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Accusations and counter-accusations hurl regarding hacking

The U.S. claims China is actively stealing U.S. companies' intellectual property and hacking the federal government.  China accuses American hackers of attacking government sites and trying to stir insurrection.  The strong accusations are casting an awkward shadow on America's relationship with its second largest trade partner, a nation that it heavily relies on for its manufacturing needs.

I. White House: China Hacking Must Stop

Following statements by the White House that there would be consequences for Chinese hacking, National Security Adviser Thomas Donilo hurled more criticism at the Asian superpower this week.  He said President Barack Obama wants a friendlier relationship with China, but that the hacking issues are stifling his hopes.

In a speech before the Asia Society in New York he accused China of creating "a growing challenge" to economic relations, via the hacking.  He says that U.S. intellectual property is being stolen through "cyber intrusions emanating from China at a very large scale."

He says that the President is trying, noting that he "engaged with China at an unprecedented pace, including twelve face-to-face meetings with [departing Chinese Prime Minister] Hu Jintao."

He concludes, "We have worked hard to build a constructive bilateral relationship that allows us to engage forthrightly on priority issues.  The United States and China, the world’s two largest economies, both dependent on the Internet, must lead the way in addressing this problem."

President Obama
President Obama and Security Adviser Thomas Donilo [Image Source: White House/Flickr]

China gives a counter case-study in which if found 140,000 attacks a month to be directed against a pair of its government sites, with roughly two-thirds of those attacks being traced to the U.S.

U.S. research firm Mandiat labels the U.S. and China as the world's top two sources of attack traffic on the internet.  China accounts for about a third of global attack traffic, while the U.S. is in second place, account for about a tenth of attack traffic.

II. China Sympathetic, But Military Officials Blast U.S.

At times China has responded to accusations with an aggressive counterattack, but this time it took a sympathetic tone.  In a speech over the weekend Chinese Foreign Minister Yang Jiechi remarked, "[Cyberspace is] a community of common destiny.  What cyberspace needs is not war, but rules and cooperation.  We oppose turning cyberspace into another battlefield, or using the Internet as a new tool to interfere in other countries' internal affairs."

Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Hua Chunying told reporters in Beijing that her government was working to "protect peace, safety, openness and cooperation in cyberspace", including looking to protect the U.S.

She adds, "China is willing, on the basis of the principles of mutual respect and mutual trust, to have constructive dialogue and cooperation on this issue with the international community including the United States to maintain the security, openness and peace of the Internet."

One big question though is whether a February report by Mandiat is accurate.  That report shows evidence that a number of the attacks on U.S. corporations and government networks were carried out by what is believed to be a secret unit in China's military.

Chinese Foreign Minister Yang Jiechi on Mar. 9 said the American media was exploiting the report for political gains and said the report itself was on "shaky ground" in terms of facts.

Maj. Gen. Liu Lianhua commented to Reuters, "This talk from the U.S. has no foundation whatsoever.  And what evidence is there? There isn't any!"
 
China hackers
China claims the U.S. is the real cyberaggressor. [Image Source: Asia Society]

Wang Hongguang, deputy commander of the PLA's Nanjing Military District, claims his nation's military lacks cyber offensive capabilities, but when asked whether they would develop them to counter foreign threats, he replied, "Personally, I think we will. If the enemy has it we'll want to have it too. We must have the means at least to defend ourselves."

He calls the U.S. "a thief calling others a thief."

III. The North Korea Factor

Ultimately both sides claim to want to talk, but at the same time both seem determined to attack the other.  But there is additional pressure to resolve the differences on cybersecurity amid the crisis in North Korea.  With North Korea moving to possibly go to war, the U.S. has cause to try to work out its difference with China, a long time ally of the North.

In his speech Mr. Donilo alluded to this threat, praising China for backing new UN sanctions against North Korea.

He comments, "North Korea’s claims may be hyperbolic -- but as to the policy of the United States, there should be no doubt: We will draw upon the full range of our capabilities to protect against, and to respond to, the threat posed to us and to our allies by North Korea."

North Korea
China is reportedly concerned that North Korea could turn on it. [Image Source: CNN]
 
Reports indicate China is concerned that North Korea could turn on it, using the threat of its emerging nuclear capabilities to blackmail it into increasing financial support.  In a sign that China and the U.S. may be approaching a collective "solution" to the North Korean crisis, a senior Japanese diplomat arrived in China late last month.

Japan -- a top ally to the U.S. in the region -- has long been at odds with China over the Diaoyu/Senkaku Islands, a group of islands south of Japan, which both China and Japan claim to own.  But much like America and China's hacking dispute, Japan and China may be forced to compromise as their common neighbor North Korea flexs its military muscle.

Sources: The White House, Reuters



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I loled
By Ammohunt on 3/12/2013 3:16:28 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
"China is willing, on the basis of the principles of mutual respect and mutual trust, to have constructive dialogue and cooperation on this issue with the international community including the United States to maintain the security, openness and peace of the Internet."


Wow! coming from a country that caused the coining of the "There Great Firewall of China" label for their censorship efforts...spoken like a true and committed communist propagandist!




RE: I loled
By sixteenornumber on 3/12/2013 4:48:52 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
Wow! coming from a country that caused the coining of the "There Great Firewall of China" label for their censorship efforts...spoken like a true and committed communist propagandist!


You do make a good point, however there are cultural differences that I don't fully understand. An individual, I'm willing to overlook things to a certain point. I just hope there is more to this statement than public opinion. I'd really like this to be true!


RE: I loled
By inperfectdarkness on 3/13/2013 4:23:06 AM , Rating: 2
"Cultural differences"? You mean, the ones where hypocracy is a legitimate and respected form of expression? Exactly how does "openness of the internet" jive with "we ban everything that we disagree with"?

Really, the only "fitting" counter to the "we steal from you and censor everything in our own country we don't like" policy is to barrage fire trojans/worms into their mainframes that will dispense images of hardcore p0rn0graphy and the protests at Tiananmen Square. Literally flood mainland China with virtually everything its pretentious government is trying to obscure from its citizens.


RE: I loled
By inperfectdarkness on 3/13/2013 4:27:00 AM , Rating: 2
"Cultural differences"? You mean, the ones where hypocracy is a legitimate and respected form of expression? Exactly how does "openness of the internet" jive with "we ban everything that we disagree with"?

Really, the only "fitting" counter to the "we steal from you and censor everything in our own country we don't like" policy is to barrage fire trojans/worms into their mainframes that will dispense images of hardcore p0rn0graphy and the protests at Tiananmen Square. Literally flood mainland China with virtually everything its pretentious government is trying to obscure from its citizens.


RE: I loled
By sixteenornumber on 3/12/2013 4:55:54 PM , Rating: 2
and i forgot to mention in my previous post, China's case study says that 140K attacks/month are from the US. Where did they originate? multi-point proxy, VPN, botnet... China could give the same argument but somehow i believe Symantec over some political entity.


RE: I loled
By Noonecares on 3/12/2013 9:58:38 PM , Rating: 1
You believing Symantec is quite amusing. America actively hacks other countries, deploys nasty viruses to damage infrastructure, and also wants to be world police. Remember that program that was hidden in smartphones for a while.... I would be more worried about the criminals in America than those on the internet in China. Also I am pretty sure the smart companies aren't getting hacked for their i.p. but those are the ones that don't send for their products to get made overseas.


RE: I loled
By Jeffk464 on 3/13/2013 1:33:16 AM , Rating: 2
No doubt the US government has done some pretty nasty things over the years. I still don't like the idea of China stealing all of our tech advantage since that's about the only thing we have left.


RE: I loled
By Jeffk464 on 3/13/2013 1:35:14 AM , Rating: 2
You are right in that outsourcing the manufacturing of something to China is the #1 way to hand over all time and money that went into R&D.


RE: I loled
By Jeffk464 on 3/13/2013 1:29:16 AM , Rating: 2
Holly poop, this is the first time I have ever seen china back down on anything.


Stealing? lolwhut?
By JeBarr on 3/12/13, Rating: 0
RE: Stealing? lolwhut?
By inperfectdarkness on 3/13/2013 4:00:56 AM , Rating: 1
You're either a troll or completely insane. Espousing the altogether elimination of intellectual property would push progress back to the dark ages.

I'm betting you're one of those idiot fanatics who wants to see Bradley Manning exonerated and released from prison. I submit that you should start practicing what you preach by removing/disabling all the locks on every piece of property you own. Your house, your car, your smartphone.


RE: Stealing? lolwhut?
By Strunf on 3/13/2013 8:51:14 AM , Rating: 2
Dark ages? you mean "Age of Enlightenment", even as it is most discoveries are made in Universities and most of them don't have any patent whatsoever, intellectual rights exist today mostly for non essential stuff, hell if we analyze all the patents 99% of them are pointless and we could live very well without them, heck some would even argue that patents slow down the technological evolution since it stops people from improving someone else design.

BTW the funny thing about locks is that with or without them you still get robbed.


RE: Stealing? lolwhut?
By inperfectdarkness on 3/14/2013 4:21:46 AM , Rating: 2
There is no incentive to develop medicine if the drugs cannot be patented & sold at a premium to recoup the huge cost of investment. Don't give me crap about how grants could cover R&D. Money has to come from somewhere.

This concept applies to ALL developments. Eliminating intellectual property rights is a de-facto state of eliminating just compensation for the inventions/development a person or persons create. Once you do that, the only "progress" you'll see is only from people who desire to work pro-bono. Many, many other will simply NOT work to develop new things because there is no financial benefit in doing so (and indeed, potentially great financial cost). I myself am certainly not motivated to design a new form of internal combustion engine that triples gas-mileage using conventional fuels...if there is no way I can be compensated for the time/work invested in it.

As far as locks...no security measure is a 100% certainty. The idea is DETERRANCE and making your stuff less opportune than someone else's.


RE: Stealing? lolwhut?
By Strunf on 3/19/2013 7:19:37 AM , Rating: 2
Funny you speak of medicine cause companies are making huge profits in this field and this thanks to... patents, where did I say drugs would be given for free? also if you develop a new medicine you will be first to market and potentially be a couple years if not more without any competition since you don't have to give away your formula either and anyone else that wants to copy it will have to figure it out (and it's not that easy) and even if they get it they still have to run trials and of course get an approval from the state to sell it, so even with out any kind of patent you would still be without any competition for at least 2 years. Coca-Cola never patented its formula yet I've never tasted any cola like theirs...

I myself would develop for sure that engine, I would then flood the market with my engines and be without any competitor for at least 2 years, in mere 2 years I would have shaken the market and racked a huge profit out of it, after 2 years some competitor may show up but by then I'm already selling a better version of my engine, so yeah they may copy but they WILL ALWAYS be one step behind.

I don't think you have any idea how hard it's to reverse engineer complex formulas or devices, the easy to copy stuff is usually the stuff even a 10 years would come up with and this represents maybe 90% of the patents.


Made In China
By btc909 on 3/12/2013 9:01:02 PM , Rating: 3
Stop buying crap that is "Made In China". Don't give them your money.




RE: Made In China
By Jeffk464 on 3/13/2013 1:36:06 AM , Rating: 2
I would like to see anyone try to buy nothing made from china, you basically can't do it anymore.


We Won't Stop Hacking You...
By Tuor on 3/12/2013 4:31:31 PM , Rating: 2
...but we'll be happy to talk to you about it.




The correct spelling is Mandiant
By sundragon on 3/12/2013 6:58:38 PM , Rating: 2
Please correct the spelling to "Mandiant"

Thanks,

Mandiant




By johnsmith9875 on 3/14/2013 11:35:44 AM , Rating: 2
I saw a video of a North Korean store selling chinese copies of "Microsoft Window". Probably a fake don't you think?




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