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Violent video games in the hands of minors is becoming a popular debate among leaders in Washington DC

As many states still consider creating game-related legislation that would stop the sale of violent video games to minors, Senators heard arguments about the impact of violent video games on the adolescents that play them.  The subcommittee of the US Senate Judiciary will consider what can be done about violent video games, state regulations and free speech.  Federal courts have temporarily forced states like California, Illinois, Washington and Michigan to hold off on restricting the sale of video games to minors.  Even if stores will no longer be allowed to legally sell violent games to minors, it is unknown how many stores will actually help enforce the ban.

Psychologists and researchers are currently doing more research to see if there is any correlation between "violent" video games and violence or crime.

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Government Out of Bounds, Again!
By TomZ on 3/31/2006 10:26:23 AM , Rating: 4
Yet another job that government is trying to do, that it has no place doing. Managing what children do with their time, and the content they access, is the job of their parents, not the government. Sheesh.

And looking at it another way, this could be interpreted as unwanted censorship. Who better to judge the content my kids can access then me, their parent?

I think government should protect children from real threats like child sexual predators, disease, etc. and forget about this other waste of time.




RE: Government Out of Bounds, Again!
By theslug on 3/31/2006 10:32:49 AM , Rating: 3
It's similar to how the sale of certain movies and magazines are restricted as well. The producers of those things can still make them, but that doesn't mean everyone can see them. It basically seems like they want to restrict games in the same way. But I agree though, it is ultimately the job of the parents to determine what their kids can and can't see, not the government.


RE: Government Out of Bounds, Again!
By TomZ on 3/31/2006 10:42:17 AM , Rating: 1
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that in the case of movies, books, and magazines, these are voluntary restrictions set voluntarily by the publishers and industry trade associations like MPAA. I don't think these are governed by any laws.


RE: Government Out of Bounds, Again!
By theslug on 3/31/2006 10:51:02 AM , Rating: 2
You might be right about that actually. I know some theaters won't even show a movie unless it's been rated by the MPAA, and stores can refuse to sell things out of choice. And these are private entities. So, the gov't should definitely not be involved in this.


RE: Government Out of Bounds, Again!
By Kilim on 3/31/2006 2:47:01 PM , Rating: 2
I work for Gamestop and we do not sell M games to people under 17. We also do not sell T games to kids who are too young, which is judged merely by the clerk.

We even get secret shopped to check compliance.

But all of this means nothing when some stupid Mom, and yes it is the MOM for some reason, who buys Manhunt for the 12 year old.


RE: Government Out of Bounds, Again!
By TomZ on 3/31/2006 3:08:32 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
We even get secret shopped to check compliance.

By whom?


RE: Government Out of Bounds, Again!
By DeathSniper on 3/31/2006 9:33:43 PM , Rating: 2
Er...many consumer industries have their own people pose as customers on random days at random locations...who then go and rate things from customer service, time to check-out, compliance with their policies, etc...


RE: Government Out of Bounds, Again!
By TomZ on 4/1/2006 9:42:24 AM , Rating: 2
OK, so it isn't a government agency.

Seems like the current systems are working fine to me. Why do we need the US Government involved?


By Christopher1 on 4/1/2006 3:21:41 PM , Rating: 1
Why are they stupid? There is absolutely NO, repeat NO evidence that violent videogames cause children to become violent! I was playing Doom at the tender age of 10, and I didn't turn into some violent serial killer wanna-be!

The real reason for children becoming violent isn't because they are playing violent video-games and seeing violence everyday. The real reason for it is that the parents are not telling them "That is fine in fantasy, but if you do it in real life, YOU GO TO PRISON!"

That is what my parents told me MANY times when I was growing up!


By dmcanally on 3/31/2006 10:40:54 AM , Rating: 4
Your kids will still have every chance to do what you want them to; they just won’t have the chance to do it without a consenting adult. As a parent you are able to go into the porn shop and buy them all the nudies they desire. They just won’t be able to go in on their own and get it for themselves.

However I do agree that legislation such as this is a huge waste of money. While a child may not be able to go into a store a directly purchase the game he or she could certainly have someone old enough do it for them. Hell when I was 19 I paid bums to buy me beer all the time.


RE: Government Out of Bounds, Again!
By blwest on 3/31/2006 3:00:20 PM , Rating: 3
quote:
I think government should protect children from real threats like child sexual predators, disease, etc.

And bad parents! LAWL


RE: Government Out of Bounds, Again!
By blwest on 3/31/2006 3:08:16 PM , Rating: 4
The way to make a better government and country is to have fewer laws, not more. Some day we'll have a law that says that I cannot chew gum and walk at the same time, because I might swallow the gum, trip on a rock and kill myself--all because one person was stupid enough to die doing such an action. Let the idiots do what they do best: be idiots.

I resemble this to the cell phones and driving laws. I grew up driving a stick shift, eating on the go and talking on a cellular phone. I have not ONCE been in an accident or caused an accident by doing this.

ANSWER: learn to drive

If you can't do this then it's nature's way of weeding out the people already drowining in the genetic gene pool.

Look at animals: the weakest die. If you're the slowest antelope in africa and the lion eats you...well then you're lunch. Think of an idiot who swallows his gum, chokes and kills himself while walking....like lunch.


By Slaimus on 3/31/2006 3:57:22 PM , Rating: 3
The problem is those people crash and kill OTHERS. This is the same motivation for anti-smoking laws. You can smoke all you want, but if second hand smoke is giving others cancer, the government will step in.


RE: Government Out of Bounds, Again!
By fsardis on 4/1/2006 9:28:51 AM , Rating: 2
you see, i never understood what exactly the american government is trying to do.

i live in a place where kids play any type of games, violent or not and still go to school with books in their bags instead of firearms.

my brother has played almost every game with an 18+ rating out there and he is still not violent in any way, nor has his attitude changed in any way. I guess american kids have trouble seperating games from reality. thats too bad for you, i just hope this c**p wont spread to the rest of the world because america is known for doing that lately.


RE: Government Out of Bounds, Again!
By TomZ on 4/2/2006 10:32:23 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
i just hope this c**p wont spread to the rest of the world because america is known for doing that lately.

Please don't blame America for all the problems in the world. If you have problems in your country, they are your country's problems. Just as our problems are our problems. If your country decides to emulate a harmful aspect of American culture, that is your problem.


LIES !!
By kattanna on 3/31/2006 11:27:57 AM , Rating: 2
I like how the BIGGEST lie they are using to bring in more legislation on this is that it makes kids violent...

interesting though how juvenile violent crime has actually dropped over 40% in the past 10 years....

but lets not let the facts get in the way of a good PR event to make some politicians look good..for the children..

LOL





RE: LIES !!
By AnaxagorasZeres on 3/31/2006 11:47:11 AM , Rating: 2
See, when you need to score points with the 'Family' crowd so your party doesn't lose next election, you can't let the facts get in the way of the truth.


RE: LIES !!
By SoylentG on 3/31/2006 11:53:19 AM , Rating: 3
I think this type of thing is a load of crap. People need to parent their children, and the government should limit the sales of games to minors. I remember buying Mortal Kombat and I had to go get my mom to come into the store to tell the clerk it was ok for me to buy it. It's simple. If you're a teen, you have to realize that arguing is pretty moot. You don't ask the person who the law affects what the law should be, thats a terrible idea... Please keep that in mind, teen posters :p


RE: LIES !!
By oTAL on 3/31/2006 12:26:47 PM , Rating: 2
Actually... I think your wrong.... most laws should be voted by ppl affected by the law (directly, indirectly and potentially). What you don't do is ask minors to decide on such matters. I do believe teens should be allowed to express their opinion on this... we just shouldn't care about it... but let them express it anyway =p muahahahahhahahaha.
*lol*


RE: LIES !!
By TomZ on 3/31/2006 2:44:58 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
I remember buying Mortal Kombat and I had to go get my mom to come into the store to tell the clerk it was ok for me to buy it. It's simple.

But in your case, which you claim was effective, this was not due to any governmental regulation, right? This was probably due to voluntary actions on the part of the publisher to provide ratings and the retailer to enforce a policy about who they'll sell to.


RE: LIES !!
By Slaimus on 3/31/2006 4:06:28 PM , Rating: 2
It is more of a sociological change. If it was 50 years ago, the same law would have put the parent in jail if their kids screwed up (we still have many laws left over that punish the parent for not parenting). These days, parents do not want this responsibility anymore. If this is what the majority of society wants, then the law should be created. Call your respresentatives in Congress if you do not support it.


By Christopher1 on 4/1/2006 3:30:45 PM , Rating: 1
Parents are not responsible for what their children do. You can tell you child many times "Don't have sex before marriage, don't kill people, don't do this and don't do that!"

Sooner or later, the children realize that you are the BIGGEST hypocrites in the world, because they realize that when you were there age, you were having sex, you were drinking, you were doing drugs...... It's gotten to the point where children do not believe adults.

We do not need to protect children from sexual contact with adults and with other children. We need to get rid of the people who see it as being something dirty, and then have to brainwash the minds of children into thinking that it was dirty!
Childhood sex is one of the most BEAUTIFUL things in the whole world, even with adults, and I am speaking from experience.

We need to tell the moral idiots in the world, "ENOUGH! You are twisting our children into thinking that all sex is wrong, and that stops NOW!"

I taught my own children, that having sex with anyone, even an adult!, is not wrong as long as the adult or other person asks their permission to touch them sexually first.

You wonder why children are being raped, murdered and sexually assaulted..... it is because you are teaching them to ALWAYS do what adults tell them to do, and you wonder when someone takes advantage of that power.

A better thing to teach your children..... "No one may force you to do anything that you do not want to do or force you to NOT do something you want to do, EVEN ME OR ANOTHER ADULT, unless you are putting someone in physical danger with your action or inaction!"

That is what I taught my daughters from BIRTH on, and they are now 13 and 15 year olds, with healthy sexual appetites, and straight A+ grades in school.

There is no such thing as a sexual predator, except for the person who actually goes up to a child or adult, grabs them, forces them down and forces a sexual act on them.

Anything else, as long as the person as for permission, even with adult/child sexual acts, is consensual sex, and should NOT be reviled, it should be celebrated.


By TomZ on 4/2/2006 11:24:32 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Childhood sex is one of the most BEAUTIFUL things in the whole world, even with adults, and I am speaking from experience.

The reason that children cannot ethically enter into a consensual sexual relationship is that they lack the emotional maturity to make that decision. This is the same reason that children cannot sign legal contracts, vote, buy alcohol, sign up for the military, and why you as their parent are legally responsible for them (...despite your incorrect assertion to the contrary).

As their parent, you have the right to teach your children as you want, whether it makes sense or not - but don't come here and feed us this line of complete bullshit.

Also, when you teach your children your groovy, delusional views of sexuality, you might want to remind them that when they take your advice and have sex with adults, that in our society, that is called statutory rape and if caught, will land that person in jail.

Finally, the responsibility for rape, murder, and sexual assault is on the person committing those crimes. It is not the fault of society.


By vortmax on 4/3/2006 12:51:15 PM , Rating: 2
You are a very sick man and I will pray for you and your daughters.


Correct me if I'm wrong
By littlebitstrouds on 3/31/2006 2:45:54 PM , Rating: 2
But what exactly is wrong with not selling any games without consent? And why do people think that while this is the parents "job" that any law limiting the sales to minors as an impedance to just that. In fact it's actually promotes this. If I know my kid can't buy a video game that I don't want him to have, now I can actually controll what my child does. Anything that helps me KNOW what my kid is getting and not getting is a good system.

I don't care if you think it's censoring (it's not), there is hardly anything wrong with this. It's not like they're saying they can't make these games anymore they're just saying you can't sell them to my child without me deeming it ok. Sounds like a pro-parent ideal to me.




RE: Correct me if I'm wrong
By Kilim on 3/31/2006 2:50:55 PM , Rating: 2
I agree with you. I am sure a teenager can get alchohol somewhere. But it is nice to know as a parent that he cannot just go to the supermarket and get a six pack of Pabst. Same with cigarettes.

I work at a mall, where parents will dump off their kids on the weekends for movies and shopping. Knowing that they cannot use that money to buy their 13 year old ass a copy of GTA is better than nothing.


RE: Correct me if I'm wrong
By TomZ on 3/31/2006 3:16:05 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
I don't care if you think it's censoring (it's not), there is hardly anything wrong with this.

Yes, it is censorship. Why? Because you and I probably don't agree on what is appropriate for our children. And I probably won't agree with some panel in Washington about what is appropriate for my children. And it's not exactly black-and-white, right-and-wrong, right? The decision is a subjective judgement about the content.

It's also not pro-parent, because our job as parents is to teach our children how to make responsible choices. In this case, it seems like what we are saying is that we want to give up that choice, which is the right and responsibility of the parent, to a panel in Washington to decide. How does that prepare our children for adult life?


RE: Correct me if I'm wrong
By theslug on 3/31/2006 3:47:45 PM , Rating: 2
I think what he means by saying it's not censorship is that the producers of games (and movies, books, etc) still have the right to make those things, but that doesn't necessarily mean that just anyone can see them. For the same reason that it is not censorship if a theater refuses to show an unrated movie. Now, if we were talking about what content couldn't go in said game or movie, then that would be censoring.


RE: Correct me if I'm wrong
By Samus on 3/31/2006 4:00:10 PM , Rating: 2
yet somehow columbine is the fault of Doom, a almost cartoonish story based on another planet in the future no less, where-as movies don't get any flac, like the matrix, although not entirely realistic, featured trench coats, real guns, and a plausable theme.

im really tired of vice city taking the flac for bad parenting.


RE: Correct me if I'm wrong
By littlebitstrouds on 3/31/2006 4:22:20 PM , Rating: 2
What you're talking about are stratagies for parenting not what is an actual fact. Not even going to argue which is better, limiting or allowing and waiting for them to make a decision because this is all based on opinion. And whether or not we dissagree on what is approriate, the content is still available . As a parent I would rather censor too much and cost me a trip to the store to deem what I think is acceptable for my child than there being no limit on anything.

Now to the problem with tying violence in video games to real life violent behavior. This is a subject that should not be tied into the legislation's process to verify this sort of program. It's too hard of a point to truely prove.

Personal opinion... if you're upset and you listen to sad music you get more upset... if you're angry and you listen to angry music you get angier... if you have violent ideas and play violent video games you'll get more violent ideas which might facilitate violent behavior. So lets take care of why these people are violent in the first place which, of course, is probably the parents job:-)


RE: Correct me if I'm wrong
By TomZ on 3/31/2006 4:42:15 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
As a parent I would rather censor too much and cost me a trip to the store to deem what I think is acceptable for my child than there being no limit on anything.

That's fine with me. But please don't decide what is right for my children, and I also won't try and decide what is right for your children. The problem is that when the government gets involved, that is exactly what happens. Censorship is subjective, not objective.

What is the problem with the ratings systems and voluntary selling restrictions that are in place now? Why does the government even have to be involved and taxpayer dollars spent/wasted, and this possibly turned into some political thing?

In what other endeavor have you seen the US Government be able to handle efficiently and effectively?


By littlebitstrouds on 3/31/2006 5:07:59 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
In what other endeavor have you seen the US Government be able to handle efficiently and effectively?


Well considering they're the largest business in American the US Government seems to build roads, deliver mail, allow me to live an American dream through protecting me in a larger sceme of the sense. Don't hand out general comments... on a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being every form of our government failing, please rate our government in comparison to the rest of the world? hmmm pretty damn good I would say.

quote:
That's fine with me. But please don't decide what is right for my children, and I also won't try and decide what is right for your children.


Point is I'm not really deciding, I'm just making it harder to get, call it a buffer.

quote:
What is the problem with the ratings systems and voluntary selling restrictions that are in place now?


Send a 15 year old in to get a game rated for over 17... yeah they'll get it easy. Now make a law with a strict enforcement and see if that store sells it. I get carded for cigars at 24, and I'm glad I do everytime.


RE: Correct me if I'm wrong
By fsardis on 4/1/2006 9:36:16 AM , Rating: 2
and so your kids will learn as they grow that its ok to have someone monitoring you all the time. and next comes the big cameras and satelites that watch your every step but its ok to your kids (future americans). and in america nobody will be free or have a private times, but thats ok to future americans cause they grew to know that monitoring is normal. it keeps you safe from "terrorists". and so in a few generations you have a nation of sheep. a nation where everyone will be affraid to do anything because the "big brother" is watching.

how is that any different from communist russia? oh yea wait i know, they had spies instead of cameras....


To the Government's defense
By DarkPrime on 3/31/2006 11:07:07 AM , Rating: 2
I don't think there should be any laws limiting violent games or holding such game makers liable for crimes commited by those who play such games. However, on the topic of the government stepping in what is the parent's domain, is this a problem when it appears that there are too many parents totally neglecting their job as a parent? I believe there are too many parents in this country that believe their child is always innocent and who provide little if any parenting. It's sad to me if the government has to step in in the first place.




RE: To the Government's defense
By TomZ on 3/31/2006 2:41:24 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
It's sad to me if the government has to step in in the first place.

Yes, the parenting situation might be sad. But you're assuming that it is a forgone conclusion that the government "has" to step in. Who said it does?

Surely the government has to step in when kids are really in jeopardy, e.g., cases of neglect, abuse, poverty, etc. But keeping my kids from being able to buy a copy of Gruesome Shootout IV from Best Buy doesn't exactly fall into the category of what the government "has" to do.


Wont do much good in the end.
By segagenesis on 3/31/2006 12:45:33 PM , Rating: 2
Even if they have thier cake and want to eat it too, this wont do much to the average teenager who knows how to get games by "other means necessary". Just like the case with the infamous "PARENTAL ADVISORY" stickers on CDs and such we've seen over the past decade now (and failing for the most part in my opinion) of keeping explicit lyrics out of the hands of minors. Hell, just look at schools where they took candy out of the vending machines how much kids bringing the stuff in bookbags are making.




My opinion
By double007seven on 3/31/2006 5:48:43 PM , Rating: 1
I would argue that violent video game do not make kids violent...I would argue that video games give violent kids an outlet.

For instance...a violent kid can only kill in real life a couple people before being sent away to jail forever.

On the other hand if he has violent video games to play as an outlet, he can do all the killing he wants without getting in trouble!

Does this make sense? I think so! But then again everything is relevant!




RE: My opinion
By Mirabiles on 4/1/06, Rating: 0
psychology
By Mirabiles on 4/1/06, Rating: 0
"It looks like the iPhone 4 might be their Vista, and I'm okay with that." -- Microsoft COO Kevin Turner











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