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Jobs asks for a bit more patience on 3rd party support

When the iPhone launched earlier this year, Apple definitely had people excited. Apple CEO Steve Jobs touted that the iPhone would be a revolution in mobile phone technology. As news of the phone spread, users began noticing that the iPhone did not appear to have any support for third party applications -- applications that a user can download and install onto the iPhone.

While it was clearly indicated that the iPhone runs on OS X and that there were a fair number of unique and well designed applications, concern was growing rapidly over application support. Because of its powerful underlying operating system, the iPhone is a perfect platform for development.

During an interview with Walt Mossberg at the D 2007 executive conference, Jobs revealed that the closed nature of the iPhone is simply due to security. According to Jobs, Apple is looking into ways of supporting third party applications on the iPhone without compromising the iPhone's stability and security.

"I've used 3rd party apps. The more you add, the more your phone crashes. No one's perfect and we'd sure like our phone not to crash once a day," said Jobs. "If you can just be a little more patient with us I think everyone can get what they want."

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OS X unstable?
By GoatMonkey on 6/1/2007 10:38:20 AM , Rating: 5
If the iPhone runs OS X and 3rd party apps can cause the iPhone to crash, does this mean that 3rd party apps cause OS X to crash? I thought OS X was more stable than that.




RE: OS X unstable?
By JazzMang on 6/1/2007 11:04:02 AM , Rating: 5
hahahahahahahahaa


RE: OS X unstable?
By Martimus on 6/1/2007 2:06:35 PM , Rating: 3
I am surprised that there is surprise that an operating system can crash. Even the simplest operating systems can crash at times, you just need to have a program do something that either the software or hardware can't handle like division by zero, or overrunning the stack.


RE: OS X unstable?
By Snuffalufagus on 6/1/2007 2:08:14 PM , Rating: 3
:) 'Finder' is a third party app? :)


RE: OS X unstable?
By michaelheath on 6/1/2007 3:22:13 PM , Rating: 2
As much as I like OS X, it is almost as fallible as Windows, just in different ways. However, the stability of Mac OS X on the desktop isn't in question here...

I am sure that it's already obvious, when Steve Jobs says that the iPhone 'runs Mac OS X' he means that in the way that you could say a Windows Mobile phone 'runs Windows' as an OS. It's probably some condensed version of the OS where features had to be removed to conserve space, seeing as how a full install of Mac OS 10.4.x takes up over 6 GB of HD space which is well beyond the capacity of the proposed 4 GB iPhone. With this theory in mind, it could be observed that you are probably going to be navigating with a 'Finder Mobile' instead of a full blown Finder.

Another obvious statement that could also be said to follow up what I said above would be that developing an iPhone application is probably different than developing for Mac OS X. Like developing for the Palm, RIM, or the Windows Mobile platform, attention to details like making sure an app stays within RAM limits and avoids bogging down the CPU and keeping it free to do primary functions that it was designed to do (which is a phone as it's primary function and everything else secondary), so I can understand why iPhone developers want to hold off on opening up the platform. What good is it if the phone ceases to perform as advertised if you download a buggy app? Mac OS X was terrible in it's 10.0 version, so terrible that Mac OS 9 came in the same box for people who didn't want to switch immediately. Microsoft didn't even start developing Office Mac until 10.1 came out. I figure the same applies here. As eager as everyone is to make apps for the iPhone, it's probably better to wait anyway.

Being an Apple user for almost as long as I have lived (while also being a PC enthusiast in general for just as long), Apple's primary goal with all of their devices is singluar: "It just works." Having experienced the last 20-odd years of Mac computing, 80% of the time it's true. I know people who own Windows Mobile devices, Palm Treo's, and Blackberries in various iterations, and working in a tech division on a University campus, I've seen a wide variety of tech problems. These products crash with or without third-party apps. I own a cell phone that crashes less often (I think it happened once in the 14 months I have owned it so far) than I hear about any one given convergence device. Two people I know have a cell phone as a back-up to their Palm Treo. My good friend who owns a Blackberry seems happier, but I still occasionally get cut off on a phone call with her because 'It tanked on me.' If Apple wants to try and make a virtually unsinkable convergence phone and make sure that they get it right before opening up the platform to developers, more power to them. It worked for the Intel switch-over. I hope it works out for them here.

On a side note: I hope Microsoft develops a Mac Office Mobile, and maybe Skype will find a way to hack that Wi-Fi to allow for VoIP. If that happens, I can forget about buying a laptop... my iPhone can do it all for me :D


RE: OS X unstable?
By Snuffalufagus on 6/1/2007 5:46:43 PM , Rating: 2
Seems like everyone here misses sarcasm, even when surrounded by little happy faces.

I think the point that GoatMonkey and I are attempting is that the 'oh so super stable Mac' is a bit of a farce and like any OS can be just as unstable as any other platform due to bugs in both the OS and third party apps.

I may not be representing his thoughts correclty, but that was at least the reason for my sarcastic comment.


RE: OS X unstable?
By melgross on 6/2/2007 1:55:30 AM , Rating: 2
No, as has been stated several times by Jobs. The OS in the phone is the full version of OS X, minus the utilities, background pictures, drivers, etc that would have no place on the phone.

Windows Mobile, on the other hand, isn't Windows at all. It is an entirely different OS that just has the name Windows, and the same appearance desktop.

The reason why OS X programs won't work on the phone is that, as Jobs said, the desktop is entirely different, so the front ends of the programs wouldn't work, and there is no mouse, without which most of those programs also wouldn't work.

The rez is also far too low for full desktop, and portable, computer programs to be able to present themselves usefully.

Basically, most everything would have to be re-written, as far as their interfaces go.


RE: OS X unstable?
By dcollins on 6/1/2007 7:20:51 PM , Rating: 2
Any poorly written program can bring an OS to a halt.
quote:

#include <sys/types.h>
#include <unistd.h>
int main(){
while(1){ fork(); }
}

Will render windows (with a GNU env installed), Linux, and OS X useless in a minute or two. Phones are supposed to be real-time devices I understand wanting control over third-party devices.


RE: OS X unstable?
By Ralph The Magician on 6/1/2007 11:56:30 PM , Rating: 1
Actually crashing OS X is a challenge. Crashing apps running in OS X is easy. There is a difference.


Not really.
By retrospooty on 6/1/2007 10:10:39 AM , Rating: 2
"Apple is looking into ways of supporting third party applications on the iPhone without compromising the iPhone's stability and security."

This is not going to be truly an open platform, basically this means that Apple will support 3rd party apps that they have approved of, not that any software company simply made for it. They first have to get past Steve Jobs ego to get "approved". Still, better then not supporting 3rd party apps at all. Now if the price were 1/4 of what it is, we'd have a winner.




RE: Not really.
By Wolfpup on 6/1/2007 8:42:46 PM , Rating: 2
1/4? It's actually cheaper than some of the newest Treos. It's reasonably priced compared to other so-called "smart phones".

And I agree with Steve about wanting stability to be a priority. We don't know how they're going to do this. There's not THAT many applications I need on a PDA anyway.


BlackBerry hardly ever crashes
By UNCjigga on 6/1/2007 10:14:45 AM , Rating: 2
Maybe Steve should ask the RIM folks how they do it. I've had a BlackBerry 8703e for a while and its only crashed 3-4 times (2 times with early builds of new software I was testing).




By melgross on 6/2/2007 1:58:18 AM , Rating: 2
Pretty simple. RIM has few API's for ther programs, therefore they have few programs. They recently said that they have developed, and are developing more API's for third parties.

Once that is done, your "new" Baackberry will crash more oftem.


Wrong title
By joey2264 on 6/1/2007 11:34:11 AM , Rating: 4
You guys might want to fix the title. It should be something along the lines of "iPhone may feature limited 3rd party support".

You don't want your readers to think you are mindless, soulless, Apple zealots, do you?




Sub-OS for containment?
By TimberJon on 6/1/2007 12:07:53 PM , Rating: 2
I remember that someone had an apple laptop and ran a program that allowed windows to run on it, but when windows crashed, it did not compromise the core OS.

If the Iphone is so powerful.. couldnt it support a program that runs CF or symbian, your choice? and then install third party apps on a partition associated with that sub-OS?

Then it wouldnt make the phone crash, and it would make other OS's look bad. While we would HATE that, it WOULD benefit Jobs both ways. Giving us third party support, and making his product and OS look superior. I still wouldnt believe THAT garbage, but if it seems so, I would let it be!

It would be awesome if one of the sensors in the thing broke, then it would go haywire.




RE: Sub-OS for containment?
By JoeBanana on 6/1/2007 1:24:20 PM , Rating: 2
This is true... But look it from another perspective of running 2 OS, and also one on top. That would be very slow and impractical. Also all the errors can't be bypassed like that.


ActiveSync
By gramboh on 6/1/2007 12:19:20 PM , Rating: 3
They have no choice but to support MS ActiveSync for Outlook if they want any business customers.




iPhone launched?
By Griswold on 6/1/2007 12:33:32 PM , Rating: 2
I dont think so just yet.




this is an iphone
By sprockkets on 6/1/2007 1:06:25 PM , Rating: 2
Hey Jobs, you are not running a non multitasking Palm OS 5.x, so why the worries hahaha...




The high end market
By crystal clear on 6/2/2007 4:03:56 AM , Rating: 2
For a start-

Merrill Lynch: iPhone shipments to total four million this year

Although market expectations may be higher, Apple will only ship four million iPhones this year and 12 million in 2008, according to a recently released report from Merrill Lynch. The report indicates that monthly shipments will initially total 200,000-300,000 and ramp to about one million units by the end of the year.

The iPhone is expected to begin shipping in June.

According to a recent report from In-Stat, despite a rapid increase in the number of multimedia-capable phones, US wireless subscribers have not yet been persuaded to take advantage of these capabilities. However, if Apple can deliver on the hype, it would changes the underlying dynamics of the market, and may give a significant boost to all wireless carriers.

http://www.digitimes.com/telecom/a20070601VL200.ht...




iPhone updates
By crystal clear on 6/2/2007 4:36:02 AM , Rating: 2
1)Responding to reports that it had received an order to produce 5 million iPhones with delivery scheduled to begin in September, Quanta issued a cryptic statement that neither confirmed not denied the reports.

2)Apple CEO Steve Jobs said Wednesday that he expects to begin selling the iPhone before the end of June. The widespread expectation by analysts is that the launch will coincide with Apple's World Wide Developer Conference (WWCD) in San Francisco. Jobs is scheduled to deliver his keynote on Monday, June 11.

3)"Most stores expect the phone on 6/15 or 6/22, and most expect to only have a few (highest number was 40 at one store) on hand initially." Kather's report states, "Overall pent-up retail demand at Cingular stores appears very strong, with about 15-20% of the stores we contacted keeping a waiting list for customers interested to purchase it."

http://www.informationweek.com/news/showArticle.jh...




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