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GM's next generation Chevrolet Impala will remain FWD-based

GM's 4.5 liter V8 Duramax diesel engine

Honda's 2.2-liter i-DETC diesel engine
GM's Northstar to fade away while Chrysler's Hemi may see less service

In late December, President Bush signed into a law a new energy bill which will raise the Corporate Average Fuel Economy (CAFE) average to 35 MPG by 2020. Some auto manufacturers balked at the idea while the bill was under construction, but Detroit’s Big Three all committed to complying with the new standard once it passed.

The first victims of the new energy bill are already starting to show up just a month after the new energy bill passed.

General Motors announced that it cancelled plans to build new versions of its Northstar V8 engine. GM's Northstar engine was introduced in the 1990s and has been a staple in the engine bay of high-end Cadillac luxury vehicles.

GM will instead rely on its direct-injection (DI) 3.6 liter V6 engine to power its luxury vehicles. The DI V6 produces 304 HP in the CTS compared to the 320 HP, 4.6 liter Northstar V8 engine used in the larger STS. The V6 engine does, however, have a huge deficit in the area of torque when compared to the current Northstar V8 -- the V6 produces just 273 lb-ft of torque while the V8 delivers 315 lb-ft.

GM claims that the move to the DI V6 will not only improve the fuel economy of its larger vehicles, but will also save weight across the board -- the V6 is anywhere from 150 pounds to 200 pounds lighter than the Northstar V8.

Another big loser in the midst of new CAFE regulations is Chrysler’s Hemi engine. "The Hemi is not the powertrain of the future," said Chrysler co-president Jim Press. "It's the powertrain of today."

The Hemi engine will not be dropped entirely from the Chrysler portfolio, but its role will be greatly diminished. The 5.7 liter V8 Hemi engine was recently upgraded for the 2009 Dodge Ram and now produces 380 HP and 404 lb-ft of torque -- up from 345 HP and 375 lb-ft. Fuel economy was also boosted by 4 percent and emissions were reduced compared to the old Hemi engine.

Despite the upgraded power and improved fuel economy, vehicles like the next generation Dodge Charger and Chrysler 300 will likely miss out on Hemi power. Instead, Chrysler is developing new "Phoenix" high-output V6 engine to take the place of the Hemi. The engines will feature dual overhead cams, variable valve timing and cylinder deactivation. Ranging-topping variants are likely to surpass 300 HP, like its competitors, and provide better fuel economy than its Hemi counterpart.

When it comes to actual vehicle platforms, General Motors is already taking steps to comply with the update CAFE. The company originally planned to resurrect the Pontiac GTO -- again -- using the same underpinnings as the upcoming Chevrolet Camaro and Pontiac G8. Those plans are now shelved.

"I think (the Monaro/Pontiac GTO) is gone for now," said GM's Bob Lutz. "We’ve got nothing in the product plan right now like that. We’d like to have, but you can’t do everything."

GM was to also build the next generation Chevy Impala using the same RWD platform. Those plans were also shelved and the next generation Impala will continue to ride on a FWD platform.

Despite the killings that were mentioned above, manufacturers are looking to new, more efficient powertrains to power their vehicles into the future. All of the major manufacturers are looking to hybrid, fuel cell and electric vehicles to boost fuel economy. Manufacturers, however, are also looking towards an increased use of turbocharging and diesel technology to boost economy.

Ford recently announced its "EcoBoost" engine line which takes advantage of turbocharging. Its new 2.0 liter turbo four produces an incredible 275 HP and 280 lb-ft of torque. The company's new 3.5 liter V6 produced a whopping 340 HP and 340 lb-ft thanks to turbocharging. Both engines produce the power of a V6 and V8 engine respectively while achieving greater fuel economy.

On the diesel front, General Motors will soon roll out a new 4.5 liter V8 Duramax diesel engine destined for its light-duty pickups and SUVs. Toyota is following suit with a new V8 diesel engine for its Tundra full-size pickup and Sequoia full-size SUV. Honda is also prepared to make a 2.2 liter i-DETC diesel four cylinder engine available in its 2009 Honda Accord and 2009 Acura TSX. A larger 3.5 liter V6 diesel will finds its way into the Honda Pilot, Honda Ridgeline and Acura MDX.

The new CAFE regulations were a big wakeup call to all auto manufacturers who sell vehicles in the U.S. It's great to see that manufacturers are adept enough to evolve and adapt to give customers the power they crave with increased fuel economy at the same time.

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Sheet
By napalmjack on 1/23/2008 11:45:00 AM , Rating: 4
Well, good going politicians. You neutered the Charger and killed the GTO.

Thanks.




RE: Sheet
By Brandon Hill (blog) on 1/23/2008 11:48:01 AM , Rating: 2
There's always the Challenger :)

My guess is that the 300C and Charge will stay with HO V6 engines while the upcoming Challenger will continue on with the 5.7 liter and 6.1 liter Hemis... for at least a few years.


RE: Sheet
By theapparition on 1/24/2008 9:57:27 AM , Rating: 4
I find it particuarly amusing when I see the "death of sports cars" headlines.

First, some facts.
High performance cars make up only a fraction of the sales of cars/trucks. When faced with CAFE decisions, the manufacturer's are going to look at the number of vehicules sold by fuel economy. When ever you want the biggest change, you don't go after the smallest items. The end result.......the top25 offenders probably won't be sports cars. They'll be Trucks and SUV's.
The end of the big V8 dead? So far from the truth. There are advantages to forced induction (turbocharing and supercharging) but issues as well. There is an old addage, "there's no replacement for displacement". So true. NA engines will deliver signifigantly more torque than their equal powered turbo'd counterparts. Torque is what gives acceleration response, which consumers have become accustomed to.

Now for those horrible American engines:

For example:

2008 Mitsu Evo X:
2.0L 4cyl Turbo 320hp
16city/22highway

2008 Corvette
6.2L 8cyl 436hp
18city/28highway

And now for that same engine in a much heavier car:
2008 Cadallac CTS-V
6.2L 8cyl 430hp
17city/25highway (2007 models were 15/24)

Which would you rather have? Less power in a small turbo engine, with poorer fuel economy, or more power in a more fuel efficient engine. (I just tried to pick cars that were similar in performance, I don't need lessons on the fact that they appeal to differnt markets). The GM LSx series of engines will also be updated with displacement on demand and VVT. Such enhancements will only add to their fuel economy. Can't do DoD on a 4cyl and the EVO already has VVT.
So for as much as American companies get bemoaned for big fuel-sucking low-tech engines, they seem to be doing all right.

What's really sad, though, is that the Corvette actually props up GM's average fuel economy figures, which hover somewhere around 24mpg. Toyota, recognized as the leader in fuel economy, only manages close to 28mpg, after all those Prius' it sold. Belive me, the Tundra will face the chopping block before most sports cars.

Out of the big 3 American, GM is probably in the best position to meet the new standards. Ford probably a close second. Chrysler billed itself as the big, heavy, punch-you-in-the-face brand, and such will have to do a complete revamp of product line, not only engines, but put their pig-heavy cars on a diet. German brands will also have issues, but have more experience with meeting those requirements in Europe. Still, because you have European experience, that doesn't mean that it will translate to American consumers' tastes.

It was sad that they cancelled the Monaro, though. The Challenger and Camaro will be cool, and I still think you'll see a Pontiac version of the Camaro (whether they call it Firebird or GTO). Performance cars are very much alive, and you won't see them going anywhere soon.

Now....400hp Suburbans, you may want to buy now if you really want one.


RE: Sheet
By masher2 (blog) on 1/24/2008 10:15:02 AM , Rating: 2
> "Now for those horrible American engines:"

Err, the Evo X (in addition to being more than 10% heavier than a Corvette) is also an all-wheel-drive model. That alone equals the difference in mileage between the two.

> "Torque is what gives acceleration response, which consumers have become accustomed to"

Consumers buy what they can afford. When CAFE standards force domestic automakers to put big-block models at a price point high enough that they don't impact fleet standards, sales will certainly decline dramatically.


RE: Sheet
By theapparition on 1/24/2008 12:44:07 PM , Rating: 3
quote:
Err, the Evo X (in addition to being more than 10% heavier than a Corvette) is also an all-wheel-drive model. That alone equals the difference in mileage between the two.

Err, you also dismissed the Cadillac, which is also a full 10% heavier than the EVO X is.
All wheel drive models should have very little difference in mileage, since the the other axle is only operable when the computer senses bad conditions or the operator is hard on launch, where 50% of the torque can be delivered to the front wheels.

So let's take a look at another comparable model.

Infinity G35
3.5L V6 306hp
17/24mpg

Infinity G35x (all-wheel drive)
17/23mpg.

Overall.......very comparable cars to the Cadillac, with very similar mileage numbers. Yet the Cadillac gets a full 40% more power. Would you want 40% more power for the same cost of fuel? So which engine is more efficient? You know the answer. Adding some high-tech features to these engines will only make them better.

quote:
Consumers buy what they can afford. When CAFE standards force domestic automakers to put big-block models at a price point high enough that they don't impact fleet standards, sales will certainly decline dramatically.

The problem is, those big-block models we are talking about are already more efficient than most of their sales fleet. Sales won't decline dramatically, since they are already a minor sales item. When Chevy sells 618,257 trucks and over 400k SUV's per year, and only 30k corvettes (that already have higher mpg than corporate average fuel economy) it has a minor impact.


RE: Sheet
By masher2 (blog) on 1/24/2008 2:36:17 PM , Rating: 2
> "Err, you also dismissed the Cadillac, which is also a full 10% heavier than the EVO X is"

According to the Cadillac site, there isn't a 2008 CTS-V. There's an 07...but it uses the 6.0l engine, not the 6.2. The 2009 CTS-V has the 'Vette engine...but its going to be supercharged, which pretty much negates discussing NA engines.

Also, when comparing engines, you can't just pick one outlying example and claim its indicative. Engines are tuned for specific purposes. Take for instance the engine in my very small, light, two-seater, which gets 17/24 mileage. It's tuned for power at all costs, not economy.
The same displacement V6 engine (not the same engine itself) even in a substantially heavier sedan can get 19/28. Add direct injection to that and you can hit 30mpg highway.

But in any case, I'm NOT disagreeing with your primary point, that mpg doesn't correlate inversely to displacement. There are a lot more factors involved.


RE: Sheet
By theapparition on 1/24/2008 4:10:50 PM , Rating: 2
I did put the 2007 Cadillac epa numbers in the original comment. Still a good basis for comparison. Two of my vettes are supercharged and put out over 800hp and over 1000hp. The 800hp one is my daily driver, and can get over 30mpg highway, so I know a little bit about forced induction too. ;)

Your absolutely correct that engines are tuned for distinct purposes. Point is, engines are always tuned (from factory) for:

1. Emissions
2. Safety
3. Performance
4. Fuel Economy

Most engines are pig-rich from the factory, since that makes the engine safer to operate in all enviroments. With a proper aftermarket tune, you can signifigantly increase hp, mpg, and lower emissions.

quote:
Also, when comparing engines, you can't just pick one outlying example and claim its indicative.

True, but if I didn't have any examples, someone would chime in disputing the claims.

In any event, the facts speak for themselves. I tire when I hear that American sports cars with big low-tech engines are gas guzzlers, when in fact, they usually exceed (or are on par) with most other cars on the road.


RE: Sheet
By Samus on 1/24/2008 3:31:41 PM , Rating: 1
I have a Mazdaspeed Protege with over 200 wHP. I consistently get 30MPG highway. I had a Subaru WRX (non STi) that had somewhere in the 250wHP range with 15psi boost, still got 30MPG highway.

I'm tired of people saying performance cars and SUV's get simular mileage. That's simply impossible when you have a 1:2 weight differential. Protege/Subaru are 2500lbs, Tahoe is 5000lbs. The acceleration, top speed, braking and overall fuel milage will be much less than a compact car.


RE: Sheet
By eye smite on 1/23/08, Rating: 0
RE: Sheet
By Christopher1 on 1/23/08, Rating: -1
RE: Sheet
By TheDoc9 on 1/23/2008 12:08:50 PM , Rating: 5
maybe in 50 years when we're all required to ride segways someone will be saying that to you.


RE: Sheet
By creathir on 1/23/2008 12:16:59 PM , Rating: 1
Muscle cars are my right to drive. Sports cars are my right to drive. Hummers are my right to drive. I pay taxes on those roads just like you do. If you want to drive a freakin' yugo, go right ahead. I'll stick with my Ram 1500 Quad Cab.

- Creathir


RE: Sheet
By eye smite on 1/23/2008 12:28:30 PM , Rating: 1
We don't care what you drive.........do we? You want to spend more on gas, be my guest.


RE: Sheet
By Topweasel on 1/23/2008 12:37:26 PM , Rating: 2
But that is the thing. This new Law prevents companies from selling these options because otherwise people wouldn't purchase the high MPG cars. This law sucks because basically tell the car companies what to sell, no matter what the majority actually want.


RE: Sheet
By ebakke on 1/23/2008 1:00:18 PM , Rating: 4
While I would never buy a muscle car, or really any vehicle that guzzles gas, I completely agree with you. Let the people decide what they want. If we want 4 MPG vehicles, sell us 4 MPG vehicles. At some point, people will get sick of spending $2304911234 a day for gas, and they'll demand higher standards. The difference is that they'll demand it from the manufacturer not the government. Even at $3 per gallon, Americans have shown that they're not willing to change their driving behavior, or their vehicles.

The government needs to get out of deciding what vehicles consumers can/can't buy.


RE: Sheet
By bpurkapi on 1/23/08, Rating: -1
RE: Sheet
By masher2 (blog) on 1/23/2008 1:26:25 PM , Rating: 3
A law removing overtime wages and requiring people to work 50 hours/week would help the economy. A law requring the death penalty for property-based crimes would help the economy. A law requring anyone past retirement age to be euthanized would help the economy.

There's a little problem with a thing called "freedom", though.