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Print 83 comment(s) - last by Belard.. on Oct 13 at 8:21 AM


Microsoft Office 2010 won't come on DVD. Rather you can either download it directly from the internet, or if you have a new Windows 7 PC, merely unlocked the version that comes preinstalled with an upgrade card. The upgrade cards will be available from Microsoft and retailers.  (Source: Microsoft)

Microsoft Word 2010
Microsoft is trying to hook more people on Office with a partially functional ad-supported edition

"Hard at work on your homework?  How about a late night snack at Taco Bell?"

That's the kind of message that may soon be popping up when you're writing Office documents, if you opt to stick with the free ad-supported edition -- Microsoft Office Starter 2010 – which was just announced.  The new free edition will only feature partial functionality.  The critical question that has not yet been answered about this new edition is exactly how much will be disabled.

That is a critical question because competitors are already offering popular alternatives that are ad-free and free.  Among these are Open Office 3 and Google Docs.  Microsoft must tread carefully when deciding just how many features to support in the free version, in order to give customers incentive to upgrade, but avoid having them jump ship to a more functional free alternative.  The free ad-supported version is exclusively on PCs (i.e. it is not available for Macs also have their own version of Microsoft Office).

The free edition joins three other editions of Office 2010: Office Home and Student 2010, Office Home and Business 2010, and Office Professional 2010.

The other big news about Microsoft Office 2010 is that it will go DVD-free.  A locked full version of the software will be available on new Windows 7 PCs.  Customers can purchase an upgrade card from Microsoft or at retailers to "upgrade" or unlock the software and experience all its features.

Microsoft says the approach will allow users to install more quickly and without the hassles of physical media.  They also say that its better for the environment, bragging, "An added bonus: The card’s packaging is smaller than the full package (DVD) product, and is eco/retail-friendly."

A broad public beta is planned for later this year to help people decide if Office 2010 is for them.  Microsoft says that upgrading from  the beta to full versions will be quick and easy.

Another piece of news about the upcoming version of Office is Click-to-Run.  Click-to-Run will be managing downloads -- both software installations and patches -- within Office 2010.  Microsoft says that Click-to-Run "significantly reduces the time and effort required to download Office 2010 over the Internet." Click-to-Run uses virtualization, so multiple installations of Office 2010 with different features, alongside older versions of Office are possible.



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Wow...
By R3T4rd on 10/9/2009 9:13:19 AM , Rating: 3
If this is 80% or even 60% of the full Office Version....MS is going to really kill Open Office. First though, we'll have to see how annoying the rolling adds are.




RE: Wow...
By omnicronx on 10/9/09, Rating: -1
RE: Wow...
By Bateluer on 10/9/2009 9:27:15 AM , Rating: 5
Err, OOo supports nearly everything that MS Office does. You just have to take the time to learn how to do it.

I don't see this killing OpenOffice at all. Ad supported applications blow. And I definitely don't see Microsoft making a Linux version either.


RE: Wow...
By invidious on 10/9/2009 9:50:59 AM , Rating: 5
Why do people who use linux not realize that nobody cares about linux?


RE: Wow...
By meepstone on 10/9/09, Rating: -1
RE: Wow...
By Bateluer on 10/9/2009 10:17:10 AM , Rating: 5
Nobody cares? The estimated 30 million linux users probably care.


RE: Wow...
By xti on 10/9/2009 10:28:21 AM , Rating: 5
which is a drop in the well compared to how many windows users are out there.

think about how many college students are out there who just need word to type papers up in word. This is the gateway drug of software for the average joe if they pull it off.


RE: Wow...
By R3T4rd on 10/9/2009 10:54:55 AM , Rating: 4
Exactly my point. Most average Joe's/Jane's don't know much about Open office or will care to learn how to use it. I still think with this move, MS is going to put some dent into Open Office.


RE: Wow...
By cochy on 10/9/2009 7:30:28 PM , Rating: 3
Hmm your own logic defeats your comment. On one hand you say that the average user barely knows what OpenOffice is, and on the other hand you're saying that MS will put a dent into OpenOffice. Well the users that you are describing probably don't even use OpenOffice to being with.

I'd say most OpenOffice users would not jump ship to a stripped down MS product with ads.


RE: Wow...
By lagitup on 10/11/2009 7:28:47 PM , Rating: 3
I've used OOo in the past, and I have to say I would definitely consider switching based on the one feature MS Office has that OOo doesn't come close to matching.

Pretty.

A quick story: I got compliments on a PowerPoint the other day. Not because it was a PowerPoint, the novelty of that has subsided. But with the new design templates and easy customization in the 2007 release there are more unique designs available, and, with SmartArt the possibilities for unique, well designed presentations (or papers or whatever) are absolutely incredible and, imo, unmatched in OOo.

The chance to get a bit of that for no scratch is seems way worth it, unless this is the functionality they choose to reduce.


RE: Wow...
By Zingam on 10/12/2009 7:56:27 AM , Rating: 4
And all that stuff will be available in the ad-supported version?


RE: Wow...
By retrospooty on 10/9/09, Rating: 0
RE: Wow...
By descendency on 10/9/2009 5:56:58 PM , Rating: 5
What's scary about Linux is the number of colleges that are now trying to force people into becoming Linux users. I am a computer science student at a large public university and ALL of my classes have programming projects that are REQUIRED to run on linux. They don't even cover the Windows implementation and they teach from Macs...

Windows machines are over 70% of the market (Mac claims 20%, even though I don't believe it, and I doubt linux is more than 2%... I'd even dare say Windows is more than 80%) and a very large number of Mac (and even Linux) machines run Office. A very very small percentage of Windows machines run Open Office.

What's even worse is the fact that people try and talk about Linux as a Windows replacement, which it is NOT. You hear Linux users all the time talking about how "Linux is not free Windows" yet people are now trying to act like it is.

This isn't even a debate. The marketplace has spoken. If niche users want their program, it's fine, but don't force it on everyone...

On Topic: I'm excited to hear that MS might release an advertisement supported version of the software for free. I'd even go with an internet based version if it were cheap enough. I'm tired of paying for a ton of features I will never use.

I use OneNot 2007, Word, and Excel. I haven't opened Access in ages, and have never used Groove, InfoPath, Publisher, etc.


RE: Wow...
By rbfowler9lfc on 10/9/2009 10:15:15 PM , Rating: 4
quote:

I use OneNot 2007, Word, and Excel. I haven't opened Access in ages, and have never used Groove, InfoPath, Publisher, etc.

Then get Office Home and Student. Dirt cheap, and licensed to run on up to 3 machines. For me, this one is a steal.


RE: Wow...
By Taft12 on 10/11/2009 9:42:00 PM , Rating: 2
If you have an issue with the OS your programming projects require, you are in the wrong program.

Might I recommend a community college program where you can choose courses specializing in any technology of your choice.


RE: Wow...
By davekozy on 10/12/2009 4:02:06 AM , Rating: 2
Unfortunately the free version only includes Word and Excel. No PowerPoint or OneNote. Oh well. I guess I'll be supporting MS again next year and buy the student version. I already donated this month for Windows 7 Pro.
If it's on Wikipedia it must be true.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Office_2010


RE: Wow...
By Uncle on 10/12/2009 2:48:15 AM , Rating: 2
It would make a difference if that 30 million were businesses, not just Joe Sixpack. Which is what Microsoft is worried about.


RE: Wow...
By namechamps on 10/11/2009 11:34:37 AM , Rating: 2
30 million < # of PIRATED copies of windows.


RE: Wow...
By mforce on 10/12/2009 7:21:09 AM , Rating: 2
Actually my mother uses Linux and OpenOffice and she cares. I installed them so I could legally make use of a P III @ 450 MHz. It works perfectly for simple office and internet stuff proving that you don't really need expensive hardware and software to do basic stuff.
You don't really need Win 7 , Office 2010 all running on a Quad Core with 4GB of RAM to do office work and browse the web.


RE: Wow...
By ImSpartacus on 10/9/2009 10:11:00 AM , Rating: 5
I have personally relied on OO for nearly a year and I can tell you, while it can do nearly everything Office can, it still sucks.

There's this thing called an interface, most open source programs aren't to good in regards to it.

Office is just so much easier to use. I am still finding new features in OO that I have enjoyed in Office for years. The interface is simply cryptic.


RE: Wow...
By quiksilvr on 10/9/2009 2:40:08 PM , Rating: 2
Exactly. OpenOffice needs to go for broke and just do the ribbon interface or something similar. Maybe like a row of icons instead of tabs.


RE: Wow...
By Belard on 10/9/2009 3:06:55 PM , Rating: 5
The interface of OO 3.x is very much the same as MS-Office 2003.... so I'm not sure what exactly is so CRYPTIC about it.

BTW... where is the AUTO-SUM function on OO-CALC? Thats the only thing that bugs me.

For most people, for word processing and spreadsheets... OO 3.x gets the job done.

But MS-Office 2010 looks nice. But I want my media.


RE: Wow...
By omnicronx on 10/9/2009 1:13:36 PM , Rating: 5
I love this argument, I'm sorry but OO does not support nearly everything office does. I am a part time nix user, I've had my fair share of experience with OO (heck I was using it while it was still Star Office), it never has been on the same level as Office. Linux users may wish it was, but its not..

Now I am not saying that for the average person that just uses the basics, but to say it supports everything that office does is absurd. For example while OO may have something similar to VBA, its not nearly as robust, and is quite frankly sub par IMO.

Basic functionality is not what makes or breaks a production sweet, and until OO can match the advanced functions of Office, it will never be a competitor, especially in the corporate environment. Excel graphing is also sub par at best, it barely competes with 97/2000 editions.

I also do not see how you don't think this will impact OO, they cannot continue to expand with the nix market alone, the only way for them to expand is into the windows environment, and if there is a free alternative office suite in which the users are more comfortable with, which one do you think they are going to choose?


RE: Wow...
By AssBall on 10/9/2009 2:19:29 PM , Rating: 2
I completely agree, assuming you meant to say that the OO spreadsheet graphing is just plain inferior to Excel.

P.S. productivity suite, not production sweet Omni :)


RE: Wow...
By omnicronx on 10/9/2009 2:44:57 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
I completely agree, assuming you meant to say that the OO spreadsheet graphing is just plain inferior to Excel.
Yep..
quote:
P.S. productivity suite, not production sweet Omni :)
*Facepalm* .. productivity is forgivable, but sweet instead of suite? EPIC FAIL

Back to grade 3 English for me. ;)


RE: Wow...
By Nekrik on 10/9/2009 1:43:48 PM , Rating: 3
I've not used the latest versions of OOo but last time I did there was pretty much zero support for SharePoint and MOSS. With out that type of functionality they're not even on the radar for many corporate users.


RE: Wow...
By mfed3 on 10/9/09, Rating: 0
RE: Wow...
By R3T4rd on 10/9/2009 11:04:34 AM , Rating: 3
Don't know why I was down rated. But with Open Office having a very small percentage out there and then MS pulls this? Yeah, I think its gonna hurt Open Office especially in ares of Schools and where students who use OO more. Like I said, even if MS's free version is add filled and operates at 70% functionality, most average people will use it.

You also have to keep in mind, most of us who post here are Tech Savy and like alternatives to paying MS, but the average Joe and Jane don't care.


RE: Wow...
By Belard on 10/9/2009 3:20:03 PM , Rating: 5
Wimps who don't like an opinion will down-rate you, it sucks. :( They don't seem to understand the difference of opinion and saying something stupid or flaming.

Screaming MS-OFFICE SUCKS...! maybe should be down rated.
or
MS-OFFICE causes Glen Beck to happen... should easily be down-rated... or up, depending on your position ;)

with that said...

I install OO (especially the nice 3.1) on clients who don't want to spend $95 ~ 250 per copy of MS-Office. Or friends, etc. OO still isn't there with MS-Office 2000, which *I* still use today. Come' on! Its almost 10 years since MS-Office 2000.

For free, OO is a great value, its fast, stable, easy to use... even if was $50, it'll smoke MS-Works.
Also, people should note that OO has a lot more than just WP/SS/PP functions... yet still lacks a built-in PIM. Which shows OO's development groups short-sightedness. OO is made mostly by programmers for programmers... not office users, and it shows.

One of my clients has 10 PCs. All have OO. It gets the job done. Saves him $2500. Being a business, he's not supposed to use the Student Edition ($95)... but even that is about $1000.


RE: Wow...
By Nekrik on 10/9/09, Rating: 0
RE: Wow...
By Alexstarfire on 10/9/2009 9:21:10 PM , Rating: 3
Depends on their needs. If you can't afford $2500 worth of software then having OO is better than not having anything. I can't really say much without knowing specifics. Just saying.


RE: Wow...
By Belard on 10/10/2009 12:54:35 AM , Rating: 3
quote:
Sorry, but to me it sounds like all your clients are victims of your personal agenda to promote open source.


Are you pretending to be an idiot or just work for Microsoft? :) Victims? Agenda? Did you pay for the browser you use?
So whats the big "evil" that open source is? Uh oh, can't take money away from Microsoft... the most profitable computer company in the world.

For those who take things to serious. I said one client, as in more than one. Its wasn't in his budget, he didn't need it and its better than the client "pirating" MS-Office, no?

In my post, I even point out the flaws in Open Office. Version 3 is much refined over 2... Version 1 was horrible, but better than Star Office 5~6.

I still use MS-Office 2000. Does everything I need. But since I don't like/need Outlook - I'm looking at buying the $100 home version of Office 2010. I have Win7-RC on my notebook with OpenOffice 3.0. So after Win7 comes out and Office 2010, I'll buy them and put them on my computers. Feel better now? ;)

Another client, with about 12 computers. They're using WinXP & Office 2003. Vista sucks and the need to install MSO-2007 wasn't worth it. I've scheduled to replace 2 PCs and upgrade rest to Win7 and Office 2010(Business). Feel better now?

My 4 year old... he has Open Office on his desktop. I don't think he cares that its Open source or whatever.

PS: In general, I don't like Microsoft. But I buy my software, I buy my DVDs, I buy my games. If a product is good, then I say use it, buy it, enjoy it. I love my Microsoft Sidewinder 2 joystick. Its 8 years old and there is NOTHING on the market that is worthy to replace it. :(

So choices are good. With Open Office, MS feels compelled to compete against it and Linux too. Thats good for US. I'm glad we have 5+ major web browsers... it improves the standards (ie: websites aren't broken to work with IE) of the internet. I use Opera 10. And most of my friends and clients are/have moved OFF of IE6~8. I'll also buy a PS3 one day. I have no plans to ever buy an Xbox.... nor an iPod. I prefer AMD over intel, but half of my computers are intel.

Open Office, I think drove MS to make Office 2007 the way it is. Office2003 is mostly a skin-job of Office2000 with some nice fixes. So MS decided to make a real change in their product because people were NOT seeing real reason to buy an NEW Office suite... the design was stagnate. Even Office 2010 looks more different and better than Office 2007. 95~97~2000~XP~2003 look and work pretty much exactly the same. So its GOOD that is MS is going to OWN the market, they better be the best or close to it.


RE: Wow...
By frobizzle on 10/12/2009 11:39:53 AM , Rating: 2
Frankly, improvements in Office over the years have moved at a glacier pace. It only has gotten increasingly bloated. That is why I still use my antique version of Office 97. It is small (comparitively) and stable and does what I need.


RE: Wow...
By Belard on 10/13/2009 8:09:16 AM , Rating: 2
O97 was quite good... But O2000 has quite a few improvements that makes it nicer to work with.

You see the actual fonts in the fonts menu is a big one. Since O2000 is sooo old, you should be able to find a legit disc & key for about $5~10.

I may get Office2003 for free if they dump them from an office for spanking new Office2010. But I think I'll go for broke and just get the $100 2010. ;)

I did install Office97 on a Win7 test box. :)
The funny thing about office97Pro is the installation key. There is a "master" key that is so easy. I won't type it here, but will give a hint. 1234~ Its like Space Balls.


RE: Wow...
By Proteusza on 10/9/2009 9:45:12 AM , Rating: 1
Open Office = Free, no adverts
Microsoft Office = either not free, or free with a feature stripped down version with adverts.

I know which option I'm choosing. Its free all the way.


RE: Wow...
By Tamale on 10/9/2009 9:55:48 AM , Rating: 5
I want to love open office, but the simple fact is that every time I try it to open up documents others have made with office, the formatting comes through differently.

powerpoint is the worst, but I've had problems with word and excel documents too.

until this basic interoperability is bullet-proof, open office will never get a grip in the market.


RE: Wow...
By Alexstarfire on 10/9/2009 9:48:05 PM , Rating: 2
I've never had problems with it, but I can say that I haven't tried to open documents from the latest versions of Office either. Couldn't tell you what version the files came from, but they opened up just fine.


RE: Wow...
By segerstein on 10/9/2009 9:54:24 AM , Rating: 2
I guess the real competition are online office suites - Google's Docs and IBM's online office.

The locked down Office 2010 Started might still have more features than the online offerings of Google, IBM and Microsoft's own Office Live!


RE: Wow...
By iFX on 10/10/2009 10:55:23 AM , Rating: 3
OpenOffice is terrible. No one would pay for it anyway.


RE: Wow...
By Belard on 10/11/2009 7:59:44 AM , Rating: 2
What do you mean Terrible?

I believe that Open Office is the 2nd most use Office Suite in the world. Its interface is the mostly the same as MS-Office 2000. Its very stable. Its standardize and more compatible than any version of MS-Office. Mac & Windows versions aren't exactly "compatible" in function, features and in file formats.

Open Office is available for Windows, Mac, Linux, BSD, Solaris, OpenVMS and even OS/2. Its available in 100+ languages.

And its price? $0. No 50page EULA, etc. Want to talk about terrible, try using Wordperfect X4 (use the trial version) - and Coral charges $365 for their best version. $150 for their basic, $85 for "home" version... none comparable to MS-Office 2003 or OpenOffice 3.x

Open Office 3 includes: word processing, spread sheet, presentation, Database and a Drawing program (Visio). Overall, they have done a very good job to create and update a product that is not making a company billions of dollars.

I personally (still) use MS-Office 2000 and will be buying Office 2010 (home). I think OO is a very good product. But its still worth it to me to spend $100 for the home version of Office2010 when it comes out, I need the compatibility and more rich content that MS includes. I won't deal with ADs.

If OO had 40+% of the Office suite market, things would be more interesting :) I doubt OO will ever get that high, but they have enough of the market that MS notices and they have adjusted their offerings. MS-Works was always a weak suite, fine for free or $25. Office 2007(2010) still has a top price of $600, but typical business pay $200~400 per copy (OEM~Retail).

Office 2010 looks much more improved over 2010... can't wait to use it.


Unlock
By Spivonious on 10/9/2009 9:21:18 AM , Rating: 2
I'm confused. Office 2010 isn't even out yet so how would it somehow be present on new Windows 7 PCs? Or does this not take effect until later next year?

I also have to admit that including Office 2010 with Windows, if it is indeed a Microsoft decision and not an OEM one, is definitely going to get the attention of the EU and USDOJ.




RE: Unlock
By orgy08 on 10/9/2009 9:33:59 AM , Rating: 2
It isn't included, its just "pre-installed" with the option to buy it. I'm sure if they include an option like they did for internet explorer showing their office and links to other office products, they should be fine.


RE: Unlock
By theapparition on 10/9/2009 12:43:37 PM , Rating: 1
Interesting though.

With no sales of physical media, can Office 2010 be installed on any OS other than Win7?

Will they even offer a downloadable version?

The way I see this is, if you want Office 2010, you'll also have to purchase Win7. Or did I miss something?


RE: Unlock
By Lord 666 on 10/9/2009 12:49:12 PM , Rating: 2
Nah, it works on Vista fine. The download will be available just like Technet or MSDN software. The question is if they are going to break it up into smaller pieces or one large .iso. I received it as O2010_SingleImage_retail_ship_x86_en-us.exe via the download site.

However, have to note my 2010 installation didn't go too smooth at first. Had to install with UAC turned off and then turn it back on for it to work correctly.


RE: Unlock
By GoodBytes on 10/9/2009 9:39:43 AM , Rating: 3
System that you buy today comes with some 30 or 60 (I forgot), day trial of Office. This trial of Office was there since a long time ago. In stead of having a limited trial version, you have a limited ad-supported Office.

This is great for those who barely use Office, to still view and do basic, light, editing on a document, without having the software expire on them.


RE: Unlock
By johnsonx on 10/9/2009 12:23:27 PM , Rating: 2
yeah, it seems to be an agreement MS has with the various OEMs, to pre-install office as a trial version. Then when someone wants office for real, all they have to do is buy the key-code (or in the case of build-to-order places like Dell, if the customer orders office all Dell has to do is drop the license key package in the box, they don't even have to put a different image on the system)

it's not part of the windows install itself

It's a smart move by microsoft... imaginge what would happen to the sales of Office if many OEM's started putting OpenOffice on PC's?


RE: Unlock
By RjBass on 10/9/2009 1:51:54 PM , Rating: 2
My business already does. OpenOffice ships with all new desktops and laptops sold unless the customer opts in for the Microsoft Office upgrade.

Now, to ad to that, my business only ships about 30 new PC's a month, and compared to HP or Dell, that's nothing.

At the same time, the school where I am a part time Tech teacher has switched all PC's to OpenOffice. Apparently it is also happening in many other schools in the area as well. And I seriously doubt that school's are going to opt for an ad supported, stripped down version of the real thing, not when they can just get OO for free and teach the kids at a young age on how to use it.


RE: Unlock
By amandahugnkiss on 10/10/2009 5:47:39 AM , Rating: 1
wow, that is fucked up!


RE: Unlock
By oTAL on 10/9/2009 9:54:25 AM , Rating: 5
quote:
is definitely going to get the attention of the EU and USDOJ


Don't think so.
People don't seem to understand the browser problem. The EU doesn't really care about which browser people use. It cares about the power that the browser gives the company it belongs to.

The browser is like the main window to the internet. If you have a complete domain over the browser market you can start to wield some influence over the shaping of the internet.

e.g. MS could optimize IE so that it opens their search engine quicker. They could make it run proprietary code faster and neuter JS until they have their own closed solution for RIAs dominating the market. That way they could stop other browsers from emerging while stopping competing web technologies from gaining adoption.

The EU worries that, as companies tend to do, MS uses its OS monopoly to gain monopolies on other markets.

A good example is Google Wave. With the browser alternatives, this service would not be possible (try to run it in IE an you'll see what I mean).

This argument is valid for OSs, for browsers, for search engines, and even for media players. They provide leverage into other markets.

As for office... if they want to offer it for free, what's the worst thing that can happen? (honest question, there could be something I'm missing.....)

I know this will be an unpopular post, but I do think the browser ballot is a good thing.


RE: Unlock
By Golgatha on 10/9/2009 10:45:59 AM , Rating: 4
The EU cares about making free money through fining non-EU companies. Nothing more and nothing less.


RE: Unlock
By Proteusza on 10/9/2009 11:17:15 AM , Rating: 2
Yeah, I mean the US DoJ would never fine Microsoft, and they arent currently investigating Intel, right? Its obviously just the EU, those greedy commie bastards.

Oh wait, MS got fined by the DoJ, Intel is being investigated in the US and has already been fined in both Korea and Japan. In that case, I welcome you to the Communist States of America.


RE: Unlock
By Tony Swash on 10/9/09, Rating: -1
RE: Unlock
By CU on 10/9/2009 11:58:54 AM , Rating: 3
Think so.
People don't seem to understand the document program problem. The EU doesn't really care about which document program people use. It cares about the power that the document program gives the company it belongs to.

The document program is like the main window to documents. If you have a complete domain over the document market you can start to wield some influence over the shaping of documents and how people communicate in writing.

e.g. MS could optimize Office so that it opens their docs quicker. They could make their other programs like Outlook open docs faster and neuter other formats until they have their own closed solution for docs dominating the market. That way they could stop other document programs from emerging while stopping competing document formats from gaining adoption.

The EU worries that, as companies tend to do, MS uses its OS monopoly to gain monopolies on other markets.

A good example is Google Wave. With the browser alternatives, this service would not be possible (try to run it in IE an you'll see what I mean).

This argument is valid for OSs, for browsers, for search engines, and even for media players. They provide leverage into other markets.

As for office... if they want to offer it for free, what's the worst thing that can happen? (honest question, there could be something I'm missing.....)

They could use a free version of Word to cause the doc format to become the standard and allow its services to better handle them that would include its web service which would have a similar outcome as you claim a web browser would. However, I don't believe your claim is true. It was for the money.

Also I don't see a problem with them giving away anything free with windows. Be it Word, IE, or a car from GM (that would help them out). And I think the EU was wrong. Any browser could optimize their browser to open their search engine faster, or create one. Any browser could optimize proprietary code faster and kill others. It is up to the user to choose which one they want to use. And lately that has been moving from IE to Firefox. So IE being installed is not helping it. It could even hurt it. Some people look at the free addon (IE) and go it couldn't be as good as what a company dedicated to that kind of addon make. Plus no company should be force to include or advertise another a competing company.


RE: Unlock
By carniver on 10/9/2009 7:26:19 PM , Rating: 2
Exactly what I had in mind. That sort of argument just applies to anything. As a consumer I don't know if it's going to bring forth better competition, but what I do know that EU themselves pocketed tons of money every time, there's a conflict of interest which will affect their neutrality.


RE: Unlock
By Alexstarfire on 10/9/2009 9:37:35 PM , Rating: 1
Yea, I can understand that, but this isn't fucking IE6 anymore. If such things happened then they should be fined and sued and such, but this seems more like a preemptive strike than anything else. I'm not sure about the EU, but in the US you don't get sued just because you have the potential to do something illegal. This isn't The Minority Report after all.


Office 2010 is worth the upgrade
By Lord 666 on 10/9/2009 9:57:29 AM , Rating: 2
Been beta testing Office 2010 for a while now; for me the biggest improvement is in Outlook and Powerpoint. Sure, Excel is now available in x64 version, but coming from a Office 2003, the new features are worth the upgrade.

Disclaimer: Lord 666 is not a Microsoft employee nor an agent. Just a technology enthusiast that spends most of his time during the day in an Office product.




RE: Office 2010 is worth the upgrade
By damianrobertjones on 10/9/2009 10:10:13 AM , Rating: 2
Also been testing the beta and other than no access to the exchange public folders, it's fantastic. Especially like the small little bits that thaye've changed withing Outlook


RE: Office 2010 is worth the upgrade
By corduroygt on 10/9/2009 10:59:46 AM , Rating: 2
Is searching for an e-mail or a phrase inside an e-mail still pathetically slow compared to mac mail, or even the web-based gmail, or did they finally index it?


RE: Office 2010 is worth the upgrade
By damianrobertjones on 10/9/2009 12:18:54 PM , Rating: 2
It is now indexed.

But..

I disable indexing the moment I build a machine for myself in every single way. I'd rather not have the darn thing indexing away at random 'ish' times.

Either way, now finds mail quickly, probably due to people stating that Mac mail finds mail faster. Thanks Mac Mail :)


RE: Office 2010 is worth the upgrade
By johnsonx on 10/9/2009 12:30:27 PM , Rating: 2
I and many of my customers use Novell GroupWise, which has had pretty much instantaneous message searching for years (I have about 6 years worth of e-mail in my mailbox, and any search takes less than 5 seconds). I was always puzzled on the occaision I'd use someone's Outlook/Exchange system and have the search take forever and a day. I'm sure there were solutions to improve that, but by default the search function was essentially unusable.


RE: Office 2010 is worth the upgrade
By kkwst2 on 10/9/2009 2:28:37 PM , Rating: 2
Hmmm, that's odd. Completely opposite of my experience.

What version of Groupwise do you use? I assume you're caching if you have 6 years worth. I'm on 6.5.7, and my cache search only find really old stuff from 05-06. My online search finds only stuff from the last few months. That leaves a couple years that it just ignores in any search.

It is near-instantaneous, but obviously nearly worthless. I eventually had all my groupwise mail forwarded to Google mail specifically so I would be able to search it.

My Outlook searches of 10k+ messages takes 4-5 seconds, and they don't ignore several years worth of messages.


By johnsonx on 10/10/2009 6:33:29 PM , Rating: 2
You must have some sort of problem in your mailbox, probably a corrupt index or message store file. Mine finds ALL of my mail regardless of whether I search from my home PC in caching mode, office pc in online mode, or from a web browser using WebAccess. I'm on GroupWise 8 now, but have used every version since 5.0 and haven't ever had any different behavior that I can recall. It's always just worked, and does the same for my customers.
One thing that can be useful in caching mode is to go to the Tools Menu and click 'Retrieve Entire Mailbox'.


Downloading Office 2010
By PrinceGaz on 10/9/2009 7:51:54 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Microsoft Office 2010 won't come on DVD. Rather you can either download it directly from the internet...


Downloading directly from the internet is how someone I know very well has obtained every version of Office all the way back to Office 97 (I think that was the earliest version I used...)




RE: Downloading Office 2010
By Belard on 10/10/2009 1:04:02 AM , Rating: 2
I can confirm that Office97 works fine under Windows7 (other than Outlook).

A lot of legit software, especially with netbooks - are purchase and installed from the Internet. But the DVD version is needed for office environments or people with a few computers. Its not fun to have 3 or 4 computers and having to DL 2-3GB of the SAME software over and over again. Its a waste of bandwidth and time. Also, what if the person is on dialup? Or its a business computer without internet access? Or an office worker who doesn't have rights to install software, especially over the internet?

I think this article is referring to the HOME FREE edition of MSO2010. Even MSO2007 has a $5 disc you buy, but you also bought the license key in a separate package. *I* love it. I have one DISCs Set, and it'll work on any client based on the keys they own.

In some offices, they have discs and versions all mixed up - its a nightmare. Wrong OEM disc, wrong version, etc that won't install - even thou I have the key for a legit computer.

So expect to be able to go into FRYS, Microcenter or newegg and simply buy a $5 disc for those who want it.


RE: Downloading Office 2010
By namechamps on 10/11/2009 11:45:43 AM , Rating: 2
Why would you downloaded it over and over.

Nobody does that with patches now. The sysadmin team downloads patches, hotfixes, Service packs, etc. Then they test them in test environment then they roll them out via the company network.

No reason you couldn't do that with office. Company buys a volume license, and pushes the software out to each computer via the company network over the weekend. Too easy.

"Or an office worker who doesn't have rights to install software, especially over the internet?"

If someone doesn't have rights to install software how is a DVD going to help?


RE: Downloading Office 2010
By MonicaS on 10/11/2009 12:28:56 PM , Rating: 1
Cool!

Monica S.
Los Angeles Computer Repair
http://www.sebecomputercare.com


RE: Downloading Office 2010
By frobizzle on 10/12/2009 1:17:03 PM , Rating: 2
Just what DT needs - a spammer!


RE: Downloading Office 2010
By Belard on 10/13/2009 8:21:14 AM , Rating: 2
er... a typical family home has 2~4 computers. Not just an office. Many small companies is just a guy with 1-2 workers and many times they don't even run a network other than the internet.

You're thinking like an IT person who has dozens or hundreds of workstations to work with, yeah - you're 100% correct. Most business people have problems just turning their computers on, still!

Like one office, I set them up to share among specific computers. Even after almost a year - their most "PC Savvy" guy is still moving/copying data from one PC to another VIA USB-Flash key! I pointed out the FOLDER on the desktops to him... DUH. Still took him a while. Then again, this same guy trys "recharge" his NEW wireless mouse on the base for his OLD wireless mouse/keyboard. (A) the keyboard still works - very nice. (B) The new mouse doesn't recharge. (C) even after I threw away the power cord for the base - he dug it out of the trash to recharge a mouse that can't be recharged.

For some techs, such as myself. A DVD is very handy when going to multiple small clients or friends, etc. That is what the DVD or USB Flash key is for.

About the "rights" parts... my mistake. I meant more like an employee to go OUT onto the Internet to buy software to put on the computer.


Hilarity ensues
By marvdmartian on 10/9/2009 11:46:36 AM , Rating: 2
This could potentially bring some real hilarity into the work place, or college campus.

Here's Johnny, sitting quietly in the university library, working on his term paper. Johnny opens his ad-supported version of Office 2010, and goes to use the WORD program, when (because he forgot to turn down the volume on his laptop) he's blasted with:
DO YOU SUFFER FROM ERECTILE DYSFUNCTION????????

Poor Johnny.....now he'll never get laid in college!! ;)




RE: Hilarity ensues
By xsilver on 10/9/2009 12:59:44 PM , Rating: 3
uh worse yet an ad that says:
"cant be stuffed doing your term paper? download pre-written papers here"


What about MS Works?
By Bateluer on 10/9/2009 10:18:09 AM , Rating: 2
Will an AD supported, gimped, version of MS Office, what will happen with Works? Will entry level Windows PCs now include the Ad supported version of office 2010 instead of Works?




RE: What about MS Works?
By PitViper007 on 10/9/2009 1:47:21 PM , Rating: 2
Good question and one that I was thinking of as well. Works has its problems, namely the fact that the file formats aren't compatible with the full versions of Office. Yes I know you can get the converter filters, but that's just an extra step. It's fine for home use though, especially if you don't have to share work with a full version of Office.

To me, IF Microsoft doesn't cripple Office Starter too badly, it would be a good replacement for Works, providing the same flow and formats as the full Office suite.


By DEredita on 10/9/2009 10:25:13 AM , Rating: 2

I am using Office 2010 Technical Preview from Microsoft on two machines. I was selected as a tester back in July, and using both the 32-bit and 64-bit editions.
While being very similar to 2007, like the Microsoft tab on the upper left opens up the "File, Save, print..." drop down, but adds many useful features in. Save as allows for recovering unsaved versions of your documents, version tracking, mark as final version (doesn't allow others to edit the document), save as pdf is now built in, etc... Print is very nice interface - it opens up a window over your work space with a document preview on the right side, and on the left side are drop down to select your printer, large print button, and all of the important print options all in front of you.

I like Office 2010, as it keeps the Office 2007 interface, but significantly simplifies and adds a lot of important functionality. I look forward to deploying the finalized Office 2010 Professional version in our work environment here in the Spring.




I have but one question:
By VinceL on 10/9/2009 2:37:22 PM , Rating: 2
The only thing I would like to know is, will MS OFFICE have fully context sensitive right mouse click menus?

Meaning, when I right click in the margin, will the option for margins be on the list? Is there something I am missing? I know it is there for fonts, paragraphs and all that, but why so little formatting? I know you can go up and go through the ribbon bar thing, or whatever it is called, but it is faster just to be able to click in the area where I want something to happen. I got used to it in other word processors I used in the past, and I found it very helpful in working with documents in a simple and straightforward manner.

Other than that one little annoyance, and the fact that Outlook is slower than snot, MS OFFICE is fine. It's not great, but it gets the job done. I am just a casual user, so Lotus WordPro was much easier for me to use back in the day. Maybe it is just what you get used to.

Oh well, I won't complain further, I got OFFICE 2007 Ultimate for $70, but I wouldn't pay any more for any version of it.

As for Open Office, I can see where it might not be up to snuff for a company-wide deployment that requires full interoperability with MS OFFICE, but I use it at home on the computers I don't want to spend the money to put MS OFFICE on. It is fine for normal-duty casual use.




Alternatives
By PorreKaj on 10/12/2009 2:14:39 AM , Rating: 2
Just wanted to say that ppl should take a look on Lotus Symphony :)

I use it, like it.




No way
By Zingam on 10/12/2009 7:54:39 AM , Rating: 2
KMA - It's Open Office all the way!

I've used MS Office for many years but I've switched 2-4 years ago to Open Office gradually. Now everybody uses Open Office and it does the trick! It does all I need!

My experience with Microsoft Office has always been a very frustrating one. No, Microsoft, no thanks I don't your office suit any longer.




here we go again
By 4wardtristan on 10/12/2009 6:02:24 PM , Rating: 2
charging system builders +$300 for the install discs(again), thanks MS.




What's with these STUPID names?
By Belard on 10/9/2009 3:44:01 PM , Rating: 1
What is MS's deal with stupid product names?

Windows 7 Home Premium? When "Home" is enough, and call "Home Basic", just plain "basic" - I do... screw them.

Home and Free Office 2010
Office Home and Student 2010
Office Home and Business 2010
Office Professional 2010

WTF? Remember when it was just "Office 97 Pro"

How about:
Office 2010: Freebie
Office 2010: Home ($100~120)
Office 2010: Business
Office 2010: Pro (or Professional)

MS loves looooong names. Even have long names for their icons so you can't read them on the desktop or makes extra wide menu-bars.

"Microsoft Office 2007 Word"

"Word 2007" is too simple? Nope, got PUSH the brand name.

So on your desktop, all you see is:
"Microsoft
Office 20.."

"Microsoft
Office 20.."

"Microsoft
Office 20.."

Rather than simply "Word 2007" I think we're pretty much sure its MS and its Office.




I'd rather use Open Office
By goku on 10/9/09, Rating: -1
RE: I'd rather use Open Office
By mmntech on 10/9/09, Rating: 0
RE: I'd rather use Open Office
By Bateluer on 10/9/2009 10:15:19 AM , Rating: 1
I've been using OOo extensively since 3.0 was released for all my school papers. Never had an issue with formatting or anything like that, though I've been using it mostly for text documents. The only experience I have with Calc are with my budget spreadsheet and some training plans I've created.


By damianrobertjones on 10/9/2009 10:15:12 AM , Rating: 2
Why is it crap? I use, along with 120+ people, Office SBE all day everyday and I can hardly say that it's crap.

Just because you pay for something doesn't make it crap, like not paying for something doesn't make it crap.

P.s. I do like open office, but also see merit in MS Office.


RE: I'd rather use Open Office
By Belard on 10/9/2009 3:25:02 PM , Rating: 1
OO is not 100% compatible... sure WORD is very compatible.

But Excel charts, Power Point graphics, etc... not compatible. If a business, school, whatever has nothing but OO - then its not an issue. But if another business needs work with a PP presentation and its not compatible... then its a problem.

For most home users and students... OO gets the job done.
But in the real world, OO 3.1 is still below MS-Office 2000.


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