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Datel's no-longer-allowed memory unit retails for $39.99 and offers 2 GB of storage. Microsoft claims it has disallowed it as it "promotes cheating."  (Source: Amazon.com)

Microsoft's memory unit only has 512 MB of capacity and no ability to expand or swap out the storage. It retails for $29.99  (Source: Amazon.com)
Datel claims Microsoft is violating antitrust laws

Like Apple's campaign against iPhone unlocking, Microsoft has justified trying to kill Xbox 360 modding with claims that it supports piracy or other foul activity.  And like Apple, it has gone to the length of damaging its own customer's legitimately purchased products to try to stomp out modding.

Microsoft, like Apple, is also tightening its control on the hardware, disallowing third party memory units for the Xbox 360.  While its bricking of modded consoles hasn't earned it a lawsuit -- yet -- its decision to kill third party memory units apparently has.

UK-based Datel, which manufactures a third-party memory unit, has filed suit in U.S. District Court in San Francisco, accusing Microsoft of unfairly favoring its own Xbox 360 accessories by disabling the functionality of competing technologies. 

A hard drive or memory unit is necessary to store saves, Gamertag information, or software purchased on Xbox Live, though newer units have a limited amount of internal Flash (512 MB) that can be used for these purposes.

Datel's complaint states, "Microsoft's purpose in disabling Datel's memory cards is to prevent consumers from choosing a Datel product that offers far better value for the price.  There is no benefit to consumers from Microsoft's decision to target and disable Datel's memory cards. To the contrary, Microsoft's actions will leave approximately 50,000 consumers with useless memory cards and (without the ability to access their data on the cards), forestall innovation, and deprive future consumers of the benefits of competition."

The company is seeking unspecified monetary damages and an injunction banning Microsoft from "disabling or erecting technological barriers to Datel accessories."

While Microsoft claims it killed the third-party memory units to protect consumers against cheating, it may have had other motivations, as it stands to bump its own profits by eliminating the third party competition.  Whereas Microsoft's unit is only 512 MB and retails for $29.99, Datel offers a much larger 2 GB unit for only $39.99 and the unit comes with expandable/swappable capacity, via an SD slot.  The company's complaint can be found here (PDF).

Microsoft experienced previous class lawsuits when its consoles damaged discs or failed with the iconic Red Ring of Death (RROD) failure which has reportedly claimed 54.2 percent of the company's consoles over their lifetimes.  Microsoft has also been sued in the past for bricking its customers consoles.



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clairification (fact-check)
By biohazard75 on 11/24/2009 8:49:49 AM , Rating: 2
The newer Xbox360's (manufactured within the past year or so-- since the new dashboard was released) do not need external memory devices to store the user profile; there is 128 or 256 MB of flash memory embedded in the system for that purpose.




RE: clairification (fact-check)
By Brandon Hill (blog) on 11/24/2009 8:57:24 AM , Rating: 5
I thought that the purpose of these things were to easily transport savegames/profiles between Xbox 360s. i.e., taking your card over to a friend's house instead of lugging your entire machine.

I'm just asking because it's been a while since I've used a 360 so I may be a bit fuzzy on this.


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By FITCamaro on 11/24/2009 9:16:36 AM , Rating: 5
Both of you are technically correct.


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By Hiawa23 on 11/24/2009 10:45:56 AM , Rating: 5
Of course MS wants you to buy their mem cards, sounds like business 101, that's what it's all about, it aint about competition for these companies, consumer, yes, but any company wants no comp as they don't want that, & can set prices as they see fit. Look at our health care providers, or energy companies & the strangle hold they have on their industries.

I got a 120GB hdd, & a 256MS mem card which I never even pulled out of the package. I really have no need for a mem card as most of my friends I play online with & none of my 40 & over friends with families come over to play Xbox, but I can see how this may be important to the younger crowd.

I have always supported Datel's products, & looks like they may have a case here, but again, MS has deep pockets, so this will go nowhere. Datel, continue to fight the good fight, though. David meet Goliath......


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By The0ne on 11/24/2009 11:26:59 AM , Rating: 2
If anything, Datel will get some PR out of this. They were, when I was still gaming, one of the best places to shop for games, mods, accessories, etc. I'm actually surprise they're still around! But that's a good thing :D


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By Cypherdude1 on 11/25/2009 12:13:30 AM , Rating: 2
I said previously that Microsoft would be prosecuted for violating anti-trust laws in Europe. Because of the way American politics operate, based on money, I don't expect anything substantial to happen here. But in Europe, things are different. I still expect the European anti-trust prosecutors to file charges against Microsoft for disconnecting third party storage units.


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By weskurtz0081 on 11/25/2009 8:47:57 AM , Rating: 2
And you don't think European politics operate on money?! LMAO!!!!! Maybe you might want to do a little reading on the corruption in European politics, you might find a different reality.


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By steven975 on 11/24/2009 9:34:23 AM , Rating: 4
Yes, but I think MS is concerned with the fact that SD cards can be used, making editing files pretty easy.

Of course, most will assume it is all about money...perhaps it is.


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By scrapsma54 on 11/24/2009 10:20:44 AM , Rating: 3
Not unlikely. This is a power play from microsoft, their publishing department complained about not making MONEY.

Oh how I so loathe corporate greed.


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By Hiawa23 on 11/24/2009 10:58:41 AM , Rating: 5
Oh how I so loathe corporate greed.

You have a point. I agree to a point, I have worked for Goodyear for nearly 13 years & that's as corporate as you can get. All companies are looking at everything in these troubling economic times, so I would not say it's all greed, for most they are trying to weather the storm, but these companies are in business to make money, that's it, it's what keeps me & my 25 employees working, & many of you, that's the only reason. Your numbers start sliding & you will see your corporate officers bringing down the hammer on you, I am sure it's the same at Microsoft, which to me is a MEGA corporation.


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By Oregonian2 on 11/24/2009 1:37:35 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
I am sure it's the same at Microsoft, which to me is a MEGA corporation.


And it's been having MEGA layoffs.


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By Hiawa23 on 11/24/2009 2:14:23 PM , Rating: 3
And it's been having MEGA layoffs.

your point being what, since alot of companies have had layoffs, big & small or gone out of business completely in these tough economic times, & now every expense is under examination. Believe you me, it's the same here at Goodyear.


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By Oregonian2 on 11/25/2009 2:00:13 PM , Rating: 2
Yes, roughly. Despite GM & Chrysler and a lot of megabanks, many still seem to see mega-corp Microsoft as a bottomless pockets company who are greedy when they ever want to make a profit. Big companies are just small ones on a large scale and can go down the tubes just as easily.


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By tastyratz on 11/24/2009 10:26:14 AM , Rating: 2
another fact check.
what the hell can you do with 128 or 256mb of space? Very little. Try downloading any game demo's or ripping music for in game... fact is that space is just enough for bare essentials.

This is just Microsoft attempting to secure a lucrative storage accessory market with significantly overpriced older hardware (dare I say gouging)

I hope this company wins.


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By Reclaimer77 on 11/24/2009 11:02:16 AM , Rating: 3
Okay before I weigh in let me state that I'm not well read on this subject and I don't own a 360.

But how is this any different than the way Apple restricts it's market, or how Sony rules it's proprietary formats with an iron fist ? I'm trying to understand the difference here.

It seems like lately everyone wants to make MS the bad guy when other people get away with doing the same thing.


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By The0ne on 11/24/2009 11:23:43 AM , Rating: 2
To me, it isn't different. I hate it but it's how some companies, unfortunately large ones, decide to do their businesses. A buck is a buck and all of us working in companies or own a company knows that.


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By tastyratz on 11/24/2009 12:28:55 PM , Rating: 2
It's no different.

I side with Microsoft in articles here almost as often as I oppose them based on whether I feel it is right or not.

I don't agree that a company such as Microsoft or ANYONE ELSE should be allowed to conduct business this way.

If the PS3 stopped allowing user thumb drives to back up your data and only allowed Sony branded one you would see my same complaint there.

Don't confuse my argument for Fair use with generic Microsoft bashing.


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By PhoetuS on 11/24/2009 1:11:51 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
But how is this any different than the way Apple restricts it's market, or how Sony rules it's proprietary formats with an iron fist ? I'm trying to understand the difference here.


Apple doesn't restrict the use of peripheral products on their hardware to ONLY Apple brands (i.e. Only use Apple headphones with IPod or Apple External HDDs on Mac computers). Perhaps the closest example I can think of here is restricting the use of all RAM in Mac's to only Apple brand memory, which isn't the case.

Sony has a much more direct parallel to the MS memory card, namely the Memory Stick & the PSP. The MS ban would be the equivalent to Sony banning the use of all 3rd Party Memory Sticks on the PSP. As it is, you can buy and use lots of non-Sony Memory Sticks just fine.


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By The0ne on 11/24/2009 2:19:22 PM , Rating: 2
After presses like this happen of course. Yet, the two main players are Sony and SanDisk, of which SanDisk has better pricing. There's Lexar and there's...wait that's it I beleive. So I wouldn't necessarily say there are "tons" available.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memory_Stick


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By PhoetuS on 11/24/2009 4:01:30 PM , Rating: 2
I agree that there aren't "tons" of alternatives available, but there are alternatives. I also read that wiki & did a newegg search before posting and they both support my original assertion, that there are alternatives to Sony's brand of memory stick.

You say "After presses like this happen of course" and I don't know the Memory Stick history well enough to know if they only opened it up after a similar situation as this article describes or if it was open from the beginning.


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By Johnmcl7 on 11/24/2009 8:26:08 PM , Rating: 3
The big difference though is that Sony Lexar/Sandisk produce memory sticks with license from Sony, whereas I don't believe Microsoft ever officially licensed this Datel product.


RE: clairification (fact-check)
By biohazard75 on 11/24/2009 11:24:29 AM , Rating: 2
True-perhapse, but I was commenting that the original article implied that an external memory device was required to store user profiles, which is no longer correct on newer consoles.

The utility of said embedded memory (for games/demos/etc) was not in question. Don't confuse the issue of console usablilty with other (extended) functions.

If you want/need more storage buy an external storage device. You can say whatever you want about Microsoft's pricing practices for accessories and exclusionary practices at that point.


Opportunity comes a-knockin!
By Sahrin on 11/24/2009 9:41:47 AM , Rating: 5
Please God let this end in an open storage environment where I can dynamically add storage space to my 360 Elite. The blind stupididty of Microsoft in this regard is crippling the platform (not to mention my willingness to spend more on content from them).

This is one situation where the bigoted hatred of Microsoft may pay off: where Apple gets a round of applause for suing its users into complying with its 'great white platform vision for the future' Microsoft may be forced to heel and give consumers the flexibility to do what they want with the hardware they pay for.

No, I don't care if it enables piracy. Every piece of content I own I paid for; I refuse to be treated like a criminal because there are those out there that steal.




RE: Opportunity comes a-knockin!
By StevoLincolnite on 11/24/2009 10:10:16 AM , Rating: 3
I hope Datel succeeds.

Personally I think Microsoft is shooting itself in the foot, take for instance my situation, I originally got myself an Arcade console, quickly finding out that the 256mb memory card is not ample storage for downloading Xbox Live! content. (Although Xbox Live! works fine, I just can't download anything large).

So, I jumped on the 20gb HDD for $20 AU offer that Microsoft had going back then, again I filled this drive up with Games on Demand/Map Packs/Arcade Games/Various other DLC very quickly. - So I sold the 20gb drive for $15, and picked up a 60gb HDD for a staggering $149. (Seriously folks, I could get a 1 Terabyte HDD for less than that fricken' price!)

I have spent Hundreds of dollars on Arcade Games and Games on Demand Games, living out in the country sometimes it's my only option when it comes to game purchases, however...

... Microsoft is LIMITING the amount of Purchases I can buy, so in the end I cannot buy games or other DLC which will give them profit, because instead they think we should pay $199 for a 120gb HDD, which is day-light robbery.

In the end, I think they are have the train of thought that we should be buying Multiple 120gb HDD's for our storage needs, don't get me wrong the Xbox 360 despite all it's flaws is a very enjoyable platform. (My 1 year old Falcon Console just got the E 74 error yesterday).


RE: Opportunity comes a-knockin!
By mcnabney on 11/24/2009 10:25:44 AM , Rating: 5
Don't get upset, but you are the perfect customer for Microsoft. You might gripe and complain, but you won't walk. When a company/vendor does something to piss me off I cease being a customer. I also don't game on consoles since I prefer a more open standard.


RE: Opportunity comes a-knockin!
By The0ne on 11/24/2009 11:25:07 AM , Rating: 2
Greed comes in many forms and is hella strong with gamers :) But like you said, the simplest thing to do is do without a console you hate. Life is not going to end because you don't have it :D


By StevoLincolnite on 11/24/2009 10:24:58 PM , Rating: 2
I'll eventually walk one day if they don't get the failure issues under-control, next time I might just end up going with Sony.


RE: Opportunity comes a-knockin!
By DFranch on 11/24/2009 12:30:55 PM , Rating: 2
The 120GB drive is not $200. I bought one last year for $135. It is still a rip off though. I'd love to drop a 1TB drive on my X-box. My Brother is still using the 20GB drive but refuses to pay that much for a 120GB upgrade. You are absolutely right they are shooting themselves in the foot by limiting how much content people can download.


By StevoLincolnite on 11/24/2009 10:27:44 PM , Rating: 2
Read my Post again, I said AU - That's "Australian" Currency, not American. - I can assure you a 120gb HDD -is- $199 here, and the Arcade console is selling around the $299 mark.


RE: Opportunity comes a-knockin!
By Hiawa23 on 11/24/2009 12:35:32 PM , Rating: 2
Please God let this end in an open storage environment where I can dynamically add storage space to my 360 Elite.

Honestly, I don't think God cares how much space you have on your 360, & come on, you know this open storage environment isn't going to happen, not for the 360. Too much money, & MS has to have a top notch legal team.

Makes for good discussion & those of you who keep complaining, about MS being greedy, tell us what company isnt, I don't think it's going to change.

Personally, I have the 120GB drive, I can't even fill that up other than game installs which can be deleted, re-installed at the drop of a hat. I also have a 120 GB drive on my PS3 with nearly 90GBs empty, so most folks don't even need all the extra space. If you want open storage get a PS3 cause that's the only way you are going to get GOLIATH's attention, or continuing whining about it, while they sit on their perch looking down on you.


RE: Opportunity comes a-knockin!
By FITCamaro on 11/24/2009 12:53:14 PM , Rating: 2
I have the Elite as well. Don't have any space problems.

However, for users who want to download videos, TV shows, and movies, you definitely can have space issues. This is why I think Microsoft should support USB hard drives. Hell even encrypt the son of a b*tch so the data can't be read except for on a 360. Just give people the ability to expand their storage without having to pay huge amounts of money for paltry amounts of space. I mean you can get a 1.5TB hard drive right now for $100 and a 120GB one from MS will run you more than that.

And I have a PS3 with a 250GB hard drive in it and it hasn't been turned on to play games in over 6 months.


RE: Opportunity comes a-knockin!
By The0ne on 11/24/2009 2:40:56 PM , Rating: 2
That is a sad sight with your PS3 :/


RE: Opportunity comes a-knockin!
By Reclaimer77 on 11/24/2009 3:58:02 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
That is a sad sight with your PS3 :/


What's sad is lack of compelling titles to actually PLAY on the PS3.


RE: Opportunity comes a-knockin!
By The0ne on 11/25/2009 2:54:22 PM , Rating: 2
Hence why I don't own the xbox or ps3 yet and rely on my PC mainly and Wii from time to time. FF13 and Gran Turismo might have a chance to convert me however but we'll see. FFXIV will definitely convert me but it's on PC so no deal there.


RE: Opportunity comes a-knockin!
By ekv on 11/25/2009 3:39:22 AM , Rating: 2
I just got the $99 1.5TB drive. Can't really afford it, but when you couple that w/ "super saver" shipping ... it's a no-brainer. [Besides, the 3TB RAID 5 was getting a little slim 8]

Your point about
quote:
users who want to download videos, TV shows, and movies
is so totally spot-on it's amazing. MSFT is trying to make the 360 into an HTPC type of platform, the veritable center-piece of a family entertainment appliance. Well, duh, it takes storage to do that. So to get the storage, would you resort to modding? Some would. [I don't use the 360 enough to justify such a commitment]. I suspect AES encryption on the 360 would be plenty fast.

I hope MSFT realizes that if they relax a bit, the market will actually help them out. [Kind of like the Laffer curve, where lower taxes means more actual revenue, if you know what I mean].


Cheating?
By PhoetuS on 11/24/2009 9:37:24 AM , Rating: 4
Maybe I am missing something here, but I don't understand how killing support for 3rd party memory cards "Protects consumers from Cheating."

Seems to me the only thing it does is limit consumers to MS own overpriced memory cards.




RE: Cheating?
By JasonMick (blog) on 11/24/2009 9:41:13 AM , Rating: 2
Microsoft's premise/excuse is that many of these third party memory units store data on SD cards, which can be easily read and modified on your computer, allowing you to cheat by modifying them, if you know how (or have a utility to).

Of course, blocking third party units also promises to bring in more money for Microsoft, too.


RE: Cheating?
By VultureTX on 11/24/2009 10:53:37 AM , Rating: 2
wait! Can you not just use a $10 adapter cable or the right tools to hook up your Xbox360 Hard drive to any SATA enabled PC?
The Xbox hard Drive saves game data just like the memory cards and the utilities for copying Xbox hard drives have been out for years.

So how did this MS memory unit ban stop a method of cheating? Unless it was the target the people who could not afford a hard drive for their Xbox.


RE: Cheating?
By bob4432 on 11/26/2009 2:18:54 AM , Rating: 2
yep, if you take the hdd apart and remove the actual hdd, it is just a regular 2.5" hdd, nothing special - not special connectors, just a regular 2.5" sata hdd.


Dear Microsoft...
By crazyblackman on 11/24/2009 9:31:47 PM , Rating: 3
Please keep ripping your customers off on faulty hardware and your overpriced online service and your extremely overpriced peripherals!

They absolutely deserve it.




RE: Dear Microsoft...
By crazyblackman on 11/24/2009 9:47:56 PM , Rating: 3
The PS3..."Everything you need is right in the box". "It just does everything"!!!

The Xbox360... "You can have a little taste now, but it WILL cost you later..."It's got crack cocaine in it"!!!


Hmmm
By Makaveli on 11/24/2009 8:41:40 AM , Rating: 1
And it begins.....




RE: Hmmm
By FATCamaro on 11/24/2009 10:02:01 AM , Rating: 1
Can you imagine the waaah waaah crying if this was Apple or Sony?


Does this really block cheating?
By adrift02 on 11/24/2009 11:00:21 AM , Rating: 2
While I see how cards like this allow unsigned code (Wii twilight hack), wouldn't someone still need to mod their console to utilize a cheat in a game? I would think that they would still need some sort of console hack to execute the code properly in-game like with the Wii. If that's the case then M$ is going to have some trouble justifying this. After all, they seem to be doing just fine detecting/banning consoles which are modded.




By BoFox on 11/28/2009 5:13:38 AM , Rating: 2
1) Microsoft blocks out 3rd-party memory.

2) Datel says "No, or we'll sue."

3) Microsoft says, "Heh, let's bring it on! Let's see if you'll bleed dry with those lawyer/court fees!"

4) Datel and Microsoft go to court. Both spend millions $$.

Possible output:

A) Datel wins and earns some "damage $$" (which more than makes up for the litigation fees). Datel then continues selling chips.

B) Microsoft wins. Microsoft then continues selling chips, but would the profit ever make up for those court fees (millions of $$)?

If MS wins, would it actually be worth it for M$? Just to prevent a few hackers from playing with their XBOXes while pissing off 100's of thousands of customers?

Heck, M$ should just let Datel make those "hack-proof" chips with the same security code or whatever, if M$ is really telling the truth. Otherwise, Datel wins (unless M$ can prove that M$ offered to let Datel also make those new chips and that Datel declined).




What's wrong, Microsoft?
By themaster08 on 11/26/2009 3:22:15 AM , Rating: 1
What is it with Microsoft? Does it have bipolar disorder or something?

How is it that in the OS market they are growing so open and in-touch with their user base, offering a value for money, excellent product, whilst at the same time using Apple-like tactics on their user base to fuck them up the ass in the console market?

All these excuses about piracy and cheating. Whlst that may be true to some extent, it's nothing a little encryption couldn't solve. Everyone here knows what's really going on. The more people buy these ludicrously priced peripherals, the more Microsoft is inclined to continue fucking the ass of it's customers until we all take a stand.

Whilst I love Windows, I will never buy an Xbox 360. Especially not now.




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