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GE holographic disc stores 500GB of data

Researchers at GE have validated technology that will one day usher in the next generation of optical storage -- holographic storage. The researchers have developed a disc the size of a standard DVD that can hold 500GB of data. The researchers say that conventional optical storage discs only store information on the surface of a disc while holographic storage can store information on the entire volume of the disc material.

Tiny holographic bits of information are written to the disc in patterns and can then be read back by the drive. The capacity of holographic discs are a breakthrough, but the technology used in the process is similar enough to the current DVD and Blu-ray technology in wide use that future optical drives will be able to read CD, DVD, Blu-ray, and holographic discs.

GE's Brian Lawrence said in a statement, "GE’s breakthrough is a huge step toward bringing our next generation holographic storage technology to the everyday consumer. Because GE’s micro-holographic discs could essentially be read and played using similar optics to those found in standard Blu-ray players, our technology will pave the way for cost-effective, robust and reliable holographic drives that could be in every home. The day when you can store your entire high definition movie collection on one disc and support high resolution formats like 3-D television is closer than you think."

GE reports that its researchers have been able to successfully record micro-holographic marks approaching one percent reflectivity at a diameter of about one micron. The one-micron size will allow a disc the size of a conventional DVD to hold 500GB of data. GE has been working on holographic storage for six years and the 500GB capacity is a milestone in its research. The researchers hope to eventually devise a way to store 1,000GB of data on a single disc using the holographic process. In 2007, InPhase started shipping holographic writers and media that could store 300GB per disc.

GE's Bill Kernick said, "GE’s holographic storage program has turned the corner, and with this milestone we can now intensify our efforts in commercialization opportunities. We’ll continue to engage with a variety of strategic partners to create the best route from product development to introduction into the marketplace."



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Flash pwns this stuff
By Hacp on 4/28/2009 9:46:12 PM , Rating: 2
I can't wait till the day we migrate to flash. I'm thinking in 5 years, 16nm flash will be a reality. Couple that with 4-6bit MLC and we'll have fash, cheap, reliable storage media. Dvds will be a thing of the past. All our media will be consumed in a proprietary SD format.




RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By xRyanCat on 4/28/2009 11:16:13 PM , Rating: 2
But... Flash is more expensive then current conventional disc mediums, including Blu-Ray, and it will likely stay that way for quite a while.

I believe downloads and streaming will likely replace a lot of physical media in the next 10 years. Until then, discs have proven cheap and reliable and won't be going anywhere in 5 years.


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By FITCamaro on 4/29/2009 8:21:38 AM , Rating: 3
There's also the "its mine" factor.

A digital download I can't touch. A movie on a disc or flash card I can. I prefer physically having something to not.


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By Mitch101 on 4/29/2009 9:50:37 AM , Rating: 4
Yup I heard about halogram optical storage breakthroughs 4-5 years ago yet the tech is still not available on any consumer grade level.

If there is one thing I have learned from SED/OLED is dont get excited over news about breakthroughs and even if it could be available there are attorneys and patent disputes which will further delay innovation.


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By invidious on 4/29/2009 3:04:02 PM , Rating: 2
I agree 100% on the not getting excited for the scientific breakthroughs. Like you said new ideas and concepts usually take a decade or so to become products. By then the demand might be gone or something else could beat them to it.

But I think what you would have heard about 4-5 years ago was the scientific breakthorough of discovering halographic storage or perhaps a proof of concept. This article however implies that they are far beyond that, that they have a functional disc. If their claims that it uses technology that is similar to current optical drives then this might not be more than a few years away from consumer use.


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By Alexstarfire on 4/30/2009 5:59:03 AM , Rating: 2
Not sure what he read, but what I read about 4-5 years ago was a prototype, not some theoretical process. It did read at a slower than a snail crawling in molasses rate of 3 kb/s on a disc that stored more than even top of the line Blu-Rays discs we can purchase today. It was not yet practical by any means.


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By CascadingDarkness on 4/30/2009 10:25:03 AM , Rating: 2
I second that to an extent. Not because I really need to caress my game discs.

Steam and others have made huge improvements. It's easy to pull down all the games I use after a format, but the day Steam some how dies, if I can't get copies of those games, I'm coming after someone.

That is why I ran out to get a physical copy of Empire Total War. Not because Best Buy grants me the USS Constitution (though that is a bonus).


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By invidious on 4/29/2009 3:11:28 PM , Rating: 3
Yes, cost will be in optical disc's favor for the near future for sure. This is mainly because of the optical disc's passive nature. The disc itself doesnt do anything, it is acted upon. A flash drive has to have a controller inside of it. This makes the flash drive prone to ESD and water damage. While an optical disc is only vulnerable to heat and physical damage, of which the flash drives are also vulnerable to, though to a much lesser extent with phyiscal damage.

So for the same size you could have the cheaper optical disc or the more expensive and easier to damage flash drive. I am not saying the flash drive is the "wrong" choice, but it definately it not without its drawbacks. Optical is going to continue to have a market.


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By Avitar on 4/30/2009 5:21:38 PM , Rating: 2
Ever hear of the Next Computer? Steve Jobs developed it after the suits bounced him out of Apple to put "professional" management in place in the 1980's. (Of course now he owns the suits ) He centered the Next Computer around network communications because he believed back then as you do now. Networks have never developed with the speed he expected and the one useful thing about the Next Computer is that it was the development platform for the World Wide Web and the first web pages in 1992.

The behavior of businesspersons is just wrong for a network centric system, there will always be someone trying to game the system, illegally or legally, for advantage. Even within enterprises you find that linking documents to data slows systems because the management decisions cut the per person IT expenditure by $10 dollars per year will slow the network response time from ten second to an hour. Until we have multiple fiber optic based ISP competing for the business of providing Network connections for households and businesses the business models will always cause the MBA to short change the network user, because they can get away with it.


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By rippleyaliens on 4/28/2009 11:37:16 PM , Rating: 2
Flash may indeed pwn this, BUT, once again, Flash still has problems. With the big one, being capacity, and a smaller one being size. YAH that is the right order. 500GB on a CD size= AWESOME archive capability. Some people kinda like to have this thing called a BACKUP.. AND a write once media = a good solution.
when flash is available at 500gb, at a cost of under $1, then yah flash pwn them all, until then other media will and always be needed.

Downloading movies from internet, as in streaming is cool and all, but myself, i still like to be able to like STOP, put in a different movie, and continue one. Internet delivery cannot do that yet. With talk of isp's capping their download, you can count me out of that one. Flash is fast, RAM DRIVES make flash drives look like hard drives, of yesteryear..
http://www.ramsan.com/ NOW THAT IS POWER!!!!!.
Flash drives are just the next logical step. Getting there, but at a pace, that is just reasonable, will take 3-4 years, before we see ssd drives take over hard drives in sales.. BUT SPACE the final frontier, SSD's will be a long time until that happens.

BUT holo dvds, whatever, will mean even higher density movies. Quad HD anyone.. im looking forward to this.


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By Hacp on 4/29/2009 2:17:23 AM , Rating: 2
I'm sure they'll be able to develop a write once flash chip that'll be cheap. The big advantage I'm seeing is in size. Would have rather have a slightly lower quality 50gb movie in the size of an SD card, or a super HD movie on a CD thats 10x the size and 100x easier to break.


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By HueyD on 4/29/2009 8:40:44 AM , Rating: 2
http://www.sdcard.org/developers/tech/sdxc

How does 1 - 2TB on a SD card sound....coming soon.


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By afkrotch on 4/29/2009 11:44:35 AM , Rating: 2
Umm....SDXC increases the maximum capacity, doesn't mean it'll come at that capacity.

SDHC has a max capacity of 32 GB. They came out in 2006 and we didn't see the first 32 GB card until Spring 2008.

I wouldn't expect a 1 - 2 TB SDXC until late 2010-early 2011. If not even later.


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By HueyD on 4/29/2009 11:52:20 AM , Rating: 2
I agree, it will probably not be this year, but I don't expect hologram storage to be out this year either. If SDXC works and media becomes available (and affordable), hologram storage will be too little, too late.

My opinion :)


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By afkrotch on 4/29/2009 12:12:56 PM , Rating: 2
I can't imagine these hologram storages ever coming out. They've been sitting on the back burner so long, while all your major players are screwing around with multiple layer BDs.

I'm thinking we'll see a 1 TB SDXC before we'd see the hologram disc or a 500 GB BD. Course the SDXC would be well out of an average person's budget. I'm thinking when it does come out, it'll be in the $2-3k price range.


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By AEvangel on 4/29/2009 7:57:26 PM , Rating: 2
True....as even today most of the 32gb & 64gb thumb drives are out of what most people will pay for it.


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By MrPoletski on 4/30/2009 8:42:37 AM , Rating: 2
more important is if they are backwardly compatiable with older SD slots...


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By HueyD on 4/29/2009 8:45:09 AM , Rating: 2
Cablevision is offering 101Mbps internet service in NY area for $99. That should be fast enough for start and stop of several movies.
http://www.multichannel.com/article/210164-Cablevi...


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By JediJeb on 4/29/2009 6:35:14 PM , Rating: 2
Yea, but out here in the middle of nowhere like me, it is either dial-up or satellite, neither of which is all that good for download movies or playing games. And I doubt we will get anything else around here in the next 5 years.


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By captchaos2 on 4/28/2009 11:37:31 PM , Rating: 5
Ok, now when I get a scratch on the disc, I'll lose an entire folder at a time!


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By Samus on 4/29/2009 3:39:48 AM , Rating: 2
im sure their capacity takes into account error correction, much like other optical (or any storage) formats. they leave a decent amount of headroom, usually 10-12% for CRC correction...so you'd need a pretty strategically placed scratch to lose data.

furthermore, reading into how this technology works, the error correction might even be better than conventional optical media since the laser carrier is triaxis (conventional laser carriers are single-plane) and tilts the laser to focus around lower holographic layers in order to reach data stored in layers above. unfortunately ge is close-lip about what this means to data integrity but i'd guess it means the laser can work around surface scratches from an angle.


RE: Flash pwns this stuff
By MrPoletski on 4/29/2009 6:16:15 AM , Rating: 4
My flash got me arrested :(


They better damn well...
By icanhascpu on 4/29/2009 1:39:48 AM , Rating: 2
...produce the disks inside holders. I don't give a damn about backward compatibility if I'm going to risk naked disks holding 500GB of data getting scratched. I want these things coming inside some tough and durable containers that do NOT OPEN until inserted into the drive.

Just like back in the CD 1x days.




RE: They better damn well...
By Hyperion1400 on 4/29/2009 3:27:02 AM , Rating: 2
Actually, Blu-ray does a pretty good job of self-preservation. Although they aren't encased, it is VERY hard to scratch a BD; you pretty much have to do it on purpose. I own quite a few and have used and abused them. In order to cause any significant damage you would have to take a brillo pad or piece of sand paper to them.


RE: They better damn well...
By Schrag4 on 4/29/2009 10:34:11 AM , Rating: 3
I bet my 1, 3, and 5 year old kids could do a number on a BD if I turned my back on them for 2 minutes.


RE: They better damn well...
By afkrotch on 4/29/2009 11:16:24 AM , Rating: 3
Ya, but at the same time, doesn't matter what it is. A 1, 3, 5 year old could destroy it. Be it a BD, BD in a protective case, SSD, full computer, anvil, etc.


RE: They better damn well...
By Chernobyl68 on 4/29/2009 12:07:51 PM , Rating: 2
nothing is child-proof... :)


RE: They better damn well...
By Schrag4 on 4/29/2009 12:11:57 PM , Rating: 3
Good point. I have 3 older brothers that are close to my age, and I remember that we destroyed many, many things (too many to list here). And now it's payback. I think grandparents must secretely smile when their children complain about the devestation caused by little ones...


RE: They better damn well...
By afkrotch on 4/29/2009 12:15:04 PM , Rating: 1
Ya, I remember when I turned 15. I ate out a black hole.

OHHHHHHHHH!!! Nailed it!!!!!!


RE: They better damn well...
By grandpope on 4/30/2009 11:52:57 AM , Rating: 2
I sure hope that when you said SSD you meant Super Star Destroyer.


RE: They better damn well...
By Silver2k7 on 4/30/2009 8:03:03 PM , Rating: 2
I completley agree, something alike a 3.5 inch floppy or a minidisk. Where the surface of the disc is protected would be a better solution.

Data protection is much more important than backwards compatibility of old optical disc formats.

A mimidisk for those who dont know what im talking about ^^
[img]http://www.vinyltodigital.co.uk/images/services/mi...[/img]


The day is getting closer
By amanojaku on 4/28/2009 10:58:25 PM , Rating: 5
When my girl will ask: "You got any porn?"

And I'll say: "Yeah, all of it."

And she'll go: "All of what series?"

And I'll say: " ALL PORN. As of five minutes ago."




By inperfectdarkness on 4/29/2009 6:30:10 AM , Rating: 2
you don't browse much, do you?


RE: The day is getting closer
By freeagle on 4/29/2009 6:43:15 AM , Rating: 5
When the day comes and your girlfriend asks you: "You got any porn?"
You'll know that you're not doing a very good job


RE: The day is getting closer
By Jeffk464 on 4/29/2009 11:54:09 AM , Rating: 1
Just remember to pay for porn once in a while so we can keep these chicks screwing in front of the camera.


sounds cool, now I just wanna know...
By jlips6 on 4/28/2009 11:54:59 PM , Rating: 3
how resistant is it to fingerprints and scratching?
How much does it cost per disc?
What's the Read/Write speed?
Is this ready for efficient production?




RE: sounds cool, now I just wanna know...
By Samus on 4/29/2009 3:41:36 AM , Rating: 4
your last question answers your first three.

until its ready for production, nobody knows!


RE: sounds cool, now I just wanna know...
By Hiawa23 on 4/29/2009 8:27:03 AM , Rating: 2
pretty impressive. I hear some keep saying what happens when the disc get scratched but if you take care of your disc this really is not an issue. 500GB is pretty impressive but I hear engineers are working on 400GB Blu ray discs.


RE: sounds cool, now I just wanna know...
By Samus on 4/29/2009 11:39:13 PM , Rating: 2
Pioneer already has working 400GB multilayer bluray discs, but there are conflicting reports about backwards compatiblity. I've read everything from "it's backwards compatible out of the box" to "requires player firmware update" to "will require optical pickup modification to read the non surface layers."

Confusingly, my impression was BD players can already read dual layers, so the mechanics to focus beyond the surface layer are already present. Theoretically all that should be required is a firmware update to recalibrate the focus stepping, which would be dope (proud bluray burner owner :)


By Silver2k7 on 4/30/2009 8:15:53 PM , Rating: 2
400GB in 16 layers, compared to the standard 1 or 2 layers, this does not sound possible with a firmware only change.

I believe Sanyo talked about 4 layerd discs 100GB, but they needed a new laserdiode.. and hoped to be able to have them on the market in 2011.


Optical Storage is Dead
By myhipsi on 4/29/2009 8:47:45 AM , Rating: 1
At least for me it is. Flash is getting cheaper by the hour, and by the time this thing sees the light of day you'll probably be able to store 500GB on a usb device the size of a Bic lighter for just as cheap.

As it is, I already have 100 DVD-Rs that I bought at Costco about 2 years ago sitting in a drawer collecting dust. As for Blu-ray, even though it's been on the market for a while now, it's still prohibitively expensive to use as a backup solution ($400.00 for the writer, and $15.00 per 25GB disc). Let's face it, the best high capacity backup solution right now is an external usb/e-sata HDD. It's fast, cheap, and reliable.

As for a medium for movies, games, etc. I think a great solution for the future is to put movies and games on write once proprietary flash based devices. Remember the good ole days of cartidges, near instant boot up, noiseless, and reliable. Well, imagine cartridges, just a whole lot smaller.

Mechanical optical drives are for the birds, IMO. They're noisey, and slow. They take forever to recognize a disc and actually start loading something. They scratch easily if mishandled, and they're bulky when compared to thumb drives.

The day I can finally toss my CD/DVD drive in the garbage and never have to hear another one spin up again, will be a happy one for me. Optical drives had their day in the sun, solid state storage is the future.




RE: Optical Storage is Dead
By afkrotch on 4/29/2009 11:14:09 AM , Rating: 3
blu-ray burner (under $170)(http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Sub...

blu-ray discs (under $5 a 25GB disc)(http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Sub...

Optical drives will be around a very long time. Hell, tape drives are still around. It's simply the cost.

4 gb USB key - $15
4.7 gb DVD (50 pack) - $15

Over 58 times the capacity for the same cost.


RE: Optical Storage is Dead
By myhipsi on 4/29/2009 12:43:47 PM , Rating: 2
I guess I was a little out of date on pricing, so your point is well taken with respect to the cost of Blu-ray storage.

I should have rephrased my subject line to "Optical storage is dead TO ME!"

Cost notwithstanding, I loath optical mediums for many reasons. Like I said before, I'm looking forward to the day I can toss my DVD burner, and buy and install Windows 7 (or whatever O/S of the day) from a USB key.


Will they encase it?
By kyleb2112 on 4/29/2009 12:36:39 AM , Rating: 4
500 gigs is way too much data to risk from a scratch. Will they finally encase these, or are we all still too enthralled by the pretty rainbow to hide it away?




Still remember the times...
By DeepBlue1975 on 4/29/2009 8:42:36 AM , Rating: 2
I still remember when optical storage media was far far more capacious than any available single hard disk drive at the moment (talking about desktops).

Now we have ultra cheap, 1tb+ HDDs on one side, and on the other, ultra expensive, 25gb BD disks which, in spite of the time it went by since its introduction, are still far from being ubiquitous at all.

I don't have a BD drive and, considering the prices, I think I won't either. DL DVDs are already expensive (and slow to burn) enough to make it a very rare buy for me.

We desperately need something like what the article describes to become mainstream and have a reasonable price after a couple of years of its introduction, as at 4gbs/disc you need a ton to make a home backup, and using an HDD as a backup does not seem too wise for me (making a mirror is better, but expensive, too)




RE: Still remember the times...
By afkrotch on 4/29/2009 11:24:13 AM , Rating: 2
The problem is adoption rates. If no one adopts, the price can't drop. If no one is buying, then the companies have no incentive to create more factories to produce.

Anyways, I hate backing up to disc, as then you have a bunch of discs. I use 4 x 1 TB external HDDs for backup. Once a week, I turn it on, copy everything over, then turn it off.

By the time this 500 GB hologram disc or 500 gig 16 layer BD disc comes out, we'll have 4 TB 3.5" hdds.


By PAPutzback on 4/29/2009 9:52:18 AM , Rating: 2
Unless I missed it it doesn't seem like anyone touched on the fact that an optical storage unit requires a 5 1/4 inch bay. Now for a media playback unit I think smaller and noiseless is better. Take a look at the ion systems coming out. They whole unit is about the size of a DVD drive and is capable of 1080P. Take a look at HDDs. WE are going from 3 1/2 inch drives down to 2 or less inch ssds. The future (1 to 2 years) of a HTPC is going to be about the size of a netbook or less. Give me a flash drive for my movies please. I don't want to hear drive spin up.
Perhaps someone will come out with a carousel that could hold 1000 SD cards and load them to play movies. No scratches to worry about, no kids fingerprints... The future electronics will be small.




By afkrotch on 4/29/2009 11:32:16 AM , Rating: 2
Slim drives require even less space. Was looking at one of the Sony slot loading slim drives myself for my desktop.

Nvidia Ion would be a failure as an HTPC, as it has no room for expansion. You'd end up with a lot of random external devices plugged into it, like hdds, optical drives, etc.

Also who is going to 2.5" SSDs for storage? Sure, they're using it for Windows and their programs, but all storage is still slapped onto a 3.5" 7200 rpm hdd. If you wanted to, you can get a 2.5" 7200 rpm hdd. Their storage is up to 500 GB atm.


By Chudilo on 4/29/2009 12:29:00 PM , Rating: 2
If they made the disk physically a quarter of the size of a DVD they'd have something everyone would be dying to have.
Imagine a tiny little disk that could fit in a device the size of the original ipod with with 125gig capacity that you could just pop in and out of the device.
I bet it can also spin like 100 times slower then a CD/DVD to conserve battery power.
I think this standard could work if they play their cards right.




There was a time..
By goku on 4/29/2009 2:38:45 PM , Rating: 2
There was a time when these discs held MORE data than a HDD, much much more! Remember the CDROM? Came out in the 80s when they only had like 10MB HDDs? And what about DVDs? Well they were still bigger than most drives at the time they came out but by then, drives already got pretty close in capacity. Now? Discs are lower in capacity than disk drives, kinda sad...




Yeah right.. Fool me once...
By ipay on 5/2/2009 3:21:41 AM , Rating: 2
shame on you, fool me twice-shame on me. I agree that flash is much more practical and flexible technology and can't wait till it'll replace the optical media. It will always be backward-compatible(all you need is a reader or usb) regardles of capacity, it doesn't require the whole new architecture and hardware and new standards every few years(just imagine shuffling your whole movie collections to different mediums). Just think of the whole +/- DVD mess and incompatibility hell they put consumers through because they couldn't divide their profits properly. Who lost? us.




holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By Pirks on 4/28/09, Rating: -1
RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By ReligiousScience on 4/28/2009 8:12:47 PM , Rating: 5
This statement is off in so many ways I don't even know where to begin...

Maybe the replies will do the talking for me.


RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By v3rt1g0 on 4/28/2009 8:20:59 PM , Rating: 4
It's Pirks. What do you expect?


RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By Pirks on 4/28/09, Rating: -1
RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By chmilz on 4/28/2009 8:35:43 PM , Rating: 1
<shudder> I have to agree with Pirks. Solid state storage technology is killing motorized devices at a spectacular rate, for good reason. Add the internet to the equation and goodnight, thanks for coming.


RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By inighthawki on 4/28/2009 9:38:52 PM , Rating: 3
When i can get a 5gb sd card for < 10 cents each let me know


By albundy2 on 4/29/2009 5:03:36 AM , Rating: 2
where can YOU get a rewritable dvd that can be writen on over 100,000 for 10 cents?

also, just a shot in the dark here, does anyone make flash that can be writen to once and read till it falls apart, like a dvd? something tells me this would be the 5GB flash card for 10 cents your looking for.


RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By Diesel Donkey on 4/28/2009 10:02:38 PM , Rating: 2
For now it is in optical disc format, but isn't the holy grail of holographic storage a solid-state system with no moving parts? I can't seem to find a reference at the moment, but I believe that it is an eventual goal for the technology.


By Diesel Donkey on 4/28/2009 10:12:53 PM , Rating: 2
Here's an example:

http://www.manifest-tech.com/media_dvd/dvd_holo.ht...

Look near the bottom.


By afkrotch on 4/29/2009 11:48:53 AM , Rating: 2
Yes, SSD tech is doing it at a spectacular rate. Hence why majority of everything still uses motorized devices.


RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By mattclary on 4/28/2009 8:35:08 PM , Rating: 2
Actually, I bet he's not that far off the mark. I'm guessing the standard "3 to 5 years away" for these disks... By that time, I suspect SSDs are going to be REALLY freaking cheap. As the process continues to shrink, capacity is going to be easy to get at a great price.


RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By Totally on 4/28/09, Rating: -1
RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By Pirks on 4/29/2009 12:05:19 AM , Rating: 3
640K will be enough for everybody


RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By ipay on 5/2/2009 3:31:01 AM , Rating: 2
Maybe its not dead yet but it should die quick and painful death for all the compatibility crap consumers have to put up with. Its really sad. I refuse to buy optical drive for my next build whether blu-ray or anything else, knowing that as soon as the newer and faster discs come out my hardware will be garbage. Ohh.. and not to even mention different disc manufacturers..


By meepstone on 4/28/2009 8:46:27 PM , Rating: 1
Considering how overly priced SSD's are, I doubt a small percentage will be using them before this comes out.


RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By inperfectdarkness on 4/28/2009 9:00:17 PM , Rating: 2
there will be a super-huge market for these.

the entire DOD (as well as many other government and civilian agencies) have already banned the use of all flash & portable drives. only floppies & disk drives are "safe" to use.

trust me, conflicker was only the beginning.

(p.s. yes, i know it SHOULD be simple enough do disable auto-run drives...but i'm not in I.T.)


RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By Pirks on 4/28/2009 9:05:18 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
the entire DOD (as well as many other government and civilian agencies) have already banned the use of all flash & portable drives. only floppies & disk drives are "safe" to use
This decision will be reverted once Windows 7 is deployed there, since autorun security (mega)hole is finally plugged in it. So not an argument.


RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 4/29/2009 6:17:22 AM , Rating: 2
In the classified space, this will remain.


By inperfectdarkness on 4/29/2009 6:32:19 AM , Rating: 2
100% true.

if only because disks are much more easily purged & sanitized than flash drives.


RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By djc208 on 4/29/2009 7:55:12 AM , Rating: 2
You're assuming these would somehow make it into DOD machines in the next decade. Considering government contracts go to the lowest bidder the DOD machine I have right now is still using a DVD/CDRW drive. Specialized applications may get them but only because they would need that capacity to move data outside the DOD network. Which is not very common.

The big problem with the flash media ban is that most of the stuff I want to move is small, and burning a CDR for a file that would fit on a floppy disk (which we don't have any more) seems a waste.

Again, Windows 7 may fix the problem but it will be years before the DOD transitions to it I'd imagine. We just in the last year converted to XP.


By afkrotch on 4/29/2009 11:51:24 AM , Rating: 2
Windows 7. Hell, we haven't really even started moving to Vista.


RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By jlips6 on 4/29/2009 12:14:36 AM , Rating: 3
Think software, video games, music, the annoying instruction DVD's that come with your fog machine or even occasionally a disc in a Wendy's fast food meal.
When is flash memory going to be as cheap as CD's?
Not for years and years yet.

The bottom line is, CD's are really cheap to manufacture with small memory storage. Flash memory... not so much.

It is possible. I mean, these discs could come out in a decade or two from now. This is the dailytech after all. But please forgive me if I hedge my bets on disc storage rather than flash memory for cheap data distribution.


RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By Ratinator on 4/29/2009 2:30:58 AM , Rating: 1
Hmmm....25GB RW Blu-Ray disc is around $25. 16GB Flash Drives are down around $30 now. It isn't as far apart as one may think.


RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By afkrotch on 4/29/2009 11:55:36 AM , Rating: 3
FFS, ppl need to research before opening their damn mouths.

25 gig BD-R = $5 or less

It's as far as jlips6 makes it out to be.


RE: holo/optic/disc storage is dead
By Ratinator on 4/29/2009 12:08:31 PM , Rating: 1
Dude, take a chill pill. You need to read what someone posted before opening your mouth: I said BD-RW not BD-R.

Last time I checked flash was re-writable. Comparing apples to apples.


By afkrotch on 4/29/2009 12:17:14 PM , Rating: 3
Oh, my bad. Make that

BD-RE = $10


Didn't I read about this years ago?
By Mindless Rambler on 4/28/09, Rating: -1
RE: Didn't I read about this years ago?
By thekdub on 4/28/2009 9:18:33 PM , Rating: 2
You're right, the technology isn't new. But that's not what the article is about. Its about GE developing a holodisc that can store up to 500GB of data, which is more than any previous disc.

Its nice to see some innovation, but I think that for the average consumer, flash memory will be the cheaper and more practical format. You just can't stick a holodisc in your pocket or on a keychain. Well, you could, but it might not work at the end of the day.


RE: Didn't I read about this years ago?
By Mindless Rambler on 4/29/2009 12:52:16 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
But that's not what the article is about. Its about GE developing a holodisc that can store up to 500GB of data, which is more than any previous disc.

No, the title said "GE Makes Holographic Optical Storage Breakthrough", which is wrong because there was no breakthrough here since we've had this level of technology for some time, InPhase Technologies even advertises 300gb, 800gb, and 1.6tb solutions at their webpage.


RE: Didn't I read about this years ago?
By melgross on 4/29/2009 1:22:20 AM , Rating: 2
This IS a breakthrough. Ge said that this is based on current Blu-Ray technology, so that it can read, and likely write, our current formats as well. It should also be cheap.

The non working InPhase technology will be VERY expensive, assuming they ever get it working.


RE: Didn't I read about this years ago?
By Mindless Rambler on 4/29/2009 1:37:13 AM , Rating: 3
quote:
This IS a breakthrough. Ge said that this is based on current Blu-Ray technology, so that it can read, and likely write, our current formats as well. It should also be cheap.

No, that isn't what it said, and this still isn't a breakthrough. The article did not say that this disc was based off of Blu-Ray technology, it only said that GE's disc is similar enough to CD, DVD, and Blu-Ray technology in that future optical drives meant for GE's holographic disc would be backwards compatible, just like DVDs are with CDs, and Blu-Ray with CDs and DVDs.

quote:
The non working InPhase technology will be VERY expensive, assuming they ever get it working.

Assuming they ever get it working? InPhase has been shipping their products for years. Did you even read this article?


By themaster08 on 4/29/2009 4:32:53 AM , Rating: 2
It's a DailyTech headline.

Nuff said.


RE: Didn't I read about this years ago?
By fic2 on 4/28/2009 10:34:16 PM , Rating: 2
Mindless Rambler is right. Holographic storage has been coming out in 3-5 years for at least 15 years now.

Interesting - I did find that apparently you can buy a 300G drive from inPhase for around $18k. Maybe I'll have to pick up a couple....


RE: Didn't I read about this years ago?
By fic2 on 4/28/2009 10:39:09 PM , Rating: 3
Apparently I was wrong - doesn't look like it was ever released according to wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/InPhase_Technologies. And their last press release was in '07.

Yeah, go ahead and rate me down but I have been reading about the promise of holographic storage long enough to know it's not around the corner.


RE: Didn't I read about this years ago?
By scruffypup on 4/29/2009 12:38:53 AM , Rating: 2
Well reading that wikipedia link and you will never find anything out!!!

Try doing better research than relying on one site for everything,...

http://www.inphase-technologies.com/products/defau...

obviously they are making and shipping holographic storage media and have done so since 2007

This is not intended to compete on the average consumer's needs for mp3s, however, it can possibly make some radical changes in life down the road. As for now, it can make a big difference to large companies,...


RE: Didn't I read about this years ago?
By melgross on 4/29/2009 1:25:42 AM , Rating: 1
This doesn't work for anything other that some heavy duty storage.

It's VERY slow. Would you like to write to this, or read from it, at those speeds?

It's also very expensive.

This isn't working in a useful manner for most uses. It's very specialized.


By Radnor on 4/29/2009 4:41:07 AM , Rating: 2
"50 year media archive life"

Your right this isn't for your hands. But it quite perfect for backups/storage solution. The lifetime of a CD-R or DVD-+R is 3-5 years, taking extra care and using good ones.

"300GB – 1.6TB Capacities
20MB/s-120 MB/s transfer rate and milliseconds data access time "

Not the fastest, but 1,6 TB on a 50 lasting years media. Your joking right ? If it is for backups or storage doesn't need high transfer speeds. Does need fast access time witch it has.

This is not for you and for me. But i know many companies that if they knew this existed, it was a perfect backup solution.


By afkrotch on 4/29/2009 12:08:29 PM , Rating: 3
It's VERY slow? Huh?

20MB/s-120 MB/s transfer. It's max transfer is faster than a DVD. It's also faster than a BD.

54x CD - 7.93 MB/s
22x DVD - 29.04 MB/s
12x BD - 54 MB/s

Hell, if it can sustain the 120 MB/s transfer, it'd be equivalent to a 300 GB Velociraptor HDD. It's anything, but slow.


By fic2 on 4/29/2009 11:56:58 AM , Rating: 2
Pardon me. I looked at inPhase's website press releases and didn't see anything newer than 1.5 years ago (Nov 2007). None of the press release headlines says that it is shipping.
http://www.inphase-technologies.com/news/default.a...

I would think that if a company is alive and actually shipping a product they would announce it.


RE: Didn't I read about this years ago?
By marvdmartian on 4/29/2009 10:57:43 AM , Rating: 1
Maybe you're thinking of a long, long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away??

"Help me, Obi-Wan Kenobi! You're our only hope!" ;)


By gsellis on 4/29/2009 11:34:59 AM , Rating: 2
Yes, you did. Pioneer was working on this in 2004. After a brief search, I found a link.

http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/783/10177...


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