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LulzSec's latest target is the Arizona police, which it mocked with Spanish profanity after hacking.  (Source: LulzSec)

LulzSec says the hack was in response to a recent anti-illegal immigrant act, which many say amounts to legislating racial profiling. The bill also implements warrantless arrests of individuals who may be U.S. citizens.  (Source: FlagDailyPhoto)

Even after attacks on the U.S. Senate, CIA, an FBI affiliate, UK law enforcement, and now the Ariz. police, international officials seem no closer to catching LulzSec. The group is a splinter faction of the larger hacking collective Anonymous, and formed shortly after its key members hacked HBGary in Feb. 2011.  (Source: Barbara Ling)
Emails, passwords, confidential documents, and more are all stolen from the state of Arizona

LulzSec appears to be taking its promise to hack international governments and banking institutions -- dubbed "op antisec" -- seriously.  The group on Thursday published a treasure trove of information, purloined from Arizona police department servers.

I. Police are Helpless to Stop LulzSec

The group entitled the release "Chinga La Migra", which is Spanish for "F**k the border patrol", according to slang site UrbanDicitionary.

LulzSec appears to have penetrated deeply into servers of at least one Arizona police department, stealing 708 files, which range from training manuals, to internal documents detailing arrests and more.

The documents were posted to popular torrent tracking site The Pirate Bay, with a description that included an ASCII art picture of a machine gun with the text "OFF THE PIGS".

They also posted the real names, usernames, and passwords of seven Arizona Department of Public Safety officials.  They post the home phone numbers of four officials, and the home addresses of three of them -- including a highway patrol officer named Steven G. Loya.

In their press release the group writes:

We are releasing hundreds of private intelligence bulletins, training manuals, personal email correspondence, names, phone numbers, addresses and passwords belonging to Arizona law enforcement. We are targeting AZDPS specifically because we are against SB1070 and the racial profiling anti-immigrant police state that is Arizona.

The documents classified as "law enforcement sensitive", "not for public distribution", and "for official use only" are primarily related to border patrol and counter-terrorism operations and describe the use of informants to infiltrate various gangs, cartels, motorcycle clubs, Nazi groups, and protest movements.
Every week we plan on releasing more classified documents and embarassing personal details of military and law enforcement in an effort not just to reveal their racist and corrupt nature but to purposefully sabotage their efforts to terrorize communities fighting an unjust "war on drugs".

Hackers of the world are uniting and taking direct action against our common oppressors - the government, corporations, police, and militaries of the world. See you again real soon! ;D

S
teve Harrison, a Arizona DPS spokesperson stated, "We are aware of computer issues. We're looking into it. And of course we're taking additional security safeguards."

II. Hack Casts Light on Controversial Law

SB1070, "The Support Our Law Enforcement and Safe Neighborhoods Act",  was passed by the Arizona state legislature last year and signed into law in late April 2010.  The bill was ostensibly designed to crack down on the large amount of illegal immigration from Mexico, the U.S.'s southern neighbor.

The new law contained a number of provisions, including making it a felony offense to transport illegal immigrants and instituting new fines for those caught hiring illegal immigrants.

But its most contentious provision is that it requires "legal" aliens to carry their documents with them at all times, and allows police officers to ask for documents individuals they "suspect" might be illegal aliens, during routine investigations.

The bill's critics say the measure institutes a standard of racial profiling since many illegal aliens are Hispanic.

Polls from mid-2010 [1][2] indicate between 55 and 70 percent of Americans supported the measure.  Of those who didn't support, it, one poll indicates nearly half of them opposed it because they felt it didn't go far enough, surprisingly.  However, a poll by the Associated Press and Univision showed that race was a deep determinant of support, with most whites supporting the poll, but most Hispanics opposing it.  

Some Arizona police officers said that they would not try to enforce the new law out of moral objections, even if they were told to.

Several lawsuits and legal challenges have been filed against the law, which they say amounts to legislated racism and is unconstitutional.  A Federal U.S. District Judge, Susan Bolton, issued an injunction last July, right before the law was set to go into full effect.

She barred several parts of the law, including a provision "authorizing the warrantless arrest of a person" suspected of being an illegal immigrant, a provision that makes it a crime to fail to apply for or carry alien registration papers, and a provision that makes it a crime "for an unauthorized alien to solicit, apply for, or perform work."

While some may have mixed feelings on illegal immigration, they may wish to make note that the act is the latest of multiple bills on a state and federal level that look to expand allowances for warrantless arrests of American citizens not committing crimes.

III. Government Can't Catch LulzSec to Save Their Servers

The recent LulzSec hacks on U.S. government agencies -- which include distributed denial of service takedown of the U.S. Central Intelligence Agencya hack of U.S. Senate servers, and an attack on an affiliate of the U.S. Federal Bureau of Investigation -- have yet again demonstrated an appalling level of incompetence in cybersecurity on a state and federal level.

A recent government audit found that one in three FBI cyber investigations officers was incompetent by industry standards.

Despite rival hackers posting the handles of LulzSec's key players -- "Topiary", "Sabu", and "Kayla" (M) -- they seem no closer to arrest the group's members.

Thus far the only arrest has been a hacker who went by "Chippy1337" (real name: Ryan Cleary).  A former member of the 4-Chan-related hacker collective Anonymous, Mr. Cleary reportedly had published server logs of members of Anonymous.  The group responded by excommunicating the young man and "doxing" him -- reveal his real world identity, including address, online.

Mr. Cleary had marginal ties to LulzSec, maintaining one of their several IRC chat servers.  He was arrested in Britain earlier this week.

Similar to the arrest of Robert Cavenaugh -- another hacker who anger Anonymous -- Mr. Cleary's arrest shows what seems to be a clear effort by LulzSec and/or Anonymous to feed the government supposed members (really enemies of the group) to throw them off their trail.

Recent posts have revealed that LulzSec is a splinter group of Anonymous who wanted to perform higher profile attacks, and thus distanced themselves from the greater group.  The group's members are believed to have orchestrated the February 2011 attacks on security firm HBGary, which cast a light on CEO Aaron Barr's questionable social engineering tactics.  Disgraced, Mr. Barr was forced to resign to "focus on taking care of my family and rebuilding my reputation."


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ILLEGAL allien. Did you miss the illegal part?
By Adonlude on 6/24/2011 11:27:09 AM , Rating: 5
quote:
...and allows police officers to stop individuals they "suspect" might be illegal aliens, even if they have committed no crime.


Wait what? So now entering our country illegally is no longer a crime? Officers can detain anybody with "reasonable suspicion" a crime has been committed. An illegal alien, by definition, has committed a crime. The only possible issue is how reasonable suspicion is established without racial profiling.




RE: ILLEGAL allien. Did you miss the illegal part?
By TSS on 6/24/2011 12:28:55 PM , Rating: 1
I think the point here is the *legal* aliens should have their papers on them at all time because they can be stopped and inspected, even if there's no reason to suspect that person of anything.

In other words, an legal immigrant just walking down the street can be stopped by police to have their identity and status checked. Even if they aren't suspected of anything, they are suspect.

And it's a very serious issue. I'll leave out a yellow star reference but if we don't watch that slippery slope we might get a new thing to refer to.


RE: ILLEGAL allien. Did you miss the illegal part?
By Dorkyman on 6/24/2011 12:43:38 PM , Rating: 4
Could be wrong, but I have read that the FEDERAL government REQUIRES legal aliens to carry their papers with with at all times. This part of the Arizona law just backed it up with local law enforcement.

Also, the Arizona law was modified; an officer cannot simply stop someone because he/she suspects they are an illegal.


By The Raven on 6/24/2011 5:07:57 PM , Rating: 5
I know this is a fact in Japan. When I lived there I had to carry what we called a "gaijin card" on me at all times. I didn't have a problem with that because I was in someone else's country.

I was told that if I lost it, I could be detained in jail until it was proven that I was there legally.

This is neither here nor there, but it is not a big deal to have to "carry papers"... even on Axis soil.

Besides, I have to carry papers in MY OWN BELOVED COUNTRY if I so much as want to take a P!$$ (i.e. IMO excessive amounts of permit reqs).

And of course there are the classic examples of things like driver's licenses and SS cards.
quote:
an officer cannot simply stop someone because he/she suspects they are an illegal.
As you say, this "probable cause" thing that has been going on for quite a while is not voided by this law. People need to get a grip.

Other laws need to be changed IMO. This one is fine in and of itself.


By Omega215D on 6/24/2011 5:23:54 PM , Rating: 3
Most other countries require something similar to papers or documents needing to be carried.

People fail to realize that our state issue IDs and licenses are a form of "papers" that we carry on our persons at most times. If not then either the person knows their social security number or the police can access the DB.


RE: ILLEGAL allien. Did you miss the illegal part?
By Samus on 6/25/11, Rating: -1
RE: ILLEGAL allien. Did you miss the illegal part?
By SunTzu on 6/25/11, Rating: -1
By PReiger99 on 6/25/2011 9:50:06 AM , Rating: 4
You can't be serious. The constitution no matter if it's an American one or one from another country, is the most important document a country can have. It sets general rules/rights/duties/etc that are usually extremely hard to change and as such, it prevents a government to behave like an autocrat.

Around where I live, I don't have to carry ID on me all the time, of course, if I'm arrested (for a valid reason), it will make the process much longer as they will have to determine who I am. But any police officer who just "checking for ID" would not get anything from me. I don't have to until they charge me of a real infraction/crime; I'm not living in a police state and I can thanks my country constitution for that.


RE: ILLEGAL allien. Did you miss the illegal part?
By ihateu3 on 6/26/2011 6:35:23 AM , Rating: 2
Where are all these police that actually follow the law at? They don't around here, or any city I travel to. They do what they want. And I live in an area of cities that are only 30k - 50k populations in Ohio!

If you dare stand up to them, you face getting beat up, or a made up charge that they know you can beat, but also know you have to spend money on a lawyer to do so. I hate to say it, but it seems better to suck up to them than pay money out the ass just to defend your innocence, just so they can do it all over again next week....


RE: ILLEGAL allien. Did you miss the illegal part?
By The0ne on 6/27/2011 4:57:52 AM , Rating: 2
What you've described is everywhere. Most cops are just aholes simply because they are cops and know they can do almost anything they want. Having a law enforced just makes it worse as it leads to profiling and such. And why not, who else is going to cross the border, Japanese people? Still, that does not make it right as it then leads to many other issues with race, color, etc.

I had a copy stopped me to give me a ticket because he saw a girl in my car take a camera shot with a flash. I asked him why he stopped me and he laughing stated he just wanted to make sure it wasn't anything strange. Ok, fine...so why the ticket? Cause I stopped you so I have to give you a ticket so I don't look dumb. Fcking cop.


By mostyle on 6/27/2011 11:49:46 PM , Rating: 2
> Why the ticket?

Several states require by law that documentation (either ticket, warning, field ID) be issued. Now as to why ticket.. That is at the individual's discretion.


By tng on 6/24/2011 7:50:08 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
This part of the Arizona law just backed it up with local law enforcement.
Exactly, AZ enacted most of this as almost a duplicate to EXISTING Federal laws because our National government does not seem to want to enforce their own laws anymore...


RE: ILLEGAL allien. Did you miss the illegal part?
By Lanister on 6/24/2011 12:50:47 PM , Rating: 5
Wow, people are still so clueless about what this law does. SB1070 does NOT allow law enforcement officers to simply stop anyone they see on the street and ask them for their papers. There has to be prior legal contact and then suspicion during that contact for them to ask for ID.

So if you are Illegal and are obeying the law, other than the one you already broke to get here, then you have nothing to worry about. If you get pulled over for speeding, and don't speak English or are unable to provide a valid ID then this law kicks in and the officer is allowed to check into your legal status.

But why bother with the facts of the Law..


By kattanna on 6/24/2011 1:40:34 PM , Rating: 5
quote:
But why bother with the facts of the Law..


um.. because that doesnt make for catchy headlines??


RE: ILLEGAL allien. Did you miss the illegal part?
By adrift02 on 6/24/11, Rating: 0
RE: ILLEGAL allien. Did you miss the illegal part?
By nolisi on 6/24/2011 4:36:35 PM , Rating: 2
Not when I run or take a stroll around the block. Sometimes I go up to the corner store with a $20. Sometimes I take my dog on a walk for a couple miles so he gets his excercise for the day.

It's not unreasonable to be around without ID, and cops can stop you anywhere that's not your private property.

I like how you also assume that it's impossible that ID gets lost, destroyed or stolen as well...


RE: ILLEGAL allien. Did you miss the illegal part?
By tng on 6/24/2011 7:56:37 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
It's not unreasonable to be around without ID, and cops can stop you anywhere that's not your private property.
I don't think it is a good idea to actually leave my property without my ID. My wallet is easy to put into running shorts, and you never know....

As for losing your ID, been there and had to deal with that. That is why I don't leave the house without my ID now, it was quite a hassle.


By kake on 6/25/2011 12:37:54 PM , Rating: 2
Especially if you decide to pick up beer on the way home. They still card me at 30.


By th3pwn3r on 6/25/2011 2:49:43 PM , Rating: 1
Good luck keeping that wallet in your pocket if you actually COULD run :D I normally keep I.D. on me but when I go running at my local park it isn't one of those times. It really doesn't matter either since they have a massive data base with every LEGAL person here in it. The flags go up when a search comes back empty. Carrying I.D. does make things a lot easier for law enforcement though, I won't deny that.


By The0ne on 6/27/2011 5:02:23 AM , Rating: 1
I don't think this is the problem. The problem comes about when officers make an excuse to stop someone because of their profiling. They can claim whatever they want in stopping the person or group but not call cops follow the law to the dot. Hell, normal officers don't even do this. See my other reply about being stopped because of a camera flash and being ticketed because he didn't want to look stupid...all the while smiling and giggling like a little bitch.

It would be nice if all law enforcement officers follow it but you know as well as I do that not all do. It's just human nature to have aholes in any loaction at any time.


By soyItaliana on 6/30/2011 4:45:34 PM , Rating: 2
Oh like " I thought you had a busted tail light when I stopped you but I guess not, while I have you stopped though I need to see your papers" ? : )


RE: ILLEGAL allien. Did you miss the illegal part?
By Bostlabs on 6/24/2011 1:50:30 PM , Rating: 3
Incorrect.

Police officers cannot simply stop someone because they appear to not be legal. There HAS to be another reason for the stop. Speeding, out of date tags, caught in a criminal act, etc.. before an Officer and inquire on their legal status.


RE: ILLEGAL allien. Did you miss the illegal part?
By chenjf on 6/24/2011 2:27:19 PM , Rating: 2
The issue is that most people are only seeing that illegals are doing the crime. What happens if they witness a crime or was a victim of a crime? Do they have to think twice before reporting it?


By Bostlabs on 6/24/2011 2:43:52 PM , Rating: 2
Heck we (AZ) have many crimes that are not done by illegals.
As far as identification goes, I carry mine every where I go. Why shouldn't everyone have too?


By Bostlabs on 6/24/2011 3:01:44 PM , Rating: 2
Sorry, I misunderstood what you were saying.

I've worked with several people of Mexican ancestry, many were citizens, several I suspected were not, and a few that I knew were not here legally (but of course couldn't really prove) and the answer to your question was (before SB1070) probably less that 25% would report the crime in the first place.

However, the same is probably true for the rest of AZ as well.


By cmdrdredd on 6/24/2011 3:53:35 PM , Rating: 2
You are REQUIRED BY FEDERAL LAW to have your papers on you AT ALL TIMES! Plus, 99% of these cases are traffic infractions. Driver has no license, so you have to figure out exactly who this person is. Don't you carry an ID with you? I thought so...now go complain about how carrying an ID on you and you being a citizen is violating some right. It's not and nobody will listen to you because you're stupid.


RE: ILLEGAL allien. Did you miss the illegal part?
By KCjoker on 6/24/2011 7:08:42 PM , Rating: 2
What a complete load of nonsense. It doesn't matter how difficult it is to become a citizen of ANY country. If you don't follow that countries laws to become a citizen there then you don't want to be there bad enough. Do you have any idea how hard it is to become a citizen in Mexico? Their rules are more diffuclt than the USA's.


So tired of racism
By soyItaliana on 6/24/2011 4:23:48 PM , Rating: 1
I am an American and I couldn't be more ashamed to say thatthan right now! Look, I understand wanting to get all the drug lords out of here. But don't put your noses up ok? There are plenty of WHITE AMERICANS that are dealers too! Do you honestly believe that the Mexicans just dropped drugs over here and the US has never seen or heard of these drugs before! Chale...(as some of my mexican friends might say) The majority of Mexicans come here to work and do jobs that I know my fellow Americans wouldn't do. Has anyone noticed the price of produce since this happened? Its BS! My Mexican husband is stuck in Mexico now because we don't have 10k to pay off the imigration government. haha isnt that a laugh? Has nothing to do with them checking his background or has he ever been in trouble in Mexico its about the almighty friggn dollar!He is a good man never did a drug in his life and has no criminal background. No wonder they sneak over here, the US makes it too hard to come to live or to get a Visa its all about the money! Money money money. I hate my country! Q ODIO A MI PAIZ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This country is not as clean as all the upidy people want to claim, if they were then we'd do thorough checks for people who want to come and not charge them a crazy dollar amount! A dam doctor from Mexico is probably the only one who could afford this crapola!




RE: So tired of racism
By The Raven on 6/24/2011 5:55:10 PM , Rating: 3
I guess you see this policy as racism because you are married to a Mexican I suppose. "Mexican" is not a race. It is a demonym. That means if you are white German-Mexican (many people here in the US do not realize that there are many like this) then you are to be treated the same way BY LAW. And unfortunately "by law" is as good as we can do because there are racists out there and unfortunate events can and do happen. But the alternative is to have anarchy where frankly racism would be even worse.
quote:
There are plenty of WHITE AMERICANS that are dealers too!
Yes, and we know that because they get arrested too.

Also, I would think that there are less light skinned Mexicans over here because of the racism that is rampant in Mexico. Don't believe me? Turn on Univision and count how many mestizos you see reporting the news. There is probably one doing the weather.

So I wouldn't put too much on racism here. Is it bad policy? That is a valid concern.

Yes, I agree that the immigration policy is horrible. But we need to have and respect law to keep order. Once you cannot find a solution within the system to change the law is it expedient to practice civil disobedience (illegally immigrating) but with all civil disobedience you must do so knowing and respecting the consequences (deportation).
quote:
No wonder they sneak over here, the US makes it too hard to come to live or to get a Visa its all about the money! Money money money.
Why did your husband come here? "Money, money, money?" Money motivates people everywhere. Trust me, your country is doing alright compared to other countries. I know he may have come to be with you, but then why did you not emigrate to Mexico instead? It always goes back to money (or safety, which costs a lot of money to have in Mexico these days).

The fact is that the US makes it too EASY to live here...illegally. If we upheld the law that we had, then I suppose you wouldn't have been torn from your husband because he would've never been here in the first place and you would both be down living happily on a farm in Michoacan together.

I do not want to talk immigration policy with you because I think we would agree, but with regard to the law it seems that you and I are at odds. I believe that the law needs to be respected (in this case the federal law is being upheld) until it is proven broken. But our form of law is not broken because you see that we are discussing reform constantly these days. It is just a matter of deciding which way we want to go.

Please be patient and also proud of your country to the extents that you should be proud of it. Don't just right off all the good based on one issue even if you are right on that issue.

And above all I wish you the best of luck getting back with your husband. Frankly I would take my chances in Mexico. Even with the danger. We all die sometime. At least in Mexico you won't die of litigation like we are all prone to here in the US. ;-)

In closing, get rid of minimum wage and payroll taxes, end the drug war, and let my damn people go already! (I'm a half-Mexican libertarian if you couldn't tell ;-)


RE: So tired of racism
By soyItaliana on 6/26/2011 1:14:14 PM , Rating: 2
And if you're reaally part Mexican ( I did come cross the end of the post while scrolling down) Eres un veruenza! Q pena q eres asi! Quizas tu piel es oscura pero eres gringo por endentro cabronsito!!!!


RE: So tired of racism
By The Raven on 6/27/2011 11:25:22 AM , Rating: 2
Yes, I am no only part-Mexican, but HALF Mexican.

You are exhibiting prejudice as racist as those who you revile.
#1 I am "white" (though my dad and his family are all "dark")
#2 I do not speak Spanish (fluently anyway). It has always been on my to do list, but my job requires that I focus on Japanese. So anyway, I had to use an online translator to read your insults.

Look I don't know where you get off insulting me... I said that I probably agreed with you on policy (though I'm not sure what you believe should be done)...
quote:
I do not want to talk immigration policy with you because I think we would agree , but with regard to the law it seems that you and I are at odds.

I'm sorry if anything I said was interpereted as an attack on you. Let's not make this personal. It is an international problem. I spoke of it as such.

But you firing back like this make me wonder what you would propose? Lawlessness? My point is that we need law. You make it sound like you think that people are either anarchists or racists.

And also my point was that there is racism everywhere, not just the United States. Say what you will to prove me wrong on these points, but please keep the racist personal attacks to a minimum.

Again, I feel for you and your husband in your situation. But I cannot come to a discussion on immigration and base my opinion of the law solely on the emotion I feel when I hear stories such as yours (and I do not mean that to be offensively dismissive at all). I feel sad and then realize that we do need law. I can't just feel sad and then decide that just because I'm sad that we need to open the borders. It either makes sense or it doesn't. My personal feelings are irrelevant. Though that could act as the catalyst for me to push for reform (which I do).
I subscribe to the Libertarian party's platform here...
quote:
3.4 Free Trade and Migration
We support the removal of governmental impediments to free trade. Political freedom and escape from tyranny demand that individuals not be unreasonably constrained by government in the crossing of political boundaries. Economic freedom demands the unrestricted movement of human as well as financial capital across national borders. However, we support control over the entry into our country of foreign nationals who pose a credible threat to security, health or property.
http://www.lp.org/platform

And while we're at it...
quote:
3.5 Rights and Discrimination
We condemn bigotry as irrational and repugnant. Government should not deny or abridge any individual's rights based on sex, wealth, race, color, creed, age, national origin, personal habits, political preference or sexual orientation. Parents, or other guardians, have the right to raise their children according to their own standards and beliefs.


RE: So tired of racism
By soyItaliana on 6/27/2011 3:14:55 PM , Rating: 2
Ok, maybe I was a little hard on you. I am Italian and its hard wired in to be hot headed and emotional : ( but when you implied that I am only upset because I am married to a Mexican, it made me feel like you thought I was shallow. Even if things didn't work out with him and I, I will still feel the same about what this country is doing and how they're doing it. In your post there were just some keywords that caused me to see red as some would say. I want everyone to be proud of who they are on the inside. Not be so proud that a person would be racist though. I will not pretend to understand all the poiltics involved in this, but I do know in your second recomendation about governing the law not being misused and so on, may I ask you something? Who will be in the streets making sure this happens? I am not trying to argue with you anymore, I just don't feel secure that if we shake our finger at big brother and say hey no racial profiling that they will just listen ya know? Did you mention your skin is white even though you are hlaf Mexican? I am part Italian and my skin is white as snow, so it is fair to say that you and I will never know what it feels like to be stopped walking our dog, or just going down to the corner store and be questioned because we look illega ( how does an illegal look anyway?) A loaded down truck filled with produce? Come on man...it just isn't right. I never said I thought the borders should be wide open, but the hard working people that came here illegaly should not be spoken to or about like they're animals or aliens from another planet. Do you know about the factories in Mexico that the US owns that uses Mexican women over there as slaves and the mexican government turning a blind eye because we pay them very well? What about all those young women raped and killed or worse burried alive? In order to start some kind of reform I personally feel all these new laws need to be removed completely to show good faith that we are not a racist country. Then everyone needs to come back to the table and Mexico needs to be involved too. It needs to be easier( finacially) for them to come to work or visit and go through a complete list of checks in Mexico and if theyre caught doing drrugs, drinking and driving, selling drugs any violent crimes they are deported. I agree with that. And of course I know there is racism in every country. And it is foolish no matter where it is. I have lost faith in my country for good reason. My fondest memory of my country is back in the 80's and 90's when I was growing up. My issues while have alot to do with this issue at hand it doesn't stop there,and did not just happen over night. It has been decling for many years, in short I feel like we have just gone mad here. As far as my insults I am sorry, I do get very emotional. For the most part I would describe my words to you as being harsh or scoulding more than let's say filthy. The only bad word I uused was cabron and for that again I'm sorry.

Ok...and for the person who didn't like the song I cut and pasted on here : ) What can I say I was born in the 70's and I'm just one of those goofy,emotional lets hold hands in a circle, why can't we all just get along type of girl : ) I'm sowwee...


RE: So tired of racism
By The Raven on 6/28/2011 2:11:01 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
when you implied that I am only upset because I am married to a Mexican, it made me feel like you thought I was shallow.
Sorry, I meant that I see it as why you think it is racism. And to tell you the truth I meant to say a "dark" Mexican. If you were married to a "white" Mexican then you would not see it as racism, I guess. I was just trying to show that the matter is Americans vs. Mexicans (so to speak) and not white skin vs. brown skin. People who think Mexicans (not dark-skinned people) are a threat to the economy, their jobs or whatever. Are there racist people here in America? Most definitely. But we cannot just say that everyone here is racist. That is totally unfair and untrue of the majority of people who push these types of laws. I say this in defense of them, even though I disagree with their long-term policy.
quote:
I will not pretend to understand all the poiltics involved in this, but I do know in your second recomendation about governing the law not being misused and so on, may I ask you something? Who will be in the streets making sure this happens? I am not trying to argue with you anymore, I just don't feel secure that if we shake our finger at big brother and say hey no racial profiling that they will just listen ya know?
The short answer is: good cops. That is all we can do. And unfortunately, even some good cops see so much of the negative sides of society that they develop prejudices as an unavoidable consequence of what they experience on the job. So racism on the job for a cop might be unavoidable I think, but as I said in a different post, the requirement that cops have probable cause has been around for sometime and is sufficient for our discussion. Yes there are people out there with badges and guns... do we trust them? We'll why wouldn't we if we are the ones who asked them to patrol the streets?
quote:
Did you mention your skin is white even though you are hlaf Mexican? I am part Italian and my skin is white as snow, so it is fair to say that you and I will never know what it feels like to be stopped walking our dog, or just going down to the corner store and be questioned because we look illegal ( how does an illegal look anyway?) A loaded down truck filled with produce? Come on man...it just isn't right.
Well again probable cause is key here. What you speak of is what led to the Watts riots in LA. These laws state that if someone is stopped and questioned for another reason (e.g. speeding) then when they hand the cop their L&R the cop can check to see if they are legal just like they will do with "whites". They cannot just raid a quinceañera and ask for everyone's papers. Besides, have you ever been somewhere like California where there is a large latino population? There are so many latinos that that is all the cops would have time to do: just checking IDs all day lol.
quote:
I never said I thought the borders should be wide open, but the hard working people that came here illegaly should not be spoken to or about like they're animals or aliens from another planet.
I'm not sure what you are referring to, but that is true. No one should be treated like an animal.
quote:
As far as my insults I am sorry, I do get very emotional.
Apology accepted. You definitely get a pass here because you are understandably upset about the situation with your husband. I would expect nothing less as far as emotion goes. I'm just trying to be a voice of reason. Because reason often gets thrown out the window when our emotions take over.

I'm still wondering how you two ended up in the US even though your husband is somehow ineligible to be a resident.


RE: So tired of racism
By soyItaliana on 6/29/2011 1:26:12 PM , Rating: 2
I respectfully disagree that they are a threat to our economy, I don't see any ilegals coming over taking jobs from " the white man" my husband refused to come here under a fake name, he came here iegally this is true, but while he was here he was offered ss numbers from many whites selling them for 300 -400-500 and refused he worked here under the same name he used in Mexico and just paid into the ilegal status tax pool and most know what I'm talking about. I hear so many people say they come here take our benefits and dont pay our taxes. HA! Thats all I have to say about that.

And as far as everyday cops somehow being racist as a product of their enviroment no amor no. Listen I know its a hard job very hard and so dangerous and that is why we are not all cops right? But you have to be self disciplined be prejadist of the crimes not of skin color. I'm going to share a little TMI with you, when I was 12 a Mexican neighbor had her nephew from Mexico over well this family was always so nice to me, my mom was always working to pay the bills and the mother over there always fed me ( I loved her white rice) : ) anyway long story short the nephew forced himself on me and I carried hatred for a long time against the race that made me an ass whole but the difference is I'm not anymore. It is ignorant to judge all people from that race on some people that are idiots. What if I said all white men are pedaphiles just because there are alot out there? Wouldn't be cool right?

You ask how my husband and I got to where we are today? Its simple he came here ilegally we were together for 2 years then we got married here in Florida through the clerk of the circuit court. He went back to see his 2 daughters, I couldn't go with him because I have a daughter and her father is a butt head and would not give me permission to get a passport for her. Even now, he will not et me take her even to The Embassy for an appointment if we could get up the 5k it would take. Its a nightmare! Her father pays no child support sees her at his leasure and is having a baby with someone else, its a control thing. He can't control anything else in my life, but he knows I will not leave here without her even to visit my husband in Mexico. And my husband's ineligibilty is only from the Italian disease " FUNDS-R-LOW" haha but seriously jokes aside the only thing stopping him from coming back here is money. God Bless you and all I ask of you is to take a good look in the mirror babe. There is a lot of pressure here to be as white as you can be. Just don't sacrafice your values please. Love who you are and be proud. And always ask yourself before speaking or acting WWJD? Peace my friend


RE: So tired of racism
By The Raven on 7/1/2011 2:05:36 AM , Rating: 2
You misunderstood me on a couple of things:
1) I do not think immigrants are a threat to the economy. I was talking about that as a reason that others are resistant to allow people in easily (illegal or legal). I mentioned this because you say it is racism. I say it is not and that it is more of a difference of opinion from people like you a and me who think cheap (or skilled) labor is good for the economy. I'm saying that just because someone wants to beef up the border or what not doesn't make them a racist. And that is a serious charge. That is like calling someone a pedophile without any case against them.

2) RE: racist cops: I'm just saying that there will always be racist cops (or at least cops who use race to make decisions) and some of them are raised that way and others become that way through other means like what I said and also your story of the kid from Mexico. You have bad experiences and your views are changed. You know how difficult it can be to change that as a result of your experience.
quote:
He went back to see his 2 daughters, I couldn't go with him because I have a daughter and her father is a butt head and would not give me permission to get a passport for her.
Ahh... the ol' "broken home" story... I've heard this one too many times (and no I'm not judging you, as I am the product of a broken home myself). I met several Brasileros and Peruanos in Japan who could not marry their "fiance" because their legal spouse would not agree to divorce because they would lose their immigration status and be deported. Some just did it on paper to get into the country, but many were nice couples who fell out of love or what have you. And then they couldn't get on with their lives because they couldn't get divorced. They told me that there were ways around this but that it cost money and a lot of effort. (Again, this is an example that no country is perfect, racism is everywhere and so you shouldn't be so down on the US.)

So what to do? Maybe you can call your ex's bluff and tell him that he can have full custody of your daughter so that you can go to Mexico. Being a deadbeat, he will refuse and you can use that against him in court to get full custody. Well that is how it works in the movies anyway lol. But best of luck to you with that. As I said, my parents were divorced when I was 4 y/o and that had a huge impact on me. It was an ugly divorce with a lot of fighting throughout my formative years. So I wish you and especially your daughter the best.
quote:
There is a lot of pressure here to be as white as you can be. Just don't sacrafice your values please. Love who you are and be proud. And always ask yourself before speaking or acting WWJD?
I've never been pressured to be white so I'm not sure what you are talking about. I am white skinned Mexican, but I am a freedom loving American on the inside. Unfortunately it seems most people in the US forget where they came from... a rag tag bunch of people who cherished their freedom: people who fought and died for their freedom or people who emmigrated here for freedom at great expense. Freedom is what this country was founded on and we should hold that dear. You should hold that dear. Don't be ashamed to be an American. Jesus wouldn't deny the principles that made our country great in the first place, he would try to restore them. (Peter would be the one to deny his heritage...3 times!!! ;-)


RE: So tired of racism
By soyItaliana on 7/1/2011 12:50:13 PM , Rating: 2
oh wow, a man who knows his bible? awsome! I will keep this short as we have pretty much talked everything out huh? The only thing out of all that you said that I want to reply about is my ex and my daughter. I ove her so much, I just won't take chances that she might think I am was serious. That would look like I was willing to leave her here and me go onto Mexico and start a new life. No way! She has had her heart broken enough and she is only 9 I am the only person in this world that she has man, I love her so much. I wouldn't even play like I was going to do something like that I just cant. If that means I can't be with my husband well then I guess I'll just have to live with it and be sad until she is older and can go with me. But there again, its not fair to make him wait for me that long either. I give up!


RE: So tired of racism
By The Raven on 7/1/2011 4:03:43 PM , Rating: 2
Oh I wasn't serious on that one...but speaking of someone who knows their bible...it is like the wisdom of Solomon, no? ;-)
It is like threatening to cut a baby in half. Only in the old testament is it considered wise to threaten something liek that lol. Try doing that in today's America... whoo... you'd be considered a dangerous psychopath.

In conclusion, please continue to fight the good fight to allow more hard working people over here, but please don't accuse people of being racist as their reason to want the borders difficult to cross. It is mean spirited and turns people off to the real argument.


SB1070
By borismkv on 6/24/2011 12:21:47 PM , Rating: 5
I think you need to read the actual law, folks. There's a lot of hype around this law that is just outright stupid. For instance, the whole, "Show me your papers" rhetoric is idiotic. Legal immigrants are already required to carry papers when driving. It's called a driver's license. And legal immigrants are also required to carry their visa with them when they pass through border patrol checkpoints. The main purpose of this law is to allow enforcement of existing immigration laws beyond the 100 mile enforcement zone allowed to the Border Patrol. And the law doesn't specify allowances for "Warrantless arrests" but rather requires police personnel to contact INS if a specific individual does not provide identification.

Then there's the fact that it makes human trafficking a Felony (not a misdemeanor), and trafficking in unaccompanied minors a serious felony. And if you haven't already read what some human traffickers do to the people they ferry, you should. It is not uncommon for them to take what little funds an immigrant is willing to provide for illegal entry and either kill them or leave them to die in the desert.

I also don't think you guys realize what the lack of proper border patrol enforcement does to the state of Arizona. There are entire towns down here that have been taken over by cartels. A number of the fires that are burning down homes and laying waste to the countryside were allegedly caused by signal and camp fires created by scouts for human trafficking and immigrants themselves. Immigrants also tend to leave a trail of garbage like you would not believe. The popular trafficking routes tend to resemble garbage dumps for the amount of refuse that is left behind.




RE: SB1070
By Bostlabs on 6/24/2011 1:39:15 PM , Rating: 3
borismkv, thank you!

I live in Phoenix and while it isn't as bad as further south, at least yet, it isn't pretty.

Every time I visit Tucson it appears to get worse and worse. I won't travel any farther south than Tucson anymore unless it is required for work.

I love this state and all we are trying to do is get a handle on the situation. If you arrived here legally and went through the proper steps I welcome you! If you have gotten here by hook or crook and are contributing to the crime rate or stealing someone's identity to get State support, driving without a lic or insurance or are part of the drug trade I DO NOT WANT YOU HERE! I don't care what color your skin is but if you are doing any of that you are scum and need to be sent back.


RE: SB1070
By Omega215D on 6/24/2011 5:47:42 PM , Rating: 2
And if they think this country is tough, try going to Asia or Europe. My friends, who are from those places, tell me I should have my papers in order before heading out there.

Even though my dad was born and raised in Hong Kong if he wants to go back to visit he needs to have his passport and visa at all times.


A recent government audit...
By mherlund on 6/24/2011 11:13:23 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
A recent government audit found that one in three FBI cyber investigations officers was incompetent by industry standards.


Maybe there will be some openings...?




RE: A recent government audit...
By fic2 on 6/24/2011 11:58:08 AM , Rating: 5
If they got rid of everyone in gov't that was incompetent there wouldn't be anyone left.


RE: A recent government audit...
By th3pwn3r on 6/25/2011 2:46:05 PM , Rating: 2
Haha, sadly, I believe this is almost true.


Dangerous Joker mentality
By quiksilvr on 6/24/2011 10:17:42 AM , Rating: 1
There is a method to the madness, but it is madness nontheless. Putting home address, numbers and actual names of cops in Arizona, aka New New Mexico is essentially putting out a hit.

Killing these men will solve nothing except push the law forward so please don't even consider it. Death is rarely the answer and it isn't the answer in this case.




RE: Dangerous Joker mentality
By MrBlastman on 6/24/2011 10:43:17 AM , Rating: 2
Exactly. Lulz crossed the line a while ago. Before it was funny to watch, now it is cringeworthy because of all the lives they are impacting--potentially beyond the electronic world and into the physical.

I suggest that once they are caught, since they are so bent on releasing private, personal information on us, that we string them up publicly in "stocks" and should any of these releases lead to the death of private citizens or public servants--they be given a public execution. It is only just. Martyrs or not, a good drawing and quartering would do them some good--it'd send a message that malicious hacking and destruction of private lives is no longer tolerated. No longer is it a road towards wealth and fame.

If their crimes don't lead to the physical harm of innocents, making them spend a few months in "stocks" in a busy public square (perhaps ship them around the country/world) so people can spit on them before they're shipped off to prison would be fitting.


RE: Dangerous Joker mentality
By tng on 6/24/2011 8:08:13 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
send a message that malicious hacking and destruction of private lives is no longer tolerated. No longer is it a road towards wealth and fame.
I wonder how many of these people have actually thought that through. Do they realize that there are REAL people out there that have real families that can be hurt or killed by release of the info? Could they be that socially stunted or are they aware of the potential damage to peoples lives that they caused?


RE: Dangerous Joker mentality
By Bostlabs on 6/24/2011 2:01:05 PM , Rating: 3
Yes and we've had enough death of Border Patrol Agents, Police Officers and Private Citizens over what is happening on our southern border.

Then there is the deaths of people involved in the drug trade to consider.

Then add land being destroyed, property being destroyed, entire sections of parks that are labeled as unsafe with signage from the Federal Government. But the Feds state the the border is safer than it has ever been.

Really? I just saw a news story that said that the Mexican Army had crossed the border into Arizona. They said they were lost. Hello? There are clear signs, if not destroyed, that state when you are entering the United States.

But our border is safe...


too bad
By p05esto on 6/24/2011 10:34:33 AM , Rating: 3
Bummer, I was liking LulzSec and thought they were fighting a fine fight. But now they are supporting illegal immigrants who are here wrecking the country? Illegals causing crimes, trafficking drugs, starting wildfires for distraction, etc etc etc and LulzSec takes their side? I'm formally now AGAINST LulzSec and will be speaking out against these pimple-faced dorks at every opportunity. What morons.




RE: too bad
By Taft12 on 6/24/2011 11:06:58 AM , Rating: 1
You're allowed to oppose both bad legislation AND illegal immigration.

The world doesn't exist in black and white, George W Bush.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/You%27re_either_with_...


RE: too bad
By LRonaldHubbs on 6/24/2011 1:23:20 PM , Rating: 2
On the other hand, if you support a group on one issue while ignoring their actions on other issues, you're following another very dangerous doctrine:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_enemy_of_my_enemy...


RE: too bad
By th3pwn3r on 6/25/2011 2:54:13 PM , Rating: 1
You guys are missing the point LulzSec is making. If you want to abuse power you're going to be abused.


Hackers Aware of PR Now?
By bplewis24 on 6/24/2011 10:25:03 AM , Rating: 2
I find this pretty funny. Members of this hacking group clearly realize public sentiment is turning against them, so they stage this hack to try and win back some public relations favor in a positive light.

Sorry, but we still know what you're about...and it ain't civil rights.




RE: Hackers Aware of PR Now?
By chick0n on 6/24/2011 11:08:35 AM , Rating: 2
you don't get it? they're trying to get out of their mom's basement ! They never had the balls to walk out the door to begin with. so they need as much fame/name they can get, at least it can make themselves proud in the lonely and dark basement.


This doesn't sound particularly racist to me...
By borismkv on 6/24/2011 12:26:23 PM , Rating: 2
Leaked documents "describe the use of informants to infiltrate various gangs, cartels, motorcycle clubs, Nazi groups, and protest movements"

Since when did the Mexicans start taking over Motorcycle clubs and Nazi groups? lolwut?!




By Bostlabs on 6/24/2011 1:47:19 PM , Rating: 2
The connection is via the drug trade.


Nothing serious
By borismkv on 6/24/2011 2:03:12 PM , Rating: 2
So, after talking with a buddy of mine who works in IT at the county level in AZ, the data they got was nothing important. The sensitive data is in a secured network that Lulzsec didn't (or couldn't) break in to, so it doesn't look like any operative IDs will be leaked. Publicizing personal info on police officers is a douchebag move, but doesn't sound like they're going to out any ongoing operational info, cause they didn't get it.




RE: Nothing serious
By Bostlabs on 6/24/2011 2:08:56 PM , Rating: 2
I'll have a chance to talk to a friend of mine that is an Officer of the Chandler AZ PD. It should be interesting.


LulzSec Clothing!
By TheLulzBoat on 6/24/11, Rating: 0
RE: LulzSec Clothing!
By th3pwn3r on 6/25/2011 3:00:01 PM , Rating: 2
That's way too much for a T-shirt.


Looking for
By Scootie on 6/24/2011 3:35:07 PM , Rating: 2
I was 99% certain that after what did to Sony Lulzec will target Apple.




lulzsec sucks
By Rob94hawk on 6/25/2011 12:42:20 AM , Rating: 2
lulsec are prolly a bunch of idiots that work out of their parents basement and have no clue how the real world works. 10 years from now they'll all be employed at McDonalds and be married to some fat ugly chick with 3 kids.




Hey Lulz...
By Alkapwn on 6/25/2011 3:20:12 AM , Rating: 2
Target China next please. Show them how its really done.




By overlandpark4me on 6/25/2011 9:06:08 PM , Rating: 2
because if I was in Mexico or any Europeon country, they would randomly stop me, ask me for my passport, then throw me in jail if I couldn't produce it. In the State's people are having a cow because of laws that have been passed that ask for I.D. to vote. It comes down to a political party that will compromise our security for votes.




Hang Them!!!
By 123 Of Much on 6/27/2011 12:56:57 PM , Rating: 2
I would say that hacking these sights and releasing information is paramount to ESPIONAGE !!!!
""""PUNISHABLE BY DEATH"""""
GIVE THEM WHAT THEY DESERVE...
"'HANG THEM'"

That'll show the next generation of "ESPIONAGE-type hackers
Not to F*%k w/ the "United"-States...




Different color same principle...
By soyItaliana on 6/26/11, Rating: -1
By Skywalker123 on 6/26/2011 11:39:33 PM , Rating: 2
I was with you until you posted the retarded song.


Can't wait
By michal1980 on 6/24/11, Rating: -1
RE: Can't wait
By MrBlastman on 6/24/11, Rating: 0
RE: Can't wait
By Taft12 on 6/24/2011 11:10:10 AM , Rating: 5
You guys realize that posting on DT to flaunt your erections over the thought of some lulzsec prison rape is pretty much the same "hiding behind a screenname" as what lulzsec has done, right?


RE: Can't wait
By MrBlastman on 6/24/2011 11:19:07 AM , Rating: 1
Who cares? It is just speaking of reality. The reality of the matter is--prison is not a pleasant place.

Also, it is NOT the same thing. I have not released the real names of innocent, law-abiding people. I have not released personal information of government employees. I have not cost municipalities and businesses millions of dollars in expenses to fix their equipment after a hack.

If they want to go gallavanting around like they are "Robin Hood," then they need to have a thick enough skin to tolerate the masses throwing tomatos at them.


RE: Can't wait
By Wiggy Mcshades on 6/24/2011 10:18:28 AM , Rating: 5
Humans have always used their intelligence to their own benefit, why should anyone do any different? These people don't think they're "tough" they think of themselves as intelligent, alas the security measures they've employed for themselves. Although it's ironic you're actually the one typing out taunts from behind a keyboard directed at people who won't read them after talking about being "a man".


RE: Can't wait
By michal1980 on 6/24/2011 1:33:05 PM , Rating: 2
because he's 'benefit' is coming at the expense of others. He's not creating anything, he's destroying things.

If I use my intelligence to kill people for their money, would you defined that action as well?


RE: Can't wait
By Mitch101 on 6/24/2011 10:24:51 AM , Rating: 3
LulzSec site taken down by lone-wolf hacker
http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/blog/2011/jun...

Name(s): Xavier Kaotico, Xavier de Leon

Email: [redacted by the Guardian]

Age: 30 as of 2011-06-21

Location: Possibly New York City, NY (has lived there)

Websites: sabu.net, pure-elite.org, confinement.org

Profession: Independent IT consultant

Interests: Python programming, Linux, network security, exploit development


RE: Can't wait
By icanhascpu on 6/24/2011 12:29:26 PM , Rating: 1
False.

Their site is kept accessible through snapshots and redundancy. Jester and the like are making themselves the brunt of many-a-joke.


RE: Can't wait
By Aloonatic on 6/24/2011 1:27:48 PM , Rating: 2
This happened the other day, not sure if it had anything to do with it.

http://twitpic.com/5ewplw


RE: Can't wait
By Murloc on 6/24/2011 10:28:07 AM , Rating: 3
it's better to do this than starting a punch fight with a legislator. It's more effective. Who cares about being though?


I'm glad LulzSec is doing this
By BigToque on 6/24/11, Rating: -1
RE: I'm glad LulzSec is doing this
By Yames on 6/24/2011 12:02:17 PM , Rating: 2
How does being a cop from Arizona have anything to do with a law that was passed by the legislature of Arizona. For all we know these cops that were "exposed" could be against these laws.

You may not like the law, but it was passed through proper channels. The only thing corrupt here is the lulz dorks.


RE: I'm glad LulzSec is doing this
By Bostlabs on 6/24/2011 3:46:53 PM , Rating: 2
Yes and they know their spouses info, their children's info, where they live, how to contact them, etc...

These jokers should be charged with any crime that happens to these innocent people. Funny, they publicly stated that they wouldn't do that. Shows how far that they can be 'trusted' to honor their word. That would be zero.

When they are caught, and they will be, I hope Bubba visits them several times and loves them long time.


RE: I'm glad LulzSec is doing this
By BigToque on 6/25/2011 1:26:25 AM , Rating: 2
The children! The children! Won't someone please think of the children?!?

Don't do things you shouldn't be doing and you have nothing to worry about. Isn't that how it goes?

Do the right thing, and people will take care of you.


RE: I'm glad LulzSec is doing this
By Bostlabs on 6/27/2011 1:12:49 PM , Rating: 2
So you are saying it is ok that their family can be targeted and it is perfectly fine if they get hurt, kidnapped or killed?

It's a very sad world we live in now if this is the new norm.


RE: I'm glad LulzSec is doing this
By th3pwn3r on 6/25/2011 3:08:10 PM , Rating: 1
Your hopes of "Bubba" visiting someone are morally wrong as well. You're no better than LulzSec, maybe even worse. What good could come out of Bubba's visits? At least Lulzsec may push some good changes to take effect. Only time will tell though.


RE: I'm glad LulzSec is doing this
By Bostlabs on 6/27/2011 1:16:04 PM , Rating: 2
Perhaps, but there is a price from what they are doing. Bubba is only part of the price.

Don't want to pay that price. Don't do the crime for the Lolz.

As for me being no better than LolzSec.... I will get no joy or LOlz out of that happening to them. They made the choice to do what they did for the lolz. There is a price for their fun. I expect them to pay that in full. If part of that price is Bubba then so be it.


RE: I'm glad LulzSec is doing this
By th3pwn3r on 6/25/2011 3:05:05 PM , Rating: 1
I agree and it all comes down to morals in the end. If my work is pushing me towards doing something shady then I'll find a new job instead of knowing I don't have to worry about it because consequences for my actions will be non-existent.


Hope that this turns out for the best...
By wewter on 6/24/11, Rating: -1
RE: Hope that this turns out for the best...
By tng on 6/24/2011 8:18:30 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
We should praise this work, and realize that they have the potential to do much evil, yet are using their powers for the good of the community as a whole.
Yeah, it really doesn't matter that some innocent cop's family member may be killed, after all it was for the right reason...

Get real.

quote:
I hope that the media sensationalizing LulzSec does not demonize them in the eyes of the public
To late, they did that themselves.


By Bostlabs on 6/27/2011 1:20:48 PM , Rating: 2
Agreed tng.

These guys doing it for the good? HorseHocky!

They've stated very clearly that they are doing it for the LOLZ. They won't be laughing when they are caught.


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