backtop


Print 54 comment(s) - last by SlyNine.. on Jun 28 at 3:52 AM


Adrian Lamo has become only the second source in Wikileaks history to be outed, and the first to be apparently intentionally outed by the site.  (Source: Zero Zumbrun)

U.S. Army Intelligence officer, SPC Bradley Manning, in uniform  (Source: Wired.com)
Hacker also participates in personal attack on Lamo; Lamo is only second source compromised in Wikileaks history

Adrian Lamo has become a hot news topic.  The celebrity hacker who once hacked servers at The New York Times and Microsoft recently turned in a U.S. Military officer, Bradley Manning, over a series of leaks -- including a leak of 260,000 confidential diplomatic wires -- which Lamo felt represented a tremendous danger to nation security.

Now with Manning in military custody, Wikileaks received a major portion of the transcript of Adrian Lamo's chats with Manning from an anonymous source.  That source was Lamo.

Lamo, a long time Wikileaks supporter and donor became only the second source in Wikileaks history to be outed.  And reportedly it was Wikileaks itself that outed Lamo.

The following is the unabridged logs, which they allegedly passed along to the site BoingBoing.  The complete log follows:
(12:15:11 PM) bradass87: hypothetical question: if you had free reign over
classified networks for long periods of time... say, 8-9 months... and you
saw incredible things, awful things... things that belonged in the public
domain, and not on some server stored in a dark room in Washington DC...
what would you do?
(12:16:38 PM) bradass87
: or Guantanamo, Bagram, Bucca, Taji, VBC for that
matter...
(12:17:47 PM) bradass87: things that would have an impact on 6.7 billion
people
(12:21:24 PM) bradass87: say... a database of half a million events during
the iraq war... from 2004 to 2009... with reports, date time groups,
lat-lon locations, casualty figures... ? or 260,000 state department
cables from embassies and consulates all over the world, explaining how
the first world exploits the third, in detail, from an internal
perspective?
(12:22:49 PM) bradass87: the air-gap has been penetrated... =L
(12:23:19 PM) Adrian: how so?
(12:26:09 PM) Adrian: yt?
(12:26:09 PM) bradass87: lets just say *someone* i know intimately well,
has been penetrating US classified networks, mining data like the ones
described... and been transferring that data from the classified networks
over the "air gap" onto a commercial network computer... sorting the data,
compressing it, encrypting it, and uploading it to a crazy white haired
aussie who can't seem to stay in one country very long =L
(12:27:13 PM) bradass87: im here
(12:27:24 PM) Adrian: Depends. What are the particulars?
(12:28:19 PM) bradass87: theres substantial lag i think
(12:29:52 PM) Adrian: I don't understand.
(12:30:13 PM) bradass87: what was the last message you recieved?
(12:30:47 PM) Adrian: (12:28:19 PM) bradass87: theres substantial lag i think
(12:30:56 PM) bradass87: before that
(12:31:09 PM) Adrian:
(12:26:09 PM) bradass87: lets just say *someone* i know intimately well,
has been penetrating US classified networks, mining data like the ones
described... and been transferring that data from the classified networks
over the "air gap" onto a commercial network computer... sorting the data,
compressing it, encrypting it, and uploading it to a crazy white haired
aussie who can't seem to stay in one country very long =L
(12:27:13 PM) bradass87: im here
(12:27:24 PM) Adrian: Depends. What are the particulars?
(12:31:43 PM) bradass87: crazy white haired dude = Julian Assange
(12:33:05 PM) bradass87: in other words... ive made a huge mess :'(
(12:35:17 PM) bradass87: im sorry... im just emotionally fractured
(12:39:12 PM) bradass87: im a total mess
(12:41:54 PM) bradass87: i think im in more potential heat than you ever were
(12:41:54 PM) Adrian : I have more messages than resources
allocatable to action them. Please be very patient.
(12:45:59 PM) Adrian: not mandatorily
(12:46:08 PM) Adrian: there are always outs
(12:46:17 PM) Adrian: how long have you helped WIkileaks?
(12:49:09 PM) bradass87: since they released the 9/11 "pager messages"
(12:49:38 PM) bradass87: i immediately recognized that they were from an
NSA database, and i felt comfortable enough to come forward
(12:50:20 PM) bradass87: so... right after thanksgiving timeframe of 2009
(12:52:33 PM) bradass87: Hilary Clinton, and several thousand diplomats
around the world are going to have a heart attack when they wake up one
morning, and finds an entire repository of classified foreign policy is
available, in searchable format to the public... =L
(12:53:41 PM) bradass87: s/Hilary/Hillary
(12:54:47 PM) Adrian: What sort of content?
(12:56:36 PM) Adrian: brb cigarette
(12:56:43 PM) Adrian: keep typing <3
(12:59:41 PM) bradass87: uhm... crazy, almost criminal political
backdealings... the non-PR-versions of world events and crises... uhm...
all kinds of stuff like everything from the buildup to the Iraq War during
Powell, to what the actual content of "aid packages" is: for instance, PR
that the US is sending aid to pakistan includes funding for
water/food/clothing... that much is true, it includes that, but the other
85% of it is for F-16 fighters and munitions to aid in the Afghanistan
effort, so the US can call in Pakistanis to do aerial bombing instead of
americans potentially killing civilians and creating a PR crisis
(1:00:57 PM) bradass87: theres so much... it affects everybody on earth...
everywhere there's a US post... there's a diplomatic scandal that will be
revealed... Iceland, the Vatican, Spain, Brazil, Madascar, if its a
country, and its recognized by the US as a country, its got dirt on it
(1:01:27 PM) bradass87: i need one myself
(1:10:38 PM) bradass87: its open diplomacy... world-wide anarchy in CSV
format... its Climategate with a global scope, and breathtaking depth...
its beautiful, and horrifying...
(1:10:38 PM) Adrian : I have more messages than resources
allocatable to action them. Please be very patient.
(1:11:54 PM) bradass87: and... its important that it gets out... i feel,
for some bizarre reason
(1:12:02 PM) bradass87: it might actually change something
(1:13:10 PM) bradass87: i just... dont wish to be a part of it... at least
not now... im not ready... i wouldn't mind going to prison for the rest of
my life, or being executed so much, if it wasn't for the possibility of
having pictures of me... plastered all over the world press... as boy...
(1:14:11 PM) bradass87: i've totally lost my mind... i make no sense...
the CPU is not made for this motherboard...
(1:14:42 PM) bradass87: s/as boy/as a boy
(1:30:32 PM) bradass87: >sigh<
(1:31:40 PM) bradass87: i just wanted enough time to figure myself out...
to be myself... and be running around all the time, trying to meet someone
else's expectations
(1:32:01 PM) bradass87: *and not be
(1:33:03 PM) bradass87: im just kind of drifting now...
(1:34:11 PM) bradass87: waiting to redeploy to the US, be discharged...
and figure out how on earth im going to transition
(1:34:45 PM) bradass87: all while witnessing the world freak out as its
most intimate secrets are revealed
(1:35:06 PM) bradass87: its such an awkward place to be in, emotionally
and psychologically
(1:35:06 PM) Adrian : I have more messages than resources
allocatable to action them. Please be very patient.
(1:39:03 PM) bradass87: i cant believe what im confessing to you :'(
(1:40:20 PM) bradass87: ive been so isolated so long... i just wanted to
be nice, and live a normal life... but events kept forcing me to figure
out ways to survive... smart enough to know whats going on, but helpless
to do anything... no-one took any notice of me
(1:40:43 PM) bradass87: :'(
(1:43:51 PM) Adrian: back
(1:43:59 PM) bradass87: im self medicating like crazy when im not toiling
in the supply office (my new location, since im being discharged, im not
offically intel anymore)
(1:44:11 PM) bradass87: you missed a lot...
(1:45:00 PM) Adrian: what kind of scandal?
(1:45:16 PM) bradass87: hundreds of them
(1:45:40 PM) Adrian: like what? I'm genuinely curious about details.
(1:46:01 PM) bradass87: i dont know... theres so many... i dont have the
original material anymore
(1:46:18 PM) bradass87: uhmm... the Holy See and its position on the
Vatican sex scandals
(1:46:26 PM) Adrian: play it by ear
(1:46:29 PM) bradass87: the broiling one in Germany
(1:47:36 PM) bradass87: im sorry, there's so many... its impossible for
any one human to read all quarter-million... and not feel overwhelmed...
and possibly desensitized
(1:48:20 PM) bradass87: the scope is so broad... and yet the depth so rich
(1:48:50 PM) Adrian: give me some bona fides ... yanno? any specifics.
(1:49:40 PM) bradass87: this one was a test: Classified cable from US
Embassy Reykjavik on Icesave dated 13 Jan 2010
(1:50:30 PM) bradass87: the result of that one was that the icelandic
ambassador to the US was recalled, and fired
(1:51:02 PM) bradass87: thats just one cable...
(1:51:14 PM) Adrian: Anything unreleased?
(1:51:25 PM) bradass87: i'd have to ask assange
(1:51:53 PM) bradass87: i zerofilled the original
(1:51:54 PM) Adrian: why do you answer to him?
(1:52:29 PM) bradass87: i dont... i just want the material out there... i
dont want to be a part of it
(1:52:54 PM) Adrian: i've been considering helping wikileaks with opsec
(1:53:13 PM) bradass87: they have decent opsec... im obviously violating it
(1:53:34 PM) bradass87: im a wreck
(1:53:47 PM) bradass87: im a total fucking wreck right now
Note: These logs are incomplete.  Additional portions have been classified by the U.S. government, pending its investigation.  However, this is the unabridged confession.

BoingBoing, as noted, first published coverage of these logs and suggested Manning to be a transgender individual.  Gawker picked up and expanded on this story, citing a source named Ilva in its commentary (this individual, contrary to Gawker's claims has not seen Lamo since 2007, according to him).  Again, Wikileaks appears to be the source of BoingBoing's publication, according to Lamo.

Lamo tells us he sent the logs to Wikileaks "To see if they'd be true to their ethos, and publish something, even if it incriminated a source, or if they'd cover it up. I wanted to pose a catch-22.  They did neither.  [T]hey passed them on to a disgruntled ex-fan who knows my ex-wife[.]  ID'ing me as the source. They broke their own rules.  Any source that pisses them off could face termination, prison, or worse."

As evidence that the organization betrayed him, Lamo cites that neither the U.S. government nor Wired, where his close friend Kevin Poulsen works, would have leaked the logs.  And besides Wikileaks they were the only ones with the logs.

Poulsen had the logs on the USB stick, which has not been connected to a networked computer.  And the U.S. government took Adrian Lamo's copy.  The U.S. government's system that they're stored on is believed to be air-gapped (not connected to external networks).  So there's no apparent way someone could have stolen the logs.  The only other party to have them was Wikileaks, who appears to have been the one who released them.  Additional evidence supporting this assertion is provided by the fact that the attached snippet preceding the logs matches the one Lamo recalls sending to Wikileaks.

There is the possibility that the transcript was stolen from Wikileaks, which would essentially be just as damaging for the site's credibility.  However, that possibility seems unlikely given the site's unblemished track record pre-Manning.

There's more to the story as well.  A hacker named Nadim, once a friend of Lamo, also has become involved in the incident.  He reposted the leaks along with personal IM logs of conversations he had with Adrian Lamo and his wife Lauren Lamo.  These logs seem clearly engineered to paint Adrian in a negative light.

Lamo tells us, "Nadim's a good kid. Or he was. He's very idealistic. I fucking warn people not to put me on a pedestal. It's a long fall.  They passed [the logs] on to Nadim, who was vocally trying to make me "pay"[.]  It's Nixonesque dirty tricks."

In his post to a Fairfax, Virginia forum, Nadim claims that Lamo falsified the logs, due to duplicated lines and the word "confession".  Lamo expressly denies this claim, stating, "No.  Those were satellite issues.  If I was going to fuck with text, I'd claim the first part was a fabrication."

Also Nadim posts a chat log where he discusses leaking the documentary film Hackers Wanted.  The film was indeed leaked over bittorrent.  Lamo points out, "[N]ote /him/ offering to leak the film - not me asking."

And Lamo says that Nadim did not leak the film either.  The movie is narrated by Kevin Spacey and follows the adventures of Adrian Lamo and his friends.  Directed by Sam Bozzo, the film has never seen official release due to alleged conflicts between its producer and others on the team.

Nadim also leaked a lengthy discussion that he had with Lamo's soon-to-be ex-wife Lauren Lamo.  Lauren, who is going through divorce proceedings with Adrian reveals details of Lamo's use of prescription medicines.

A short excerpt of that conversation follows:
Nadim: There were 2600 articles published about "hacking your brain" with certain "boosting" medications
Nadim: Is this related?
Lauren: It has crippled him, into living like this, and without these meds, he can't function, or so he thinks.
Lauren: I suppose.
Lauren: The first and only time he ever stayed at my parents home in phoenix he stole a bunch of my mothers medication (one that he too happened to be taking normally) and gave us quite a scare in the morning.
Nadim: Adrian doesn't trust people, but makes his entire functioning dependent on drugs?
Nadim: I'm angry at him.
Nadim: He could have so easily avoided such a trap
Lauren: so lackadaisical he was spilling his coffee all over himself burning his legs and falling over speaking nonsense.
When considering these messages, one must realize that first Adrian Lamo and his wife are going through a trying divorce, so it'd be easy to take a personal conversation out of context.  And Lamo never asked to have his personal life held up on a pedestal, he says (Lamo has been diagnosed with Asperger syndrome, which he takes several medicines for).

Lamo tells us, "There's very little dirtier than playing on an ex-wife, an ex-lover, and a disgruntled fan to mishandle information submitted in confidence in an attempt at character assassination."

This story is significant for several reasons.  First, if substantiated, these claims represent a complete and purposeful compromise of Wikileak's policies by the site's leadership.  Lamo comments, "I think it's clear that Wikileaks needs change from the top in order to protect their sources.  Nobody who vexes them is safe.  They mishandled this wikileak - who's to say what they're doing with the 260,000 DOS cables?"

Secondly, this represents Lamo giving the public access to the complete chat logs for the first time, so they can draw their own conclusions about the incident.

UPDATE: Tuesday June 29, 2010 8:30 p.m. -
We have since come across what seems to show (in the form of a podcast interview Lamo gave to an Australian blog site) that Lamo's allegation that Wikileaks outed him was flawed, and that he actually outed himself, while Wikileaks allegedly confirmed him as a source. We've updated the title according. Lamo asserts that Wikileaks violated site policy by independently confirming him as a source through back-channels.

Lamo has not backed down from his call for Wikileaks director Julian Assange to resign. He claims that even though he outed himself, Wikileaks outed or confirmed him as a source as well -- a distinction which now seems academic.


Comments     Threshold


This article is over a month old, voting and posting comments is disabled

We can only hope..
By Daniel8uk on 6/24/2010 5:52:05 PM , Rating: 2
I hope to hell, and I mean more than a lot of things in my life that these cables are released to the public.

I doubt it will happen, I slightly doubt the cables were ever stolen, but I think it will benefit every single person on earth... Who isn't incriminated in these cables that is ;)




RE: We can only hope..
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 6/24/2010 6:34:36 PM , Rating: 5
Wrong answer. The world can't handle this sort of stuff. It does not belong in the public domain, not now, not ever.


RE: We can only hope..
By DominionSeraph on 6/24/2010 7:52:27 PM , Rating: 3
Perhaps someday.
But as of now, the majority of the world believes that a magic man who lives in the sky is running things. Releasing technical details to them just doesn't work -- they have no idea how to process them.


RE: We can only hope..
By Daniel8uk on 6/24/2010 8:07:41 PM , Rating: 2
How do you know what the world can and cannot handle?

It's fine if you want to live in your cosy little world where nothing bad ever happens and your always on the side of the 'good', but that isn't for everyone, some people would like to know the truth, so they actually know how to act and who to act against.

The government doesn't do that, the courts don't do that. So what other choice do we have?


RE: We can only hope..
By mumedina on 6/24/2010 8:23:52 PM , Rating: 4
You mention it as if you've personally seen the purported wires?

I'm sure you have, seeing that DT has had quite a few exclusive "interviews" with Adrian ever since the Manning story broke out.

Personally, I wish the wires would get released so we could see the extent of human evil and corruption conducted by our supposed leaders (and I use that term loosely). If I had them I would release them to world...but that's just me.


RE: We can only hope..
By kroker on 6/25/10, Rating: 0
RE: We can only hope..
By hughlle on 6/25/2010 6:16:56 AM , Rating: 4
lies and ignorance are important to hold societies together?

so you mean our "lies" have held the middle east together. they havn't ended up with a total loss of near all rights, poeple being convicted for 10 years for "conspiring to perform a terror act" simply by sending one email or offhandedly saying one thing in jest. the thousands upon thousands of cctv cameras in the UK, warrantless searches (my brother was sat up in a tree recently reaading a book, a policeman came over with a sniffer dog and illegally demanded to search his bag)

lies and ignorance do anything but keep societies together.


RE: We can only hope..
By 91TTZ on 6/25/2010 10:20:15 AM , Rating: 4
Huh?

Who are you to say that the world can and cannot handle? Who are you to determine what information should be shown to others?

You seem to be in favor of censorship.


RE: We can only hope..
By Reclaimer77 on 6/25/2010 3:52:12 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
You seem to be in favor of censorship.


I don't think you can call secret government documents a form of "censorship". That would be like saying unless everything you do in your life isn't 100% disclosed to us, you're censoring us.

There is a process for secret documents being released to the public. It's called declassification. Done in a very careful manner to make sure they aren't putting lives at risk or compromising any operations.

Hacking is wrong and illegal, no matter what the results. He did something morally and legally wrong, was very careless, and on a person note doesn't appear to be very mentally stable either. I simply can't agree that we have a "right" to hack and steal documents because we think we have some obligation to know what's going behind the scenes.


RE: We can only hope..
By RivuxGamma on 6/26/2010 8:36:39 PM , Rating: 2
I disagree. Our government needs to answer to us. I'm not saying that there is no info that should not be made widely public, especially if it can be used in a way that harms us or gets people killed, but, in principle, our government needs to be answerable to us. It's the only way to keep it in check.


RE: We can only hope..
By sh3rules on 6/24/10, Rating: 0
RE: We can only hope..
By DominionSeraph on 6/24/2010 8:04:01 PM , Rating: 2
Have you ever taken aspirin/Tylenol/Advil?
Do you know how they work?

Do you know how the power grid works? Do you know what your computer's CPU is doing right now? Do you know the chemical processes the food you eat goes through?
Do you know how your car regulates the combustion chamber's fuel-air mixture?


RE: We can only hope..
By crleap on 6/24/2010 9:02:32 PM , Rating: 1
Pretty cool that the info to answer all of those questions could be answered after a short session of googling huh?


RE: We can only hope..
By bigboxes on 6/24/2010 9:11:49 PM , Rating: 5
That's pretty elitist of you. Personally, I prefer the free sharing of data. That way I can decide what's best for me. But that's just me.


RE: We can only hope..
By sh3rules on 6/24/2010 11:14:36 PM , Rating: 2
But I agree with you! I guess I'm not good at sarcastic writing.


RE: We can only hope..
By DominionSeraph on 6/25/2010 12:21:35 AM , Rating: 2
No, you're just not good at following a thread.


RE: We can only hope..
By DominionSeraph on 6/25/2010 12:19:57 AM , Rating: 5
What's best for you isn't an issue. If you decided it was best for you to eat a shotgun, nobody would care. You really don't matter.
The problem arises when a bunch of idiots get together and think they're qualified to dictate policy. You are likely far too stupid and emotionally unaware to be anywhere near qualified for that, and having multiples of that doesn't increase the overall competency level.

Right now I'm listening to Fox News in the background going over President Obama's unfavorable poll results over his handling of the Gulf oil spill. As though he has the power to do any more. Military subs will be crushed long before they reach a depth of 5000ft, nor are they equipped to manipulate objects. Scientific research equipment is suited to collect undersea samples, it is not geared to do underwater drilling work. The President's authority over BP is practically nonexistent -- it is the judicial branch which will determine the scope of their liability. What's he supposed to do, order them out of the area so that we can spend weeks setting up people and equipment leased from other oil companies just so they can do the exact same thing BP is doing? He'd be crucified if he did that because public perception would be that the situation was moving backwards.
The people are going to be dissatisfied no matter what.

People are stupid and emotion-driven leading to decisions hanging on magical thinking. They want things magically "done," having no concept whatsoever that the path from here to to there is a series of technical steps with technical limitations. You can't tell them this because they don't want to hear it .
Because the public is a bunch of babies, you have to baby them. It's an unfortunate reality. If you give the NASCAR Nation a simple set of facts, they will draw the wrong conclusions. And because they're too stupid to even begin to realize they're stupid, once they've drawn a conclusion, they can't alter it. (A true genius recognizes that he can be stupid at times, and doesn't have a problem going over things again to root out that stupidity. An idiot, on the other hand, is blissfully unaware.)
Giving them all the facts just leads you right to banging your head against the wall over their idiocy, so you can't do that. You have to tailor your message such that they'll draw the appropriate conclusion the first time. This is a LOT of additional work, and unsatisfying work at that. But it has to be done.


RE: We can only hope..
By congokit on 6/25/10, Rating: -1
RE: We can only hope..
By SlyNine on 6/28/2010 3:39:50 AM , Rating: 1
I think his point is valid and an insightful look at the folly of peoples premises and conclusions. But you ad-hominem attacks are meaningless and is at best anecdotal / dribble.

"And you know better?" What's your point. It seems at least he's trying to form a premise based on valid information. He didn't say he had an answer to solve all our problems.


RE: We can only hope..
By ekv on 6/25/2010 2:06:37 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
What's best for you isn't an issue. If you decided it was best for you to eat a shotgun, nobody would care. You really don't matter.
I'm not a doctor, but I'm not wrong in saying your reliance on a government solution will lead to clinical depression.

W/o an external point of reference there really is no hope. And having no hope ... then it really doesn't matter. Unless. Unless there is Somebody who cares, no matter what. Somebody who cares whether or not you decide to take your own medicine.


RE: We can only hope..
By DominionSeraph on 6/25/2010 2:27:08 PM , Rating: 2
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperbole

I was viewing him from my personal perspective as a member of the general population, and pushing that view. For me to expand the picture to encompass, say, hypothetical family members, would have watered down the message. The general public is not his family. They do not care in the same way.

On average, one American commits suicide every 15 minutes.
I really doubt you spend every day crying over each one.


RE: We can only hope..
By ekv on 6/26/2010 12:07:02 AM , Rating: 2
Drop dead.

So, was that a rhetorical device? no?

I know what you're pushing. I've had to wipe that stink off my s.h.o.e.s 8) a few times, even though I try to avoid it.

You come off as erudite, brilliant even ... a regular legend in your own mind. However, your faith in government solutions speaks volumes. Higher critical thinking will lead to cynicism and, in your case, clinical depression. Where is the hope? In whom do you place your trust?


RE: We can only hope..
By DominionSeraph on 6/26/2010 12:51:09 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
However, your faith in government solutions speaks volumes.


The only management technique you can think of is micromanagement. That rather speaks to the limitations of your imagination.

Micromanagement isn't very effective. It takes the decisions away from the people who have the relevant facts right in front of them, and sends the message that only management has anything of value to contribute. Workers eventually clue in on that and live down to that expectation.
Pessimistic control freaks make bad managers.

It is far better to give your workers the tools needed for them to accomplish their jobs, give them just enough oversight to both let them know their positive work is positively valued and that they can't get away with goofing off, and expect success. When failures occur, then you have something concrete to investigate. And the point of failure will usually be a straightforward technical issue, unlike micromanagement where you have to rip apart the convoluted decision-making process because the failure is likely due to the worker not communicating all the relevant facts or the manager misunderstanding the situation as described.

Micromanagement is robotic. People are organic.
It's better to use organic processes with people.

quote:
Higher critical thinking will lead to cynicism and, in your case, clinical depression.


You really shouldn't try to project things onto me. A lesser mind cannot encompass a greater mind, so you're just taking wild shots into a complete blankness that will always be blank to you. You have no valid checks because the universe in which the truth resides is far beyond your ability to model.
If my mindscape were to be crammed into your little head, it would break you.


RE: We can only hope..
By ekv on 6/26/2010 2:12:08 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
You really shouldn't try to project things onto me.
Who said anything about management techniques? I'm speaking about a Saviour. You may want to re-read what you wrote.


RE: We can only hope..
By Kenenniah on 6/24/2010 10:37:29 PM , Rating: 2
It doesn't matter if someone knows the technical answers for all those. It's still not blind faith.

A person has a headache. They take Advil. The headache goes away. Maybe the first time they ever took Advil they took it on faith that it might help. After a few times however it becomes knowledge based on personal experience and observation. They don't have to know how and why it works, to know that it works for them.

Same with all your other examples. For the purposes of how people actually use those items, technical knowledge isn't required. For how those things are used, it's experience and observation that tells people this item gives me this result. Not faith.


RE: We can only hope..
By DominionSeraph on 6/25/2010 12:36:57 AM , Rating: 2
Country X starts becoming a headache. We send in a package of Advil. The headache disappears.

Results can still be observed without knowing the technical details.


RE: We can only hope..
By Kenenniah on 6/25/2010 2:37:15 AM , Rating: 2
Slightly different. With a personal headache and repeated uses of Advil we see the effects firsthand. Eventually enough to be relatively sure that the Advil helped.

When the government uses something (Advil) to solve a headache (another country), first off we only have their word or the media's that the Advil was sent. We also don't know if anything else was sent or done, and if so, what. We don't have the ability to observe completely. When it comes to government actions, unfortunately a lot does become a matter of faith or lack thereof.


RE: We can only hope..
By Patchouli on 6/26/2010 5:36:36 AM , Rating: 2
If advil fixes my headache by killing, lying, and cheating, I'd sure like to find out.

You're just as blind as everyone, you're just a fool who's trusting the government to look out for anyone's best interest. And, if that's not true, then why would you argue that it's best that the public doesn't know the terrible things they're doing, for terrible results, because then they couldn't get them done?

Even if you're an elitist, it doesn't make you elite.


RE: We can only hope..
By SlyNine on 6/28/2010 3:52:22 AM , Rating: 2
Deductive inferences vs. inductive inferences.

Inductive example: We know the sun will rise because it has rose every day preceding it.

Deductive example: The sun will rise because as the earth spins this side will eventually face the sun.

90% of peoples knowledge probably comes from Inductive reasoning. Unfortunately that also leads to people believing in things simply because they always have, or accepting things because "that's just they way it is".

When you don't have all the information or time to processes information, inductive is ok. But I think this world would benefit from more deductive reasoning. People are just to lazy, and maybe stupid, otho I hope not.


RE: We can only hope..
By Looey on 6/24/10, Rating: -1
By frostedambassador on 6/24/2010 6:17:15 PM , Rating: 2
I am following this story closely, and this log was already posted by Boing Boing 4 and a half days ago:
http://www.boingboing.net/2010/06/19/wikileaks-a-s...
http://www.boingboing.net/2010/06/20/was-alleged-w...

The redacted personal information was originally included in the first link, then removed when someone pointed out to Xeni the reason it had been censored. The redacted information was then included in the second article once it was clear the information was already public.

As far as I know, though, the accusation that WikiLeaks leaked this log is new.




By frostedambassador on 6/24/2010 6:26:12 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
As evidence of that, Lamo cites that neither the U.S. government nor Wired, where his close friend Kevin Poulsen works, would have leaked the logs. And besides Wikileaks they were the only ones with the logs.


There's also the more likely possibility that Lamo isn't as great a security expert as he thinks he is, and all this attention he has brought to himself has encouraged many who value the freedom of information to hack his network to acquire the full logs...


By DominionSeraph on 6/25/2010 2:53:38 PM , Rating: 2
From the article:

quote:
Poulsen had the logs on the USB stick, which has not been connected to a networked computer. And the U.S. government took Adrian Lamo's copy.


By frostedambassador on 6/25/2010 4:43:18 PM , Rating: 2
That wasn't in the article before I posted the comment. Neither was the admission that the log was posted on BoingBoing four and a half days ago. Or the link to this material supposedly published by "Nadim".


Master Kenobi...
By sh3rules on 6/24/2010 11:17:11 PM , Rating: 2
How do you know what the world can and cannot handle?

That's a very big claim.




RE: Master Kenobi...
By SteelyKen on 6/25/2010 12:36:14 AM , Rating: 3
You want the truth? You can't handle the truth!


Psyop
By SiliconJon on 6/25/2010 11:25:21 AM , Rating: 3
It's also possible that Lamo is working with the Gov for an alternative method of reducing the threat Wikileaks poses by deploying a psyop that will discourage future leakers.




RE: Psyop
By frostedambassador on 6/25/2010 4:38:23 PM , Rating: 2
I thought that might be a possibility at first. But Lamo is doing such a bad job of this that if he were put up to it by some governmental organization, they're certainly regretting it now.


Where?
By NullSubroutine on 6/24/2010 6:28:45 PM , Rating: 2
I always heard that he released 67,000 pages of diplomatic documents to wikileaks, anyone know where to find all that?




RE: Where?
By frostedambassador on 6/24/2010 6:42:53 PM , Rating: 2
Wikileaks has stated that isn't accurate: http://twitter.com/wikileaks/status/15612005016

Whether that means they don't have them, they haven't looked at them yet (they have a large amount of information they haven't gone through yet), or the number isn't right, we currently have no way to know.

Also, I doubt they would all be published together if WikiLeaks does have them. They publish in a way to maximize the political impact of the material. They have so far shown no desire to publish information that directly endangers national security, so perhaps we would only see some cables released in a staggered fashion.


Lame-o
By DigitalFreak on 6/24/2010 8:22:08 PM , Rating: 2
Manning's biggest mistake was trusting Lame-o. I'd be happy to see Lame-o disappeared.




RE: Lame-o
By zodiacfml on 6/24/2010 11:58:58 PM , Rating: 2
agree.
if Manning was only mature and wise enough to control himself... got too excited and emotional which is typical.

Lamo, i think, is also unstable and got excited too. he should have just given advice as to what Manning should do, which is to stay calm.


Air-gapping != Security.
By Klinky1984 on 6/25/2010 12:19:53 AM , Rating: 3
I find it funny that Lamo suggests his chatlog discussing leaking information off a .gov air-gapped network couldn't have been compromised because one of the copies is with the .gov their air-gapped network.




Realities in
By Nightraptor on 6/25/2010 2:31:25 AM , Rating: 3
The reality of situations like these is that EVERY country has conducted actions to preserve their own security that would be extremely damaging if they were public knowledge. EVERY leader has made disparaging remarks about friends and foes alike that if known would cause significant damage to friends and may lead to war with foes.

It is not a matter of whether or not the public can "handle" what is in these documents, but rather the damage this classified information would do to the reputation of this country and the security of this country if they were to become public knowledge. In the world of international relations the release of classified, confidential statements concerning other countries and our diplomatic strategy towards them can be just as damaging to national security as the release of information on how to hack military networks.




Links
By frostedambassador on 6/24/2010 7:06:12 PM , Rating: 2
Could we have some links to the information "Nadim" has posted?

That might help the article read a little less like Lamo using DailyTech as his speaking piece.




for the umpteenth time
By inperfectdarkness on 6/25/2010 8:51:04 AM , Rating: 2
he was not an officer; he was enlisted.




Massive Power...
By lukasbradley on 6/25/2010 10:43:24 AM , Rating: 2
...Rests in the Hands of Massive Douchebags




Adrian Lamo = 0 credibility
By masamasa on 6/25/2010 10:57:43 AM , Rating: 2
From hacker to rat. His actions speak for themselves.




Asperger's?
By jhtrico1850 on 6/25/2010 2:00:47 PM , Rating: 2
I find the account of Adrian Lamo having Asperger's rather suspect. May 20, Wired publishes this article http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2010/05/lamo/ claiming "Something about his halting, monotone speech, perhaps slowed by his medication" made the police force him on stretchers. That is hardly lockup worthy.

May 21, http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/... Manning starts chatting with Adrian. I'll quote Salon...
quote:
Lamo told me that Manning first emailed him on May 20 and, according to highly edited chat logs released by Wired, had his first online chat with Manning on May 21; in other words, Manning first contacted Lamo the very day that Poulsen's Wired article on Lamo's involuntary commitment appeared (the Wired article is time-stamped 5:46 p.m. on May 20).


The dots are there in a bogus Asperger's puff piece dated May 20 and the groundwork for Manning's arrest May 21, I'm just having a hard time connecting them. But I am pretty sure something is there...




propagandistic
By superstition on 6/25/2010 2:21:07 PM , Rating: 2
For the other side, read Glenn Greenwald's article:

"The strange and consequential case of Bradley Manning, Adrian Lamo and WikiLeaks"

"Adrian Lamo and Kevin Poulsen have a long and strange history together. Both were convicted of felonies relating to computer hacking: Poulsen in 1994 (when he was sentenced to 3 1/2 years in prison, ironically because a friend turned government informant on him), and Lamo in 2004..."

It gets better.




By Lord 666 on 6/25/2010 2:30:28 PM , Rating: 2
There is at least another person on the inside with access that is sharing intel. Manning felt comfortable about leaking information because he recognized the NSA pager communications on 9/11/01.

But as Manning pointed out, there are much larger answers out there such as;

1. Are there aliens and are they among us now. Also includes Rosewell.

2. Who killed JFK?

3. When did Hilter really die

4. Did the US really land on the moon and when?

5. CIA activity in the illicit drug business

6. Full details of MK Ultra and all of its side projects

7. Is global warming real

8. When will oil run out

9. Did the US bait Japan into attacking Pearl Harbor

10. Is there a cure for cancer and/or HIV? Where did HIV really start




Potentially related...
By Aeonic on 6/25/2010 5:50:26 PM , Rating: 2
I just saw this link on wikileaks, I guess it's kinda old, although it's on the front page now. And I'm not really sure what to believe. But here it is:

http://www.wikileaks.com/wiki/U.S._Intelligence_pl...

quote:
This document is a classified (SECRET/NOFORN) 32 page U.S. counterintelligence investigation into WikiLeaks. ``The possibility that current employees or moles within DoD or elsewhere in the U.S. government are providing sensitive or classified information to WikiLeaks.org cannot be ruled out. It concocts a plan to fatally marginalize the organization. Since WikiLeaks uses ``trust as a center of gravity by protecting the anonymity and identity of the insiders, leakers or whistleblowers, the report recommends ``The identification, exposure, termination of employment, criminal prosecution, legal action against current or former insiders, leakers, or whistleblowers could potentially damage or destroy this center of gravity and deter others considering similar actions from using the WikiLeaks.org Web site.




By toyotabedzrock on 6/25/2010 2:54:29 AM , Rating: 1
They passed on information without changing it. If he left his im name in the info thats Lame asses fault.




Not wikileaks
By WinstonSmith on 6/25/2010 10:34:09 AM , Rating: 1
Considering that this Lamo/Manning exchange occurred _after_ Manning was relieved from his intel job, what makes anyone think that official sources weren't already monitoring his online activities and are the ones responsible for the leak of this sanitized exchange to discredit Wikileaks?




"Paying an extra $500 for a computer in this environment -- same piece of hardware -- paying $500 more to get a logo on it? I think that's a more challenging proposition for the average person than it used to be." -- Steve Ballmer














botimage
Copyright 2014 DailyTech LLC. - RSS Feed | Advertise | About Us | Ethics | FAQ | Terms, Conditions & Privacy Information | Kristopher Kubicki