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Software Ballmer On Vista: "When It's Ready"
Purav Sanghani - May 24, 2006 2:15 PM

51 comment(s) - last by jtesoro.. on May 29 at 5:58 AM

If anyone is even keeping track of Vista's release anymore, congrats

Recent news has hinted at yet more delays in Microsoft's Vista launch in January of 2007. If anyone actually believed that Vista would be released at that time they obviously did not follow Microsoft's previous delays of the upcoming operating system.

As Ballmer himself states "Certainly, when Windows Vista comes to the market next year, and it will be next year, we will make sure that we make a high quality product, ship a high quality product, when it's ready."

The last few words, "when it's ready" are reminiscent of the old Duke Nukem Forever days but hopefully it won't take Microsoft as long to release the final versions. Ballmer went on to later add "What we are discussing ... with hardware partners is when they would really like it -- early January, late January, February. We are on track for shipping early in the year."

Last week Microsoft announced official hardware requirements to run Vista which give us something to hold on to and plan with for migrating our environments to Vista...eventually. The requirements seem very high compared to those of our current beloved Microsoft operating systems but at the rate hardware is advancing these base requirements will probably be standard at the time Vista is launched.

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I'm an indie kid

By Mudvillager on 5/24/2006 2:20:07 PM , Rating: 4

My opinion is that Microsoft should take as much (reasonable) time as they can to make Vista as great as possible!

RE: I'm an indie kid

By TomZ on 5/24/2006 2:26:18 PM , Rating: 2

I agree - for now, WinXP is working just fine. MS should make sure that the first release of Vista is a good one.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By das mod on 5/24/2006 2:56:06 PM , Rating: 3

why not focus on finishing once and for all the so long waited for Service Pack 3 .... XP still has potential and a great future..... who cares when vista is released :P

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By Griswold on 5/24/2006 2:58:08 PM , Rating: 2

Well I want vista, because it will do many things much, much better than 2k or XP. But I dont want another rush job that forces me to wait for SP1 or SP2 before I can use it.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By akugami on 5/24/2006 3:54:17 PM , Rating: 2

It seems more and more likely there will be a SP3 for Windows XP. One must remember that the majority of users will still be on XP and not Vista well into 2007 even if it was released in Jan'07. Especially with the delays on Vista which sound more and more like it might not hit till the second half of 2007. Even if Vista is released I will wait for SP1 when the bugs are worked out.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By ncage on 5/24/2006 10:34:07 PM , Rating: 3

I'll tell you why it makes no sense. Sure it would be great for XP users but for microsoft to put a lot of resources towards this makes absolutly no buisness sense at all. XP is going out and vista is comming in. It makes no sense to spend all kinds of resources on something that microsoft is going to want to phase out in the near term. Its all about revenue. How much revenue push do you think xp has left? Not much.

On the discussion of moving to vista makes no sense because it really doesn't offer anything of use. I heard the same discussions when xp came out and was replacing win2000. Well how many people run win2000 anymore? Probably not that many.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By segagenesis on 5/24/2006 3:56:57 PM , Rating: 2

Just curious... what would you mean by "many things much, much better"? I seem to do everything I need in XP or 2K. But YMMV.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By OrSin on 5/24/2006 4:05:46 PM , Rating: 2

I was thinking the same thing. I don't see Vista doing much for me at. All I can think of is better 64 Support. The rest is eye candy and junk for the the AOL types.
Really I want my desktop OS to do is to process programs. If I want the other junk I download from a 3rd party or even MS, but I hate OS blot. I think the hardware people want it the most so they can justify 4Ghz for word processing.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By OrSin on 5/24/2006 4:08:19 PM , Rating: 1

Oh yeah I forget we really need a SP3. I reload windows and put on SP2, then I had to Download another 140MB of updates. That crazy. I'm fine becuase I'm on broadband but what about the the dail up people. And thier are still allot of them. That what 3 days just to update?

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By Griswold on 5/24/2006 5:23:24 PM , Rating: 2

I said "It" does many things better. UAC (while annoying to some) beats the crap out of the rights management of 2k and XP for example. I mainly mean internal stuff not the GUI.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By hadifa on 5/24/2006 6:58:02 PM , Rating: 3

"Just curious... what would you mean by "many things much, much better"? I seem to do everything I need in XP or 2K. But YMMV."
That's the as I thought when MS introduced win 95. I thought DOS would do everything I need. I seriously thought that. The same as thinking no one can fill a 240MB hard drive ever -I thought the same about 40MB earlier- and so many other genius ideas I had. Hahah.

Nope, XP does not cut it and MS knows it. You think XP is good enough probably because you haven’t seen something better or you got used to the way you are doing things.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By segagenesis on 5/24/2006 8:13:27 PM , Rating: 3

quote:
Nope, XP does not cut it and MS knows it. You think XP is good enough probably because you haven’t seen something better or you got used to the way you are doing things.

I agree because I thought the same, but I really have come to prefer the "if it aint broke dont fix it" mentality come of late when it comes to Windows so I'm still somewhat skeptical. I'll likely wait a year first...

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By Garreye on 5/24/2006 10:39:13 PM , Rating: 2

For me the sidebar and the virtual folders (or stored searches or whatever you want to call it) is enough incentive to upgrade to vista. I'm really picky when it comes to having my PC organized and these features should be a big plus. I'm also big on mutlitasking so the taskbar previews as well as flip and flip-3d should be really useful for this. The new security features look pretty good too.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By Pythias on 5/24/2006 6:32:16 PM , Rating: 3

DX10!!!

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By anandtechrocks on 5/24/2006 2:47:27 PM , Rating: 3

I think they should make sure to release a high quality product, but I wish there were some competition in the OS market to help make newer, better products...

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By michael2k on 5/24/2006 3:35:49 PM , Rating: 1

Competition only exists when there are people buying the competition.

As much as I love my Mac and iPod, the existence of competition has made both much better. It is too bad that the reverse isn't true for Windows; Linux and Mac OS X don't register high enough to be true competitors for Windows (yet). The unveiling of affordable Intel Macs, and hopefully soon CHEAP Intel Macs, may change that yet.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By TheBaker on 5/24/2006 5:24:42 PM , Rating: 2

quote:
Competition only exists when there are people buying the competition.

As much as I love my Mac and iPod, the existence of competition has made both much better. It is too bad that the reverse isn't true for Windows; Linux and Mac OS X don't register high enough to be true competitors for Windows (yet). The unveiling of affordable Intel Macs, and hopefully soon CHEAP Intel Macs, may change that yet.

You're missing the one thing that could make Apple a real player in this game:

Stop trying to be a glorified hardware vendor and sell the OS to anyone who wants it!

There's no competition right now because Apple determines exactly what will be in their boxes so they don't have to come up with a bunch of drivers and provide as much tech support as Microsoft does. If they will get past that hump and sell the product to anyone who already has a Windows box and wants to change to OSX without having to buy a new computer, we have a whole new ball game.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By Pirks on 5/24/06, Rating: -1

By Pirks on 5/24/2006 6:38:51 PM , Rating: -1

Nope, there is competition, it's just more original and creative than merely selling OS boxes, which is what Microsoft was doing all the time. Nobody besides Apple sees personal computer as a friendly thing, which you just yank out of the box, plug it in and enjoy immediately. No need for drivers and stuff like that. There's a friendly Apple store near you, you can go for help there if you're stuck, and you can plug some certified by Apple hardware in your box and no need to insert driver/setup CD and answer some questions if you're total noob with that. It's a major selling point for Apple - not to offer kind of DIY box where you, the end user, are responsible for all the technical details like drivers, antiviruses, software DVD players and firewalls and so on. They offer integrated solution where everything possible to take care of was taken care of, no need for you, the end user, to think about where to get DVD software or drivers or where to go today to update your antivirus or something. This is called full service and so far Apple is the only company who does it. Now, it's technically possible and actually pretty easy to make your Vista PC look and feel like that, like novice user friendly Mac, it takes a willing vendor and some work with MS on the central update site (to update everything on your computer in one run, Apple update-style) and that's it, nothing like launching a rocket to Mars. Why there are no such vendors yet? Two easy answers 1) PC vendors just don't get it yet why Apple grows so blazingly fast these days, they're get accustomed to the old ways of doing things - selling DIY boxes with Windows quickly slapped on, and 2) Dell seems to start understanding it first, from all the major vendors I know. Did you hear about Dell deciding to open two retail stores, and copying other Apple ideas? If yes, then stop being naive and see through the blinds - it's PCs adopting Apple way, not the vice versa. Apple's not going to separate Mac OS and Mac because this will immediately make Apple just another DIY box vendor. But now Dell and soon others will run after Apple trying to open their stores and such... and they will fail, because they, like you, just not getting the story yet. Opening retail store won't help IF you still sell DIY boxes. Read my detailed post in the comments for the recent AT article about Falcon North West and also replies to it from Jarred Walton, one of AT editors, we got pretty interesting discussion going, where Jarred was denying the facts first but kind of understood the picture later.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By TomZ on 5/24/2006 7:07:18 PM , Rating: 2

The flaw in your reasoning is that you assume that everybody wants a simple, vertical solution provided by a single vendor, at a higher cost.

There are lots of us out that that like DIY, we like mixing HW and SW from lots of vendors, and we like the cost savings due to this model. We like lots of choices.

Apple is like IBM in the old days. Yes, there was growth and momentum, but they eventually got stomped when things opened up and lots of vendors started playing together. That is the uphill battle that Apple faces going forward.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By Pirks on 5/24/06, Rating: -1

By Pirks on 5/24/2006 7:51:42 PM , Rating: -1

There are three flaws in your reasoning.

1) There are more casual non-geeky noob users than techies, hence potential Apple market is inherently larger than Windows market, just like Windows market is even larger than Linux market, for the same reason - Linux in general is a bit more geeky and techie-oriented OS. While at the same time Mac OS is Unix inside so it also attracts a portion of Unix/Linux/BSD crowd who can live there just like they live in Linux or FreeBSD or whatnot. So even more potential marketshare than Windows, which is not Unix like and not as simple/friendly as MacOS.

2) Higher cost - compare prices for Sony monoblock PCs that look small and stylish like iMacs. Sony's all-on-one TV-PCs are much more expensive with similar hardware specs. Compare Dell XPS with the iMac with same hardware specs - same price. Compare Dell Inspiron with MacBook with the same hardware specs - MacBook has slightly more features like webcamera, ability to run both Windows and MacOS and only $100 more expensive - so here we can also say "same price". So "higher price for Mac" is basically a myth since Macs went Intel.

3) IBM PC brand going bust by opening things up and being stomped on by myriad of clones. This is precisely the reason why Apple will never open its hardware and sell MacOS separately. Apple saw what happened to IBM because of PC hardware and software being totally open for cloning, and Apple of course learnt their lesson. Keep dreaming about seeing MacOS openly sold for clones - people forgot what happened to IBM, but you didn't... and Apple didn't forget too.

Note also that your flaw number three also answers the original poster who asked why Apple for god's sake isn't opening MacOS. You basically answered his question and helped my arguments by mentioning IBM, that's a really nice argument, thanks! ;-)

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By Garreye on 5/24/2006 11:01:31 PM , Rating: 2

There are lots of PCs sold that you can

quote:
just yank out of the box, plug it in and enjoy immediately

. Most people who buy a computer don't have to install drivers or anything like that when they buy there computer. As for the other things: a lot of PC now come with a software dvd players, firewalls(SP2 usually, not the best, but still a firewall), and antivirus (most of which update automatically). Although these features could be improved in many cases, most users who aren't computer saavy probably won't care.
For a central download station, I think the manufacturer of the PC should be doing this, not MS. This would make sense because they would then know the hardware that is in your PC. You can just go to the manufacturer website in most cases and enter your computers model and get a list of downloads, but its not as streamlined as a central download station would be.
As far as dell "copying" apple on opening retail store, it's not like apple invent single brand stores, or did the thousands of other companies that have there own retail sotres copy apple too?

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By Pirks on 5/25/06, Rating: -1

By Pirks on 5/25/2006 1:11:17 PM , Rating: -1

quote:
There are lots of PCs sold that you can "just yank out of the box, plug it in and enjoy immediately"

Sure you don't have to assemble everything yourself these days, but Macs still feel more like polished and lean machines. It's like comparing diesel Mercedes to Corvette - Mercedes can't do the tricks Corvette with fat performance tires can do, and costs more as well, but Corvette does not have that premium slick feel, or you know, compare some Sony products like Vaio notebooks with say Dell Inspirons. Sony's have more style and design and look and feel classy, but of course cost more. Same with Apple - when you buy your generic PC you'll get some slapped on stuff with different non-consistent interfaces, you know like a Lego pieces which don't match each other quite precisely, while Mac is one monolithic piece of art, for the same price as Dell by the way! So, yeah, PC is not that bad too, but if you have say $1500 to spend on a new home computer, and you are okay with changing whole computer every two-three years, instead of replacing parts inside it, then you'll get better overall experience buying Mac. Not a principally different experience, 'cause both Mac and generic PC will do same office/email/web, but this stylish feeling is only for Mac or for much more expensive Sony's. Now, I'm not saying getting cheaper parts from newegg is worse than getting a Mac. No way! I'm assembling my PCs myself and nothing beats newegg, but... what I'm saying is: there are much more people out there who are noobs and they are much better with Macs just because Macs won't bother them with upgrades, drivers for upgrades, choosing a card from a zillion choices at newegg and so on. This kind of activity (optimizing our PCs and upgrading them by parts replacement) is well suited for us techies, but, as I said there are much more noobs than us, and, therefore, potential Apple market is nuch bigger than the one for Windows, unless Windows world copies those ideas from Apple (unified polished look for everything in the system, unified and polished automatic software update, no need to do anything besides plugging in a new hardware - OS sets up hardware _quietly_ in the background, and so on)

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By Pirks on 5/25/06, Rating: 0

By Pirks on 5/25/2006 1:56:28 PM , Rating: 0

quote:
As far as dell "copying" apple on opening retail store, it's not like apple invent single brand stores, or did the thousands of other companies that have there own retail sotres copy apple too?

Dell is copying Apple not in opening retail stores, and you know it. They are copying Apple in trying to sell their computers to general public, or noobs, as I call them. And they will fail, because retail stores don't do much for selling computers to noobs. Why? Think about this: Apple has its retail store chain and many other companies have their retail chains. But only Apple had big boost in retail chain lately. Have you heard about, say, Sony PC business booming and their Vaio stores opening everywhere? What I heard is that Sony is likely to go under with PS3, and that's it (well, rootkit story and Sony's failed MP3 player line - that's old stuff but takes its space in the big picture as well). But they too have their retail stores, just like Apple! Understand my point? Dell is going to go Sony way, not Apple way. Read my other posts to get more detailed explanation, there's a lot of things to have in place besides retail chain that Dell does not have.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By Larry on 5/24/2006 11:09:55 PM , Rating: 3

Sorry, but I've seen the Apple fan talk since my time with Boston Computer Society and I wasn't sold then either.
Basic rule of thumb, Monopolies suck.
With Apple it's you get it our way or the highway.
Want a different video card then what we support, sorry kid no can do.
Want a different sound system then ours or different features then we support or a different peripheral, printer, monitor, etc. Nope your toast.
Some feature you want that Steve Jobs has decided he doesn't want right now or doesn't see a need for you to have. Guess what you ain't getting it.
Anyone without short term memory problems and who goes back far enough can remember the tortured explanations of why the first MAC's didn't have colored screens, or why SuperDisk was the wave of the future or why Appletalk was the peripherical interconnect of the future.... I do and the attitude p.o.ed me then and it does now as well.
I want choices, and I want them to be my choices, not Steve Jobs.

Now I’m no fan of Microsoft’s either, but at least till lately they stayed out of hardware. That appears to be changing and I don’t like that either.

Am I’m really not a fan of the way both have tried, and largely succeeded, within there respective systems, of killing off all independent software development. Is Apple’s or Microsoft’s word processor really the best one out there? If you said yes, then I pity you, WordPerfect beats them both hands down. Think Excel is really the best spreadsheet, or Access really the best database you can use? Paradox, Firefox, and Quattro did better on their worst days. Sorry but being easy to use and idiot proof may be very satisfying for idiots, but they aren’t doing me much good, I want a little more.

Yea Steve Jobs can make his interlocked Apple stuff all play perfect together, but he is also frozen into it by the same thing. Which is why I can still get faster, better and cheaper hardware in the marketplace on the other side where competition is still the watchword and people HAVE to keep innovating, at least till Microsoft buys Dell and kills the entire market. When that day comes I’m going back to a number two pencil and a pad of paper.

Larry

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By Xavian on 5/25/2006 2:13:38 AM , Rating: 2

i like Office, however i only use it for word processing and excel. Database applications is where i use a robust solution. MySQL is better than access in so many ways its not funny.

however i completely agree with what you said about apples 'our supported hardware only' policy. It could also be argued that OSX is ONLY more stable because Jobs refuses to support the sheer number of configurations out there. If apple opened up they might just have the same bug-infested OS that MS has.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By TomZ on 5/25/2006 6:46:22 AM , Rating: 2

quote:
i like Office, however i only use it for word processing and excel. Database applications is where i use a robust solution. MySQL is better than access in so many ways its not funny.

That's kind of like comparing apples and oranges. If you want to make a comparison to a Microsoft product, you should compare MySQL to Microsoft SQL Server.

Access is not intended to be a "serious" database. It is a desktop application that is simple to use, and has just enough power to get the job done for relatively simple tasks.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By Pirks on 5/25/06, Rating: -1

By Pirks on 5/25/2006 1:47:08 PM , Rating: -1

quote:
however i completely agree with what you said about apples 'our supported hardware only' policy

Since Intel Macs are PCs inside, this argument is not working anymore. Besides, for noobs it does not matter if there are only 50 choices for Mac while 500 for PC - same stuff for them - so there is choice for them.

quote:
It could also be argued that OSX is ONLY more stable because Jobs refuses to support the sheer number of configurations out there.

It's not more stable, crashes in Macs are not less common than crashes on PCs with good hardware and drivers.

quote:
If apple opened up they might just have the same bug-infested OS that MS has.

Sure they will have bug-infested OS - they will open it, Chinese will quickly write a bunch of crappy drivers in Visual Basic or similar for their cheap $10 networking cards and such, and all the crashes resulting from this will be blamed on whom? On those Chinese? Oh really? ARE you suure??? See, it's so easy to grasp, isn't it? He-he :-)

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By Pirks on 5/25/06, Rating: -1

By Pirks on 5/25/2006 1:37:54 PM , Rating: -1

quote:
I want choices, and I want them to be my choices, not Steve Jobs.

This is the reason why I'm not going to buy a Mac myself right now, since their desktop iMacs are a joke expansion-wise, you're right here. However, you too missed my point, and I'm going to repeat it here, 'cause this argument is unbeatable (hey, try to beat it! I'd like to watch this and enjoy), and the argument is (repeating again): there are much more noobs than techies, and they do not want your zillion of choices, they just don't care if there are 500 video cards for PCs or only 50 for Macs, what they want is this: buy box, open it and get everything done simple, no hassle, no thinking how this thing works and what hardware is inside, then sell it in 2-3 years, and get a new box and so on. Yes, you can do this with PC _if_ you are lucky, because when you get a generic PC these days there's a chance that if you replace/add hardware later you'll need a setup CD and you'll have to install a driver for a new card/hardware. And there's a good chance you'll need to get some additional software to make DVDs or toast them... 'cause XP doesn't have this stuff embedded, and by the time Vista's out who knows what Apple pops outta its sleeves, I've been watching them beating MS to market many times with all these cool new features like Dashboard, Expose and Spotlight, so, well, why don't they beat MS again with WinFS, for example? Who cares if it'll be technically less cool than MS's stuff, if Apple users will get it a couple of years ahead of MS. Apple users probably got used now to Apple beating MS to market. I just have this feeling now that Apple will always maintain distance from MS and always produce more user friendly PCs for the same cost as Dells, which is, you know, not a joke. And your arguments about PCs being infinitely more expansive and such - they work only for minority of tech-proficient users. Like I said - if you are a noob, and you want similar experience to, say, your TV or stereo (buy, use, replace, that's it!) then there's no other way but Mac now. Unless some other PC vendor wakes up and decides to follow the market trend of making PCs more accessible to general public. I'm not saying PCs are inaccessible nightmare, 'cause of course they are not, I'm just saying that Apple is a clear market leader here. Getting some open source BSD, slapping on some NeXT, packaging and integrating it beautifully and then switching to Intel, while at the same time growing its market share at this unbelievable rate - very implessive for a techie like me. I'm waiting for midi-factor Mac with some expansion capabilities, similar to Shuttle - gotta grab it and remember my sweet Linux days back in Uni... you should probably too - since Intel Macs are PCs now, and this "omg there's no hardware for PowerPC Mac" thing is no longer true... time to shift your preception of the world a little ;-) You can always run Windows/Linux or whatnot on it, plus MacOS which is Unix... so it's just a matter of waiting for a new iMac like desktop but with separate case larger than Mac Mini.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By Griswold on 5/24/2006 2:56:45 PM , Rating: 2

Agreed. Its so popular to bash MS for the flaws and security risks in the current windows versions, but even when MS apparently is willing to take the time and do it right for a change (the last couple windows launches were really nothing to call home about), they still get flak from every possible side.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By Phynaz on 5/24/2006 4:13:08 PM , Rating: 2

Agreed.

LOL, I agree with Griswald. I hope I don't get hit by lightning today.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By Griswold on 5/24/2006 5:27:23 PM , Rating: 2

quote:
I hope I don't get hit by lightning today

I'm optimistic in this case.

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RE: I'm an indie kid

By Pythias on 5/24/2006 6:34:20 PM , Rating: 2

quote:
Agreed. Its so popular to bash MS for the flaws and security risks in the current windows versions, but even when MS apparently is willing to take the time and do it right for a change (the last couple windows launches were really nothing to call home about), they still get flak from every possible side.

Its also popular to bash MS because its included in oem pcs but its perfectly okay for apple. *boggle*

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Make sure it's virus-proof and exploit-proof!

By shuttleboi on 5/24/2006 4:23:07 PM , Rating: 1

Microsoft should not release Vista until it is 100% virus-proof and exploit-proof. Would you buy a new car that had problems with the brakes or the engine?

RE: Make sure it's virus-proof and exploit-proof!

By PLaYaHaTeD on 5/24/06, Rating: 0

RE: Make sure it's virus-proof and exploit-proof!

By codeThug on 5/24/2006 5:55:02 PM , Rating: 1

And Forthly (or is it quadly?) He has every right to expect it to be virus fee and exploit proof.

Perhaps your software development team has much lower expectations of the code it throws? Or are you just a sloppy code toad with an axe to grind?

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RE: Make sure it's virus-proof and exploit-proof!

By codeThug on 5/24/2006 5:56:57 PM , Rating: 2

oops, comment got pulled. The moderator obviously beat me to it!!!

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RE: Make sure it's virus-proof and exploit-proof!

By TomZ on 5/24/2006 6:12:28 PM , Rating: 2

Sorry, but it is impossible to make (non-trivial) software 100% secure. To not know this is to not understand the nature of software and the environment in which it operates.

As another poster said below, it's like trying to build a completely theft-proof car - another impossible task. As long as you build in security features, the "bad guys" will figure out ways around them. But because there are no such thing as 100% theft-proof cars doesn't mean the car manufacturer failed to provide reasonable security.

That same level - a "reasonable level" is what we need in software. Forget about 100% "perfect" anything.

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RE: Make sure it's virus-proof and exploit-proof!

By shuttleboi on 5/25/2006 2:10:44 PM , Rating: 2

Thank you for the information. For the record, I have a BS, MS, and PhD in computer science and have been known to write a few lines of code.

However, I'm not talking from the point of view of an extremely skilled computer scientist but rather from the point of view of a computer software consumer. As a consumer, I do not want my OS to be buggy and exploitable to such a degree that there are biweekly virus/trojan issues or hundreds of patches to be installed every so often. If you are happy with this situation, then your expectations have been lowered beyond recovery.

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RE: Make sure it's virus-proof and exploit-proof!

By jtesoro on 5/29/2006 5:58:19 AM , Rating: 2

I agree with you that consumers do not want "buggy and exploitable to such a degree that there are biweekly virus/trojan issues or hundreds of patches to be installed every so often". This can be achieved to a "reasonable level", as TomZ previously said.

While I respect your education and your ability to write "a few lines of code", you are way off base if you think it is possible to write an OS of this complexity that is 100% virus proof and exploit proof.

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RE: Make sure it's virus-proof and exploit-proof!

By shuttleboi on 5/25/2006 2:12:09 PM , Rating: 2

Forth, you must really enjoy your job as an ASP website "programmer".

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RE: Make sure it's virus-proof and exploit-proof!

By archermoo on 5/24/2006 4:56:53 PM , Rating: 2

quote:
Microsoft should not release Vista until it is 100% virus-proof and exploit-proof. Would you buy a new car that had problems with the brakes or the engine?

Bad analogy. Better would be "Would you buy a car that could be stolen or vandalized?" Of course everyone who owns a car has already done so...

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No hurry

By jskirwin on 5/24/2006 3:33:22 PM , Rating: 2

After living through seemingly countless OS upgrades I'm in no hurry to make the leap to Vista - Especially since I don't see what value it offers me or my clients.

RE: No hurry

By nangryo on 5/24/2006 7:57:47 PM , Rating: 2

True...., for me .. I'd rather to see at least SP1 out for the vista to make sure everything goes right. I have some vintage sooftware and hardware that barely run smoothly on XP after many tweaking and modification....., so I'll just wait to get the Vista get better..., and get more driver/native software support.

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I'm probably in the Minority on Vista,

By formulav8 on 5/24/2006 3:16:34 PM , Rating: 3

But I am kinda looking forward to tinkering around with the hundreds of new API's that Vista is coming with. :)

Jason

Wow.. why haven't I found another site yet?

By Tebor0 on 5/24/06, Rating: 0

By Tebor0 on 5/24/2006 4:53:31 PM , Rating: 0

First... I realize it's my own laziness that has prevented me from finding a better site to visit so I guess it's my partly own fault, and kudos for getting the subject of the article across, but…
Come on!! Why don't you just throw in a couple “M$” remarks instead of the actual Microsoft name or how about how Bill Gates is the devil and Apple/Linux are gods? I expect this kind of writing in an individual forum post but in a news story article?

I suggest you read the original article you referred to for an example on how someone can write about Microsoft without resorting to tongue in cheek comments. If not... please take my future article title as a suggestion.

”Vista launched, M$ issues patch, if you didn’t expect anything else, congrats”

Or am I maybe just missing the point of this site? Is this a site meant for blogs with the hope that some form of credibility can be attached because of the site name or is this supposed to be reputable news reporting site where credibility is obtained through NEWS articles?

/rant off

RE: Wow.. why haven't I found another site yet?

By Tebor0 on 5/24/2006 4:55:11 PM , Rating: 1

lol.. well..
The point of my long winded post is simply this:
The articles posted on this site are quite often a joke to read and I have trouble taking anything seriously.

Parent

RE: Wow.. why haven't I found another site yet?

By lealwai on 5/24/2006 5:41:39 PM , Rating: 2

Then y are u here?

Parent

the id, the balmer, and the super balmer

By codeThug on 5/24/2006 5:26:29 PM , Rating: 2

"When It's Ready"

I believe Id software has the distinction of coining this phrase for the software industry.

Nurse? More thorazine for monkey boy please...

vista stratergy

By crystal clear on 5/25/2006 8:19:42 AM , Rating: 2

Vista was designed specifically for OEM system builds ,so look at it from the marketing angle.
MS wants to target them first,then come to the retail version.So the big boys, big dogs,big guns-call them what U prefer, decide the release schedule/or launch schedule.
Intel also has close working relationship with MS,put that in focus.
Vista finished or unfinished is not the issue-updates,of all types will keep on coming as usual.
So its only marketing stratergy that's keeping MS on the hold-THE OEM people hold the key to the launch date.

Finally...

By Clauzii on 5/25/2006 1:52:16 AM , Rating: 1

...Macro$oft ie. Bill'y found out how good OSX is :)

Well if MICROSUCKS is gonna wait until Vista is ready...

By cornfedone on 5/24/06, Rating: 0

"We can't expect users to use common sense. That would eliminate the need for all sorts of legislation, committees, oversight and lawyers." -- Christopher Jennings