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Honda Insight 2  (Source: CAR Magazine)

Honda CR-Z Concept, FCX, and Insight 2 Concept  (Source: CAR Magazine)
Honda gets ready to take on the Prius with the Insight 2

Honda's next generation "Prius Killer" hybrid has been seen roaming the desert under heavy camouflage. Most of the time, the vehicle has been caught with a Toyota Prius tagging along for comparison purposes.

Today, however, we are finally able to see what the five-seat Insight 2 hatchback will look like -- at least in concept form – when it launches next year courtesy of CAR Magazine. The design borrows heavily from the production Honda FCX Clarity fuel cell vehicle, although it's likely that many will claim that Honda directly ripped off the Prius' design.

While the car you see pictured to the right is considered a "concept", if Honda's previous concepts are any indication, this is about 97% production ready. Ditch the large wheels and tone down the front lighting and you'd be looking at the production model.

There aren't many more concrete details available on the Insight 2; however, we do know these few tidbits of information regarding the vehicle. First, the Insight 2 will undercut the Honda Civic Hybrid in pricing. Early reports from Honda insiders suggest that the Insight 2 will be priced below $19,000 when it launches next spring. For comparison, the Honda Civic Hybrid starts at $22,600, while the Toyota Prius starts at $21,500.

Secondly, the Insight 2 will likely use Honda's next generation Integrated Motor Assist (IMA) hybrid system. The new IMA is reportedly 50% cheaper to produce than the existing IMA used in the Honda Civic Hybrid.

"The original Honda Insight pioneered hybrid technology in the U.S. and remains a symbol of Honda's commitment to innovative technology and fuel efficiency," said Honda CEO and President Takeo Fukui. "This new Insight will also break new ground by providing an affordable hybrid to an expanded number of customers craving great fuel economy and great value."

Honda hopes to sell 200,000 units of its Insight 2 globally with half of those sales coming from North America. Sales of the Insight 2 along with a production version of the CR-Z hybrid will push Honda's global annual hybrid sales to 500,000 units.



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Front wheels
By AssBall on 9/4/2008 12:13:45 PM , Rating: 2
Are they actually larger than the back ones or is that an optical illusion? It would provide better ride and economy/vs costs.




RE: Front wheels
By FITCamaro on 9/4/2008 12:21:30 PM , Rating: 1
I think the bottom picture is showing the progression from concept to production.


RE: Front wheels
By walk2k on 9/4/2008 1:51:25 PM , Rating: 2
The bottom picture shows "Honda CR-Z Concept, FCX, and Insight 2 Concept"...

Those are the only pictures I've seen of the Insight2, it may be an optical illusion, or the front wheels may actually be larger. It's a front-wheel drive car, the rear wheels don't do anything, they are really just there to keep the back of the car from dragging on the ground.


RE: Front wheels
By lagomorpha on 9/4/2008 6:00:53 PM , Rating: 3
Just because the rear wheels don't turn relative to the car doesn't mean they aren't vital to steering! Morbo: "Cars do not work that way!"


RE: Front wheels
By Brandon Hill (blog) on 9/4/2008 1:54:51 PM , Rating: 2
The bottom picture is of three distinct vehicles.

CR-Z: three-door hatchback, two-seater hybrid based on the Civic platform
FCX Clarity: fuel cell sedan
Insight 2: discussed in this article


RE: Front wheels
By kattanna on 9/4/2008 5:01:27 PM , Rating: 2
no, it actually looks like the front wheels are larger. the only problem i see with that is carry 2 different size of tires for spares.


RE: Front wheels
By Alexvrb on 9/4/2008 6:38:39 PM , Rating: 2
It seems likely that the wheels and tires will be the same size on the production model. If you're unlucky, Honda might do what they did with some years of the Accord hybrid. Your "spare tire" will be a can of fix-a-flat. Saves money AND weight! Spare tires of course can be purchased at extra cost. :P


RE: Front wheels
By walk2k on 9/4/2008 6:51:05 PM , Rating: 2
Typical spares in modern cars are usually "donuts" anyway - not the same size as your regular tires. Suitable only for driving short distances at slower speeds.


RE: Front wheels
By Samus on 9/5/2008 4:18:21 AM , Rating: 2
i'd be more concerned about the inability to rotate. i doubt the wheels are different sizes.


Mark-up?
By Baked on 9/4/2008 11:41:40 AM , Rating: 2
I wonder what's the average mark-up gonna be.




RE: Mark-up?
By Suntan on 9/4/2008 3:09:04 PM , Rating: 2
Agreed. Show me where you can actually buy a Prius for $21,500 right now…

-Suntan


RE: Mark-up?
By Spuke on 9/4/2008 4:29:34 PM , Rating: 2
Most people don't buy stripper cars (meaning cars with no options). And dealerships don't carry no option cars because they aren't as profitable as a more loaded car would be.


RE: Mark-up?
By deeznuts on 9/4/2008 4:39:20 PM , Rating: 2
True, but some people are bidding those cars higher than MSRP in some instances. Or at least they did before.


RE: Mark-up?
By Solandri on 9/4/2008 6:00:50 PM , Rating: 2
Hondas don't have options. They usually sell 3 trim levels with the only "options" being auto/manual and navigation. Not sure how useful that is in the Internet age, but in past days it was nice because you could easily compare prices between dealers.


RE: Mark-up?
By Zero76 on 9/7/2008 4:46:37 AM , Rating: 2
yep u got that right..is either DX ( wich i rarely or non existan in accord models ), LX, And EX. and every little niche in between that you can get for a little extra, but well, fewer options, i guess later on they will add more stuff once they figure out how to compensat the extra weight that may incur when you add more stuff to the vehicle itself.


It ain't close to my baby...
By RoberTx on 9/4/2008 10:43:15 PM , Rating: 1
My baby is an '08 Kawasaki KLR 650. 60+ mpg, $5350 purchase price, $60 a year for insurance, 100+ mph top speed, 16,000+ miles with zero issues, maintain it in your sleep...beat that.

Also...

"We are sorry for the inconvenience but we've determined you have a low DailyTech rating and may possibly be a robot. In order to maintain the high quality posts that our readers demand, please enter the text in the image below exactly as you see it to continue posting. Once you have achieved a higher DailyTech rating you will not longer be required to enter the text. "

Oh, grow up nerd.




RE: It ain't close to my baby...
By Zero76 on 9/5/2008 3:32:11 AM , Rating: 2
Yes i ll beat that!! you cant compare apples to oranges.. yes is Dual purpose bike, but consider using that on winter..then what you get is a NERD that cant drive it on the snow, cold days or rain, Not everybody have the taste or resources. yes it is your baby wow... Mine is a 08 Yamaha R6R, great gas mileage, good looking, and i dont look like a nerd when i drive around. Got that? Ha..And i forgot..is more fun to drive around ;), insurance a little higher and well even if is almost as fast as a airbus319 on take off, i keep up in the safe range of speed.


RE: It ain't close to my baby...
By RoberTx on 9/6/2008 12:08:27 AM , Rating: 2
I'm 52 and have ridden all over the place year round on dirt bikes. I have spiked MEFO knobs sitting in the garage. I eat nails and spit out thumbtacks, 5 years USMC. I use small cars and fat bobs for traction. I wipe my butt with a cactus. My KLR can whup the snot outta your girlie R6R. The KLR is the bike with combat cred on the 21st century battlefield, The KLR has been in the Corps for over 8 years now. Only mad dogs are man enough to swing a leg over the KiLleR. HuhHuhHuh, that made me tired. I'm going to bed now...


RE: It ain't close to my baby...
By Zero76 on 9/7/2008 4:41:20 AM , Rating: 2
hey dude did u forget that ur 650 is not supersport and doesnt even match a R6R?, and honestly 5 years of usmc doesnt match 18 years of real pounding trainig on the desert, cold cold mountains and a place u dont wanna be, the cold antartica,oh i forgot the amazon too, and yes you guys are trained by us down south every september, the best of the best goes down there to put themselves to the test, probably i could sit in ur back and twist you in 2 in 60 secs while i m taking a no.2 but lets not embarras ourselves, you are in a different sort of category and i dont want you to feel bad ;0), different perspectives. BTW Read the spec of the krl, is a beginner bike, but at your stage its ok, smart ppl ( dont wanna use the g word anymore ) will kinda give you the weird eye at you anyways while they speed up like a rocket in their nsx's or flagship mercedez, or race the c#$%^ out in their R6's R1 and REAL Nija'z 1000 in a nice warm spring day. Good luck next time you try to use you scooter to catch some of them. cc's on your bike wont mean nothing, and R6's are not a girlie ride..your attitude might be , but not the R6, neither the KRL, even if is a slow tuned version of a better kawasaki.


RE: It ain't close to my baby...
By RoberTx on 9/11/2008 3:56:10 PM , Rating: 2
I'm sorry. I didn't realize you were a legend in your own mind. By the way, your an illiterate idiot.


RE: It ain't close to my baby...
By Visual on 9/5/2008 3:42:09 AM , Rating: 2
this is your first post, and you got a message for your post ratings?
wtf dailytech!


RE: It ain't close to my baby...
By RoberTx on 9/6/2008 12:14:27 AM , Rating: 1
Visual, watch your language, there are nerds on this site.


Honda gets it
By pauldovi on 9/4/08, Rating: 0
RE: Honda gets it
By djc208 on 9/4/2008 2:51:02 PM , Rating: 2
The Volt will still do well, but like the hybrids before it, the series hybrid is a new animal and the first one out the door (Chevy) has the steepest slope to climb. Give the volt two or three generations with some competition (plug in Prius, proposed "cheaper" Tesla) and you'll see something closer to what you're reading here.

Plus they still ocupy different niches right now. None of these hybrids offer plug-in capability. For people like me who live close to work and most shopping I might not need gas for months with a Volt. With one of these I'd just need gas less often.


RE: Honda gets it
By Spuke on 9/4/2008 3:06:35 PM , Rating: 2
The Honda's are not series hybrids and they aren't using LI batteries. If Honda were doing a series hybrid with LI batteries then their car would cost just as much as the Volt.

Anyone care to take bets that when Honda or Toyota finally does a serial hybrid with LI batteries that it will be hailed as the second coming of Christ? Even if the price is the same?


RE: Honda gets it
By Ringold on 9/4/2008 3:48:42 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Anyone care to take bets that when Honda or Toyota finally does a serial hybrid with LI batteries that it will be hailed as the second coming of Christ?


Thats the truth.

Going back to Pauldovi, this car looks smaller than the Volt, and it still looks like a hybrid/small cheap economy car. The Volt looks like a real car. I'd fully expect a car like the Volt to cost more. They look like they're in two different categories.

Besides, what defines success with a new technology? This new Honda is really Hybrid 2.0, the long-awaited mass-market friendly hybrid after many years of refinement. The Volt is, like Spuke said, a different technology. By this measure of it being too pricey, the Prius should've been a miserable failure. I'm not sure what is with the GM-bashing, but I don't see any reason why the Volt would be a failure.

If I were in the market for a car, I'd look seriously at one. Of course, unlike people that look to sell a heavily depreciated and still young asset for a sexy hybrid, I'm saving big bucks by planning on driving my 05 car 'till 2012 at least. I'll need a truck next year, but thats different. I need a truck to do truck things, not save gas.


RE: Honda gets it
By lagomorpha on 9/4/08, Rating: 0
RE: Honda gets it
By Spuke on 9/4/2008 6:45:26 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Americans really need to get over the idea that small cars have to be cheap economy cars if we want to adapt to modern gas prices.
People want the space. Small cars don't have it. It's as simple as that. The people that have no issues with small cars are buying them. Those that do are buying mid size cars. To each his own. YMMV.


RE: Honda gets it
By Murloc on 9/5/2008 6:31:13 AM , Rating: 1
mid size?
those would buy enormous and cheap SUVs that suck.


RE: Honda gets it
By mmcdonalataocdotgov on 9/5/2008 7:51:30 AM , Rating: 1
My Camry looks like a Camry, which is one of the highest selling normal looking cars of all time (Okay, I said normal.) And I get 38+ mpg combined fairly regularly. Have been since July 2006 when I got it. It is still in the top 5 gas mileage cars sold in the US (according to Road & Track). Full leather, nav system, sun roof, alloy wheels, etc. How normal a car do you want?


Bland
By Aeonic on 9/4/2008 2:54:41 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Ditch the large wheels and tone down the front lighting and you'd be looking at the production model.


Funny thing is those were the only really two nice looking things on it. When are we going to get a energy efficient car that doesn't look like the Hello Kitty special edition playset. Seriously, give me an evil looking hybrid, and I'll drive the hell out of it :)

I guess automakers have to design for the least common demoninator to sell the most cars over the greatest range. Just like most music. But that's never the "good stuff". For a purchase like a car, I'll never settle for the Brittney Spears version.




Great....jk
By mdogs444 on 9/4/08, Rating: -1
RE: Great....jk
By xti on 9/4/2008 11:00:20 AM , Rating: 1
i'm hoping you aren't trying to impress the ladies in your $19k non-gas-guzzler. Step up your game!!


RE: Great....jk
By Lord 666 on 9/4/2008 11:13:02 AM , Rating: 2
No, mdogs tries to impress ladies with his overpriced jeans, not by his Accord 2door.

Girls really dig those True's ;)


RE: Great....jk
By Souka on 9/4/2008 11:40:59 AM , Rating: 4
On my Insight2 - I'll put a racing stripe down the middle and a big muffler on mine... babes will be impressed.

Might even upgrade the hubcabs to something more flashy too.

LOL


RE: Great....jk
By mdogs444 on 9/4/08, Rating: -1
RE: Great....jk
By amanojaku on 9/4/2008 12:09:03 PM , Rating: 5
Virtual girls love my video cards. Come on baby, render my fire.


RE: Great....jk
By CheesePoofs on 9/4/2008 1:12:01 PM , Rating: 1
Consider yourself notified. My girlfriend digs small cars (she wants a Smart Car).


RE: Great....jk
By Spuke on 9/4/2008 3:09:28 PM , Rating: 4
quote:
Consider yourself notified. My girlfriend digs small cars (she wants a Smart Car).
That's because your girlfriend is a sheep.


RE: Great....jk
By FITCamaro on 9/4/2008 5:40:23 PM , Rating: 2
They say a woman's taste in the size of their cars mirrors their preferences for the size of their men.

I kid...I kid...


RE: Great....jk
By Lord 666 on 9/4/2008 1:26:20 PM , Rating: 2
Actually, I have a 06 Jetta TDI (NAV and leather) and appears to be a girl magnet in its own right. My wife fights me for it and it definitely got the attention of another attractive lady at 7-11 the other morning. She spent significat time comparing her 08 Jetta to mine with specific attention to the lack of chrome around the windows on hers vs mine.

Anyway, women are actually more interested in how much you make and what type of job you have in the area i have - everything else usually follows. Some of the richest people i know drive pickups with ocean front property... so its ultimately not what you drive.


RE: Great....jk
By FITCamaro on 9/4/2008 5:38:41 PM , Rating: 2
It's a girl magnet because women drive them and find them cute.


RE: Great....jk
By FITCamaro on 9/4/08, Rating: 0
RE: Great....jk
By mdogs444 on 9/4/08, Rating: 0
RE: Great....jk
By mdogs444 on 9/4/08, Rating: -1
RE: Great....jk
By Noya on 9/4/2008 1:41:25 PM , Rating: 2
Wow $32k, someone doesn't know how to car shop.


RE: Great....jk
By Spuke on 9/4/2008 3:13:22 PM , Rating: 2
He's quoting MSRP. APMV.


RE: Great....jk
By Arribajuan on 9/4/08, Rating: 0
RE: Great....jk
By HOOfan 1 on 9/4/2008 12:30:40 PM , Rating: 2
Looks very much like the Prius to me. I think they need to diversify the style a bit, unless they are keeping that style so that people will know it is a Hybrid when it drives by. As hot as the Prius is at the moment, he might be able to inpress the ladies more with a Hybrid than with a Ferrari


RE: Great....jk
By Fireshade on 9/8/2008 10:20:20 AM , Rating: 2
It looks like a Prius, because both cars are as aerodynamically streamlined as possible -for yet an extra mileage- given the family-5-persons requirement. So you'll get this "drop" shape.


RE: Great....jk
By lagomorpha on 9/4/2008 6:17:15 PM , Rating: 2
"i'm hoping you aren't trying to impress the ladies in your $19k non-gas-guzzler. Step up your game!!"

Ahem.

http://www.nydailynews.com/autos/2008/06/23/2008-0...

"A new national survey conducted by "Challenge X" - a nationwide collegiate engineering contest sponsored by the U.S. Department of Energy and General Motors reveals that nine out of 10 women say they'd be more likely to talk to or date a fellow who tools around in the latest hybrid or fuel-efficient ride, rather than a flashy sports car."

As far as I can tell a man in a fuel efficient car implies "look I care for the environment and don't waste money foolishly, I'm more likely to be someone who is capable of caring for your offspring" whereas a man in a Charger or Corvette shouts "look at how tiny my penis must be that I need all these cylinders to feel masculine, I treat the environment like shit and I'll treat my offspring like shit". Not saying it always holds true, but the implication is there.


RE: Great....jk
By Spuke on 9/4/2008 6:55:29 PM , Rating: 1
Women are social creatures and tend to go where the wind goes. Yesterday it was SUV's, today it's "green", tomorrow it's shoe leather. That "study" surprises me not one bit.

Women like security and expensive, "small penis" cars shout security. A woman will put up with the small penis as long as she knows she won't have to sleep on the street.

Don't believe me? Go hang out in a place where women and rich men meet and pull up in your Prius in a parking lot full of Ferrari's and see how many women you get.


RE: Great....jk
By Spuke on 9/4/2008 7:04:00 PM , Rating: 2
Here's a study for you.

http://tinyurl.com/58tyzy


RE: Great....jk
By lagomorpha on 9/4/2008 7:31:22 PM , Rating: 2
"Interestingly, every one of the women tested had a "significant" increase in testosterone level in their saliva after listening to the Maserati"

There you have it women, want to grow hair on your face and body? Buy a Maserati.


RE: Great....jk
By Spuke on 9/5/2008 2:19:32 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
There you have it women, want to grow hair on your face and body? Buy a Maserati.
"She's a man, baby!"


RE: Great....jk
By lagomorpha on 9/4/2008 7:34:53 PM , Rating: 2
So it's another case of women saying they want one thing but subconsciously desiring something completely different? Ok yeah, that sounds pretty much on par.


RE: Great....jk
By walk2k on 9/4/2008 7:04:20 PM , Rating: 1
Indeed studies have always shown that *educated* women prefer men who drive practical cars rather than flashy ones.

Personally I don't need attention from the kind of women who are attracted to blinged-out Hyundais (hood rats) or hopped-up pickup trucks (dumb white trash) or bitchin' Camaros (New Jersey hair-metal sluts) thanks anyway!


RE: Great....jk
By Lord 666 on 9/4/2008 10:03:13 PM , Rating: 2
Do you even live in NJ or stayed over for more than 1 night recently?

Maybe, just maybe, that was in the 80's and early 90's, but not anymore.


RE: Great....jk
By Spuke on 9/5/2008 2:28:21 PM , Rating: 2
My wife has a Masters and LOVES sports cars, convertibles, exotics and such. So do her educated (Masters and Ph.D's) friends. At the same time, they are practical and would never stretch their budgets and other silliness to get those types of cars. But, if ANY of them had the money, the Prius wouldn't be their first (or seconds) choice of car to drive.

That said, if my wife's friends all started driving Prius', she might consider one. LOL! But like I stated in an earlier post, women go where the social wind blows.

PS - She wants a MINI convertible.


RE: Great....jk
By Zero76 on 9/7/2008 4:52:01 AM , Rating: 1
i just have a 98 accord ex. 4cyn..nothing out of the ordinary, chicks get in and out all the time, now i need new shocks..geeez , and is not the car what attracts them..is the DRIVER, ya feel me now?.

I can be riding a little golf cart and still get booty no matter what.


RE: Great....jk
By xti on 9/10/2008 11:54:46 AM , Rating: 2
you need new shocks? where they a bit tubby?


RE: Great....jk
By Misty Dingos on 9/4/2008 11:02:54 AM , Rating: 2
It does bear a resemblance to the Prius. Does it not? But I will cut them some slack. Same problems of breed the same solutions.

One question. When the battery pack goes south and needs replacement is that going to be covered under warranty?


RE: Great....jk
By shin0bi272 on 9/4/2008 11:46:38 AM , Rating: 2
no because the battery will last 5 years or so and the warranty will be 3 just to screw you over. its how they work.


RE: Great....jk
By walk2k on 9/4/2008 12:32:12 PM , Rating: 3
If it's like the Prius, which it most likely will have to be to compete, the battery has a 10 year warranty. So far none have been replaced (Prius) except because of car accidents. They are designed to last 180,000 miles, there are some Prius taxis in Canada with well over that much mileage that are still running on the original batteries.


RE: Great....jk
By Spuke on 9/4/2008 3:15:30 PM , Rating: 2
Many batteries on the Prius have been replaced. Not just accidents. A simple search on the Prius forum will give this info.


RE: Great....jk
By 9nails on 9/6/2008 12:34:10 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Misty Dingos said, "One question. When the battery pack goes south and needs replacement is that going to be covered under warranty?"


Worse, the battery was designed to last the "lifetime" of the car. That's about 5 - 8 years. Planned obsolescence? The dealership will pull the old battery out, recycle both the car and battery and you walk home.


RE: Great....jk
By IcePickFreak on 9/4/2008 11:05:58 AM , Rating: 2
I got to agree here, why does it have to be a 4 door hatch-back and look strikingly similar to the Prius?

I'm quite sure the success of the Prius is due to it's efficiency and not it's "good looks"


RE: Great....jk
By Spuke on 9/4/2008 11:12:57 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
I'm quite sure the success of the Prius is due to it's efficiency and not it's "good looks"
Hybrid owners (especially Prius owners) want their cars to look like hybrids. They want an easily discernible shape that screams "fuel efficient".

I think it's ugly. The Civic Hybrid, Volt, or Camry hybrid would be my choices IF I were looking for a hybrid.


RE: Great....jk
By therealnickdanger on 9/4/2008 11:29:22 AM , Rating: 4
Escalade Hybrid is more my speed... LOL


RE: Great....jk
By shin0bi272 on 9/4/08, Rating: 0
RE: Great....jk
By michael2k on 9/4/2008 12:35:32 PM , Rating: 2
You're the problem actually.

Honda had a whole hybridized their standard sedans(Civic and Accord) that no one bought because they didn't look like hybrids. So because no one bought them, they designed their next hybrid to LOOK like a hybrid.


RE: Great....jk
By Krioni on 9/5/2008 9:23:57 AM , Rating: 2
I think that the standard sedans didn't sell as well as hoped because the price differential was too high.

Not many people were/are willing to pay an extra $5,000+ dollars for the hybrid version of a particular vehicle when it would take many years worth of gas savings to recoup the extra cost.


RE: Great....jk
By michael2k on 9/5/2008 12:15:46 PM , Rating: 2
Well, people who wanted it to look like a hybrid were willing to pay the price premium!

So now we have a hybrid looking Insight. Make the product for the market willing to buy it, right?


RE: Great....jk
By Spuke on 9/5/2008 2:33:09 PM , Rating: 2
BTW, the Camry Hybrid sells about as well as the Prius. And because of the current Prius supply problems (sales are actually down on them), the Camry Hybrid may overtake it.


RE: Great....jk
By Krioni on 9/5/2008 9:25:10 AM , Rating: 2
And I forgot to mention that the availability of the hybrid versions was/is also an issue.


RE: Great....jk
By Brandon Hill (blog) on 9/4/2008 12:42:28 PM , Rating: 5
Who cares what the marketing says? Are you that misguided and easily fooled by marketing and swayed by peoples' opinions/statements that you can't accept a vehicle on its merits (in this case; great fuel economy, reduced emissions, relatively low price).

Hybrids are seen as "smug". Minivans are "mommy mobiles". Big SUVs and pickups are "gas guzzlers". Miatas and VW New Beetles are for the "limp wristed".

WHO CARES!!!!!

Buy something based on its merits and stop being such sucker for perception.


RE: Great....jk
By consumerwhore on 9/4/2008 1:03:19 PM , Rating: 2
Mod parent up.

I'm starting to think that that episode of South Park did way too much unnecessary and unrepairable damage to the hybrid car industry's image (by way of tainting the owners' images).


RE: Great....jk
By JoshuaBuss on 9/4/2008 4:44:28 PM , Rating: 2
well said, brandon. I've gotten quite a few chuckles since getting my a4 avant.. "Seriously, a STATION WAGON!?!" but all I can say is "show me a car that would be as much fun and still be as useful"

people care about image way too much.


RE: Great....jk
By LtFarva on 9/5/2008 9:39:32 AM , Rating: 2
RE: Great....jk
By randomly on 9/4/2008 11:12:40 AM , Rating: 3
of course it looks similar. If you are trying to maximize mpg your are going to get similar solutions. Same laws of aerodynamics apply, same structural materials, same goals of minimizing weight, providing sufficient interior space while fitting the engine and mechanics etc...

If you are willing to sacrifice some of that MPG, you can make it look different. If you want to maximize mpg, they're all going to look similar.

It's the same reason the US space shuttle and the Soviet Buran look very similar. It's not because they copied it, but they had the same design constraints.


RE: Great....jk
By Spuke on 9/4/2008 11:18:42 AM , Rating: 2
There's more than one way to skin a cat. There's also more than one way to design a car that's aero efficient. The Prius has a CD of .26 and the old Infiniti G35 has a CD of .26 also. Both are slippery but have radically different designs. If you want to compare new cars the Nissan GT-R has a CD of .27.


RE: Great....jk
By Spuke on 9/4/2008 11:27:16 AM , Rating: 2
BTW, both the Prius and the G35 have the same frontal area.


RE: Great....jk
By puffpio on 9/4/2008 1:18:24 PM , Rating: 2
so what you are saying is that we could have had a prius that looked like a g35?? :D


RE: Great....jk
By Spuke on 9/4/2008 3:18:43 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
so what you are saying is that we could have had a prius that looked like a g35??
Yes.


RE: Great....jk
By Lord 666 on 9/4/2008 11:31:41 AM , Rating: 2
what does the new G35 have? I remember the 928 had something miserable like .38.


RE: Great....jk
By Spuke on 9/4/2008 3:23:32 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
what does the new G35 have? I remember the 928 had something miserable like .38.
The G37 Coupe has a CD of .30. The new (G35) sedan has a CD of .29. .38 is nothing. The Solstice has a CD of .44.


RE: Great....jk
By masher2 (blog) on 9/4/2008 11:51:50 AM , Rating: 2
But the Prius has signicantly more interior area per unit mass than the GT-R. That's the other factor in the equation.

To maximize the volume/surface area ratio, you need a spherical shape. To minimize wind resistance, you need an aerodynamic wedge with a Kammback and low frontal area.

To do both at once, though, you need something very like Prius.


RE: Great....jk
By Spuke on 9/4/2008 3:28:06 PM , Rating: 2
The GT-R's frontal area is actually lower than the Prius. I really think the only reason for the Prius' design is to make it more easily recognizable as a hybrid. Sure some of it is to offer less drag but they could've achieved the same result with a different design.


RE: Great....jk
By ChronoReverse on 9/4/2008 3:38:31 PM , Rating: 2
That doesn't really make sense. There were hybrids before the Prius and they don't look like that. Even the original Prius didn't look like that.

I'm more inclined to believe that it was an engineering compromise as masher said.


RE: Great....jk
By Spuke on 9/4/2008 4:39:32 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
I'm more inclined to believe that it was an engineering compromise as masher said.
Then why did Toyota purposefully make the Prius "immediately recognizable as a hybrid" (a trait the owners specifically want) if their intent was to make simply make the design an "engineering compromise"? THAT makes no sense.


RE: Great....jk
By randomly on 9/4/2008 10:48:14 PM , Rating: 2
You've conveniently ignored the issue of weight which is so critical for high MPG vehicles. Even with the added weight of the battery pack, the Prius weighs almost 1000 lbs less than the G35, retains a sizable cabin for passengers, and is able to fit all the extra systems and batteries for the hybrid power train in the vehicle.

If you think you can design a G35 with equivalent MPG to a Prius you are just ignorant of the engineering required. It's a lot more complex than just getting a low drag area.


RE: Great....jk
By shin0bi272 on 9/4/2008 11:34:23 AM , Rating: 2
It's the same reason the US space shuttle and the Soviet Buran look very similar. It's not because they copied it, but they had the same design constraints.

Dont tell Richard Branson that they might have to scrap the space ship-1 program entirely and copy NASA!


RE: Great....jk
By Enigmatic on 9/4/2008 11:45:17 AM , Rating: 2
I think the key thing is the price here. It seems to be undercutting the Prius by quite a bit, while offering the same "I'M BEING GREEN" styling and fuel efficiency. I think alot of people considering a Prius will definitely pick this up instead.


RE: Great....jk
By shin0bi272 on 9/4/2008 11:47:54 AM , Rating: 2
Yeah youre probably right... so would that make it a knock off?


RE: Great....jk
By randomly on 9/4/2008 10:16:24 PM , Rating: 2
The spaceship 1 is a suborbital vehicle that only goes about mach 3. Even the SR-71 flies faster than that. The Space Shuttle is an orbital vehicle traveling at mach 24+. It takes 40 times the energy per pound to get the shuttle up to it's orbital velocity as the Space ship 1 uses for it's suborbital flight. The nifty shuttlecock design of the Space ship 1 would just burn to a charcoal brickette if you tried to use it as an orbital vehicle. No cargo bay either.

Two very different sets of design constraints, two different results.


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