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DISH, cornered and out of options, finally agrees to pay TiVo for the use of its patents

DISH Network Corp conceded defeat and agreed to pay TiVo Inc $104 million Monday, wrapping up a heated, long-running patent battle over Dish’s DVR technologies.

TiVo originally won a set of patent claims against DISH in 2006, claiming that DISH illegally violated its patents when DISH was developing its own DVR systems. DISH opted to appeal defeat to the next highest court – leading to a string of disappointments that stopped only when the Supreme Court decided not to hear the case.

The original claims, filed in 2004, revolved around patents for a TiVo DVR’s ability to record one program and watch another, a technique that the company pioneered during the late 90s – in additional to a number of infringement claims regarding DISH’s DVR hardware. While lower courts eventually overturned TiVo’s hardware claims, the original software claim – and the resulting $74 million judgment – stuck.

DISH’s $104 million payment covers the original judgment plus interest for the time spent in appeals. It is unclear if TiVo will seek additional damages.

The case is far from over, however, as a number of claims regarding DISH’s development of a workaround – which it says do not infringe on TiVo’s patents – are still being worked out.

While DISH customers are still able to use their DVR boxes at this time, that ability may be in jeopardy in the near future: a lower court ordered DISH to shut down the 3 million DVR boxes its customers use, however that decision is on hold pending additional appeals.

DISH remains confident its workaround is sufficiently different from TiVo’s patents, adding that “TiVo’s pending motion for contempt should be denied.”

“We look forward to that ruling in the near future,” DISH said.

The Motley Fool notes that $104 million is a virtually insignificant sum to DISH, who last year had over $2.6 billion in operating cash flow – as opposed to TiVo’s $273 million in 2007 net sales and a “tradition of negative cash flows.” It also notes that shutting a court order forcing DISH to unplug its DVR boxes would give the satellite company’s competitors – namely, Comcast, Verizon, DirecTV, and others – an unfair competitive advantage, since they would be unaffected.

DISH Network Corp changed its name from EchoStar Communications in late 2007. The company recently accused DirecTV owner News Corp of hiring the world’s “second best hacker” in order to develop counterfeit DISH access cards.



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TIVO who???
By theapparition on 10/8/2008 9:16:56 AM , Rating: 3
Are they really still around. Thought TIVO went the way of the 8 track.

I'm not knocking them, they actually had a Superior implementation, but there is no way they can keep up with the cable/satellite providers with their own hardware.

I thought they had a small chance of just selling the TIVO service to providers, but realized that hope was dead when I saw that comcast will be charging extra for the privilege of TIVO software. Who's going to pay for that. If history is any indication, the average consumer is quite happy with mediocre.




RE: TIVO who???
By austinag on 10/8/2008 10:24:15 AM , Rating: 2
Do you work for Comcast or Dish?


RE: TIVO who???
By theapparition on 10/8/2008 10:35:52 AM , Rating: 2
I work for neither.

And I have a TIVO with lifetime subscription. Don't use it anymore since the highly integrated FIOS boxes do a similar job, and includes high def.

The TIVO unit is unplugged and hasn't been used for a year, and I don't miss it. TIVO has been operating at a loss for years, and I don't see them changing that trend.


RE: TIVO who???
By FITCamaro on 10/8/2008 10:37:24 AM , Rating: 2
*drool*

FiOS. Me want.


RE: TIVO who???
By Brazos on 10/8/2008 11:03:27 AM , Rating: 2
I love my Tivo Series 3 with 2 HD Cablecard tuners. Hooked up a 1T external drive. Best software of any DVR.


RE: TIVO who???
By qdemn7 on 10/8/2008 11:06:07 AM , Rating: 2
Except for the fact you can have up to TWO terabytes on an HD Series 32 Tivo. That is a great deal of recording time in either SD or HD. Can your FIOS box do that? Can your FIOS keep recordings for a year or more?

In short Tivo still has a great deal to recommend that nothing from any of the providers can match.

You don't want you Tivo, I'll take it off your hands for the cost of shipping.


RE: TIVO who???
By omnicronx on 10/8/2008 11:27:56 AM , Rating: 3
Bell Canada now sells PVR's that have two expansion slots for your own hard drives, so yes other companies are already doing what TIVO is, and for a fraction of the price. Not to mention that you can keep upgrading the size of your hard drive as you please, without having to upgrade your hardware.

There are just too many options out there, let alone it just makes more sense for most people to rent a PVR from their cable/sat provider that doubles as the receiver box.


RE: TIVO who???
By FITCamaro on 10/8/2008 4:15:55 PM , Rating: 3
quote:
Can your FIOS keep recordings for a year or more?


Haven't seen a DVR box yet that will delete your video if you don't tell it to. If you set the DVR to never delete things, they stay until you delete them. Now you might fill your DVR up and be forced to delete things, but it won't do it on its own.

And actually for some Scientific Atlantica DVRs, there is a portable hard drive you can plug into it to increase its storage capacity.

I'll admit the Tivo software sounds nice. Especially their new thing that will let you record shows off your DVR onto your computer.


RE: TIVO who???
By theos0 on 10/8/2008 10:56:15 PM , Rating: 2
Dude, you can have the same space on a Dish dvr. Not too mention the DVR with dish is free.


RE: TIVO who???
By theapparition on 10/9/2008 7:55:25 AM , Rating: 2
Err,
My boxes have 2 SATA ports, and I have an additional TB installed already. If I wanted more.......just buy another one and plug in, bingo.....2 TB. Never came anywhere near exceeding 1TB though, so it's a moot point for me.

Can it keep recordings for a year or more? Considering I still have season 3(?) of Lost still on there, I think the answer is yes.

I'll not deny that the TIVO software is better, but not by leaps and bounds, it's only minimal difference. Problem is, the average consumer don't care about minimal differences. They care about low payments, integration, and free replacement for failure. Can your TIVO do that?

And the Series 3 can't keep up with OnDemand and other features offered by the cable co's box.

It's a shame, as I'd like to see TIVO succede. But I think thier business model is screwed, and they will not be able to survive.


RE: TIVO who???
By kkwst2 on 10/13/2008 1:37:03 AM , Rating: 2
You can get a regular box to handle OnDemand, a Tivo subscription, and the cablecard for the same price (actually slightly cheaper if you prepay a year or more for Tivo) as the Comcast DVR price. That means the only extra price is the price of the TivoHD, which you can get for less than $200 refurbished.

Comcast DVR's don't have the SATA or firewire ports enabled, so there is no way to upgrade, and no working hack that I know of.

The software difference is not minimal in my book, but I agree that most consumers won't understand.


RE: TIVO who???
By RU482 on 10/8/2008 12:11:21 PM , Rating: 2
how much do you want for that unplugged Tivo?


RE: TIVO who???
By theapparition on 10/9/2008 7:58:23 AM , Rating: 2
You can bid for it on Ebay like everyone else..... :P


RE: TIVO who???
By Scrith on 10/8/2008 3:49:17 PM , Rating: 2
Ignorance is bliss.


RE: TIVO who???
By Reclaimer77 on 10/9/2008 12:20:48 AM , Rating: 2
Ummmm do you realize how very few people are privelidged to have FIOS ??

I think your losing perspective. Tivo is a damn good product.


RE: TIVO who???
By theapparition on 10/9/2008 7:57:41 AM , Rating: 2
No loss of perspective. Before FIOS......I had Comcast. Even then, I thought the Comcast offering was virtally as good as the TIVO one.


RE: TIVO who???
By kkwst2 on 10/13/2008 1:32:03 AM , Rating: 2
You're not stressing it then. There are many well-documented problems with Comcast DVR software, including it not recording a series when they overlap but don't start at the same time. So you have to record each show manually.

You can get a Tivo HD refurb for less than $200, and the monthly fee is chaper than the comcast DVR fee in my area.

I've had two comcast DVR's fail in 2 years, causing me to lose all my shows. In addition, there is no way to add storage to a Comcast DVR.

With Tivo's, you have two options, upgrade the internal hard drive (unsupported) or add an external drive (supported).

Not to mention that I can back up my shows to PC with Tivo, and watch them on the road with my laptop. Try that with your Comcast DVR.

I certainly agree that most will not go for the Tivo, but I disagree that the Comcast DVR software is close to the Tivo software. It's not in the same league. Most users are not sophisticated enough to know the difference, which to some degree relegates Tivo to a niche market. However, I'm certainly hoping they can survive.


RE: TIVO who???
By Smilin on 10/8/2008 10:54:39 AM , Rating: 1
Oh yeah, they are still around.

"I'm not knocking them, they actually had a Superior implementation, but there is no way they can keep up with the cable/satellite providers with their own hardware."

Keep up? WTH are you talking about? TiVo is leaving them in the dust. They have the best DVR out there by a *wide* margin.

-Dual HD tuners (long before anyone else had) with cable cards
-Large storage that can be expanded with a common external drive
-Programming via phone or ethernet (or plug in wireless usb ethernet)
-Ability to move shows between DVRs
-Ability to move shows to your PC and even burn them.
**Ability to run all your music and photos from your PC to your home entertainment system
-Rent/Purchase movies from amazon.com
-live365 streaming music
-youtube integration
-Wishlist and swivel search (aka show me all Hi-Def sci-fi movies playing anywhere over the next two weeks)
-actually more online services integration (yahoo etc) than I can name.
-Real live customer support...try that with your cable company.

Oh yeah, and in addition to the 1080i HD recording it also has THX certified surround via HDMI or Optical.

Yeah people that rent a DVR from their cable company *think* they have a TiVo but they don't.


RE: TIVO who???
By Smilin on 10/8/2008 10:58:48 AM , Rating: 2
I just realized. You guys are talking about some 1995 series 1 or 2 Tivo. They were again ahead of their time but that was ages ago. The Cable Satellite DVRs have nothing on the current generation of TiVos.


RE: TIVO who???
By omnicronx on 10/8/2008 11:43:52 AM , Rating: 3
quote:
-Dual HD tuners (long before anyone else had) with cable cards
Most Cable sat providers have the same thing, who cares if Tivo had it first.
quote:
-Large storage that can be expanded with a common external drive
As I already noted Bell Canada is already doing this, expect other companies to follow suit.
quote:
-Programming via phone or ethernet (or plug in wireless usb ethernet)
Which is unneeded for sat/cable providers, if they want to send updates, they have a hardline connection (which is pretty obvious).
quote:
-Ability to move shows between DVRs
I could really care less, how many TV's do you need in a household with PVR capabilities? This is just a bonus for the few people that actually use it
quote:
**Ability to run all your music and photos from your PC to your home entertainment system
Many Many better ways to do this, and lets face it, how many people have an internet connection in their living room.
quote:
-Rent/Purchase movies from amazon.com
On Demand services far surpass anything you can rent/purchase from amazon.com.

I could go on but this post is getting too big.. Point is, for most people a normal PVR from their cable company is more than enough. Not to mention that they come and set it up for you most of the time.

Anywho, MCE machines blow either of these out of the water.


RE: TIVO who???
By omnicronx on 10/8/2008 11:45:47 AM , Rating: 2
Ooops forgot to mention that Cable cards are going to be a thing of the past, but thats a different issue ;)


RE: TIVO who???
By juserbogus on 10/8/2008 5:30:26 PM , Rating: 1
so, Tivo supports SDV.


RE: TIVO who???
By juserbogus on 10/8/2008 5:23:26 PM , Rating: 2
by programming he meant your programming.... If I'm at work and someone tells me about a show I can schedule my tivo over the web or from my phone.

another nice one that wasn't mentioned is moving my shows to my phone. when I take a trip(very nice for planes) I catch up on my tv shows or movies.


RE: TIVO who???
By Smilin on 10/8/2008 5:43:47 PM , Rating: 2
quote:

quote:

**Ability to run all your music and photos from your PC to your home entertainment system


Many Many better ways to do this, and lets face it, how many people have an internet connection in their living room.


Ok, how are there better ways to do this (when you don't have an internet connection in your living room)???

I think you might have missed the part where you dont need one. You can plug a wireless usb nic into the tivo.

MCEs are nice but how many out there have dual HD cards? They are basically stuck in non-HD still.

While you are shooting everything down why don't you tell us why THX certified audio (hdmi or optical) is a bad thing?

You also never explained how you can program your cable/sat DVR from anywhere on the web (even mobile phone).

My point is: TiVos are far superior to any DVR out there.

If most people are fine with the $5 one from the cable company that's all good...most people don't even know the difference between Digital and HD either. For those of us that know, TiVo is better. Don't be hating.


RE: TIVO who???
By theapparition on 10/9/2008 8:06:38 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
For those of us that know, TiVo is better. Don't be hating.

For the record.......once again. TIVO is better.

Problem is, TIVO doesn't care about you. They care about thier business, which means getting as many subscribers as they can. Which means going after the masses, not the high end user. Their business model was built on that fact, and without the masses, they will soon be out of business. When was the last time they posted a profit???

Enjoy your TIVO for now, I predict it will soon be gone.


RE: TIVO who???
By omnicronx on 10/9/2008 11:01:25 AM , Rating: 2
quote:
Ok, how are there better ways to do this (when you don't have an internet connection in your living room)???
360, PS3, laptop, wireless audio adaptors, mce machine.. regardless of which you choose you need to have a wireless nice in the device.

quote:
MCEs are nice but how many out there have dual HD cards? They are basically stuck in non-HD still.
You are living in 2005, MCE now supports cable cards, with my MCE setup I can record Cable HD, ATSC HD, and an SD channel at the same time, while watching whichever one I wanted. I can also record two ATSC HD and from the cable card at the same time. I know a few people who have multi cable card setups and dual ATSC OTA HD cards, with the ability to record 4 streams at once.
quote:
While you are shooting everything down why don't you tell us why THX certified audio (hdmi or optical) is a bad thing?
THX is just a certification, you pay for the peace of mind that your Tivo outputs sound as it is meant to be heard. Only problem is this is not only source dependent i.e the sound track of the program you are watching, and it is equipment dependent, i.e your receiver also has to be THX certified for it to mean anything. Whats worse is many THX certified receivers (looks at sony) just plain do not do what they are advertised to do (THX ultra is suppose to maintain max rated power output on all channels at a respectible THD, which everyone knows is just not the case with most receivers). THX is designed for theatre use, and does little to nothing unless you have a perfectly placed audio system with really good components. This accompanied with the fact that TV audio masters don't even compare to Movie audio makes it even more useless. Bottom line, THX is meant for movies, not compressed and low bitrate(compared to movie tracks) DD audio.
quote:
You also never explained how you can program your cable/sat DVR from anywhere on the web (even mobile phone).
I misunderstood, I thought he meant firmware updates. This is one thing that cable/sat DVRS do lack, but at the same time, I already do this from my MCE machine so its not like you don't have options.
quote:
My point is: TiVos are far superior to any DVR out there.
I never denied that it was not, it does have a few added features that no other PVR has, my point was that 95% of the users don't use these added features, which is why TIVO has lost a lot of its popularity. If THX, being able to remotely program your recordings and the ability to copy recordings to your computer is a must, then TiVo is for you, if not then paying for a TIVO box, a lifetime or monthly subscription, and the hassle of having cable cards is just not worth it for most people. Last week my dad finally got cable HD, all he had to do is call up our cable company say we wanted a box, and it came in the mail two days later. He merely plugged it in where the old box was and he was up and running. He doesnt know what THX is, he wont even remotely program, and he sure as heck won't be moving his recordings to his PC. I think its a safe bet that most people fall in the same boat.
quote:
.most people don't even know the difference between Digital and HD either. For those of us that know, TiVo is better. Don't be hating.
Once again, I am not saying TV is a bad product, but you said it yourself, most people don't even know the difference between HD and SDTV, so one would think those same people have no idea about the added features of the Tivo.


RE: TIVO who???
By theapparition on 10/9/2008 8:52:43 AM , Rating: 2
For clarification, I have a series 3 and and two series 2 units

quote:
-Dual HD tuners (long before anyone else had) with cable cards

My Comcast Scientific Atlanta box had dual HD tuners, long before the Series 3 was available. I know, because I was waiting for it.

quote:
-Large storage that can be expanded with a common external drive

Both the Sci-Atl Comcast box and my current Motorola FIOS box have external SATA ports, and I've expanded storage on both.
quote:
-Programming via phone or ethernet (or plug in wireless usb ethernet)

Advantage - TIVO
quote:
Ability to move shows between DVRs

Huge benefit......but FIOS's multiroom DVR system lets you do this too.
quote:
-Ability to move shows to your PC and even burn them.

You can do this with FIOS too, but it's more limited than the TIVO implementation.
quote:
**Ability to run all your music and photos from your PC to your home entertainment system

FIOS too.
quote:
-Rent/Purchase movies from amazon.com

FIOS On-Demand.......plus free on demand for all channels that I'm already paying a premium for. Advantage: Cable
quote:
-live365 streaming music

80 channels of music from FIOS
quote:
-youtube integration

Advantage - TIVO
quote:
-Wishlist and swivel search (aka show me all Hi-Def sci-fi movies playing anywhere over the next two weeks)

FIOS is close, but TIVO is still a little better
quote:
-actually more online services integration (yahoo etc) than I can name.

You'd be surprised how many widgets the FIOS implementation has.
quote:
Oh yeah, and in addition to the 1080i HD recording it also has THX certified surround via HDMI or Optical.

Ditto FIOS, as long as the source material was done in THX.

Now for the drawbacks.
Something breaks.
Advantage - Cable

Cost
Advantage - Cable

All in all, unless you are one of the select few that needs those few extra features, TIVO is not the way to go.


RE: TIVO who???
By Elementalism on 10/8/2008 11:25:08 AM , Rating: 2
afaik TiVo still owns a sizeable chunk of the dvr market. Which should grow as Comcast introduces their OS to their DVRs and DirecTV starts using TiVo hardware in 2009.

And after seeing friends with cable DVRs. There is simply nothing on the market that compares to a real TiVo unit.


Tivo just not worth it to me
By happyfirst on 10/8/2008 1:33:08 PM , Rating: 2
I have ONE friend with a TIVO that raves about it. Everybody else uses their cable DVR.

And for the record for that one poster before, cable companies had dual HD tuners LONG LONG before Tivo. They weren't cable card because cable card didn't even exist yet I think and why would they even be cable card since they were provided by the cable company!!!

To me, Tivo versus every other cable box is almost like an Ipod versus every other mp3 player, except for two HUGE differences, initial cost and monthly subscription.

How many of you that own ipods and love the look and feel of that ipod would still purchase that ipod again if it's initial cost had been 2 to 3 times that of any competitor AND just to keep your ipod working every month you needed to pay ANOTHER monthly subscription? And when that ipod broke, you had to buy another one versus just being able to swap your player out for another one.

Sure the Tivo has a nicer interface, is nicer to look at, etc, just like an ipod. But in the end, the CORE functionality is the same.




RE: Tivo just not worth it to me
By Smilin on 10/8/2008 6:46:09 PM , Rating: 2
actually no. TiVo had the first dual HD Tuner DVR, the series 3.

There were HD tuners before that and there were dual tuners before that (not sure who won those races). However..TiVo had the first dual HD Tuner DVR. I know because I was waiting around at that time for the thing to be invented by someone. I bought a preordered series 3.

Also cable cards have existed since 1996 and most cable DVRs use them (they ship already installed).

TiVos are more expensive but they are better. It's up to the consumer to make the choice if that is worth it.. In my case I bought a lifetime subscription up front and it paid for itself probably 4 years ago. To switch to a cable company DVR I would have to pay $5-10/month and downgrade to a frankly very shtty box.

The mp3/ipod analogy kind of fails us here.. there are just too many features missing from the cable company DVR. To bring the analogy back around it would be more like a walkman tape player vs an mp3 player. If you've owned a tape player your whole life and never seen an mp3 player I suppose you would be perfectly happy though. At their CORE they both play music!

Your friend isn't alone. It's hard to find many TiVo owners who don't love them. You just don't see that enthusiasm with any other DVR.


RE: Tivo just not worth it to me
By happyfirst on 10/8/2008 11:17:55 PM , Rating: 2
Actually yes. Again, Tivo did NOT release the first dual tuner HD box. They were late by 3 YEARS!!!!!!

Scientic Atlanta released a DUAL HD DVR back in dec 2003. Google it. I know because I got ONE way back then. Cable cards didn't exist as you just acknowledged till 2006, when Tivo released the Series 3, Tivo's first dual HD tuner box.

I sure hope your tivo device never fails. You don't have a lifetime subscription. Your specific tivo device does. If it breaks, bye bye lifetime subscription (unless another promo comes out). You really going to use that for your entire lifetime?

I think the tivo/mp3 player analogy is fine. Feel free to list some of those MANY features that you consider are so important.


RE: Tivo just not worth it to me
By cys123 on 10/8/2008 11:47:14 PM , Rating: 2
The cable card concept appeared since late 90's. But no product was shipped until 2004. And it was already obsolete the day it came out. Newer version of cable card (2.0) was not available until last year, and still under massive revisions. 2.0 cable card is basically a embedded computer in PCMCIA form factor that has its own CPU, memory, even TCP/IP stack.

Yeah, I remembered that Scientific Atlanta Explorer 8000HD was available since 2003. At that time, I was working on the network stack of second dual-tuner HD DVR, the 8300HD. These boxes actually have 3 tuners, but the third tuner is reserved for networking (basically a virtual cable modem inside).


RE: Tivo just not worth it to me
By Smilin on 10/9/2008 6:17:25 PM , Rating: 2
quote:

Actually yes. Again, Tivo did NOT release the first dual tuner HD box. They were late by 3 YEARS!!!!!!

Scientic Atlanta released a DUAL HD DVR back in dec 2003. Google it. I know because I got ONE way back then. Cable cards didn't exist as you just acknowledged till 2006, when Tivo released the Series 3, Tivo's first dual HD tuner box.


I said 1996, not 2006. See...
quote:

Also cable cards have existed since 1996 and most cable DVRs use them (they ship already installed).


I think you are correct about Scientific Atlanta being first though...it just wasn't available to me.

quote:

I sure hope your tivo device never fails. You don't have a lifetime subscription. Your specific tivo device does. If it breaks, bye bye lifetime subscription (unless another promo comes out). You really going to use that for your entire lifetime?


Nice theory. I'm using my second series 3 and didn't pay a dime or lose the lifetime subscription when I got it. In fact the subscription is the same one I had with my series 2 although I did pay a transfer fee back then...which has again long since paid for itself.

quote:

I think the tivo/mp3 player analogy is fine. Feel free to list some of those MANY features that you consider are so important.


See previous list.


By Reclaimer77 on 10/9/2008 12:30:13 AM , Rating: 2
Scientific Atlantic sucks. They should stick to making calculators. My ISP/Cable company provided me with a DVR and after a week I turned it in and bought a TiVo.

The most unbearable issue was the, no lie, THREE second lag between me pushing a button on the remote and the DVR actually responding to the request. Thats unnaceptable.

You know what, its fine if you guys took the easy and cheap way out and went with your cable companies bargain basement Taco Bell of DVR's. But don't come here spreading FUD and trying to kid yourself that you have anything close to a Tivo.


Title is Wrong and Misleading
By DaveLessnau on 10/8/2008 10:36:29 AM , Rating: 2
Why is this article entitled "DISH, TiVO Make Peace to the Tune of $104 Million?" DISH and TiVo did NOT make peace in any sense of the word. DISH's appeal was turned down in this case and they were forced to pay up. But, there's yet another lawsuit between the two companies (as noted in the article) regarding DISH's software "workaround" that they claim doesn't infringe TiVo's patents. How does the final loss of one lawsuit and the continuation of the same issue in another lawsuit equate to anyone "Making Peace?"




RE: Title is Wrong and Misleading
By Myg on 10/8/2008 11:30:26 AM , Rating: 2
Didnt notice that myself...

Funny; must be one of those newfangled American references (to the wrong concept of course).


By Reclaimer77 on 10/9/2008 12:35:10 AM , Rating: 2
Peace at the point of a gun is still peace.


US patents getting rediculous
By omnicronx on 10/8/2008 11:33:36 AM , Rating: 2
I think I am going to start get a bunch of BS patents just hoping that one of them plays out.. I mean someone must have had the idea to have a VCR that splits the cable connection in which you can record while watching long before Tivo came up with the idea. Its just too easy to reuse common sense ideas, but because they are in the 'digital domain' they are considered a different idea, which in reality, they are not.

They should be following similar lines of drug patents, certain amount of years to actually make use of the patent, and say 5 years after the release of the product before anyone can make it (like generic drug companies do).




RE: US patents getting rediculous
By wempa on 10/8/2008 12:43:21 PM , Rating: 2
Yeah, exactly. Patents are getting silly. The people issuing them really must have no clue about technology and are easily persuaded. Heck, let's patent a quad tuner concept .... record 3 shows and watch a 4th ! Stupid.


By theapparition on 10/9/2008 9:02:44 AM , Rating: 2
"Everything that can be invented has been invented." -- Charles H. Duell, U.S. Commissioner of Patents, in 1899.


LOVING!! my Dish HD dual tuner DVR
By kattanna on 10/8/2008 10:33:29 AM , Rating: 2
man.. there is nothing like recording 2 HD feeds, while watching another pre-recorded show.

we almost NEVER watch live TV anymore.

and with the ability to record 2 different things at once.. gone is the battle over who gets to watch what when there are competing shows on at the same time.




By FITCamaro on 10/8/2008 10:36:42 AM , Rating: 2
Yeah I've recently heard about being able to record two shows while watching a 3rd. My box can only do two shows at a time (can record two but you have to be watching one). It'd be nice but I still just don't trust satellite enough in my area. If I lived in an area with less rain perhaps.


“Then they pop up and say ‘Hello, surprise! Give us your money or we will shut you down!' Screw them. Seriously, screw them. You can quote me on that.” -- Newegg Chief Legal Officer Lee Cheng referencing patent trolls

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