not truly suited to replace a traditional computer. Think of a college student, who instead of buying a laptop or netbook bought an iPad. they would be forced to go to their schools library in order to write a lengthy report that makes up most of their grade for a class.

There are many people who spend more time inputting content into a computer than they do viewing it. For them, the limited abilities of a content viewing device would cause problems, especially if it costs as much as their content input device.

The idea behind the Slate, and the reason its geared for business, is as a mobility content input device. This may not be the thing that sells millions of units to the average masses, but it fills a needed role. At your desk, you dock your tablet, giving it keyboard and mouse functionality, and perhaps a larger screen. Then when you leave your desk, you pick it up and keep working on it with the touch interface.

It is not a fancy new idea, it is the evolution of the portable computing. years ago someone slapped together a device with integrated keyboard, mouse, and screen and created an expensive, yet mobile computer. yet, many people didn't really like using the built in mouse, so at their desk they had another.

I for one am hopeful that, just like laptops, tablet computers will evolve, become more powerful, and have longer battery lives, so that they will be able to phase out their predecessor.

A content viewing device can never do that.


That's a tremendously well presented and thoughtful argument as to why reality is not reality.

Unfortunately for you reality is reality.

Apple sold 17 million iPads in the first nine months. With a version one device.

They will sell three times that number in the next twelve months.

Reading your post is like listening to someone standing waist deep in a river offering a rational sounding argument as why their feet are not wet and cannot possibly be wet.

All the other posts here saying the iPad is a useless piece of crap that cannot possible catch on or replace the old style computer just seem ridiculous in the face of Apple's sales figures. Hands on hearts guys at it's launch how many iPads did you think Apple would sell in the first nine months?

Does the fact that reality seems to conflict so deeply with your inner mental picture of the world suggest to you that one or the other need adjusting so that they might fit? I will leave you to guess which one needs adjusting :)


RE: What a lot of hokum in one place.
By Pirks on 1/25/2011 2:52:26 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
iPad is a useless piece of crap that cannot possible catch on or replace the old style computer just seem ridiculous in the face of Apple's sales figures
Apple sold just a few percent of whatever amount of PCs was sold and self-assembled in the world, so looks like Apple's tiny sales figures (compared to PC/parts sales) only prove that iPad is useless toy that can't even exist without PC and its iTunes on top of ol' trusty Windows.


By Luticus on 1/25/2011 1:08:04 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
Important to who? For how long? The world is changing and Microsoft failed to notice until it was too late. All tablets based on Windows 7 will fail. Not a single one will get any traction in the market, in the consumer space or the enterprise space. At every turn Microsoft fell back to defending their old ageing monopoly products and now they are up shit creek without a paddle.


LOL, Really Tony... all that and for what? You have no evidence that windows 7 tablets will fail and even if they do, so what? That still doesn't mean Microsoft as a whole will fail. Microsoft is a massive tech company with the number one desktop operating system and office productivity solution. Everything else is just gravy. That's not even mentioning Windows 8 when it's released. If you seriously think Microsoft is irrelevant just because apple released some phones and an ipad you're fooling yourself. That's like saying America is irrelevant because we had a recession, obviously not the case.

Microsoft is huge, and they've just release the single best desktop operating system on the market. They've had some huge successes recently with their software. Windows Mobile 7 is looking to be a strong future contender, xbox is doing great (now), and IE9 will be a huge hit. Granted apple isn't going anywhere either but I'm not the one saying someone's irrelevant.

The next time you want to use words like "hokum" to describe one of my quotes i suggest you have a lot more than baseless speculation to back it up!


By omnicronx on 1/25/2011 1:49:19 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
This is why OEM centric platforms will always win out in the long run, and why MS is most likely far from being irrelevant. Apple will most likely continue to garner a huge share in the consumer tablet space, but eventually they are not going to be in the dominant position they are now in the grand scheme of things. The question is, who will be there to fill the gap.

Such hubris based on so little actuality. The confident reference to a "gap" that doesn't actually exist is a stroke of genius. Perhaps you failed to notice this. http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/11/01/18/appl... Looks like Apple are moving to wrap up the tablet screen production sector like they wrapped up the flash memory market a few years back. I guess the tablet OEMs are going to win just like they did with the iPod - oh wait a minute :)


Seriously, have you no understanding of how the market works? Do you seriously think that Apple has the production capacity to ever dominate the business tablet market? They barely have enough capacity to meet current CONSUMER demand.

The iPod is a CONSUMER device, that was undeniably pushed by iTunes into dominance.

iPod sales out of this consumer space are non existent, so to even compare the two makes me laugh.

The history of the iPod has absolutely no relevance when discussing the applicability of the iPad in the business space.

I also don't see why I should care about a 3.9B infusion for supply contracts, as though this has any relevance to the topic at hand. You are kidding yourself if you think that infusion is for anything else other than to increase its current production capacity as they are not meeting current CONSUMER demands.

They could spend their entire 60B in reserves and they still would have nowhere near the production capacity needed to dominate the entire market moving forward.

Sorry Tony, but history is not on your side. OEM centric platforms have shown time and time again why they make far more sense, especially in the business space.

I'm not trying to claim any product is better than another, I'm just commenting on the business model.


"The whole principle [of censorship] is wrong. It's like demanding that grown men live on skim milk because the baby can't have steak." -- Robert Heinlein














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