Print 101 comment(s) - last by karlostomy.. on Jun 23 at 3:04 AM

Current Windows Phone 7.x users will have to make do with Windows Phone 7.8

Microsoft may be down in the single-digits when it comes to worldwide smartphone market share, but the company is not going to sit by on the sidelines while the competition from Apple and Google pass it by. Today at the Windows Phone Summit, Microsoft announced the follow-up to Windows Phone 7.5 -- Windows Phone 8.

While Windows Phone 7.x is based on Windows CE, Windows Phone 8 shares its NT kernel with PC-oriented Windows 8 operating system. Thanks to the shared codebase, developers won't have to do "double duty" developing programs for Windows Phone 8 and Windows 8.

Joe Belfiore, corporate vice president of Windows Phone, introduces Windows Phone 8
Windows Phone 8 will support dual-core processor at launch, and quad-core support will come at a later date (Windows Phone 8 can theoretically support up to 64 cores
). In addition, Windows Phone 8 will support three screen resolutions: 800x480, 1280x768, and 1280x720. Although we question the need for both of the latter screen resolutions, we'll give Microsoft the benefit of the doubt on this one.

Other features include microSD support for removable storage (movies, videos, photos, apps), VoIP/Skype integration, in-app purchases, Internet Explorer 10 (complete with anti-phising technology), native NFC support, and a mobile Wallet Hub to store credit/debit cards, and deals/offers, (it sounds quite a bit like Apple's Passbook from iOS 6). Nokia's NAVTEQ mapping technology will also be built-in to Windows Phone 8 including offline maps. Another new feature, Tap+Send, allows users to "bump" phones to share data. However, we've seen this functionality before in Android devices.

Customizable tiles in Windows Phone 8
The biggest change announced is a revamp of the Start screen and the Live Tiles system. Microsoft is now giving users the ability to completely control the Start screen and resize tiles to make their phones more personal. For example, if the Pictures hub is most important to you, you can resize the tile to make is take a huge portion of your screen while at the same time reducing the size of tiles that don't interest you as much.

Microsoft also made it official that current smartphones running Windows Phone 7.x will not be getting an upgrade to Windows Phone 8. While some functionality will make its way into Windows Phone 7.8 (like the new customizable Start screen), you'll have to purchase a brand new smartphone to get the full Windows Phone 8 experience.

Source: Microsoft

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Oh those were the days!!!
By Ramstark on 6/20/2012 1:44:46 PM , Rating: 2
I am beginning to feel like that time when everyone said "Oh, Xbox? That would never beat the Playstation, that thing is awful!"...
Excellent products with WELL DEVELOPED AND TESTING TIMES, MS is always an excellent "Long track racer" It is a company built and used to market products later in the game, but win with them.
For all of those who just disapprove without even testing the hardware or software, please, just avoid commenting, try everything and then give your opinion...
iThings, your "Playstation time" has begun!!

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By MrBlastman on 6/20/2012 2:33:05 PM , Rating: 1
First the slate and now this, I'm thinking you are possibly correct. The ability to run PC software on a tablet or phone wins me over immediately. "Apps" become pointless overnight. There's so much software already out there, why bother waiting for something to be made when it has already been done?

Okay, there are some neat apps that don't exist as software but it is a matter of time.

When I do something on my desktop, the last thing I want to do is screw around with trying to adapt it to a portable device. Now, with these, I don't have to.

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By B3an on 6/20/2012 2:51:59 PM , Rating: 2
Err you cant run desktop software on WP8 though. Why would you even want to?! How could you possibly control or navigate desktop software on a tiny screen using touch? That would be amazingly awkward. On a Win 8 tablet it's fine because you have a larger screen but more importantly you can simply connect any mouse of keyboard.

It should be a lot easier for devs to port over their Metro style Win 8 apps though. If it is then i can see the WP8 app store suddenly getting a ton more apps.

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By MrBlastman on 6/20/2012 3:00:17 PM , Rating: 1
It isn't so matter a matter of "why would I want to," but instead, it is more a matter of, "I can."

I like options and flexibility. I don't like being shackled to a platform like... ahem, *cough* the app store.

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By xdrol on 6/21/2012 6:46:21 AM , Rating: 2
You still can't.

First, different architecture. The phone/tablet will be ARM, the desktop will be x86/x64. It's not just a matter of re-compiling with ARM target: If your code has assembly or intrinsics, happy rewriting.

Second, in WinRT, 80+% of the previous API is gone. (One can safely assume WP8 is the same as tablet-Win8 - AKA WinRT - with some restrictions.) There is just a completely new API that not even exist in Win7. If your application is a bit more complex than a stone (and why wound it not - I'd use a stone in that case..), happy rewriting.

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By Digimonkey on 6/21/2012 10:10:46 AM , Rating: 2
Did you miss the Surface announcement where MS showed off an intel based tablet with Windows 8 Pro? That product directly addresses the issue of running software you'd normally run on a desktop/laptop but on a tablet.

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By MrBlastman on 6/21/2012 11:31:41 AM , Rating: 2
Reading is not a pre-requisite to be a fanboi. Only a blatant disregard for facts and buying in to hype is needed to join the club!

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By Ramstark on 6/20/2012 6:50:02 PM , Rating: 2
Well, clearly you aren't a WP user, do your know it has Office? I have used Powerpoint since I have the phone, as well as Excel some times...Neither of them are painful to use in my horribly small LG900...

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By BillyBatson on 6/20/2012 11:08:35 PM , Rating: 2
A lot of us would actually want. It might not always be the ideal situation but being able to run certain things on the go vs. not being able to at all or having to rely on an app form, is a big plus. I've connected to my home PC remotely from my 3.5" iPhone many times.... It's not ideal both I've both wanted to and have had to do this to access files.

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By elleehswon on 6/21/2012 1:15:59 PM , Rating: 2
though i see some benefits, my concern is "do you really want to use something at an enterprise level that's built to work on a phone.?" from a functionality standpoint, you can't expect much.

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By Taft12 on 6/20/12, Rating: -1
RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By B3an on 6/20/2012 2:59:54 PM , Rating: 3
Xbox - Best selling console for over a year in western countries. And best online experience by miles.

Kinect - Fastest selling consumer electronics device ever . Is in the guinness book of records for this.

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By corduroygt on 6/21/2012 8:42:22 AM , Rating: 2
Xbox is only the best selling console in the US and UK.

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By poi2 on 6/21/2012 9:57:50 AM , Rating: 2
Kinnect is good man . . .
It is a good product man . . .

Do you have RROD somewhere in your brain ?

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By Smilin on 6/21/2012 10:25:44 AM , Rating: 2
Has Xbox even recouped its R&D and RROD losses yet?

Years ago, holy crap man. Your rock is under a rock.

Put consoles, accessories, and game licenses to the side for a moment and just think about this: There are about 25 million people paying $60 a year for XBL Gold. That's a money faucet.

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By Taft12 on 6/22/2012 1:00:05 PM , Rating: 1
According to MS's SEC filings the Xbox 360 has a net loss of ~$1 billion, including Live subscriptions. The lifetime net loss for the franchise is $5 billion.

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By karlostomy on 6/23/2012 3:04:50 AM , Rating: 3

If you have no valid link to support your conclusions, other posters will be forced to conclude that you are trolling.

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By Tony Swash on 6/20/12, Rating: -1
RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By MrBlastman on 6/20/2012 3:04:19 PM , Rating: 2
Tony, when I see your posts I hear the Peanuts™ teacher talking. However,

This all means that the MS must come up with a strategy for how it can make profits, substantial profits, and generate strong ongoing growth in the new mobile markets.

Microsoft doesn't need to worry about making profits. They already are making them!

In 2011, they made 23 billion net at a 33% profit margin! HUGE profits. They've proven year after year they can make profits.

They can afford to have loss leaders to help them gain what they most need and that is market share. They need market share more than anything else so they can burn through all those profits they make with other products.

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By Reclaimer77 on 6/20/12, Rating: 0
RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By Tony Swash on 6/20/12, Rating: -1
RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By Reclaimer77 on 6/20/2012 3:37:47 PM , Rating: 2
why did Google spend $12 billion on Motorola? For fun?

For the patents. Which are worth twice their weight in gold given today's tech industry arms race style buildup.


I guess in your mind Google spends 12 billion because Android isn't making money? That makes sense? 12 billion, with a B ...

Please just stop.

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By elleehswon on 6/21/2012 1:22:10 PM , Rating: 1
First and foremost, i hope your vacation was enjoyable. Even though your rantings are delusional here regarding what you measure a company by, vacation is vacation.

now, onto my point...

That's it! Time to go back to analog! No more IP! :)

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By spread on 6/21/2012 1:58:08 PM , Rating: 1
Why then is both Microsoft and Google moving into making their own integrated hardware/software products, why is MS endangering it's precious relationship with it's OEMs

I would guess because those OEMs have been dragging their feet with their crap hardware and poor driver support which makes Microsoft look bad.

why did Google spend $12 billion on Motorola

Patents, maybe hardware capability but mostly patents.

Mobile advertising may never be a substantial business.

That means Google is going out of business. Let's all short Google stock because they are going out of business. You first. You drink your own Kool Aid first and prove it's tasty stuff.

Crazy old man. "Suck my iStick you iDiot." - Steve Jobs

By TakinYourPoints on 6/20/2012 6:35:19 PM , Rating: 2
It is less about the fact that Google doesn't make that much money off of Android. Its more about the fact that Google pulls in way more money advertising on the iPhone and that Microsoft makes more money than Google on the actual hardware.

It's just funny/bizarre is all.

RE: Oh those were the days!!!
By Cerin218 on 6/22/2012 2:43:04 PM , Rating: 1
They make money back on the games and the content. They wanted to have a lead in the console arena. How many of my friends have sat drunk at night and bout MW3 or some such at 60 Bucks? Or bought clothes for their avatar? Or bought media. That's where they make it back. You don't make the money upfront on the hardware, you make the money on the back end with the consumables.

By geddarkstorm on 6/20/2012 1:14:44 PM , Rating: 2
developers won't have to do "double duty" developing programs from Windows Phone 8 and Windows Phone 8

It is always such a pain developing programs for that which you are developing programs for!

Sorry, it's just a hilarious typo to me, gave me a smile.

RE: Finally!
By Brandon Hill on 6/20/2012 1:17:05 PM , Rating: 2
You got me! ;)

RE: Finally!
By JasonMick on 6/20/2012 2:23:32 PM , Rating: 1
It is always such a pain developing programs for that which you are developing programs for!

Sorry, it's just a hilarious typo to me, gave me a smile.
But on that topic, how is that worse than having to develop for Android where you have like 3+ versions, several common screen sizes, and a host of other variables.

In terms of SDK, I doubt that much will change aside from XAML/Silverlight "purdy fonts" (I know, a technical term, right?) and such stuff that many WinPhone developers don't even bother with anyways as it takes so much work. Maybe some added shader support in WinPhone8, but nothing world-ending.

RE: Finally!
By Mitch101 on 6/20/2012 2:37:23 PM , Rating: 1
Flurry: Windows Phone app development catching up to Android

Flurry credits mounting developer interest in Windows Phone to a number of factors, including continued frustration over Android fragmentation, concern for increasing competition on iOS and dwindling faith in BlackBerry. "Whatever the reason, it's clear that Microsoft still knows how to attract third-party developer support," Farago adds. "Flurry expects Microsoft to make continued headway over the course of 2012."

RE: Finally!
By Reclaimer77 on 6/20/2012 3:02:32 PM , Rating: 1
Windows Phone has been "catching up" for three years now. That's all we hear, how they are catching up.

Of course you conveniently leave out the fact that the "catching up" only started to happen when Microsoft decided to directly pay app developers because there wasn't enough interest in the platform. You're making it sound like a grass roots effort based on popularity and true frustration with Android. Do you mean to tell lies, or just didn't know MS was paying for app development?

RE: Finally!
By JasonMick on 6/20/2012 3:13:11 PM , Rating: 1
Windows Phone has been "catching up" for three years now. That's all we hear, how they are catching up.
Hmm, Android was announced in 2007, didn't catch up to Apple in terms of market share until 2010... so what's the big deal?

I'm not saying Microsoft is going to be as dominant as Android, but clearly they're doing something right, given those numbers... you have to give them a little bit of credit Reclaimer.

Even if you don't like the platform for whatever reason, can't you at least agree that more competition is better, as it will drive Android and Apple to innovate more?

RE: Finally!
By Reclaimer77 on 6/20/2012 3:29:40 PM , Rating: 1
MS's idea of "competing" is much like Apples. Sue or license the competition away. So yes, I WOULD like to see more competition, but that's not really how it seems to be going down.

What MS did with their patent licensing is almost gangsterism. Tell manufacturers they're infringing and have to pay $10-20 PER headset sale without telling them specifically what the offense is. Then only reveal it to them when they agree to pay and force them to agree to not disclose it? That's racketeering, it's just wrong.

Hell Microsoft makes more money from Android phone sales than their own! Competition at it's finest I guess?

RE: Finally!
By JasonMick on 6/20/2012 4:34:46 PM , Rating: 1
What MS did with their patent licensing is almost gangsterism. Tell manufacturers they're infringing and have to pay $10-20 PER headset sale without telling them specifically what the offense is. Then only reveal it to them when they agree to pay and force them to agree to not disclose it? That's racketeering, it's just wrong.
I agree with you there, but that's the way our glorious patent system works. I blame politicians as much as Microsoft. How can you really fault a company for maximizing its profits?

Face it -- that's the beauty and ugliness of capitalism -- a for-profit company will fully exploit every single loophole and legal technicality it can to get an advantage -- fair or unfair. It doesn't matter how many workers get stomped on, how anticompetitive it is, how many rivals die. As long as it increases sales, at the end of the day, Microsoft and the majority of other for-profit companies will go for it.

We debated endlessly about tax dodging (at the expense of small businesses who can't tax dodge) and you defended Apple, Microsoft, et al. on that. You now condemn them, but really the principal is the same -- companies exploiting legal loopholes to the detriment of others.

I myself am at least consistent in that I find both offenses unsavory. Just because something satisfy profit-at-any cost principals of corporatism, doesn't make ti right.

That said, I still would argue all that aside Microsoft has done a lot more to innovate OS-wise than Apple. Apple drove the quality of core apps and battery life a long ways forward in 2007, and the rest of the pack in many ways only caught up in 2010, 2011. But it has stalled since innovation wise, where Microsoft continues to innovate.

RE: Finally!
By Paj on 6/21/2012 7:39:57 AM , Rating: 2
Great points. Whatever system you love, you gotta take the faults that come with it.

RE: Finally!
By Reclaimer77 on 6/21/12, Rating: 0
RE: Finally!
By geddarkstorm on 6/20/2012 3:43:55 PM , Rating: 1
Well, from what I understand of Android, it's all Java based anyways (hence the need for Dalvik); which means development is the same whatever ones version. Now, that's only true in so far as what the kernel supports, but WP8 is a different kernel from WP7, so that same issue applies; but even more so (linux kernels are still linux kernels, and the jump from the 2.x to 3.x wasn't all that big, mostly just bug fixes). And it WP8's kernel doesn't seem to be -completely- identical to Windows 8... otherwise quad core support would be there immediately. (I think they should have just used the straight up Windows RT. Makes no sense they didn't.)

I dunno, some things Microsoft is telling us just don't add up, but I never said anything was worst or better (and there's huge advantages to having unified app support scaling up the entire Windows 8 product line; it's a brilliant idea), just that the typo in the original article was awesomely fun.

Where is datdamonfoo and InverMe now?
By corduroygt on 6/20/2012 2:33:54 PM , Rating: 2
Looks like I won my bet that they downrated me on :

RE: Where is datdamonfoo and InverMe now?
By datdamonfoo on 6/20/2012 2:41:18 PM , Rating: 2
Alright. Even though 7.5 phones will get much of the software features of WP8, I suppose it isn't exactly WP8. So you won the bet.

By corduroygt on 6/20/2012 2:54:00 PM , Rating: 2
They only get the customizable home screen, nothing else, not to mention no app support as very few devs will specifically target WP7 anymore.

By Mitch101 on 6/20/2012 2:44:32 PM , Rating: 2
Because your not playing the popular vote. Glorify the top seller and you'll get rated up by its peers.

Then you have those who disagree log into their second account to down rate you and rate themselves up.

But in the end don't care there are no prizes for the rating system on DT.

By TakinYourPoints on 6/20/2012 8:09:42 PM , Rating: 2
Look at some of the garbage that gets upvoted, let alone some of the trash that gets posted as "news", and then think again about feeling bad about if you get downvoted. :)

By AnnihilatorX on 6/20/2012 1:18:27 PM , Rating: 2
You didn't mention the single most important update to a feature missing in Mango (7.5) - multitasking.

Now VoIP and location service can run in background. The former allows Skype to be receving calls all the time, and the latter allow GPS map software to still give you directions while you switch to another app.

RE: Multitasking
By corduroygt on 6/20/2012 2:10:24 PM , Rating: 2
Are you sure they mean it can run in the bg waiting for calls, or just that when you're in a call, you can exit the app without getting disconnected? iOS 4 and above can do the latter but not the former.

RE: Multitasking
By AnnihilatorX on 6/20/2012 4:01:36 PM , Rating: 2
The former is what I get the impression from Ars Technica.

In Windows Phone 8, there's full support for this kind of application. VoIP software will not only be able to run persistently in the background, it will also be able to integrate with the built-in dialer. This allows VoIP calls to be placed without having to venture into a separate application.

Cross compatable?
By adrift02 on 6/20/2012 1:28:59 PM , Rating: 2
The only thing that caught my eye here was that Windows 8 and the phone can share apps. I think that's a huge point, not to be overlooked. Everything is moving to the cloud and having my phone sync seamlessly with my desktop would win me over.

RE: Cross compatable?
By XZerg on 6/20/2012 3:19:40 PM , Rating: 2
Windows 8 RT (ARM), not Windows 8 x86, will share the apps. I believe we may have to wait for Windows 9 or 10 to actually have a common OS to rule them all, and that too if one processor becomes a clear victor by then or we have generalized everything to a point the OS makes it seamless for programs on different CPUs.

RE: Cross compatable?
By adrift02 on 6/21/2012 3:17:46 AM , Rating: 2
Ah bummer, thanks for the clarification though. I see that as the next logical step, get customers hooked on all of your products through cloud syncing, integrate functionality, etc. I hate manually setting up access to work docs across my laptop, iPad, and Android phone (though Dropbox helps).

By Trisped on 6/20/2012 2:34:32 PM , Rating: 2
What does the Developing... at the end of the article mean? Was there suppose to be more to the article? Is it referring to a comment/joke in the previous paragraph? Is it a comment on the current state of the phone (it is developing)?

RE: Developing...
By Etsp on 6/20/2012 2:48:37 PM , Rating: 2
The story itself is developing. Micrsoft is currently hosting the event that this information came from, and the event is still ongoing. More shall soon be revealed. Stay tuned.

RE: Developing...
By Trisped on 6/20/2012 3:14:02 PM , Rating: 2
Oh, thanks.

Windows RoT
By tharik on 6/20/12, Rating: 0
RE: Windows RoT
By Solandri on 6/20/2012 3:38:38 PM , Rating: 2
Heh, here are some past doozies:

Windows 95 - Much-delayed update to Windows 3.1 which was originally supposed to ship in 1993. Rumored that Gates named it Win 95 to force the development team to actually ship it by 1995.

Windows NT - NT = new technology. But bashers frequently called it Windows NoT.

WinCE - 'nuf said.

Zune - Rhymes with and is almost a homonym for doom.

PlaysForSure - It did, until it didn't.

By That Takes the Cake on 6/20/2012 2:35:00 PM , Rating: 2
That'll teach you.

Glad I never upgraded
By MartyLK on 6/20/2012 9:53:22 PM , Rating: 1
I bought into WP in the beginning and was more than dissatisfied with it after discovering how ancient it is feature-wise. I have a 1st gen. Samsung Focus and from time to time I think I would like to upgrade it for a WP with a FFC. Then I look at things like the limited memory of the available choices and I back away from it. I can't bring myself to go from a healthy 40GB phone to less than 16GB max. After the MS announcement today, I am grateful I never did go through with an upgrade or purchase of any current WP hardware.

I seriously doubt I will ever get into WP of any kind in the future. The choices that Android and Apple provide make WP obsolete at best. And it's just...unpleasant, to think about how conservative MS has been with the system. They aren't interested in the whole user-experience. They seem to be only concerned with propaganda. They seem to only care about the future so much so they never get down to Earth and produce a whole product here and now. They will forever be playing catch-up with the real systems already out and pleasing user all the time.

By Reclaimer77 on 6/20/12, Rating: -1
RE: Right
By quiksilvr on 6/20/2012 1:08:30 PM , Rating: 2
I have to agree. I was hoping the announcement would be that Windows Phone 7 and 8 will be discontinued and instead all future Windows Phones will run Windows RT with the metro interface (kinda like how Android 4 works)

RE: Right
By geddarkstorm on 6/20/2012 1:12:18 PM , Rating: 1
I had thought that was the direction they were going too; and it would have been a good one. But this is more like... Windows Phone 7.6

What a missed opportunity.

RE: Right
By Flunk on 6/20/2012 1:47:05 PM , Rating: 3
Realistically, Windows Phone 8 is a version of Windows RT with a downsized interface. The Apps will be cross compatible (although enabling it might be up to devs).

RE: Right
By quiksilvr on 6/20/2012 2:11:23 PM , Rating: 2
Well that's good to hear...except the whole "screw our early adopters" approach, leaving ALL Windows Phone 7 users with phones that will never get Windows Phone 8.

RE: Right
By theapparition on 6/20/12, Rating: 0
RE: Right
By kleinma on 6/20/2012 2:31:42 PM , Rating: 5
Yeah versus apple giving you the latest iOS on your old ass iPhone so it runs even shittier than it did before. And the update is packed with features your old iPhone doesn't even support. Basically forcing you to upgrade by degrading the quality of your existing phone. Or how about android? So fragmented it's a crap shoot how long the phone you get will receive updates, and ends up with with a hugely fragmented set of apps that don't work on your device. Go with one of those options. They are much better.

RE: Right
By retrospooty on 6/20/2012 3:15:35 PM , Rating: 2
regardless, you buy a phone today for the features it has today, not for an OS that may come in the future. Anyone that feels entitled to a next gen OS update on an old phone should really take some pills and come back down to reality. If your phone doesnt do what you want it to do, why did you buy it?

RE: Right
By Pirks on 6/20/12, Rating: 0
RE: Right
By Pirks on 6/20/12, Rating: 0
RE: Right
By StevoLincolnite on 6/20/2012 5:52:35 PM , Rating: 2
I think we have just been spoiled in PC land.
It's not unusual to get an OS upgrade on a 10 year old system which brings with it new functionality.

RE: Right
By Arsynic on 6/20/2012 2:44:55 PM , Rating: 3
Or MS could just do like Apple and call the new update "8" instead of "7.8" whilst leaving out features just so the dummies wouldn't feel left out...

Face it, iOS 5 on the iPhone 3GS and the iPhone 4S are two different experiences yet, all iDiots keep saying, "Yay! Apple is so benevolent that they gave even the old devices the iOS 5 update." But if they called it iOS 4.8, they would say, "Booo! Apple is abandoning us!"

The tech cock-measuring has to stop.

RE: Right
By corduroygt on 6/20/2012 6:56:06 PM , Rating: 2
The 3GS gets many features of iOS5, and most importantly, most apps are still compatible with it whereas WP7 only gets the start screen and nothing from the kernel and WP8 apps will not be compatible for the most part with it.

RE: Right
By phryguy on 6/20/2012 9:14:57 PM , Rating: 2
Yep, all still currently sold iPhones (3GS, 4 and 4S) all will get iOS 6. However, the older models won't get all the features the 4S gets.

RE: Right
By maven81 on 6/20/2012 1:11:32 PM , Rating: 4
How exactly is partnering with Nokia a hobby? Seems to me they've got an awful lot invested in this. If you're going to be a hater at least make valid points ;)

RE: Right
By geddarkstorm on 6/20/2012 1:16:37 PM , Rating: 2
I'm curious why it is launching with only dual core support, and won't get quad core till later. Just seems... really... weird.

RE: Right
By kleinma on 6/20/2012 2:25:42 PM , Rating: 3
Its not weird. You cant compare dual core windows and quad core android since windows actually runs efficiently and android needs the extra horse power just to be on par.

RE: Right
By Reclaimer77 on 6/20/12, Rating: 0
RE: Right
By corduroygt on 6/20/2012 3:26:47 PM , Rating: 3
We call this "beta tester" anxiety. As in calling other phone owners beta testers in your commercials, but the Shyamalan twist is actually you are the beta tester :)

I'm an iOS fan but Android's got my respect and I'll buy one if iPhone 5 turns out to be crap.

RE: Right
By geddarkstorm on 6/20/2012 3:36:14 PM , Rating: 1
You are really going to claim that? Have you seen Anandtech's bench marks and reviews of Windows Phone devices, such as the Lumia 900? They are seriously underpowered compared to even some dual core android phones.

Moreover, WP8 is supposed to share a kernel with Windows 8, so why is quad core not automatically supported? They'll add it later, so obviously the absurd claims you throw out are not valid; but how come it isn't standard now that quad cores are becoming common place, and since support should already be in the kernel? Talk about shooting your hardware possibilities in the foot!

It is bizarre, and gains Microsoft nothing, while making it lose a lot of areas of competition.

RE: Right
By Reclaimer77 on 6/20/2012 3:48:31 PM , Rating: 1
Exactly. To listen to these guys talks about WP7, is like hearing someone who's just been released from a brain washing camp. WP7 is somehow faster than Android, more efficient, all while running on vastly lower-powered phones AND getting better battery life. LOL right!

It also washes your car, makes a damn sandwich when you want, and injects feel-good happy thoughts into your brain!

I've seriously never seen a bigger case of confirmation bias in my life than what goes on here over WP7. Of course these people don't go to Anandtech and look at benchmarks!

RE: Right
By Mitch101 on 6/20/2012 5:58:47 PM , Rating: 2
Android Sold = $15.00 for Microsoft = Microsoft Wins

Thank you for your Windows Phone financial support.

RE: Right
By Reclaimer77 on 6/20/12, Rating: 0
RE: Right
By Mitch101 on 6/20/2012 8:48:51 PM , Rating: 4
What your doing is thread crapping in a condescending tone my vacuous friend.

You add no value or information to any post you only offer your opinion on matters and don't offer any hard facts.

RE: Right
By Manch on 6/20/2012 6:18:29 PM , Rating: 1
I got a Lumia 800. I got it as an all in one to replace my zune and my phone(galaxy). In that regards it works great. Got a couple time waster games on it for when Im dropping the kids off, but its not magical. I think it runs great for what I use it for. A phone, mp3 player, camera for whatever, and the daily exchange rates. The UI is great, but androids works just fine too. I do not give 2 fucks if it feels or actually is a split second faster/slower. Fits in my pocket, it works, and it was cheap. (I do miss my galaxies keyboard...fuckin touch screens) I tether it to my android tablet! I prefer android tablets, I hate surfing on a phone. Ill be hard pressed to buy a Win 8 tablet but I wont rule them out. I can do what I want on my android tablets and unless MS will allow that same degree of freedom, I aint switching. That being said, this is DT, there will always be fan boy flame wars about whos phone/tablet is better like they built it themselves!

But seriously:

I've seriously never seen a bigger case of confirmation bias in my life than what goes on here over WP7

Have you never read an apple article on this site? :D

RE: Right
By Reclaimer77 on 6/20/12, Rating: 0
RE: Right
By TakinYourPoints on 6/20/2012 8:01:31 PM , Rating: 1
WP7 is somehow faster than Android, more efficient, all while running on vastly lower-powered phones AND getting better battery life. LOL right!

Yeah, it's called having an OS that doesn't run like a pig. The fact that WP7 (or iOS, or WebOS) running on a slower single core CPU is smoother and snappier than Android on technically faster hardware speaks volumes as to how badly optimized the latter has been up until very recently. As to the last point, you're looking at about 7% of total Android hardware running ICS after so much time, pathetic.

RE: Right
By Reclaimer77 on 6/20/2012 8:17:22 PM , Rating: 2
I like how you can spew the same FUD over and over again without ever trying to back up your point. I refer you back to the Anandtech Lumia 900 review. Every single statement you just made it false. It is NOT faster than the competition. The browser is, frankly, horrible. And there's absolutely NO evidence that it utilizes CPU more efficiently than Android phones.

Can you actually back your statements up with facts?

Oh and for the last time people, the battery life is NOT that good. In fact it's pretty bad!

RE: Right
By TakinYourPoints on 6/20/2012 11:50:41 PM , Rating: 2
I should have cut off the quote on battery life. Smoothness of the UI is the main thing I give WP7 over Android, it isn't even a close comparison between the two. I also never once have spoken about battery life in a WP7 discussion.

And btw, WP7 actually does quite well with talk time. The top talk time scores all go to larger handsets with much bigger batteries in them.

The main thing holding back WP7 isn't the OS, it is decent hardware. Even with slower SoCs it was still very competitive when it launched in 2010. Unfortunately its hardware has stagnated while Android handset makers and Apple kept pushing specs as hard as they could. In Android's case it was needed to make the OS less choppy, as well as giving something to market towards the neckbeards. Hopefully Microsoft and Nokia will try and be more competitive on that front with WP8.

RE: Right
By Manch on 6/21/2012 12:30:43 PM , Rating: 1
This android vs WP7 flame war sounds a lot like Windows vs Mac OS arguments that used to stir up crap.

Anyhoo, I think the key to WP8 succeeding is the fact that it shares its code with Windows 8 and that youll be able to run the same software on either your phone, tablet, or laptop/desktop is very compelling. I got a lumia 800, I preferr it over the 900. Larger screen is great but the way they put it together isnt as good to me. Same hardware other than 4g. I dont have it so I dont miss it. So even now with its dated hardware it runs just fine for what I use mine for but Im not under any delusion that it will go toe to toe with the higher end androids.

I do think the OS is holding back Wp7, not that its bad. Its quite impressive but its based off of CE. I think they hit a wall with what they wanted to do vs what they could do with that code, hence no updated hardware and the shift to Win 8 code. Remember the Kin? Nope? no one does except as a reminder that MS was royally effing up during the developement of both platforms. I think WP7 would have been out a hell of a lot sooner if they had dropped or merged the two teams together. I think wp8 will be a very compelling choice when it comes out, but if they do not offer more of what I want then I have no problem with android. Apple on the other hand can go fuck themselves.

RE: Right
By TakinYourPoints on 6/20/2012 6:36:43 PM , Rating: 1
"Better than Android"

Careful not to trip over that bar you've left so low

RE: Right
By SilentSin on 6/20/2012 3:47:23 PM , Rating: 2
It actually has up to 64-core support if someone were going to make such a thing. It's using MS's NT kernel (should be nearly the same as on Windows 8 RT if not the exact same). That's probably more of a consideration for tablets using the kernel than phones but it's there. The initial batch of devices will probably be dual core S4 phones, Qualcomm was plastered on quite a few slides from the announcement.

RE: Right
By geddarkstorm on 6/20/2012 4:00:44 PM , Rating: 2
Well, now we are getting conflicting information. We're told at release WP8 cannot support quad cores, and can only do dual cores, and that it will take an update (like WP7's 7.5 update which brought much needed advancements) to unlock quad core support.

So, why is this, if it can theoretically support up to 64 cores out of the box? MS is just limiting its hardware possibilities for no gain, it seems.

Something tells me the WP8 kernel isn't identical to the Windows 8 RT kernel; which I think it should have been. No reason not to just stick RT straight on a phone. Nothing prevents that, so why didn't MS do that?

This all seems like a case of the right hand not talking to the left hand.

RE: Right
By SilentSin on 6/20/2012 4:40:19 PM , Rating: 2
It does seem like WinRT (or WART if you please) is still half baked. Just look for the videos of all the Surface freezes at the launch event or videos of the WART launch tablets from Computex. That happened on a variety of platforms, which brings up your point.

MS limited phones severely with WP7 but it was more for platform control than anything and all WP7 devices I've used seemed very stable. I think WP8 and WART will have some serious teething problems since this will be the first dive into vast array of ARM SoCs out there. I hope it's nothing worse than what Google went through with the first few iterations of Android tho.

If we are to believe the presentation than coding for WP8 is the same as WART, you just have to change a build target or something which indicates the kernel is very closely related. I guess we will have to wait and see if that is really true once the SDK is in the wild.

RE: Right
By Reclaimer77 on 6/20/12, Rating: 0
RE: Right
By kleinma on 6/20/2012 2:23:28 PM , Rating: 2
You are clearly a hater based on all your posts about Microsoft and it is clear you feel threatened that they are putting out cool devices and software. Now your shit idevice looks old or your crappy fragmented android ecosystem faces a challenge and you are scared. So you post nonsense.

RE: Right
By FITCamaro on 6/20/2012 1:17:12 PM , Rating: 2
Have you actually used Windows Phone yet Reclaimer?

I actually am a bit fond of it. It's snappy and clean cut.

Now programming for it....I like Android better.

RE: Right
By Brandon Hill on 6/20/2012 1:18:26 PM , Rating: 2
Yeah, I prefer the interface of Windows Phone 8 to Android and iOS. It's just that the app support isn't there yet IMHO.

RE: Right
By geddarkstorm on 6/20/2012 1:24:21 PM , Rating: 2
Am I the only one who finds it sad that suspicions were correct, and that Microsoft will not be upgrading phones with WP7 to WP8? Talk about giving all those Lumia 900 buyers a cold shoulder.

RE: Right
By Flunk on 6/20/2012 1:45:46 PM , Rating: 2
Oh yes, I have an HTC HD7 that's about a year old and I feel quite annoyed. Phones should at least get 3 years of updates. To be out in the cold after just over a year is annoying, if i had just bought this phone I would be furious.

Based on sales of my Windows Phone apps I think I'm going to move to cross-platform development and based on this, it looks like Android is going to become my top platform now.

RE: Right
By geddarkstorm on 6/20/2012 2:08:51 PM , Rating: 2
Speaking of cross platform, Mono looks really interesting--letting you do C# and .Net development for WP, Android, and iOS. Android apps made with Mono's C# are supposedly significantly faster than java Android apps (Xobot is a project working on porting all of Android into C#). It's pretty expensive though, and no idea if that's anything like what you use, but I think it's kinda cool.

RE: Right
By Mitch101 on 6/20/2012 5:40:31 PM , Rating: 2
I don't. Were going to get 7.8 most likely well optimized for the single core phones. It should be fine for everything except high end game engines because Microsoft is allowing developers to do native code. in WP8.

This is a much better option than them giving us 8.0 and us having the performance of the single core be a bad experience when we download a game that's too much for a single core. Still I dont need to play Crysis on my phone.

Talk to the iPhone people the experience was bad getting the iOS update it made their phones sluggish at times.

My contract will be up a few months after the WP8 phones arrive. Most likely my carrier will have some upgrade deal if not Im free in just a few more months. No biggie.

RE: Right
By TakinYourPoints on 6/20/2012 8:03:34 PM , Rating: 2
RE: Right
By corduroygt on 6/20/2012 3:23:56 PM , Rating: 3
It's even more ironic that they called other phone owners (presumably Android), "beta testers" in their commercial. Who are the real beta testers now?

RE: Right
By TakinYourPoints on 6/20/2012 11:52:29 PM , Rating: 2
Yeah, egg on their face bigtime for that one. Sticking with a certain level of SoC for so long really bit them.

RE: Right
By damianrobertjones on 6/20/2012 1:28:20 PM , Rating: 2
In all honesty (Looks at the HTC Titan next to him) I wouldn't even notice if there was a dual core cpu in my WP7 phone as it simply does what I ask it to do without freezing, stopping or generally getting bogged down.

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