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Stephen Elop (L) and Steve Ballmer (R)  (Source: Reuters)
Stephen Elop will become Nokia Executive Vice President of Devices & Services

Well, can't say we didn't see this one coming. When Nokia poached former Microsoft executive Steven Elop for the CEO job back in 2010, many speculated that Nokia's mobile division would one day fall under the wide umbrella of Redmond, Washington-based giant (with Elop being the Trojan Horse). It looks as though those musings were correct and Microsoft announced this evening that it is purchasing Nokia's Devices and Services Unit for a whopping $7.2 billion ($5 billion for D&S, $2.2 billion to license Nokia's patents for 10 years).
 
With this acquisition, Microsoft will gain 32,000 Nokia employees. In addition, the transaction will be finalized during the first quarter of 2014.
 
Steve Ballmer, who will soon be on the way out the door as Microsoft's CEO, was quite ecstatic about the purchase. "It's a bold step into the future - a win-win for employees, shareholders and consumers of both companies. Bringing these great teams together will accelerate Microsoft's share and profits in phones, and strengthen the overall opportunities for both Microsoft and our partners across our entire family of devices and services," said Ballmer.
 
"In addition to their innovation and strength in phones at all price points, Nokia brings proven capability and talent in critical areas such as hardware design and engineering, supply chain and manufacturing management, and hardware sales, marketing and distribution."


Nokia Lumia 1020
 
While Stephen Elop has been sitting atop the Nokia food chain as CEO for the past three years, he will leave the title behind to become Nokia Executive Vice President of Devices & Services within Microsoft's loving arms.
 
"Building on our successful partnership, we can now bring together the best of Microsoft's software engineering with the best of Nokia's product engineering, award-winning design, and global sales, marketing and manufacturing," said Elop. "With this combination of talented people, we have the opportunity to accelerate the current momentum and cutting-edge innovation of both our smart devices and mobile phone products."

In a letter to the troops obtained by The Verge, Ballmer explained Elop's role in a little more detail (it looks as though Elop will be brushing shoulders with Julie Larson-Green):

1. Stephen Elop will be coming back to Microsoft, and he will lead an expanded Devices team, which includes all of our current Devices and Studios work and most of the teams coming over from Nokia, reporting to me.

2. Julie Larson-Green will continue to run the Devices and Studios team, and will be focused on the big launches this fall including Xbox One and our Surface enhancements. Julie will be joining Stephen's team once the acquisition closes, and will work with him to shape the new organization.


Slide presentation of Microsoft's motives for acquiring Nokia [Courtesy Microsoft]
 
With Microsoft now taking the driver's seat with Nokia's devices division, all of the folks wishing to see Google's Android operating system on Nokia hardware have likely just seen their dreams go up in smoke. However, Microsoft now has the luxury of having both hardware and software under one roof (a la Apple) in an effort to claw back some market share in the smartphone sector.
 
It's no fun when there are just two players taking up the lion's share of the smartphone market (iOS and Android), so we’ll eagerly wait to see if Microsoft can double down on its mobile efforts at the same time that BlackBerry is contemplating becoming a "niche company"...

But with that out of the way, who wants to place bets on Stephen Elop as the next CEO of Microsoft come Q1 2014?

Sources: Nokia [1], [2], Microsoft



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Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By flyingpants1 on 9/3/13, Rating: 0
RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By juhatus on 9/3/2013 2:02:17 AM , Rating: 4
flyingpants1: ever used WP8 or even WP7.8? what core apps and functionality is missing??

IOS felt so old after using even 7.8. I miss live tiles, I miss the integration of chat/messages/phone, everything needs a app on IOS when most of the needed functions already was on Lumia 800.

Cant change from iphone right now because of employer. *sigh*


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Samus on 9/3/2013 4:32:05 AM , Rating: 5
I agree. WP8 is awesome. People who talk trash about it generally have no experience with it.

WP8's problem isn't apps or functionality. It has all the same popular apps as iOS and Android. Niche product functionality like bluetooth accessories might not have support (Pebble smartwatch doesn't, but the upcoming Agent smartwatch does...)

...but that's about it.

It has Nokia Here and Google Maps, the two best map/navigation platforms in existence.

It has Facebook and all that crap.

It has an excellent camera/video app (and usually a good camera lens to back it up)

It has Exchange Activesync support (obviously)

It sync's with Google, iCloud, Dropbox, Hotmail/Outlook (obviously)

Nokia hardware is tits.

The problem is bad marketing. Hopefully Microsoft can turn it around because like Palm, they have a great product. But we all know what happened to Palm (other than HP) when they couldn't market a great product :(


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By TakinYourPoints on 9/3/2013 4:57:06 AM , Rating: 3
Software is the main thing WP is lacking. Its a much bigger issue than things like specific hardware incompatibilities, and Microsoft knows it given how much money they've thrown at developers in the past. Google won't make apps for it and developers would rather make money on iOS. WP's live tiles and UI are great, but for someone who uses a lot of apps its too much of a tradeoff. If you don't use many apps then obviously it doesn't matter.

Its a shame since aside from having a great UI, WP also has an excellent SDK. Its probably the best mobile SDK out there, much better than Apple's or Google's. A platform needs to be profitable for developers though, and you need users for that. Developers may make a small fraction from Android than what they make on iOS, but its still enough to justify development. The best SDK in the world doesn't help when WP marketshare in in the single digit percentages.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By damianrobertjones on 9/3/2013 8:06:12 AM , Rating: 3
"Software is the main thing WP is lacking"

Which software?


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By retrospooty on 9/3/13, Rating: 0
RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By othercents on 9/3/2013 8:38:48 AM , Rating: 2
Chicken and Egg.

Developers won't write for WP8 until there are enough WP8 users that can offset the cost of producing the application. People won't purchase WP8 until there are enough big ticket games available on WP8.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Mitch101 on 9/3/2013 11:12:53 AM , Rating: 3
There are enough Windows Phone users for any developer to get into the mix at this point they would be stupid or being paid not to port their app. But there are plenty of alternatives and why is google so worried about Windows Phone? If they aren't worried they why do they continually block the phone from Google services? Simple they know Windows Phone is growing and they are being anti-competitive.

http://www.wpcentral.com/kantar-windows-phone-hitt...

Kantar Worldpanel - July 2013 Windows Phone Share by country
•Germany: 8.8% (+2.6% YoY)
•GB: 9.2% (+5% YoY)
•France: 11% (+7.4% YoY)
•Italy: 7.8% (-0.5% YoY)
•Spain: 1.8% (+0.1% YoY)
•USA: 3.5% (+0.5% YoY)
•China: 2.4% (-2.2% YoY)
•Australia: 7.4% (+2.4% YoY)
•Mexico: 12.5% (+10.5% YoY)

"Windows Phone's success has been in convincing first time smartphone buyers to choose one of its devices with 42 percent of sales over the past year coming from existing featurephone owners. This is a much higher proportion than Android and iOS. The Lumia 520 is hitting a sweet spot, offering the price and quality that new smartphone buyers are looking for."

Windows Phone still struggles a bit in the hyper competitive US market, it has shown explosive growth in numerous countries, including Mexico, France and Great Britain

Android fell from 58.7 percent to 51.1 percent of US sales.

Queue the Reclaimer, Retro, Cheeze FUD.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Reclaimer77 on 9/3/2013 5:40:50 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
But there are plenty of alternatives and why is google so worried about Windows Phone? If they aren't worried they why do they continually block the phone from Google services? Simple they know Windows Phone is growing and they are being anti-competitive.


Speaking of FUD. This is a typical opinion from a Windows Phone user who wants to make this personal, but it's just silly.

Google doesn't care WHO uses their services, they get paid either way. It doesn't make any sense that Google would be "worried" Windows Phone users would use their products. That really makes sense to you, in your mind? Honestly? Google wants the maximum number of people using their apps/services, regardless of what they are using it on!

If Google has an enemy, it's Apple. And yet Google has no problem profiting greatly from iOS users and releasing apps for that platform. In fact they just released Google Now for iOS. I repeat, Google Now, THE signature Android feature, is available for iOS.

That theory is so illogical and biased, it defies reality. I know impassioned Windows Phone users are pulling the underdog card, claiming Google is singling them out and being "anti-competitive". But the simple fact is Windows Phone does NOT have the user base to warrant app development. That is why you don't see an official YouTube app.

As far as the quote from the clearly NOT biased site, "WPCentral", umm okay? Would you like me to counter with an equally biased quote from AndroidHQ or whatever?

quote:
Queue the Reclaimer, Retro, Cheeze FUD.


Still immature and trollish, but at least you didn't make one of your awesome penis jokes or whatever. That's improvement. Maybe one day you can make a post without having to constantly mention other posters just because they don't agree with you.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By nikon133 on 9/3/2013 6:06:08 PM , Rating: 2
That is not true.

Google is pretty much blocking anyone to create YouTube app of same standards like those on iPhone and Android. There were articles here on DT, search.

True iOS platform is bigger competitor to Android right now. But iOS already have that many users Google doesn't want to miss on.

Number of WP users is much lower, so Google seems to see them as acceptable collateral.

In addition, WP philosophy is much closer to Android. Both are based on standard platform with OEM support. Google can expect that Apple will not release really cheap iPhone, which - in worst case scenario - gives Google big chunk of market for themselves only, even if it is low-margins chunk of market.

But WP is fighting for that chunk, and quite well - cheap Lumias, IMHO, are among the nicest smartphones for the money; at least here in NZ. For the price of Lumia 520, for example, you can get Samsung Galaxy Flame. Compare specs; no contest.

And then, WP has great potential in business market segment, where it can easily integrate with Microsoft's ecosystem. Even if it hasn't yet, it is all but given it will happen.

This, I believe, is what Google is trying to prevent from happening. iPhone already happened. Not much Google can do there without hurting themselves.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Reclaimer77 on 9/3/2013 6:21:23 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
There were articles here on DT, search.


Yes, I have. Articles that proceed from the false premise that Google is singling out Windows Phone or being "anti-competitive". When no such proof exists.

quote:
Number of WP users is much lower, so Google seems to see them as acceptable collateral.


Again, that makes no sense. Do you understand that Google makes their profit from services used, NOT so much from handset sales?

Google didn't get to where they are today by chopping off their nose to spite their face, but that's the fictional scenario you people are creating.

Also the idea that someone at Google thinks they can "keep Windows Phone down" by denying YouTube is such a hack line of thinking. That's not how things really work. There's LOTS of app developers ignoring Windows Phone, Google is just the biggest, but they're hardly alone.

It just seems like a fanboi-driven issue that's not chocked full of facts and logic.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Monkey's Uncle on 9/3/2013 6:35:44 PM , Rating: 1
The reason there is no youtube app of similar quality to those found in Android and Apple stores is that no developer has been arsed to write one for WP.

As an (ex) software developer, I would not be interested in writing apps that caters to 10 or 15% of the world smartphone/tablet market (and I would want both - not one or the other).

I am much more interested in writing an app targeted where the real money is - the larger 85-90% audiences. If I have the time to invest in that other 15%, I will get around to it when I get bored. I would not be in a hurry since I will be far too busy keeping my main market happy.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By a5cent on 9/4/2013 4:54:20 AM , Rating: 3
You are clueless.

There are at least two YouTube apps on WP that at least rival the quality of the official clients on iOS and Android. MetroTube and MyTube. I personally prefer MetroTube over the official Android YT client.

That you are no longer a developer is also obvious, otherwise you would know that WP is, on average, the second most profitable mobile OS to write apps for. More than enough studies exist on the matter which Google can surface. Targeting iOS offers the highest profit potential by far, but average earnings on Android are low compared to WP. The main factors are the ability to still get your app seen on WP (easier to market) and the culture (WP and iOS users don't expect all apps to be free).


By a5cent on 9/4/2013 4:56:07 AM , Rating: 2
Sorry Nikon133, my reply was to Monkey's Uncle.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By inighthawki on 9/3/2013 11:08:39 AM , Rating: 3
You mean the million apps on ios and android, 999,950 of which are utterly worthless?


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Mitch101 on 9/3/2013 11:30:27 AM , Rating: 3
I love how 160,000 Windows Phone apps isn't enough? I have 6-7 (Nokia Maps (EXCELLENT), Facebook, Movie Times, Netflix, Pandora, Skype, etc) I use regularly and maybe 30 apps in total Ive used in the last year. I had more on my previous phone but I never used a lot of them so I just didn't bother to install them on my new phone. That leaves 159,970 more I don't seem to have a need for but that's suffering somehow if I don't have 500,000 fart, flashlight, Malware infected, and cheap clone apps to choose from.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 11:50:06 AM , Rating: 2
ITs not quantity , its quality. Like I said - You cant possibly act like WP has anywhere near the app support. When great games or apps come out, its geneerally on IOS and Android and WP, is a "maybe later, maybe never" deal.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Mitch101 on 9/3/2013 12:10:18 PM , Rating: 2
Sure they are going to go with the largest user base first for maximum sales first then trickle to second and third marketshare but it makes its rounds to Windows Phone or copy cat applications make it there and the original company starts to lose out to competitor apps.

There is nothing more I want to do on my Windows Phone. I was forced to upgrade because I wanted a better camera not because of anything to do with Apps. I would still be using my single core 800mhz windows phone because it was rock solid but after 2 years I wanted a better camera. Something I cant ever say about any Android device I have ever owned. Sorry I see no need to give up on Windows Phone its rock solid and does everything I want. Im not falling for the you don't understand Android is much better now tricks any more they had their chance and Android continues to fail to make me a believer.

Its why many people are staying with iPhones its because they see no benefit to getting an Android when their stuff works perfectly fine for them.

If its not broke don't fix it.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 12:18:01 PM , Rating: 2
"There is nothing more I want to do on my Windows Phone. I was forced to upgrade because I wanted a better camera not because of anything to do with Apps..."

I see your point, and it works for you and that is great. Like I said, its a good OS. The thing is apps do matter to alot of people and that IS a weakpoint for WP period.

"If its not broke don't fix it"

That is a very good point and I am glad you said it. For you, its not broke. WP works great for you. For MS/Nokia, it IS broken . At the end of last quarter WP8 in total from all makers was at 4% worldwide marketshare.

- The OS is good.
- The hardware is behind (although, it looks like in the next few months it will catch up)
- The apps are behind.

That isn't enough to gain mass marketshare. They have to give users something compelling for large amounts of users to switch and they haven't done that. It is good and you like it, but you have to admit you are in the minority.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Mitch101 on 9/3/2013 12:37:52 PM , Rating: 3
Later this year they get 1080p and quad core processors for those who live and die by specs but its not needed.

The OS is so well optimized and smooth already. My old 800mhz single core was fluid and only the camera was holding it back. The single core CPU was never an issue for the device.

Nobody needs quad cores. Words with Friends and the same games found on Android run on the dual cores of iPhone and Windows Phone just fine. Quad and Octo cores coming might make sense on a tablet for video editing but otherwise are not needed. Using more advanced CPU's only makes sense if they can consume less power and extend battery life.

Ive never rebooted my Windows Phone ever in what now 3 years? Thats not good thats incredible.

Nokia has already surpassed everyone with thier camera and optics nothing comes close. Your phone goes everywhere and having the best camera ever is a huge plus.

Any Apps missing from any deverloper is just a missed opportunity for them and allows thier competitors and clone makers an opportunity to become the new standard. I havent found one I needed that exists on any other device.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 12:49:05 PM , Rating: 1
I agree, most people really dont need a quad core, but on a 5 inch or more screen, you DO need more than 720/768p. Anyhow both are coming, so good... You don't need to convince me, you need to convince millions and millions of normal end users to buy it.

Good luck.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Mitch101 on 9/3/2013 2:01:50 PM , Rating: 2
I never found myself saying I cant make out this word because of the darn resolution. Its fine I read everything on the screen fine. Its got plenty of detail. I have not seen a case where having a higher resolution on a 5" screen helped in any way. By all means If you think you have a definitive use where 1080p offers something necessary on a 5" screen over 720 lets see it. Please provide visual proof of the benefit. I could be wrong but I just haven't see the proof yet.


By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 2:24:14 PM , Rating: 2
I dont want to get into a whole separate debate about res. This thread isnt even about res. Boiled down it depends on your eyes. 300-350PPI is fine for most people, some can still see pixels (I can at 300-350 and cannot at over 420PPI) but at 5 inches, 1280x720 is only 293PPI and getting low. 5.5 at 280x720 is only 267PPI. If your eyes cant detect it, then dont worry about it, some can... It's a moot point anyhow, as WP is getting 1920x1080 phones very soon. It's good for the platform, good for competition, and good for users with good eyesight. Bad for... No-one. It's one less reason for some people to not buy WP, so its a win for your platform. +1


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By BZDTemp on 9/3/2013 12:18:23 PM , Rating: 3
The thing is that you are not seeing all the great stuff that comes on the WP platform when looking for the apps for the other platforms. At the best you're seeing cross platform titles, but that is only part of the story.

If you're a Mac guy then you may not even know of PaintShopPro, but that is not the same as it not being a great program. Just as when you're a Windows person you may be doing your software development with Visual Studio, but that is not the same as there being no great development tools for a Mac (even if you don't know it's name).


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 12:38:46 PM , Rating: 2
"The thing is that you are not seeing all the great stuff that comes on the WP platform when looking for the apps for the other platforms."

Point taken, I am sure there are some good apps, but there are also alot of good ones missing. MS doesn't need to convince me or people like me, they need to convince millions and millions of normal end users to buy it. So far they have not and I dont see anything in WP8 or with Nokia's lineup that will do it. Maybe if WP9 adds something compelling and some better future hardware it will sell better. We'll have to wait and see.


By Mitch101 on 9/3/2013 2:13:20 PM , Rating: 2
Sales are outpacing new smartphone user growth and taking market share from others. That has resulted in selling millions as more people use them they will understand too.

Its not like the Android vs one size fits all iPhone. Android had it easy to become the leader. Microsoft has two major players one in the one size fits all with a heavy following and something more nimble like the Android device market. So the pace is slower but its still gaining.

The great pyramids weren't built overnight it took time and Microsoft has time.

Lets not forget when Android wins so does Microsoft through licensing.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By BSMonitor on 9/3/2013 4:02:23 PM , Rating: 3
Because almost everyone who has chosen an Android phone makes that choice for the NFC, customization nonsense, Quad cores, big low PPI screens (until this year).. etc.. All those nifty features you continually rant about...

** Not because it was the first iPhone alternative with cheaper variants.... Which is still by far and away the vast majority of Android market share. **

Better future hardware. Such as??

NFC?? Customizing widgets?? Quad core ARM?? Crap, crap, crap.. I'll take 41MP, low light camera and Wireless charging over any of that crap.

Whooo, my Chrome flies on my smart phone quad cores!


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 4:06:39 PM , Rating: 2
What are you 12 year old?

What does any of that have to do with WP sales (which is the topic the grown ups are discussing here)?

Care to chime in on what you think MS needs to do to get the ball rolling on WP sales, or are you content just acting like a jr. high school dropout?



RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By BSMonitor on 9/3/2013 4:19:46 PM , Rating: 1
Weird, disagree with Retro and he calls you a child. Sink to his level, and you are a troll.

Easy, fanboy. Sales alone aren't the end all.

You think for one second Google wouldn't swap market share numbers for Apple's margins??

Bum bum, owned again.


By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 4:25:52 PM , Rating: 2
"Weird, disagree with Retro and he calls you a child"

You didn't disagree with me. You didn't say a single thing about the topic at hand. You want on some odd rant about a totally unrelated topic... And yes, you did in a very childish manor and have been doing it all day http://www.dailytech.com/CommentUser.aspx?user=238...

"You think for one second Google wouldn't swap market share numbers for Apple's margins??"

Of course they would, but much like your rant above, that isn't the topic at hand either.... Read carefully. Windows Phone 8 is the topic.

"Bum bum, owned again"

Again? You haven't made a single point. It's not that your point was right or wrong, or even not fully explained... You didnt even try to make a point. I have been nothing but patient with you, but I am done.

Enjoy your care-free childhood. When you grow up you may understand.


By nikon133 on 9/3/2013 5:50:40 PM , Rating: 3
I think it is really down to exposure. Almost everyone I know nowadays have smartphone, and I cannot think of anyone who is really heavy on using anything beside built-in apps. Me included. Sure I will fire up a game when waiting for my wife to finish shopping, but I haven't and will not purchase smartphone because of specific app/game availability.

Granted, majority of people I know are well above 30... so my observation might not be as applicable on younger users... but still.

I know only one person who purchased a tablet for specific app, and he is a bit of a special case.

However, a lot of people will purchase phone based on what they see their friends are using, and what their friends recommend to them. Since WP started last, with market already well saturated by iPhones and Androids, this is a huge handicap.


By Motoman on 9/3/2013 12:44:11 PM , Rating: 4
Please.

"But there's eighty-bajillion apps on the Apple App store!"

Who cares? There's a few dozen that any given person is going to have any real interest in, and the rest are all variations on fart jokes.


By flatrock on 9/3/2013 12:20:52 PM , Rating: 2
A lot of little things like a banking app for my credit union. They have both iOS and Android versions.

Not as many games. Apps aren't going to get updated as often or have as much functionality simply because the Windows Phone market is so much smaller. It's hard to play catch up. Microsoft has a better chance than RIM simply because they have deeper pockets.

I would like to see Windows Phone succeed, but I think my next phone will run Android. I don't have the patience to deal with less mainstream products like I used to.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By StevoLincolnite on 9/3/2013 4:57:13 AM , Rating: 5
I personally have a Nokia Lumia 920 myself, love Windows Phone 8, heck there is very little I can fault with it.

However, with that said I do find some more obscure apps not being available to be rather annoying.
For instance, No official Steam app (The unofficial ones don't work for me), My bank doesn't have an app nor does my local radio station to stream music from on Windows Phone, but I expected that when I got the phone. (I actually thought I would loose out allot more in the apps department!)

On Android it wouldn't have been a problem with the Radio, I would just download a flash player.

Still everyone who has played with my phone has liked it, even a few people even went out and bought one.
The funny part is, you see the Phones rather often in TV shows, just no one knows what they are, which comes down to marketing.

On the OS side, I *so* want Tethering support out of the box, my phone was essentially a brick for a few days until I got a Wireless router and a Sim card for it! :P


By StevoLincolnite on 9/3/2013 4:57:32 AM , Rating: 2
Er. Tethering support over USB rather*


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Reclaimer77 on 9/3/2013 9:23:07 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
People who talk trash about it generally have no experience with it.


Oh look it's another Jason Mick, who has a kneejerk defensive reaction and classifies all arguments against Windows Phone as "trash talking".

quote:
It has all the same popular apps as iOS and Android.


This is a lie and you need to stop repeating it. Lying doesn't help advance your cause at all, so why bother?

Instagram? Candy Crush Saga? Temple Run 2? Youtube? To name a few.

The most popular apps in the world are either absent on Windows Phone or come WAY later than Android or iOS. This isn't cool, and you would look a lot less biased if you would acknowledge that fact. Or is facts "trash talking" too?


By a5cent on 9/4/2013 6:03:22 AM , Rating: 3
@Reclaimer77

It's ironic that we can now find more Instagram apps on WP than on any other platform. 6tagram is not developed by Facebook/Instagram, but it is endorsed by them, making it the official Instagram app for WP. The argument that WP lacks a YouTube app is even more disingenuous. Those that exist are just as good if not better than their iOS and Android counterparts. Your negative opinion of WP's app situation is extreme, and like any extreme opinion, it is false.

With the exception of games, almost all the big name apps that exist for both iOS and Android are also available on WP. Anyone denying this is just ignorant.

Games are a different story. WP is missing some of the very popular games from other platforms. However, WP also has its own collection of exclusive time wasters. The selection isn't as good as it could be, it is adequate, but if you're the type that wants the latest flavour-of-the-day game, then you will find WP's selection lacking. This too is changing however. Gameloft will publish its upcoming games simultaneously for all three platforms. Cross platform game engines like Unity make this this economically feasable, despite WP's low market share.

The problem with WP's app selection is no longer where you WP detractors are making it out to be. It's with the smaller apps that are developed for smaller markets. A small local credit union, your states most popular factory outlet, your countries most prominent cultural event organizer. That type of thing. These institutions don't earn anything with their apps. It's not a core part of their business strategy and reaching 90% of smartphone users is good enough for them. Nothing short of a much larger market share will solve this problem however, but the problems people like you imagine to exist have largely been solved are will be solved shortly.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Visual on 9/3/2013 6:56:08 AM , Rating: 1
How about a battery monitor app? Detailed power usage statistics?
Hell, even a clock tile that does not have also stupid weather forecasts and whatnot other battery-draining crap on it?
Nope. No luck.
And even 3rd party developers can't provide good solutions for those, because of stupid live-tile update restrictions. An app can not update its tile more often that X minutes, and not at all if there is no network... WTF, why would a battery tile require a network?

How about a home screen organization that actually allows you to group things and separate things?
How about a file browser?
How about a usable bluetooth file transfer interface?
How about an email client that can handle more than one account of the same type?
How about contextual volume control instead of a single global one?
How about a decent music player with some features my 15 year old noname had, like folder-based navigation, playlist editing without going online, lyrics display?


By ctodd on 9/3/2013 8:37:39 AM , Rating: 2
Wow, they haven't fixed the volume control issue in 8? That was a major bummer for me in 7 & 7.5! Also, would have liked a virtual volume rocker like every other os has!! Apps was an issue for me, but my grips were more with the functional things that Apple did better. My wife took the phone and liked it; however, it freaked out twice (once requiring a factory reset) and she hasn't looked back since. Could have been just the Samsung hardware.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By datdamonfoo on 9/3/2013 10:30:01 AM , Rating: 2
Can you explain the email client thing? I had three email accounts on my windows phone client, two gmail, one comcast (no longer have comcast, though), and they all worked fine.


By Visual on 9/3/2013 10:53:36 AM , Rating: 2
Well it did not let me add a second gmail account, but I last tried that back when my X8 was brand new. Maybe they have fixed it since.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By jeepga on 9/3/2013 8:12:39 AM , Rating: 2
Well said. I wouldn't touch an iPhone. And I cannot wait until my contract is up to dump Android.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Zingam on 9/3/13, Rating: -1
By a5cent on 9/4/2013 6:12:17 AM , Rating: 2
I found it superior to Google's hell.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By althaz on 9/3/2013 2:13:55 AM , Rating: 2
Surface lost less than $1B, so at least get your facts straight. Moreover, Windows Phone has by miles the highest customer satisfaction ratings of all the major smartphone platforms.

Keeping customers isn't an issue, its attracting new ones.

The app availablitiy criticism is also well wide of the mark. There's a lot of stuff missing from the WP app store, but it's not the core apps (virtually all the most popular apps are on Windows Phone and in many cases - eg: Facebook, Drive and IMDB for example - they are far better than on other platforms) it's all the rest of the apps.

IMO The problem with Windows Phone is the incredibly slow development cycle. At first things were updated rapidly in WP7, now it seems like nothing has basically changed since the launch of WP8 - which didn't change much either.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By inighthawki on 9/3/2013 2:20:34 AM , Rating: 1
A lot of Windows Phone 8 was under the hood. For example, moving the kernel to the NT kernel from WinCE. They also improved the development environment (support for DirectX11, and native code, for example). I have no doubt that "Windows Phone Blue" will also help unify the experience between phones tablets and PCs more.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Reclaimer77 on 9/3/2013 2:51:27 AM , Rating: 2
Yes it will "unify" the experience with using phones nobody likes and nobody buys, Surface tablets that nobody buys, and Windows 8 that everyone dislikes and nobody buys.

Brilliant strategy!


By captainBOB on 9/3/2013 5:42:51 AM , Rating: 2
I use Windows 8, there goes your nobody.

Why? Client Hyper-V and Storage Spaces to name a few.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Krotchrot on 9/3/2013 9:51:19 AM , Rating: 3
"Windows 8 that everyone dislikes and nobody buys."

"This is a lie and you need to stop repeating it. Lying doesn't help advance your cause at all, so why bother?"

Hypocrite much?


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 10:15:46 AM , Rating: 2
"No-one is buying it". It's not literal, it means that not many people are buying it.

Unless you can explain how a 2% install base and 4% sales is significant.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Mitch101 on 9/3/2013 11:54:55 AM , Rating: 2
Is google search not an option on Android Phones? I used Google to find some fact before commenting.

Windows 8 rockets to 7.41% market share as Windows XP falls below 35% mark
http://thenextweb.com/insider/2013/09/01/windows-8...


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 12:46:09 PM , Rating: 2
Windows phone 8 is the topic here, not Windows 8. Someone above said it's like Windows 8 in the sense that no-one is buying it. Drawing a parallel to make the point doesn't change the subject. WP had 2% install base as of the end of Q2 2013 and 4% sales for Q2.

http://communities-dominate.blogs.com/brands/2013/...


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Mitch101 on 9/3/2013 2:26:11 PM , Rating: 2
Math can be hard sometimes.

Do you believe the same amount of smartphones are sold every quarter?

If so then 2% growth is not but the answer is no more smartphones are sold each quarter than the previous quarter. Which means when your gaining market share your not only gaining market share from competitors but your outpacing the growth of smartphones in general.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 3:20:15 PM , Rating: 2
Yes, math can be hard sometimes, but I will help you through this one ;)

WP is growing from microscopic to tiny... If it keeps growing and breaks the magic 10% barrier, gimme a call. With BB getting out of the way it is possible. Dont forget Android is growing too. It's just that it cant possibly double its 75% marketshare from the previous quarter as that would be 150% duh. 75% to 79% is still a 4% growth in comparison to WP's growth. In fact, Android's marketshare increased by 4%, which matches WP's whole total sales of 4%... Good luck though.


By Mitch101 on 9/3/2013 7:47:11 PM , Rating: 2
It has already broken the 10% barrier in several countries but that's the denial in you talking when you need to look for a number that suits your needs. Well I cant use european numbers Ill run to US numbers especially since reports havent come out on the 1020 sales and the lower end devices that are about to flood the market and start cutting android off in the low price field. We even know iPhone will begin to do the same as they come out with a low cost device cutting android off at the feet level as well which is where a lot of Android sales come from for smartphones. I notice your avoided that Android lost market share this year in a few places why dont you speak about that? Why so worried about the 3rd place phone manufacturer?

Android lost 7.6% market share in the US.
http://appadvice.com/appnn/2013/09/apples-iphone-t...


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Reclaimer77 on 9/3/2013 2:55:08 PM , Rating: 2
It’s true that globally, Nokia’s Lumia line set a record with 7.4 million units sold in the quarter. But those numbers mask the grim reality. First, North American sales actually fell to just 500,000 units. Second, average selling prices actually fell almost 20% from the prior quarter. To boost sales, Nokia has become a low-end smartphone maker.

Am I just a "hater", or do you not understand the significance of this?

Microsoft has been keeping Nokia on life support prior to this acquisition, I guess they've decided to just double down on failure entirely. They've also been flat out paying for app development. Yet all that hasn't been enough. Outside of Microsoft and Nokia, it appears there's very little interest from anyone in Windows Phone.

Trying to paint Windows Phone as anything but a struggling floundering curiosity is just absurd. Regardless of you and your own myopic feelings are on it.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By BSMonitor on 9/3/2013 3:40:42 PM , Rating: 1
And, I am always right! I have all the answers on every topic! Agree with me!!!!!!!!!

(despite my ridiculous positions on just about everything)

Finished it for you bro


By Mitch101 on 9/3/2013 7:50:19 PM , Rating: 2
Isnt it funny they are so focused on Microsoft gaining .5% market share in the US but completely overlook that Android Fell 7.6% in sales in the US but its all about Windows Failing? Which of the two lost marketshare?


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Reclaimer77 on 9/3/13, Rating: -1
RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Samus on 9/3/2013 4:42:36 AM , Rating: 3
Reclaimer, let me throw some stats at you.

The average smartphone owner has 41 apps installed.

The average smartphone owner uses less than 10 apps 96% of the time they are not talking, texting, or surfing the web, with the remaining 2% presumed to be productivity related, the remaining 1% health & fitness related, and 1% other.

43% of smartphone usage is in gaming. All mobile platforms have the same popular games ported to them.

26% of smartphone usage is social networking. All mobile platforms have the support from all popular social networks.

WP8 has Google Maps and syncs with the entire Google ecosystem. If it didn't, and this were a problem, you could switch to hotmail/msn/outlook.com free and have the same functionality Google has.

WP8's greatest flaw is Bing and poor marketing.

Youtube missing from WP8 is not Microsoft's fault. Microsoft can't MAKE Google write a Youtube app, and Google can claim API this, support that, all they want, but we all know its anti-competitive.

No phones have better cameras than Nokia's, except some Sony Xperia's we can't get in the USA.

I don't think you've ever used WP8.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By BabelHuber on 9/3/13, Rating: 0
RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 8:35:00 AM , Rating: 2
LOL... N1

WP8 isnt a bad OS. It's alot like BB10 is today and WebOS was 3 years ago... A good OS with some good features (and far less developer support) that not many people are buying.

Why? There is no compelling reason to switch. MS was late to the game and is behind on app support and no-one cares.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By BSMonitor on 9/3/13, Rating: -1
By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 11:54:53 AM , Rating: 2
I like the way you insult and dispute zero points. All I said was its a good OS, but not many people are buying it.

You have to do something better than the current market leaders (IOS or Android) to gain market share. Not just catch up to where they were last year and that is what WP8 (and BBOS10) have done. It's just not going to be good enough.

That is hardly a "fanboy" comment and nothing you can say changes the point made... But I am listening.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Reclaimer77 on 9/3/2013 2:18:16 PM , Rating: 2
Nice try, I've hated Apple before Android even existed. Or the smartphone for that matter.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By BSMonitor on 9/3/2013 3:38:34 PM , Rating: 2
LMAO, so your arguments are based on "hate" for a company.

Wow, much more credible.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 3:42:17 PM , Rating: 2
Again, you have disputed zero points. Just your usual angry troll without anything substabntial to say.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By BSMonitor on 9/3/2013 4:15:20 PM , Rating: 2
At least I am not a fanboy troll masquerading as a credible source for a debate. With a reach around buddy (reclaimer) who loves to bully everyone who disagrees with us.

As I said, the same arguments you make against WP8 are exactly the same arguments iPhone users had against Droid. But you are right and they are wrong because you are siding with Google instead of Apple.

Congrats, baaaaahhhhhh. "Everything Google does is AMAZING!!!"

Hmmm where's the Droid with a 41MP, perfect low light camera??


By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 4:29:03 PM , Rating: 2
By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 4:29:30 PM , Rating: 2
By Calin on 9/3/2013 3:13:47 AM , Rating: 2
Surface lost $900 millions in unsold inventory (or something like that) - there certainly are other money invested as R&D and so on, which probably won't come back.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By Mint on 9/3/2013 5:59:40 AM , Rating: 2
How do you know that Microsoft/Nokia have NOT been paying developers? Just focusing on missing apps doesn't mean anything.

MS is in it for the long haul. Their angle into the mobile market is by making Win8 apps exceedingly easy to port to WP8. Without that hook, they wouldn't have a chance compared to Android and iOS. Even Blackberry's large, loyal userbase isn't enough to get BB10 ecosystem off its feet. It's very tough to get others to develop for your OS.

But MS did it with PDAs in the pre-multitouch era, eventually surpassing Palm (who had virtually the entire market at first). They did it in the console arena with XBox, taking on the Sony PS/PS2 behemoth. It took a full generation and a half for XBox to become an attractive platform to develop for, and that was against a foe against whom they had huge advantages in software development tools.

MS is making a good product with WP8, but it'll take time for developers to come on board.


By flyingpants1 on 9/4/2013 12:13:10 AM , Rating: 2
They obviously haven't been paying enough. Time is what they don't have, that was my point. It's been several years already and WP8 should be a very mature platform by now.


RE: Microsoft is acting a lot like RIM
By damianrobertjones on 9/3/2013 8:05:05 AM , Rating: 1
Do you just repeat what you read? I'm under the impression that the 'app' situation is all but over and WP has caught the competition.

Market share, albeit slow, is also increasing.


By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 8:36:40 AM , Rating: 2
"Do you just repeat what you read? I'm under the impression that the 'app' situation is all but over and WP has caught the competition."

Where did you read that?


By flyingpants1 on 9/4/2013 12:18:32 AM , Rating: 2
Sometimes I do, especially when I've heard the same thing over and over again from multiple sources.. and in this case the counter-argument is always the same.

The counter-argument is always that WP8 is "good enough". You can see it over and over again in the comments on this very page. It has Netflix and Angry Birds, therefore it's good enough for most users. Great. Just like Windows RT.

The problem is, it doesn't need to be "good enough". To convince people to switch, it needs to be MUCH better than the competition, or at least have some differentiating factors, better features, killer apps, etc. The giant camera sensor is a great try, but it's just not enough.


One of Microsoft's last throw of the dice.
By KiwiTT on 9/3/2013 1:23:46 AM , Rating: 2
I sincerely hope this finally gets Microsoft into the Smartphone race good and proper. They may even buy BB to cement it. Adding the BB app to Windows and the backend BB servers maybe just enough to stop Microsoft's slide into oblivion, especially in the smartphone stakes.




RE: One of Microsoft's last throw of the dice.
By purerice on 9/3/2013 1:48:08 AM , Rating: 4
6 years ago regulators would have blocked that due to monopolistic concerns. Now regulators would encourage that due to monopolistic concerns. Technology moves fast. Often faster than the courts.


RE: One of Microsoft's last throw of the dice.
By FITCamaro on 9/3/13, Rating: 0
By Rukkian on 9/3/2013 10:32:24 AM , Rating: 3
quote:
How would they be a monopoly though when they're dead last behind their competitors in terms of users?


That is exactly what he is saying - 6 years ago, the 2 companies made up probably 95% of the market. Now they are both niche players, and putting them together would add competition to Android and IOS, which would be a good thing for consumers.


Surface Phone
By inighthawki on 9/3/2013 2:10:05 AM , Rating: 1
Hopefully now that MS has a full featured phone division at their fingertips they can coordinate with the surface team and combine the best of both worlds. The build quality of the surface wipes the floor with iPads even the best of Android devices. A little upgrade to the hardware inside and it's easily the best on the market. I would pay premium to get a surface phone right now.




RE: Surface Phone
By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 10:30:09 AM , Rating: 2
" I would pay premium to get a surface phone right now"

MS's problem is that you are in the extreme minority. It's not that WP8 is bad, or Surface pro is bad, its that no-one cares.


RE: Surface Phone
By troysavary on 9/3/2013 5:32:18 PM , Rating: 2
Apparently you care enough to troll every WinPhone article published here.


Promotion
By TakinYourPoints on 9/3/2013 4:46:08 AM , Rating: 3
And Elop rises up the ladder. I will not be surprised if he ends up being the next Microsoft CEO.

On another note, who is going to license Windows Phone when its seen as a loser in the market and Microsoft is now a competitor in the hardware space against its own OS? If it wasn't totally clear before, Android is now the only choice for hardware companies that need a mobile OS. No way HTC and Samsung are going to put any real effort into WP now that they're competing with Microsoft for hardware sales, they can just ride Android into the sunset.

This doesn't make any sense, why does MS need to build phones? Microsoft isn't Apple; they aren't an integrated hardware company, they're a software company. Surface in both incarnations is a flop, WP hasn't been a hit, and even the XBox is in the red after a decade. What do they gain by switching gears like this?




RE: Promotion
By Mint on 9/3/2013 6:45:10 AM , Rating: 1
XBox isn't in the red anymore. They are cumulatively, but not marginally going forward. Remember that their Entertainment and Devices division has a lot of money-losing projects as well.

But MS invested in XBox because it's their entry into the living room. XBox One's HDMI passthrough is a clear indication of them trying to become a gateway to a much larger business than just console gaming. They're going to integrate cable/satellite alongside Netflix/Hulu/other video streams into one seamless interface.

This can only happen by selling hardware alongside software. Google is getting insignificant penetration with its Google TV partnerships with TV manufacturers. Same with Windows Media Centre via HTPC, or Apple TV.

Surface was a flop because the hardware it was designed for wasn't ready. Forget RT, as it's just a hedge in case Intel doesn't deliver. Haswell (and maybe Silvermont, depending on MS's model plan) will make the next Surface models far better. Battery life and weight are the biggest problems with the current Surface, and Haswell Y-series will solve it.

As for WP8, it's pretty clear why they need to go into hardware. The entered the game too late. MS tried to get others to adopt its mobile platform without the Nokia partnership, but it didn't work. If they didn't take things into their own hands, they would have failed for sure (and may yet fail, but at least with Nokia they have a chance).


RE: Promotion
By GPig on 9/3/13, Rating: 0
RE: Promotion
By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 8:42:48 AM , Rating: 1
I think its a good match...

- MS, the company that ignored the mobile revolution for years too long.
- Nokia devices and services decision, the team that kept its aging OS (Symbian) and ignored the mobile revolution for years too long.

The pair makes perfect sense... Now lets all go buy some WP8 phones LOL.


MS buys Nokia?
By Samus on 9/3/2013 1:12:12 AM , Rating: 2
I'm as surprised as everyone here. Really. I honestly didn't see this coming.




It was nice knowing you, Finland
By ET on 9/3/2013 4:44:14 AM , Rating: 2
There goes the neighbourhood.




But it's ugly
By mjv.theory on 9/3/2013 5:39:11 AM , Rating: 2
I am quite surprised that people talk about a lack of top end hardware or deficient app choice or not enough marketing, as the root of Windows Phone's problem.

The biggest problem by far with Windows Phone is the ugly sesame street UI. And if you disagree that it is ugly, then I think you ought to know that you are by far in the minority.

Of course, personal computing devices, i.e. PCs, and to an even greater extent, mobile computing devices, i.e. smartphones and tablets, are very much in their infancy. There are many changes to come to these hardware and software platforms, not the least of which is convergence.
However, there is one thing of which I am reasonably confident, if users are given the choice of an aesthetically pleasing environment or a slightly more productive but less pleasing environment, they are most likely to compromise toward the "pretty" one.

And that's not to suggest that M$ is intrinsically more capable of designing "productive" systems than anyone else - a fact of which Linux and Mac users will already be very aware. Also, don't forget that the vast majority of users do not require "productivity" from their computing systems. For most people's requirements iOS and Android are already perfectly adequate. The days of users paying for basic software, especially the OS/UI itself, are coming to an end. Companies like M$ will find it increasingly difficult to persuade people to pay significant amounts of money for the dubious privilege of using a word processor that may or may not be ever so slightly better than many other free alternatives. The highlighting of this fact alone is perhaps of the most significant impacts of the mobile "revolution".




NO WAY!
By Belard on 9/3/2013 9:11:03 AM , Rating: 2
OMG!! ReallY!

I can't believe this! I'm sure HTC and Samsung will continue to develop and make more WP8 devices!




This pretty much puts to rest...
By iamkyle on 9/3/2013 1:23:04 PM , Rating: 2
...the rumours of BlackBerry's hardware division sale. Now it's most likely going to either be wound down, or the whole company taken private at this point.




Nokia opens gates to Microsoft
By henhill69 on 9/4/2013 8:34:00 PM , Rating: 2
Complete acquisition details and prospects provided @ http://viralbond.blogspot.in/2013/09/nokia-opens-i...




Hostile takeover
By Zingam on 9/3/13, Rating: 0
Fiasco
By Tony Swash on 9/3/13, Rating: -1
RE: Fiasco
By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 10:21:26 AM , Rating: 1
LOL... Yup. Its the software company that very nearly missed the mobile revolution, marrying the hardware/phone team that nearly did the same clinging to an aging Symbian OS for years too long.

I would like to think that they can come up with some great things, but it doesnt look promising. Ultimately, the "marriage" of the two isnt what matters... They will need to make some really great phones to make people want to switch. It would have to be something alot better than what Nokia/MS has done so far by a longshot.


RE: Fiasco
By Tony Swash on 9/3/13, Rating: -1
RE: Fiasco
By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 10:38:56 AM , Rating: 3
Ugh... Horace Dediu? Pass. If I wanted to read the irrelevant opinion of someone that only sees/cares/notices part of the whole picture I would rather just read RIM's product outook.

LOL... Horace Dediu.


RE: Fiasco
By Tony Swash on 9/3/13, Rating: 0
RE: Fiasco
By retrospooty on 9/3/2013 2:00:16 PM , Rating: 4
Do we really need that site to tell you that MS's Windows business is in decline and that the server market is where the profits and most future potential is? That is kind of an obvious one.

It's not that his #'s aren't correct or that some of his assumptions aren't sometimes astute, it's that he doesn't always see the whole picture. He often looks at things through a microscope, with great detail on a particular area not noticing what the rest of the world just out of his narrow-focused microscope view is doing. Make sense?

It's a good site for a fanboy to get data that seems to show certain things, but it often misses the whole big picture...

Oh wait ;)


"Paying an extra $500 for a computer in this environment -- same piece of hardware -- paying $500 more to get a logo on it? I think that's a more challenging proposition for the average person than it used to be." -- Steve Ballmer














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